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Have you considered contacting OW's mom to verify that WH is staying away from OW? I know it would make your WH angry, but you might want to do this. Also, I have another question that is going to be painful, but could there possibly be an OC on the way?

Given your WH's stance on birth control and that it was OW's mom who exposed the A, you might want to verify this also.

But please, do not bring this with WH alone. Address this with the help of the MC. Maybe you can call the MC ahead of time and let him/her know you will be bringing it up.

I've only brought this up because if there are some extenuating circumstances that can impact the M and COM, then the earlier you know about it, the more pro-active you can be.


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No, OW is not a minor. She is a little younger than I am. OW's mother is very controling. How he justifies skipping the NC letter...she could make waves/a scene at his work and other interests. The OW's mother called me after a serious incident concerning the OW - won't elaborate.

As for OC - I don't know. I'm very sure I would have been contacted again if this was the case...and child support/OB care bills would have come our way.

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The OW's mother called me and told me of the adultery. WS denied it until I had an email exchange with this person and proof was attached to the email.


I have to tell you that when I read this statement, I was proud of OW's mom for telling you. She didn't have to tell you, and I am sure it wasn't easy for her. She could have just told your WH to leave her D alone, and never told you about it.

Consider this statement:

You have more control in this situation then you realize.

Your WH did not leave you for OW. He stayed. So, at least for now, he WANTS to be married to you. He wants to stay in your home.

When he chose to cheat - he effectively left your M. Now he wants back in. Perhaps you need to set the bar a little higher for him to get back in.

I am not suggesting you do this - but consider this possiblity:

What if you said to him: "I love you, and I want to stay married to you. I want to work on building a better M with you. I want to be the best W I can be. But in order to do that, I need you to do some things to help me heal from your betrayel. First, I need you to write a NC letter, which I will mail. 2nd, I need you to committ to spending 15 hours a week with me, dating and having fun....."

you could set your own boudaries, whatever they are. But the point is, I keep hearing you say "he won't do this, and he won't do that"
Who says that he gets to make all the rules?
Why does HE get to choose, how YOU will heal???
You get to make some of your own choices, for your own life. Frankly, he has made enough bad choices for you.

And if he is not willing to follow YOUR boudaries? Then perhaps he needs to consider moving in with his mom (or a friend)
Becuase You have a life to live.. You have children to raise. And either he is on board with you - or he needs to get the heck out of your way.

You CAN NOT be expected to just forget it and "move on". that method never works, and you would only end up back here again.


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D Day June 25, 2003
Divorced December 17, 2003

Newly married to a wonderful man!
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The OW's mother called me and told me of the adultery. WS denied it until I had an email exchange with this person and proof was attached to the email.


I have to tell you that when I read this statement, I was proud of OW's mom for telling you. She didn't have to tell you, and I am sure it wasn't easy for her. She could have just told your WH to leave her D alone, and never told you about it.

Well, I must disagree with you there. I would have rather gone to the grave having no clue.

She didn't do it for any kind of "good reason"...she did it to hurt someone. I do not appreciate sharing in that hurt. I'm sure she got perverse pleasure in thinking she was causing as much pain as she could.

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I'm hating these giant mood swings.

One minute I think I may be okay...the next the stupid movie starts in my head and I'm right down in the pit again.

How am I supposed to compete? I will never be "drop dead gorgeous". Heck, right now I'm lucky if I don't have spit up on whatever I'm wearing.

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RU,

I'm going to tell you what my counselor told me. I'm sharing this with you because your situation is so very similar too mine in that my catholic H and I did not contracept, had babies frequently, I nursed so there would be natural child-spacing. I also practiced natural mothering and exclusive bfing. This was at my H's insistence.

Because this was "how things are supposed to be". I converted to Catholic when I was pregnant with # 4. I've read some of your posts on other threads and I can tell you...they sound like I wrote them myself.

To my H, everything was my fault or my responsibility. I thought it was something that *I* was doing wrong. The day I birthed # 5, I made sure everything was clean and ready so I could go have my baby. I didn't rest that day, but my H laid down and rested. Later that evening, I called my midwife and told her I was on my way. She expected me to be spitting the kid out by the time I got to the hospital.

She wasn't too happy that I interrupted her dinner so I could rest at the hospital and kick into labor. I was 0 dilation, 0 effacement, and -4 station. The midwife told me if I wanted to rest, I had needed to go to a hotel instead.


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The midwife went back out to dinner and told me to relax , walk a bit, or do what made me comfortable. I relaxed, walked, got into the shower, where I had 3 contractions. They were intense, but that was my labor. I told the nurse to page the midwife (she had the guard park her car since she was just returning from dinner when she got the page). My midwife came in, broke my water and 3 pushes later my baby was born.

I really just needed to rest...that's how overworked I was.

My H supposedly had a brief affair with my sister around the time I got pregnant with my 6th child (who was planned). I wouldn't find out about it until that child was 17 mos old. And I wasn't told by my H, it was a jerk who was hooked up with a relative who told me to be spiteful.


I got to a point where I was so low, that I contacted an IC. I chose Greg Popcak since he wrote a column for a magazine that is published by a catholic group who promotes natural family planning.

He was the counselor who told me that even if I had met every need and desire of my H and had been the perfect wife, my H still would have done what he did.

He said that my "H has an impoverished view of intimacy". See, my H understood what being open to life meant. He expected me and the M to be that way. He not only had a commitment to me, but to each COM individually and the family unit as well. The counselor saw the infidelity not only as a betrayal of the spouse but an affront to those little children that my H knowingly and expectingly co-created with me and God.

Dr popcak asked me point blank what I was going to do for myself, so when my h betrayed again, i wouldn't be in the place I was. He wanted to know what i wanted from myself, because my H has personal issues that affect his ability to be truly intimate.

I hope what i wrote to you doesn't offend your sensibilities so that you won't want me to post to you anymore.

But i want to tell you that this might be the case with your spouse. He could very well have issues that he too has to iron out so he can be a faithful spouse.


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You might be wondering why I'm here at MB if the problem is my H's.

I have to say it's because at the time of my dday and for awhile after, with the # of kids I had and the economic situation, I believed that i didn't have a choice but to stay with my H.

However, MB was one of the first sites I found following dday. And God must've had a reason to make me computer challenged...I was clueless to what a discussion forum was so never posted to it here at the time. If i had, I don't think i would've stayed M. But I did want to find a way to make co-existing with my H easier. I began utilizing the concepts of EN's, LB's, and a modified plan a in that I tried to make me and the M desirable.

As i implemented these ideas, i learned where I was lacking. I learned concepts about relationships and boundaries and things that made me in control of *me*. I was getting myself to the place that if my h dissed on me again, i wouldn't be brought down so low. I learned that while I couldn't control the behaviors of others, i had control of my reactions and responses to those behaviors.


And the light bulb went on...I actually had a big say in my life. I could direct it. Others didn't control me.

(Look at what womanoffaith said to you in another post...)

I raised the price of admission for so many people in my life. I learned that I could take care of me, had every right to, and the responsibility to God to do so.


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That's why I want to encourage you, RU, to hang in there. If you could call Dr H and get MC through MB, I think it will be for the best. I wish I had.

Even if $$ is tight, still call. Explain your situation, it is different in that you have alot of little ones relying on their parents M. You might be surprised, the Dr could very well want to help at a rate that works for your budget. At the very least, call into the radio program.

Jewel


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Could you point me to the post by womanoffaith? I have been unable to locate it.

I am hanging on, but I am scared and still very hurt and sad.

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RU, click HERE for a link back to WofF's post to you.

You responded to her earlier regarding the part that didn't apply to your situation, but there was more information there in her post to you that might apply.

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RU, click HERE for a link back to WofF's post to you.

You responded to her earlier regarding the part that didn't apply to your situation, but there was more information there in her post to you that might apply.

Thank you. I looked for the response on a bunch of other threads instead of this one. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />

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Hee! Don't be embarrassed. These forums are huge, move fast and go back for years. There are a lot of ways to get lost. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

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RU,

If you click on the "Search" at the top of the page, it takes you to a screen where you can type

womanoffaith

into the box where it says to search by username.


Her old posts might help you.

You might also want to go over to "just found out" and read the notable posts thread started by pepperband. It is full of thoughts and ideas about MB principles, tried and true letters and concepts, and just really great posts from a wide variety of past and present members.

One thing I did was read on the recovery forum a lot when I first started. I wanted to know and understand what happens down the line - and this helped me so much in knowing what to expect! I was able to know that when I started feeling something, it was likely because I was hitting that phase of recovery, and that others had hit it before me, and that there were posts dealing with it that I had already read. I found that just knowing there was a timeline I was moving through was reassuring - and knowing what might happen to my feelings next made the difference.

You are in a recovery that really does have a pattern to it to a great degree. Read a lot here, on all the different forums, so you can see yourself in the posts of others, and understand what might be coming to an emotion near you.....


and hang in there. You are getting pretty great advice.

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RU,

I see you posting that you are not "drop dead gorgeous" and cannot compete.

You don't have to compete.

He already chose to stay married to you. You are not in a competition.

Also, it's important that you understand that this affair he had

IS NOT ABOUT YOU.

It is also not about the looks of the other woman.

It is about your husband's inability to protect himself and to protect his boundaries with other women, to stick to his vows, and to recognize the needs of the marriage above everything else.

He knows what this affair is about, and the idea that he wants you to "just get over it and move on" is evidence that he wants to bury his own guilt and not look at himself and his faults and behavior.

Because the affair was HIS choice about HIMSELF.

And not about you.

Remember that.

Had you been in the room when the vote was taken on the affair, you would have voted "no".

And he had to talk himself into this affair, don't forget that. It didn't "just happen", it was something thought about and fought about inside his head.

He fought himself, but CHOSE to give in to his own weakness.

And now he regrets that.

He now CHOOSES you.

The problem is that he is not doing the things he needs to do to make you feel as though the choice is positive, right, safe, and loving. You are not sure that his choice is one borne of love, or convenience, or guilt, or...what....

And you are insecure, blaming yourself, working on doing everything you can to be "good enough", look "good enough", feel "good enough". But RU, the affair wasn't about this - it wasn't really about YOU or YOUR faults.

It was about needs, and a marriage of TWO people that wasn't where it should have been, a loss of connection between the two of you, desires unmet, intimacy lost....and BOTH of you felt that.

But only one of you chose an affair.


And it takes both of you to fix it.

Give him Joseph's letter.

Tell him he needs to read it. And ask him to take just 10 minutes a night reading one of the books with you - Surviving an Affair, His Needs Her Needs, After the Affair, just one book for 10 minutes together.......ask for that time to help you heal. He needs to begin to understand that there is NO "just get over it", and that there is at least 2 years from when you guys BOTH start working before you really settle out and feel safe with him.

He broke the trust. He needs to get to the repair, and unfortunately you will have to work to get him the tools to do it. That's probably the worst part of this - too often the WS has to be dragged to the workbench.

SB

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RMJ,

Thank you for all the posts to me. Many of the things you write could be straight from my future journal.

I'm still having a great deal of trouble and sadness, though. I'm trying to minimize the LBs, but really have no desire to put effort into fulfilling my WS's ENs. After the devastation he has caused in my life two years in a row...it is almost like I look at him as a roommate.

Everyone keeps asking me (well, those who know...which aren't many), "What do you want to do?" Sounds so easy, doesn't it?...but for me it isn't. I saw the pain in my childrens' eyes last year when they were without a parent...I just can't imagine putting them through that again. Unlike my WS, I have a responsibility to these children...and their happiness matters to me a great deal.

Quote
You might be wondering why I'm here at MB if the problem is my H's.

I have to say it's because at the time of my dday and for awhile after, with the # of kids I had and the economic situation, I believed that i didn't have a choice but to stay with my H.

However, MB was one of the first sites I found following dday. And God must've had a reason to make me computer challenged...I was clueless to what a discussion forum was so never posted to it here at the time. If i had, I don't think i would've stayed M. But I did want to find a way to make co-existing with my H easier. I began utilizing the concepts of EN's, LB's, and a modified plan a in that I tried to make me and the M desirable.

As i implemented these ideas, i learned where I was lacking. I learned concepts about relationships and boundaries and things that made me in control of *me*. I was getting myself to the place that if my h dissed on me again, i wouldn't be brought down so low. I learned that while I couldn't control the behaviors of others, i had control of my reactions and responses to those behaviors.


And the light bulb went on...I actually had a big say in my life. I could direct it. Others didn't control me.

(Look at what womanoffaith said to you in another post...)

I raised the price of admission for so many people in my life. I learned that I could take care of me, had every right to, and the responsibility to God to do so.

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Thank you SB. I appreciate your post.

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He knows what this affair is about, and the idea that he wants you to "just get over it and move on" is evidence that he wants to bury his own guilt and not look at himself and his faults and behavior.

Because the affair was HIS choice about HIMSELF.

And not about you.

Remember that.

Had you been in the room when the vote was taken on the affair, you would have voted "no".

And he had to talk himself into this affair, don't forget that. It didn't "just happen", it was something thought about and fought about inside his head.

He fought himself, but CHOSE to give in to his own weakness.

And now he regrets that.

He now CHOOSES you.

The problem is that he is not doing the things he needs to do to make you feel as though the choice is positive, right, safe, and loving. You are not sure that his choice is one borne of love, or convenience, or guilt, or...what....
SB

SB,

I am bringing up this thread again because of some things my WS keeps saying:

"The affair was a symptom. We need to work on the root problem." (In reading CoDependancy No More, I'm finding we are both that way to the extreme.)

"Every time you bring up the affair, it takes me to H*** again. I have to relive the worst mistake of my life."

I have to heal from his affair, though! And I feel like I am being forced to do that alone. Alone, yet again.

What do I do?

Guess this is really for anyone wanting to answer...not just SB.

Thanks!

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I feel like I am being forced to do that alone. Alone, yet again.

What do I do?

Guess this is really for anyone wanting to answer...not just SB.

Thanks!
Hi RU
It sounds as if we are at the same stage! We are working with Jennifer and maybe I can pass on some of the wisdom we got from her.

We started by filling out the EN questionnaire. His was long and full of demands. Mine was . . . zero. I had NO ENs that I was interested in having him fill. She managed to eventually coax one or two tiny things out of me but that was all. As far as his ENs are concerned, I have NO INTEREST in filling them.

So we turned to the LBs. That was when the light came on. He was doing so many LBs that I had totally withdrawn. Totally blocked him out. As soon as she got him to stop some of the worst DJs, the situation improved. Who said there were no magic bullets? It certainly felt like a magic bullet from where I was! Once he stopped the worst of the LBs, I was able to consider meeting an EN or two which is where things stand right now.

Another thing; when we started counseling with her I told her that I did not know if the A was still going on as H had been cheating for 16 years without my knowledge so was evidently pretty good at it. She told me that she would know pretty quickly. Yesterday I asked her and she told me that she there was NC. How did she know? Because WH was trying! Apparently a WS will pay lip service to the recovery process but will not actually do much. I asked her about the fact that every day he asks me to 'get over it, put it behind me' and she told me that this was a normal reaction but that she would ask him to stop saying it as it was a LB.

Does any of this help at all?


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Yes, it helps. Every little bit helps.

I never expected to go through this...and now I read in everything that is a big "red light" for ending up dealing with this. At least one good thing will come from all of this - I will teach my children about starting a relationship and keeping it healthy...and affair-proofing from the get go.


Quote
Quote
I feel like I am being forced to do that alone. Alone, yet again.

What do I do?

Guess this is really for anyone wanting to answer...not just SB.

Thanks!
Hi RU
It sounds as if we are at the same stage! We are working with Jennifer and maybe I can pass on some of the wisdom we got from her.

We started by filling out the EN questionnaire. His was long and full of demands. Mine was . . . zero. I had NO ENs that I was interested in having him fill. She managed to eventually coax one or two tiny things out of me but that was all. As far as his ENs are concerned, I have NO INTEREST in filling them.

So we turned to the LBs. That was when the light came on. He was doing so many LBs that I had totally withdrawn. Totally blocked him out. As soon as she got him to stop some of the worst DJs, the situation improved. Who said there were no magic bullets? It certainly felt like a magic bullet from where I was! Once he stopped the worst of the LBs, I was able to consider meeting an EN or two which is where things stand right now.

Another thing; when we started counseling with her I told her that I did not know if the A was still going on as H had been cheating for 16 years without my knowledge so was evidently pretty good at it. She told me that she would know pretty quickly. Yesterday I asked her and she told me that she there was NC. How did she know? Because WH was trying! Apparently a WS will pay lip service to the recovery process but will not actually do much. I asked her about the fact that every day he asks me to 'get over it, put it behind me' and she told me that this was a normal reaction but that she would ask him to stop saying it as it was a LB.

Does any of this help at all?

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