I hope you have a better day today W1

It's very sad what this young woman put you through. Your story is an example of why I plan on having some serious discussions with both my daughter and my son as they get into that portion of their young lives. So sorry for your son.

I hope today will be calmer.

For now, my son will stay officially enrolled in his high school, but will be on independent study for at least the next month. This was the best we could do, and the only option that would leave the door open for him to walk at graduation if we can get the judge to agree to it at our next hearing.

Imanotherone: We've had that talk with all of our kids. We also had a no dating until the age of 16 rule. Guess that didn't work. So, as far as the baby goes, she's officially not allowed to have a boyfriend or date until she's 30 and married.

I hope all your days are calmer. Prayers are up for you and yours. We have a local girl in trouble for sexting pictures of herself to several boys, and the parents of the girl are angry that the boys she sent them to are not also in trouble, which I find troubling. They didn't DO anything. But it gives me hope that some judicial systems are reasonable, and I pray that yours will be in this matter.

That's like my rule, writer. Mine are not allowed to date until they are older.

Than me.

Good rule!

See, I just tell my DD that dating is irrelevant because I am sure God loves me enough that Jesus will come back before she is old enough to date. She just rolls her eyes.

I think these are all excellent strategies!

Writer - it's past time to reconnect this young man and yourself with your faith. I've been feeling so strongly about saying something for the last week since you posted it but didn't really know why.

It's such a part of who you are, that I'm certain that the distance is adding to your pain right now.

Please go with your son and talk to the bishop and seek a blessing.

Two really good books to help: "He Did Deliver Me From Bondage" - I only remember the author's first name "Colleen". And the other is "The Worth of Every Soul" or the previous title "The Worth of A Soul" by Stephen Cramer (he used a pseudonym for the first edition, then re-wrote it under his real name). You and your son could benefit from reading these two books together while he's home on independent study. Pray and fast about a solution.

Writer - I'm new to the forums (posting at least, been lurking a while) but I've always admired you and your story. I just wanted to let you know I'm very sorry for the situation your family is in and I'm praying for you. I'm also LDS and if I knew your name I'd put it on the temple prayer roll (you're free to email me, my addy should be in my profile - I'm not sure if I can put Writer1 down on the little slips, though I'm sure the Lord knows what I'd mean).

I don't have much advice but just lettin' you know I'm here. Oh and I am completely on board with your dating strategy for your daughter....

Writer-I continue to hope for a good outcome for you boy. I'm sure this is a horrible time for you. I shared a bit of your story with my 13-year-old this morning--told her that young women should NEVER abuse the truth for personal gain.

I did the same yesterday with my 17 yr old son; told him if by chance I had a daughter, I'd be having a similar but different conversation with her.

Thinking and praying for you, W1

I'm glad our story is touching other people's lives for the better. We've had many "sex" talks with our kids, mostly revolving around the fact that you shouldn't do it until you are old enough and mature enough to accept responsibility for your actions. We've always made it clear to our kids that sex is for committed, mature, married people. My son has told me many times over the past week that he wishes now that he would have listened to us on this one. It never occurred to me that something like this could happen to our family.

Kayla: I have been contemplating the church situation for a long time. I didn't grow up in the church, or any church for that matter, and I realize now that I joined for all the wrong reasons, mostly social. There are some things I struggled with for a long time, and then when I started grad school, I really started to question everything I had done and why I did it. I still don't have all the answers. Sometimes, I feel as though I really want to go back to church. There are some things I miss about it a lot. But there are still a few unanswered questions and issues standing in my way. It seems so difficult to overcome. Plus, no one else in my family is thrilled about going back. The boys would rather sleep on Sunday mornings, though they do attend Seminary and Mutual (well, I guess my 17-year old won't be going to Seminary anymore, since he isn't allowed near the school and the church is across the street). My H has developed a bit of a coffee habit. I don't know how many cups a day he consumes to keep himself awake at work, since none of us are getting much sleep these days. He seems amicable enough about going back, but not terribly excited.

We're taking a night off tonight. My 17-year-old is staying with my mom and my other son is watching the baby and my H and I are going to see Five For Fighting in San Diego. We've had the tickets for awhile and didn't want them to go to waste. I'm having a hard time getting into the thought of going to a concert right now, but I'm sure we'll have fun once we get there.

Don't let coffee or sleep keep you away - your family desperately needs the spiritual fortification right now. I've read what you write, when you write about your faith and while you have questions, you also have more answers than you give yourself credit for. Use the link I posted in OT and watch Elder Holland's talk, then watch two a day until you've watched the entire conference - there were some great things shared that would comfort you or direct you right now in this situation.

Also - call your son's seminary teacher and see if he can watch conference talks and write reports or something to help him keep up there. I realize that his admitted behavior with this girl may keep him from graduating from seminary, but he still needs the spiritual strengthening.

I don't want you to blame yourself here, but please realize that your son's recovery will be easier with the return to his faith than without it.

And your marriage has a greater probability of survival in activity than outside of that activity. Going to church, reading scriptures and praying as a family tends to help husbands remember their priorities rather than blame.

P.S. I didn't grow up in an active family - everything I do within my faith is because my husband and I chose to make it a priority. Our path has not been easy; in fact it's been pretty doggone tough, but I would hate to see how I would think and feel about my life if it weren't for my faith and daily renewal in that faith.

Writer, I understand your frustration. We can talk to our kids about the dangers of premarital sex, and of having sex at a young age, but it seems we can't arm them with the tools necessary when those strong teen urges strike.
Look at the Palin family. I'm quite sure that mom and dad told Bristol "just say no," but when push came to shove, those hormones kick in. Your situation is compounded not by an unexpected pregnancy, but by felony allegations. In many ways, to your son, I'm sure this is worse than an unplanned pregnancy. I wish I had an answer.
Sadly, I don't think any of our Western religions do a good job in preventing teen sex. In some, it just encourages kids to get married "very early," to prevent unwed sex, but is that really the solution? Had your son "married" this girl, were they really adult enough to be committed? Of course not. So, in the eyes of the church, your son gets tossed, while some other 17-year-old who decides to marry his teen bride gets a pat on the back. Neither was ready, IMO.
But that's for another day, after we get past this crisis. I feel terrible for your son. And in the "church of imanotherone," he certainly would be welcome

Talked to a prosecutor friend of mine here in Michigan whose had to make decisions in these type cases many times.

He suggested you try to get a PRIVATE polygraph test. If your son passes (which he should...right?) then you give the private test results to the prosecutor and offer to take a state one thereafter...if required (they MAY rely on the private one since most private ones are adminstered by the same people they know and trust). IF he fails...you keep the results your own little secret and WORRY because your son is lying to you. Probably plea bargain time at that point.

He also said that 99.99% of the time, a woman that young will NOT recant her story. She's too invested in the lie and mostly do to parental pressure will NOT cop to the truth. Her friends will most likely lie for her too (as will/would your sons friends) so all those outside parties just aren't trustworthy no matter what they say. [though getting HER friend to incriminate her would be beneficial].

As a prosecutor...HE, personally, was reticent to prosecute and charge people in these situations UNLESS he felt he could get a guilty verdict. He wondered if there was more to the story or if the prosecutor had a few "golden nuggets" of information (like maybe an email or saved chat session wherein your son "apologized" for being "aggressive" or forcing her or something) because that's what it would have taken him to move forward (based upon the facts & circumstances you gave me including...the delay, the phone calls and the timing of the charges). He also thought the "house arrest" was suggestive that there was MORE evidence in the file than just a "he said-she said" case. Your defense attorney will be able to see anything they have in due course. My friend said he operates under a duty to not waste the taxpayors money. HOWEVER, not all prosecutors office operate that way. Many, maybe even most, don't feel ANY duty to "decide" to not prosecute. They feel that is the juries decision to ascertain the truth and as such they have a duty to charge EVERYTHING and allow the chips to fall as they may. [sidenote: this philosophy also guarantees JOBS....be it court personnel, defense lawyers, judges, prosecutors, etc.].

As far as using the court appointed attorney or not. It's a crap shoot. Some court appointed attorney's are GREAT whereas others are fresh outta law school and merely on some list and don't have a clue. The same can be said of a PAID attorney, though most that claim a speciality will at least have SOME experience. He recommended interviewing the court appointed one and going on your gut. If you can't afford an experienced one and don't like the one appointed...TRY to switch.

Good luck,

Mr. Wondering

I tend to think this case is one that keeping everyone employed. I have the luxury to believe what ppl say based on the story you have told I would do the lie detector thing MrW suggested.

In times like these when you might feel God is punishing you or you have reaped what you have sown, (all not true), it also might be difficult to expect victory in this battle.

I encourage you to not accept the accusations of the enemy and to instead expect God to provide a way.

Remember, we are the apple of His eye and He will protect us.


Get some practical help from friends, fellow parishiners, or even a law student from a local colledge for phone calls, running errands and any documents chasing.

"Hope maketh not ashamed"

I agree with the advice that you're getting from Mr. W. Early in my career I worked for the public defender's office, juvenile division. I was in charge of interviewing the parents the morning after their children were arrested and before they went into the hearing to see if they would be held or released to their parents pending trial.

In my experience, they are more likely to hold a kid if the charges are very serious or if they were at risk to offend again. Your son being released to you is a good sign IMO. I agree with Mr. W, get a private polygraph done, and start gathering character witnesses for your son. Showing the Court AND the prosecutor that you are going to be a proactive parent in defending your son will look good for you as opposed to the type of parent who tells the detention center to "keep 'em". (I actually had parents who did this.) I also had parents who swore their kids had the rent money in their pocket when they were arrested for selling drugs.

We will be meeting with our attorney either Monday or Wednesday of next week, so I will ask about a polygraph at that time.

Next Thursday, we meet with the investigator for the probation department. It's a very important meeting, because the investigator will recommend one of three things based on the interviews with our son and us. He basically has three choices. 1) 6-month probation without having to admit guilt. 2) 1-year probation, my son has to admit he's guilty. 3) No probation and the case goes to trial. Obviously, we're hoping for #1. #2 leaves a bad taste in my mouth, since I would essentially have to tell my son he has to admit to something he's already insisted to everyone that he did not do (and I believe him) just to avoid going to trial. Neither our attorney or the public defender think #3 is all that likely, based on the lack of any real evidence and the fact that my son has no prior record. I would love the case dismissed altogether, of course, but only the judge could do that. It isn't within the investigator's jurisdiction to make that recommendation. At least, from what I understand so far. We should know more after Thursday.

Right now, my son is at youth conference for our church. We got permission from the person in charge of his home supervision so that he could go. I'm so happy he's getting a chance to get out of the house and be with some of his friends and have a little fun.

We're getting started on the independent study, so he won't fall behind in school. I really hope he gets to walk at his graduation ceremony at the very least.

His grandparents want to be present at our next court hearing in May. Does anyone know if extended family are allowed to attend? I'm going to ask the attorney when we have our meeting next week, but just wondering if anyone else knows the answer to this question sooner.