Hello, I need help with exposure. I could give you my whole story and background if that helps, but I'll start with my question.

I should have exposed on D-Day, however, I didn't know about MB at that time. So my WH continued his affair and I gave up on him. I moved out with our DD, we sold our home, we went to a Mediator to have divorce papers drawn up, and we live separately in apartments. WH told me from the time I moved out that he missed me & DD and wanted us back. I told him that would only happen if he dumped OW. He could never figure out how to make that happen (shocker!). Our divorce papers were never filed with the court, so we are not divorced yet. In November he told me he tried to end things with OW and she threatened suicide (again, shocker!), so then he wasn't sure how to proceed because he would feel terrible if she ended her life. I told him about Dr. Harley and the Surviving an Affair book and if he had any hope of saving our marriage then he would would follow Dr. Harley's advice. I told him his first step would be to send OW a No Contact letter. He asked if he could read the book when I was finished. I gave him the book last week before I finished it, but he hasn't said anything about sending the letter yet.

My question is:
Should I expose to the family of OW at this point? The templates I found on here are more to breakup the Affair. I feel like I should still send them a message that the affair happened, my husband has decided to save the marriage, please convince the OW to stay away from him. OW was married when she met my WH. She asked her H for a divorce two weeks after she met my WH. Their divorce is now final. Her exH friended me on Facebook about three months after the affair began. We traded stories about how it all began and that was the extent of our communication. I've figured out from his friend list who her mother, sister, and brother are. Her father does not use FB apparently. Is it necessary to expose to them? If so, should I wait until contact ends between WH & OW? WH's family and my family are already aware of the affair.

I'm a bit unsure about this whole Reconciliation. I have fears of course, but want to give it my best shot. I don't feel like I am in love with WH anymore which feels strange. I'm hopeful that those feelings will return once he ends contact with OW and we begin spending more time together.

I am confused about why you think the affair is over when you know it is not over. The affair is NOT over. You should expose the affair to everyone as soon as possible. Without forewarning your husband.

What makes you think your husband wants to save your marriage? I see nothing here that indicates this.

Don't you WANT to break up the affair?


I would worry about reconciliation when you have a willing partner. You do not. Your husband is still very active in his affair and is not willing to end his affair.

I would expose the affair and then go into a pitch black Plan B.

If you have any old emails, jokes, etc., that were perhaps forwarded from OW to your hubby, have a look to see the email addresses that were on the group list. I managed to get a ton of email addresses of OW's friends and family that way.

If you have phone numbers, you can also try entering those into a FB search. I got lucky with quite a few of those and it brought me to their names, and then I checked photos to be certain that I had the same person. Another thing that I did is check to see who "liked" their comments/photos, and then I checked THAT person�I found lots more family that way.

You should use exposure to break up the affair. DO NOT wait for it to end! Get as many names, contacts, that you can now, and then once you start exposure you need to blast them all at once (wait 2-3 minutes between each email using FB and pay the $1 for each so that your email doesn't get send to their spam folder).

I also looked up OW's neighbors using the county tax auditor site, four on each side of her, and sent a letter to them (with a family photo at the top so that they could recognize my H from having been at her house).

I was the same as you and did not expose correctly at first. When I did it the second time I blasted it everywhere. I thought of it as like making the largest party invitation list ever.

You can post your exposure letter on here if you'd like for us to have a look before you send it.

ML- Thanks for your replies. I know the affair is not over, but I am hoping it is over once he puts the NC letter together and changes his contact info.
I think he wants to save the marriage because, from September when I moved out until November when he finally told me he wanted to end it with her, he cried every time we exchanged our daughter. I was always very cold toward him and told him he knows he has to end it if he wants me back. He wrote me a three page letter begging me not to sign divorce papers, everything he misses about us together, apologized for destroying our family, and took responsibility for all he has done. The letter made me emotional and hopeful, however, he didn't mention any sort of plan to leave OW. I signed divorce papers the next day and told him that divorce is our only option if he can't dump OW. He was upset and crying again.
At that point, I mostly accepted that our marriage is over. If he can't leave OW on his own then I shouldn't do anything to force him to end it. So yes, I do WANT the affair to end. However, I gave up fighting for our marriage in September and decided to let the affair die a natural death. If WH and I are meant to be then it will work out.
I have exposed it to everyone we know except OW's people. I guess I'm not sure what to say to her people at this point. Do I go with the standard template or also include that OW is mentally unstable so WH doesn't want to push her over the edge and she needs their help.

Blind- Thanks for your help. I have figured out several of OW's friends from WH's FB friend list. They are aware of the affair already. WH, OW, and her friends played on a volleyball league all summer. Apparently, they are all as morally bankrupt as OW because they all knew about it and did nothing. I don't have any emails because WH doesn't use email very much. OW lives in an apartment.

I will think more about the letter and hope to post it soon.

Most waywards want to keep the OW and their spouses around at the same time. He wants you hanging around as an option. If he wanted to save your marriage he would have left the OW. He has not done that. It is a wonderful feeling for him to keep you on the sidelines while he pursues his affair.

Hopefully, you will do EVERYTHING to kill the affair. You should be striving to kill it because he is not interested in saving your marriage. He is interested in keeping you around as an option, which is why he tried to get you to kill the divorce. I hope you can understand this.


I would go with the standard template and add that your H has been in contact for some time and wants to come home but says that the OW is mentally unstable and he doesn't want to push her over the edge.

Unless you have personally spoken to these people, the affair has not been exposed to them. They only know the lies told by your husband and the OW. I would target the OW's parents, family, and friends. You will probably have to pay a $1 to send them a private message otherwise it will go into their spam box.

And more importantly, I would make plans to go into a pitch dark Plan B. This is a separation where he is not allowed to contact you. As long as he is allowed to contact you, it inadvertently props up the affair, while tearing you down emotionally and physically. The affair will die faster if you are not hanging around as his "option" while he pursues his affair.

He didn't want your marriage enough to dump the OW. I hope you were not persuaded by his crocodile tears. All waywards know how to produce great crocodile tears in order to get their way. It is a manipulation tactic. As you can see, he was never serious or he would have ended his affair.

Please follow this.

Here is my letter:

Hello Friend/Family of Slutface,
It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of her friends/family should be aware that OW is having an affair with my husband, Joe. We have been married for 4 1/2 years and have a 2 year old daughter together. They have been having this affair since May according to the evidence.
I left Joe in September because of this affair and we sold our home. Joe has indicated for the past 3 months that he doesn�t want a divorce and would like to keep our family together. He says he has tried to end things with OW, but she seems to be mentally unstable.
I would ask that you use your influence with OW to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husband/boyfriend around her because she is no friend to marriage.
Thank you,
BW


I plan to send these via FB message and pay the $1 to send each message. I have her mother, sister, and brother. OW is only 25 years old and her siblings are younger. It appears that her brother is late teens - maybe 20 years old. Should I still include him? What about her ex-husband? Should I send it to him? He already knows about the affair. I also will send to her 4-5 friends that played volleyball with her and WH over the summer.

Good job and when will you be sending the messages?

Yes send it to her XH and her brother.

Send it to them all. Good job on the letter!!

Okay, great! I think I will send them today. Nothing to lose!

And everything to gain.

We are here for you.

I'm nervous! I have a few things to get done at work, but I plan to send them this afternoon before I leave the office.

We understand, but you will be amazed how relieved you may feel after it's done. The truth will set you free and you aren't hiding his dirty little secret for him.

Okay, I sent to her mother, sister, brother, and exH.

It asked me to pay $1 for the first message - her mother. It didn't ask me to pay $1 for the other ones. Is that normal?

I totally forgot about spacing them out a minute or two! But the time stamps say they were all 3 minutes apart.

Great Job!!!



Did you send to the friends who played volleyball?

Yes, I just sent it to the four friends. Two of them made me pay $1, so apparently that must be part of privacy/security on FB.

Her exH is now chatting with me about it. He says he really misses OW and still loves her. I know some terrible crap that OW said about her exH. I want to tell him to move on, but that might be insensitive.

Omg, the sister replied and asked if it ever occurred to me that WH is leading us both on and that I shouldn't be blaming OW. AND that OW and I are the only victims here. Seriously!
I told her I took the advice of a trained psychologist that specializes in recovering marriages after an affair and that is why I contacted her family/friends. She said, "You need a new husband not a psychologist". WTF!

ETA: Now I just got a phone call from an out-of-state number. I ignored it. OW has my phone number from when I text her a few times earlier this summer. Could be coincidental, but no voicemail.

LIB,

Omg, the sister replied and asked if it ever occurred to me that WH is leading us both on and that I shouldn't be blaming OW. AND that OW and I are the only victims here. Seriously!

Good, almost any response is a good response, it's a bit like advertizing, she at least knows of the affair, what she or anyone else does do with that information you can't control.

However WH and OW don't know who knows, or who told whom, and they don't know who secretly disapproves of them as a result. You have shone on spotlight on their affair, and since most affairs are fragile anyhow, have made it more likely to end sooner. You've converted their magical love affair into adultery plain and simple.

God Bless
Gamma

Good job on exposure.

Have you heard anything from your WH?

Thanks, Gamma.
The sister told me she knew of the situation and asked why WH didn't contact her himself. I told her WH didn't know I was sending the messages. I also clarified that her sister willingly entered a relationship with my husband with full knowledge that I would do everything to save our marriage and that DD & I are the only victims. She didn't reply to that.

WH text me a few hours after the messages were sent. He was shocked and not happy about it. He said if OW has thoughts of harming herself then he will stand by her side and he hopes I am happy with what I did.
I told him he could go ahead and file those divorce papers if he is choosing OW in this situation.

I am happy I did the exposure. It feels good. I think it was easier since we are already separated and I accepted that the marriage is quite possibly over. I'm not sure how I would have handled WH's reaction if I were in my fragile D-day state. Thanks for the advice!

Now are you going to Plan B?

That's the thing about exposure, it's empowering. And don't worry about what he's said. It's all standard fog -- he ripped YOUR heart out and he's worried about his OW?? The nerve!

Great job, lifeisbetter!!

NOW, I would plan on going into an very dark Plan B. Have you read about Plan B? Plan B

Well, WH was just here to pickup DD for the weekend. He says he talked with OW and she pretty much hates him now and has agreed to end contact. We didn't have much time to chat since it was near DD's bedtime, they had to get going. He said he was planning to dump OW this Sunday after he returns DD to me. I said, "Oh really? Because just last night I asked your plan to dump her and you didn't have a plan. So I implemented the plan today and it seems to have worked!" He said OW didn't want all these people involved and is embarrassed that they know about her mental health. I told him, don't care!!

I sort of did Plan B when I moved out. Not dark because we don't have family in our city to help with DD. He didn't know where I live, we only texted about exchanging DD, and met at a gas station to exchange her. It was very helpful for me to have that distance from him. This was from Sept-mid Nov. I probably broke that sooner than I should have, but I was glad he said he had tried to end things with OW.

So WH already asked if we could hangout as a family tomorrow. Ummm, no!! I told him his next step is to change his contact info and give me all his passwords. We'll see how that goes.

He has a doctor appointment on 12/16 for STD test & depression screening. He agreed to that a week or so ago and that was the soonest appointment I could get.

Oh, and he should still send her the NC letter, correct? Since he is still foggy and I have no idea how his conversation with her went.

My suggestion would be to go into a pitch black Plan B. Write out your letter tonight and make arrangements for an intermediary. Do you have someone who will agree to be an intermediary? I would also be thinking about how you do child exchanges without EVER seeing your husband.

Here is the Plan B letter. Please make this appropriate for your situation and then post it when you are done. We can give you feedback.

Sample Plan B letter, from SAA (revised edition) pages 77-78:

My Dearest __________,
I apologize to you for my part in creating an environment that helped make your affair possible. I foolishly pursued my goals without understanding my responsibility to meet your most important emotional needs. I was not there for you when you needed me the most and we are now both suffering for my mistake. [Add your willingness to address other complaints that the unfaithful spouse may have communicated prior to the affair.]

I am willing to avoid the mistakes I've made in the past and create a new life for both of us that will meet your needs. But I cannot do that until you end your relationship once and for all. Living with you under these conditions has been the most painful experience of my life, and I can no longer endure it.

Until your affair ends, and you are willing to follow a plan of reconciliation with me, I will avoid seeing you or talking to you. Our friends, ________, have agreed to help make arrangements for you to see our children on schedule that is mutually convenient. They will provide transportation. If you want to communicate about the children or any other mater, it will have to be through them.

I ask that you respect my decision to separate from you th is way. You must know about the suffering I have endured because of your relationship, and I simply cannot be with you any longer knowing that you are together. I still love you but I cannot see you under these conditions.

As soon as you are willing to permanently end your relationship, follow precautions to avoid absolutely any contact with the other person, and join me in a plan to restore our relationship, I will be wiling to discuss our future together with you.

I hope that we will be able to rebuild our marriage some day. I want us to be able to meet each other's emotional needs and to avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We can build a new lifestyle together in which everything we do makes us both happy. Then there will never be a reason for us to be separated. I want to be your best friend, someone who is always there for you when you need me. And I want you to be my best friend.

I cared for you when we married and I continue to care for you right up to this day. But I cannot be with you or help you as long as you are in this relationship.

With all my love,
(signed)

This letter should be delivered by your friends to the unfaithful spouse, and a copy sent to the lover with a note at the bottom saying:

I love ______ with all my heart and am willing to do whatever it takes to make her happy. I will wait for that chance.

Oh no, you need to send HIM a no contact letter. His affair is far from over.

And.....all OW tell the wayward the affair is over due to their humiliation after exposure.

It doesn't mean it is.

Be forewarned and expect them to try to continue the affair. Expect it and be pleasantly surprised if you are one of the few who killed the affair for good with exposure.

Okay?

Prepare for further battle for your marriage.

These are meaningless, empty words that you have heard many times. He has no intention of ending his affair. He is just saying this in order to keep you around as an "option" while he continues his affair with the OW.

The affair won't collapse until you stop hanging around as his option. He is not ready to give up the OW. He probably told you she dumped him so you would STOP exposing her. He wants to protect his OW.

But let me assure you of one thing: the affair is not over.

You might also call the OW and tell her that your H has been pursuing you and tells you he was going to dump her anyway this Sunday. Tell her everything he said.

Perfect! Her friend just replied to me and said she is WITH OW right now and they want to clear some things up. I asked what they want to know. Waiting for their response!

Good deal! Tell her about how he has been hanging around all this time asking to come back but told you he couldn't dump the OW yet because she is a mental case. REALLY LAY IT ON THICK!!

So OW's friend said that OW is blinded by love and believes everything that WH tells her. I told her that WH has been pursuing me since I left him in Sept. I said I am not the one delaying the divorce, he is. She said that while we were chatting WH & OW were texting the entire time. WH was telling OW how much he loves her and he can't lose her. Unbelievable! Also at the same time he is texting me that it is over with OW and wants to know where we stand. WH had told me in mid-Nov that he was not having sex with OW and trying to ignore her. That never happened! According to OW's friend they had sex as soon as 2 days ago. Apparently WH told OW that our divorce papers were filed, not true. She also said that we are both fools for wanting a man that lies about everything. I thanked the friend for being the middle man and talking with me. She wished me luck.

I was pretty pissed off after my chat with her. I text WH and told him to go ahead and file the papers because I don't want to be stuck in his love triangle anymore. He said he doesn't want to file them. I told him to be a freaking man, step up to the plate, and choose a path because I don't enjoy being an option. He said he would choose a path and asked if he could give me his decision on Sunday. WTF!! I said, no if you can't decide now than I clearly don't mean enough to you so go enjoy your life with stupid slutty home wrecker.

This is so exhausting! I know you guys want me to go to Plan B, but I really want to just skip to Plan D. I don't have any ideas for an IM. I'm not in love with WH anymore. I feel like OW is crazy and will never go away. I don't think I mentioned that WH & OW live in the same dang apartment complex, different buildings. He will never be away from her!

Thank goodness OW's friend called! Now you know for a fact that he was gaslighting you the entire time. (Hopefully, OW now realizes he has been deceiving her, too! ). If I were you, I would tell him everything you just told us regarding your conversation with OW's friend. I would want to make sure he knows he got caught on every single one of those lies.

I think you should go ahead and file for divorce while in Plan B. Obviously, you cannot save your marriage singlehandedly, and your husband's cruel charade has gone on far too long. The purpose of Plan B is simply to keep the BS sane by blocking contact from the WS. You can certainly do that while waiting for your divorce to be finalized.

JC- Our divorce is already written up and paid for. The only thing left is for WH to take the papers to the court and pay an $80 filing fee. I'm not sure how long it takes to get through the court. WH is stalling because he says he wants to be a family.

Latest development: OW is planning to move home to her parents in the next state 5 hours away. WH called me crying today still begging me to give him a chance. I said: I told you a month ago I would give you a chance after OW is gone, but you continued banging her anyway!!! Also said our only hope of any chance is if she does, in fact, move away. He said OW lost her job in Oct and has been waiting tables since then and can't afford her apartment. Seems her misfortune has perfect timing! I'll believe it when I see it.

For Plan B can WH bring DD to my apartment and I stay in the bedroom maybe? That would be more ideal for our situation. I would be willing to put Plan D on hold for the sake of our daughter. It breaks my heart when she asks about mommy & daddy being together. WH tells her our family will be together again soon. I guess he likes to gaslight our toddler also!!

It would be best if you could find someone to help with drop offs. Waywards don't like loosing control and usually try to break plan B. Given your WH is a cake eater, waiting in the bedroom during drop offs, gives him the opportunity to try to break your Plan B.

LIB, you need to go into a very dark plan b. I will just keep telling you this over and over again. And no, it is not plan b if your husband comes in your home. Change the locks and don't allow him in the house EVER.

File for divorce and don't stop it anymore. You have absolutely no call or reason to put the divorce on hold.

He doesn't have keys to my apartment because we live separately. I will see if WH's step-brother could help with exchange.

I'm confused. I thought Plan B was the last step before finalizing the divorce? Don't some people Plan B for up to 2 years and then divorce? I should probably read more about Plan B.

You should file for divorce while you are in Plan B so that you are legally protected. The 2 years mark is the point at which you give up and move on.

Do you have a neighbor or day care center that could facilitate the exchanges? Does your child go to day care? It is not a good idea to ask a relative of your WS to do these exchanges because he/she typically won't honor your Plan B.

Yes, WH picks up DD at daycare on MWF and I get her from him at 7:30 pm. She sleeps at my place every week night to maintain consistency. On his weekends I get her back on Sunday evening. So it is really only 3-4 times a week. I have a couple friends I could ask also.



I apologize in advance, but I really don't understand the whole legal process. We met with a mediator and laid out separation of assets, parenting plan, and child support. It's all written up, signed by both of us, and notarized. The mediator stated they don't send it to the court to be filed, so WH has the papers in his possession. When we are ready to be divorced he pays $80 for the court to process the papers and then it's done. I believe it takes less than a month in our county for the court to process it. So wouldn't that be the last step when I give up on Plan B?

It takes 1-2 years to get divorced in most states, so if you file when you go into plan b, you will be divorced by the end of 2 years. If your husband does end his affair in that time you can drop the divorce action. But regardless of the outcome, you would have legal protection while you are in plan b.

Dr Harley doesn't tell people to stay in plan b for 2 years, only that they CAN give it that long. They should not hold out hope beyond 2 years though.

Okay, I don't think I could Plan B for two years, but I like that there are guidelines for time.

Update: MIL called me on Sunday night and said she had just got off the phone with WH. She said, "He is so upset and sobbing. He just wants his family back. He said he hasn't ate in three days and never sleeps..." So I told her he hadn't ate in three days cuz that was the day I threw a bomb on his stupid affair by exposing it to OW's family/friends. I think she was under the impression that he had ended contact with OW and I am the one preventing him from being happy. I set the record straight with her. She said they are coming to town this Saturday to see WH because it's his birthday next week. She invited me to dinner with them. Wow! I told her they could see DD while they are here, but I would not be spending time with them or WH.

I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B.

You know, LifeisBetter, your post actually inspired me to post and email the radio show so I could do what I needed to. You are a very strong person and I commend you for still being willing to see if your marriage works out. I feel you. It sucks.

"I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B."

A week to process the papers, right? It takes months or years to get divorce. But you need to do so something to get legal protection. That means either filing for divorce or a separation.

"I called the court to see how long it takes to process our divorce papers. She said it would only take a week. I live in North Dakota, so I think things don't take as long here. So I'm not going to file the papers until I'm ready to give up on Plan B."

A week to process the papers, right? It takes months or years to get divorce. But you need to do so something to get legal protection. That means either filing for divorce or a separation.

ML- No, the lady said that once I file them they send it to the judge, he signs it, and it's final. No stopping it. My sister got divorced in March of this year. Her lawyer filed papers with the court and my sister had the divorce decree in 3 weeks.

My daughter is all I have to protect. I don't foresee him taking her or not paying child support. He knows if he did anything like that I would get a lawyer and fight for more in the divorce. We split everything pretty fairly with the Mediator.

Thanks, Fancy! I'm glad I could help. I spent a lot of time here just reading before I posted. It helps to know other people have been through this and succeeded.

On Sunday before Christmas WH said he broke up with OW and was ready to be my husband again. I didn't believe him. That evening the OW sent me a FB message saying they broke up and she was willing to answer any questions I have. She also said, "he told me he will always love me and I want him to be happy. He says he loves me and doesn't love you, but wants to have more time with DD." I didn't respond to her.
WH came over that night and said I could ask him anything. I wasn't prepared for this and didn't know what to ask. I told him what Dr. Harley says about ending contact for life and it will be extremely depressing for him for a few weeks. He has been on Zoloft for almost two weeks, so will take a couple more weeks for full effects. I told him he needs to change all contact info. He said he would just block her. I explained the danger of blocking so he agreed to change phone #/email after Christmas.
OW gave him gifts for his bday & Christmas. He plans to return them and mail her the money. I asked him to include the NC letter with the money.

He is not enthusiastic about taking the precautions to prevent contact with OW. How should I behave with him? I feel like I should be positive, nice, and excited that we finally have a chance to be together again. That if I remain positive it will help with his depression. But it's hard not to get pissed that he isn't running to Verizon immediately for a new phone number.

What should be the next step? I need to get SAA book back from WH so I know what to expect.

You should DEMAND that he implement extraordinary precautions today or move out. This is not even negotiable. If he sees you vacillating on this, he will not take you seriously and you will go through ANOTHER false recovery. Many waywards will agree to everything and follow through on nothing just before Christmas so they can spend Christmas with their family. I suspect that might be the case here. It is your job to hold him accountable. The WS does not get to decide how or IF they will comply.. They either do or they don't. If not, he should be asked to leave immediately.

He should be willing to meet all your EP's TODAY. It does not matter if he is enthusiastic or not.

From Surviving an Affair, pg 66-67

The extraordinary precautions do more than end marriage-threatening affairs; they help a couple form the kind of relationship they always wanted.

These recommendations may seem rigid, unnecessarily confining, and even paranoid to those who have not been the victim of infidelity. But people like Sue and Jon, who have suffered unimaginable pain as a result of an affair that spun out of control, can easily see their value. For the inconvenience of following my advice, Sue would have spared herself and Jon the very worst experience of their lives.


Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).

_____Spend leisure time together.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.

_____Avoid overnight separation.

_____Allow technical accountability.

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.

Be sure to see the letter and its proper delivery.

Stay positive and sweet. Avoid DJ's and AO's at all costs. He may not be enthusiastic about this, but as long as he follows through with them that is ok.

Can you please share the list of EP's you have put in place with your husband besides the no contact letter?

Checklist for How Affairs Should End

_____The unfaithful spouse should reveal information about the affair to the betrayed spouse.
He offered to do this but I wasn't prepared on what to ask him. I know where/when they spent their time together. I know they had sex often, not sure I want more details. I could ask him about gifts and make sure he gets rid of all reminders of OW. What else should I know?

_____The unfaithful spouse should make a commitment to the betrayed spouse to never see or talk to the lover OP again.
He knows this is a requirement, however, I can't say he has actually committed until all contact info is changed. In addition to phone/email change, I asked him to cancel FB and Snapchat. I plan to cancel my FB as well. Mostly to show him we can both live without FB.

_____The unfaithful spouse should write a letter to the lover OP ending the relationship and send it with the approval of the betrayed spouse.
He has the template and I'm hoping we can send it early next week.

_____The unfaithful spouse should take extraordinary precautions to guarantee total separation from the lover OP:

_____Block potential communication with the lover OP (change e-mail address and home and cell phone numbers, and close all social networking accounts; have voice messages and mail monitored by the betrayed spouse).
See above.

_____Account for time (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a twenty-four-hour daily schedule with locations and telephone numbers).
I set up GPS on our phones. His has not activated yet. He is out of town this weekend with DD for his family's Christmas.

_____Account for money (betrayed spouse and wayward spouse give each other a complete account of all money spent).
We have separate bank accounts. Prior to affair I had his password, so we will need to do that again.

_____Spend leisure time together.
We need to work on this. I am considering a trip in February for our fifth anniversary. IF this NC thing goes well.

_____Change jobs and relocate if necessary.
Job is N/A. Currently we live in separate apartments, however, WH lives on same block as OW. I'd like him to move, but it's too soon to move in with me. I am hopeful OW is forced to move to her parents 5 hours away and WH can stay where he is until his lease ends in April. OW is broke and will likely be losing her roommate soon. WH said her whole family wants her to move home since I did exposure.

_____Avoid overnight separation.
WH has worked overnights since before DD was born. He does this so he can have weekends off and more family time. I've asked him to switch to a day shift even if that means two days off during the week. He said we can look into it in January. His employer is making some scheduling changes after Jan 1.

_____Allow technical accountability.
I'm not sure about this. ??

_____ Expose affair to family members, clergy, and/or friends.
Yes, everyone knows. We don't attend church, but recently my friend shared an online sermon about Adultery which was encouraging. I have started the online Marriage series by that same pastor. I have went to church a few times since we separated and plan to go on a regular basis going forward.

There is not much reason to move forward if he doesn't move in with you and change his phone #. All of these steps at affair proofing are meaningless if he still doesn't even live with you and won't change his contact information.

I think what your husband really wants is to keep both you and the OW. He is not ready to give up his affair. Like I said before, many WS's talk big words to the BS just before Christmas so they don't have to spend Christmas alone. He wants to keep you around as an option while he continues his affair. Sorry.

I agree, ML.

He says he wants to live with me, however, I'm hesitant to allow that immediately. I plan to see how this week goes with sending NC letter, changing contact info, etc.

Life, I would give him a few days to give you the NC letter and change his info. If he doesn't, then get yourself back into plan B. Any hesitation on his part means that he is not serious about recovery.

You were right, ML!!
He brought DD home this evening. He was wearing the freaking sweatshirt from OW he had told me was planning to return. He said he didn't even think about it bothering me when he decided to keep it.
THEN I asked him how his EPs were going that I had asked him to put in place. That's when he admitted that OW is still texting him. Ugh!! I flipped out. Told him to get out, he cried of course.
I told him not to contact me unless it's to tell me he has a new phone #.

Back to Plan B!

Sorry for your pain. You have an awesome support system though! Wishing you the best.

LIB, I hate it when I am right about stuff like this, but when you are on this forum for any length of time it is real easy to spot the real gold from the fools gold. You continue to get fools gold.

My suggestion: go into a dark Plan B and don't come out until the people on the board tell you he is sincere. The next time he approaches you with grand plans and crocodile tears, don't respond until you have let us look n at the offer.

Your husband wants both of you and wants to keep you around as an option. He knows if he cries a few crocodile tears and makes some empty promises you will jump. You need to show him that won't work anymore. When you take Plan B seriously, he will take it seriously.

Ok, sounds good.

Do you think I should have said anything to OW when she sent me the FB message that they broke up? I was inclined to tell her to stay the hell away from my family, but quite sure she would never listen. Plus, I didn't really want to give any attention to the self-serving POS.

Communicating with OW is a waste of time. Obviously, her FB message is not sincere. I fell for a similar ruse when OWH "forced" her to send me an apologetic email. My husband knew all about it because they were still talking on the phone and emailing daily. Duh, me.

You are getting great advice here. At this time, your husband is not serious about recovery.

AM

It sounds like your WH was testing you. I'm sorry that he was not serious. I had been through the same thing. A serious repentant man would jump to do the the things you require of him in appreciation of a second chance.

I also second not contacting OW. All I got was lies when I did.

Do you have an IM?

Thanks armymama & RQ.

My friend said the same thing. WH should be happy to do anything I ask. Yes, I have an IM.

This happened to me Christmas 2011.
My wife (who had left and lived with OM for a week) returned and claimed they broke up.
I insisted on a NC letter....she instead wrote a love letter. She refused to follow the letter in Dr Harleys book.
Then OM wife texted me and said that they were still in contact.....

Do not let him move in until he is completely willing to follow Dr Harleys program.
Otherwise you will be miserable! Because its one thing to have a spouse move out and carry on a affair. Its quite another when they do it while in the home!

His behavior is absolutely disgraceful.
Just stay in Plan B.

Sorry to hear what you've been dealin with, LIB. My WH also came back around Christmas to say he was ready to commit to our marriage but wouldn't do any of the EPs like changing his phone number/email or disclosing about the affair. Back into Plan B.

You can do it!

On Saturday morning I woke up extremely frustrated with this situation. I told WH at Christmas that he ruined 2013 for us and I'm not going to sit around and wait for him to carry this into 2014. So I decided to break Plan B and show up at WH's apartment. If OW was there with him then I'd demand the divorce papers in front of them and tell them both they are scum. If she wasn't there I just planned to tell WH to get his crap together or I will file the papers this week. I had to bring DD with me which wasn't ideal, but I knew I could keep my cool no matter what.

So I got there about 10 AM and he just buzzed me in - didn't even ask who was there. OW was not with him. I told him DD wanted to say hello and allowed myself to check out the apartment (I had never been there before). There were several mementos sitting around from OW. A couple paintings she did for him - one of them together and one of WH & DD together. I asked him why he still has this stuff sitting around if they "broke up"? He said he hasn't taken the time to get rid of anything because he is so depressed and just tries to sleep when he is home. There was also a collage of photos OW made of WH & DD with some quote on there about "family". WTF! This chick is psycho. So I took all this stuff and threw it in the corner of his room with a bunch of boxes he never unpacked since we moved. I tried to pack it up for the dumpster, but he wouldn't let me. So he was crying most of this time and asking if we could hangout as a family that day. I told him we could if he went to get a new phone number and we would discuss the other EPs. I was there about 15 minutes.

Later in the afternoon he text me from his new phone number and asked to come over. When he arrived he told me he had met with OW again and told her it was over for sure. He said, "I told her that I've never been this depressed in my life, I don't have any friends left, my family is upset with me, and BW & DD don't deserve any of this." I asked him if he gave her all her crap back and he said she stormed out saying he would never hear or see her again, so he didn't have a chance to give anything back to her.

We talked about canceling FB, changing email address, and sending NC letter. I'm going to help him switch his email over, but I asked him to get rid of anything from OW on there first. He blocked her on FB, but we plan to cancel both of our accounts. We are writing the NC letter tonight and hope to mail it tomorrow.

He asked me to set up marriage counseling, but I told him I want us to do Dr. Harley's program. I noticed it's majorly discounted right now. Is that a common sale?

You need to watch his actions not his words. What actions has he DONE to prove to you that he's ready to do the work?

Oh LIB, I feel your pain. I decided to go back into Plan B instead of helping WH do everything he's suppose to. He's an adult. He should be able to do everything you ask on his own. My WH said all the right things, but when it came down to it the hesitation in doing all EPs without major encouragement just wasn't enough. You do have to protect yourself. I've been back in Plan B for 3 days and it actually feels really good. If WH meant it, he would do everything without question. Actions always speak louder than meaningless lies. Good luck. Take good care.

Why did you break Plan B?

Brain - He has done much more than he did right before Christmas. He changed his phone number, canceled FB & Snapchat, changed email address, wrote NC letter that I sent, GPS on his phone and has been spending all his free time with DD & I. I am very happy with the progress we have made the past few days.

Prisca - I agree it wasn't the greatest idea to break Plan B. I was just frustrated that day and sick of the waiting game. I'm glad I went there because now I know the things from OW that he needs to get rid of.

So are you back in Plan B?

He is still getting his ENs met by 2 women. He's stringing you along. You need to get back into Plan B and don't break it until you've come to the board and inform the board. We will guide you on what to do.

No, I'm not in Plan B. I've seen him everyday since he changed his phone number and began meeting all the other EPs. He has been NC with OW since Saturday.
What should I do different?

How are you confirming NC?

Since he's been in contact with OW since Saturday. Is he changing his contact information again?

Have you seen him throw all the mementos out?

I have the passwords for Verizon and email. He still works overnights, but GPS shows he is at work. When I'm at work during the day GPS shows he is at my apartment.

I may have worded that wrong. I meant he has been "no contact" with OW since Saturday, meaning he talked with OW on Saturday and said it was over. She stormed out - according to him. Then he went to Verizon to change his phone number. Since then we changed email address and canceled FB/Snapchat.

He hasn't thrown mementos out yet. He went back to his apartment for clothes on Sunday, but he hasn't been there since. He slept on my couch Saturday night and has been with me when we aren't working. I think getting rid of that stuff will be a goal for this weekend.

Just making an update because I think you all expected a False Recovery and everyone was correct. I quit updating my thread because I knew things weren't going according to Dr. Harley's plan and we weren't making progress at all. I still believe in Dr. Harley's methods and I'm happy I gave xWH a last chance to save our marriage. Unfortunately, he wasn't enthusiastic about the EPs and starting Harley's program. We are now divorced and I am at peace with the decision. I actually feel like I am back in control of my life and it feels great.

One part of NC at the beginning of our FR was changing his phone number and email address. What I didn't know is that OW could still send him an iMessage via his old email address because that was his Apple ID. I'm not sure if people also have to change their Apple ID to prevent that from happening. I could maybe ask over on Operation Investigate.

Anyway, he lived with me and DD for two months while keeping contact with OW. We did a weekend family trip and a trip to Vegas for our 5th wedding anniversary (Note: Vegas is a horrible idea for 'reconnecting'. I sort of expected that, but it was a cheap flight and someplace warm. It was pointless since we were in FR.) I think he would have been just fine living a double life forever. Waywards are unbelievable.

I plan to be single for quite awhile. The thought of dating terrifies me. I am happy to be off the roller coaster.

Thanks to everyone for your help and advice!

I'm sorry.
Dr. Harley would probably encourage you to have no contact with him.
Are you in no contact?

LifeIsBetter, wish you and your DD all the best!

Are you communicating with him? Are you using an IM?

Is he paying CS?

Sorry it had to end like this. How is your self-care going?

Not in Plan B. We text regarding DD and it has been working well. I deactivated FB back in January when we attempted to reconcile and I don't miss it, so I don't see what he is doing via FB which is nice.

Yes, CS was established back in 9/2013 when we separated. He was paying without a court order. The court order began this month. He is also spending more time with DD than he did this past Summer when he was deep in the affair.

I am doing good as far as self-care. I go to the gym on days that xWH picks up DD at daycare. My family lives one hour north, so I see them more often. I go out with friends when they have time. I'm excited for it to warm up so I can do more things outside with DD. We live near a park with a splash pad, so we are looking forward to that.

This weekend will be one year since xWH met OW. I was out of town at a work event when he met her and I will be at that same event this year. I'm not anxious about it. It's kind of strange what a relief it is to be done with him.