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gabagool, I am talking about the RULE, not the exception. I don't know if the babblings of a falling down drunk are true or not in every case.[I doubt if the falling down drunk even knows what is true] In almost every case we have seen here, it is NOT TRUE and the BS can even demonstrate it is not true with recent loveletters, cards, etc.

Even so, it doesn't matter if its true or not, because the remedy is the same.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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Is your wife in an affair, gaba? dontknow


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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I will be happy to give you some suggestions on steps you need to take here in BC.

How can I contact you as I am open to any suggestions and options at this point.

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Mel is giving you great advice. She helped me for a very long time. Hi, Mel!

I agree Mel has been great. I do understand the fog babble part of this. The frustrating part is not being able to have much influence over the actions of the other person you have placed your love and trust in for years. It is sick and cruel.

Thank you for taking the time to post.


Me 58 BS


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This is what ALL affairees say. They say they have been out of love for years. This is called FOGBABBLE.

I understand Mel. Thanks.

The point of my bringing this up was this confession took place about 5 years ago, so her resentment and anger has been building since that time.

Like a fool I was optimistic that things were slowly improving as there was less conflict, what was really happening was she was withdrawing. Hindsight is 20 - 20.

This challenge is trying to retain perspective when you are feeling beat up, confused, angry, hopeful, discouraged, sad, lonely, anxious, depressed, sick. I literally cried for the first time in many years over this situation. The pain and sorrow has been intense. As many who have been here know the rollercoaster ride you are on is more than bearable at times.

One hopes things can be worked out on one hand, yet you have to prepare yourself incase it cannot be resolved. It feels like walking a razor blade in bare feet, you get injured in the process, and one slip can be disaterous. I know what I want to do but I cannot predict the behaviour of my W, I cannot control what she is doing.

Then I begin to wonder how long can a person live in such craziness. There are complications in my situation as well. It seems my W has traits of a personality disorder and one of those traits is if there is no apparent crisis then one will be created. Living in this chaos takes its toll on your mental well being. That is why most of my friends and two of my children have said to me -"You have been very tolerent I think you will be better off on your own" "Get away from the craziness". Intellectually I understand what they are saying and I appreciate there care and concern. The issue is I am still attached emotionally, even though my wife tells me how out of touch and disconnected I am to my emotions.

I have buried my mother and father, and I think dealing with death is easier than dealing with marital issues like this. Death has a finality to it. This is prolonged and painful. Nothing prepares you for this sort of situation. It is like being in a car accident, you get injured, you go into shock, you try to get help. This forum has been my lifeline. I literally thought I was going nuts until I found this place. Maybe I am going nuts I have friends that would agree with that LOL.

Thanks to all of you who have taken the time to post. I reread my entire post again last night and believe it or not I do hear what you are saying. I do realize I do get lost in my own fog through this process. I am having difficulty seeing the forest for the trees, so thanks for your patience and persistance in gettng through to me. And thanks for letting me ramble on. It is theraputic and helps to clarify my thoughts to dialogue on her.

For those of you who are so inclined I would appreciate your prayers for wisdom and strength.





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Well, you are going to have to take better care of yourself. For awhile, you will need to meet many of your emotional needs yourself.

I don't know what you are interested in, but start doing things. Exercise, go out with friends, join a upport or hobby group, detail the car, organize the garage, volunteer, start a business, whatever.....

These things will bring up your general satisfaction and self-esteem.

In the meantime, I would stop talking to your wife about relationship issues. Just enjoy yourself and keep busy.

Also, move back into your own bed.

Would she go do something fun with you? I would try that, and if she refuses, go alone, and come back and tell her how much fun you had. The idea is to see if she would spend any time at all with you doing things she likes. It might take some time.

You can slowly turn this thing around. I think it sounds very promising.

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Hi, Believer. How are you doing? wink

bcboy, another great vet is helping you.


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There are some things that a lot of adulterers do. First of all, I have found through personal experience, that a lot of them play the woe is me, I am not happy and haven't been in oh, such a long time. And yes, often it includes the speaking to a friend.

However, that is an "out" for them in my opinion. After all, if they had stuck it out after they have "shared" their unhappiness, well then they "tried", didn't they.

A big load of manure imho. Trying is not 'doing' is it? I have found that so very often, after a false recovery, the WS says' "Well, I tried, didn't I?". When all the while the trying is leaving the door open to run away from thei family and their vows.

Plus,instead of sharing a confidence with a friend, if they had been up front with their partner/spouse, would that not have caused some action reaction and an effort to make things better between you? I firmly believe that all this woe is me is emotional blackmail and frankly, abuse. All wrapped up in an I gotta be me package that gives the WW or WH a big fat excuse for being a faithless partner.

And on that note, I will back off, to leave you in the great vets on this board. As I am not sure it is helpful to you at this point to hear of my own experience and opinions.



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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Is your wife in an affair, gaba? dontknow

Still not that I can tell, I think she will end up a walk away wife...its been a year of this garbage and I STILL can't believe it.

Also, ML, you and others have been telling BC to move back into his bed.....I don't understand. With HIS WIFE IN THE SAME BED??!!!?!?? Or are you saying kick her out of bed?

I understand exposing, I understand the wisdom behind plan a and plan b, but this sleeping with your wife when she wants to VOMIT just looking at you.....man, sleeping together IS SUPPOSED to be an
action of love, of complete and utter trust, of protection, warmth and comfort...the sex is just icing on the cake! I could never, so I can understand why BC would feel like sleeping alone.

Is telling him to go back to his bed a way of showing hes a tough guy or something? please explain, thanks.

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Well, who wants to share a bed with someone who might vomit on them?

But the point is, SHE is unhappy in the bed, and SHE should address that by sleeping in the basement, in her car, or moving out. It is not his problem.

Affairees are selfish creatures. If they don't like the living accomodations in the marital home, they need to be the one who moves.

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Originally Posted by gabagool
Is telling him to go back to his bed a way of showing hes a tough guy or something? please explain, thanks.

Not at all. Its a way of treating her to the consequences of her choices. If he moves back into his own bed, TO WHICH HE HAS A RIGHT, she has a choice. She can either sleep with him and get used to it, or SHE can go sleep on the floor.

If she does not want to sleep with her H, then why should HE be the one to get kicked out of his own bed? That is ridiculous! If she wants to sleep separately, then she should be the one who experiences the consequences of that choice, NOT HER HUSBAND.

What kind of a JERK kicks a man out of his own bed? And why would you EMBOLDEN such a jerk by appeasing her? dontknow

I just don't understand men sometimes. If a man came home and tried to kick a wife out of her own bed and her own room, she would LAUGH! Why do men allow themselves to be pushed around like that? You men are just too wimpy sometimes.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

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If she wants to vomit when he is in the marital bed, I would suggest she sleep in the bathroom, that way she will be close to the porcelain god and not make such a mess.

OTOH, his marital bed is the bedrock of where the M started and was consumated. Why would any man in his right mind give that up. this is much more about what WW gave up by her unfaithfulness, and the consequence of no longer desiring to be in the marital bed rests solely on her, not the BS.

Gabo, no one said the BS kicked her out of her bed. If she leaves it, as she has already done metaphorically, it's all on her , not the BS.

I never gave up my bed, but did on several occasions, ask WW to sleep elsewhere, as she was no longer welcolmed in my marital bed. But that was a long time ago, and things have changed for the better since then.

she understands, the boundaries now.

All Blessings,
Jerry

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I left my bed BEFORE my wife began this walkaway krap. It was a combo of no sexlife, her complaining about the way I slept (or didn't) and I just felt like she couldn't stand me.

I now feel that THAT was my SINGLE BIGGEST MISTAKE. I never should have left that room. Now, I see it as ME getting the ball rolling.


Yeah, BC, you should move back to the room, on second thought. It's gonna be rough, but a sacrifice NOW may pay off big in the future.

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What kind of a JERK kicks a man out of his own bed? And why would you EMBOLDEN such a jerk by appeasing her?


Well a WW who wants to cake eat thats who. I am more than a little ticked off right now. You are absolutely right why try to appease someone who bold face lies to you. Well tonight I just did up a couple of scenarios for her so she can see what the division of assets would look like. GULP - not such a rosy picture for her. She is really upset that she will be facing a change in lifestyle.


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You men are just too wimpy sometimes.

Well not any more folks. After watching her do her little temper tantrum about how she will have to get a mortgage I mentioned to her that she said to me "I can't think about the money right now I have to look after my happiness" and that she is the moving party in wanting to separate then it is not my problem that she does not like the outcome.

So if you want to act so disrespectfully then look out for the consequences. I asked her last night if she has been in contact with the OM. Oh noooooo I have not heard from him, "you have blown this waaaayyy out of proportion, have you apologized to him yet????" Well low and behold I check and find out that he has been calling her every two days, imagine that, a WW caught in a lie. So if she thinks she can try and kick me to the curb, and treat me with so much disrespect then forget it sister this cowboy is moving on. I am no ones doormat. You want to go find yourself then good luck to you.

Every man has his limit and I think I just reached mine. Lady you want to be independent then your wish is my command.



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GG - Who says you can't undo a mistake? What's she going to do? Give you more of the same? So...start by taking naps in there and letting her catch you being comfortable in your own bed again.

Then one night go to bed before her and stay there. Get that ball rolling...

Sooly


Sooly

"Stop yappin and make it happen."
"The will of God will never take you where the Grace of God will not protect you."

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Just wanted to get some feedback from here. My wife has continued down the road of separation. Her view is we just separate for about 1 year, keep everything the way it is financially, where we both live out of the same bank account. My response is I am not interested in separating I am interested in working on our marriage. She also tells me I am her problem. She is very angry and disrespectful when ever she speaks to me. I am continuing to be polite and pleasant. She is focusing on issues that happened 20 years ago and cannot see I have changed my behaviour. My kids have said to me "Dad you have changed, but Mom refuses to see it, if she acknowledges you have changed she will no longer have a scapegoat"

Today she said she talked to the lawyer last week and the lawyer told her I have no business in her personal life. She has done nothing wrong, but she may as well have because she is being tarred with the same brush as if she has. She is still angry that I confronted her "friend". I also suspect she enjoyed the attention and invited it. The exposure seems to have dampened the contact between the two of them.

I get this written note. "We are not working on the marriage right now, we are seperated - which means living apart and working on our individual issues - which can't be done living together (has been tried) now we recognize that and try separation with a hope to reconcilliation. Do you understand why we need to be apart?"

I don't understand this, as I think this sounds like an excuse for her to get her space and to test drive some other relationships. As I was doing some investigation I discovered she had a singles newspaper ad clipped out and was hiding it. But she keeps saying she is not interested in starting another relationship.

She is not willing to work on the marriage. But she does not want the consequences of separation financially. But she insists on separation physically. No negotiation on that one.

It seems to me if you insist on separation then you separate. Am I missing something here? This is becoming increasingly confusing.

Is there ever an end to the turmoil, pain and confusion?



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" It seems my W has traits of a personality disorder and one of those traits is if there is no apparent crisis then one will be created. Living in this chaos takes its toll on your mental well being. That is why most of my friends and two of my children have said to me -"You have been very tolerent I think you will be better off on your own" "Get away from the craziness". "

Most of your friends and at least two of your children are BEGGING you to get away from this toxic woman and regain your ability to have a normal life. Please listen to them!

This woman wants your money, and the easy lifestyle that is all. She is acting heinously. And has been even before this affair. You are so used to it that you still love her, as heinous as she is as a person and as miserable as she makes you and all those around her.

Please buy a clue and divorce her. If you want a life free of daily heartache.

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"I am starting to favour leaving the marriage for the following reasons:
1) Loss of trust in her - This is huge
2) Her continued criticism of me
3) She is not willing to go to MC
4) She is pursuing Legal Separation - Lawyers now involved.
5) Continued contact - underground with OM
6) Her personality disorder -
7) Constant creation of turmoil and chaos - part of personality disorder
8) continually changing requirements from her for what I would need to do to restore the M.
9) Feels I am emotionally abusive.
10) Feels I am emotionally disconnected
11) High level of conflict and tension between us


Please read what you wrote here. It is really important. You are worth having a good life. This toxic woman will ruin the rest of your life affair or no affair.

"I think I am being motivated by a fear of being alone, fear of loss, change etc...."

Yes, I understand you wanting to fight for the marriage since you have been with this toxic woman so long it almost seems normal for you. It does take some adjusting to be away from a person we have been with for 20 years. Even if they are very bad or toxic for us. But your kids are grown. You can now leave her.



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bcboy

How are you?

Just wondering. Hope you are okay. : )

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I am bumping this for the benefit of Geno that Melody has been helping.

Also just an update.
1) Tnanks to Melody Lane I have been continuing on with Plan A. Wife is pursing the separation still.
2) Son is having difficulty and is expressing anger towards his mother wondering why she can't get along with his dad.
3) I have repeatedly told my wife I do not want to separate.
4) Wife is playing the role of a martyr as she is saying she knows that the person who decides to separate is viewed as the bad person (which really upsets her as she needs to be viewed in a positive light at all times) - (she is even making comments that she is prepared to loose her family because of her actions)
5) Children are viewing her behaviour as peculiar and they are dealing with it by distancing (or limiting contact) themselves from her.
6) She will soon have to economically support herself as a result of her decision to separate. This will likely be a real wake up call for her as she does not make much.
7) Friends have been calling her questioning what she is doing. Some have been very pointed in telling her what she is doing is wrong.
8) Wife is concerned her reputation has been damaged because I have exposed her relationship with the neighbour.
9) Friends have been telling her she is not free to pursue another relationship even though she is separated, she is still married.
10) Believe it or not I have reason to believe there has been no PA (she is absolutely paranoid about STD's), however I feel she definately been involved in an EA. I have still told her this is adultery.
11) I am making plans to be the best man God wants me to be. I am looking at taking a training course and then travel overseas to help underpriveledged people (part of my therapy)
12) I will be doing everything possible to get a better connection between my head and my heart. I have been very successful at being rational and have been told I am good at strategic planning, but I am really bad at recognizing emotions. I was brought up believing that real MEN don't have them or need them (Think John Wayne) and learned how to stuff them. I am slowly starting to understand but need Gods help and mercy in this area.

13) I have read many womens frustrations with their husbands, that they are not meeting emotional needs. I suspect there are many men (like me) who have very little idea about emotions (good at doing, fixing, thinking) they don't know their own emotions so be patient with your men ladies, it is not intentional, we have just not connected the way you have. I know it seems improbable because it comes so easily and natural for you. But in my case you really are speaking a foreign language.

So I have learned I am not always in control of my situation. There are some situations you just have to accept and make the best of.

God Bless


Me 58 BS


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