Man_learning,

Wow that surprises me. If you do not mind me asking, were you otherwise able to recover and have a good marriage to date?

To be honest I never recovered at that time, I just buried myself in my work and never asked anything. As someone else noted, my marriage like many just went on for years in a damaged state.

Because of her affair I was never able to shake the feelings that I wasn't good enough for her or that she never fully approved of me.

After I blundered into MB our marriage improved in every way except sexually, well actually it improved sexually for the first week. My W says she doesn't know what she would have done had I not found MB and she sometimes mentions MB in her prayers, I'm not kidding.

So we are stuck in a spot now where my W is happy with me and our marriage, but there is no answer from her about why the sex is dead.

You know my W's dad was a cheater too. I have thought that might play a part in her doing what she did. She is also not a good communicator. I wish, probably like all BS, she had clearly communicated how "truly unhappy" she was before doing this.

I'm not sure if I would describe my W as a good communicator or not she sorta has two natures. When W is with her immediate family she tends to lecture, is super-critical, angry, argumentative and disapproving. With outsiders she is diplomatic, self-effacing, helpful and compassionate, and is viewed as a saint. This may be one reason she can never come clean as it will tarnish her image.

Did you read any of the WW threads on here, reading them really helped me understand my W.

God Bless
Gamma

Thanks Gamma, and I am glad you found MB. Sorry for the loss of time you experienced. I've lost some time myself and it pains me. Hope all things improve for you.

The WW or FWW that posted in this thread have been helpful. I would like to read WW threads. Is there a way to search for them or to locate them?

Man_learning,

The technique I used was to finding a WW thread then search for other WWs who posted to their threads as Iscanned backwards in time.

You can often judge by the number of posts they made how much you can get from their threads, although some of the WWs who are chased off quickly with few posts are often very honest about their feelings.

You can also use a search string in google like this

"I am a ww" site:http://forum.marriagebuilders.com

God Bless
Gamma

Coping with Infidelity:Restoring

ml,
you asked for more info about my false recovery. here is my story:
after my husband found out late march 2011, we were planning on divorcing. he kicked me out immediately and i got my own apartment. we had 50/50 custody of the kids. after a couple days, i started thinking, "what the hell have i done?". i was scared. i asked my husband for another chance and he said he would if i had no contact forever. (this is before he discovered marriage builders). at the time, my mind was confused and i really didnt know exactly what i wanted. i did not want to break up the family and seeing our kids only 50% of the time was killing me. i also did not want to go back to the marriage we had, which included ao's and dj's. my love for him was pretty much gone. but as i said i was scared. my life as i have known for 20 years had completely changed. i agreed with the no contact and returned all items i had of his. i still was living in my apartment, which in hindsight, was a mistake. eventually we had contact through emails. they were sporadic. i would email for a couple days, then felt guilty and have no contact for several weeks. this went on for 8 months. we also met 2 times in the summer but no physical contact. during the 8 months of false recovery, i saw changes in my husband. he really took a hard look at himself and wanted to really change and make improvements. but of course, i was skeptical. how can someone change after being the same way for 40 years?? i didnt realize it, but he was using plan a. and it worked! i eventually fell back in love with him even though i was really fighting it. i realized his changes were true. i became a believer of the marriage builders plan. i moved back home in february 2012 and we implemented the plan. we are following the program to a t. you can not pick and choose which parts of the program you want to do. it all works together. and it does work. i am proof of that. my husband and i are on our way to an even happier marriage that ever.
my husband posts here under 20yearhistory if you would be interested in his view.

Thanks clearmind.

Logically speaking, however, these you speak of are resolutely foggy.

While they are honest about their feelings, those feelings are based upon flawed data from their affair, and their current emotional state. They rattle off typically foggy excuses for their adultery.

It's usual crap like "we hadn't been happy in a long time" or "we were never happy" or other cherry-picked observations from the marital history to support their current emotional state.


So while it looks like in-the-moment honesty, what it really is, is confirmation bias applied historically used as a justification for a current emotional state or justification for adultery.


Yet, considering the Love Bank model (that love is a collection of positive memory associations related to the meeting of emotional needs by someone of the opposite sex, and can be reduced by negative memory associations related to love-busting behaviors) - we know that adultery occurs in a state where the faithful spouse is only being credited for Love Busters while doing all the heavy lifting, and all the affair partner has to do is provide EN meeting without financial or domestic interest.


This would be comparable to a bank teller funneling from the cash drawer, and deciding that the stolen money is worth more since it doesn't involve paying taxes or long work hours. Yet, how can one continue to steal funds if they quit the job?

Hmmmm...

Well, the statistic quoted is that relationships based on adultery fizzle out by the 3 year mark once the betrayed spouse steps out of the picture, and the affair partner has to carry the full weight.

The negatives of the theft become apparent.


Yet, when a WS is caught... well, then they also tend to project the negative consequences and feelings associated with it on the betrayed spouse. After all, if the marriage was great, and the betrayed spouse so great... they wouldn't have cheated, would they?


This is, of course, patently false. The only way to avoid adultery is to admit that you are capable of it, and to take steps to avoid it - do not allow those of the opposite sex, who are not your spouse, meet your emotional needs.

ML, this is a complete waste of time that will distract from recovering your marriage. If you want to recover your marriage, you need to be searching DR HARLEYS works and other posters who have RECOVERED their marriages. The blind cannot lead the blind. A wayward cannot lead you to recovery and a poster who is in a bad marriage cannot either.

You want to save your marriage? Read up on the program!

AMEN to that !

Read Dr Harley's Plans/Study them until you know them well/Implement the Plans/Evaluate your performance of the Plans as well as your results/Adjust yourself accordingly.

You really are an engineer after all!

I am a word-engineer.

After you do a proper exposure you should read these to educate yourself.
False Recovery
False recovery need voices of experience

So he continues to try to contact her? And you haven't exposed?

Sir, you've been properly advised about affairs as addictions. It may also profit you to think of an affair as a vampire. Whe you want to kill one that happens to be sucking the lifeblood out of your marriage, should you take a tiny little hammer and go "tap, tap, tap" on the vampire's heart and check its pulse every few seconds to see whether it's dead, having as your primary goal a modulated application of just enough pressure to stop its heart? Or should you get the biggest mallet and sharpest stake you can find and pound like hell on that sucker until there's blood all over the place & the stake is buried in the vampire's chest and it's dead beyond all doubt?

To answer this, ask yourself: Is your primary goal not to upset your wife, or is your primary goal to kill her affair, as quickly as possible, and thereby give you a chance to save your marriage?

Are addicts always upset when their crackpipe is taken from them & thrown away? Of course.
Are addicts who are permitted to retain recourse to their crack pipes at all likely to recover? Of course not.

It reflects selfish unwillingness to acknowledge that reality. Not "inability" borne of some lack of mental capacity, but rather, unwillingness borne of selfishness.

Not merely a mistake, as though it were some sort of accident, but rather, as a deliberate and horrible choice.

No one who would answer this question in the affirmative can be considered yet to have "recovered." Infatuation is not "love." Mutual selfishness on the part of two affairees is not "love."

Man_learning, your wife sounds a long way from remorse. I can't tell if the affair is even dead. I also can't tell if this OM is still trying to mess with her mind; but if he is, then you need to send him the clear message, not that you'll kill him, but that you'll make his life such that he'll actually wish that you had. He needs to perceive that your wife equals way, way more trouble for him than she'll ever be worth to him. That's what exposure can achieve. If you are in fact a man learning, this is a pretty important thing for you to learn, when it comes to affairs.

Another excellent post GO.

Man_Learning have you read this also? "I encourage BH to confront OM" Dr. Harley

Dude , my recovery was hindered (helped?) by having no idea of what the HELL I was doing, but at the same time, a recklessness that gave full freedom to my instincts, which providentially, were not disastrously wrong. A poster here asked me what drove my then WW to immediately see what she was facing, and return to our marriage with a fervor that surprised even me:

My barely-contained emotions also demonstrated that there would be no �pleasant� life for her
after an affair-occasioned divorce. She would not �get the house� in any settlement, unless
a pile of smoldering ashes constituted a �house� to her. She would never be able to return
to her teaching job, because even after OM�s retirement, Mrs. OM continued to work there.
Her family, with virtually NO history of infidelity would not be joining forces behind her, as
obviously my FOO would be behind me. Our friends, all of whom were involved in long-term,
stable unions, would not accept her actions, and �see her side of it�. And of course, POSOM,
having turned tail and run, weeping for cover, still quivering, until he died, that I might yet
inform Mrs. OM of his actions, was not likely to provide her a suitable companion. He wanted
an easy piece of co-worker tail, NOT a long-term commitment. WW had NO comfortable
alternative-life support system to imagine running to.

Sometimes. like in the movie Platoon, you just have to call an air-strike on your own position, and hunker down. Call in the fast-movers, my friend.

ML-

It's now a few days short of 2 months since her dday and it's high time you put the wheels in motion on exposure. By not doing so, you are sending a bad signal to her and him that you are indeed spineless.

I know full well the level of emasculation an affair can have on a dude.

Nothing will make you feel like a man than fighting for your woman. And snapping her out whatever fog she's in by exposure is a good start to being THE MAN.

The answers to the questions you ask are bordering on wishes and dreams. Actions determine this outcome not hopes.

Exposure questions.

How much detail in the exposure letter to WW's fiends family? I have read the standard letters. Should mine be that simple, or should I add other important info?

Should I mention that she lied and mislead me for years?

How she denied it, but now admits it?

How she had me take of the kids while she traveled with him?

I know she has unfairly criticized me to justify her actions to herself and to make the div she was considering appear warranted?

That she involved him with my children at my home and other places?

That they were intimate in my house and/or bed?


Should I mention that her sister is supporting her actions?

About our Children

How much detail for 11 yr old daughter?

How much detail for 13 yr old?

Do I tell them at the same time?

Should I post these questions in the Exposure 101 thread?

self deleted

Man_learning,

Do a search on this site for exposure letters, or use the google search tip I posted earlier.

Generally be factual without giving unneeded detail as it will make you look more like a person who is interested in saving his family more than destroying his wife.

The exposure letter for OM is another story, since you are trying to wound him and make it less likely he can assault your family again.

God Bless
Gamma

You'll find all the examples of exposure letters in here.

Facebook, workplace, family, friends all of it. Thanks to Melodylane.

Exposure 101