Hi everybody,

I also think that my WS is in a romantic affair...but it seems to be a combination of sorts.....from the description above..a mix of all of them....

...would like your take on my situation.

Here's hopefully a 'short' summary:

....it's been 2 yrs since D-day (dec 2004)...PA had only been going on for about 3 months at the time I found out....(they work together, hard to say how long EA had been going on!)

...so, when I discovered the A... the 'high' was really 'high'.....it had consisted of a series of VERY secretive meetings for SF....'nobody' was to find out....as both WS and OP were in a long-term R and neither had initially intended to leave their spouses!!??.....I do think the 'forbidden' element of the meetings heightened the thrill of it all.... WS was big on 'compartmentalizing'....

...until I found out....

...although WS initially said he would end it....they work together; OP was heartbroken and within weeks came clean with her spouse and decided to end 27-yr R (....willing to sacrifice her M for WS???...as proof of her 'love'??? yeaks!); as A was exposed not even at its 'height', WS still seeing WS as 'soulmate', and WS could not imagine NOT seeing her....(...to deal with M recovery with me!) ....and did he feel obliged to do the same as OP to prove his love for her!!?? ....I certainly wouldn't call destroying families as proof of love!

....anyway....not surprisingly, I found WS to be totally in fantasyland...saw A and himself and OW as Romeo and Juliette, and would not be kept apart by 'society'.... what???.....(I should have asked when he planned on killing himself...never mind that they were adolescents!)..... thought all that needed to happen was for him to 'move out'...his way of 'respecting me'... not intending to D me....continue raising boys with me and remain co-owners of financial investments ....come and go as he pleased from our 'home'....'help' each other.... share get-togethers and activities.....share cottage..... (unfortunately, being in an 'artistic' circle..'open relationships' exist and WS used 'acquaintances' as models.... although clearly it was never a lifestyle that WE ever considered.... but it suited WS to think so NOW!)

...however, even 2 yrs after D-day.....and 1 and 1/2 yrs after 'moving out'....WS is choosing NOT to live with OW (I think it's his idea of keeping the passion alive...or at least as long as possible!).... is choosing NOT to legalize separation, let alone D me.... is continually attempting to have me break PLAN B.... and waiting for me to get over the 'pain and loss' so we can go ahead with friendly 'co-parenting' ...DS has also reported WS 'bursting into tears' while just sitting alone at the table.....

...then I find out that on New Yrs Day....WS had called up my parents wanting 'news', asking about my brother, telling them he loved them and ended conversation crying.....

What????

...in talking to my psychologist SIL, her explanation is that WS, by wanting to NOW legitimize more and more his R with OW, by introducing her over the holidays to his family and some family friends....is actually allowing 'reality' to kick in more and more.... and so....his 'losses' are also more and more evident! ...OUCH!

....and how about WS convincing 'talk' that he is 'sure' of his choices??.....SIL told me that most likely I am seeing WS 'defensive mode'... only allowed to see what he wants me to see and THINK!

... I was very surprised....WSs can remain in the fog for a long time!

...throughout the whole time, my message to WS has consistently been: ....ready to meet with you and discuss anything....when OW is out of the picture....when choices clearly demonstrate that ME and family are a priority in his life...and is willing to committ to R and family.....

...and although I have been saying this from the very beginning...it's only 2 yrs after D-day that I think it is actually starting to 'kick in' in WS's head that I am dead serious about not seeing HIM, otherwise!

So...I do agree with Dr. Harley....long-term... it may very well be the BS that is a threat to M recovery.....as some WS take soooo long to wake up.....the BS has had the time to 'move on'... or is no longer willing to 'risk' recovery....

....because the 'reality' of an A....is that WS has in fact really 'complicated' his life even more...rather than making it easier or more effortless!

My WS is in late 50's....I do believe it's a combination of MLC...hormonal changes...tendencies to be depressed and impulsive...it all overwhelmed him...and so made very poor choices long-term!

...in the meantime....the best a BS can do....is remove oneself from the chaos that WS is choosing to live....PLAN B is a real lifesaver!

...for now I am nowhere near choosing a D...unless of course WS files! ...as I am too busy 'rebuilding' my life...it's going to be a while to get over this!

Well, I think you are doing what little can be done, particularly if you have separated yourself from the day-to-day rollercoaster of dealing with your WS.

It sounds like he can't bring himself to stop the affair, nor does he want to lose you completely.

Your choices would seem to be:

1. Continue on as you are until the affair burns out.
2. Take more severe action to try to force a decision on his part one way or the other.
3. End the relationship with him and don't look back.

Following choice #1 requires a degree of faith that the affair will eventually end on its own. The odds are in your favor here, but if it does not, will you look back later and say that you wasted years waiting for him to come to his senses?

Choice #2 in your case essentially means divorce, since you are already in Plan B. Although you don't want to consider that option at this time, it may just be the key to jogging your WS out of his fantasy or forcing him to seek a closer relationship with the OP, which could strain that relationship. Remember, divorced people do sometimes re-marry each other.

In choice #3 you will have concluded that there is no saving the marriage, or that there are limits to how much you will do or accept to save it. Basically, you close the door on this part of your life and open a new one.

Over a period of time the right decision will become clearer to you, but it should not be based on the fear that you will never find someone you can love as much, or who will love you equally.

Hiker, thanks for taking the time to read and reply to my post....



Yes....I do agree...with PLAN B, I have gotten off the day-to-day roller-coaster of dealing with a WS...and life is soooo much better.... and WS's choices....particularly choosing not to live with OP....and wanting to do friendly co-parenting with me....definitely seems like he wants to remain....a cake-eater....and NOT have to choose!



...even if A were to end...no certainty that WS would want to 'recover' M.....fear of failure?? rejection?? too much effort??....and to be honest...I really don't know if at 'that time'...the longer this goes on...I MAY want to risk recovery....

In the meantime...I can't say I feel like I am 'wasting' years waiting... I am working hard at living my life...on my OWN...and appreciating being on my OWN..... AS IF WS will not be back....can't say interest in another R is at the top of my list right now... so the problem of 'wasting time' waiting is not an issue...rigth now!

....although I am starting to wonder if I would feel differently if the separation were legalized or D happened! ....because I ACT as if I AM married...but without a S.....so....

...it's the famous question...which comes first....the egg or the chicken?



For me Hiker....#2 & #3 really go together....were I to go through the process of a D....it would not be as a means to force 'reality' in fantasyland...although you are right, it is what it might take....I only am prepared to do that with PLAN B.... plan D for me would mean #3....

...however..even #3 cannot be 'total'...as we have our 2 boys in 'common'....



...that's how PLAN B happened.....even though it was a hard decision, I just 'knew' that it was the only way to go....to get out of 'toxic' relationship with a WS....

...finding someone else?....well....at best...it will be... different...because 'sharing' the bond of having children with someone is incomparable...particularly as I do not intend to have any more children.....

At this time...I am trying to be STILL....and not let the chaos around me affect me tooo much...and then....we'll see!

I am sorry Hiker..I am not familiar with your situation...and would like to know how you are doing....I suspect your experience involves(ed) a romantic affair seeing your keen interest in that....

...do you have your own thread, and can you direct me to it?

Luna,

Your approach to all this seems very sensible to me.

I do think the fact that he is obviously still attached to you is evidence that your marriage would be recoverable if the affair ends, as opposed to him not coming back to you.

Sometimes I wonder if a wayward spouse actually wants the betrayed spouse to file for divorce so that they don't have to make that decision, and consequently can derive some comfort by telling him/herself that "hey, I'm not the one who wanted a divorce."

I don't have a thread with my story. It's kind of strewn over several threads. I'll take the time to tell you more later, but things are not good.

Luna,

I'm amazed at your strength. I'm only two weeks into a Plan B, and I can't imagine two years of "being married without a spouse." It's just amazing to see that the fog can go on that long, but I guess there are some people who never come out of it.

SDG

Luna has always been an inspiration to me, and remains so, even though I wasn't able to save my marriage.


Amazing how the WS thinks that the BS should want to remain married when they are left for someone else. Divorce? How unreasonable! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

Alph.

Hi Hiker,


Actually....even with PLAN B....WS has the excuse that ME, BS, is choosing NOT to see or speak to him, not even for the sake of boys....and probably not getting much sympathy... because it begs the next question: how come?....uhmmmm...'maybe because I cheated on her' DUH!

Fortunately...I can read right through his 'manipulative ways'..... which just don't 'stick'....thanks to the distance and perspective I have gained by going into PLAN B...

I just looooove PLAN B......I feel very empowered.... and for obvious reasons....WS is in the opposite side of the spectrum....can't even get me to TALK to him!

fantasyland vs. reality....

...the battle goes on!



I am sorry to hear that Hiker....

Hi SDG,



Actually....even though it's been 2 yrs from D-day.... sometimes it still feels like it was just yesterday.... which I guess supports the 'theory' of relativity...LOL!

....that's why Romantic Affairs are the most difficult to deal with.... the fog takes a long time to lift...if it ever does at all! ...because if and when it does.... the fall is hard and long!

Hi Alph....hat off to you, too!

Hey everybody,

Geez! So much to read here...so little time. I'm speed reading at this point.

Luna, I find your stamina amazing. I feel that I will be filing in the summer. I'm not doing it to bring WH back; I am going to do it, as I feel that I cannot truly get on with my life without the D. It is my own shortcoming, and i'm trying to hold back, I just don't think I can. I am weak and want some closure to this death of my M. I'm strong, but not invincible. I don't have much fight left, but to remain, silent and still, in Plan B. I don't know how much longer I can go on watching my WH go from woman to woman searching for what he had with me. It's a [email]d@mned[/email] shame. Lousygolfer had it right. If replacing me was so easy, why has it taken a total of 3 women so far to do it. Maybe the third time is the charm. I dunno, I'm just tired of taking it to heart.

Again, you amaze me with your strength, and not to mention patience. I feel as though I am being disrespected and cast aside, as if he can return at any time. I need to separate myself from his notions; I feel D is the one true way to do this. I cannot harbor him and his delusions anymore.

Just wanted to know if any one out there has had to deal with this thing I struggle with almost daily. I want to go kick the crap out of the OM for destroying my family. Yes, I know it takes two, but he is a serial cheater. He knows what he is doing. My wife just doesn't get that. She thinks she is in love and can't see what just about everyone else knows -- the guy is dogsh**.

I can't save my marriage but I could sure teach him a lesson and maybe spare somebody else some grief. The only thing stopping me is that I don't want to give my wife ammunition to win custody of my kids.

Have any of you dealt with this?

Mickey,

I'm dealing with it today, I discovered my WW was having an EA with her co-worker on Friday. I exposed and confronted on Saturday. Today is Sunday, and this morning I was laying in bed thinking of how the OM knew I was married and knew me.

My only recommendation is to let him OM know in a way which makes you the bigger person. I am not going to talk to him face to face, that could very well go badly. I don't recommend doing that - ever - to anyone. Calling will either get you hung up on or worse: you will hear things and say things you don't want to. It could be recorded in certain states. Write him a note to tell him the truth: You love your spouse, you are trying to save your marriage, and you want him to know that. That's my plan, be the bigger man. The better man. WW may think she is with the better man, know that you are exactly that by your actions (regardless of your past, you have changed the moment you discovered - you will never be the same)

Thanks, Jayban. I did call him a while ago and he just lied and said nothing was going on long after my wife had admitted the affair. I said the things you mentioned. I accomplished nothing. If I would have found out right when the affair started I would have stopped it by scaring him off.

Mickey have been dealing with it for 7 months

Its pointless to worry about your WW and the OM, get your self strong and be there for you kids

Mickey,

I can definitely identify with that. In fact, the OM in my case lied long after the facts were clear. I tried reasoning with him like Jayban mentioned. Told him he was ripping my family apart and that my five-year-old son wants his mommie and daddy to stay together. His reply: "That's your problem."

If we had been face to face instead of on the phone I would probably be in jail right now. I wrote to the jerk's wife to offer her evidence of the cheating and the jerk threatened to bring some friends down and "beat the sh** out of me." My reply? "You know where I live. I'll be waiting."

I was as mad that night as I have ever been in my life. But I'm in the same position as you. I don't dare get into trouble if I intend to get physical custody of my son. That is more important than taking out my anger on this lying a**hole.

I trust that eventually my anger will subside. Yours will too.

*bump*

For Bobolina

bump for jamesus

bump the original

*bump*

Read this whole thread. There are some great posts by Marsh in here on what Fog feels like--page 8 (@ 25 posts per page) and beyond--that I found very helpful.

[quote=vikingruler]I honestly believe this site lower's that fact for those who attend and try and work things out.... I did read somewhere's that for those that are disposed to suicide it would be after all the attention is gone and it would be an act of last desperation. I think I also read that most suicides are for the attention not the ending act.... to bad you can't go back and ask the ones that did if they really meant to do it..

i am actually a lurker. but i was reading this thread and read this post back on page 13. thats all ive gotten to. i tried to commit suicide last year, 2 mos. after d day. ill start a post w my story soon. but in response to this i wanted to say that i actually wanted to die and get my WH attention that way. to show him how much he truly destroyed me. I wrote suicide notes and all. but before i drifted off from taking over 200 pills(small ones). I got a picture in my mind of my 7 YO son going to school telling his teacher and friends his mom was dead. I actually drifted out of my car and found someone in a remote area and told them to call 911. I then passed out. They saved me, god saved me.
It was before i found this website. before i did it i actually never had this thought in my brain. I actually thought that my son would be better off since my husband convinced me (wittingly or unwittingly) that i was unlovable. i figured him and OW could live w my son in heavenly bliss. I was thrown away like trash. This website helped me a lot thru the past year. I felt like I was so alone. I cant figure out how to do paragraphs, sorry.

I TRULY FELT THE SAME WAY.. I believed that if I would kill myself it would shake him up and the old H would come home and be a dad to his children, because my kids needed him more than me.

There is scripture, Jeremiah 29:11 I believe where G-d says he has a plan for you. He knows the beginning and he knows the end.

I FELT THE SAME WAY.

I'm so glad you are here, I'm so glad you lurked and I'm so glad you haven't given up. We are here for you. I can't express, explain or convey how I felt so similarly to you.

WH in my life threw me away like trash, I couldn't believe it.

You aren't CRAZY. You are so special and you will get through this. Please post your story and become part of us and know that you can make it, and G-d has a plan in your life.