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Joined: Aug 2017
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Hello Group , you might think i was writing a novel.

Me - Wife - age 60 - active somewhat fit
"D" - Husband - age 63 - active somewhat fit

First of all, the kind of looking that I am talking about is not just noticing a woman and getting a glance and moving on. No its much more. We just had our 1st anniversary and yes I noticed this kind of looking/ behavior when we dated and yes I addressed it and I married. I had noticed it so bad that I purchased him his own Her Needs His Needs book to read.

When we started dating I noticed it immediately as I have always been very alert and a very discerning person, so not a whole lot gets by me without noticing, Sometimes this is an advantage and sometimes its not.

1. First occurrence was in a restaurant when we were sitting in a booth. As we got up to leave of course we both saw a blonde sitting with her back to us, but we could only see the top of her head. As we headed out of the booth, my (D) walking in front of me totally turned around walking backwards started looking directly at the blonde in the booth. I was saying are you kidding me, I never uttered a word about the incident as we new into the relationship, but I put the incident into my memory.
2. While at a small restaurant/bar a girl walked by wearing shorts. (D) was at the very end of the table and when she walked by I noticed he had his elbow resting on the table with his hand propping his face.. When she walked by he casually leaned over to the right and got lower until she was out of his sight.
3. Another time we were going down the street and a woman was jogging on the sidewalk and how do I explain this reaction, but honestly he jumped a bit and turned his head in her direction but looked totally back as if he did a 180 head turn. I am not exaggerating it was like he heard a gun go off and turned to see where the sound came from, You might be pondering or giving him the benefit of the doubt that he might looking at something else, and i would have thought that too, however it was a Sunday afternoon and she was in front of an old abandoned building with no signs, no cars nothing to look at but only her. I then addressed the issue right then, actually a lot of these instances.He said he wasn't looking, then he said it doesn't mean he wants to sleep with them, he says all men look.

Ok, you have only 3 instances at the onset of my many grrrr moments. So now let me give you a bit of background info before I proceed.

Around or about the first month into dating prior to us having any sex..... i had what I call my interview in which i sat down with (D) and asked him what was he looking for in a woman, what were his goals. I asked him are you a Christian, do you smoke, do you drink a lot of alcohol, do you want to get married, do you like or watch porn have you ever taken drugs? Mind you that all these things that we discussed we were sitting on a bench next to a lake for a couple hours, trying to get to know if we had the same outlooks before getting to involved and emotionally attached. I asked him if his close female friend was indeed a friend or had he had sex with her. All of the above he answered with no's and a yes that he will drink a beer and that he tried pot back in the day. Some of his answers were no i don't like porn but i did see playboy books around my dads garage and that he used to go to strip joints back in the day. OK, so now i have what I assume is all my information and that it is laid out on the table as complete honesty as we didn't need to withhold any information. So the journey begins in which I am still seeing the looking and then there is this female friend. After figuring it out after only 4 months into our relationship the complete story was put on the table and I told him that I knew it was more and that I better get the truth. He told somewhat the truth, first well it was only a kiss but nothing more, i said nope that is not going to work, then inch by inch the truth started creeping out, yep they were in a full blown sexual relationship and she is married but he fully confessed that it had been over for more than a year. The kicker is that he tried to sell me that she was only a friend and that he couldn't wait for me to meet her and that she was so happy for him to have met me and we needed to go over and hang out play cards. Hmmmm. well somethings still wasn't sitting right, so about 9 months passed and I find out another lie about this fling being over a year ago. The fling was still going on when I first met him in March. They had actually had sexual relations in February..... wow what happened to a year ago, they had sex right up until I met him in March. I gulped down the news like swallowing vinegar. After we got married is when I found all the Porn...... yep. I found over 2 years of porn almost every night. This find almost threw my marriage into divorce, as we had only been married a little over 3 weeks when I found out this lie. He said if you knew you wouldn't have liked me. Really (D), i told him i could have handled the truth much better than being lied to he said well that was before i met you, then I showed him some of his porn that i snapshot.I showed him the dates and they were after we started dating. He said I had no business looking on his phone. he said some things you dont need to know just like finding out about the female friend. This is when i bought the book Her Needs , His needs in hopes that we can move on.

Looking at women is still a very large problem, granted he has curved some of the knee jerk reactions to look. I have watched (D) at traffic lights, He will follow the car with his head and eyes with any woman that is sitting at the intersection until she turns left and passes us, his eyes never fall away. I watch him lean over and view his right side mirror to watch every single car that goes by, in my opinion to get a glance if their is a woman in the car. i have watched him look in his rear view mirror and watch as they put on their makeup. Every car that passes us on the street interstate he constantly looks to see who is driving.I can 99% sure as we walk in to any place, he is already looking around as if to find where they are. This is what I see. He gets outright mad when i call him out on it. First response is that "I am tired of getting accused" Second response "I am not looking", Third response "All men do it" Fourth response "It doesn't mean anything" Fifth response "No One ever said anything to me before" *** this response is the worst he was married 43 years and he has not actually dated only 1 night stands with the girls at the bar with exception of the female friend that happens to be in his neighborhood.

Now how can all 5 responses be logical with each other, either they mean something or they don't, either he is looking or he isn't, I am not accusing as it is factual. How can he in the same breath say he isn't looking then immediately say all men look.This isn't Burger King and you can't have it all your way. I think he gets an actual rush. Its like a high and its a habit. I am here to tell you that not all men look at women like "D" does. this is almost like an addiction, not a casual happen chance that a girl walks by.
It is like a smoker that smokes habitually yet at the end of the day he can't count each cigarette that totaled to 2 to 3 packs a day. Like an alcoholic that can't see he is one, but everyone else can. I must tell you that I do have a video to prove what I said he does. Yes, the marriage counselor that I went to, said have you tried to video so that he can see it, I said no.The very next day I got my phone out and boom he actually re positioned himself in his seat ...you can plainly see "D"s head and body movements watch as the girl about 16 yrs old with shorts on as she goes out the door. I showed the video first to the counselor he agreed 100% i witnessed what he said was not happening. I showed the video to him while at the counselors office. He was mad that i made the video, but then he said you are right I was looking at her at least that is what the video shows, The counselor said no "D" you were checking her out. Needless to say that was our last and his only counseling session.

D has some great qualities indeed, most women would love to have what I have ,,,,,,,, however they don't see the entire picture, they don't know the underlying lie about the porn addiction that he had yet he said he didn't and other lies that he said is no big deal.

I do not believe that all men look with the exception of a hey and how do you do kind of thing.. I don't believe these blogs that says men can't help it and that is the way they are geared, if that were true, the entire society would be doomed if we all did what we wanted to do.
I am told that I am jealous. I perceive that comment as a cop out on the real issue which is "D"'s inability to look away. I told him it is disrespectful to me and how it made me feel. It is easier to blame me with bad behavior and bad habits. I told him that I rejected the excuse that I am jealous and that I won't drink the poison that he is trying to sell. I have too much proof that that it is more than being jealous. I think "D" became addicted at a very young age looking at Playboy around the age of 8 or 9, then onto strip clubs at the age of 17 then got into porn after his divorce of 37 years for 3 years night after night...... because "D" works in the service industry utilities he has a lot of time going from house to house and being on the road that he has became somewhat addicted and conditioned to looking at women and its the norm for him. You can 'D"sitting in grocery store parking lots when he is not busy at work, D can be found in parks for hours when he isn't busy. All the arguing he is now trying to find church parking lots to spend his time when work is slow.

sorry for the novel, i was just curious as to anyone's thoughts as it sure has placed a strain on my new marriage.

Basically i am not going to leave as I have been married for only a year and I was single for more than 23 years. My longtime boyfriend died in our 10th year together, so its not like I have been single too long and don't know how to act. This is not the case. I just want to give it my best shot. "D" does when it comes down to a really bad quarrel apologizes and says he will do better that he wants to be a good husband, i genuinely think he means it, but old habits are hard to break or so it seems.

Thanks everyone

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Welcome to Marriage Builders! What do you think about calling the radio show? I think your situation needs swift radical action as your DH thinks he will charm you into accepting this but it’s unacceptable and you are going to find yourself out of love with him pretty quickly and then who will fight for the marriage?


Me 40, OD 18 and YD 13
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Originally Posted by AllgoodNGA
...So the journey begins in which I am still seeing the looking and then there is this female friend. After figuring it out after only 4 months into our relationship the complete story was put on the table and I told him that I knew it was more and that I better get the truth. He told somewhat the truth, first well it was only a kiss but nothing more, i said nope that is not going to work, then inch by inch the truth started creeping out, yep they were in a full blown sexual relationship and she is married but he fully confessed that it had been over for more than a year. The kicker is that he tried to sell me that she was only a friend and that he couldn't wait for me to meet her and that she was so happy for him to have met me and we needed to go over and hang out play cards. Hmmmm. well somethings still wasn't sitting right, so about 9 months passed and I find out another lie about this fling being over a year ago. The fling was still going on when I first met him in March. They had actually had sexual relations in February..... wow what happened to a year ago, they had sex right up until I met him in March. I gulped down the news like swallowing vinegar. After we got married is when I found all the Porn...... yep. I found over 2 years of porn almost every night. This find almost threw my marriage into divorce, as we had only been married a little over 3 weeks when I found out this lie. He said if you knew you wouldn't have liked me. Really (D), i told him i could have handled the truth much better than being lied to he said well that was before i met you, then I showed him some of his porn that i snapshot.I showed him the dates and they were after we started dating. He said I had no business looking on his phone. he said some things you dont need to know just like finding out about the female friend. This is when i bought the book Her Needs , His needs in hopes that we can move on.

Looking at women is still a very large problem, granted he has curved some of the knee jerk reactions to look...

You discovered that he was an unashamed adulterer, and also a barefaced liar, while you were dating him. You posted here for advice and were told NOT to marry him, but you married him anyway and now find that he is ogling other women, lying to you about his pornography habit, and blustering, arguing with you, and gaslighting you when you tell him that you are unhappy about his behaviour. That is not how any concerned spouse would behave about a complaint, especially not ones as serious as these.

Originally Posted by AllgoodNGA
I am told that I am jealous. I perceive that comment as a cop out on the real issue which is "D"'s inability to look away. I told him it is disrespectful to me and how it made me feel. It is easier to blame me with bad behavior and bad habits. I told him that I rejected the excuse that I am jealous and that I won't drink the poison that he is trying to sell. I have too much proof that that it is more than being jealous. I think "D" became addicted at a very young age looking at Playboy around the age of 8 or 9, then onto strip clubs at the age of 17 then got into porn after his divorce of 37 years for 3 years night after night...... because "D" works in the service industry utilities he has a lot of time going from house to house and being on the road that he has became somewhat addicted and conditioned to looking at women and its the norm for him. You can 'D"sitting in grocery store parking lots when he is not busy at work, D can be found in parks for hours when he isn't busy. All the arguing he is now trying to find church parking lots to spend his time when work is slow...

He is a voyeur and a pervert.

Originally Posted by AllgoodNGA
Basically i am not going to leave as I have been married for only a year and I was single for more than 23 years. My longtime boyfriend died in our 10th year together, so its not like I have been single too long and don't know how to act. This is not the case. I just want to give it my best shot. "D" does when it comes down to a really bad quarrel apologizes and says he will do better that he wants to be a good husband, i genuinely think he means it, but old habits are hard to break or so it seems.

The fact that you've only been married for a year is a good reason to LEAVE, not a reason to "give it your best shot". This man, and this marriage, does not deserve your best shot. He is a sexual pervert and you need to get out of there immediately.

Before you married him, you posted here for advice and got these unambiguous, strongly-worded replies from two of our best, most experienced posters, to which you never responded:

Originally Posted by unwritten on 18th August 2017
Sunday, I am a little confused as to why a woman of your age would be staying in a relationship like this. Lets review the resume of your bf.

-had an affair on his former wife, which she likely to date does not know about (I would be asking myself if this was the only one)

-had an affair with the wife of his neighbor and friend, and not only did he not tell him but remained friends after the fact throwing dirt in the mans face every time he goes over there and pretends to be 'friends'

-continues to flirt with and remain buddies with his former lover right in front of everyone, showing no remorse or understanding of the disgusting nature of his actions

-lies to you about it when you ask him

-finally trickle tells you about the affair, but admittedly continues to be shady about the details

-does not see anything wrong with this behavior

-does not intend to change this behavior

Somehow you yourself have bought into the fact that there is something OK or normal about this. There is not. What he did was wrong. What he continues to do is wrong. Here we would say that this is not a *past* affair but rather that it is a *current* affair. Whether he continues to have sex with her or not, he is still in constant contact with her and has no plans of stopping.

It would take a team of Budweiser horses to keep me from running far far away from this man.

Here is my advice
: call up 'Jennifer's' husband right now. Tell him everything you have been told. Saying it is not your place to do so is like saying it is not my place to call the cops when I see my neighbors house getting robbed. I will just wait for the robbers to tell the homeowner. Yes that IS how complacent that sounds, because NO it does not happen that a long term affair is just exposed to the BS for no reason. Not to mention the fact that this man has suffered long enough in the dark, why would you just wait for the truth to come out, which may or may not ever happen and may happen in another several years when he has wasted more of his life being betrayed by everyone around him. That is just downright immoral and mean to do to a person! Then, pack your bags and get the heck out of there. Unless you want to keep dating a long term adulterer who has a firmly entrenched sense of entitlement and wayward mentality and plans to continue to live by, communicate with, flirt with and have an affair with his lover right in front of your face indefinitely. I am hoping you do not respect yourself so little as to think that is all you are worth.


Originally Posted by Sunnytimes on 18th August 2017
I would not contemplate pursuing a relationship with "Wayne" at all.

If he isn't really bothered to intrude on someone else's marriage, he won't be bothered if he steps out on yours. If you pursue a relationship I'd count on being cheated on.


I don't know how much more strongly those posters could have given this advice, in order to get you to act on it. They could not have been clearer. However, given that his behaviour has become worse, and that he is bullying you into accepting that his behaviour is normal for a husband and that you are, essentially, unbalanced, unreasonable and irrational, we will only reinforce what you were told before. The question is, will you listen, or will you only hold off, hoping to hear from someone who will tell you to work on the marriage (unlikely on this board)?

Several people that have replied to your two threads, including me, have had long-term coaching from the Harleys, and we have posted here for many years, and listened regularly to Dr Harley's radio show. We know what he would tell you to do; it is what you were told to do in the posts cited above. Reverse the terrible, dangerous mistake you made by marrying this sexual pervert and get out of this marriage. Have nothing more to do with him.


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Originally Posted by NewEveryDay
you are going to find yourself out of love with him pretty quickly and then who will fight for the marriage?

She should not fight for this marriage! Your implication is that it would be a tragedy for this to fail because nobody fought for it, but not all marriages should be fought for. She should never have gone into this marriage, as she was told when she first posted here with such a dreadful history.


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I just want to clarify that I don't say that your husband is a sexual pervert because of his use of pornography, not even to the extent of its being an addiction. Neither is it because he has had an affair, plus, as you said, a number of one-night stands during his first marriage, with women that he met in bars. Both kinds of behaviour are horrible, but Dr Harley successfully treats them every day. The majority of recovered marriages on these boards have had either or both issues to deal with.

I say it because you said this:

Originally Posted by AllgoodNGA
...because "D" works in the service industry utilities he has a lot of time going from house to house and being on the road that he has became somewhat addicted and conditioned to looking at women and its the norm for him. You can 'D"sitting in grocery store parking lots when he is not busy at work, D can be found in parks for hours when he isn't busy.

That is not normal behaviour for a married man. Men are very visual in their sexual appetites, but they don't go out of their way to spend hours spying in public places.

Given that he masturbates to pornography, what do you think he's doing when he is being a voyeur in car parks and public parks?


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Originally Posted by AllgoodNGA
...because "D" works in the service industry utilities he has a lot of time going from house to house and being on the road that he has became somewhat addicted and conditioned to looking at women and its the norm for him. You can 'D"sitting in grocery store parking lots when he is not busy at work, D can be found in parks for hours when he isn't busy.


Originally Posted by SugarCane
That is not normal behaviour for a married man. Men are very visual in their sexual appetites, but they don't go out of their way to spend hours spying in public places.



AllgoodNGA, I'm strongly affirm what Sugar Cane is telling you. I don't know of any man who would spend hours in PARKS. Alarm bells were jangling so hard in my head when I read this I had to sign in to reply to you.

Your husband tested and gaslit you during your dating relationship to see what he could get away with in his relationship with you. He found he could get away with almost anything. Now you are aware he spends hours in parks... watching what... children??

No normal person spends hours in parks. When I had kids I couldn't wait to finally get out of parks because they were so tedious and boring. Do you enjoy spending hours watching kids play in parks? Does anyone else you know?

Please read this blog about Clara Hinton. Her husband tested her in similar ways to the way your husband has tested you until he knew that she would serve well enough as his enabler. He went on to abuse and rape children for 40 years. Your husband may not (or may) be a child molester, but whether he is or not, you have given him every reason so far to expect your support in enabling outrageous behavior. You've accepted everything about his behavior, even his flat out lying.

http://clara-hinton.blogspot.com/2013/05/chosen-to-be-child-molesters-enabler.html

This blog is a long read. Once you get a few posts into it you'll get the picture.

I'm so sorry you are in this mess.

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Have you ever talked to his exwife to find out the real reason for the divorce?


FWW/BW (me)
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2nd M for both
Blended Family with 7 kids between us
Too much hurt and pain on both sides that my brain hurts just thinking about it all.



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Allgood, I’m confused at what kind of advice you are looking for here? Not that his very obvious ogling of women isn’t itself reason for concern, but that is just the tip of the iceberg in terms of the loose boundaries and lack of morals your husband has. But you already knew this going into marriage. You knew about his affair and his ‘friend,’ and we all warned you to not marry this man. You went ahead and did it anyway. Why did you decide to go ahead with the marriage knowing full well what kind of man he was? And why now do you seem to be so baffled that he is behaving in the exact way you knew him to be before you married him? Why would we give you advice when you failed to take the initial advice and married him anyway?

The bottom line is, you are an enabler of this behavior. You knew what he was like before marriage and enabled him to continue his ‘friendship’ amongst other things. You now say you will not divorce him, which means, no matter what he does, there will be no consequences. So there is really no advice we can give you here because you do not seem willing to walk away from this man regardless of what he does. Sorry, but welcome to the life you chose here. Unless you are willing to set some boundaries and if (when) he doesn’t meet them, get out of this toxic situation, no one here can help you.


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