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Originally Posted by LifeIsBetter
He doesn't have keys to my apartment because we live separately. I will see if WH's step-brother could help with exchange.

I'm confused. I thought Plan B was the last step before finalizing the divorce? Don't some people Plan B for up to 2 years and then divorce? I should probably read more about Plan B.

You should file for divorce while you are in Plan B so that you are legally protected. The 2 years mark is the point at which you give up and move on.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Do you have a neighbor or day care center that could facilitate the exchanges? Does your child go to day care? It is not a good idea to ask a relative of your WS to do these exchanges because he/she typically won't honor your Plan B.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Originally Posted by MelodyLane
Do you have a neighbor or day care center that could facilitate the exchanges? Does your child go to day care? It is not a good idea to ask a relative of your WS to do these exchanges because he/she typically won't honor your Plan B.


Yes, WH picks up DD at daycare on MWF and I get her from him at 7:30 pm. She sleeps at my place every week night to maintain consistency. On his weekends I get her back on Sunday evening. So it is really only 3-4 times a week. I have a couple friends I could ask also.

Originally Posted by MelodyLane
You should file for divorce while you are in Plan B so that you are legally protected. The 2 years mark is the point at which you give up and move on.


I apologize in advance, but I really don't understand the whole legal process. We met with a mediator and laid out separation of assets, parenting plan, and child support. It's all written up, signed by both of us, and notarized. The mediator stated they don't send it to the court to be filed, so WH has the papers in his possession. When we are ready to be divorced he pays $80 for the court to process the papers and then it's done. I believe it takes less than a month in our county for the court to process it. So wouldn't that be the last step when I give up on Plan B?


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
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It takes 1-2 years to get divorced in most states, so if you file when you go into plan b, you will be divorced by the end of 2 years. If your husband does end his affair in that time you can drop the divorce action. But regardless of the outcome, you would have legal protection while you are in plan b.

Dr Harley doesn't tell people to stay in plan b for 2 years, only that they CAN give it that long. They should not hold out hope beyond 2 years though.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Okay, I don't think I could Plan B for two years, but I like that there are guidelines for time.

Update: MIL called me on Sunday night and said she had just got off the phone with WH. She said, "He is so upset and sobbing. He just wants his family back. He said he hasn't ate in three days and never sleeps..." So I told her he hadn't ate in three days cuz that was the day I threw a bomb on his stupid affair by exposing it to OW's family/friends. I think she was under the impression that he had ended contact with OW and I am the one preventing him from being happy. I set the record straight with her. She said they are coming to town this Saturday to see WH because it's his birthday next week. She invited me to dinner with them. Wow! I told her they could see DD while they are here, but I would not be spending time with them or WH.

I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Dec 2013
Posts: 58
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You know, LifeisBetter, your post actually inspired me to post and email the radio show so I could do what I needed to. You are a very strong person and I commend you for still being willing to see if your marriage works out. I feel you. It sucks.


Me: 32, BW, 22 weeks pregnant
Him: 32, WH recently diagnosed with Bipolar
Together 11 years
Married 6 years
DD: 3 years old
D-Day: 11/8/2013
NC Letter: 12/2/2013 failed
Plan B: 12/9/13-current


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"I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B."

A week to process the papers, right? It takes months or years to get divorce. But you need to do so something to get legal protection. That means either filing for divorce or a separation.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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"I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B."

A week to process the papers, right? It takes months or years to get divorce. But you need to do so something to get legal protection. That means either filing for divorce or a separation.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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ML- No, the lady said that once I file them they send it to the judge, he signs it, and it's final. No stopping it. My sister got divorced in March of this year. Her lawyer filed papers with the court and my sister had the divorce decree in 3 weeks.

My daughter is all I have to protect. I don't foresee him taking her or not paying child support. He knows if he did anything like that I would get a lawyer and fight for more in the divorce. We split everything pretty fairly with the Mediator.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Fancy #2770659 12/12/13 09:32 PM
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Thanks, Fancy! I'm glad I could help. I spent a lot of time here just reading before I posted. It helps to know other people have been through this and succeeded.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 61
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On Sunday before Christmas WH said he broke up with OW and was ready to be my husband again. I didn't believe him. That evening the OW sent me a FB message saying they broke up and she was willing to answer any questions I have. She also said, "he told me he will always love me and I want him to be happy. He says he loves me and doesn't love you, but wants to have more time with DD." I didn't respond to her.
WH came over that night and said I could ask him anything. I wasn't prepared for this and didn't know what to ask. I told him what Dr. Harley says about ending contact for life and it will be extremely depressing for him for a few weeks. He has been on Zoloft for almost two weeks, so will take a couple more weeks for full effects. I told him he needs to change all contact info. He said he would just block her. I explained the danger of blocking so he agreed to change phone #/email after Christmas.
OW gave him gifts for his bday & Christmas. He plans to return them and mail her the money. I asked him to include the NC letter with the money.

He is not enthusiastic about taking the precautions to prevent contact with OW. How should I behave with him? I feel like I should be positive, nice, and excited that we finally have a chance to be together again. That if I remain positive it will help with his depression. But it's hard not to get pissed that he isn't running to Verizon immediately for a new phone number.

What should be the next step? I need to get SAA book back from WH so I know what to expect.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
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Originally Posted by LifeIsBetter
He is not enthusiastic about taking the precautions to prevent contact with OW. How should I behave with him? I feel like I should be positive, nice, and excited that we finally have a chance to be together again. That if I remain positive it will help with his depression. But it's hard not to get pissed that he isn't running to Verizon immediately for a new phone number.

You should DEMAND that he implement extraordinary precautions today or move out. This is not even negotiable. If he sees you vacillating on this, he will not take you seriously and you will go through ANOTHER false recovery. Many waywards will agree to everything and follow through on nothing just before Christmas so they can spend Christmas with their family. I suspect that might be the case here. It is your job to hold him accountable. The WS does not get to decide how or IF they will comply.. They either do or they don't. If not, he should be asked to leave immediately.

He should be willing to meet all your EP's TODAY. It does not matter if he is enthusiastic or not.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.



"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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Be sure to see the letter and its proper delivery.

Stay positive and sweet. Avoid DJ's and AO's at all costs. He may not be enthusiastic about this, but as long as he follows through with them that is ok.

Can you please share the list of EP's you have put in place with your husband besides the no contact letter?

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Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.
He offered to do this but I wasn't prepared on what to ask him. I know where/when they spent their time together. I know they had sex often, not sure I want more details. I could ask him about gifts and make sure he gets rid of all reminders of OW. What else should I know?

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.
He knows this is a requirement, however, I can't say he has actually committed until all contact info is changed. In addition to phone/email change, I asked him to cancel FB and Snapchat. I plan to cancel my FB as well. Mostly to show him we can both live without FB.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.
He has the template and I'm hoping we can send it early next week.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).
See above.

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).
I set up GPS on our phones. His has not activated yet. He is out of town this weekend with DD for his family's Christmas.

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).
We have separate bank accounts. Prior to affair I had his password, so we will need to do that again.

_____Spend leisure time together.
We need to work on this. I am considering a trip in February for our fifth anniversary. IF this NC thing goes well.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.
Job is N/A. Currently we live in separate apartments, however, WH lives on same block as OW. I'd like him to move, but it's too soon to move in with me. I am hopeful OW is forced to move to her parents 5 hours away and WH can stay where he is until his lease ends in April. OW is broke and will likely be losing her roommate soon. WH said her whole family wants her to move home since I did exposure.

_____Avoid overnight separation.
WH has worked overnights since before DD was born. He does this so he can have weekends off and more family time. I've asked him to switch to a day shift even if that means two days off during the week. He said we can look into it in January. His employer is making some scheduling changes after Jan 1.

_____Allow technical accountability.
I'm not sure about this. ??

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.
Yes, everyone knows. We don't attend church, but recently my friend shared an online sermon about Adultery which was encouraging. I have started the online Marriage series by that same pastor. I have went to church a few times since we separated and plan to go on a regular basis going forward.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 92,985
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Originally Posted by LifeIsBetter
_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.
Job is N/A. Currently we live in separate apartments, however, WH lives on same block as OW. I'd like him to move, but it's too soon to move in with me.

There is not much reason to move forward if he doesn't move in with you and change his phone #. All of these steps at affair proofing are meaningless if he still doesn't even live with you and won't change his contact information.

I think what your husband really wants is to keep both you and the OW. He is not ready to give up his affair. Like I said before, many WS's talk big words to the BS just before Christmas so they don't have to spend Christmas alone. He wants to keep you around as an option while he continues his affair. Sorry. frown


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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I agree, ML.

He says he wants to live with me, however, I'm hesitant to allow that immediately. I plan to see how this week goes with sending NC letter, changing contact info, etc.


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 3,066
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Life, I would give him a few days to give you the NC letter and change his info. If he doesn't, then get yourself back into plan B. Any hesitation on his part means that he is not serious about recovery.

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You were right, ML!!
He brought DD home this evening. He was wearing the freaking sweatshirt from OW he had told me was planning to return. He said he didn't even think about it bothering me when he decided to keep it. banghead
THEN I asked him how his EPs were going that I had asked him to put in place. That's when he admitted that OW is still texting him. Ugh!! I flipped out. Told him to get out, he cried of course.
I told him not to contact me unless it's to tell me he has a new phone #.

Back to Plan B! frown


BW (me)-31
WH - 33
M - 5 years
DD 3 years old
EA/PA - 5/2013
D-day - 6/29/2013. He refused NC.
I moved out with DD 9/2013.
Sold our home and made divorce arrangements.
Plan B - 12/8/2013
FR - 1/2014-3/2014
Divorced 4/2014
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 1,650
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Sorry for your pain. You have an awesome support system though! Wishing you the best.

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LIB, I hate it when I am right about stuff like this, but when you are on this forum for any length of time it is real easy to spot the real gold from the fools gold. You continue to get fools gold.

My suggestion: go into a dark Plan B and don't come out until the people on the board tell you he is sincere. The next time he approaches you with grand plans and crocodile tears, don't respond until you have let us look n at the offer.

Your husband wants both of you and wants to keep you around as an option. He knows if he cries a few crocodile tears and makes some empty promises you will jump. You need to show him that won't work anymore. When you take Plan B seriously, he will take it seriously.


"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena.." Theodore Roosevelt

Exposure 101


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