Zhamila,

You are getting some good stuff to chew on! Thank you so much because I am benefitting from it!

Mel, it's not that anyone is gunning for her....we are tired of her complaining daily about her husband and doing nothing PRODUCTIVE to resolve the issues in her marriage other than playing the victim.....was it you who told me almost 10 years ago...If you refuse to do something to change the situation you lose your right to complaint about it?

Mel, it's not that anyone is gunning for her....we are tired of her complaining daily about her husband...

OK, after WalMart today (where notebooks were ALSO $.17/ea, I might add, LOL!!!), H started yelling "CRAP! OH MY GAH, DANGGIT!" as he got in the car. I said, "What's wrong?" - I thought a pit bull was attacking his leg or something, or at least a Cockapoo.

He had stepped in gum on the parking lot.

He continued AO'ing, I asked him to please stop the AO. He said, "I'm not AO'ing!" Hmmmm. "This is disgusting, some IDIOT dropped gum on the ground! Kids, you'd better NEVER drop gum on the ground!"

I handed him a napkin so he could put it on the bottom of his shoe & it wouldn't get on the carpet (just had the car detailed - the clean don't last long with 4 kids, but we do what we can )

Later, he said, "Will you forgive me?" I said I have a hard time forgiving behavior that repeats so much. This upset him. I asked what forgivess means to him. He explained that he wants me to release him from the obligation to repay. I told him I am not able to do that, I need him to repay me by never having another AO again. This upset him again.

He called it a "little slip." Then he started pointing out all of my flaws, like when I said the F word a few weeks ago. I told him I'd be happy to talk about my problems at another time, but I wanted to stay focused on his eliminating AOs. He kept saying the F word - "so that's not a problem?" I asked him to PLEASE stop saying the F word, and that we can talk about my problems some other time (he kept saying it). I told him his anger is unacceptable to me, I do not want to continue living with an angry man, nor having my children and I exposed to his angry behavior. He promised (again) to stop.

Rrrrrr. I'm getting angry with MYSELF now. I am a fool to put up with this.

I'm sure she's willing to own her mistakes and acknowledge her own love busters and do whatever it takes to eliminate them, including anger management if she finds that she doesn't seem to be able to just stop it.

A couple of comments, Zhamila:

Whatever you can do to stop these discussions earlier in the process will be good. They are making massive love bank withdrawals on both sides.

He should not be asking for "forgiveness." When he does, just redirect the conversation to the productive and enjoyable life you have ahead of you when the love busters are gone and you two have learned to negotiate. After an AO you may not feel like talking to him for awhile, and he should not be demanding it.

Don't ever get into a discussion comparing the relative worth or badness of each other's actions. If you find you've fallen into one, don't try to persuade him that the discussion is a bad idea. Just stop talking.

Most importantly, when your husband is having an angry outburst, he is not rational. (Insane.) All the attempts to get him to stop and to talk about the problem right then and there are going to be addressed irrationally. My anger management therapist said whatever we were talking about before the outburst, we should take 24 hour timeout on talking about it again. Take an hour off, and when you get back together, talk about something else. Your favorite sports team or whatever mutual interests you have.

Markos, this advice is SO helpful! It really helps me see what I can do in these situations. Thank you!! OK, summarizing:

So, when he asks me to forgive him, I'll try to redirect to our happy future (though that is a stretch for me right now...but I'll try)

When he starts changing the subject to my failings, what then? He seriously said the F word 7 times loudly & I begged him to stop. (I had said it under my breath a couple of weeks ago...to myself re: work) Can I just leave? It's really hard to pick up and leave, but so painful to stay. It was truly horrific for me.

OK, so we were getting in the car when he started AO'ing. What should I do then...let him keep going while we all sit there and wait for it to end? And when he asks me to forgive him on the way home? I'm just not sure what MY part is in this - I mean I agree with you about it all, I just want to know how to deal when we're in the car, etc.

Most importantly, when your husband is having an angry outburst, he is not rational. (Insane.) All the attempts to get him to stop and to talk about the problem right then and there are going to be addressed irrationally.

By the way, we negotiated a 2 week "get the mail together" trial today. Thanks for the help everyone!!

This is very important to remember. NEVER try to rationalize with someone who is having an AO. Just excuse yourself from the conversation. Trying to straighten him out will only fuel the fire.

I wouldn't even say "Please stop your AO." It puts him on the defense and feeds the fire. IF you say anything at all, all I'd say is "I'm not going to talk about this right now." Keep it short. The more you say, the more YOU are at risk of lovebusting, too. You can talk about the fact that he had an AO later. Remember, during the AO, he is insane. Trying to convince him it's an AO right then and there will not get you anywhere.

Great to hear

So, when the children and I are in the car, and he's throwing a tether or yelling about his shoe, do we just have to wait for it to pass? I mean, I hate that.

I understand that many folks are telling me I should feel differently about my H and my marriage

Z,

"You should feel differently" is not Marriage Builders advice. Dr. Harley would NEVER tell you that.

My advice to you is, give the negotiating a try, stick with the anger management for your husband, give it a chance to work, and if you don't feel like doing this, share your objections with Dr. Harley and see what he recommends. He may be able to make some adjustments to his recommendations for you, or he may hear more information and decide you need to go a different route.