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I had the bad feeling no one would understand.

I don't mean to be overly dramatic, but I feel I am backed into a corner and have no other options to stop this pain if this relationship cant be made to work.

Thanks

Last edited by Frustrated_Jim; 07/30/10 10:23 PM.
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So if I can convince her to file for a legal separation then can you help me work on our relationship???

j

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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
To my horror, I found out that she had gotten married to this guy she had dated back in spring of 2007. She was married to this guy and hide it from me for over a year, living with me the entire time.
I would count your blessings you learned about her capacity for deceit before you married and had children.

She has "secret second life" to a pretty extreme degree...which means she will likely always hold secrets from you... Have you read the Basic Concepts? She most likely be unable/unwilling to follow the POJA/PORH which = unhappy marriage. Good candidate for an affair if you were to ever marry her.

Run run run. I know you don't want to hear it but you need to look at the big picture. frown


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Originally Posted by SusieQ
I would count your blessings you learned about her capacity for deceit before you married and had children.

She has "secret second life" to a pretty extreme degree...which means she will likely always hold secrets from you... Have you read the Basic Concepts? She most likely be unable/unwilling to follow the POJA/PORH which = unhappy marriage. Good candidate for an affair if you were to ever marry her.

Run run run. I know you don't want to hear it but you need to look at the big picture. frown


I've always been rather naive with social interaction, being blindly trusting of people.

Still years later after these things happen, I still am in a state of disbelief.

I have a horrible time accepting it all. Due to the timing of my illness and when she left me back in 2004 being at the same time. I feel as though my illness drove her away. I know I was not the most loving person even when I became ill.

I guess I am rather stupid and foolish, just looking at this from a simplistic point of view. I love this girl and do anything for her.

Yes;
The Policy of Joint Agreement: From day one I have always made her a part of all my plans, discussing even simple every day decisions with her. I've always felt this was important. I always worked very hard to give and come to compromises that were acceptable to both of us. I made much of the agreement easy, and I didn't mind, it was joint in my mind even though I did give up things, it was fine.
My work when we first met was too stressful, too demanding, and most of all too time consuming. I left the work to have more time with her. I started a company together with her, so we could work together. I really don't have other friends to any extent, I have one male friend that lives about 1500 miles away that I talk to about once a month on the phone. My old male neighbor I talk to a couple times a year. That's about it. K is everything to me, I've always wanted to focus all of my time, effort, love, attention and affection of her. I've wanted her to be involved in every aspect of my life, I've always wanted her to be my recreational companion. I don't go golfing or hang out with the boys. It's all about her.

The Policy of Radical Honesty: I've made her my world sine shortly after we met, completely discontinuing my long term friendship with that other girl, as I knew it was going to inter fear in our relationship. Never keeping that or any other secrets from her.

She has also always had my complete and total honesty, never keeping anything from her.

I guess part of the reason that I have never felt like I was having an affair even once I found out she was married is because I remained completely devoted / committed, honest, open, etc. with her. Even when I found out about it, that same day, I told her, I love you, it is okay, we will figure this out, we will get through this together, and that is when I first got the response from her that she would get a divorce and what she did was a mistake. After marriage, she never spent time with this guy or consummated the marriage, from what she told me, and I do believe her about this. I feel like the marriage is on paper only.

A also am skeptical at this point if she would be able to follow POJA/PORH.

Not only do I love her and am attached to her, I am also dependent on her due to my disability, which makes it extremely difficult to in vision being without her. It also makes it extremely difficult for me to ever see myself building a life with someone else.

In the first couple years I knew here, I would have said she would have had no problem with POJA/PORH. Then something with her changed around that time I got sick. I don't know if it was me or if it was her drinking and Alcohol abuse or what, but something changed that has never gone back to the same again.

I should run, but I have no where to run to and no one to run to, and with being disabled, running from her is even harder, she is the income earner. She is my life and I have always wanted her to be my wife.

If that (being my wife) isn't what she wants (which I guess it isn't since she has not gotten the divorce) I can't understand why she choose to spend her life with me and to come home to me every night.

I would do anything to get back the wonderful devoted girl I met 9 years or so ago and to have her as my wife.

I hope I don't seem like too horrible of a person for staying with her even after I found out about her marriage. I lover her, and I am just devoted to her and have always been willing to do what ever it takes to make our relationship work.

J

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I wonder if I could get her interested in this MB program and work through the program with me.

But she is married to someone else, though. She is another man's wife. Marriage Builders is for marriages, not affairs. If you cared about her you would encourage her to go to her husband and leave her alone.


Her H is clearly not someone she cares about or desires to have a relationship with. I think it all comes down to family pressure that drove that married to happen.

What good does it do to encourage her to go be with someone she does not care about?

J

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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
[
But she is married to

Don't know what to say. I was deceived into this. I didn't start an affair. I've been with her ongoing from before the marriage and after, with me not finding out about it until a year and a half later. She is the one that snuck out and married this guy that she has no real relationship with.

I desperately want to fix our relationship so she can get the strength to get the divorce done and un due her mistake.

J

Jim, but you know NOW that she is married to someone else so you can't claim you are deceived any longer. The truth is that she is married to someone else.

She has plenty of "strength" to get a divorce. It takes no strength to get a divorce. The issue is that she doesn't want to get a divorce and you won't accept that.

She is a married woman, Jim. No one here is going to help you pursue a relationship with a married woman.


How can I help her be okay with her family with getting the divorce done?

J

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Jim,
you came to us for advice, so please listen.

You have no future with this woman. She has alcohol problems and has no problem keeping big secrets from you-like her marriage to another man! Additionally, she left you during a bad time in your life and even though she's technically "back", she REFUSES to commit completely to you. She's put you in the position of being the Other Man (OM) to a married woman, and REFUSES to change that situation in ANY way.

Jim, you really have no other choice but to toss her out. What else CAN you do? You can't MAKE her divorce her husband, and she's clearly prepared to let you be the OM for many years to come. Is that what you REALLY want? I'm guessing not or you wouldn't be here.

You came here for advice to make/convince her to get that divorce, but I seriously doubt there's anything we can tell you that would do that, because despite what she says, YOUR FEELINGS AND OPINION ABOUT THIS SITUATION DO NOT MATTER TO HER!! If they did, she would have gotten that divorce long before now.

There is really only one thing you can do here. Dump her. Kick her to the curb before, God forbid, you end up getting her pregnant and bring a child into this mess. It may not seem like it right now, but you WILL survive without her and you WILL ultimately be better off with her gone.

The girl you knew 9 years ago is GONE, and there's no getting her back. She has changed for the worse, and the person she is now is completely undeserving of your devotion. Don't waste more years of your life with her, she is NOT worth it.

Last edited by MacNut; 07/31/10 02:55 AM.

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Hi Jim,

I am hardly ever up this late but it is storming now so woke up. Stopped here to look and saw your post.

Jim, you seem like a decent person. Along with the others here I can sympathize with your situtaion. By the time you found out she was married you were already emotionally involved with her. She deceived you for a year.

However, that was two years ago. Jim, the reality is that the people here Do in fact understand your situation. But, this IS a marriage building site and she Is married to another
for what ever reason. The people here are committed to marriage and are committed to the fact that marriage is an exclusive relationship between the two spouses. Therefore, if anyone here was to advise you on how to fix your 'realtionship' with K, they would in effect be assisting you in breaking up her current M. I would be astounded if anyone here would violate their principals and do that. Jim, the issure or question of divorce is the exclusive property of K and her current H to the exclusion of all others. While I can understand your feelings, I hope you respect this stance.

In addition Jim, I feel that the support issue may also be influencing you to some extent. That should not be the case. You certainly can make it on your own. You are a young guy. There are plenty of single women in your area of the world to choose from, and the vast majority of them would not have the issues that this other man's wife has.

The bottom line is Jim, you need to stop trying to apply MB concepts. You need to begin working on letting this woman go and letting her deal with Her marriage in her own way. I am sure you would find plenty of support here for this. If K decides on her own accord and w/o your influence to divorce her H, and then after an appropriate time wants to reunite with you - Great!

Best Regards.
Tom


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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I also have always had difficulty with interpersonal relationships due to high functioning autism.
Jim, by any chance, does SHE have high-functioning autism, too?

She is not living her life the way people usually do.


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Jim,

You seem to be saying that due to your medical problems (and ensuing financial problems), you cannot leave her. I wonder if, instead of alleviating your problems, being with her for the past 9 years has not aggravated your problems. Maybe you will find that, without her, your anxiety attacks and depression etc may diminish.
It sounds like you have lived in a very stressful situation most of your adult life.
Maybe it's time to take control, scary as that might be.

Tully

(t/j - Sugar, I've sent you an email...)


Courage is the most important of all the virtues, because without courage you can't practice any other virtue consistently. You can practice any virtue erratically, but nothing consistently without courage.
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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
Her H is clearly not someone she cares about or desires to have a relationship with. I think it all comes down to family pressure that drove that married to happen.

What good does it do to encourage her to go be with someone she does not care about?

J

The same could be said about you... you are clearly not someone she cares about or desires to have a relationship with.

She is living a double life...and you just happened to find out about it. I would wager that she is telling her H that she is your caregiver (because you have an illness) and that you have HIRED her to spend the nights at your place.

He is probably buying that story just like you are buying the story about the marriage...never consumating it...and not wanting to disppoint her family with a divorce. crazy

She's got ALL you buffaloed.

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hello J, I am so sorry that you are here but this is a step in the right direction if you listen carefully and heed the advice given.
I am realtively new to MB and just read your story, one thing that puzzles me is this, have you ever considered contacting H and having a conversation with him? it may very well clear up some issues for you.


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I'm sorry I haven't read threw the whole thread because I wanted to get my two cents in before it was too late...


DUMP HER AND KICK HER OUT!!!

She is not even GIRLFRIEND MATERIAL!

I am sorry to be harsh but it is the truth, you can not change her, only you can change yourself, and in order to change your situation that you are in is to GET HER OUT OF YOUR LIFE FOR EVER!!

Find someone that will treat you right, that can be marriage material.

If you try to fix this messed up 28 year old little child then you will NEVER be happy.

SHE WONT EVER CHANGE!

It has been 2 years since you have found out....and what have you accomplished?? Nothing! Because she wont change, do yourself a favor and please get rid of her, and stop supporting another mans broken woman.

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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I desperately want to fix our relationship so she can get the strength to get the divorce done and un due her mistake.

J


I know you desperately want to fix her...but honestly honestly you CAN'T!

Your best bet is to dump her.

Change your phone number, email, etc so she can't come crawling back to you when times are hard. I'm telling you right now, if you keep letting her come back you will never marry, have no kids, and by the time you are 55 it will be too late and you will be a lone. Is that what you want?

I'm sorry again on being so harsh, but it sounds like you are a really nice guy, and you have a married woman living in your home taking advantage of you, get your balls back from her and live a happy life WITH OUT HER!

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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I had the bad feeling no one would understand.

I don't mean to be overly dramatic, but I feel I am backed into a corner and have no other options to stop this pain if this relationship cant be made to work.

Thanks


Trust me we understand your situation, and we are trying to help you, that married woman that is living with you is not worth it, can't you see?

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Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I guess I am rather stupid and foolish, just looking at this from a simplistic point of view. I love this girl and do anything for her.

You will do anything for her? Even suffering the pain to see a married woman living with you and not devoting her life to you?


She has also always had my complete and total honesty, never keeping anything from her.

And yet she can go behind your back and cheat and marry another man with out you knowing??


Not only do I love her and am attached to her, I am also dependent on her due to my disability, which makes it extremely difficult to in vision being without her. It also makes it extremely difficult for me to ever see myself building a life with someone else.

If this is the case, then I am sorry, I can't help you, none of us can, you need to realize that woman is a liar, no matter how much you love her, and if you can live you life like that for the rest of your life, then all I can say is "GOOD LUCK!" laugh

I should run, but I have no where to run to and no one to run to, and with being disabled, running from her is even harder, she is the income earner. She is my life and I have always wanted her to be my wife.

If that is what you believe then that is your life, you have already decided your life that you want to live. Someone once told me "you are at in your life because you made it your life, if you want something to change, then YOU HAVE TO CHANGE and PAY THE PRICE!"

If that (being my wife) isn't what she wants (which I guess it isn't since she has not gotten the divorce) I can't understand why she choose to spend her life with me and to come home to me every night.

Because you are meeting her needs, just like her HUSBAND was meeting her other needs, you say she is with you every day and every night, if that's a case put a VAR in her car and then you will see. She is having the best of both worlds, a husband and a b/f to live with.



J
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Jim,

RUN!

Get as far away from this woman as you can get.

Even if she got a divorce and you and she ended up married, what makes you think she will remain faithfully married to you? She didn't "cheat" on you with another man, she married another man and is cheating on him with you.

RUN!

Don't look back!

Get away while you still have a shred of sanity and a grasp on reality. This relationship is TOXIC!

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Hello Jim,

I sincerely hope you are feeling at least a little better than you seemed to be last evening. I suspect the reason you are not posting lately is that you have not been receiving the advice you were expecting or hoping to hear. I am not surprised. As far as I am concerned MB is the elite of the legitimate pro-marriage sites on the internet. It is equivalent to what I think the Green Bay Packers are to the NFL. (just my own silly sports analogy here..*s*) There are other legitimate pro-marriage sites as well, but few and far between, and I have no doubt that you will receive similar advice on those sites as well. The downside Jim is that there are mostly likely internet sites and/or individual counselors who are NOT pro-marriage or are NOT at all ethical or legitimate, and would be willing to give you misleading advice that is contrary to what you are receiving here. These sources would be dangerous and harmful to you morally and emotionally. Be careful Jim on what you are searching for.

All that being said, altho I do not know your situation first-hand at all, it strikes me that you appear to be fairly isolated in terms of being able to receive trusted advice and counsel in this matter - just plain simply someone trustworthy to confide in. So, I think you are relying on your own feelings rather than having the luxury and comfort of someone you can trust to 'bounce' your feelings off.

If you think that people on the other end of an electronic connection on the Internet - given that they are true, caring and most importantly legitimte - do not care, then you are just simply wrong Jim. The legitimate ones, and there are so many here, are moral, honest, filled with true life experiences, compassion and caring, honest, and etc. But, they are not going to be dishonest with themselves and their morals to simply tell you what You want to hear.

This leads me to say to you again that for the sake of your emotional and mental health, and for the sake of your spiritual health (and I know you said you are not very religious, but still it is a truth), you need to disengage from this woman who you think of as a 'wife', but who in reality is Not. If you do this, and come back and promise that you are, I will welcome you back with an open mind and open arms.

Jim, I have been a member here for about 5 mos., and back in the 80's I did crisis intervention. Of all the posts and of all of the telephone conversations I have had to do this one to you has been the hardest.

With regards to you and your health,

TOm

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Originally Posted by teaser_8
hello J, I am so sorry that you are here but this is a step in the right direction if you listen carefully and heed the advice given.
I am realtively new to MB and just read your story, one thing that puzzles me is this, have you ever considered contacting H and having a conversation with him? it may very well clear up some issues for you.

I thought about it, but never knew what I would say or what that would accomplish.

J

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Originally Posted by SapphireReturns
Originally Posted by Frustrated_Jim
I desperately want to fix our relationship so she can get the strength to get the divorce done and un due her mistake.

J


I know you desperately want to fix her...but honestly honestly you CAN'T!

Your best bet is to dump her.

Change your phone number, email, etc so she can't come crawling back to you when times are hard. I'm telling you right now, if you keep letting her come back you will never marry, have no kids, and by the time you are 55 it will be too late and you will be a lone. Is that what you want?

I'm sorry again on being so harsh, but it sounds like you are a really nice guy, and you have a married woman living in your home taking advantage of you, get your balls back from her and live a happy life WITH OUT HER!

I think you guys are very likely all correct about everything.

I am honestly pretty emotionally fragile and do not know if I have the ability to do this type of abrupt separation at this point.

Thought you have pointed out the extent of the moral predicament I am in; even though the even larger problem is her and her lying and her deceptive behavior.

I just don't know how to face being alone. I have almost no friends and have devoted myself to K. I don't work because I am disabled, so I have no co-workers and such for support.

But I do hear what your saying about the situation, and it is hitting home that your right. I don't think she will ever change.

I want to be married to someone, someone that loves me as much as I love them. At 31, I am ready to be in that type of fully committed relationship & marriage, I am just having such a hard time letting go of the hope that things will get sorted out with K and that I will achieve that with her. Even though the practical side of me does know your right, and I don't think it will ever happen, no matter what I do.

J

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