We've both been tested - negative.

I don't know if he's in a physical affair right now. He was registered on a bunch of "local adult finder's sites" which I asked him to delete and he said he "forgot" where they are. I know he still gets invitations and, unfortunately, I teach at night.

I know he's still in online EA's. Sunday, I found him chatting with a OW online. I asked if I could read the chat and he basically became very angry and said he "minded" and "nothing was going on" and then implied that I could go ahead but he was in a very agressive stance. I've read enough of the other evidence I didn't bother reading this one.

His reaction told me all I needed to know.

Mys

I rarely post to anyone on this forum anymore, as I have, so far, chosen to stay in a marriage similar to yours, but after reading your post, I have to say that I would encourage you to leave this man as soon as possible. If you do not have children, there is nothing to keep you there....don't let him ruin any of the rest of your precious life....he may change someday, but he will not change while you stay with him as he has no reason to change...

The analogy of you being his favourite pet hits straight home with me, too....it hurts, but it's true....

You deserve better than this. Believe that.

LIR

the good news is that you have done plan A...

you gotta wrap your mind around the idea...

you have made changes....

so that in plan B....

you know you did work on your side of the street...

these things should empower....

look whats the reason he hasn't divorced you yet...
what do you think that is..

"On the other hand, I don't know if he will or even can make a committment to our marriage."

Does it matter which is the problem?
won't or can't?

The fact is he ISN'T committed to the marriage.

I was married to a serial adulterer for 25 years.
I didn't realize he had a problem at first...
and I thought he was behaving himself for a decade before he moved out to be with OW at the end...

Just before I read your thread I was thinking about how easy it is for sex/porn addicts to get their next fix these days compared to just a few decades ago. Just a few decades ago there was no internet access 24/7 to porn, no internet access to the sort of people who'd be willing to meet up with strangers for sex. (tv wasn't even on overnight back then) I was thinking how at least back then sex addicts didn't have so much easy access to their next fix, so much non-stop temptation to deal with. I assumed my WXH's problem was mostly under control when he convinced me to put eveyrthing in storage and travel to his jobs in an RV with him - no more ONS's on business trips or dating OW when he went on contract assignments for a few months at a time... but once he started with the online porn it wasn't long before he 'fell in love' with an OW at work and moved out.

Maybe he can't stop.

So you tell him to move out and go into Plan B.

Maybe he won't stop.

So you tell him to move out and go into Plan B.

For whatever reason, he HASN'T stopped.

So you tell him to move out and go into Plan B.

Does it really matter WHY he is the way he is?

If it turns out he is a sociopath and can't change, would you really consider letting him stay and living the rest of your life this way?

If it turns out he can change but just doesn't care enough about you to change, would you really consider letting him stay and living the rest of your life this way?

Regardless of WHY he is the way he is, the longer you let him stay and accept his abuse the less likely he is to ever change.

Oh and I understand all about your hesitancy because of financial issues and such...

And so does he BTW. He's aware that you feel so dependent on him...

I made the mistake of not making a stand because I was scared (and because pre-internet as far as I could tell he was trying and behaving - he no longer went on business trips).

I didn't leave my WH.
He left me.

Don't assume that by staying with him you're buying yourself ANY SPECK real security, that somehow he will then feel obligated to never leave you. You may think you're somehow bargaining an agreement such as: 'well I didn't leave him even after what he did, so I can at least feel secure he won't leave me for an OW'.

It doesn't work that way, trust me.
I DID have to deal with all that financial stuff, and a divorce, and two suicidal daughters, and sometimes even myself feeling suicidal, all at once, at a time when I had just been diagnosed with severe (level 4) hypertension, with no relatives in the state, my resume having not been updated in 2 decades...

Get yourself ready girl ASAP.
Because even if you do not kick him out, he may just leave anyway.

Here's a strategy that helped me immensely when I was facing indecision, when fear and uncertainty started to paralyze me (in my case it was indecision over WH's dragging out his being 'torn' between me and OW over a few years and several false recoveries):

I made a Venn diagram with one circle containing my to-do list for if my WH stopped the divorce and came home. Another circle was filled with my to-do list for if my WH went through with divorcing me for the OW. There were a LOT of thigns common to both to-do lists, in the overlapping part of the Venn diagram. So whatever the WH's mood du jour was, whatever point he was at on his rollercoaster of wishy-washy-ness *I* still had my own plan I could be working on instead of waiting for him to decide.

Eventually I caught on that the things I was avoiding, getting my finances in order and becoming less dependent on him, belonged in that overlapping area too, not just in the 'if he leaves me for OW' circle. Becuase I realized that he was exploiting my dependency on him, counting on it to keep me too scared to set boundaries and to Plan B his butt.

YOU need to give no further thought to why your WH is a sex/porn addict because until he is willing to give it up, it's not even relevent, he just IS an addict is all you need to know for now.

YOU still need to have a plan to follow, to eliminate your dependency on him, and to be no-bluffing prepared to move on without him if he doesn't wise up.

Hi Mys,

Look below my moniker. You are not alone neighbor!

My mom has bipolar disorder and alcohol killed my dad in 1993. I'm an only child.

Oh yes, I WAS married to a serial cheater too. That is what brought me here in 2000. At the time I joined I wanted to know what "I" did to have a guy cheat for 12 years. Well duh, I know better now! The kicker is that I didn't find out he cheated until AFTER I left him. People literally came out of the woodwork with information, names, places, years.

I can't IMAGINE what it feels like to have him do this right under your nose! The pain he is willing to inflict on you says he is not marriage material. He pretended. To me when someone cheats over and over from pretty much day 1 the contract (marriage) you signed was bogus and you have a great big OUT mentally and physically! (to me from my experience)

My adult daughter was so darned angry I'll never forget the loud words "Mom, HE COULD HAVE KILLED YOU!!!". (std's)

You HAVE to make a plan and follow through. Like what was said before one foot in front of the other. It may feel like you have 100 lb weights around your ankles. That is NORMAL!

You are one smart lady and I think you'd feel healthier faster the sooner you get away from your abuser. He IS abusing you!

I care!!!

I'm 45 miles from the KS/NE line in the south central tri-city area.

Oh PUH-LEAZE!

mys, do you see that this is a man who wants everything he wants, gives nothing because it doesn't help him, cares nothing about your happiness because it doesn't benefit him, and keeps you around cos you're giving him regular SF and probably food and cleaning?

Why would you want that crap? There are MUCH better men out there, just waiting to meet you.

What? No way should it take a YEAR!!! That is NUTS!!! He made the decision to commit to the marriage WHEN HE GOT MARRIED!!!

(Sorry to shout Mys, but my level of frustration with your husband is through the roof after reading your thread...the shouting isn't at you, though if it will help you take ACTION, I will gladly shout "til the cows come home"...)

I can assure you that your husband is VERY HAPPY with your counselors as they are allowing him the status quo at YOUR expense!!!

ENOUGH!!!

NO MORE.

THIS.

MUST.

STOP.

NOW.

TODAY...YOU decide that YOU are worth it...That LIFE is VALUABLE and far too precious to waste another second living like this...


Firstly, I will say that I am not one that buys the sexual addiction theory...I think that the psychology arena has decided to give SELFISH OVERINDULGENCE a name that they can try and "treat"...It is "therapism"...Instead of just calling it what it is... SIN/DEVIANT BEHAVIOR...Your husband is CHOOSING this...I do not believe for one second that it is an "illness" that he does not have the power to control...

And yes, Plan B would MOST CERTAINLY "work" on "addicts" - actually it is a GREAT way to let them know that their choice to behave in that way is UNACCEPTABLE and REMOVES you from the equation - Boundaries work GREAT with abusive people...Please remember though that Plan B is about and for YOU...Whether it will "work" on him is not the issue at hand...


Mys, you need to bring the bottom UP...His hitting rock bottom may very well depend on YOU taking ACTION...Otherwise you just enable him to continue to abuse you...Enabling is NOT kind to either one of you...


He will not change until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change...Count on it Mys...

You must ACT...

Let's start with steps...

1. Get out your phone book...look up attorneys...Call one...Find out about legal separation/getting him removed from the house/temp spousal support...etc...

Come back here, report and we'll go from there...

Ready...Set...GO...

See you in a bit...

Mrs. W

FYI: I know a couple of MB'ers located in KS.

You are right to choose Plan B, MYS. Don't make any decisions about divorce while you are in this precarious mental state. You don't have to make any decisions under duress. Better to make such a decision after a few months in Plan B when you have your strength back and have a sound mind with which to make a good decision.

Agree Mel!

Just to clarify, calling an attorney regarding legal separation would only be a means to get Myschae's husband out of the marital home and cover her financial bases...

Mys, consulting an attorney/filing for legal separation is not the same as divorcing...I am certainly not suggesting that you make that kind of decision right now...

Mrs. W

And don't forget about opening your own bank account-- in your name ONLY-- TODAY!

You have two missions today:

1. Call the women's shelter/a lawyer. SOMEONE with law knowledge and can help guide you legally.

2. Get your own bank account set up in ONLY your name.

3. Do not tell your H about either of these things-- do it for you!

Mys--

DON'T EVER GROW A WISHBONE WHERE YOUR BACKBONE SHOULD BE!

E.

ETA: I think finding the other MBs that live near you might be a good thing, if they are willing to communicate with you off the boards, even by telephone. They can help you follow the plan when you feel that you are slipping-- and its better than having to get to a computer, coming here, and posting and waiting for a response... (not that I'm suggesting you leave here... just a more "immediate" support system might help)... kinda like an AA sponsor...

Dunno who they are or if they'd be willing... just a thought since someone brought it up...

Mys,

It's been a minute since I've been on the boards but a dear friend asked that I look at this thread, Thanks RAGS......

Anywhichwho, it looks like you've got some wonderful advice thus far on this terrible situation. So you know, I'm a recovering Drug Addict with over 4 years clean, so I have a bit of insight on how addiction works.

So let me briefly talk about him. First off, lets presume this is some type of addiction. Addicts lie, cheat, steal, and basically do anything possible to get their next fix. Addicts feel little if no remorse for anything as they live in a self-centered world and somehow/someway, this whole thing is someone elses FAULT (I think you said he blamed you because you were "negative"). I will say right up front that I totally disagree with advice of "confronting him", to me that is beating a dead horse.

In my humble opinion, the only thing an addict can understand is a hard cold consequence. That consequence may be from you putting up a strong boundary, though I doubt it. It may come from getting a disease. It may come from you moving out. It may come from you filing for legal seperation and getting alimony. It may come from a divource. He's the problem, you truly have no control over which of these, if any, will have a profound enough impact upon his life to get him to turn things around. As an example, I as a divorced addict ran my car into a bridge breaking 21 bones. I was in and out of hospitals/nursing homes for 3 months & that was not a strong enough consequence for me to quit my addiction. It planted a seed that maybe someday I'd stop. However, not having my girls for one weekend as a result of my addiction, was enough to get me to seek help.

With all that being said, my personal opinion would say that it's time for a serious Plan B. And quite honestly, as that's been talked out on the boards all I've heard from you is "I don't know how I could do it". I fully realize and appreciate that it is a scary proposition but please look at a couple of things;

1. Look at the out pouring of love and care flowing from this board.

2. Look at the support group rallying behind you, offering to pick you up in your time of need and run the race with you.

So, if that were to be the desired course of action, I'd ask to seek an attitude of "How can I make this happen" and look at all the avenues that open up to you.

Lastly, I also live in the Sunflower State, born and raised in Dodge City but I now live in Salina. I know a little about the laws here.

Mys,

what would you think about getting together with Ragamuffin and LH at some point, make new friends who could also be some type of support system for you..it sounds like both of them would be willing to at least meet with you.

Maybe the group of you could meet for coffee sometime??

Mys--

Did you get your bank account and call a lawyer/women's shelter yesterday?

Check in with us!

E.

Mys--

You've posted on a few other threads today, so I know you've been around...

Are you avoiding my (our) questions?

I'm assuming you didn't make any phone calls or go to the bank yesterday... or you probably would have told us about it...

What steps are you taking for YOURSELF TODAY??

You can't come here for help and just vent or complain... if you want out of this situation, you have to DO something... or it will do nothing but get worse and make you feel worse-- its not gonna get better on its own. Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result is insanity.

So, at the VERY least, please call a women's shelter to get legal advice, or call a lawyer and set up a free consultation just to learn your RIGHTS--- TODAY!

That's not getting divorce, it is educating yourself and covering your tookus. And making sure you are prepared.

I still think you should set up your own bank account too, Mys-- but for now the most important thing is getting some legal advice.

Let us know what's going on, what you've DONE.

ETA: I don't want this to come across as harsh or 2x4ing-- I really don't. I'm really concerned about you Mys, and wish I lived closer to KS-- I'd track your butt down, drag you out out for a cup of coffee to browse the yellow pages for options! Unfortunately, that would involve me buying a plane ticket though ...

I think that coffee with the above mentioned MBs would be really beneficial for you.

Please check in Mys. I don't want you to disappear, you need help, we are here for you!


E.

{{{{Mys}}}}

I haven't seen any advice here to disagree with. Plan B is necessary, but it's not the end of your marriage! It's the beginning of a new you! One who can take care of herself for a time!

Confrontining in love? it means that you love the person so much, you keep them from harming others (including yourself) becasue you know how much damage that does to them and others.

Think of Lord Voldemort. When he killed, it ripped his soul. When we harm others, a similar thing happens. In time, we dont' even recognize ourselves.

Preventing someone from harming others is not an evil, hateful thing. It is done in love! It is done to protect a person from their own actions, and done to protect others from the consequences of their actions.

I don't think you could act with anything but love, Mys. I think you love L too much to do anything hateful to him, even if you got a little bit angry or frustrated or pissy.

That is not selfish. You are supposed to have some aspect of self-preservation. That's what makes you human.

So, confronting him in love? You already know what that is.

You know what I think? I think you punish yourself any time you think you've hurt someone else, especially someone you love like L. But, I don't think you've done anything to harm him, and there is, as you already know, a difference between hurt and harm.

I think it's important that you get comfortable with hurting others when you know that the short-term pain will translate into long-term gain, such as telling your students to keep time tables, or the other challenges you provide. This makes them better programmers.

All you are doing here, is challenging L to become a better husband so that you can have a good relationship, a better one, one that is satisfying for the both of you, but that starts with some boundaries. Tendency toward a totally dependent relationship on your part is unacceptable, not to mention dangerous, as it seems has been evidenced here!

I don't know what all has happened since the last time I posted, but I am sorry for the loss of your husband and best friend, as you knew him.

There is still love in the world, Mys. There is still love for you, even if through a computer. There is still protection and safety for you.

Plan B isn't about giving up; it's about the very thing you want to do: save your marriage.

You know where I am; contact me, any time.

YIM

Myschae,

I am sorry for all you have suffered. All of it.

Like the others here, I doubt it is in your best interest to stay with your H. He is abusive. You know it, too. This is codependency. I learned a lot about codependency form Alanon – my family is full of addicts.

One of the things children of addicts and abusive parents do is marry the same kind of person. It’s astounding how often this happens. You are still a prisoner of your childhood. As I was when I married my wife.

My W was in a VLTA that lasted half our M. And an EA (possible PA) before that. Even after I found out about these A’s I stayed because I was too scared to leave. Confrontation is scary. I was a card carrying member of CA International. I used every excuse I could think of to avoid making her think about what she was doing head on including stuffing it, using ADs, thinking endurance was best for the kids and venting to a series of incompetent ICs.

Confrontation is complicated. It is an art. It takes practice. You will learn by doing. Slowly and in small things at first.

But at the moment you have nothing to confront him with. You know. He knows. He knows you know. You know he knows you know. What’s to confront?

I did not have family I could lean on. And I sacrificed most of my friends to my abusive M, like abused women tend to do (even though I am a guy).

I wanted to die, too. Not suicide. At least not active. Just disappear and die. I hoped for it.

But I eventually had to choose slow death or risk it all. You will have to risk it all too.

Life is much, much better for me now. I confronted both W and OM. Then I stood up and turned away. W left for six months but then begged to come back. We are not divorced, although it may still come to that, yet the M is much better than it was when W was so abusive.

I felt so much better after I took control of my life I can’t describe it.

I see a lot of strength in you. More than you realize you have. I truly see you getting control of your emotions and standing up.

Hope is not a plan. You need to plan! Little steps at first.


With prayers,

PS: I don’t understand the past Oct D-Day. I see you registered and started posting back in 02. You certainly have gone down hill since then. Have you known about or suspected what is going on since 02?

PPS: If I could convince you of one and only one thing I would ask you to lean on God a bit. This is what got me through. And it wasn’t just hope. It was active intervention.

Mysch,

Please, just six months of not having any contact with him. That is not divorce.

My God, you are on mind altering prescription drugs because of this man. You don't need him. You do not need to be with a man that causes you to be on drugs just to cope.

Please get away from him. At least for six months.

Mysch, life is full of beautiful, wonderful people. And you are one of those people.

You are so smart, you have so much to offer and so much life to live. Please don't let this marriage take that away from you.

Marriage is supposed to be a place where love grows, where love expands, first between the two in it and then outwards to the community. It is a place of security, where hope and dreams grow. A safe place where love grows. This is it's purpose.

Just six months Mysch. And then re-evalutate.

Yesterday I took a significant downswing and had to all my support team in to call me down from the edge. I think medc is right. It's not fair to use these boards with the amount of suicidal ideations I am experiencing now.

I want to thank everyone for your support now but I need more than this board can feasibly offer.

Thank you all,

Mys

that's not even close to what I said...But...




Your are right about this. You need help FAR beyond what can be offered on an internet site. Please get impatient help before it is too late. If your doctors do not agree...get new doctors. You are a classic case of someone that needs inpatient care.

God bless. Take care of yourself Mys.