My Wife of 20 years ran off to Mexico with another man 2 months ago. They met at the end of a holiday last winter. She was travailing fro the first time with her girlfriend. Later they developed a relationship online with this guy and started a plan to get together. 3 months ago she announced she was leaving and going to find herself for the next 3 months. Turned out to be in Mexico with this same guy. He live full time in Mexico.

We separated legally in a real hurry as she was in a real hurry to settle matters. She promised an attempt to reconcile on her return. Later she said it was a lie to get me to sign over assets? I was very bitter when she told me about the affair and the internet romance that followed? It was not a pretty picture for over a month.
I truly love this woman to my sole but we were having issues and were annoying each other all the time. We weren’t working things out however.
Both of us say that we love each other but it had gone too far in our emotional separation in the last few years?

Here is the kicker. After 1 ½ months apart and her shacked up in Mexico with the new boyfriend, she is now contacting me and we are discussing reconciliation? Or at least the possibility. This behind the back of the new boyfriend.

This has absolutely crushed me as I was just starting to move on emotionally. This tlak has kicked me so hard I can hardly function now. It is by no means a certainty about reconciling but we are planning on getting together to start talking face to face on a upcoming return home that she has to make?

Any advice? I do love this woman but the hurt of the affair and new boyfriend are going to be tough to swallow? Is it too late to start again?
Please help me?

BB,

Welcome to MB, I think you will find a wealth of information on this site concerning relationships, marriage, surviving infidelity etc. Read it, read it all very carefully.

My natural instincts would say "kick her to the curb". I suspect those are your feelings as well. Prior to coming here, that is exactly what I would have told you.

Now I will offer you a bit more measured advice. First, it is possible to recover this marriage, but it will take a few years if at all, and it will take a lot of focus, pain, and emotional energy.

Your first step is to evaluate your marriage, and your failures. Then evaluate the failures you feel you made in responding to your W's actions. Until you know yourself, your goals, your boundaries, your role, and the changes you need to make, you will not be able to productively recover your marriage or make a good decision to leave.

THis site is NOT a marriage at all costs site. It is meant to give those troubled marriages the best chance if recovery IF one or both of the spouses decide they want to.

So the first big decision is to decide if you really do want to. That leads back to the self-evaluation I just mention, but it also leads to considering her behavior.

For example you allowed your W and friend to go off on a vacation without you and knowing what you know now that was a very bad idea. She has now split the marital assests and gone to Mexico to be with lover boy.

If you decide to even try and rebuild, OM, lover boy, MUST be out of the picture completely via ANY form of communications. Until that happens you don't have a snow balls chance in Mexico of making this work. Next, you will need a plan for recovery and she should probably express a willingness to go see a pro-marriage counselor with you.

The heavy lifting is often done by the BS, IF the marriage is to recover. If you don't feel you can do it, perhaps it is best to move on, AFTER you have evaluated yourself, learned where you failed the marriage and made changes in that behavior. Why do I say that? If you don't make the changes you bring the same baggage to a new relationship and suprise second and third marriages fail...alot. Why? Nothing was learned,nothing changed, so nothing changes.

You could view any attempt to recover the marriage as working on you so that no matter how it turns out you are ready for a good relationship. Sort of a win-win situation.

So do some reading, alot of thinking, and decide on what your boundaries are and make plans to protect them even if you decide to attempt to recover this marriage.

Hope this helps.

God Bless,

JL

PS: Do you two have children and what age are they?

Thanks for the response, It is much appreciated. I have looked around this site extensively before I registered and posted this
We do have 2 kids. 24 year old step son at college in another town. He is disgusted with his mother’s actions. A 17 year old daughter living with me. My daughter is very upset and rebelling now I believe due to the situation. It has been a good bonding thing for the 2 of us however she believes here mother is never coming back to our town?

My wife left with only her personal belongings and a desire to be paid cash for all the assets. We were in very good shape financially and splitting was very easy. I have less money but it was not any real issue. She only talked of reconciliation after the agreement of how to split the assets. Once she got with the new boyfriend the story started to change and reconciliation was dead again She was obviously testing the waters with the new boyfriend.

She was uncertain; I believe what she wanted to do. Only I the last week has things changed. Personally I was sure I never wanted to see her again until she started sending me invitations to chat? I am so confused now.

We both love each other and both have said so many times. My problem is if we can recover? She is only just starting to broach the subject and is terribly confused now. She has been crying several days now about what she is done but thinks too much has happened. Is it? I wish I was certain

Your advice about disconnecting with the new boyfriend is good and that is what I am working on with here now. She is uncertain but considering this every day.

Should I put my foot down and say you must break it off now and then the years of recovery could begin? That is how I feel but I am being very careful not to push to hard this last week. My wife is very impulsive and emotional person. I have always been careful talking about emotional issues. She often would overreact to criticism as a first response. Rational later on always?

How do I talk to here next?
Thanks
BB

I know you have said you love her and are willing to consider reconciliation, but you should also consider whether your children want her back.
If they are as repulsed by her actions as you say, it may affect their relationship with you if you allow her back into your home. Once your DD is out of the house, will either her or your son WANT to come and visit you if the mother is there?

Also, if you do try reconciliation with the wife, protect yourself. After making you split the assets and running off, I would include a post-nuptual agreement as part of reconciliation. If she has another affair, she leaves only with whats in her savings account.

Good luck with your choice.

Good points. Would they want her back? Probably they would regardless because she is there mother. She calls them regularly and does care. the kids are upset but i doubt that they could cut her off? It is unlikely.

I have thought about an agreement if we reconcile. My lawyer suggested at the separation and I have thought about it several times. The lawyer suggested it because she was playing dirty during the negation. The lawyer said her behaviour pointed to an agreement if reconciliation happens. It was still being discussed at that time.

Still looking for an answer on how to confront her on leaving the boyfriend and returning to Canada and home?
BB

BB,

You don't confront her about the OM. You don't issue ultimatums. You don't tell her what to do. Is that clear?

Having said that, I will now tie back to what I said to you in the first post.

What are you boundaries? If one of them is that you will NOT compete with another man for her affection, attention and love, state that.

If one of them is that you fear for your marriage and feel that a necessary boundary is that ANY woman you are intimately involved with cannot be in contact with old lovers, state that.

If you feel that you need to protect your own mental health and sense of security, and having her or any woman that you happen to love in contact with old lovers threatens that, say so.

Are you seeing a pattern? You are NOT confronting her, you are in fact confronting your own boundaries, figure out what they are, and state them. These are YOUR boundaries, if she wants to part of your life should realize that these boundaries will not be crossed. Her choice, your boundaries.

I have a few other thoughts about your post to me.
What are you confused about? You don't want to see her. I know, you really are confused. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But, what you are very likely confused about is that you love the woman you married, not the woman that left you and is talking to you now. Your confusion stems from the fact that when you contact her in anyway you naturally start to see her as she was NOT as she is. It is why us guys often think our W's are beautiful all of their lives. We see them in our mind as they always were, and the reality is NOT important. NOW, the reality is important. And you are confused about the W you married and were married to so many years and the WW that you face now.

This leads naturally into parts of what I told you earlier. She COULD become once again the woman that you knew, loved, married and had a child with. But, she has to do it, and that means she has to change her perspective about herself, her weaknesses, her failings, and YOU. That will be her call, not your, but if she does not demonstrate these changes, not just "I'm sorry's", then there will be no rebuilding the marriage.

Now that you are in contact with her, consider doing plan A. It means exposing her to all that MIGHT help her see the light. It means trying to meet her needs and showing her there is hope. IT means protecting your boundaries. Thus you need to articulate them: what do you expect of a friend, a W, a lover, of yourself? KNOW these things and protect them. You also need to remove love busters from your vocabulary. You know how she has acted, you know she is a liar, a cheat, an adulteress. You don't need to tell her, she knows as well, and in her current mindset doesn't care. That may change.

You also need to take good care of your daughter at home. THat is MORE, MUCH MORE important than the woman living in Mexico right now. Get her to counseling, talk to her, show her the information on this site, by some of Harley's books, let her see how these things should be handled. How marriages and relationships should really be carried out. Let her learn from your experiences so that she can avoid some of them.

Oddly, this is a wonderful OPPORTUNITY for you to show your daughter how a man handles deep sorrow, deep hurt, and betrayal. IT will also show her how SHE should if the occasion ever arises.

Frankly, do plan A indirectly, but if the affair continues or contact continues, go to plan B. You have signed the separation papers, your daughter is with you. Plan B protects your love for your W and allows her more time to get it together. IF you run out of love, before the affair ends and she gets out of the fog, there is little chance the marriage will be saved. Plan B be her absence from your live means that the drain of love from your heart is slowed because she is not LB'ing you, not rubbing your face in it so to speak.


So consider your boundaries, state them, and most of all take care of your daughter. Your W's problems are her own, and she must deal with them herself.

Hope this helps, please think about this.

God Bless,

JL

Thanks JL good points. Very supportive points for me rite know. I will try and follow them. Especially about my daughter.
It has been a very positive thing already for the 2 of us. Real bonding is going on in the last months. Prior to the separation we had difficulty talking for the last 2 years. The hormonal teenage girl and I were on very different planes of thought. It is definitely coming back to the relationship we had in the past and that is wonderful.
I have thought about counselling for her and myself for that matter, but have yet to act on it? To be very honest I have had difficulty getting a lot of things done as normal at home and at the office. My senior management has been supportive of my difficulties but it has been difficult to function as before to date? At home things are starting to get done but it is a slow process. Simple things have been difficult to get accomplished some days.
My Stepson at College is just as troubled and disgusted with his mother’s actions and it too as been positive to our relationship. Ours was pretty good before anyhow.

I have been pursing plan A without knowing the plan listed here. I have read it over a couple of times now and think I have a strategy going forward.
Any advice for supportive lines to use might be useful?
Thanks again
BB1961

bb,

You might want to consider some anti-depressants. What you are going through is very very tough and depression is very common. You won't need them long term, but right now you want to be on the top of your game and the anti-D's give you the best shot at that.

As for your step-son and daughter, do your best to help them, and oddly the less negative you say about your w, the better. She is their mother and their needs for her are very different than yours. Do consider some counseling, perhaps via church or something like that.

Talk to them, help them, support them, and focus on them. They need to know there is something solid in their life and that is YOU. You will NEVER regret doing this.

I am glad to hear you are doing the reading. It takes awhile for the full picture of what Harley writes about to fully sink in, but as you work it, and as things evolve, you will find it is powerful.

As for your W, give it time. This is a process not a fix, rarely are their shortcuts. So settle in for the long haul and realize that progress is measured in baby steps, which means that from time to time you will fall on your tush. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> Get up and keep stepping.

No matter how this turns out, YOU will come out a better man. If you do focus on the kids, THEY will come out to be better adults. Teach them by example, how a man with boundaries, morals, values, takes the time to really assess the behavior of someone that has failed them. You won't regret that either.

Must go, but hang in there and have faith in yourself and your kids, they sound like terrific kids.

God Bless,

JL

Actually I do have anti depressants. It helps once in a while but it is hard to function on work days however. Both types I have tried leave me groggy and difficult for me to handle work. I am a manger in a very fast paced factory that has gone through major changes lately. I have got be on the ball for work. The problem is that if I take one in the evening I can barely get moving in the mornings. They do help on rough days though.
I found out that some of the reason my wife has been talking again. She is upset about the kids. Turns out both have been upset at her about here possibility of staying permanently in Mexico with the boyfriend? I am not questioning the kids; she volunteered that info today in a chat session. My wife is conflicted because of the kid’s reactions. It could take years to get over this mess even if she came home now and tried to reconcile. I am being supportive now just for the sake of the kids but I am deeply troubled by her behavior.
Funny thing just came to mind this week. My wife’s mother did the same thing to her family and was out of the picture for many years leaving her dad to do everything. The kids were a little younger 10 to 14 I believe? None of them talk to there Mom now? Coincidence?

Both kids aren't dealing with this well. Both feel abandoned and believe she has gone crazy or something. I can only be there for them and hope there mom drops Mexico and the boyfriend down there and gets her ****** together. I am trying hard not to say anything negative to them about there Mom. Just being there for them is my goal.

What I mess I am in?????????

BB,

Actually YOU are not in the mess. Your W is. You have a 17 year old daughter to rear, and I am sure you will do a good job. Keep talking with her, get her counseling, and really be the father she needs right now. Your step-son, needs less care, but just the same he needs YOUR support. Have him come home when he can, call him and make sure he is doing well, make sure he knows he can call you.

AND as for you, move on with your life. Right now you have no choices to make, you think you might in the future, but right now, you don't. She is gone and she may or may not come back. You have to decide if you want to wait, and if so for how long. But, rest assured "This to shall pass". You have a good job, your health is good. The separation agreement is signed, you are not in a mess BB. You just aren't sure what your path is. That will become obvious in the next few months.

I have noticed that in my life when really big decisions need to be made, that really there isn't a decision, the data is always clear which is the best choice. Now I could go against the path revealed, but it has always proven that by going in the obvious direction, that was the right decision.

You are in the collecting data phase right now. Collect it, examine it and you will KNOW what the right decision really is. Give it time. You are going to survive this. Your relationships with your kids WILL become closer. Your understanding of yourself, your goals, your bouandaries, your morals, will increase as you examine where you really stand on many things. In the end you WILL survive and prosper.

Your W??? IT is unlikely that she will come out of this whole. Some of the damage may be repaired, but she lost more than she realized.

I am not saying the latter with any glee. I am simply pointing out that meeting your commitments and vows has rewards that violating them does not.

Hang in there.

God Bless,

JL

Thanks JL
Hate to admit it…. I had a good cry after I read your reply.
You’re so right, I need to move on and support my children. They are forever, my wife is not obviously. Maybe she may come back into my life again? Hard to say?
Yesterdays chat with her was a difficult one for me. She wanted to slam me for her perspective of our separation. Very different than mine. She harped on the fact I consulted my closest friends and my parents about the separation. She said I was a big mouth getting them involved. I needed someone to talk to about this and they were there for me. She has told nobody, not her family (brothers and sisters only) or her friends. She said only that she was leaving to find herself for a few months.

I just realized late last night how she could have done such a thing without at least talking to friends and family during this all. Most people like to bounce ideas off people they are close to when problems exist. She had been very upset that I talked about this situation with anyone. This had bothered me that she was so mad about my consulting others. She had told nobody of course. Why it took me so long to realize how she could tell nobody is bizarre? She did have a confidant.
The new boyfriend was here sounding board!!!!!!!!

You are right JL she is the one in a mess. She abandoned her family and all her friends for this guy. She is the one at the loss. I have good friends and a supportive family, good job, morals and people like me. I am not too bad off am I.

I do Love this women and probably will till the day I die. I need to be happy with my life and when and if she comes to a realization of what she lost. It will be her call. I am I transition and not looking for a relationship. If she comes to a decision after I meet someone it would be over forever? I will still have my family and my happiness with no regrets
Thank you JL, you have been big help with all you resonses
BB

should i forget about her forever? single choice
	Keep up plan A
	forget she ever existed
Votes accepted starting: 09/03/07 10:46 AM
View Results

BB,

My bad, as the kids would say. I thought you had exposed this affair to everyone. Part of plan A is to expose the affair, and that means HER family needs to know. She will be mad, she will be spitting nails she will be so mad, but affairs don't do well in the light of day, when secrecy has been stripped away.

Now exposure needs to be done with the idea of rebuilding the marriage and seeking help in convincing her to end the affair. It is part of ending the affair. Let me make a recommendation to you. You NEED to expose this affair to her family, that is part of plan A, and it is painful, but very potent. However, given the age of your children, I would suggest that you talk with them about this.

Now here is the problem exposure needs to occur before she can spin this. So if you decide to discuss the plan to expose and you explain to your kids the reason for the exposure, you need them to NOT tell your W what is about to happen.

I don't want you to put your children in the middle, but I do think they can learn something. Because when you expose you ask for their HELP in trying to convince your W to end the affair. Given her family history, they might do that for their grandchildren and you.

She is still in the fog BB, and as such you can expect to hear some really bizarre things come out of her mouth. Before you know it will be your FAULT <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> that she had your step son. Yup, makes no sense but neither will alot of what she has said.

I strongly urge you to expose to her family and seek their help. Please consider it, and realize this IS part of plan A, and it is an approach strongly recommended by an international authority on marriage and rebuilding marriages.

Your family knows, your kids know, her family needs to know. If for no other reason so they can help her IF she ends the affair and your marriage does not work out. She will need someone on her side.

Think about it and discuss it.

God Bless,

JL

PS: Read the plan A part again, so that you understand the goal here. IF you want this marriage or a chance at rebuilding this marriage, the affair MUST end first. Exposure is about ending the affair and asking for help in rebuilding if it comes to that.

Hi JL
I was a little shocked to see your comment about exposing the affair to her family. I didn’t read that in the plan. I looked for it too. There are plenty of opinions either way on that subject posted, but nothing I could find in the plan?
The other dilemma, assuming I would consider this exposure is that her family is almost non existent.
Her Father (a good man) died in an accident 15 years ago.

Her mother who I mention in a previous post, abandoned the family when the kids were young. She has had little to do with her for the last 30 years. No contact at all for the last 10 years. She is way out of the picture.

2 Brothers, One has told me flat out he doesn’t want to hear a word about it but is concerned and does worry and check up on me. The other brother I have not talked to, He may listen and be helpful? Hard to say?

She has 2 sisters
Both sisters had severe drug problems in the past and interfered with our family in the past. The Boys and my wife were pretty normal considering there problems. The 2 other girls were another story.
Either might listen to me if I could find them? One has no contact with my wife for years but I could find her if I put some effort into it?
The other sister does contact my wife these days but I have lost track of her? She is kind of transient.

Friends….Well very few.
My wife has been rather strange the last 2 year, even before the affair. She has stopped contacting her friends almost altogether. She spent most of her time in the bedroom sleeping or brooding. It was a major reason for our problems. Obviously depressed and was medicated and seeing her Doctor regularly. Did little good now it appears.
Her best friends all went by the wayside, all except one. The girl she went to Mexico with in January. They have been very close for 15 years. Odd thing happened down there. They fought constantly and 6 days in they parted company NEVER to talk again. Ii heard the story and blamed my wife. Imagine how popular I was with that comment?
She did start with a new friend last year. New girlfriend of my best friend. She however knows nothing of her actions with the boyfriend?

The other thing to note is that she will fly home to take care of some business next week. Not sure what the business is and I haven’t asked?

Help more confused than ever.
BB

One other thing to mention. She has threatened me many times that she would expose me to my family and my coworkers if I uttered a word about the Affair and her new location.
I believe her 100%
I have never done anything illegal but have used Porn as a substitute during our problems. It was easier. I am a very sexual individual and always have been. I did get carried away with it and she found it on my computer.
I feel awful about it. I am terrified and certain she would do her best to tell everyone that she could about it. I am not really worried about my family. Just the kids, friends and my professional reputation with my employees?
BB

bb:


From prior posts by others about changes in their spouse's behavior long before d-day, I would strongly suspect that the affair started 2 years ago. Or, if not this affair, then there may have been another one.


She is threatening you! Defuse this by exposing your Porn use 2 your family and coworkers yourself. Do this at the same time you expose her affair.

Telling the truth is NEVER wrong. Keeping secrets from the ones you promised 2 love ALWAYS is.

As for a plan:
I would suggest you call one of the Harleys for marriage coaching. They will know what 2 do 2 encourage your W 2 call them herself if she wants 2 save your marriage.

It isn't me, but if it were in a si2ation like this one, I'd let her calls go 2 voicemail and respond only when I wanted 2. You need 2 keep yourself from being hurt by simply hearing from her. You also need 2 remove her "fix" by calling you while she's still with her OM. Let HIM meet ALL her needs. He won't like doing that for very long. And only when she gets herself away from the OM and proves 2 your satisfaction (and the Harleys) that she's done so, would I consider trying recovery with her.

But that's me.

-ol' 2long

BB,

You shouldn't be shocked. Dr. Harley strongly suggests you expose to everyone who you think might help, even take out a newspaper ad if necessary. Read his articles on exposure.

However, having said what I have, IF you feel that exposure to her family will be of little use, and it seems from what you have said that it wouldn't help much, then don't bother.

I am concerned as is 2L that she has been acting strangely for 2 years. It could suggest emotional issues, Midlife crisis, menopause, some other medical situation, OR it could suggest that this is NOT her first affair. Hard to say, but perhaps you might want to check old phone records or credit card records to see if something pops up.

In some ways it makes little difference in others it might solidify your choices concerning fighting for this marriage. I cannot tell you on that one.

Must go.

God Bless,

JL

Hello
Been a troubled 2 days. Thinking of saying the ****** with this and go to plan B?
She has been very angry in the last 2 days in our chats. Wants to tell me off. Told me tonight she was actually mad at our son because he has completely disowned her. He is mad over the announcement that she would like to stay in Mexico possibly forever. She told the kids this few weeks ago. Our son has completely stopped talking to her and she is very upset. She was venting at me and apologised for that today.
The Boyfriend is still there through all this. I feel he is coaching her feelings on this?

I was ready to tell her off tonight until she told me in an IM chat what the issue was. Still I am very discouraged. She also said that she had made up her mind at that instead of driving home as she had once promised. She will now fly home, take care of her business and return to the boyfriend.

2 years of strange behaviour? she is or was under the doctors care for a chemical imbalance. The meds caused lows and was a\n issue. She also started on menopause at tat same time. Possible causes? Boyfriend? I doubt it. She went nowhere for 2 years but our bedroom and work? Could even get her out to visit our friends except rarely?


Plan A continue or Plan B? Move on and forget the Adulteress?
I will avoid this call for a few more days. Still not sure what way to go?
BB

BB:

This is the kind of thing I'm talking about. She calls 2 yell at you for the consequences she's facing for her asinine choices?

DON'T ANSWER THE PHONE.

If you can trust her 2 not clean you out when/if she flies up 2 get more of her [censored] from the house, then be away when she comes by and only come home after you know she's back with her OM (he's NOT a "boyfriend"! STOP calling him that! He's a co-conspirator in the destruction of your marriage!). If you can't trust her, then have one of your kids or a third party you CAN trust be there when she's around.

Whatever you do, do NOT engage her in these fruitless blame-shifting vents of hers. Let her face the consequences of her selfish choices ALONE.

-ol' 2long

BB,

Just read your thread. I'm sorry you find yourself needing advice on this forum, but welcome.

You know she is not trustworthy at this point. Why is her reason for return or "business" unknown to you?

Is it possible her visit is to clean out additional assets? That being said... If you have not already done so, change the locks, and protect any/all of your joint assets.

It was her decision to move away. Would you be "welcome" to walk into the home in Mexico? Why should she have that luxury toward the home she abandoned?

Don't wait for the next bomb to drop before building a shelter. Protect yourself, and stay strong for your family!

-JKT

Thanks for the responses. Been sole searching.
I decided to go to plan B. wrote a letter to my EX and told her under what terms we could discuss Reconciliation and not to contact me till she was ready to do so. The Truth was that the daily IM Chats were killing me emotionally. She sent me an email being very considerate of my feelings and promising to not bother me unless it was important or about the Kids. The ball is her court. I will protect my Kids and my Emotions in the mean time.
Still Love her and want her back.
If she comes back we can talk. Until then I have setup an appointment this week to get counselling. Hopefully this will help?
My best Friend is flying in a couple weeks to help. He is worried about the situation. My Family lives 3000 miles form here and my best friend moved away 8 years ago. I do have some close friends here too but it’s not the same. I really need the support. Counselling and friends should help.
bb

BB,

Hang in there. Plan B will at first be hard, but it is better than being hit over the head with constant remote contact with her. It will take awhile for you to go through withdrawal from her, so expect to be strongly affected by this plan B for a bit.

Talk to the kids and explain what you have done and why. Also be aware that she may try to contact you under rather flimsy excuses just to get her fix and make sure her safety net is still there.

I suspect you have done the right thing, but do it well. You won't regret it and it will make your decisions easier than you can see and tell right now.

Must go, take care, keep in close contact with the kids, and hang in there. You will have choices to make in the future and some of them may well be pleasant, if a bit surprising.

God Bless,

JL

Hi JL
You have been a huge help. This was an especially tough week.
Counselling starts tomorrow for me and later for my daughter. You know I would have never guessed it would be so positive for my kids and my relationship. It has been the worst time in my life and probably the best time in my life bonding with the kids. Almost want to thank my EX…………Lets not go that far however
BB

BB,

Actually, BB let's go that far. I am serious. You are thankful for the increased contact with the kids, tell them you are, and tell your ex or soon to be ex the same thing.

Acknowledge what you have learned, how you have grown and the opportunities that have come your way via this very difficult time. And your ex isn't an ex just yet. Although you have gone to plan B, one never knows the future. You may come to realize you really want out, or you may get a chance to rebuild the marriage. I know the latter doesn't seem likely but don't rule it out yet.

Focus on you, learning, being with the kids, and your work.

Hope counseling went alright, I am sure it is painful right now. I suspect it will help your daughter to have someone to talk to besides you and her mother. She really doesn't want to hurt anyone.

God Bless,

JL

Be sure 2 write a good plan B letter.

My two cents...if it were me I would get the kids on board and then state in one last communication to the wife that no more emails, texts, or phone calls to any of you. If she wants to talk with you or her kids she needs to get her butt back in the states and do it in person!! But that is just me.

Hi, bb, your wife is p'o'd that you talked about her actions and your reactions because she prefers to be in secret. You did partial exposure; a tool used to destroy affairs. To quote from somebody (I don't remember who) on the boards: [in response to your wife's anger at your talking about what she is doing]

If the OM is so wonderful, and if you are proud of what you are doing, why haven't you told everybody your own self?

Well………wrote the letter last week said don’t call or chat room. She did every day. I can’t resist. Like a kid in a candy store. I have to answer. I can’t stop. I live for the contact? My councillor says, if you can’t stop, don’t. Just know were she is at and the ball is her court. I can do nothing about her decisions.
We are having very civil conversations and dealing with our past failures calmly and rationally. I just can’t stop. Everything is saying forget about the adulteress…I cannot.
Time? Probably will make me sensible? So conflicted right now….Changes by the hour most days.
Thanks for the support everyone
BB

JL
bye the way.I did tell her thanks for leaving it helped my relationship with the kids. she thought that was good news.
BB

BB,

Well I just have to say this. You now know how hard it will be for your WW to leave the OM. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> She is addicted to him as you are to her. She has withdrawn from you, and frankly you are simply her safety net right now. If things go well for her and OM, she will be done and you will hurt.

What you experience when you don't hear from her is called
"withdrawal" pains, and it is termed that because just as a drug addict cannot just quit, you cannot either. It is brain chemistry. However, the ONLY way you can get through withdrawal is to go through it, which means for about 3-4 weeks of no contact you will WANT/NEED to speak to her and think about it hourly.

The point is, that you cannot make a rational decision until you go through withdrawal, and you may not get the choice. She may force it by sticking with OM. She has already left you.

My point... you NEED to go to plan B and go through withdrawal OR you will actually lose your love for her faster and be in greater pain in the process. But, make no mistake about it, you are not unique in feeling you cannot go to plan B because you miss her so. It is a given that if you love her you will miss her. Your problem is that you are prolonging the agony right now.

So if you really need plan B, be prepared to go through withdrawal. Read about it in Harley's articles.

God Bless,

JL

Thanks JL
It is like a drug. I cannot stop. Still talking daily even though she is withy the OM? What is wrong with me.
Actually I did go through withdrawal for a month when we had no contact. Once she got lonely and started contact again, I was hooked again. I just can’t bring myself to do plan B yet. I tried and failed.
My Councillor said it is pretty common and actually expected for the other spouse to want to reconsider their decision. We talked about the fact that I cannot stop contact with her and she said that it is not the end of the world just know your limits. Just accept that it is her decision and that I have no control of the situation.

Today’s chat was interesting to say the least?
She tells me today that she is planning on retiring there permanently. She is 7 years from her first eligible pension check form her work. Having said that she was still ambiguous about her future plans in later comments (strange). BTW The OM is retired in Mexico now.

THIS WILL GENERATE COMMENTS?
For weeks we have talked abut getting together to talk and sort out our issues. Several plans have been discussed in many varied forms. We decided today on what to do.
She is catching a ride this week with a friend that must drive to Seattle (not the OM)
I will be driving to Seattle (about 600 miles) to meet her. We will drive to Vancouver were our son is in college; visit there than travel the rest of the way home together. She will stay in our home town for 2 weeks to complete her business than fly back to México and the OM. I can’t resist the opportunity to talk? Sorry but I can’t do say no.
BTW this was my idea to meet part way

I will leave in a little over a week.

Let the comments begin>>>>>>.
BB

Cripes, bb:

Fire your counselor.

Call either Steve Harley or Jennifer H Chalmers right away and get a plan 2gether.

What you are doing is not a plan, it's a fix. Just like JL is saying.

Look, I ac2ally believe that this could 2rn around and your M could recover. But not with both you and your WW getting your fixes and going your own ways anyway afterward.

You need 2 change the dynamics of this whole thing. You need 2 get yourself in2 and through withdrawal from your emotionally-unhealthy attachment 2 your W. You need 2 value yourself as an individual that can someday be of real help 2 people like your kids and even your W, and not some pathetic incomplete half of a broken marriage who 2rns 2 an amorphous mass of jelly whenever your W calls you because she needs just a little bit more than her lying, cheating, theif of an OM can give her in the moment.

But you can't do that while you're doing what you are doing.

-ol' 2long

2long
I know you are right. However I am having a difficult time refusing to try 1 more serious effort to get through to her.
I believe it is probably futile but I must try. We are a critical point in my mind. She is beginning to formulate a long term plan in Mexico but I can tell she is uncertain. Now is the only opportunity to persuade her to return while she is vulnerable and uncertain.
Until she leaves the Om there is no hope but I think is my only chance. If the upcoming trip doesn’t work I am certain it is over forever?
BB

bb:

That WON'T WORK!

Please at least read all the infidelity articles on the home page. You will see what I mean.

The Harleys have 35 years experience saving thousands of marriages in trouble just like yours. They know how 2 do it!

You might also post on General Questions II. There's a lot more traffic there.

-ol' 2long

One more serious effort to get through to her? You mean there is a small chance that she is not totally and completely convinced that she has got you right by the cajones and waiting by the phone night and day for her?

Have you ever read the book, "Love Must Be Tough" by Dobson? I'd get a copy real quick and read this weekend if I were you, and wouldn't take anymore calls or IM until I was done with it.



Well go ahead a meet up with her, make sure she becomes absolutely without a doubt certain that you will be her safety net if she decides she doesn't like Mexico. Of course a man so smitten by a woman who is walking all over him is such an unattractive choice that even if OM does grow tired of her, she'll not want to come home to you either.

You are too needy and addicted to her to make good choices right now. I'm not trying to beat you up, anyone blind sided by acts similar to what your WW is doing would be the same. This type of behavior only fuels the waywards entitlement, however. Appeasement does not work with wayward women. You have shown her that you are willing and able to make changes where you may have failed in the past, now it is time to show her some boundaries.

Women are normally unable to divide their loyalties for very long, so that has me a little puzzled. Perhaps the OM is not meeting her needs very well. It might be a good idea to cut off contact with her altogether so that she is forced to have all her needs met by OM. It may break up the affair faster than with her having you to help OM.

If I were you, I would force myself to become unaddicted to her by refusing any contact until I was sure I was no longer in a place of addiction or attachment.

You are in a very painful emotional place, I know, I have been there and the next logical step if it continues too long is deep depression. You don't want to go there, it hurts even worse than where you are right now.

You have at your finger tips some of the brightest minds around, and many more to come help you, so keep talking and reaching out here.

BB,

One more thing that is part of exposure, and what I would do right before I cut off contact with your WW is to send the man a registered letter (to make sure he gets it) stating that your WW is a married woman and he is helping to destroy your family and hurt your children. Let him know how this has harmed your daughter and that her son has disowned her. I wouldn't threaten him but I would appeal to whatever human decency he has in this manner. Several of the recovered marriages on here had BS's who did send the OM a letter, or email.

Very important step, in my opinion.

weaver makes an excellent point. Though at the time, I didn't think it did any good 2 send RM an email just before my W 2k our son 2 his workplace in NM, in retrospect I think it was a very effective move on my part.

I pi$$ed in their cheerios!

I got all kinds of angry reaction from my W about that, like "I told you before that if you contacted RM, that it would be over". Little did SHE realize, that what was "over" was the affair, not our marriage, because the dose of reality doomed the fantasy. She's still here, and we're still recovering, but I don't think we'd even be this far along if I hadn't done that.

Exposure of any kind throws a bucket of cold water on the excitement of the affair.

-ol' 2long

Thanks for the replies
On some of the comments
“Exposure”.
Exposure has recently came out. Previous advice here was to do it and I did. I really had nothing to lose. All this did was made her appear to be comfortable with the new relationship to her friends. Little can be gained by further work in this area I believe?”

“Contact the OM”
There are wildly varied few on this site about that issue. I see little to gain on that front. The OM is isolated from his family by 3000 miles and single. I do have all his contact info. I did a lot of research on this guy. Personally think he is a con artist and so does some of the WW’s family too. I don’t see the upside to this strategy?

I have read over the forum and Harleys articles many times. Tried to initiate a plan B and failed miserably. Not that I don’t see the pitfalls with failure, I do.
My plan is trying to keep up plan A (my original strategy) until after this trip on Sept 25th
I will keep rereading all your thoughts and keep this in mind…..Thank you.
HOWEVER I WILL MAKE THIS TRIP WITH MY WW. I have made up my mind.
Is it a good decision? Likely not, I know that. I need this resolution or closure. It will be one or the other. Closure being plan B for real this time.
Will it be hard, undoubtedly. Can’t see it being worse. I have been through ****** in the last few months and am more certain of my goals with her and my life. It is coming up on do or die situation, figuratively that is.
Advice about how to handle this likely 3 days together (1 driving, 2 with our son at college) would be nice to hear.
Advice to cancel the trip is out of the question.
Thanks BB

I see that this post has more views than any other post in this section this year?
Either everyone is amazed at how ****** up I am or it is a interesting situation?
HMMMM
BB

bb:

Well, you do what you feel you need 2 do. I think most would agree with me that going on this trip with her will only drive you down deeper in2 depression, and help her 2 feel justified that what she's doing is "right", or at least that you are okay with it.

Don't you think that canceling on her and simply dealing with your pain - perhaps spending the time with your kids instead - might be less painful? Not only in the short term, but in the long term?

This thread has gotten as much attention as it has because I posted a thread on GQII, asking others there 2 come here and offer their support. Perhaps you missed that.

bb, I was pretty pig-headed and screwed up myself when I tried 2 implement plan B 5 years ago. I wasn't ready for it then. But my W never left 2 go live with RM. And her PA was over before I discovered the A. In retrospect, I can say with some certainty, that if my W were living with RM when I tried plan B 7 months after d-day, I would most definitely have made it a good one. Living with her insisting that she could be friends with RM and still be a wife and mother was bad enough. Living with the knowledge that she was boinking RM 2 states away, and that I was enabling it by "supporting" her, would have been crazy.

I don't believe I can help you at this time.

best of luck,
-ol' 2long

Sorry you are giving up on me 2long...No i don't want to cancel the trip.
Just want advice on how to best deal with this situation?
Thanks BB

Well, I wouldn't call it giving up, not quite. I just don't have any more advice 2 offer, when I know it won't be considered.

I have invested more time than I really have, on giving you some of my experience-based advice in light of the si2ation you're in.

Also, you're on MarriageBuilders. And this is the way they do things.

In the end, there aren't really any "wrong" ways 2 do this, though there may be more expedient methods than your modifications of the MB methods.

Each of us has 2 find these things out for ourselves. That's what life is about.

I've got 2 go work on our apartment.

-ol' 2long

BB,

I don't like your plan much. I agree with others that you are telling her to keep kicking you in the groin and you will take it. However, IF you are really going to do it, do it with dignity and keep your eyes open. You may learn something useful.

God Bless,

JL

Most people don't think its good either.1 close friend that has been through this almost identical situation 10 years ago thinks it’s Ok. They separated then eventually got back 10 years ago. It was nasty, worse than my situation actually. They are happier than ever now. This was his second marriage. He told me, do it know while you agree to talk and are civil...don’t be use the Lb as mentioned here. But don't hold you thoughts and goals back either. Air you positions and opinions without anger or belittlement, and then see what happens. I have little to lose.
If it doesn’t work so be it? life goes on
Thanks for your more positive outlook JL
BB
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

[censored], bb...

Why are you even here?

You don't use MB methods.

You ask for "advice" and then do something opposite.


I suppose.

Bye.

-ol' 2long

2long,

I've only been lurking on this thread, because quite honestly, you (and others) were giving bb sound advice that he was just ignoring over and over.

I'm only 60 days out from D-Day and dealing with my own issues, but in hindsight, the ONLY actions that I regret, were the ones I DIDN'T do. I was very proactive to get to as good of a place as we find ourselves in now, but the things that continue to bother me are opportunities that I MISSED for whatever reason, and I'm afraid that is where bb is going to find himself in the near future ... lamenting his INACTIONS.

Thanks for the advice MyRevelation. There are other view points out there even if others cannot see them.

My life like yours, I only regret inaction in retrospect.

2long…..Sorry but I would prefer if you don’t post here any longer. Frankly I don’t care for your style. Content is good but not your attitude


BB

bb, you've got a deal!

BB,

What is up? what have you decided?

JL

Hi JL
Was out of town for the better part of the week picking up the EX and visiting our Son. Plus I am still not sure were everything stands. Was a difficult week.
Let’s start
I went to Seattle to meet her for the secret rendezvous. It went well and we were glad to see each other and talk. And talk we did. Countless hours over the next 5 days on the road and in Vancouver. She was brutally honest about what happened over the last months. More than I really wanted to hear but I could help but listen and ask questions. It was very tough but once I got home I felt better about our future friendship. Possibility of reconciliation is there but it is somewhat remote.

Here is the kicker she is in a serious relationship with the OM, no doubt now. She tells me she has thought of leaving him a few times but has not.
The night of meeting her in Seattle without this very controlling Om knowing, we had Sex in the Hotel room. See has been in my home town for a week now and since that night in Seattle we have had sex almost every day for the last 2 weeks. The OM insists she calls him every day and she does. However she wants me too and is with me every day. Is she close emotionally? No, not always. Changes from to moment.. It is confusing but call me a pig but I can’t help but ****** her every chance we get.

I believe that she is very confused and so do our friends. Plan B will be the action of my choice in last few days she is here. Call it selfish but the sex is great and I won’t stop that.

Strange twist came in my life this week that I didn’t ses coming. A wonderful promotion was offered to me in another town that is very attractive to me. I have wanted to move there for a long time. I have decided this weekend to take it. I will have to Nov to move.

I plan to use plan B with the prevision that she leaves the control freak OM and follow me in this other town when my daughter and I move. If not I move on. I am happy with this decision on the EX and will follow the consequences that follow good or bad.

I wish to be friendly with the EX for the kids sake and am confident that we can be friendly in the future.

BB

bb,

Congratulations on your promotion and planned move. It might help you and daughter get a new start on things. If I were a betting man, she will return to OM and live to regret it. We'll see.

Did your W see and talk with your daughter? How did the daughter handle seeing and talking to your W after all of this?

I do wish you would do the reading here and develop the tool set necessary for a good relationship and to help deal with the situation as it stands. You will need this information if/when your W returns to OM.

The problem you have now is that your W is confusing "control" for "love". She does not know the difference which is probably part of the problem in your marriage and clearly will be a big problem in her relationship with OM. As for her coming back, consider this.

If she gets disillusioned with OM, and comes back would you take her back???

I would say to you that you are a fool if you did take her back. Why would I say that. If she has not learned anything about marriages and relationships then the situation still exists that she will try to find someone better later. She will and should obtain counseling before she returns to you IF that actually happens.

As long as she is around plan A her, and when she leaves go to plan B and that coupled with your move to a new town should give a few things to think about as well as remove you from the drama of all of this.

Hang in there.

God Bless,

JL

PS: you may not that I am not very optimistic about this and I am usually an optimistic guy. The reason is your daughter. When a woman leaves her child to go with OM, the chances of recovery...full recovery are not good. There are some very deep emotional issues at play in this case. Hence the recommendation for counseling before you take her back.

bb,

To add to JL's post, if I were you I might pick up a scrip of anti-d's. After spending all that time with WW, and having so much SF with her, I think you are going to experience a terrible low/emotional crash, after she leaves again.

What you are going through is very traumatic, couple that with a move, job change and the worry over your DD...it may end up to be more than you can handle without some temp help to keep you a bit steady, sleeping and eating, and all that.

Thanks JL and Weaver

Weaver I started on an anti depressant 3 weeks ago. I too am worried about the crash after she goes back to Mexico. It will be inevitable. Hopefully the drugs and the activity for the new job will keep me focused.

JL
I like you believe she will go back to the OM and live to regret it. The odds are slim here and i have little faith that she is ready to seriously try again. My best friend that no longer lives in my town was here for the weekend. He knew my wife very well. He even introduced us to each other. He said she was very confused and to give her the boot. Not as simple for me but i know he is right.

My Daughter, Yes they talked and did some shopping. It has been slightly tense but my daughter is glad to see here. she did tell my wife to leave me alone and stop torturing me among other things. My wife has been troubled by this herself. At least my daughter is supportive of me, it is very pleasing to me.

Would I take her back JL? I am less certain of that now. She needs a lot of work and i am not sure she is ready for that. I do feel better this week about probable outcomes. Her decision is hers and my life will go on regardless. My Kids love me and i am not a bad person. I have a good career, good friends; I don't drink or do drugs and am not violent nor run around. There must be women out there that would want me?

Another new twist came up with the OM. This guy is obviously a control freak from everything my wife said. Surprising since I was never remotely like that and she was always a very independent and responsible ER Nurse that took charge herself?
Turns out I find out that the OM has been hiding in Mexico for the last 5 years because of outstanding charges against him in the US. His EX wife had charged him with stalking her during their divorce and he was obviously avoiding the court. My wife said" He was getting arrested every time he flew somewhere so he decided to move to Mexico"? His EX doesn’t even know were he is today. The only reason he was able to return to the US and hook up with my wife is that the charges were dropped. His Daughter in law told his EX that if she didn't drop the charges she couldn't see her grandkids. This allowed him to travel again.

My concern is with my Wife's well being. If this guy was hiding in Mexico for so many years he must be guilty of something? He told my wife it is all a fabrication. I find that impossible to believe since his EX would not have been so persistent over that many years unless there was truth there? His EX also just remarried this year I heard. I found out a little info on her and plan on trying to contact her? I really feel I must find out if my EX is safe or not. I would hate to see anything bad happen to her regardless of what happened between us. The kids need her in their life’s forever. I am really worried!

Thanks again for all the comments, keep them coming. I know i am confused and doing irrational things but the advice is helpful, even if it has to be repeated over and over again?
BB

bb:

You don't have 2 read my posts if you don't want 2 (in fact, if you click on my username and select "ignore this user", you won't even have 2 see them).

But this sitch screams out for some "obvious" MB responses:


Don't forget that he's no expert on recovering marriages after infidelity, and so his advice may not necessarily be "right" for you. In the end, you need 2 make your own choices, but if you're going 2 consider advice from others, why not consult a professional? That way, whatever happens, you'll have no regrets long term, because you will know you did all you could.


It is good that your daughter is supportive, but be careful of putting her in an uncomfortable position as a go-between you and your W. It is good that she's supportive of you, but it would be better if she's supportive of the marriage, first. Also, she's not an expert either, so be careful.

As for the devlopments about the OM. Here's what most MBers would advise you do:

*Let the OM find out about your time spent with your W. Nothing blows a fantasy apart like removing the secrecy - in this case you're telling her affair partner that his partner is still behaving like a wife around her husband behind his back.

*Find out what the charges against the OM are here in the US, find out whether they have really been dropped, and regardless of the answers 2 those questions, inform the authorities of his whereabouts. Don't threaten 2 do this, just do it. Telling the truth is never wrong.

*Tell his EX where he is, if you know.

*
*Obviously, the XW needs 2 know that's what you believe he did. Maybe she'll press charges again. In any case, all parties involved need 2 know the truth of what he's been doing. You need this 2 deflate your W's fantasy.

Are you really divorced? You've been calling your W "my EX." If you're just separated, you're still married. And you're still married until the ink is dry on the divorce decree. Make that stand.

-ol' 2long

Hey, 2long! Long time, etc.

bb1961, reconsider and re-read 2long's posts. He is 100% on this. Especially, the exposure.

There aren't family members on your w's side who could help leverage her out of the affair, but GUESS WHAT!

If you get the OM on the phone or on IM or email or snailmail, and tell him how cozy you and your wife have been, THAT counts as exposure. It will blot out the affair and blow away the fog.

Normally it isn't worthwhile for the betrayed spouse to contact the OP. Here, if you want your M, I really think it would help.

My 2 cents.

Oh, were you using protection during sex? STD's you know.

Hi bb,

just wanted to add a few things.

Why do you think OM is a control freak? does W say that?, kind of like the W that dosen't want to say her feelings so she tells them through someone else, like the W that says to the sales man, I will have to ask my H if I can buy that.

I may be ignorant to this, but I thought when you went through Mexico if you had outstanding warrants in US they wouldn't let you through.

Why would you allow yourself to be the OM now?

Why would you tell someone on this site that you don't want them posting here anymore?

2long, I am impressed with your determination AND i have to say I too feel your frustration when your good advice is given, only to be ignored...

Kinda like the guy in the lighthouse watching in horror as the drunk ships captain slowly keeps heading for the rocks of the shore.

I know this doesn't help but i had to agree with 2long on this one, dead on 2long, dead on.

Good luck with the faux-MB plan, but you can't beat the real thing.

bb, I have read through this HORROR story and all i can say is
1 you "wife" is unable to have a healthy realtionship for what ever reason
2. she is insane
3. you are addicted to her and also insane
4. neither one of you have any business around a 17 year old child

you.. get into drug addiction counseling
expend all your energy getting free of this addiction and careing for your daughter
protect your finances
get a DIVORCE
jerseyboy

jb:

I see you're new here.

Care 2 post your story, so we know where you're coming from?

-ol' 2long

2long
fair enough
i'll do it here since the bio section doesnt seem large enoguh
me. catholic 35 mba her anglican 34...good company, good sex similare families ect. I was moving toward marriage but.. something was bothering me.. and I guess I moved to slow she met a guy at work.. she teased he called her on it.. she started sleeping with him.. she liked it..during this we had stopped having sex`because she feared cancer due to birth control pills..
she stopped taking them for ME..but continued taking them for HIM. I discovered the pills.. was hurt ( CRUSHED) and wanted to end it.. she said "no, dont give up.". "i want you to compete for me". ( She wasnt sure of him yet) I did.. 2 weeks later she said "you are losing" 2 weeks after that she dropped me .. One month after that HE left HER.. I tried a reconcilation.. she said she would try IF i agree to no sex`for me but let her have sex with HIM.. THAT fried it for me.. when she said that .. i lost ALL love for her
prior to this we had been in couples counseling.for many months.. therpiat later told me ""i'm glad "you " broke it off..she has real deep problems.. probably incest""
(( he didnt know SHE had blown me off)) you cant make this stuff up
jb

sorry to jump in here.
JB, you sound like you have it together, how are you? are you getting better from being crushed?
Have you spoke to her?
I feel bad for her if there has been some incest.
I feel bad that you had to go through that also, its hard on us isn't it?

doing
i lost contact with her when i left the area
she wanted nothing to do with me anyway
I am in deep therapy ( with 3 therapists).. I cant seem to maintain a relationship and keep picking "bad" women.
I'm sorry to say..but therapist thinks its a "mom" problem for me

2 long..i've read Michelle langleys 2 books on women's infidelity and have been posting on her womeninfidelity website
I sure aint NO EXPERT... but i think BB needs to get some calmness and clarity in his life, by distancing himself from his wife
its a tough call because his wife may feel "lost" and abandoned if he does cut and run.. but dealing with her is clearly destructive to him and not working on getting her back. all the pros say the worst thing a man can do is be "needy" needy men freighten women Plan "a" is a loving man..Plan B is an independant man..NEITHER is NEEDY
BB surely needs some professional help, and MB can surely provide it.. but he has to implement it.

and we all need to remember that we cant " save" anyone
we cant save BB
and BB cant save his wife
JB

J, this is how I explain it:

When the swedish people left sweden, they left a cold dark snowy place, where did they go? to Minnesota, another cold dark snowy place, you know why? its all they knew, they couldn't go to Florida, the land is sand, the sun shines, it gets hot, its real humid, the air is salty. Minnesota is what they know, they knew how to live there, work the land, grow the food in that cold dark snowy place. We are swuedes (sp?) we go where we know. I married a guy that did things like the men I knew, its what I knew, its what you know, We have to learn to go to Florida and that is what I am working on.

BB,

What's up?

JL

JL:

I'm not sure we'll hear from BB again. Something he said about his visit with his WW bothers me, though, and I just have 2 say this. Maybe it'll be of some use 2 others in a similar si2ation, if not BB:


Thankfully, I don't need 2 call this behavior "piggish" because BB already did that (and so he recognizes it for what it is).

This behavior was not in BB's best interest for at least 3 "obvious" reasons (and these can serve as an example for others in this si2ation, and BB, if you read around on this or any other infidelity forum, you'll realize this si2ation is rather common):

1. Mrs BB may have brought home an STD. BB 2k a risk 2 his own health by having SF with her.

2. Why keep this visit and the activities secret from the OM? You want 2 END the affair, not prolong it by supporting secrecy.

3. Your W will go back "home" 2 the OM confused, alright. You have confirmed her revisionist suspicion (assuming it isn't really true), that you only want her for sex, you don't want her for who she is. Heck, I got accused of the same thing, and I NEVER treated my W in that manner.



Again, I didn't need 2 call it selfish, because it is obvious that you recognize it for what it is.

I wish I could remember who said "the best way 2 a woman's heart is through her ears". Not sex.

Even WSs need 2 be shown some level of respect, otherwise where's the draw for them 2 end their A and come home? I don't mean honor their behavior. I mean remind them of the good qualities that they have that made you fall in love with them in the first place.

That's good plan A (and plan B) behavior. Boning a confused infidel every chance you get, because it feels good, is not.

-ol' 2long

2 long
1. i think bb and his wife deserve each other
2. I feel for the kids
3. I also love DUNE.. early novels at least
jerseyboy
"usele has attracked a big one"

Hello Everyone.
Sorry I haven’t had time to join in. Been living out of a suitcase for the last 6 weeks.
A lot has happened since I posted last.
I was offered a promotion to bigger facility in the company I work for. More responsibility but also more money too. Happened the week after I got back from picking up my Ex in Seattle. Wanted this job for about 3 years and the opportunity came up. Both my kids are very pleased since they both like this city. We visited there often all their lives. It is a good move.
The moving truck arrives in 2 days.

The big news. My EX broke up with here boyfriend and has agreed to try and reconcile. She will move to the new town in 3 weeks and try again. I am pleased but also very nervous. Most of the issues are still there. We have talked at length about these issues but have a lot to do. The kids are pleased.
In case anyone was really paying attention to details? My Ex met me in Seattle and I brought here back to my home town. We got along well. She intended to stay for 2 weeks and return to Mexico. She stayed for 6 weeks.
It was a roller coaster but when I took her to the airport, we were very close to reconciling.
She broke up with her boyfriend when she got there and moved out and got an apartment near some friends of hers. They have been keeping a close eye on her and now even call me to update me. My Ex and I talk regularly.
My first thought was to get her home immediately. It was hers too. However with the move and reconciliation things were getting too tense. We came close to calling it off. Too much pressure.
We agreed that she would stay a little longer and get her head on straight before returning. She feels awful for what she has done to everyone but is still confused and worried about the reconciliation. So am I for that matter.
My thoughts are now that if she comes back OK. We have a plan to handle that. If she or I get cold feet then so be it.
We are going to give it a shot. We will see how it works out.
BB

bb:

That's great news!

Now, this time is going 2 be delicate. Why not get with a good marriage counselor or coach 2 help you put a good recovery plan 2gether?

As always, I highly recommend calling the Harleys.

-ol' 2long

Update
Reconciliation is going well. We are still sometimes at odds. But rarely. We have yet to start counselling together. I have been going for months. She is planning on going this week herself. She wants to sort out her issues before we start on duel counselling.
She calls it her mid life crisis. She seems genuinely happy now?
We appear to be on the road to recovery
BB

Wow BB. I am so surprised. I seriously didn't think you had a snowballs chance in...

How great for both of you. I hope you are both practicing the MB concepts.

Radical Honesty, The Policy of Joint Agreement, No LB's/DJ's.

Learning how to communicate was and is a big one for me in my marriage. At least how to communicate effectively, before I get upset, and without getting rattled. It's difficult.

Have you both read His Needs/Her Needs?