All I have shown her for 17 years is how strong I am. She respects me and doesn't think I would let anyone walk on me, not even her. When I was getting my first tattoo a couple of months ago, I was looking for something meaningful to me and had something picked out, but I also asked her opinion. I said to define me in one word. She said "Strength" without hesitation. She even clarified and said "Inside and out. Conviction. It's who you are."

She fully expected me to kick her out - she was drawn back into me because I have changed and I am not like that anymore and I have handled this differently. The thing that drew her to this man in the first place was how "nice" she thought he was compared to how I used to be.

As I said, there are other factors at work here. Think I'm stupid if you like. I don't think you all realize that I am willing to take the longer, harder road to recovery with her if it prevents my children from having to see their mom leave. That even means I am willing to deal with a relapse or two if they occur. That is part of addiction recovery. I will deal with them from here on out with strength and not let my guilt make me a doormat. The plan you are all pushing seems to be more "I will not live with an addict at any cost, so they either "fully recover right now or they get out."

Two weeks it is - looking forward to your next post, humbled.

She is the one who did.

Put a GPS on her vehicle.
You would be smart to verify her comings and goings.

Working on that one as we speak. It's the one piece of intel I don't have right now.

No plan is fullproof - none. Sometimes, marriages fail. This is because of ADULTERY. Not because of the plan. The plan DOES work frequently, when implemented properly. I've been here a long time, too - reading new threads, reading back through past threads. It DOES work. Remarkably so. And on top of that it gives you a BETTER marriage than before. Of these numerous hypothetical 'other' marriages which 'recover' from adultery how many of them are REALLY recovered to a BETTER state than the original marriage? How many of them are just limping along with multiple adulteries and abuses? Because I've seen A LOT of healthy, happy, loving marriages here POST affair.

There are better and worse plans. You can try the one which has a documented success rate - along with advisors to tell you HOW they did it.

Or you could ignore their advice and chose your own plan. Your own 'special, unique' plan, just for you. One with no proven track record. You REALLY wanna make your life and family the guinea pigs for this plan? Really?


Often the most educated are the most stupid. And I say this as someone with a couple degrees under my belt - one of the a Masters. We think because we have all this education and knowledge we know everything.

You, with your MA in Psych, think you got this? Then why you posting here? If you want the wealth of knowledge that exists in this forum, LISTEN to it. You may have a degree in psyche, but the people here have REAL LIFE experience dealing with DOZENS of situations JUST LIKE YOURS. Yours isn't special, it's actually pretty cookie cutter. Your 'knowledge' is gonna keep you from really LEARNING here.


Awww, you're so cute with this cute little story.

Sure your wife respects you. She's respected you ALL along, inappropriately talking with this OM. You can see the respect just emanating from her. She's gonna respect you all the way to OMs bedsheets at the rate you're going.

Not seeing much strength here, bub.

But a lot of hemming and hawwing about your 'specialness' and 'unique situation'

To be honest, I think the MB concepts make a lot of sense for rebuilding a marriage and understanding why affairs happen. But I am not convinced they always make sense for "busting up" an affair. I will continue to read them and use them. You say I can't cherry pick. Okay. I will anyway.

I'm enough of a man to admit when I'm wrong. If I end up being wrong then I do, and I will humbly admit it and try a different approach. Until then I'll see you all in a few weeks. I'm not going to sit here and be berated for trusting myself.

As long as we are clear ... the end result of cherry picking will be all yours.

However, whatever you cherry pick, do not make the error of "trusting" your wife at this point.
Hence my HAMMERING you about the GPS.

Awww, you're so cute with this cute little story.

Sure your wife respects you. She's respected you ALL along, inappropriately talking with this OM. You can see the respect just emanating from her. She's gonna respect you all the way to OMs bedsheets at the rate you're going.

Not seeing much strength here, bub.

But a lot of hemming and hawwing about your 'specialness' and 'unique situation'[/quote]

Thanks for the support.

I don't know how else I can say this. I was an a-hole before. Do you not understand? This is not coming from my WW warping my brain - this is my own realization through my own private therapy. It is not special or unique - her comments were right on target. I was a typical emotionally abusive jerk. You are dead right - my WW did not and still doesn't fully respect me. But it has nothing to do with being firm or strong - it has to do with the fact that I was a complete a-hole. Do you get that? She doesn't respect me because she thinks I was a jerk who always put what I wanted before everyone else. Who always made everything a fight and had to "win" every fight. Making this a battle of wills between her and I is NOT the answer for my marriage. Yes, it would end the affair while we are married, but it would leave me with no marriage and destroy and credibility I had built with my wife regarding my recovery.

I just have to trust myself on this.

Good luck.

Thank you. I understand completely. And BELIEVE me, I do not trust her for a second. I am monitoring her to see if and when I CAN trust her again - that is the point.

Just curious.
Did you also trust your judgment when you were being an A-hole?

This thread made me very sad.

God's Blessings,

Say

Uh-huh. And I'm in Mensa. Did that help me notice my FWH's actions during his A? Nope! And what would my first course of action have been had I noticed and not known about MB? I would have groveled, threatened, probably would have gone into H's workplace and made a spectacle of myself and been thrown out, probably would have thrown him out of the house and been divorced by now - because he couldn't end the affair! To this day he thanks God that he was exposed, you know that, Humbled? He's glad he was exposed because he couldn't break the addiction on his own! Remember: Intelligence and emotions are often not compatible in the least.

We are not calling you stupid. We are not berating you. We are letting you know, from having been where you are, what will work more likely than not. Have you not seen a common theme, here? The majority of posters have told you that they recovered their Ms after doing certain things. The main thing we've advised you to do is to expose the A. Do you know why there aren't an equal number of posters advising you to wait two weeks? Because the posters who went another route didn't recover their marriages, and are likely not even on these boards any longer.

You make a mistake in taking our advice as a personal insult. Look at it more like tough love.

Wait the two weeks if you must. But could you come back and let us know how everything went? We'd like to have that for future posters who come here looking for help.

See you in two weeks then....

Then 2 months......

Then in 2 more years.....

Good LUCK!

I HAVE MY HAND UP HERE AS A BS WHOSE MARRIAGE IS IN SHAMBLES AT THE MOMENT.

Why is my marriage in shambles? Well, can tell you why it is and it is simple, IT IS BECAUSE OF MY HUSBAND'S AFFAIR.

My marriage is a wreck not because I implemented an excellent plan A and a super DARK Plan B, it is because my husband decided he would go off and have his need for sex met outside of our marriage. He is rutting around in the filth and disgust of affairland. Where would I be if I hadn't found MB? I would be going CRAZY. I would be an emotional wreck. I would probably eventually get divorced because I couldn't handle anymore of the affairland drama. Am I going to become divorced anyways? It is possible. BUT, I would be much better off either way. I am already better off emotionally and there is still a chance that my marriage will recover.

Your wife's affair is absolutely cookie cutter. That is why DrH's advice helps so many marriages because wayturds all follow the same script.

Exposure should be done now. You need to tell OMW. You need it to be done when you are calm so it is most effective.

I exposed my WH's affair and there was no nuclear exposure. It was more like a starter pistol. I do NOT regret it at all. Why? because now WH and OW can't go around and tell people about the "love story" that happened. EVERYONE KNOWS THE TRUTH. That gives me great solace. I am able to move on without regrets because I know I did my part.

If you have ever read my thread, you will see that people tell me that I am a good example of what to do on MB ad with the concepts. I don't ever feel like I deserve the praise because I am just following what is written by DrH and what other posters have suggested. I follow the concepts. Even if my marriage doesn't survive, it won't be a failure for MB or DrH. I WILL BE BETTER.

We want you to save your marriage. We have nothing to lose or gain from you saving your marriage except the knowledge that we made the world a little bit better. We helped someone make their life a bit better. Either way, we will have done good. I have gone to sleep many nights praying for the people on these boards, none of which I know IRL. I think of them often and hope that they can get through one more day. That is how I am paying it forward.

Please listen to these people. Listening to your own instincts got you where you are today.

We are listening to you that you were horrible to your wife. You were possibly the worst husband ever. What have you learned so you can change that? Even if this marriage doesn't recover, you wouldn't want to repeat your same mistakes over and over again. Do you personally know anyone who has survived an affair, IRL? Ask them what they did to save their marriage. Because you obviously aren't listening to the people on here who have not only survived their WS's affairs, or their own, but who have helped countless of others survive and THRIVE.

Please, when you do this your own way, don't blame MB or DrH. You won't have anyone to blame except yourself. Take care.

Thank you. I see what you are doing here, and I sincerely appreciate it. You are making me defend myself and realize this isn't my fault. And you are right. I was not horrible to my wife. I was not the worst husband ever - I was actually a really good husband. I was just depressed and crabby and it made me yell at her sometimes when I shouldn't have. I was an a-hole sometimes but I was a milion good things too. I really was and still am. And I have learned a lot - my negative traits have pretty much disappeared since I began therapy as well as reading this site. I don't ever do DJs or AOs or anything like that anymore.

I would never blame MB or DrH if I didn't follow it fully - that is not the type of person I am. I take responsibility for my decisions.

One of the things that was wrong with our marriage before was that she never wanted to grow up or be responsible - she never wanted to deal with anything. So she found me - and I was more than happy to "take care" of her. She used to love me for that. After 17 years it became "control" and she felt like she had no freedom to do whatever she wanted for her. And I felt like she never dealt with our problems in our marriage - like I didn't have a partner I could depend on when I was down. I am exhausted and tired of being the only "grown-up" in my house.

I can't explain it. I feel like she recognizes the mess she has gotten us into and is finally trying to fix something herself and not have me come in and tell her "how" to do it or fix it. She is asking me for trust at a time when she deserves none, but I really do believe she is sincere in that she wants to "beat" this herself. She doesn't want me to save her.

Lastly, I haven't mentioned this yet, and I know no one will care, but I see all their messages. One of the only reasons I have let this continue is because their whole mechanic has changed. He is messing this up more every day - it is dying a natural death. He disappoints and pisses her off daily and is starting to commit LBs. She is getting more and more upset with him daily. Why would I want to interfere with that? Meanwhile, I am meeting her ENs and committing no LBs. I really have thought about this quite a bit. Last time (FR) they ended on a high note and he was Prince Charming. This time it is getting easier for her every day that I let them continue to talk to let go of him, because she is seeing more and more of his truth. That is why I don't understand when everyone keeps telling me the affair is becoming more entrenched the longer I let it go on. It seems to be dying.

The only reason people are telling you that the affair is getting more entrenched is because it IS. They have seen it before and unfortunately will see it again and again.

Let me try a different approach now. You have read DrH's materials right? You have most likely read tonnes of posts on other threads here right? Having all of this knowledge, what would YOU tell someone who came here with your story? Using only the knowledge from THIS site, what would you advise?

Thank you, Scotland, for trying to reason with me. I would have directed them to the cocnepts and words that caught my eye:

Here is what I was working from. From "Coping with Infidelity: Part 3 Restoring the Marital Relationship":

"Since an affair does not always end the way it should, with complete separation from the lover, you may not find this column entirely relevant to you. In your case, your spouse's lover may still be a factor, and you will want to know how to restore your marital relationship with your spouse's lover standing in the wings. If you are in that position, I have addressed that topic in two of my earlier Q&A columns on infidelity ("What to Do with an Unfaithful Husband" and "What to Do with an Unfaithful Wife")."

From "What to Do with an Unfaithful Wife":

"The reason she is having trouble deciding between you and her lover is that you both meet different emotional needs. She says she still loves you and that may be the case, particularly since she still makes love to you twice a week. She loves you because you are meeting some of her important needs. Since she says she would leave you both if she had to decide between you, there's a good chance that neither of you meet enough of her needs for her to settle on one of you. But if you could do for her what this other man is doing, the conflict would be ended and your family would be secure. You would have learned to meet all of her most important emotional needs, ending her affair, and the risk of others."

"After you have established what her lover does for her that you don't do, ask her to give you a chance to prove to her that you can do it, too. Give yourself about six months where you go all out to try your best to meet her needs. And be sure you do not wreck it all by being thoughtless or disrespectful. If she is willing, take her with you on short vacations to places she would enjoy. Integrate her into your life, without making her feel that you are trying to smother her and take control. Never make any demands of her time, just offer her opportunities to become a part of you, and express your willingness to become a part of her.

She probably wants a soul-mate -- someone who she feels emotionally connected to. Somehow, over the past few years, she has lost her connection with you. Your six month effort should be designed to help her re-connect to you.

Don't tell her that your plan is only for six months, because that would constitute a threat. Besides, you cannot be sure how long you will last. But at the end of six months, evaluate your progress. If your relationship is improving, you may be encouraged enough to give your effort another six months. Remember that her state of mind will improve if you are depositing love units and not withdrawing them. She may become less defensive and less secretive about her lifestyle. She may also tell you that she has completely abandoned her lover, and is giving you a solid chance to work things out."

This is so like my situation. And I have been following it for 3 months and it has slowly been working. We are literally all the way up to the last sentence, and now she is promising to do that and has given me a timeline. Go ahead, hit me with the "it's all script, etc." I really felt like it was working.

May: "I am leaving you for him."
June: "I don't know what to do, I'm confused and I feel like I'm going to end up in love with two men."
July: "I understand why people do this. I wish there were a way I could have both in my life. I love you."
August: "I'm letting him go and I'm staying with you. Please just let me end this my own way - I need closure. I'm not going anywhere - you and I are going to be together for life. I love you."

Go ahead, hit me