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Originally Posted By: opiel

We still live together but it has been rather quitet lately. She tried to initiate sex a few times after the D-day but I turned her down. I have to admit that it was hard thing to do.... my wife is such a beautiful woman.


Why is that? Are you not ready?


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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I just cannot look at her the same way anymore. I guess I could say that I want her now more then ever but at the same time I'm beginning to resent her more and more.




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Originally Posted By: opiel


I just cannot looke at her the same way anymore. I guess I could say that I want her now more then ever but at the same time I'm beginning to resent her more and more.

Have you seen this? Listen to the clips also.
Resentment Type A and Type B


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Originally Posted By: opiel


I think she has already realised how many people she has hurt.... not just me. Her sister came to visit us last night. They have been always very close so my wife takes her bery seriously. She is 39, a genuinly good, educated woman who is about to go through her second divorce. She told my wife something like this.... girl, you have no f**king idea how much worse your next marriage is going to be compared to this one.


This goes both ways opiel. You have no gurantee that the next woman will not also cheat.

There are many red flags in your own post that unless changed will always keep you at high risk of betrayal or even worse put YOU at risk of betraying and hurting those you love.

For example:

Originally Posted By: opiel

A year ago I accepted a very well paying job which requires me to travel to another city every week. I am usually gone for 2 ~ 5 days. I discussed it with my wife and she reluctant agreed.


You do not follow POJA (policy of joint agreement.)
It has also been pointed out to you many times that traveling jobs are destructive to marriages.



Originally Posted By: opiel

When we were still dating I was a victim of sexual harassment in my previous job where a my 36 year old married superviser was pursuing me very aggressively. It wasn't unusual get a text message from her at 2 AM and most of them weren't PG rated. I am in a pretty much similar situation right now but not as severe. But I am though dude so I can handle it.


You have poor boundaries yourself with lunches and coffee with OS people and do not shut down OW when they hit on you...but think that you can handle it.


opiel it takes years to recover from an affair and no one will hold it against you if you decide to divorce. But understand that the anger and resentment will follow you even if you divorce because you have not dealt with it. Have you bought the book "Surviving an Affair?" It does not sound like you have because I can hear the betrayed spouse FOG in your posts.

Don't make decisions based solely on hurt...that will not help you recover and certainly will not help you in any future marriage. You have arrived in a gold mine of wisdom and experience. Pick up the tools.

Last edited by pokerface; 03/29/13 10:53 AM.

ME: BW
HIM: FWH
Married 18 yrs
DDay 09/2008 and 12/2008

Recovered

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Brian. thanks for the link.... it was an interesting reading; however, I think that the damage done on emotional level is simply too great to overcome. Frankly speking I don't even have a desire to try to make it work.

It is about a time to slowly start getting ready for my trip to Europe. It will be nice to stay way for a week from this mess.

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Pokerface, I agree with you.... about everything.

I can see that our bondaries leave much to be desired. No question about that. We can make some significan changes, for instance I can quit my current job, but there are also some things that we cannot change much. I guess in the end it all boils down to self-control.

Yes, there is no guarantee that the next woman won't also cheat. To tell you the truth.... when we were together we were always great. There were hardly ever any significan problems. But my wife was compaling for some time that she felt like sailor's wife.... lonely and left behind on the cliff shore.

I did order the book but it will arrive tomorrow and I am leaving tonight to Copenhagen for a week to visit my family and friends. I definitively won't decide anything until my return.

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Originally Posted By: opiel

But my wife was compaling for some time that she felt like sailor's wife.... lonely and left behind on the cliff shore.


This was your redflag to keep you from the h3ll you're in now. It is also you're key to restoring you marriage I think


Me - BH 49 years old
Her - WW 43 years old
Married 20 years
D Day Jan 7, 2013
3 kids - DS19, DS17, DS12
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Originally Posted By: opiel

Pokerface.... my wife is genuinely remorseful and wants to make our marriage work.


and

Originally Posted By: opiel


She has taken full responsibility for her affair saying.... "he was making advances, I could stop it but I didn't." She has been blaming herself only and never tried to minimaze or hide anything about what happend. FB messages, they exchanged, corraborate her story 100%.



and

Originally Posted By: opiel

... as far a polygraph test is concerned she is ready to take it at any time. As a matter of fact she suggested it on D-day herself when I asked her why I would believe anything she was telling me.


and
Originally Posted By: opiel

She is absolutely willing to close her FB and change her telephone number


If it wasn't for posts like the above, I would tell you to divorce her. You seem to have a WW who wants and is willing to make amends. That goes a long ways in my opinion...that's just my opinion.

Read SAA before making a decision. Read everything on this site. It will help no matter what you decide.


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DDay 09/2008 and 12/2008

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Originally Posted By: Wow777
Originally Posted By: opiel

But my wife was compaling for some time that she felt like sailor's wife.... lonely and left behind on the cliff shore.


This was your redflag to keep you from the h3ll you're in now. It is also you're key to restoring you marriage I think


Opiel, after reading my response to you it may have sounded like I was implying that the A may have been your fault. I was NOT trying to imply that at all and I'm sorry if it came across like that. My point was simply that, an affair, like a airplane crash, can be seen as a chain of events that may be able to be stopped if we break the chain. Regardless, the A was her decision and hers alone.


Me - BH 49 years old
Her - WW 43 years old
Married 20 years
D Day Jan 7, 2013
3 kids - DS19, DS17, DS12
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Wow777, you are right and although I'm a judoka by nature I've been kicking myself really hard about that. It wasn't that I didn't listen to her or I was ignoring her but it is all too little too late now anyway.

I hope things are going well on your end.

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Opiel, after reading my response to you it may have sounded like I was implying that the A may have been your fault. I was NOT trying to imply that at all and I'm sorry if it came across like that. My point was simply that, an affair, like a airplane crash, can be seen as a chain of events that may be able to be stopped if we break the chain. Regardless, the A was her decision and hers alone.

I didn't take it this way.... don't worry. I know that the affair was her decision but I have to admit I had my part in it too. Actually she isn't refering to it as affair, she looks at it more like a whoring adventure or simply cheating but not affair.

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Maybe that is why you have some resentment. An affair is an affair whether it is one minute or one night of giving yourself to another person. It does seem that your WW is on board with doing whatever it takes to save your marriage but first she must admit that she had an affair. She can call it whatever she wants, but in the end it is an affair!


Me (WS) Husband (BS)
DS - 15
DD -10
My D-day - 11/12/11

Today Me (BS) H (WS)
D-Day #2 01/14/12
I don't want to just survive my affair, I want to recover from it!
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Actually she isn't refering to it as affair, she looks at it more like a whoring adventure...

crazy So WW prefers, instead of being considered as a wayward spouse, to be judged as a whore?

Well, okay. At least the initials in WW don't have to be changed!

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Please listen to this and tell us what you think.

Radio Clip on When to Save a Marriage


FWW/BW (me)
WH
2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Opiel

You, my friend, have a tremendous opportunity to save your marriage here. Use that opportunity wisely


Me - BH 49 years old
Her - WW 43 years old
Married 20 years
D Day Jan 7, 2013
3 kids - DS19, DS17, DS12
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opiel,

Haven't been on this site for a long time. Just logged in tonight to see what has been going on for the past few years. You said something that I thought I would comment on
Quote:
I can see that our bondaries leave much to be desired. No question about that. We can make some significan changes, for instance I can quit my current job, but there are also some things that we cannot change much. I guess in the end it all boils down to self-control.


It does NOT boil down to self-control. At least in my mind it doesn't. It boils down to perspective and commitment.

You have more than a few posters tell you about boundaries. And in my opinion they have hit the nail on the head. But, what you must understand is that your W had to tell herself something to make her violate HER boundaries. So if I were you, I would be asking her to think about what her boundaries are, how she violated them IF SHE DID (she may not have the boundaries you think), and how will she protect them in the future.

Here is where the plan's that Harley talks about come in. She as well as you need a plan to protect boundaries. Now here is something else to consider by way of perspective.

When you married, you very likely made vows to one another. But the reality is they are vows to yourself. Who is going to enforce those vows? Are you going to enforce hers? Is she going to enforce yours? You and I suspect she knows that you must enforce your own vows. If you two do this, then the thought, "what he/she doesn't know won't hurt them." Can never be used because YOU will know if you violated your vows and she will know. Her guilt prompted her to tell you of her affair, she knows she failed.

But what will help you learn to trust again, and what will help her become a better person is if each of you reexamine your boundaries, consider your vows, and make plans that will help each of you adhere to the boundaries and vows.

These plans need to be detailed not like my diet plans: "I think I'll lose 20 lbs." That is not a plan it is a wish. A plan has milestones, metrics, actions, etc. Each of you need to do this.

Notice I am talking to you about this although you did not have the affair. Read Harley's books or at least the articles here and you will see that YOU can make the marriage stronger by having a plan to succeed, and SHE MUST have a plan in order to help you rebuild your trust in her and her trust in herself. The Policy of Joint Agreement, POJA is a painful but effective way to develop the plan and decide what the goals are for your marriage as well as your career and your family.

Hang in there, the folks here will help you. You have already shown wisdom in taking your time to make your decisions and I think you will see that with the help her you understand that you do have a future with your W and she has one with you, IF you two will learn, grow, and develop a different perspective on marriage.

God Bless,

JL

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JL, nice post I learned something from that. Hope Opiel feels the same.

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Opiel, you haven't written in a while. How are you?


Me - BH 49 years old
Her - WW 43 years old
Married 20 years
D Day Jan 7, 2013
3 kids - DS19, DS17, DS12
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In reading your WW's responses it doesn't pass the smell test that the A has actually ended yet.


I got the same exact Fog Babble from my FWW during our FR.


the 'ol "I'm not good enough. I'm a terrible person. I don't deserve you" on and on.


Oh, how the dialogue changed once the A actually ended.

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Originally Posted By: opiel


Well, it appears that with each passing day since D-day I am getting closer to just pulling the plug on my marriage.


This is completely normal. Even if you do decide to R, there will be MANY, MANY times that you will vacillate between..love, hate, despair and hope. Then start the process all over again.

They dont call it a Rollercoaster ride for nothing

What I hope you can take away from this forum and Dr Harleys teachings is that his program DOES work. IF you use it. There is hope. Hard as heck but R is possible with 2 willing partners.

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