My wife and I have been happily married for 12 years, 2 children 5 and 7. All seemed great. 9 months ago, my wife started working again part time, mostly because it makes her happy and she enjoys it very much. I began having "gut feelings" about her and her boss who is also married (and I never have gut feelings about anything!) . We had all been mutual but very casual friends for 3 years prior to her working for him. Many small out of character things happened, her perceived fondness of him, and him for her. Some negative comments about his wife... and my gut feelings became overwhelming. I then came across several emails between the two. My wife said in email to him that when she was somewhere with him that she felt as if "she was on the arm of celebrity", jokingly referred to meetings as "dates", and told him that "I guess I should maybe take him out to dinner?", in reference to our pre-planned anniversary date.(marginallizing our marriage). She emailed they should share a bottle of wine, that they spend a lot of time together, and are on the same page, he replied "I don't mind". She has told me that they have a lot in common, and are just good friends that get along and all of this is just joking. My gut told me something was not right before the emails!!! This is so out of character for my wife! She was telling another man things she does not say to anyone, even me. I confronted her and told her that I was very concerned and confused. Things were bad, she told me they would stop, and I discovered more a few months later. Asking each other what the others plans were, when the spouses were away, nothing specific, just feeling out…We've discussed and argued at length. I am so confused, challenged and out of sorts and afraid, that I don't know how to act or even what is happening. I don't believe anything has happened physically, but feel from the tone and her/his actions that it was the very beginnings of courtship at the least. She would not tolerate this from me. Am I overreacting? Please help! I'm afraid this will spiral out of control! This has been a major problem for 8 months! .
No, you are NOT overreacting. Your wife is most likely having an affair with her boss OR on the verge of one.
You need to expose this to the OM's wife immediately and your wife need to quit her job, and have no contact with this person forever.
Read up as much as you can on this sight. Find out what her emotional needs are and start meeting them.
i'm being told that they are just friends...we've never had any issues like this! Is there anyway that I'm reading this wrong?
I suggest you contact the boss's wife and tell her your suspicions. Forward her the emails, and see if she gets the same vibes as you.
I suspect there may be a bit of an explosion. TA
You could take a poll as to how many of us here heard that same line? I'm guessing you may find 1 or 2 who didn't hear it. She needs to be removed from the situation. Ask her to quit and look for fireworks. That may tell you a lot!
Tell her that friends talk to each other in front of their spouses. Ask her if she's ever told him anything she wouldn't want you to hear.
It sure sounds questionable.
If it really is innocent, then your wife won't have any problems with putting some boundaries in place -- like refusing to have personal conversations with him, keeping business meetings strictly business instead of "dates", letting you have access to her e-mail and cell phone records, etc.
Ask for some boundaries and protections. Find out if she's more interested in protecting you and your M than she is in maintaining a type of "friendship" that has great potential for causing serious damage (if it hasn't already).
And get the OM's wife on-board. Compare notes, see if she has the same concerns.
No. You are not reading this wrong. This is an affair, either emotional or physical.
I wish I could return to the days in which you dwell right now -- at the very beginnings of discovery, before my husband was making his exit strategy, after OW had already thrown OW H out. I wish I had stood up for my marriage.
This is not a risk; it's something you have to do, even though I know it's so scary. You can't believe you are in this position. But you have enough evidence, insist she end this relationship, quit and inform the OM W. Or, your marriage will end anyways.
I know this because I sat on my hands for years, and as of last week, my WH is openly pursuing a relationship with the OW, and our marriage is kaput. People tried to warn me here, but I didn't listen. Now they are "in love" and I could have at least tried to stop it while they were just cake eating, and still "loved" their spouses.
All these signs are classic. It's way past inappropriate. Expose, expose, expose.
When this first was discovered I was broken. She was well aware. So many little things have happened. Any one of these individually to me is really no big deal. I can just feel her admiration for him in my gut! His wife, as we are friends would go ballistic! She never talks that way to anyone, not even me. Thats whats so alarming. I just need to know if its just me, other friends have said they flirt, but i never noticed!!!
Zeke
LISTEN TO WHAT WE ARE SAYING!! It is NOT you. They are NOT "just friends". If you want to save your marriage, follow the advice you are hearing here.
Your Wife is not your wife right now. She is a WAYWARD wife, which means she LIES. You cannot depend on her ot tell you the truth.
There are hundreds of us here on these boards that have gone through what you have gone through now. Its no joke that people have lost their marriages because THEY DID NOT ACT.
You ahve the power to stop this right now. Expose to the OM's W, your wife quits her job, and you have no contact.
If you DO NOT do this, you will not have a marriage to fight for.
Zeke, welcome to MB. I'm sorry you find yourself here for this reason - but you're in the right place. You'll get sound advice here...
The thing that jumps out at me from your last post was that when you first found out all this, you were devastated, yet it appears that your W is still carrying on with this man.
THAT is a HUGE red flag.
When I was married I was good friends with a man who I came to know through business. Things were rough in my marriage, and at one point, my H erroneously assumed I had or was having an affair with this man. I had not. HOWEVER.. since my friendship with this man clearly made my H uncomfortable, I ended the friendship and all contact the very day he expressed his discomfort with it. I told my friend what my H thought, my friend - being a real friend, did not want to be the cause of any grief, so he took his leave and that was it. No more contact. He did return to contact at my H's approval about 6 months later (for business reasons - and the decision was made by H, and H alone)... there was no A - but if it had to be a forever thing, I was OK with that and so was my friend.
See the difference? I loved my husband. I would not have done anything knowingly that would have made him insecure or doubtful or mistrustful. So when he brought that to my attention, I took the necessary steps to FIX the situation and remove the scenario that made him uncomfortable.
It sounds like your W has no consideration for your feelings in this - and that is what leads me to believe that it is at least an emotional affair at this point (maybe more but without proof it's just speculation). The fact that she wasn't sensitive to your feelings when it was first uncovered, tells me that she's on a slippery slope.
And maybe each individual thing is no big deal - but you *are* looking at the bigger picture, as well you should.
Expose it. Talk to the boss' wife. Make her your ally. Set your boundaries where this is concerned and stick to them. Do not allow your wife to treat you like dirt while she eats cake.
By all means tell your wife that you love her, and *show* her (read up on Plan A)... but IMO at this point she needs to leave that job immediately, cease all contact with this man immediately and focus on her marriage. To do otherwise it's only going to get worse.
In loving support,
JinGA
Zeke:
Imagination is right. Take action sooner rather than later.
Do you have a keylogger?
Do not trust one word your WS says. Verify.
EXPOSE NOW.
Don't fear the anger, fear the death of your marriage if you do not.
Get the OMW all the email info you have. You have enough evidence to expose. She may already suspect.
EXPOSE!
When this came out, I could find little support from her. It came to the point that I went to see a counselor so that I could tell somebody, and get my head screwed back on right. i am a very stable, loyal as a dog, husband and father.I live my life in way so as not to bring any harm to my family. I could not believe this was happening! I told my wife, and the emails continued. She had no regard for my feelings, or concerns. She insists on contact with both him, and even with his wife in social settings. The last few times the other wife was even acting funny. I told my wife exactly how I feel, yet it seems like she needs a fix by seeing or talking to him.
i have a feeling she may suspect...they have both acted rather uncomfortable around us in the past few weeks. I'm just afraid to push it outside of my wife and I if i'm wrong. But it is ruining me. The rest of our life was as good as it gets and I just don't understand.
Guarantee that she knows. EXPOSE NOW!
Zeke,
I can make sense of it. Your wife is having an affair. Minimally it is an emotional affair, sounds like a physical affair to me. They are in close proximity far to often.
Here is a link to spying 101.
http://www.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/sho...part=1&vc=1Go about getting the proof you need. Don't think she won't lie to you now she has been the entire time she has been carrying on.
My wife and the OM were just good friends too. So good they slept together.
When this came out, I could find little support from her. It came to the point that I went to see a counselor so that I could tell somebody, and get my head screwed back on right. i am a very stable, loyal as a dog, husband and father.I live my life in way so as not to bring any harm to my family. I could not believe this was happening! I told my wife, and the emails continued. She had no regard for my feelings, or concerns. She insists on contact with both him, and even with his wife in social settings. The last few times the other wife was even acting funny. I told my wife exactly how I feel, yet it seems like she needs a fix by seeing or talking to him.
Well, my father, a serial cheater, took my sister and I (both of us were kids) to dinner at his OW's home - to eat dinner with her HUSBAND and HER CHILDREN (teenagers/early 20s!) - how's that for crust?
Hiding in plain sight I guess... my father was as nice as pie to the man whose wife he was sleeping with.
Don't underestimate the daring of a cheater. Take action now.
As for OMW - you may find an ally in her, and you may not. Expose the affair ASAP. If she's no help - so be it. Sometimes spouses of cheaters (or serial cheaters) just choose to look the other way. Don't be one of them. Be proactive. Expose to his wife, to your families - an affair loses its appeal in the light of day.
JinGA
Zeke:
I am sorry for the situation you are in.
Trust your gut. These same things happened to me and I refused to listen. I went through the same thing wondering "what if I am wrong". 2 years later she admitted to a 2 year affair. If I had gone with and listened to my gut it would have ended after one month instead of 2 years.
Houston, we got a problem. I didn't just post to Zeke, I don't know who did but it wasn't me...GF
I finally feel like someone else understands...Thanks so much the more advice the better! It is sincerely appreciated..I'm at the low point of my life and should not be
ZEKE, my friend, ALL POSTERS ARE URGING YOU TO EXPOSE!!
Do it NOW.
Or you will be standing on the porch waving goodbye to her.
That she refuses to quit the job speaks volumes.
IMHO
kirk
Seems we have a "moving" and a "going" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
JinGA
DUHHH!, Going (Crazy) at this point
(I could have written that post, I got flustered and had to really think if I did!!!! It was strange, cause the info was so similar> I need that litte vac. I'm getting ready to go on) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/blush.gif" alt="" />
I urged to snoop and get proof. I would snoop first then expose.
I am not saying snoop for a year. Hire a PI if you have too it won't take long if they are having an A to get the proof you need.
This will make exposure more powerful.
Again don't wait forever but they will just deny, deny, deny then go underground even more.
do you all really think there is enough there to take a real stand? It is very hard to believe this but impossible to dismiss!!! I love her and my children unconditionally and with everything I have.
As many here have said before, I'll say it again. Intuition is seldom wrong. You said yourself in your initial post that you had a gut feeling.
Emails from what you've said - sound like enough to at least prove an emotional affair. If you suspect it might be physical, it shouldn't be too hard to get the proof you need to make a big splash with exposure.
I guess timing depends on whether you want to expose the known emotional affair - NOW, or wait a short while (emphasize SHORT) and get proof of a physical affair. IMO one is just as bad as the other, but more proof will make it undeniable, because you just KNOW that both parties are going to try to make you look like you're paranoid and crazy, whilst denying what's going on right under your nose.
You wouldn't believe some of the junk my XH lied about - looked me right in the eye and lied to me about, when I had irrefutable proof IN MY HANDS and while I'd show it to him he'd still lie.
Because you love your children and your wife, you MUST do this. If you stand by and let it happen without intervening, you are signing the death certificate for your marriage.
When you do expose, fasten your seat belt because I can promise you that things will get a lot worse, before they start to get better. If the pain of discovery isn't bad enough, you're going to have a wife that's madder than a wet hen once she's exposed, and she's going to try to make it all "your fault"... WS do this - lay blame everywhere but upon themselves, in order to salve their own conscience. You will be made out to be the reason for every bad thing, every bad choice, every choice she's made, you'll be at fault for everything from that to the price of gas and global warming.
Preparing for this and being ready with a plan... Plan A, exposure, you've got a support network already in place here - we can help you through this and help you know what to expect... you can and you will get through this.
Right now the ball is in your court... you can play it by exposing, or you can sit on it a while - but IMO the best move is to play that hand asap and get that affair exposed. Affairs shrivel in the light of day.
JinGA
The OMW recently admitted to me that my wife makes her a little Jumpy and nervouse, but said it was because of my wifes friends...i think there is more she wants to tell me but not sure
Dollars to donuts OMW is having the same gut feelings that you are - and likely she doesn't quite know how to deal with it. You've got an advantage in that you've found this place - tons of experience here.
When my XH had his EA and I discovered it, I didn't know about MB, but I exposed it as it seemed to be the logical thing to do. Allegedly by the time I found out it had been 'over' for a while but they were 'still friends' (cough - whatever). I blew it out of the water and my XH had to make a choice right then and there - the floozy or his family.
We did bounce back from that - that event was not the undoing of my M, there were other things that undid it, and I can honestly say that once exposure, repentance and reconciliation took place, I never saw cheating type behavior in him again. He did keep on telling lies - about other things, that and his undiagnosed/untreated depression along with my own "stuff" eventually did us in. I had my issues, but I didn't lie and I don't think anything I did or didn't do was a 'deal breaker' (although he might beg to differ)... but I don't want to thread-jack here...
Exposure was the most logical thing I could think of at the time, and that notion has been validated over and over by the good folks here.
I know it's probably going to be one of the hardest things you'll ever have to do - it's embarrassing, humiliating, surreal even - but it needs to be done.
JinGA
JinGa, thanks much. I don't suspect a physical affair, but i'm not a very suspicious person by nature. The bottom line is that I feel that if we were just single people dating, i would loose her to him in about 2 minutes..Thanks so much,it means alot
Does she drive her own car? A voice-activated recorder might catch something useful.
TA
Well, you might want to get suspicious really quickly. The fact that when you first brought this uncomfortable situation to her attention and she didn't cease and desist, speaks volumes.
I know what you mean about feeling like if not for the marriage/piece of paper/vows/rings whatever, she'd be gone like a shot. That's not a good sign - and those papers/rings/vows can be undone if somebody chooses to.
What's your plan of action going to be? We can help you formulate it.
JinGA
Zeke,
DID your read spying 101?
Please read the thread. Make a plan and move forward with that plan.
Plan Spying for 2 weeks then Plan Expose if you get the info you need.
Stop second guessing yourself. Stop giving your WW the benefit of the doubt.
THE VERY MINUTE YOU ASKED HER TO STOP and she didn't was confirmation she is in an emotional affair.
So read spying 101. Key loggers, voice recorders etc.
I will bet she has another email address that you don't know about.
Start now or you will regret it.
One thing I have noticed is nobodies spider sense tingles unless there is danger!!!
I was waiting for another"event to happen" (i have not been telling her that I know more communication is going on) but they just keep coming and I wait again, caught her lying last week about him, pretty minor, but an excuse to see him(although not alone) during their week off of work(business was closed). She also emailed him knowing that his wife was gone all day asking "what are you doing while she's gone all day". I just don't get it and don't want to let her know that I know more things just yet. Noticed he calls our house about "work Stuff" when his wife is not home...
OK. Wakey wakey time.
Keep what you do know to yourself for the moment - but take the advice to read the spying thread and give yourself 2 weeks to get more proof.
What are you waiting for? This "event to happen"... what is it? Are you waiting until you come home one day and find OM in your bed with your wife? Because that's where it's headed if it hasn't happened already. Think you'll feel better if that's what happens next? I promise you, you won't.
Employees don't ask employers what they're going to do all day when their wife is away.
You've been given a ton of sound advice here - you can keep going over it again and again if you wish, running in circles and getting nowhere, OR you can take the information you've been given and make a plan to get the rest of the proof you seem to need, bust up the affair, expose it, and start the process of saving your marriage.
That choice is yours. Sit on your hands and wait for "an event", or take control of the situation and do what you can do to try to get things right again.
What'll it be?
JinGA
Most companies now days have a sexual harassment policy in place. What's going on between your wife and her boss (friends or no) would send the HR people at my firm into a tizzy. They would put an immediate stop to it.
If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then guess what. It's probably a duck.
I just want to tell you that trust your gut. I would bet that everyone on here has heard that “He is just a friend”. That is the same lie that they all tell.
You have other red flags. She does not care about your feelings and she seems to be addicted to the OM.
For us guys are needs are pretty basic. We want our wives to admire us and have sex with us and just to be nice to us. I would guess that would be enough for most men not all but most.
I am guessing you are in so much pain because you can see that she admires him talking about him as a celebrity. And she also promised that she would stop then she wouldn’t. Those are red flags and I would not just wait around and see what happens.
Since it is just a part time job ask her to give it up. If she wants to work part-time she can do it somewhere else. I think your wife would freak if you had a part-time job at Victoria Secret and the boss was flirting with you. You will really harm your marriage if you do not do anything about it, trust me I know.
My wife swore she was not having an affair and she and the OM were just friends. She was already in a physical affair with him. I am amazed at how many men are in denial in these situations.
I am guessing that your wife will say you are just jealous. If she does not want to give up the part time job then you are in big trouble. When you think about it a part time job means very little. She could go almost anywhere and get one of those. But it may be a way for them to spend more time together. She should want to please you and not worry about the OM’s feelings. Talk to her and I would try to get her to stop working with the guy and keep them apart. Of course this is just my opinion and I could be wrong
She absolutley does not need the job, only for her own satisfaction of activity outside of friends and family. Money is not an issue. I do believe she NEEDS to see or hear from him...I'm noticing an "irratabillity" when a few days go by w/no contact.The first several months I was so upset that I was not rational...now when things happen I can analyze much clearer. I'm going to continue to watch for another week and post back if it is ok with everyone. Finding the info here and support from you all means very much to me. The hardest thing in all this is that there is no one to truly express too. Its like i'm talking in a different language when I express this concern. Amazingly, I post my concern here and every beleif and feeling I've had these past 8 months is echoed back to me from you all...Still shocked! Thanks and i wish you all the best
You need to do some serious spying. If he calls her on your home phone, you can install a voice recorder in an unused jack, and tape the whole conversation.
How is your sex life with her?
Sex life has been the same, pretty much...like is aid before, she does not know all that i know. I still really believe it is the beginning, there was a lot said without being said if that makes any sense. The talk was like"ok who's going to make the first move here, we both feel something" thats my overwhelming sense...
The talk was like"ok who's going to make the first move here, we both feel something" thats my overwhelming sense...
Well, just be careful with that one... When I suspected my ex of having an affair with a coworker, I also thought it was mostly flirting with a slight chance of an EA. When I finally managed to get at the truth, it turned out they had been in a PA for months and months. Usually we BS's are a bit slow on the uptake, because it is so hard to believe our spouses would cheat on us, it only happens to "others" <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />.
So don't let too much time pass - where there's smoke, there's fire...
AGG
Many women (not all) have a hard time being emotionally involved with one man and having sex with another. That is why I asked.
I think you may be right about it just being the beginning of an EA. If I were you, I would continue monitoring, and get busy with a great Plan A. You also need to be spending 15 hours a week with her alone, doing fun things.
Soon you will need to talk to the other man's wife, and compare notes. Also your wife will need to find another job, because boundaries have been crossed.
If she gives you the, "I love you but I'm not in love with you" speech... then remove *any* doubts you may have - it's most definitely an affair.
JinGA
zeke, did you tap your phone? You can get a recorder from Radio Shack and get a tape recording of their conversations fairly quickly.
ML is right, I bought one for my son - I still have the tapes of her and her boss, calls he didn't know were even happening. He is divorced now, as he kept wanting to believe in her and would not confront her. I even paid for his PI and he still insisted that confronting her would damage the marriage chances. Now he is divorced (no fault state)
PLEASE tape their calls and read Spying 101, follow MB - my grandchildren have lost their family - maybe if my son had been less trusting and listened and come to marriage builders he would not be alone. You do not want to be where he is.
Now he understands why I fought and still fight for my marraige. But he doesn't understand the tools. I couldn't get him here. You ARE here.
Heed the advice.
Linda
I'm planning on having a discussion with other spouse this weekend...I'm scared to death....Iknow I've asked before, but is there anyway I'm misreading this???? If i had to bet my life I would say there is something there, but can't convince myself completely that it could be real...also, is it common for it to be hot and cold between the two?
Zeke,
IMVHO you are making a HUGE mistake. You can't convince yourself and you expect to convince OMW.
I can tell you if you want advice people have given it to you. You seem to keep disregarding that.
If you go to OMW and she confronts him he will deny it. Then He and your wife will go further underground. Making it harder for you to get evidence.
Why are you not snooping or spying like every single person here has suggested you do before you try to confront.
Even with pictures of them naked on a bed they will TRY to deny it. With no evidence they will certainly deny it.
GET TO SNOOPING AND STOP ASKING THE SAME QUESTIONS.
I THINK YOUR WIFE IS SLEEPING WITH ANOTHER MAN AND SO DOES EVERYONE ELSE HERE.
Your sitch is not special or unique if you think something is going on it is.
Have you set up the tape recorder on your phone line?
will follow your advice and post back...thanks and sorry for my lack of confidence in my thinking...last questionis it possible for these things to be hot and cold, one week lots of Communication, next week back off and so on??? I'm starting to notice that a little...on to 101
it possible for these things to be hot and cold, one week lots of Communication, next week back off and so on???
Yes...
OR they can be discrete one week and not so discrete the next.... Or he can only talk at certain times because of his family life. Or she can only talk at certain times because of yours.
Just spy and figure it all out.
I have monitored email for a 3-4 months now...with almost daily communication. there has been ZERO communication for past 8 days! Any idea what could be going on...? Thanks again for vereyones support and input. it means alot!
They may have gone underground and are in contact some other way. Did you talk to his wife?
Just keep checking. But if there is no contact, your wife should be showing signs of withdrawal. Is she?
she has been a little impatient and blah, she is a very unemotional person anyways, so it's easy to tell. She is trying to be very careful with me and the sit.its been a hard hard 8 months. ...she works with him so she is there now. No i did not talk to his wife. I have been a plan A champ though for about 5 days now. I sense it is making her wonder whats up?
Well, keep up the good work. But you realize that they can't work together, right? I've never seen a case where they work together work out for the marriage. It just doesn't happen.
I know that everyone here has given me advice, and frankly, it is everything I wanted to hear and everything I did not want to believe! She is not a flirt, and the things that were emailed btween the two crossed the line, and from coming from her were unbelievable to me. The gut feelings, the friends asking whats up, her diregard for my feelings about it. I was just hoping that if i continued to express my concerns for our marriage, that she would come around. What if I'm wrong about the sit.????? I'm going to plan A my tail off, as hard as it is. I'm going to keep a watchful eye. I don't think I have the courage to lay down the NC. She would with me no doubt...I'm hoping her feelings went away, i think though it is temporary. I'm still on the ropes!
There MUST be no contact. That is what will save your marriage and bring back her feelings for you.
You can't be afraid to lay down the NC.
Hi Zeke. Your story has resonance with me, and I came in here today to check on you.
You are making the same mistakes I did. You want to believe the best. You are scared. You are hanging onto any thread of hope. You don't see any contact, and you wonder if maybe, finally, it's over. You relax, and you're happy that you didn't have to take a risk, and now the situation has resolved itself on its own.
The reality is, your wife probably suspects you have her password, and she's set up a Yahoo account, a private one, just for them. It takes five minutes.
A few weeks ago, my husband moved out. He thinks he is "in love" with OW. Even though it's all out in the open, they STILL try to sneak around and act as though they aren't together. It's an addiction, and the chemicals that are released when they hide out is part of the thrill. Your wife going further underground only makes their relationship stronger -- the two of them against the world.
Please. Get off your computer right now, head down to the electronics store and get a recorder. Stop by the hardware store and pick up some electrical tape. Attach these items under her carseat. Get your evidence, so you will be able to confront her effectively.
I know how you feel right now. You are afraid of what you might hear. You are afraid it will devastate you. But trust me: it will be much more devastating to feel the pain I am experiencing now, in the aftermath of the loss of my companion of 20 years. I am surviving, and I will make it through. It is not the end of the world. But you don't have to experience this. You *can* make it through this preliminary pain, and hopefully avoid the much worse pain of the loss of your marriage.
Maybe you're also afraid that if you confront her, she'll choose OM over you. That's a slight possibility, I won't lie to you. But while this at the beginning stages, you have a much, much greater chance of it ending, of exposure being enough to make it fizzle out. Right now, he is still married and it would take BOTH of the marriages to end for them to be together. Right now, your wife has nowhere to go. There is no time like the present.
By the time the OWH approached me, it was after he'd been kicked out of the house. WH and OW had become like spouses. When I confronted my WH, he admitted that they'd been kissing in their building -- which leads me to believe there was much more, like an alcoholic who said he only had one beer. It is as though work was his other home, and she his other wife. Losing me was not as significant to my WH by the time I had hard evidence, and asking him to leave her would be like asking a man to divorce his wife. By this time, he was telling me to my face that he was excited about pursuing a relationship with her, and hoped she might have his babies.
All of our friends have tried to talk to him; he blows them off. They say he is unrecognizable. The chemically induced thrill of having an affair has replaced all common sense and decency. "Election" was running on HBO this weekend. I have to admit that the Matthew Broderick character made me laugh out loud when he told this woman, who he'd slept with one time, that he loved her. In a voiceover, he said he couldn't get the smell of her off his body, off his fingers. They had decided to get together again that same afternoon. In the middle of his workday, he plotted and schemed -- he had 45 minutes to get a hotel room set up and then get back to his job. As he drove the hotel, he daydreamed himself as a European lothario in a convertible, exclaiming that he felt free for the first time in years. But when he stepped out his car, you saw an old, filthy shoe on his foot, a middle-aged man dashing for the dirty hotel room. He ran about it like a sweaty pervert, setting out faded flowers and cheap chocolate, in preparation to sleep with her a second time.
She treated him horribly, didn't show up, even told his wife about their dalliance. And still he fawned over her, as my WH does when the OW does awful, disrespectful things to him. He comes crawling back if she bats her eye. The filmmaker did a great job of showing his decline into depravity, his desperation, and sweaty foolishness. This is addiction, that went unchecked in my case because I didn't effectively address issues earlier on. I didn't want to believe WH was capable of this. I kept coming here, hoping that someone would make me feel better, tell me it could be anything besides what it was. They begged me like they are begging you. There is no solace -- only actions that need to be taken, by YOU.
Act now, before your wife, like my WH, no longer cares about herself, her reputation, her livelihood, or YOU for the sake of this tawdry, dirty little thing.
I talk to OWH every once in a while, just to try to gauge his mood, because I don't want him to shoot WH. He's never threatened, but I know he's angry. I tell him things to encourage him to take care of himself and move forward with his life, and it seems to help calm him. Though, like my WH, he forgives this woman's disrespectful behavior toward him, and will take her back in a heartbeat. I've warned WH to be careful. But in his fogged out, chemically based stupor, he continues on in this affair. This is a really, really bad situation.
Similarly, as your situation deteriorates, more people will be impacted besides just you and OW. Right now their relationship seems simple and questionable, but trust me that it's not. We've all seen it before, and we don't want you to go down the same path. I'm living in the aftermath, with a child who has been cast aside by her father so he can start a new family. So many people in our immediate circle are hurt and depressed. I know you feel the pressure now, but it will hurt far worse later, for you, and everyone else.
So get up, go to your car, and start the process of saving your marriage. There's nothing else anyone can say to make you feel better here. It's going to hurt for now, but it can get better. It's not fair: you didn't make the choices she did that got you here. But nevertheless, if you want to save your marriage, act NOW.
Great post, Imagination. A lot of valuable food for thought.
Dude-
Quit procrastinating. Get off your duff. Get a keylogger installed in your/her computer. Get a voice activated recorder installed her in her car, and another installed on your home phone line. Start looking at her cell phone usage. How many calls/when is she calling him? Get ahold of her phone and look at her text messages.
DO SOMETHING.
You've been sitting in the same spot for weeks now.
If you change nothing...nothing will change. This will continue.
Get your proof...get ready to expose when you've got it.
Quit letting your fear rule you.
Great post Imagination. Hope you will start a thread with it. You describe PERFECTLY the tawdriness of an affair, and how important it is to stop it early.
Zeke1122,
Welcomn to the MB forums. It's the one club that no one ever wanted to be a part of, but, having been through the devastation of infidelity, the best place in the world you could have landed.
I've read your entire thread and would have to pretty much agree with others here that your W is having, at the very least, an EA with her boss. ONTH, being the rather negative person that I am, I believe it has probably escalated furthur than that by now. Could be wrong(disclaimer), but doesn't look that way.
Your gut doesn't lie to you. It awakens and alarms you to something you could never, in your wildest dreams, have ever thought would happen to you and your M. Ask any BS here, they will tell you the same thing. I certainly felt this way. But denial, is exactly what allows this unholy travesty to continue. Thus, you must put this to rest one way or the other.
Folks here have recommended that you get a key logger, a GPS, a digital recorder and so forth. So let me ask you, which one of the items have you purchased and installed? If the answer is none, then I will ask you a Q. As it was put to me and others here, "WHAT WOULD YOU DO IF YOU WEREN'T AFRAID?" What would be the next right step to take? You seem like a very smart person, so why the hesitatiuon to take the steps necessary to save your M?
You can second guess your gut forever, but, every minute wasted is more time for the A to continure. Fact is, you don't want to believe the truth, and I say this because none of us wanted to, either. We all know, been there done that. It breaks your heart!
If I could digress here for a moment, I will attempt to tell you what it was like for me.
I began to notice that my W's behavior was becoming very odd and different for her. We had been M'd over thirty years at that point, had raised two beautiful and loving sons, and were(I thought) just cruising along down life's highway. I am an alcoholic and it had caused many problems early in our M. But at this point in time I had been sober for 16 years.
When I began to notice some physical changes in certain private areas, I went to the internet for some logical explanation. Well there it was right in front of me, complete with graphic pictures. But of course, this could not be true. Not my M, not my W, no way, no how.
I had no choice but to ultimately approach my w about this, and was, of course met with a tirade, of "How could youeven think of such a horrible thing?" I was met with silence for several days and beat myself up for even thinking the same thing. So as a way to end it, I made an appointment with my family MD.
You can see how this saga is going right? He confirmed I had HPV and the only way to contract that is by having SF with an infected partner. I came home that afternoon, and looked in the fridege. Ther was 3 bottles of wine, and my heart sank. They had been purchased that day. My W knew of my appointment and why. It was a horror to me. I grabed a bottle, a corkscrew, and 2 glasses for the talk we were about to have. As we sat in the back yard on our swing, I told my W what I had. There was silence. It was for me a deafening roar. I glanced over as her eyes glazed over, and my heart was ripped from my chest!
DDAY!!!
NO CONTACT(NC) is not an option, it is a must if you want to save your M. But that choice is yours!
I wish you and your M,
All Blessings,
Jerry
Thanks, I'm no dummy...but this has turned me into a total wreck, confidence gone, self esteem beat down so bad that i can't see myself being good enough for her? this thing has wrecked my confidence so much that I'm not sure that I'm right. I keep giving the benifit of the doubt because I love her, and my family so much. I have NEVER betrayed her, EVER, and NEVER would. It's just such a leap for me to tell her that I KNOW she has feelings for someone else. I'm 6'3" 220 lb former college football player, never physically hit another human in my life, successful business, nice house, nice cars, great kids, wife always supported me, and vice versa. I have everything going for me except for the most important thing! I told her that I have hit rock bottom and the emails kept going...I've always been the one to fold and make peace if an issue ever came up. It is hard to hear that evreyone here see's what i see, and that she is not being honest. It is hard for me to overcome the guilt of spying...VENTING, sorry. Beleive me , i have taken everyones advice here very seriously, and I am and have been taking measures to look into this. Again, I love her, and through the help recieved here, am developing a plan of action. Wish i would have had this info from MB months ago...I was a blubbering, do you love me? Idiot for months, it got me nowhere, and probably did more damage. I did EVERYTHING wrong in terms of dealing with WW sit. Please, be patient with me here, don't stop trying to help, I hear you all, like i said before, not ashamed to tell everyone, need to lay down the law for the 1st time in 15 years...
EVERYONE'S self esteem was in the toilet when they found out the one person in the world who was supposed to have their back was cheating. It goes with the territory. Like Bob Pure says, recovering your marriage is a hero's gig.
Zeke, you say you feel guilt for "spying". You should NOT feel guilt. What you did was NOT wrong. You were trying to protect the very thing God gave you the job of protecting. Don't stop now. It's a tough job, but it is not only your right to do this, it is your duty.
Zeke:
Sorry that you find yourself in this situation, but you are in the right place.
Have you read the threads on Plan A and spying 101?
Zeke,
You were a college footbal player. What did you do in the face of your opponent? You threw your chest out, banged on it unmercifully, and growled before games, did you not?
Well, my friend, your in the championship game right now, and you better not fold on me <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />.
You should not feel guilty about spying, because you are NOT! You are tring, as the husband and leader of this M, to uncover the Godly truth to which you are so deserved! This is not wrong!
Key logger, GPS, voice activated recorder, and if necessary, A PI. Stop short of nothing to save your M.
Next, what will you do with that info? Do you have a plan to deal with this if your worst fears come true? I didn't. I had no clue and let years pass by me while I stewed around in a drunken fog. What a humugous waste of time.
Read up on Plan A and Plan B from this web site. Have a plan to get your life back. Don't sit on your helmet here, my friend, the kickoff is in the air.
Stick around, others will be of great help.
All Blessings,
Jerry
this thing has wrecked my confidence so much that I'm not sure that I'm right. I keep giving the benifit of the doubt because I love her, and my family so much. I have NEVER betrayed her, EVER, and NEVER would. It's just such a leap for me to tell her that I KNOW she has feelings for someone else.
This breaks my heart. I really feel for you. Unfortunately, I had to wait until after my WH performed his ultimate betrayal and left this home before I found myself again. Friends say I am glowing, and it's because I'm not getting beat down emotionally on a daily basis anymore. Yes, I have cried buckets and buckets of tears, but each day, as I wipe them away, I find myself underneath. I can't explain how much stronger I feel, with the weight of my husband's affair no longer taking place inside my home.
You can get rid of this weight as well, but since it's still in its early stages, keep her in your home after the OM is out of the picture, where you can keep your eye on her.
Losing my partner this way is painful, when I think of the memories we shared. But as for the present, honestly, I don't care what my WH does in his sticky studio pad, or with whom. I don't let those thoughts bring me down. I am filing for the big D. Called some lawyers today. Don't get to this point before you can feel good again. I know how emotionally draining this is, and how your confidence deteriorates, how having the rug pulled out from under you leaves you unsteady and unable to trust yourself.
So trust us.
Yes, this is indeed happening: an affair. To what extent, only those two people know. At this point, it doesn't even matter. Look at how whatever it is now is defeating you. It's just a matter of time before it impacts your kids, too, if it isn't already. Perhaps they are already sensing that something is amiss, that mommy and daddy are not truly connecting.
Do you really have a plan of action? Me? I would cook up one, and then half do it. Then I'd start another several weeks later, and weakly enact it. My fear would always get the better of me. Then it would be back to square one. Nothing resolved, only worsened. Things I would do without full conviction, would only serve to push them closer together. I didn't want to be alone, so I put up with it. Now, here I am. Alone.
Don't. be. me.
And for the record, you don't have to tell her you KNOW she has feelings for someone else. Once you have the evidence, just push the Play button. No more room for denial at that point. Don't worry about her getting upset at you for "snooping." She has no room to talk about betrayal. Be prepared to stand your ground and focus on what she had done, and how you are going to resolve this issue together. The first step: insisting upon no contact.
In the process of my husband confessing, he admitted that he told a good friend about his feelings for her, and he had been keeping him accountable for months, trying to help him resist. But he'd sat there in counseling, lying to my face, saying that he had no feelings for her besides friendship, berating me for daring to question his integrity. And when I exposed to our friends, he told them that I am psychotic and jealous. He tried to ruin my reputation to protect this woman, knowing he had "feelings" for her all along. He knew that if I ever found out about his feelings for her - back in the days before she asked her husband for a divorce - I would insist that he quit his job and never see her again or get out of my house. He didn't want to be alone, so he hid out until she had the guts to do what he could not. By the time I found out about his true feelings, he didn't care anymore.
He has been lying and lying and lying to me. And so is your wife. Whatever she says to you in denial of their relationship, is so she can continue to be near him. If her lips are moving, she is lying. Just don't listen it anymore. Get your evidence. Get her out of that office. Or you will be meeting with your neighborhood real estate agent today, like I am.
Thanks Imagination,
for helping me try to bring it all home <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />.
Sadly!
All Blessings,
Jerry
Thanks everyone, I'll keep you posted.
If anyone out there is questioning their TRUE GUT instinct, the one that just makes you sick, well don't question it. Finally got her to admit to feelings for this guy. Thanks to all of you that made me see the light of day and my prayers go out to the next "me" that posts here.
Sorry,
Has she written a NC letter? She will have to quit that job asap and cut all contact with OM. She said she has feelings and that is an EA but are you sure it never got physical?
Don't believe it has become or ever was physical, she said she never acted on it but i never imagined this would happen either, don't know and don't know if i'll ever know.