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***EDIT***
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:16 AM. Reason: TOS: non Harley resource
Me: 30 Him: 39 Together 5 years Married the very best man in the world 04/06/2013 after being common law for too long. I'm a lucky woman. 7 Cats - Viscount Ashley of Leftfield, Pawkie Petunia, The Timinator, Leo the Lionheart, Fruit Snack, Cloud, and Barret And our very lucky pony, Starbucks
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Alright! I could REALLY use some help with this. Tonight, I found a list WW has written for herself. Basically, a gameplan for how this D is going to go down. There's no real surprises in there, as alot of the contents are what we talked about last Saturday.
But seeing it written down, and she's even gone so far as to what things she needs to learn (things I usually do, such as the laundry machines, loading her Ipod, and such), right down to a short list of the major item who gets what list.
She's planning to use a Do-it-yourself documents place that apparently can do a D for #378.
Anyway, this has just REALLY got me freakin' out. It's like a slap of reality that there is no changing her mind.
Honestly, I don't know whether the OM has bearing on all this as even if there was no OM, she still wants this. Convinced there's no saving this M.
I expect most replies will be that this is fogbabble, but when she is making a list for herself and not saying this to me, is it more serious than expected? It's frustrating though, as she is a very avid reader, yet she has not picked up one book or afaik, not read one book on M and how to save them or D and the effects on children or Spouse.
Even in the face of what has happened in the last month, I'm scared to death I've lost her and my family is no longer going to be one.
Hard to believe that 1.5months ago, all was "normal". Where do I go from here?! The sad thing is hindsight SUCKS! If I'd known then what I know now, we could be on our way to a better/happier M without this A tarnishing our Future and now potentially a D.
BH (me) - 40 WW-31 Married 4, together 12 DD 3 DDay (EA) - 8/17/12 Confronted/admitted - EA turned PA - 9/11/12 Exposed- 9/12/12
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The most common first response to a spouse's neglect is to complain: "I'd like it if you'd be more affectionate." A complaint is an effort to communicate a problem without being demanding, disrespectful, or angry. It's a notification there's an opportunity to make deposits (or avoid withdrawals) from the Love Bank. There's nothing wrong with that initial approach to the problem of neglect since it's simply communicating a need.
But when that doesn't produce results, mistakes usually follow. The first mistake is to criticize: "Why do you ignore me? What's wrong with you?" A criticism adds demands, disrespect, and/or anger to the complaint. The message of an unmet emotional need is buried under layers of abuse. Instead of creating a cooperative partner, it creates an adversary.
When criticism fails, and it almost always does, the next step is usually to stop meeting the other spouse's emotional needs: "If you won't meet my emotional needs, I won't meet yours." And that usually means sex. It seems fair at the time, but as with criticism it usually doesn't work and leads to a steady deterioration of the relationship. Spouses start living independent lives, sleeping in different rooms, going on separate vacations, having separate friends, separate checking accounts, separate recreational activities - they become ships passing in the night.
At this point, they often make the biggest mistake of their lives-one or both spouses have an affair. There are no excuses for infidelity, but the reason most people give for having an affair is that their intimate emotional needs (affection, conversation, sexual fulfillment, and recreational companionship) are not being met in marriage. And since 60% of all marriages experience that extremely painful betrayal, this response to unmet emotional needs, which is common in marriage, is almost a certainty.
When a complaint doesn't work, and criticism doesn't work, and independent lifestyles don't work, and an affair doesn't work, then there's always divorce as a final answer to the question, "What should you do if your spouse isn't meeting your emotional needs?" There's little reason to fake it anymore. The marriage is broken, so why pretend that you're still married? This is exactly what happened to my M! It's hard to read further and see how it is very fixable, yet my W has no desire to.
Last edited by 2little_2late; 09/21/12 04:42 AM.
BH (me) - 40 WW-31 Married 4, together 12 DD 3 DDay (EA) - 8/17/12 Confronted/admitted - EA turned PA - 9/11/12 Exposed- 9/12/12
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Ok... the main thing I can look at here without going over all 50 pages over the past month is this;
1) listen to the advice you have been given - ignore her babbling - ignore her batty behavior - make sure you have spying in place to rule out continued contact - continue with Plan A
2) Calm down! - You've only been here learning and trying to apply the program for a MONTH - Given that length of time, consider that it doesn't even cover the necassary time frame for her to get through withdrawal from her affair partner... and that's if contact has indeed ended - You will be building forever habits here, not just temporary, turn-the-bus-around tactics - that process takes time
Apply both carrot and stick. Make sure you are clean, groomed, shaven, and smell good every day. Maintain an air of confidence, and even cheer.
Do not entertain her talk of divorce. If she mentions it, retort; "That's nice honey, I'm not interested in destroying our family, I'm interested in making it better." Offer her a cup of cocoa (with mini marshmallows!)
Eat well.
Get whatever sleep you can.
Exercise.
See the Dr. and ask for some antidepressants to stabilize your mood.
I wouldn't recommend it, but you could possibly make your own little divorce list;
- counter-file on grounds of adultery - petition for [Name of OM] to testify on grounds of adultery - conctact [phone company] for phone records dating xx/xx-xx/xx - set up intermediary for child exchange
If you talk about divorce at all, it has to be the uglies picture of divorce ever. No friendly fantasy divorce.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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Thank HHH.
Your comments help. Even though I should (do) already know the tips you give, it helps to hear it again. It helps to calm me down.
I'm in WA too btw! Western side
*edit Re: 1c: I'm very certain contact is continued. I do feel however based on the non-alien W making an appearance from last Sunday through Tues then the alien coming back on Wednesday that she was not in contact with OM those days. It was the W we were used to. Not glued to phone, reading like she normally does, not going out. It was a nice 3 day stint, but now the alien has reclaimed her once again.
Last edited by 2little_2late; 09/21/12 05:10 AM.
BH (me) - 40 WW-31 Married 4, together 12 DD 3 DDay (EA) - 8/17/12 Confronted/admitted - EA turned PA - 9/11/12 Exposed- 9/12/12
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It's frustrating though, as she is a very avid reader, yet she has not picked up one book or afaik, not read one book on M and how to save them or D and the effects on children or Spouse. Should've read: has not picked up one book or afaik, not even read one article on M and how to save them
BH (me) - 40 WW-31 Married 4, together 12 DD 3 DDay (EA) - 8/17/12 Confronted/admitted - EA turned PA - 9/11/12 Exposed- 9/12/12
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Thank HHH.
Your comments help. Even though I should (do) already know the tips you give, it helps to hear it again. It helps to calm me down.
I'm in WA too btw! Western side
*edit Re: 1c: I'm very certain contact is continued. I do feel however based on the non-alien W making an appearance from last Sunday through Tues then the alien coming back on Wednesday that she was not in contact with OM those days. It was the W we were used to. Not glued to phone, reading like she normally does, not going out. It was a nice 3 day stint, but now the alien has reclaimed her once again. ***EDIT*** If I were you, I would gather evidence of continued contact, adn reexpose. You have no chance if you don't kill the affair dead. OK? You need to kill the affair. Dead.
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:21 AM. Reason: TOS: non Harley resource
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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PS; I'm in "The Apple Valley" which will make sense to a Northwesterner.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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See if she will agree to a weekend away. Look up McMenamin's. They have a few resorts in OR. Packages include your room, a meal, and movies if the site has them. The Grand Lodge has a frisbee golf course. There are pubs and restaurants on site, usually a Spa, and some nice sized soaking pools. Get someone to watch your DD and get in a 2-3 day getaway.... if you can.
There is also Whistlin Jack lodge on HWY 410 that has Romance Packages.
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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When it comes to making marriage fulfilling for a wife, the "when mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy" approach dominates the thinking of many husbands. In this time-honored line of attack, a husband simply does whatever his wife wants, in the hope that he'll at least have peace and quiet. But peace and quiet doesn't turn out to be that easy. In fact, the more a husband reinforces a wife's "ain't nobody happy" part of the equation, the more skilled she becomes in making him miserable.
In many if not most cases, this "give her whatever she wants" approach to problem solving begins during courtship. In an effort to win her heart, he showers her with proof that he's the right one for her. No one will ever care for you the way I will. Then when she finally says, "I do," he's created a precedent. For a while, he tries to maintain that precedent, but one morning he wakes up to face the realization that while she gets pretty much whatever she wants, he's left with little to show for his effort. His wife might like being able to get her way, but he's getting nothing in return.
So he decides to change his approach. Instead of giving her whatever she wants, he takes charge and makes decisions that are in his best interest. If she's willing to let him suffer to get what she wants, how about a little reciprocity? Why can't she do a little suffering to get what he wants?
But his wife doesn't see his point. Thus begins the "ain't nobody happy" response that I mentioned above. That response, of course, does not endear her to him. In fact, it makes him wonder why he had tried so hard to make her happy in the first place. If she's unwilling to suffer to make me happy, I'll just make myself happy and try to ignore her. That strategy, of course, usually leads to infidelity and divorce. http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8122_wife.html
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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HDW,
If I missed that, then I apologize (trying to follow too many posts too early in the morn...)
Have a great day, all! No, Dad - you're spot on. Good call.Meaning what? He has exposed the affair.
He needn't WIELD the stick, just REVEAL it.
Remember all carrot and no stick to a donkey-WW leaves you with a fat....donkey. How is this done? In a calm, straightforward manner? And in the long run, isn't it best for my daughter for us to be able to get along and do things together like birthdays and such? Not that I would want to, but if it gets to that, I want my DD to be as least affected by all this as possible. How does one handle that? How would you like to handle it? If you wife had her way then you and her boyfriend would be polite friends and you would all get together at birthdays and sing songs while hedge boyfriend has his hands on her a**. I have three kids. My wife chose to break up yet family for her affair partner. The kids dont see the two of us together. I haven't seen her since divorce court. That's a consequence of divorce.
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***EDIT***
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:23 AM. Reason: TOS: non Harley resource
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Alright! I could REALLY use some help with this. Tonight, I found a list WW has written for herself. Basically, a gameplan for how this D is going to go down. There's no real surprises in there, as alot of the contents are what we talked about last Saturday.
But seeing it written down, and she's even gone so far as to what things she needs to learn (things I usually do, such as the laundry machines, loading her Ipod, and such), right down to a short list of the major item who gets what list.
She's planning to use a Do-it-yourself documents place that apparently can do a D for #378.
Anyway, this has just REALLY got me freakin' out. It's like a slap of reality that there is no changing her mind.
Honestly, I don't know whether the OM has bearing on all this as even if there was no OM, she still wants this. Convinced there's no saving this M.
I expect most replies will be that this is fogbabble, but when she is making a list for herself and not saying this to me, is it more serious than expected? It's frustrating though, as she is a very avid reader, yet she has not picked up one book or afaik, not read one book on M and how to save them or D and the effects on children or Spouse.
Even in the face of what has happened in the last month, I'm scared to death I've lost her and my family is no longer going to be one.
Hard to believe that 1.5months ago, all was "normal". Where do I go from here?! The sad thing is hindsight SUCKS! If I'd known then what I know now, we could be on our way to a better/happier M without this A tarnishing our Future and now potentially a D. Solomon asks Can a person touch fire and not be burned? He was referring to adultery. Your wife wants divorce, especially while in an affair because it justifies her actions. You just have to continue Plan A. Keep it up. It's your best action. And prayer.
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***EDIT***
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:25 AM. Reason: Editing quote
Me: 30 Him: 39 Together 5 years Married the very best man in the world 04/06/2013 after being common law for too long. I'm a lucky woman. 7 Cats - Viscount Ashley of Leftfield, Pawkie Petunia, The Timinator, Leo the Lionheart, Fruit Snack, Cloud, and Barret And our very lucky pony, Starbucks
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See if she will agree to a weekend away. Look up McMenamin's. They have a few resorts in OR. Packages include your room, a meal, and movies if the site has them. The Grand Lodge has a frisbee golf course. There are pubs and restaurants on site, usually a Spa, and some nice sized soaking pools. Get someone to watch your DD and get in a 2-3 day getaway.... if you can.
There is also Whistlin Jack lodge on HWY 410 that has Romance Packages. I wouldn't do a vacation until after the affair is dead. Otherwise she will just be on the phone with her boyfriend. Plus she probably won't even let him hold her hand.
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***EDIT***
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:27 AM. Reason: TOS: non Harley resource
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***EDIT***
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:29 AM. Reason: Editing quote
Me: 30 Him: 39 Together 5 years Married the very best man in the world 04/06/2013 after being common law for too long. I'm a lucky woman. 7 Cats - Viscount Ashley of Leftfield, Pawkie Petunia, The Timinator, Leo the Lionheart, Fruit Snack, Cloud, and Barret And our very lucky pony, Starbucks
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If I were you, I would gather evidence of continued contact, adn reexpose.
You have no chance if you don't kill the affair dead.
OK?
You need to kill the affair. Dead. Ditto on the reexposure. Actually, her looking at the File-A-Divorce packet at the local Stuckey's is not a bad thing. It just shows that she's clueless, unprepared and thinks that you're going to go along with this. If it gets much worse, then I'd consult a real attorney. As someone else said, the (financial) reality is not going to be what she expects especially since you have no income and watch the child.
Me (BH) FWW Married 2000, DS 8, DD 6, DD 2
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Too little to late except for posting here.
You were told 10 pages ago that exposing just WW supervisor and HR was not enough.
That they can be having affairs themselves, covering for the OM who is their buddy.
This is why you have to expose from the top down. CEO/owner, Board of Directors, President of WW division. Emails follwed up by reg mail. In the letter request what actions are they going to take.
Use the business template that melodylane gave you.
I can't believe all the vets accepting this 1/2 jack [censored] exposure being done by you.
Last edited by TheRoad; 09/21/12 08:14 AM.
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See if she will agree to a weekend away. Look up McMenamin's. They have a few resorts in OR. Packages include your room, a meal, and movies if the site has them. The Grand Lodge has a frisbee golf course. There are pubs and restaurants on site, usually a Spa, and some nice sized soaking pools. Get someone to watch your DD and get in a 2-3 day getaway.... if you can.
There is also Whistlin Jack lodge on HWY 410 that has Romance Packages. /rimshot Bada bah! As I posted, I also remembered that this gentleman is a stay-at-home Dad. Planting the seed won't be a bad idea. IN FACT, I would gather evidence for a re-exposure and plan for it to hit AFTER getting out of town for a romantic weekend. Awwww... honey, what do you mean ***EDIT*** doesn't want anything to do with you any more? Well, yes, of course I told everyone he is a scum-sucking lowlife who can't maintain a relationship of his own, and is attempting to destroy our family. Did you want some left over biscotti from our trip? I wouldn't do a vacation until after the affair is dead. Otherwise she will just be on the phone with her boyfriend. Plus she probably won't even let him hold her hand.
Last edited by Ariel; 09/24/12 09:32 AM. Reason: Do not bypass the profanity filter!
"An expert is a person who has made all the mistakes that can be made in a very narrow field." - Niels Bohr
"Smart people believe weird things because they are skilled at defending beliefs they arrived at for non-smart reasons." - Michael Shermer
"Fair speech may hide a foul heart." - Samwise Gamgee LOTR
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