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Originally Posted By: Enlightened_Ex

BS, you see women running to help out an "attractive man" all the time. How many nurses fall for patients, regardless of their marital status. Or staff who jockey for position to help the boss who is attractive with either power, good looks or maybe both.

How many rush after rock stars. After all, the groupies are not typically men.

So to argue this is a gender based phenomenon is folly. Bad character is a character trait, not a gender trait.


Actually i agree with Pep, it is more "power" or "fame" or "money" (if it is the right person i suppose it could be all three) that women go for than attractiveness. However like i said you do not see them on a daily basis running to help some man pick up something he dropped or run over to help him open a door because his hands are full.

They do these things on the sly.....

Like Scotty said i have seen men leave their wives holding 25 things in their hands to run over and open the door for a "pretty woman". I DO NOT see men leaving their wives holding 25 things to run over and open the door for a little old lady.

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I don't think this is a character thing or a gender thing. It's basically that people are self-interested.

They run over to help because they think they might get something out of it.

People are self-interested, people assume reciprocity, people speculate, people try to get bargains, and people are illogical about their personal situations.

Meaning, the person helps the DiD thinking they will get something they want out of it, think it's a bargain (in terms of the how much they value what they get or how little they think they are paying for it), and are bad at recognizing the reality that it is not a bargain.

BTW, the smart people are sometimes more likely to fall into this because they are unaccustomed to being wrong.


Me 43 BH
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Originally Posted By: rprynne


BTW, the smart people are sometimes more likely to fall into this because they are unaccustomed to being wrong.

think

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Originally Posted By: Pepperband
Originally Posted By: rprynne


BTW, the smart people are sometimes more likely to fall into this because they are unaccustomed to being wrong.

think


They think they know better and are impervios to flatter. They think they have control? I think thats it.



On the other scale, I think women are also attracted to confidance, per-say cockiness and a take control attitude.

Then they spin a tale and mix it with concern and look like the knight in shining armour. Especially if they have power , money and influence.

Funny thing is , some men buy the Bullchit of the DiD and think thay ARE a knight in shining armor.

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This is exactly how my DH's affair started. His friend was dying and his bitchwife needed support. In reality, she needed the paychecks he would get when he finished college. He finally got a sense of disgust when she called him before she called the ambulance when he died.


6 grands
DDay August 15,1998
Reconcilled Mid-Sept.1998
Husband40 FWS, Me 47 BW
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Originally Posted By: cherise
This is exactly how my DH's affair started. His friend was dying and his bitchwife needed support. In reality, she needed the paychecks he would get when he finished college. He finally got a sense of disgust when she called him before she called the ambulance when he died.
Glad he was aware of her motives. Did he try to keep her stable for his freinds peace of mind when He was really sick, and give up in disgust at the end?

I imagine he was disgusted with himself also, I assune he came clean and you are recovered. Grats if thats the case.

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This thread reminded me of a poem that I have taught in years past to my AP students. It seems to fit the Did and the final outcome of her "rescuer".

Siren Song

This is the one song everyone
would like to learn: the song
that is irresistible:

the song that forces men
to leap overboard in squadrons
even though they see beached skulls

the song nobody knows
because anyone who had heard it
is dead, and the others cant remember.
Shall I tell you the secret
and if I do, will you get me
out of this bird suit?
I dont enjoy it here
squatting on this island
looking picturesque and mythical
with these two feathery maniacs,
I dont enjoy singing
this trio, fatal and valuable.

I will tell the secret to you,
to you, only to you.
Come closer. This song

is a cry for help: Help me!
Only you, only you can,
you are unique

at last. Alas
it is a boring song
but it works every time.

Margaret Atwood


johnstwin-

"I may not know what the future holds, but I know who holds my future." -Martin Luther

Remarried my FXH 25 years to the day of our first M. God is so good-and sometimes so unexpected!

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Awesome JT, how true it is, if you fall for it.

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Originally Posted By: rprynne
I don't think this is a character thing or a gender thing. It's basically that people are self-interested.

They run over to help because they think they might get something out of it.

People are self-interested, people assume reciprocity, people speculate, people try to get bargains, and people are illogical about their personal situations.

Meaning, the person helps the DiD thinking they will get something they want out of it, think it's a bargain (in terms of the how much they value what they get or how little they think they are paying for it), and are bad at recognizing the reality that it is not a bargain.

BTW, the smart people are sometimes more likely to fall into this because they are unaccustomed to being wrong.


Unfortunately you are correct in that most people are self interested and will think "what will i get out of it".

However for this particular situation i personally disagree. Mainly because it happens all the time, IMHO probably about 90% of men will help out an attractive women every single time they see one. They will go out of their way to open a door or help her with a cart, etc.

Heck look how much they use attractive women and sex for advertising, you can pretty much sell anything if a women in a bikini is the one selling it.

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I do like these threads - the inside the mind of the wayward.

Looking back you would certatinly all see me as a DiD. I wanted to improve my trumpet playing and OM was just the man - he had the confidence and the pluck (with a trumpet, not in life).

It is so easy looking back to see the dynamics - but so blind at the time.

Purely selfishly driven to improve my playing and why on earth did those alarm bells not go off when he got out a separate phone to put my number in and why on earth did I not back wayyyy off when he said he wouldn't let his wife know about our lesson.

I just shake my head in disbelief at how blatantly obvious it was... how stupid...how blind...how selfish

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Originally Posted By: staytogether
..I just shake my head in disbelief at how blatantly obvious it was... how stupid...how blind...how selfish


Nature of the beast.. hindsight is 20/20

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Originally Posted By: johnstwin
This thread reminded me of a poem that I have taught in years past to my AP students. It seems to fit the Did and the final outcome of her "rescuer".

Siren Song

This is the one song everyone
would like to learn: the song
that is irresistible:

the song that forces men
to leap overboard in squadrons
even though they see beached skulls

the song nobody knows
because anyone who had heard it
is dead, and the others cant remember.
Shall I tell you the secret
and if I do, will you get me
out of this bird suit?
I dont enjoy it here
squatting on this island
looking picturesque and mythical
with these two feathery maniacs,
I dont enjoy singing
this trio, fatal and valuable.

I will tell the secret to you,
to you, only to you.
Come closer. This song

is a cry for help: Help me!
Only you, only you can,
you are unique

at last. Alas
it is a boring song
but it works every time.

Margaret Atwood


Margaret Atwood. I do love to read some of Margaret Atwood. I did not know this one. Thanks it is a good one.


BW-me-56
FWH-GreenMile-62
Married 1982
2 wonderful grown sons

D Day #1 4/1985
D Day #2 10/03/08
D Days continued for a while.

Started real recovery 07/15/10
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Originally Posted By: DancesWithGoats
Originally Posted By: johnstwin
This thread reminded me of a poem that I have taught in years past to my AP students. It seems to fit the Did and the final outcome of her "rescuer".

Siren Song

This is the one song everyone
would like to learn: the song
that is irresistible:

the song that forces men
to leap overboard in squadrons
even though they see beached skulls

the song nobody knows
because anyone who had heard it
is dead, and the others cant remember.
Shall I tell you the secret
and if I do, will you get me
out of this bird suit?
I dont enjoy it here
squatting on this island
looking picturesque and mythical
with these two feathery maniacs,
I dont enjoy singing
this trio, fatal and valuable.

I will tell the secret to you,
to you, only to you.
Come closer. This song

is a cry for help: Help me!
Only you, only you can,
you are unique

at last. Alas
it is a boring song
but it works every time.

Margaret Atwood


Margaret Atwood. I do love to read some of Margaret Atwood. I did not know this one. Thanks it is a good one.


I wished PP used the Siren Song if she was in the water drowning.
XWH would come to her rescue jump in and sink to the bottom.
He can't swim... dance2


Me 55, XWH 53, M 22 years
D17, D30
alien replaces my husband "I'm not happy" -7/08
Discover OW-8/08 (his direct report and I work there also)
H moves out 10/1/08, confront Ow 10/28/08
Plan B 1/09
D final 12/09

Quote: "First thing you do is pray; when there is nothing else to do, continue to pray."
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I would also point out that if anyone wants an example of gaslighting, this is a perfect one.

"Wha - ? No, no, honey, there's nothing going on here! Huh? No, I didn't notice anything! She wasn't flirting with me! She's a co-worker. She would NEVER do that!

"YOU are just imagining things. This is all in YOUR head. Now, YOU need to stop making things up and just pay no attention. There's nothing going on here except in YOUR imagination."

Next thing, he'll be saying he doesn't know what sex is and never heard of such a thing - and you'll be halfway to believing him.


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Originally Posted By: ConstantProcess
They think they know better and are impervios to flatter. They think they have control? I think thats it.


I think that's part of it. I also think people who aren't used to being used, can have a hard time spotting it when it happens to them. Additionally, there's the "throwing good money after bad" dynamic that seems to trip people up some times.

Originally Posted By: Still_Crazy
Unfortunately you are correct in that most people are self interested and will think "what will i get out of it".


I do not mean this to sound cynical. I just think it is what it is, in that people are self-interested. I mean even charity is motivated my self-interests. (i.e. one feels good helping others).

To me, the self-interests isn't the head scratching part. It's the poor evaluations of the relative worth of things. (The what will I get out of it part) I'm as susceptible to flattery as the next person, so I'm sure on occassion I have offended my spouse in a speculative attempt to garner a compliment from another woman. However, it doesn't take me long to realize this was not a "good deal."

Originally Posted By: Still_Crazy
However for this particular situation i personally disagree. Mainly because it happens all the time, IMHO probably about 90% of men will help out an attractive women every single time they see one. They will go out of their way to open a door or help her with a cart, etc.


LOL. It's probably not 90%.


Me 43 BH
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Color me DENSE. I just figured out what DiD meant. doh2


Widowed 11/10/12 after 35 years of marriage
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In a sense now, I am homeless. For the home, the place of refuge, solitude, love-where my husband lived-no longer exists. Joyce Carolyn Oates, A Widow's Story
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Originally Posted By: princessmeggy
Color me DENSE. I just figured out what DiD meant. doh2

doh2
rotflmao

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Of course, she put herself in an attractive/flirty dress prior to placing HEROWNSELF on the tracks !
LOL

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Originally Posted By: Pepperband
Of course, she put herself in an attractive/flirty dress prior to placing HEROWNSELF on the tracks !
LOL



OMG , isn't someone man enough to go her that poor girl!!

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Originally Posted By: ConstantProcess



OMG , isn't someone man enough to go her that poor girl!!


By her expression, methinks she's sitting on top of a sharp pointy rock !
It's an EMERGENCY !!!!!!!

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