Hello all,
From a while I have been reading some post from this site. I have to say thanks God for this site. Believe me in this moment I want to dissapear from the earth , in order to stop my H pain.
I have been married since 6 years ago, since some time ago, I have been a lot problems with my H.. I started to talked by phone with a friend, we spent lot time talking about our problems, and we become too much "close", sorry I speak spanish and my english is not good so I dont know how to write this. The idea is that suddenly I started to feel something more than just frienship about him. But I realized that this relations was just a dream, I decided to finished. No contact process with OM is ok.
I was confused about my feelings, I love my husband too much, but now he doesnt want anything for me. He discovered this EA because he got in my emails. He thinks I have sex with OM but I didint.
Its a long story and I hope to explain everthing in order to have some advices...
At this moment he wants to leave me, he plans to leave home this weekend.. I feel terrible, I feel I screw up, and I think my behaviour since D day haven be the best. Instead of help my H with his pain, I increment his pain.
Im a stuborn person, I love him, but he says he hate me, he said he is regreted about got married with me...
This is terrible, it hurts a lot, I know I deserve this.. but I want to fight for my M... I love my H and Im deseperate.
We have a 3 years old daughther, and even this he is going to leave me...
This pain is huge, and I know he is suffering more than me,, he said I destroyed his life..
I dont know what can I do in order to help him and our marriage.. I want to keep this family together but he says no, not anymore...
Im desperate please any advice, would be appreciate...
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Yes. U start with your personal recovery 1st.

Have you read Surviving an Affair?

L.

Im realy desperate, he is hurting himself, he doesnt use to drink but now he started to drink.

Yesterday I was so dessperate, and I drunk for first time in my like in order to stop him to drink...

I scare if he leave home, I thing he hate me... and my daughter is going to miss him a lot.. My H and my daughter are very close...

This hurts a lot,, Im responsable for this, and this pain is terrible... I ask God for forgiveness.. and even I havent pray a lot in all my life, I started now... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Thanks orchid for your reply..

No I havent read that book, I live in mexico city and I cant have any copy here, or even by internet..

Bienvenida a MB. Perdóname pero soy gringo y hablo espanglish. Yo también soy un esposo traicionado así que entiendo algo de lo que siente tu esposo pero mencionaste problemas anteriores en el matrimonio. ¿Qué tipo de problemas tuvierion ustedes?

En las primeras semanas después del Dday, yo no podía pensar en nada más que salir de la relación pero en fin decidí quedarme debido al amor que tengo por mi esposa y también pensando en mis niñas. Antes del EA ¿existía una buena relación entre tú y tu esposo? ¿El te amaba? Es el único problema (o problema más grande por lo menos) la revelación del affair? ¿El is Mexicano también?

Si no te molesta, voy a marcar tu thread como uno de mis favoritos así que recibo un correo automaticamente cada vez que alguien postée (spanglish subjunctive form of "postear") a tu thread.

A propósito, dices que tu Dday era 31 de Marzo - ¿qué año?

Hola traicionado,

Vaya Dios quizo que alguien que conoce mi idioma leyera mi problema. Gracias a Dios!!!

Algo pasó con mi conexion de internet y perdí un post que había escrito contestando tus preguntas.

Sere breve esta vez, No no existia una buena relacion entre mi esposo y yo antes de A..
Basicamente creo que nos falto comunicarnos mas y llenar nuestras necesidades mutuas.. Ambos fallamos.. yo le decia lo que necesitaba pero el decia que yo era egoista al pensar en mí y para el eso eran reclamos..
Nuestras peleas se incrementaron, nuestra vida intima tambien se vio afectada,, luego comenzamos a recuperarnos o algo asi... pero ahora parece que todo esta perdido.
Lo amo sabes? lo amo con toda el alma... Me duele tanto verlo sufrir por mi culpa.

Como puedo ayudarlo? lo dejo irse de la casa? lucho por él?

El martes pasado 21 de marzo del 2006 fue el D day, él lo descubrió y ahora no me cree nada...

esto es una pesadilla y mi hija de 3 años esta sufriendo todo esto tambien..

te agradezco el que me hayas escrito traicionado....

me encantaría que pudieras platicar con él

pero seguramente el no querra entrar a este sitio..

In my country its 2:39 am , I cant sleep.. I feel terrible.. Im not sure what should I do in order to help my H to reduce pain that I cause with my EA.

He thinks that my EA was an PA also but this is not truth.. I got involved with OM but he just fills conversation, afection needs.. Nothing sexual...

In Mexico if a man cheats is ok but if a woman does is the worst thing that a woman can do to a man.. Our society is machista, we have lot machos.. and is more difficult to deal with this..

For my H the doubt is kiling him, I understand that he doesnt trust me anymore.. so how can I help him?

Our D day was last Tuesday (march 21-2006) so I think we are living just the begining of the nightmare right?

Where I should look for the strenght to deal wiht this?

How can I help my H and my M?

Lo que tu esposo está haciendo es perfectamente "normal". Mi esposa es chilanga así que entiendo algo de tu cultura y sus ideas sobre los affairs.

Pase lo que pase, tu esposo creía en tí. En un instante su mundo se destruiyó. El no sabe qué pensar ni creer pero seguramente él va a pensar lo peor. Entiendalo. Dale su tiempo pero seas consistente. No escondas nada - absolutamente nada.

Según dice, toma por lo menos un par de años para reestablecer la confianza entre los dos pero puedes trabajar en el matrimonio desde el principio. De mi punto de vista, la confianza es el último paso.

Si puedes convencer tu esposo postear aquí, con mucho gusto le hablaré.

Estoy un poco preocupado sobre el estado del matrimonio antes del affair. ¡Qué bueno que lo habían reconocido y estaban trabajando en él! Sin embargo, no se puede hacer en un vacío. Busquen ayuda. Busquen consejo matrimonial.

El intento de salvar el matrimonio presuma que existía algo que salvar. Lo amas. Tienen una niña juntos. Falta de comunicación no es muy raro pero hay que resolverlo.

Una sugerencia - escribe tus posts en "Word" ú otro software y cuando termines, "cut and paste" aquí. Vas a perder mucho menos. Ni te puedo contar los posts que he perdido y me da tanto coraje cada vez que me lo pase!

Primero le has lastimado como no puedes imaginar. Dile la verdad pero no le roges. Sigue con lo mismo. No cambies tu historia, los dados. Contesta todo que te pregunta. Seas humilde pero fuerte.

El tiene que acostumbrarse con los hechos recientes revelados. Dale tiempo a ver realmente qué quiere él. Yo he estado en su lugar. Sé todos los pensamientos. Sé que te duele pero tienes que sufrir mucho más si quieres salvar el matrimonio.

Es fin de semana y no hay tanto tráfico aca hasta el lunes pero vas a ver ayuda mientras. Sigue escribiendo. Vivo en Arabia Saudita y mi horario no se coincida precisamente con el tuyo.

Can the two of you seek marriage counseling together? First he needs to start asking questions and getting answers and get the same answeres every single time. He will try to develop his own path to reestablish his trust in you. It may not seem reasonable or logical but you just have to accept it.

There is not a big difference between an EA and a PA although for un hombre machista, his ego is hurt much more by a PA. I am guessing the emails must have been pretty bad to put you in this situation. Doesn't matter. What's done is done. You want to save the marriage. You need to be very patient and understanding with him right now.

Before the EA I asked him about to look for a marriage counseling, but he said, for what? we can do alone...
Now I asked him again, and now, he doesnt want to recover our relationship.. he says he CANT stay near from me..

Thank you very much traicionado, it realy help me your lines...

Im tryin to keep posting here, is not easy because work, but I need this help... or Im going to be crazy..

Have a nice weekend traicionado... thanks again

oye,

Si alcanzas a convencer a tu esposo platicar con alguién, El me puede escribir a [email]robertleecox@hotmail.com.[/email] Es una dirección que no cheqo muy a menudo. Si él me escribe allí, postea tú aquí para deciremlo y voy a chequear ese correo.

Tú vas a recibir mucho más ayuda aquí. Te pido el favor que no me escribas tú a mi dirección personal. Mantén tus posts aquí en el forum para poder recibir la máxima ayuda.

No es mi fin de semana. Hoy es un día habil aquí. Sigue escribiendo. ¿Que hora es allí? ¿Las 3 de la mañana? Espera unas tres o quatro horas mas y vas a ver mas gente contestándote.

Si te digo la verdad, yo mandé mi esposa a su amante con sus maletas. Le había sacado de la casa. Ahora está commigo debido a que yo decidí intentar salvar el matrimonio. Cabe mencionar que mi esposa sigue enamorada con el OM y realmente no quiere nada que ver con el matrimonio. Sin embargo, estamos en el intento. En tu caso, tú quieres salvar el matrimonio y es una gran ventaja. Si mi esposa estuviera en tu lugar, ya estariamos felices. Cálmate un poco. Todo está muy fresco. No vas a resolver nada de noche a día. Sigue aquí. Busca consejo. Ya pronto viene. Yo tengo una junta así voy a salir el resto de mi tarde. Si te puedo dar algún consejo, busca tu fé. Pide paciencia y calma. El mundo no se ha terminado todavía. Hay chance. Dile a tu esposo que me escriba.

Cancelé mi junta. Aquí me quedo por tres horas más. Para entonces, habrán más gente aquí. Mientras, si necesitas charlar, postea algo pero dile a tu esposo que me mande un correo. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

lagrimas,

Si es posible convencerle mantenerse en la casa contigo, hazlo. Si él se saca de la casa ahora, es posible que él tenga un affair de venganza. No vas a poder cambiar sus ideas desde lejos. Dale el espacio que necesite. No te pongas encima de él pero, por favor, mantenlo en la casa. Si es necesario, ofrécele que duermes en el sillión. El se queda con la cama. No es hora de ser egoista. No le pongas muchas demandas. Por el momento, has perdido muchos derechos. Dices que quieres luchar por él. Lo tendrás que hacer pero eres capáz.

Tears,
somos varios aqui que hablamos y comprendemos el castellano.

Tambien comprendemos tu situacion.
Es importante que tu leas todo lo que puedas en la pagina principal, casi todo el libro Surviving an Affair esta alli, de alguna manera u otra. Si es posible, imprimelo y dejalo por alli para que tu esposo lo lea. Lo importante a tener en cuenta es que un matrimonio SE PUEDE RECUPERAR de un affair y ser aun mucho mejor que antes.

Pero hay que cumplir algunos requisitos.

En este momento lo importante es que tu hables sinceramente con tu esposo. Le expliques con calma que te has equiocado y que haras todo lo que sea necesario para recuperar el matrimonio. Lo prmero es que nunca mas deberas hablar con tu amigo. en segundo lugar debes ser trasparente: demuestrales tu buena intencion contestando todas sus preguntas y no escondiendo nada. Ni del pasado, ni del presente.

Eso es lo que tu puedes hacer. No lo puedes obligar a quedarse.

sigue escribiendo aqui, te escuchamos

¡Muchísimas gracias cc46! ¡Estoy a salvo!

Espero que "lagrimas" esté durmiendo. Ya sabes que en un par de horas estaré de "limited duty" en la computadora.

Me encantaría placticar con su esposo a través del forum o por correo electrónico si no se siente cómodo aquí.

Traicionado,

we can't force her husband here. He actually has every right and reason for not wanting to remain in the marriage.

There are only a few of us (BS) who are willing to forgive and try to recover. There are millions out there who either just decide not to forgive and divorce or who just never forgive but stay in a "marriage". If the data is true and it probably is, MORE than HALF the marriages suffer from infidelity at some point. So we have to wonder how they manage or managed.... I have some suspicions, and MB is a much better choice

Trac & CC,

No you can't force her H here but she can show him what has been posted. It is up to him to open his eyes or keep them shut.

Yes, D or not to D is his choice also.

Glad to see u 2 are posting to Tears in spanish. Sorry I don't understand more but keep it up. This is helping Tears and that's what is important.

Tears, just to let you know what Trac and CC are doing for you and your family is awesome. Let your H know that even though he does not want to help you right now, there are some who are willing to reach out through out worldwide network to help you and your family and that includes him.

Please give him our regards because we do understand how he is hurting. Let him know that WHEN he is ready, we will be here, Yea, even in spanish. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

My spanish is limited on what I like to eat. LOL!!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" /> For that matter so is my french and italian. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/laugh.gif" alt="" />

take care,
L.

Tear....Me apena mucho en la situacion en que te encuentras con tu esposo. Pero parece que han tenido sus problemitas de antes. Lo que tienes que hacer es convencer a tu esposo de que tu te distes cuenta de que ibas en un camino peligroso con el otro hombre, y parastes la relacional emocional antes de que se convirtiera en algo fisico. Ensenale todos los e-mails que tu y el otro hombre intercambiaron. Ahi tiene que haber algun tipo de evidencia de tu inocencia en cuanto a que paso algo sexual entre tu y el otro hombre.

Si quieres hablar en espanol estoy aqui para ti!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Yo tuve un relacion fuera del matrimonio , y ya hacen casi dos anos desde que acabo todo, y mi matrimonio esta casi normal!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/pfft.gif" alt="" />

Myrta

Hi,
La pesadilla continua, ayer recibí un correo de un amigo que tuve hace unos meses por internet.. Resulta que ese amigo vive en otra ciudad y una vez vino a Mexico y fuimos a comer, y nada mas...Pero como mi esposo esta leyendo diario mis correos, el vio primero el correo. Este señor que me escribió dijo palabras como beso, cariño y algo sobre el aroma de mi perfume..... y ahora mi esposo cree que yo también tuve que ver con este señor que conocí en internet...
Mi primera reacción fue negarle que lo habia conocido pero luego me acorde de los consejos de acá que debe ser uno totalmente honesto, asi que le dije la verdad, pero el ahora dice que porque le escondí eso, que el tiene que encontrar las cosas. LA verdad se puso como loco, dijo que pensaba darme una oportunidad pero que despues de este mail que llegó pues no, que me odia y no quiere nada de mi. Yo no lo deje salir asi y lo segui, me advirtió que si no lo dejaba en paz, me pegaría, algo que jamas habia hecho... y yo en mi afan de que escuchara el toda la verdad lo segui y le iba contando todo mientras caminabamos...El no quiere escuchar nada de mi, solo piensa lo peor, y ese señor que me escribio solo me trajo problemas.. y bueno mi esposo me pegó en la calle,,, solo una vez.. pero estaba furioso. Me dolió más internamente que fisicamente ese golpe... Luego el regreso a casa y me dijo aca pasara todo y nuestra nena vera todo, porque tu asi lo quisiste y no me dejaste ir... Y se encerró en un cuarto, a tomar alcohol y rompio unas botellas.. Se puso como loco, asi que decidi salir con mi nena y mi mama que llego de visita y me fui a casa una prima vecina.. Era demasiado para mi escucharlo así. Cuando regresé el ya no estaba en casa, y como es Doctor, tenemos medicinas y bisturis en casa, entre a ver el cuarto donde el se encierra y había sangre en la colcha, y una jeringa usada con sangre.. No se que hizo, me preocupa su integridad.. dice que quiere matarse. no quiso darme el tel de un amigo suyo para que lo ayudara...
Im dessperate, I started pray in order to ask God to help him with this pain..
He returned to home in night, he was drunk, and he didnt say anything. He is not take care of himself, he had a car accident last monday, and he needs to take medicine, and stay quiet and using a neck support but he didnt do. He dont eat anything.
I dont know what to do...

Hola Tear,

en un momento te escribo un comentario más externso. Calma, respira, no hagas nada abrupto. Su reacción es la de alguien que ha sufrido un dolor intenso y no sabe cómo canalizar lo que siente.

Si puedes avisa a alguien del temor que tienes de que él haya hecho algo contra sí mismo.

Creo que no se hizo daño y lo que hizo fue por asustarte y lastimarte, pero quién sabe. Calma, respira, las cosas no se van a solucionar pronto pero se solucionarán.

Now Im scare, every person that once I chat in internet, can send me an email, and I dont know what can my H thinks about it..
In fact, that with this internet friend, I chat several times, but, believe me nothing else happen.. and since some months I Iheard anything about him. For me this wasnt so relevant, I just chat with someone who lives in another state, and once, he came to this city and we had lunch together.. and thats it.
Today, my H got out home early in the morning I dont know where he went, im terrible worry about him.. Where he is? with who? etc..
What can I do?

Ok, ya entendía que él regreso.

Debes darle tiempo para asimilar la realidad, mientras tanto sigue leyendo el material de esta página. Los libros del Dr. Harley también están en español y te los envían a donde los pidas.

Los golpes y la violencia física, sea por parte del hombre o de la mujer, no están justificados, pero sólo tú puedes saber si realmente fue sólo un acto pasajero.

Evita interactuar con él cuando tú o él ó ambos estén en un estado demasiado vulnerable y emocional. No lo persigas de cuarto a cuarto o en la calle.

en este momento la honestidad es muy dolorosa pero es lo mejor. Una de las preguntas clásicas es el porqué lo hiciste y qué significó para tí, con frecuencia la persona con el EA o PA dice que no significó nada y eso ofende muchísimo a la pareja engañada porque es como decirle que por nada se arriesgo el matrimonio.

No sé si tu esposo lee en inglés pero quizá le sirva leer aquí. Hay dos médicos cuyas esposas tuvieron PA y ellos se separaron, lemonman y Cymanca.

En los siguientes días has todo lo posible por ser responsable de tus actos ante tu esposo, algo así como el Plan A, pero no esperes una respuesta inmediata de parte de él.

Quizá puedan ir a terapia de pareja.

Ánimo y serenidad, esto pasará y con paciencia podrán recuperarse.

Muchas gracias a todos por sus consejos..
En verdad se los agradezco.. No se si escribir en español o en ingles, mi ingles no es tan bueno, pero si mi esposo algun dia pudiera leer esto, seria mejor que fuera en español.
Mi esposo lee algo de inglés pero no se si porque esta enojado, el caso es que el otro día me dijo que yo solo estoy haciendo lo que dice "ese sitio de internet" y no lo que yo realmente quiero...
De no ser por este sitio y las ayuda que he encontrado acá no se que sería de mi en estos momentos.
Como puedo acercarme a mi esposo para proponerle que platique con tracionado, cuando ni siquiera quiere saber de este sitio o algo que yo le diga?
No se cuando regrese y cómo regrese..
La vida sigue, mi nena necesita desayunar y debo meter la ropa a la lavadora y mis actividades propias del fin de semana.. Saldré un rato de este sitio, les agradezco a todos sus lineas, gracias de corazon.
Espero poder entrar por la tarde a ver mas consejos.. Y a buscar como hacerle para que me envien en español los libros..
Como o a quien se los pido?

Tear, sé que es difícil y doloroso pero tienes que asumir todo. Aquí se dice con frecuencia que todo lo que no puedas hacer con tu esposo delante está mal. Hay gente con más o menos tolerancia a las amistades con el otro sexo pero tu matrimonio siempre debe ser más importante que nada. Entonces en lugar de decirle a tu esposo, sólo fue una comida, le dices, por ejemplo. Lamento mucho haberlo hecho y haberte lástimado, ahora me doy cuenta que estaba haciendo algo equivocado al ocultártelo y no pienso tener amigos de ese tipo. Luego escribes una carta de NC a ese amigo y a cualquier otro amigo masculino cuya presencia incómode a tu esposo. En la carta de No contact les dices que les pides que no comuniquen más contigo, que piensas concentrarte en tu matrimonio y que por favor respeten tu deseo. Mandas las cartas, por mail o correo con tu esposo en frente.

Se que es muy doloroso pero mientras menos te justifiques y más asumas tus errores más fácil le será a tu esposo perdonarte con el tiempo. Ya que él no deseé abandonar el matrimonio ya habrá tiempo para platicar de lo que no te gusta en la pareja, pero ahorita es tiempo de crisis, tienes que aguantar el temporal como dicen.

Muchas gracias y me parece muy bueno tu consejo larouse, lo haré en cuanto pueda hablar con mi esposo.. Lo malo es que no quiere ni verme.. aun no llega y no se a que hora regrese y en que momento o como acercarme a él para decirle lo mucho que lo siento y elaborar esas NC.
Debo ver a mi nena para que desaayune, tengo que salir de aca por el momento, gracias a todos.

lagrima,

Estás en buenas manos con cc46, larousse, Myrta y las demás. Ten fé. El affair es la peor cosa que una persona puede hacer al otra y la cosa más dolorosa. Pero hay chance. Lo siento que tu esposo te pegó. No tiene derecho.

Sigo con la oferta de placticar con tu esposo si él estaría dispuesto. Ya he sufrido todo así que creo que le puedo ayudar en algo. Le puedo explicar lo que sentía y como me siento ahora. El tiene que hablar con alguién. No soy mucho pero le ayudaré en cualquier momento.

¿Puedes enseñar a tu esposo cómo cambiar tu contraseña de tu cuenta de correo? Dile a él que se quede solo con la contraseña nueva. El puede chequear tus correos de tus ex-amigos pero tú no vas a poder. Sácate una cuenta nueva con su asistencia. Dale la contraseña. Tienes que ser cien porcienta transparente con él.

Seguramente él te quiere lastimar en alguna manera. Desgraciadamente no existe la manera en que puedas entender el dolor que se siente un esposo traicionado. Confía en mí - no lo quieres hacer tampoco. Te pido que le des chance y tiempo para organizar sus pensamientos. No es nada facíl. Todas te están diciendo la verdad. El tiene todo derecho de salir - de pedirte un divorcio. Nadie le podría reclamar nada. Ni yo. Mantenlo lo más cerca que puedas. Si quiere buscar una pelea contigo, ríndate. No vas a ganar ninguna lucha en este momento.

Espero que tu esposo decida intentar de nuevo contigo - pero tu tienes que estár dispuesta de esperar el tiempo que sea necesario.

Hola a todos,

Después de tratar de darle el espacio necesario a mi esposo.. hoy olvidé una credencial de la guarderia donde llevo a mi nena, regresé a casa y el se enojó y me dijo que ni eso puedo hacer, me enojé muchísimo... le dije que él tampoco ayudaba mucho y entonces discutimos y me pegó...ahora si fuerte, aún me duele físicamente el golpe, pero me duele mucho más, por dentro...nos hemos perdido el respeto... necesitaré terapia para no tenerle miedo.. y perdonar..., en esos momentos a pesar del golpe... le dije que sentía mucho que nos estemos dañando tanto, que lo amo con toda mi alma y que me perdone, que intentemos salvar lo nuestro, el me abrazó y djo que también me ama, pero que tiene rabia intensa por lo que hice...
Aunado a eso mi mama esta de visita en casa para ayudarme con mi hija, dado que mi esposo esta delicado de salud para verla,, y pueden imaginarse que mi mamá trata de proteger a su hija.. y bueno, eso lo enfurece más a mi esposo..
Mi esposo no quiere comer, solo bebe alcohol y esta furioso.
Ya tengo el tel de su mejor amigo y hoy que por fin pudimos platicar, el me prohibió llamar a su amigo.

No quiere ayuda de nadie..
Le conte de este sitio.. no quiere saber nada de nada ni de nadie, dice que el solo va a salir de eso pero que necesita sacar toda su furia.

Dice que le dan ganas de buscar a alguien para apoyarse emocionalmente como yo lo hice.. es decir tener un affair tambien, bueno eso entendí yo.

No sé que hacer,, ahora ya llegamos a los golpes,,, el solo esta enccerrado en un cuarto y bebe... no quiere ayuda de nadie.

DEbo seguir mi sentido común y llamar a su amigo?

O respeto lo que pidió y no le aviso a su amigo de lo mal que esta mi esposo?

Im really dessperate...

Tear,

personalmente creo que la situacion es peligrosa para ti y tu hija. Creo que debes irte de tu casa.

Debes alejarte unos dias. Con ese nivel de emocion creo que puede terminar mal. Hay algun lado donde puedes ir?

cc46 podría ser buena idea...podría ser la próxima semana...sería como un "break" de todo esto que ha sido tan intenso..
Tengo miedo de que mi esposo piense que no me importa lo que le pase.. o que se ponga a beber más.. no lo sé.. sé que no soy responsable por lo que el haga, pero de verdad me preocupa...
Es necesario esa distancia creo..

tear, dejale una carta donde le dices que lo amas y que quieres rehacer tu matrionio pero que si hay violencia eso no sera posible. Que es mejor que tu te alejes por un rato.

Una vez que te hayas ido, llama al amigo o a alguien que lo pueda acompanar.

En este estado de situacion creo que es necesario un alejamiento.

Hoy después de la violencia física, tuve una crisis, iba manejando el auto, llamé a mi esposo y él me alcanzó donde estaba y platicamos en el auto..Me dijo que NO llame a su amigo.. ya no sé que hacer... yo quiero llamar a su amigo.. pero.. mi esposo no está de acuerdo y me comenta que nunca respeto lo que me pide.. que ahora lo haga.. solo que no sé que tan buena idea sea. yo quiero llamar a su amigo.. solo de él puede aceptar alguna ayuda...
Cómo ayudas a alguien que no quiere ninguna ayuda?

no puedes ayudarlo.

solo puedes protegerte tu y tu hija

diselo. dile que lo quieres pero debesalejarte por proteccion

Tear

antes de que esto pasara tu esposo ya tenía problemas con el alcohol?
si crees que él ya tenía una tendencia hacia abusar del alcohol contacta un grupo de AA, a veces ellos envían gente a las casas, de ninguna manera debes tratar con él cuando está tomado, no trates de hablar ni razonar con él en ese estado.

Aunque puedes sentirte tentada a aceptar la culpa por su reacción violenta, cada quien es responsable por sus reacciones, así como tu eres responsable por haber elegido estar en contacto con otras personas.

Ambos necesitan ayuda terapéutica.

La presencia de terceros en la familia a veces añade stress a las situaciones, pero si tu integridad no está segura, realmente es mejor que te alejes totalmente.

Lee los conceptos de LB y DJ, love busters y disrespectful judgements en este sitio, donde dice conceptos básicos. Tienes que aprender a dialogar de manera diferente.

El que tu esposo esté usando la violencia y el alcohol sobrepasa los recursos de este sitio, aún cuando logren sobreponerse como pareja al affair emocional, van a tener que atender el problema de la violencia física. Por favor recurre a la policía la próxima vez y al menos levanta un acta. Él tiene que saber que no es correcto lo que hace y que no puede ser protegido por tu silencio. En todo momento puedes mostrarte amorosa en el sentido de decirle cuando busques ayuda podemos recuperar el matrimonio, o te amo pero no está bien que uses la violencia.

Me pregunto si estará abusando de alguna sustancia además del alcohol...

Si tienes que enfrentar una posible separación quizá te convenga tener registro en el ministerio público de que el ha usado la violencia.

Porqué no hablas con sus padres?
espero que estés bien a pesar de todo y segura.

Larouse,

No, nunca habia usado el alcohol, en 15 que llevo de conocerlo solo lo he visto borracho esta semana, a raíz del EA..

Siempre ha sido muy introvertido, no expresa lo que siente,lo que le enoja, sus emociones, la ira se apodera de él a veces..

Mi padre es AA, tiene muchos años sin tomar alcohol, yo viví el alcoholismo de mi padre cuando era niña y no es algo que le deseo a nadie. Jamas me habia pegado mi esposo, y saben algo? hoy que lo hizo, NO estaba borracho, solo lleno de furia y rabia por lo que ha vivido..

Se que alguien alcoholisado es muy peligroso, por eso el dia D que llego borracho, yo lo toleré y no lo contradije en nada, me dijo cosas muy hirientes, yo lo toleré, me dió unos manazos en la pierna para que yo lo viera a los ojos, y yo no dije nada pues él estaba muy borracho..

Hoy por la mañana era distinto, yo estaba a punto de irme a trabajar, mi nena va a una guardería y al regresar por algo que olvidé, mi esposo, criticó a mi madre, y a mí y yo le contesté, lo que solo aumentó su enojo. Y bueno, lo demás que recuerdo fue unos golpes.. Después lo llamé cobarde por lo que hizo, el se enojó más, yo quería correr lejos, pero no fue posible, luego me abrazo me dijo que me ama y que debe irse de casa pues hizo algo que a él también le duele.. luego hablamos un poco.

El dolor físico que siento en la cara donde él me pegó no se compara con la tristeza y falta de respeto que hemos demostrado uno con el otro.

Debo arreglar unas cosas en el trabajo para poder tomarme unos días.

Durante la charla que tuvimos, el me comento que si me ama, que quiere envejecer conmigo, pero tiene que hacer algo con toda la rabia que tiene dentro, tiene que salir y buscar algo, (podría ser otra mujer, para tener un PA) dice que jamás había sentido necesidad de tomar y ahora, si.. Incluso drogas.. él es médico por lo que tiene acceso a fármacos y fácilmente podría drogarse si asi lo decide.
Diario rezo por él, ayer mi esposo me comentó que fue a la iglesia, que necesitaba un lugar de paz.. No quiso entrar a confesión con un cura, (no le gusta eso) asi que solo fue a la iglesia.

Yo continuo pidiéndole a Dios ayuda, y buscaré una ayuda profesional para mí. Lo que he pasado no puedo manejarlo y superarlo sola...No sé donde buscar o que debo buscar en un buen consejero matrimonial, o debe ser un psicólogo?

Another day, and sun is shinning.
Yesterday, my H and I had a conversation, finally, we could speak, and without hurting..
Yesterday I accept a lie that I told him about OM, (I met him on line) I realize how stupid I was, I trusted in OM, I put in risk my family, and myself. You dont know how is online, and can be very dangerous..
I realize that I was blind, and all this pain that we are going through is my fault...
Even we have had lot troubles before the EA, I havent any excuse...
Im so regret, and I felt sick about myself..
Im human, Im not perfect, but I need professional help to deal with my selfsteem..
My H doesnt want help, he thinks can deal with this alone..
I think time, pray, can help us right?

Does anyone here knows if I can buy a book through internet?

Im interesting in "Surviving an Affair" and if there is a spanish version would be great in order to share it with my husband..when he is prepare, and able..

Hola Tear.....parece que tu esposo esta mas receptivo a ti ahora. Quizas ya se este dando cuenta que tu no llegastes a nada fisico con el OH. Que contenido exactamente tenias tus correos electronicos con el otro hombre? Hablaban de temas intimos? O era solamente temas casuales? Debes dejar que tu esposo lea todo lo que tu y el OH intercambiaron. Eso lo haria ver la realidad de lo que paso exactamente.

Yo no se si "Surviving an Affair" esta en espanol, pero lo mas seguro que asi sea. Pues ahora traducen todos al espanol. Puedes buscar en la internet. Dale a Google y de ahi puedes preguntar.

El hecho de que tu esposo beba tanto ahora no es bueno para nada. Y debes observar a ver si en realidad esta usando algun tipo de drogas, pues eso es mas serio y peligroso. Cuidense mucho tu,tu madre, y tu hijo.

Buena suerte!!

Myrta

tear

Yo como tu soy mexicana, no vivo en Mexico, vivo en Arabia Saudita y mi esposo es "traicinado", creo que ya te escribio, nada mas que yo no puedo ver lo que escribe. Yo tambien tube un affair con el maestro de natacion de mis nenas, tengo dos una de 7 y la pequena de 5. Mi situacion es un poquito similar y no al mismo tiempo, yo me enamore del OH, el OH es de Inglaterra y hace 6 meses renuncio de su trabajo y se regreso a Inglaterra. Estubimos en contacto por telefono por mucho tiempo, tengo poco mas de un mes sin contacto con el, pero me ha sido muy dificil sobrellevar mis sentimientos. Yo como tu tambien estoy pidiendo consejos. Mi esposo es de USA, y me esta dando la oportunidad de rehacer el matrimonio, me saco de la casa en varias ocasiones y le he rogado que me de oportunidad tras oportunidad, lo hago en este momento por las nenas. Si me volviera a sacar, me hiria a Mexico, pero sin las nenas, la tengo de perder toda, pues fui yo quien tubo el affair. Hasta el momento no hemos llegado a los golpes, se que lo que cuentas es verdad, en Mexico vivimos en un lugar de machos. Hasta el momento he navegado con banderita de buena suerte y doi gracias a la Virgen de Guadalupe. Mi esposo tomaba muchisimo antes de venir a Saudita, tenemos 7 anos viviendo en el medio Oriente y desde que llegamos a este pais no toma, por que no se vende alcohol, pero si estubieramos en otro lugar, yo se que estubiera ahogado en alcohol todas las noches. Tengo de casada 9 anos y en muchos de ellos tubimos muchos problemas, pero nuestro problema fue, que nunca hablamos ni dijimos las cosas que nos molestaban. Hasta ahora que llegamos aqui, vimos la realidad y esa realidad me empujaron a tener un affair y aqui estoy tratando de poner de mi parte para hacer y salvar este matrimonio. Mi esposo ha tenido mucha paciencia conmigo, eso ni quien lo dude, me ama con toda su alma, lo trizte del caso es que yo lo quiero, pero no lo amo, espero volver a amarlo, de otra forma nose que voy a hacer.
Paisana, si tu esposo te sigue pegando, lo mejor es que te salgas de tu casa como dice cc46, tomate un tiempo, pero no le quites el ojo de encima a tu esposo por que puede hacer algo que ni Dios lo quieras tengas que lamentar mas tarde. Mira yo no soy nadie para decirte que hacer, yo tambien estoy en una situacion donde estoy pidiendo ayuda, pero por lo menos cuentas con otra paisana, del otro lado del mundo que te escucha y quiere ayudarte.
Un abrazo y animo paisa.
Gemela.

Como tenia interes en saber si SAA esta en espanol, le escribi a Dr. Harley y esto es lo que me contesto:

My books are translated into 20 languages, including Spanish, but I do
not have access to the translated books in the same way that I have
access to the books in English. Foreign publishers (especially the one
in Mexico) are not as commercially sophisticated as American publishers,
and make it more difficult to obtain their products. It's something I
am trying to change. I'm hoping that the translation into Spanish will
be published here in America soon so that I can send them out more
easily. Until then, all I can do is make them available in English.
Keep in touch and we may have them within a year..

Best wishes
Willard F. Harley, Jr.

Es muy positivo que estén hablando pero yo insistiría en que asistieran a terapia de pareja o individual en el caso de él.

Si no solucionan los problemas subyacentes a tu EA y a su lapsus de violencia, estos regresarán con más fuerza y entonces puede ser irreparable.

No encuentro el link para adquirir Surviving an affair en español pero te sugiero que mandes un e.mail a esta página de Marriage Builders y les preguntes, ellos son los editores del libro.

La reacción violenta de tu esposo me hace pensar que tiene problemas para expresar sus emociones y su ira. Aunque a la larga lo mejor es que seas transparente con él en todos los sentidos, quizá es mejor a que esperes a que él esté en un mejor estado emocional. Si él insiste en saber más sobre tus actividades en la red, llega a un acuerdo con él de destinar un hora o media hora al tema cada día y parar cuando él empiece a enojarse.

Aunque está bien que aceptes que él esté molesto y no te justifiques, de ninguna manera debes aceptar un trato violento o injurioso.

Estás en el D.F?


Si deseas tener más opiniones en inglés dinos y te contestamos en inglés y cambia el título de tu threat a algo como -XWW in recovery or -XWW needing input to recover my marriage.

Te decía arriba, aunque no fui clara, que la presencia de tu mamá puede ser contraproducente en su recuperación y hacer que tu esposo se cierre más en lugar de abrirse.

Toma un día a la vez. Escucha a tu esposo sin tratar de justificarte y reconoce constantemente el dolor que le has causado, valida sus emociones, al mismo tiempo trata de mantener un trato respetuoso y en la medida de lo posible, cordial por ambas partes, pero en cuanto las cosas se suban de tono alejate.

Sé que es muy difícil llamar a la policía o a alguien en caso de que él se ponga violento de nuevo, pero si no lo haces él seguirá pensando que puede hacerlo sin consecuencias. También por eso debes insistir en ir a una terapia de pareja, no dejes pasar este incidente.

Espero que todo mejore.

Hola, gracias a todos por sus comentarios,
Myrta, desgraciadamente muchos mails que intercambié con el OM los borré, de hecho nuestra "relación" era telefónica. De cualquier forma los pocos que encontré se los mostré a mi esposo..Se ve, que yo le contaba cosas casuales, y los de él hacia mí, eran de ánimo, de apoyo, lo malo el OM es una persona muy cariñosa, y me llamaba amor, o me decía que me quería mucho..eso enfurece a mi esposo.
En el último email que le mande al OM le di las gracias por TODO y esa palabra, así escrita con mayúsculas, hizo creer a mi esposo que entre el OM y yo había sucedido TODO..

TEngo mucho que contarles a cada uno de uds que ha sido tan amable en apoyarme y escribir acá, pero es tarde y estoy en la oficina, debo ir a casa, espero poder escribirles desde casa.
De corazón gracias a todos por sus comentarios.
La estoy pasando mal, mi esposo esta furioso, cualquier cosa hace que diga cosas hirientes, que levante la voz, sé que debo ser humilde, pero no entiendo porque no quiere ayuda? no acepta ningún error... ni siquiera le pasa por la cabeza que mi error fue producto de fallas entre nosotros, sin que esto justifique mi comportamiento..

Debo irme, por ahora.

Gracias

cc46
GRacias por tu ayuda en la búsqueda del SAA en español...

gemela
En verdad tenemos cosas en común y no solo el hecho de ser paisanas..Desconozco los detalles de tu A.. mantente escribendo y aprendiendo de personas que pasaron por lo que estas viviendo.. eso estoy tratando de hacer yo..
En mi caso amo a mi esposo, pero el no quiere saber nada de mí, aunque dice que me ama. Puede más su ira, su coraje que mis esfuerzos por intentar mantener unida nuestra familia.
Mi esposo necesita ayuda, ha buscado el alcohol como compañero en esto. Esta furioso con todo, incluso a nuestra mascota, una perrita snauzer, mi esposo la patea, o agrede si tiene oportunidad...no entiendo, el pobre perro no tiene culpa alguna..
Lo mismo sucede con mi mamá, ahora todo lo que ella haga, a mi esposo le parece mal y le molesta.. esta furioso. Mi madre nos ha ayudado mucho, apoyándonos en el cuidado de mi nena de 3 años, en estos días tan dificiles..
Mi esposo no acepta error alguno,, y emocionalmente está muy mal. dice que si hubiera tenido una pistola el día D, se habría pegado un balazo...tomó una jeringa y la aguja se le encajó,, no pensó en nada, ni siquiera en su hija..
No entiendo, yo de no ser por mi hija estaría como loca.. pero pienso en ella y aprendo de ella... ella perdona y muestra sus sentimientos...
Las cosas en casa estan muy mal

gemela, eres afortunada al tener un esposo que te tolera y te ama tanto...en verdad crees que no solo estás confundida con tus sentimientos respecto al OM? yo creo que OM solo llenaba mi necesidad de atención, y conversación y es cierto que llegué a sentirme en una nube, como enamorada, mi autoestima se elevó, y luego me dí cuenta de que un hombre de verdad no se involucra con una mujer casada...no si realmente no quiere causarle problemas...no sé si enmi caso el OM en realidad se interesó en mi, o si solo buscaba tratarme muy bien, para que una vez que yo estuviera muy interesada en él, entonces si,pasar al plano del PA.. cosa que afortunadamente y gracias a Dios, no pasó. Gemela, analiza bien las cosas, seguramente tu OM no es perfecto, y tu esposo, demuestra lo mucho que te ama al tenerte tanta paciencia.. bueno es una idea..
Gracias por tus palabras gemela.. estamos en contacto, no dejes este sitio, no estás sola y NO LO BUSQUES, en un tiempo te darás cuenta de que a quien más ayudas con el NC es a tí misma..
NO LO BUSQUES..y no te permitas siquiera pensar en él... piensa en tus hijas, en 10 años como estarán, que valores les habrá podido enseñar.. eres humana y te equivocaste,, analiza bien, muy bien tus ideas..
Tu puedes paisa...

Tear...como estan las cosas con tu esposo? Han hablado mas, ha habido mas violencia de su parte?

Es muy bueno y muestra mucha madurez de tu parte, que te hayas dado cuenta, de lo que el OM era para ti. Y que no era un hombre bueno, pues como dices, no se hubiera involucrado contigo, esperando otros "beneficios". Eres muy buena mujer, y espero que tu esposo se de cuenta a tiempo. Que tenga la valentia de ir a tomar algun tipo de ayuda profesional y que los dos vayan a un consejero matrimonial.

Sigue escribiendo, es bueno para ti que te expreses.

Saludos

Myrta

tear,

Siento tanto lo que estas pasando, entiendo como te debes sentir en este momento, pero no te des por vencida, todavia no. Yo entiendo como es el tema de que los hombres en mexico pueden tener las mujeres que quieran, ah!pero nosotras no podemos hacerle eso al esposo y sobre todo en Mexico donde vivimos en pais tan machista. Tu como yo somo humanos y cometemos errores, todos cometemos errores en este mundo.
Amiga, en este momento tan dificil por el cual estas pasando, no debes darle ningun motivo para que se enfuresca mas, llevatela tranquila con el, dile que si a todo, pero tampoco dejes que abuse de ti, eso si que no. Dile a tu mami, que no se meta a decirle nada, porque le puede decir cosas hirientes, ahorita tu esposo es una fiera y puede hacer cualquier cosa.
Cuando mi esposo se entero de mi Affair, yo estaba en USA e intento suicidarse dejando de comer para ver si le daba un infarto, bajo 9 kilos, cuando yo regrese, era hueso pegado al pellejo, yo nunca habia visto a una persona tan flaca, se veia horrible, pobresito, ahora lo entiendo y lo compadesco, gracias a Dios no paso a mas, con decirte que se podia poner mis pantalones y yo soy una persona delgada, pero desde que todo exploto he estado en un estres horrible, baje 4 kilos, ahorita peso 50 kg. Yo se que debes estar bajo mucho estres, peor tu puedes salir adelante.
Como se esta portando tu esposo contigo estos ultimos dias?
Tear, no dejes de escribirme, por lo menos tienes una paisana que habla tu idioma, conoce de la cultura y el tipo de pais donde criamos.
Un abrazo, animo paisana.
Gemela.

Myrta,
Te cuento que ayer mi esposo me llamó al tel, para mostrar enojo, cualquier cosa le enoja,, todo lo ve mal.. yo solo respiré profundo y dije <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />aciencia , paciencia.. asi que no hubo discusión esta vez..
Ya en casa, él espera a que mi mamá se vaya a dormir y bajó a ver la TV... luego me preguntó, porque no le decía nada, yo la verdad estaba triste, estoy viendo lo mal que él está emocionalmente y si de por si antes de todo esto, él tenía un problema en expresar sus sentimientos y aceptar sus errores, ahora peor.. antes de todo esto, podíamos pasar muchos días sin hablarnos, cada quien mostrando orgullo y haciendo nuestro ambiente familiar, tenso y feo..
Ayer, estaba cansada, sucede que hace unos meses me detectaron una enfermedad de la tiroides que hace que me cansé más de lo normal y que me hizo subir muchos kgs, algo que afectó enormememnte mi autoestima..igualmente afectó mis estados de ánimo y mi esposo una vez me dijo que el no tenía la culpa de mi enfermedad y que no tenía porque estar aguantando mis cambios de ánimo... era irónico como el hombre que amo me decía eso y el OM me daba ánimos y me apoyaba y toleraba aún con mis cambios de humor...
Mi esposo me dijo ayer, porque no me dices nada, o es que ya no tienes nada más que decirme? solo le dije, temo tu reacción a todo, todo te enoja.. y me preguntó si conocí al OM una vez que fue a revisar mi PC pues a eso se dedica.. esa es la verdad, puede leerse raro pero así fue... no fue nada planeado, sucede que el andaba cerca de donde yo le había dicho que vivía y bueno, lo conocí y revisó la PC en casa.. mientras el estuvo en casa, (como media hora) estaba la chica que me ayuda con el aseo.. no pasó nada más.. luego platicamos un ratito mientras lo llevé a donde tomaría su transporte que es en una avenida cerca de casa...
Esa vez, cuando lo conocí, el OM no me agradó físicamente, a mi siempre me han gustado altos, y él no lo es.. y bueno en ese momento nuestra relación era solo amistad... jamás creí que me iba a involucrar sentimentalmente, aún sin que me atrayera físicamente...

Ya me desvié del tema, bueno en la charla de ayer con mi esposo, yo estaba triste, decepcionada y comienzo a pensar que quizá lo nuestro no va a poder seguir, es muy duro darse cuenta uno... y bueno quizá sea tiempo el que mi esposo necesita para ir aceptando algo que no puede cambiar, mi EA.. y aprender de eso,, aprender a manejar la ira. No me creyó y se levantó y se fue a encerrar al cuarto donde ahora "vive"
Es horrible, estar en casa y él encerrado en si mismo...cierto que compró un libro sobre algo de las relaciones por internet, (creo) y ahora a veces creo que se deja llevar demasiado por lo que lee y seguro que ahí dice que esas relaciones necesariamente significan otra cosa... pero no es asi, al menos no en mi caso..
Hoy en la mañana otra vez, él diciendo cosas de mi mamá, me las dice a mí, le dije tranquilamente, que mi mamá nos está ayudando pues esta semana yo tengo guardia en el trabajo y como él no puede cuidar a mi nena por que esta lesionado del cuello, pues nos ayuda y mucho..
Platiqué con mi mamá ayer,, le pedí que no comentara nada, y que trate de ser paciente,,, que mi esposo esta enfermo de ira, y cualquier cosa hace que estalle..
Le pido a Dios me de la fortaleza necesaria y la claridad mental para que las cosas que el me dice no laas guarde y después el amor que le tengo a mi esposo se convierta en temor, y/o indiferencia...

Ay Tear...me apena mucho por lo que pasa, pero tu esposo esta reaccionando normal. Como tu dices, es mejicano, y machista, y no puede aceptar lo que tu hicistes. Aunque el sepa en el fondo que le dices la verdad, no puede aceptar que hayas tenido que ver con el otro hombre. Mira, yo estuve ahi hacen casi dos anos, y mi caso fue mas fuerte que el tuyo, pues yo si llegue a una relacion fisica con el otro hombre. Ya mi esposo y yo llevamos casi dos anos y estamos casi 100% recuperados. El me perdono, y el tambien es latino!! El sabe que erre, que me equivoque. Desde luego los primeros meses, casi puedo decir un ano, fue bien dificil. Me peleaba, se ponia triste, iba de un extremo al otro. Perdio mucho peso al principio, se puso horrible de flaco, parecia que tenia cancer o algo asi.

Si tu sigues tratando y demostrandole que lo quieres y quieres salvar tu matrimonio,todo se va a arreglar entre ustedes. Pero tienen que ir a ayuda de matrimonio,consejeria. El necesita ayuda para su alcoholismo y quizas uso de drogas.

Lo que tu tienes de la tiroide,se llama hyportiroidismo. Te hace ganar peso, te cansas mas. Te estan dando algun tratamiento? Eso se cura muy facilmente, asi que busca ayuda para eso. Tu esposo te puede orientar sobre eso. Tu tambien puedes buscar informacion en la internet.

Bueno Tear....trata de tener paciencia con tu esposo. Trata de no provocarlo para nada. Pero como te dijo Gemela, no aceptes ningun golpe de el. si te vuelve a dar,llamas la policia, o te vas con tu mama y tu nena de la casa!!

Cuidate...Abrazos!!

Myrta

ME preguntó si tomaré mis vacaciones,, le dije que aún no lo sé.. además de que el esta furioso está delicado de su cuello y si me voy al menos sería una semana, y ahora no sé si lo mejor es estar "cerca" o darle más espacio e irme a mi ciudad natal..con mi nena.
NO sé que debo hacer...doy gracias a Dios por mi trabajo pues eso me esta distrayendo ahora...
Respecto a mi hipotiroidismo, subí como 15 kgs en pocos meses y ahora apesar de que estoy a dieta casi no bajo nada..Consulté otro médico y me mandó muchos estudios ya me loshice pero no sabe que tengo, según él mi problema no es la tiroides.. y por lo pronto no estoy tomando medicina..
A mi esposo le gustaba yo físicamente, y con lo gordita que me puse, yo sentía que ya no lo atraía físicamente... y ahí fue donde el OM comenzó a decirme cosas bonitas y yo me sentía bien, sentía que no dejaba de ser yo misma aunque tuviera muchos kgs de más.. Es frustrante esto, te cuidas mucho y no bajas, o bajas muy pero muy poquito... tuve que comprar ropa más grande.. pero bueno al menos sé que algo anda mal en mi organismo y no que es falta de voluntad o algo así.

gracias por leerme y aconsejarme..
Y no se preocupen, siempre he sido una mujer "brava" y en algunas ocasiones antes de todo esto, mi esposo había intentado pegarme, pero yo le respondía que no me iba a dejar y lo pensaba mejor..
Ahora le aclaré que no le voy a permitir golpes,, mi mamá dice que yo me lo busqué pues él está como loco, y que no debo contestarle y debo contenerme, yque por eso me busqué ese golpe... cierto que debo ser prudente pero no hay pretexto y no se vale que alguien con más fuerza y sin que tu hayas agredido primero te pegue.. siempre he pensado que eso es cobardía... y que muchas veecs los hombres golpeadores lo son porque las mujeres lo permiten o es demasiado el temor que les tienen...Yo no lo voy a permitir..y es irónico pero tuvo que pasar eso para que se abriera un poco a platicar.. pero ni modo que necesite que eso pase para ir platicando? NO..
SIempre dije que el día que el me pegara, ese mismo día me iba con mi hija muy lejos... y no lo hice porque lo amo. y bueno esta fuera de sí. se equivocó, pero NUNCA MAS..lo permitiré.

Lágrima:

El "d-day" es muy reciente y eso explica su ira y comportamiento.

Lágrima; os digo sin ninguna duda que no hay golpe mas grande para um hombre que la infidelidad. Dicen los expertos y varios libros que muchos prefieren el dolor de perder a un ser querido-----así de terrible es el dolor que siente tu esposo.

Todo lo que sabía de tí ya no existe. Es posible que tu hayas sido la plataforma en la cual él se apoyaba como hombre----eso tambien se esfumó. Nosotros los hombres dejamos de ser hombres cuando nuestra esposa prefiere a otro--------así es nuestra condición.

Lo único que me ayudó en esos momentos tan amrgos fué el tener sexo con mi esposa. Era una especie de recuperación en la cual reclamaba lo que era mi territorio. Para mí no había mas nada mas importante que tener sexo a diario. Esa fué la única manera de sentirme aceptado como hombre y esposo.

Te aconsejo que trates de acercarte fisicamente a ver si pueden tener relaciones. Quizás esto calme su ira.

Buena suerte

CIAO!

Stan,

He tratado de acercarme, pero él no quiere no me quiere cerca de él, no puedo tocarlo, ...y es muy violento ahora..
Dos días después del D day, en mi afán de que no tomara, me terminé su botella de alcohol, y ya borracha le pedí un beso, y como estaba borracha por primera vez en mi vida, aceptó y me dejó besarlo, y ya,, lo hizo por que yo estaba borracha y soy terca..

Tengo miedo Stan pero trataré de acercarme aunque no tengamos relaciones..al menos tomarle la mano.. para sentirnos..

El dice que me odia, asi que no creo que quiera tener relaciones conmigo, de hecho me dijo que quería ir a un lugar a comprar una hora con alguna mujer... afortunadamente no lo hizo...

Tear--Parece que lo que te hizo acercarte al Otro Hombre fue tu autoestima. El ganar peso te a puesto insegura de tu atractivo fisico. Y como tu esposo no te miraba ,ni te buscaba mucho <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />. El otro hombre se dio cuenta de eso, y por eso supo que decirte, pues eso era lo que tu necesitabas en ese momento. Alguien que te echara piropos y te prestara atencion. Le has dicho esto a tu esposo? Le has dicho que el te hacia sentir poco atractiva, no deseada por el. Los hombres a veces no se dan cuenta que a las mujeres les gusta ser deseadas y mimadas todo el tiempo <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Bueno, carnalita, me alegro que seas una mujer brava,con agallas. NO debes tampoco amendrarte con tu esposo. Pues los hombres abusadores toman fuerzas con mujeres debiles. Se firme, y dile que el a ti no te toca, o lo mandas a la chi.....!! <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" /> Hmm. el yo ver telenovelas de Mejico a hecho que yo aprenda algunas palabras de ustedes.... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Me imagino que tu mama esta chapada a la antigua y cree que tu mereces los golpes. Pero no, nunca una mujer merece ningun golpe de un hombre. Es para cobardes, como tu dices. Dicelo asi a tu mami.

Haz como te dice Stanley,(mi esposo) y trata de buscar a tu esposo en la cama. Eso lo podria acercar a ti, a los hombres siempre les gusta eso. Como el te dijo, el queria todos los dias hacerlo conmigo,recien DD. Eso lo ayudo mucho <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Bueno Tear,,espero hasta que tu escribas.

Hasta lueguito!!

Myrta

Myrta,

Si, desde antes del EA, platicaba con mi esposo pues ya no teníamos relaciones sexuales, o eran muy pocas.. Primero solo dos o tres al mes, luego ni eso.. Y digo ambos tenemos 33 años, no era normal, eso era signo de que algo andaba mal...
Su razón era cansancio, y yo sola permití que todo eso me afectara demasiado enmi autoestima.
Ahora igual, ya le comenté a mi esposo sobre eso, el porque el OM pudo interesarme a pesar de mis valores morales.
A mi mamá le dije claramente que NADIE debe agredir físicamente, no se justifica, y si efectivametne su forma de pensar es antigua...
Muchas veces cuando teniamos problemas antes del EA, buscaba intimidad con mi esposo, y él decía que solo así podía yo mostrar mi cariño, no le gustaba eso..
Lo irónico es que las cosas iban mejorando en ese punto, antes de que el descubriera el EA.. Ya teníamos con más frecuencia y todo excelente en la cama.. Es un punto importante en una pareja...y bueno ojalá mi esposo algun día se de cuenta de que a pesar de mi terrible error lo amo muchísimo..
ANtes cuando el me rechazaba para tener sexo, (por cansancio decía) yo me sentía terriblemente mal, me sentía no deseada, y cosas asi.. ahora sé que posiblemente me rechace pero no por eso valgo menos no?

Bueno, me permitió darle un abrazo y nada más... no quiso tener relaciones conmigo, es muy duro para mí eso y no niego que me duele y me enoja también... Y bueno cuando el quiera quizá sea demasiado tarde, y yo tampoco voy a querer...

Tear---perdona que no te habia contestado..Se me paso que te tenia que contestar. De todas formas,,,me apena mucho que tu esposo te rechazo. pero por lo menos te abrazo? Da pasitos pequenos,poco a poco con el, hasta que vuelva a tenerte confianza como su esposa, su mujer. El esta herido, y esta como ciego a todo. No pierdas las esperanzas. Me parece que tu todavia lo quieres mucho, y quieres echarle muchas ganas a tu matrimonio. NO te des por vencida todavia,Tear.

Fue muy mala jugada, que tu esposo encontrara tus comunicacinoes con el otro hombre, cuando tu y el estaban llevandose tan bien, teniendo sexo con mas frecuencia. Pero todo tiene su explicacion, no se, quizas esto tenia que pasar, pues quizas te podia pasar de nuevo con otro hombre, si tu esposo no sabia. Me entiendes? El tenia que darse cuenta que tu te encontrabas con tu auto estima baja, que estabas sedienta de atencion y mimos de el.

Cuidate!!

Myrta

tuve una charla con él ayer por la noche, dijo que me odia tanto como me llegó a a amar alguna vez, que soy lo peor para él..

Yo le dije, no soy lo peor y ojalá algún día te des cuenta,, acepto mi error y quiero seguir con nuestra familia con ayuda profesional para evitar problemas...

Su actitud es tan dificil, hoy a pesar de que el médico le dijo que no debe manejar, que debe cuidarse y estar en reposo, me pidió mi auto para ir a ver a un paciente...Le dije, porque no te cuidas al menos hasta el lunes? y se molestó... Digo ya está grande y debe cuidarse el mismo, pero no lo hace.. y todo le molesta...

Debido a su accidente, ahora seguramente pretende llevarse el auto que yo uso pues su lugar de trabajo está más lejos que el mio... Pero no toma en cuenta que me dejará a mí sin auto y nunca ha valorado cuando me preocupo por él. Es egoista y no se da cuenta...Le dije que llamara a la aseguradora para "apurar" para que nos entreguen el otro auto lo más pronto posible... Y me dijo: ahí está el número, habla tú si quieres.... Cómo es posible!!! cuando el era responsable por ese auto , y como el no va a andar en transporte publico todo el tiempo que se tarden en entregarnos el auto que el usa, pues no le apura...
No sé que debo hacer? platicarle esto que siento y pienso? seguro se enojará y me va a decir que me quede con mi auto,, o algo así..
Quizá nos convenga una separación física, al menos por un tiempo...

Ahhh! y también me comentó que que haría si él busca a otra mujer para tener un PA?

Supongo quiere vengarse....

Tear... tu esposo esta muy joven,muy enojado por lo que hicistes. Yo se que se le va a pasar. Pero tu tienes que tener mucha paciencia con el. Tear...ponte en la posicion de tu esposo, trata de imaginar, que encuentras correos electronicos de el con otra mujer, y que esa mujer le dice frases carinosas, de amor. Como te sentirias, como reaccionarias? Lo perdonarias rapidamente, o se te haria dificil?? MI esposo siempre me a tratado ensenar, que una SIEMPRE!! debe ponerse en la posicion de la otra persona. Tratar de sentir" lo que la otra piensa o siente.

Es muy dificil para un hombre, y mas que nada un mejicano machista sobreponerse a eso!!

Myrta

Cuánto tiempo? cuánto tiempo debo tolerar y ser paciente? él solo se encierra en otro cuarto de la casa, no come nada de lo que hay en casa, sale a comprar su comida...
Hay mucha tensión y le digo que hasta nuestra mascota le tocó su ira... me molesta la gente que abusa de los más débiles... y aunque sea un animal... es cachorro y también siente...

No sé a veces creo que quizá por más que yo quiera, su ego y orgullo es demasiado... y si no quiere ayuda... los problemas seguirán...

Se molestó porque le dije que si se volvía alcoholico, yo no viviría con él... de niña viví el alcoholismo de mi padre, no quiero vivir eso otra vez... y menos que mi hija lo viva..

No sé,

I am in the opposite situation. I would be like your husband. I discovered my wife having an EA with another person were plans were initiated by her to have a PA. She is on a business trip now which was the trip were the PA was going to start. I don't know if she will follow through but she did say she wants to remain friends with the guy and have dinner with him. We have been married ten years have 6 and 3 year old both of us are professionals and we have a comfortable living. When I found out about A four weeks ago I imidiatley forgave het for what had happened because I had read HIS needs Hers needs and I understood how we got to this point. I have been treating her with respect, love admiration and being very positive. Yeasterday for the first time I requested no contact with the person and she became very defensive and said I am pushing her away. She asked that I not call her for the rest of her business trip only to speak with kids. She says I am a great husband and a loving father but she needs to sorth things out in her head. If I waould have taken a firm stance from the beginning I wonder if she would have put this A to rest back when I found out. Over the past four weeks things seem to get better she has been talking about future vacations. When I bring up topics about our future two years from now and the goals we can accomplish as a family she says she cannot project that far and I am selfish because all I want is to be married. This is confusing for me

Tear...porque no le preguntas a tu esposo. "Tu quieres que yo me vaya, quires el divorcio?" A ver que te dice. Quizas el despierte de su confusion. Y dile que el que el tenga una relacion por venganza no va a solucionar NADA. simplemente todo se va a complicar mas. Ese es uno de los errores mas horribles que podria cometer. Se que te sientes frustrada porque no ves mejora, pero Tear, hace muy poco tiempo.

Ten fuerza!!

Myrta

Hello gomez..
Well, I have learned about all that marriage is difficult. A relatiohship needs love deposit, care, atention, etc...
In my case Im "guilty" about this EA,even we had troubles before, is not a justify about lie to a person that I promise to live for the rest of my life.. Even his caracter, and our distance, I accept my error, so, I need to user all my tolerance, and love in order to deal with his bad humor, his rud words, his screams, his hangovers, and yesterday he doesnt want to make love.. for me that was hard, my selfsteem is not so good, and I told him that when heis going to ask for it, Im going to say him no..
He hit me on my face, threee days ago, I love him, believe me, even my EA, I love my H, but Im not going to accept violence, and I told him.. If he hit me again, Im going to leave house, or ask him to leave it..
Main idea is that even all love that you can feel about your wife.. You are a person that have feelings, and that you (sorry I dont know how to express this in english) you worth a lot, you are a person who loves, but this is not enough to supoort everything..
I think you W is still in a fabulous dream, a fantasy, she is blind right now.. She needs to realize that OM is just that, a fantasy, and Im sure OM is not perfect, but she is looking him as he was a perfect, his soulmate, etc.. She is in a error.. and she needs to realize all this.. Why a good man can be involved with a married woman? is not a good man. He wants something more, and a married woman can offer several things without compromise, without any responsability...
I think you should ask for help, try to be with you main clear, you cannot live with the feeling that she is going something wrong, or that she is having a PA... At the end, of all this, everyone is going to have all that they deserve... I know that we cant help someone that doesnt want any help..
Try to have a limit, if in some time everything is equal, then, you with your main clear, take a desicion..
Look for personal help, in order to be quiet.
Good look, and keep posting this site.. for me is my best way right now to be more quiet.

GRacias Myrta por tus lineas...

Lágrima:

Los primeros días son terribles. Si tu esposo no quiere hacer el amor eso tambien es normal. Como dije---eso de tener relaciones (hysterical bonding) luego de d-day no le pasa a todo el mundo. Otros sienten repulsión por las relaciones.

Uno cosa debes entender-------tu esposo te ama profundamente. Si no te amara no se sentiría tan mal. Esa locura y esa ira son símbolos de su amor por tí. Es dificil de entender, pero sé que te ama.

Explicale claramente porqué le prestaste atención a OH. Dile que (aunque sea mentira de tu parte) el OH no es nada. En estos momentos tu esposo tiene la auto estima en el piso. En estos momentos él cree que no es lo suficiente hombre para tí. Te imcumbe darle todo el apoyo que puedas y decirle que como hombre él vale mucho mas que el OH. No se te ocurra defender al OH si tu esposo lo insulta. Como dije-----miente si tienes que mentir y disminuye al OH lo mas que puedas. Una cosa que atrasó mi recuperación fué que mi esposa jamás aceptaba palabras negativas hacia el OH. Entiendo que al rebajar la calidad del OH te sientes peor pero lo debes hacer para el bien de tu esposo.


Dejame saber como te resulta esto

CIAO!

Muchas gracias Stan, hoy me puse falda, a mi esposo le gustan mucho mis piernas, y después de una breve charla donde me hizo ver que no significa que me rechace sino que áún no esta listo para la intimidad. Y me dijo, "hoy te ves muy bien, me gustan tus piernas" eso me gustó muchísimo.. quería abrazarlo y besarlo, pero no puedo, no aún.
EN efecto tienes razón Stan, al principio yo decía que OM era bueno conmigo, que era un caballero, y mi esposo se ponía más furioso...ahora que veo todo con más claridad, veo que las intenciones del OM conmigo no eran tan desinteresadas, ¿que esperaba con una mujer casada?, si tanto le interesaba yo, porque no me dejó en paz, si sabía cuanto amo a mi esposo... OM sabía que yo era vulnerable, sabia lo que yo necesitaba de mi esposo, y él me lo daba.. era injusto eso.. yo sé poco de él.. y bueno entendí que yo estaba equivocada...no fui una víctima solo me equivoqué por que estaba muy mal emocionalmente.
OM dijo tener 34 años, y ser soltero, ahora entiendo porque esta solo...un hombre así no vale la pena ni pensar en él.. y gracias a Dios mi EA solo se quedó ahí y solo hubo un beso... he leido casos acá donde las mujeres creen estar enamoradas y/o obsesionadas con el OM.. gracias a Dios que no es mi caso. Me siento bien, en ese aspecto, no siento nada por el OM, yo creí sus palabras y ahora sé que no era sincero.. y sabes? valoro más a mi esposo. Lo dañé enormememnte y haré todo loq ue eseté de mi parte para recuperarlo y que me ame igual o más que antes..
Hay días malos y buenos, y solo ha pasado una semana, necesito ayuda profesional para trabajar en mi autoestima, y en mis enojos, resentimientos, etc... pero amo a mi esposo con toda mi alma, espero me de la oportunidad de demostrarselo..

Gracias por sus lineas a todos...

Acá andaré desahogando mis sentimientos y apoyando a quien mi experiencia le sirva....

"El todo es mayor que la suma de sus partes"

Lágrima:

Tu esposo no sabe que tiene una gran mujer por esposa. Enseñale lo que es un verdadero "affair" con relaciones sexuales para que vea lo afortunado que es en tenerte como esposa.

Ese beso lo destroza---te lo aseguro. No es cosa de machismo----nosotros medimos nuestra hombría a base de tener una mujer fiel. Dale apoyo y trata de seducirlo, pues tarde o temprano se va a interesar sexualmente. Aprovecha esto para tener una nueva luna de miel.

Por naturaleza los OH son hombres que tienen la abilidad de reconocer mujeres que desean atención. Eso no es nada malo, pero la maldad está en la idea de enamorar una mujer casada. Eso demuestra una calidad muy baja de ser humano. A tí no te culpo pues estabas hambrienta por atención. En ese sentido cualquiera puede caer.

Aprovecha esta situación para que tengas el matrimonio que siempre deseaste!

CIAO!

Hi,

Yesterday I wrote a letter to my H, just in case I couldnt speakt with him...Fortunatly I could speak with him, and i told him how much I love him, and I focus in positive aspects about this days. He stopped to drink since day he hit me.. (he wasnt drunk) even this I appreciate a lot that he is reading a book about how to love with open eyes, and I appreciate also that he is starting to speak, to ask me somethings about EA, and Im very possitive about this. Its a new begining...I love him a lot, now I realize how lucky am I to have him as H.
I need to be patient, and lovely, (as much as I can, because he doesnt want any physicll contact) he needs time...

He is going to start to work again next sunday I hope the rutine doesnt affect us, as it use to do it..

I want to look for professional help.

I dont know at what time im going to visit conseul I need to organize my schedule..

thanks for all your lines.

Tear!! Que bueno que estas viendo algun tipo de progreso con tu esposo. Aunque parezca minimo es algo, no?

Esta siempre bonita y atractiva para el. A los hombres les gusta que sus esposas esten lindas para ellos. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

Bueno, hoy ese otro dia triste..
Mi esposo tiene una boda de su mejor amigo mañana, fiesta a la cual iríamos juntos, pero luego de que descubrió mi A, pues ya no estoy invitada..
Lo acompañé a comprar el regalo, yo lo escogí, y lo envolví, le inclui una nota de felicitación y ni siquiera las gracias me dió.
Mi H piensa que nuestra relación jamás será igual, y lo ve todo pesimista.. Para él soy lo peor... y toda la culpa es total y exclusivamente mía..
Le dije que me siento sola, que lo necesito, su apoyo, dijo que le diga de una vez si no voy a soportar esto para que tome una desición.. Al decirle lo sola que me siento comencé a llorar, y COMO SIEMPRE no dice nada, NADA,,, bueno hoy me dijo sal de aca no quiero verte .. ya enojado...y le dije, te necesito, me siento sola,,,, y me dijo:anda ve y hablale al OM...!!!!
NO entiendo, puede mas su orgullo, y no acepta que un A es resultado de que las cosas andan mal entre los dos... por culpa de AMBOS.. y no es una justificante.. sé que lo que hice estuvo mal, sé que jamás lo hice premeditadamente.. pero es algo que no puedo cambiar..
Conociendo a mi esposo, puede pasar MUUUUUUUCHOOOO tiempo y seguiremos igual...
Estoy desesperada,,, no se que hacer, quisisera ir y decirle que me demuestre de alguna manera que me ama... y si no lo hace entonces irme o que se vaya el.
Necesito ayuda y si no le puedo tener de mi esposo entonces???

BUeno, estuvo a punto de pegarme y de no ser porque me puse brava,lo hubiera hecho, sabe que si me vuelve a tocar, entonces nos separamos...No voy a permitir que me pegue otra vez...
Me gritó, y cuando más lo necesito me grita..

No quiero que se lleve el coche a la boda de su amigo pues seguro que va a tomar...

Tuve que hacer unas cosas del trabajo y por eso sali del cuarto donde se encuentra y él se encerró con llave...

¡qué cosa es peor vivir juntos haciendonos daño? o estar separados????

Me da tanta rabia que gane su orgullo que el supuesto amor que me tiene... y todavía me manda con el OM!!!!

Estoy enojada... mi EA solo fue eso un EA.. y su comportamieto es como si fuera un PA o algo peor.. El lo descubrio cuando yo ya lo había terminado y nada NADA de lo positivo que hice el lo nota...

Me llama egoista, dice que esta de luto y que no quiere nada de mi...

Quiza no me ama,, y solo esta conmigo por mi hija o no se.

Tear, lamento que la situacion este tan tensa.

Tienes ue tenerle paciencia. La traicion del ser querido es una de las peores experiencias que uno puede sufrir. Tu esposo necesita tiempo.

Mientras tanto creo que tu debes mostrarle humildemente que lo amas y que te arrepientes porque has comprendido que lo has traicionado a el y te has traicionado a ti misma.

Manten un perfil bajo.

trata de calmarte. Los enfrentamientos no ayudan.

te deseo lo mejor

Hola
No dormí nada, discutimos horrible, gritos, y estuvo a punto de pegaarme nuevamente...yo tomé un mazo de la cocina y de no haber sido por eso él me pegaba..mi H sabia que yo me iba a defender...
Cruzamos la linea del respeto y siento que ahora él cree tener el derecho de pegarme cuando esta furioso..
Desde antes del EA, teníamos fuertes discusiones, siempre yo pidiendo atención, cariño y él pensando que yo solo hago reclamos y enojándose siempre...
Ayer dijo que hoy se irá de la casa.. yo le dije pues "que te vaya bien"
Hoy tiene una fiesta, una boda y no deja´re que se lleve el auto, pues la ultima vez que manejó cochó con el otro auto.. Temo que hoy tome mucho alcohol y luego maneje y se estrelle otra vez.
Supongo la separación física, será lo mejor ahora, para la tranquilidad de todos.
Sera su responsabilidad sus actos, ya me ha dicho que en caso de que se vaya, va a tomar, drogarse e incluso buscar mujeres.. Y yo tengo la culpa de todo,..
Lo amo mucho, pero estoy desesperada...
Sera lo que Dios quiera..

This is a nightmare, today he almost hit me again, because I denied car's key.. I refused to give him because, he is so violent, and angry that he is going to crash again (now with other car)
He saw me with hate... His eyes, were son full of hate.. He though and kick a chair tha was next to me.. He was screaming to me...
I couldnt give him the car, because his secure...
Maybe my M is going to failed... and died... My H became a violent man, not just phsysically, also, with bad words. Blame for all... Maybe my low selfsteem is not because of my gain weight...
Im worry because my baby loves her father... I always believe in marriage for all life.. Now I realize that not always works.

tear,

Violence is never justified. Where can you go to report this incident? This is domestic violence. Big time.

Go immediately.

L.

He returned from the party, he got out in night, I was worry about him... he returned very late...He doesnt speak to me...
I spoke with his mother about all this even he prohibit to do that.. I thought that his mom, should now that he is having lot emotional, troubles...
When he discover that I called his mom, he is going to be furious, maybe violent...
I realize that I have to be quiet,and inteligent, in order to avoid a fight..
Im scare,

tear,

Is your husband continuing to drink alcohol? This is something he will have to stop. Alcohol affects people differently but it is definitely mood-altering and might be a root of a lot of your husband's anger. He needs to stop drinking to get to his "right mind". He might still be angry but it will be healthier anger. Right now, if he is drinking, I don't think his anger is serving him any benefit (i.e. dealing with grief).

Regarding the EA or PA, as a BS myself, I suggest you don't congratulate yourself too much for that one. Betrayal is betrayal regardless of how far it goes so the fact that it did not advance to a PA doesn't change that much of your situation. I am sorry if that sounds harsh but I don't mean it to be.

Your husband needs time to absorb this. Your Dday was 10 days ago? Maybe two more weeks minimum before there is any chance he will start to see things "differently". Please be safe, be patient and stay out of the way. If you get angry, come here and vent. Don't express that anger to your husband. Things will change but they take time.

Hi,
NO he doesnt drink alcohol, since the day that he hit me..
Even without be drunk, his behaviour is like a drunk, he starts scream, he want to hit, even our pet had received some kicks..
He became a violent man, Im going to find police phone, just in case...
Today I made him his breakfast, he always take it to his work. But today, he didnt.. I let it inside car.. But IM afraid he is going to through out to the garbage..
Even , he crashed car that he used to drive.. Im the onee that I need to use public transportation, because he is driving car that I use to drive... And he called me selfish!!
I need to do several things, Im closer than he, of my office, but I dont know why he called me selfish....
Im angry with him, as he is going to use "my" car, he is not hurry in get "his" car..
Thanks to everyone here in read this and suggest me...
It helps me...

traicionado

Yes, Im responsable, for my EA. Im not justify myself.. Im not proud about it..I know I need to put more "deposit love" in our bank love..And show my H that I really love him..
But, do you think this is a reason to use violence? and not just with bad words?,
We have had troubles since 2 years ago.. and this EA was like the last thing..
My EA last one month more or less, even my frienship with OM last two or three months before we got "close".. I mean, before, I felt something more than a frienship... I realize that I was confused about OM, I didnt know him, I met him ONLINE!!! and he was inteligent in cheers me up, he was my confident, my support..
Anyway I think OM doesnt deserve even one word here..
My H was a good man..now Im facing a violent, rude man..

Tear,

Ok, tu, como yo somos resposables por lo que hicimos, pero no puedes seguir con alguien que te esta tratando de esa forma,
Le has preguntado si quiere que te vayas o quier que te quedes?
En mi caso mi esposo quiere que me quede, pero puede que no sea lo mismo en tu situacion.
Otra cosa que temo es que te quite a la nena, nosotras llevamos todas de perder, porque fuimos nosotras quienes cometimos este error, que ahora estamos pagando, ese es mi miedo con traicionado, aunque el dice que no me las quitara, pero eso es solo de dientes para afuera, aparte mis hijas no tienen pasaportes mexicanos, asi que peor tantito. Ten mucho cuidado con eso, sigue escribiendo.
Animo, Gemela.

Gracias gemela, pienso lo mismo,, me aterra el hecho de que mi esposo jamás acepte que necesita ayuda.. No podremos resolver nuestras diferencias con violencia o insultos...
No he tenido contacto alguno con el OM,, eso es historia, asi que no hay riesgo de que mi esposo quisiera comprobarme algo del EA.. no cuenta más que con una impresión de un email... que además no prueba nada,, de todos modos, no creo que él quiera cuidar solo a su nena,,, siempre está muy ocupado asi que no podría ver por ella..
Ya le pregunté sobre si quiere que me vaya,, no dijo nada,,,
Pasan los días y él sigue igual de enojado...no sé que hacer, que decir o no decir, , TODO es usado en mi contra...
HAblé con mi suegra a pesar de que mi H no quería, me lo prohibió, pero dados los grandes problemas que hemos tenido, pensé que su mamá debía saber lo que pasa, TODO, para que esté preparada por si su hijo hace alguna locura... además así también seremos más personas rezando por que mi esposo se calme y se cuide..
´GEMELA???? tuviste insomnio durante los días (semanas)posteriores al D day?
NO he podido dormir,,, y no puedo rendir en mi trabajo igual...

Gracias paisana por escribirme... y que tal vas tu?
Valora lo que tienes paisa...y se lo más objetiva que puedas..

Me siento tan sola!!!!
HE estado escuchando musica romántica y todo me recuerda lo hermoso que tenía con mi esposo, y por mi culpa, lo eché a perder..quizá nunca me lo perdone..
Lloro a escondidas de mi esposo pues se que le molestan mis lágrimas, dice que eso hubiera pensado ANTES del A...
SOy humana y me sorprende cuan estupida fui...
Supongo tengo un serio problema, a veces necesito de alguien más como soporte y confidente...
Merezco todo esto cierto?
La luz en esta pesadilla es mi nena,,, por ella debo soportar todo y mantenerme de pie...
OM en su momento era mi confidente,, ahora estoy completamente SOLA... de no ser por este sitio,, quizá yo misma estaría tomando alcohol para engañarme a mi misma y sentirme un poco mejor...

Gracias a Dios por este sitio y por todos los que escriben acá.

tear,

Lo siento mucho. Acuérdate que no estás sola. Tienes amigos aquí. No sé si tu esposo te perdonará o no pero hay de esperar un tantito más como ya te he dicho. Sin embargo, si te sientes así, sigue escribiéndolo y te escuchamos.



Esto es cierto pero a la vez no tiene sentido y es la parte que tu esposo aun no puede captar. Obviamente no lo habrías hecho si hubieses podido ver el resultado.



¿Lo has dicho a tu esposo?



Si y no. Todos somos responsables por nuestras acciones. En ese sentido te contesto que sí - lo mereces. Pero es una respuesta demasiado sencilla. En este caso, tus acciones han afectado, por lo menos, tres personas más - tu esposo, tu nena y el OM. ¿Eres responsable por lo que hace tu esposo ahorita? Te digo que no. Tu fuiste la raíz pero ahora sus acciones son suyos.

Solamente puedes intentar a componer las cosas que son dentro de tu alcanze. No eres responsable por componer a tu esposo. El solo lo tendrá que hacer. Lo puedes intentar a ayudar pero nada más. Puedes tener paciencia con él. Lo puedes consolar. Puedes ser transparente con todo. Puedes aguantar lo que tienes que aguantar (excepto la violencia)para que tu esposo tenga el tiempo que sea necesario.

De mi punto de vista o, por lo menos en base de mi caso, tu esposo necesitará unos tres meses para poder salir del estado en que se encuentra ahorita y mucho más para recuperar el matrimonio.

Why is it that a couple can survive an affair and successfully recover a marriage? I am betting that nobody - shortly after Dday - is willing to make that effort. Everybody believes their marriage is over and done - dead. They want to and need to grieve that loss. But, after a time, some people "change their mind" and decide to give the marriage a try. What has changed? The WS has not changed or gotten "better" in the eyes of the BS. In fact, the WS appears worse to the eyes of the BS. So what has changed that will cause a BS to want to try to recover the marriage? The BS himself/herself has changed. That is what is different. The BS has grieved the loss, learned to cope with what is totally unacceptable, realized that the love that was there has never gone. The BS has learned to see the WS in a different light and still find that WS the right choice. Whether your husband can ever do that or not - only time will tell. But that is the key - time. Be patient.

Muchas gracias por tus lineas traicionado...
¿cómo cambiar sin dejar de ser uno mismo? ayer platiqué con mi esposo. Sigue furioso por lo que pasó el domingo cuando no le presté la llave del auto.. Me preguntó si había algo más que el debía saber... y decidí decirle que le había confesado todo a su mamá, a pesar de que él me lo había prohibido... Cierto que respeté su prohibición una semana, pero al ver que mi esposo estaba tan mal, temí que hiciera alguna tontería y consideré necesario avisarle a su mamá... Para que rezara por él (al igual que yo estoy haciendolo)
No entiendo porque no quería que su madre supiera todo... yo soy madre y me preocuparía mucho si mi hija tuviera pensamientos de suicidio..y se sintiera sola sin querer recibir ayuda de nadie...
Entiendo que solo él mismo puede ayudarse y Dios.. Mi esposo no es muy creyente,.. aunque ayer me recordó mi promesa que le hice en el altar "prometo serte fiel, en lo prospero y en lo adverso.. en la salud y en la enfermedad...." acepto que fallé, me equivoqué y pedí perdón...
Mi esposo, solo ha hablado con un amigo sobre esto.. Supongo le da vergUenza decir " mi esposa me engañó"" . Es algo vergonzoso y sobre todo para el infiel.. Se te ve como una basura inmunda... que traicionaste todo por algo que no valía la pena...
Bueno, creo que nuevamente le resté depositos a mi bando del amor de mi matrimonio...
Por eso mi pregunta... debo dejar de lado mi manera de pensar y hacer solo lo que mi esposo quiera? para que me perdone y me de una oportunidad? ... el decirle a su madre fue porque yo así lo decidí, creí que debía saber por si él hacia alguna tontería...
Te come´nté que quería morirse, e incluso se sacó sangre? , rompió unas botellas, se cortó... en fin... por eso no le dí la llave del coche... pero él no lo entiende....
Ayer le arreglé su ropa, al menos un poco y quiero seguir intentando ganar depositos en nuestro banco de amor...
Sucede que no sé que cosas haría que se den esos depositos...6 años de casados y no sé que hace feliz a mi esposo...!!!!!

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

tear,

I won't say whether to talk to his mother or not. I will ask gemela to read and post to you today because she might know better.

People do change or grow. Let's say, for example, my father dies. At first I am going to find it hard to believe he is gone. Then I might go through some other stages and then I will get depressed. This depression can last a long time but eventually I will accept it and get on with life. Your husband cannot and will not stay like this forever. He will "change". You are just expecting miracles in a very short time. He needs time. The longer you two stay together, the better your chances of remaining together.

I thought your hsuband was a doctor? If he really wanted to kill himself, I am sure he would have already done it. He certainly has the knowledge. He is in great pain. He wants help but does not know how to ask for it. He is begging for help. That is why he is doing these things. He has to talk to someone. He needs professional help.

It is embarassing. I am sure he doesn't want people to know because he feels like a complete failure. Mexican women do not have affairs. It is just not acceptable in your culture. Don't get me wrong - it is not acceptable anywhere but in Mexico it is 1000 worse.

Okay gemela justed walked in so I am going to log out and give you over to her.

Amiga,

Tienes que ser muy fuerte, los hechos acaban de pasar y tu esposo esta destrozado, al igual que el mio. Amiga, las primeras semanas son un infierno, yo como tu, tambien pase por lo mismo. Y tube que ser muy humilde, dejar de ser la que antes, el sol no brillaba mas para mi y no sabia que hacer para tener contenta a mi esposo, me desvivia por atenciones, por la comida, la casa, que no le faltara nada, y cuando se enojaba, lo unico que podia hacer era, callarme, bajar la cabeza y aceptar sus insultos, pues me dijo hasta de lo que no!! afortunadamente no llegamos a los golpes.
Tambien quiero decirte, que tubiste muchas agallas en decirle a su mama lo que estaba pasando y lo que podia intentar su hijo. No quiero pensarlo, pero si le llagara a pasar algo a tu esposo, ella te va a apuntar con el dedo, tu sabes!! En mi caso, yo estaba en USA, visitando mis suegros, cuando mi esposo se entero y sintiendose decesperado le hablo a su mama y le conto que yo estaba metida en un A. El resto de los dias en esa casa fueron horribles, aunque su mama no me dijo ni una sola palabra y no hablamos al respecto, yo no queria verla, me sentia tan avergonzada, queria morirme en ese momento.
Mi esposo, tambien queria suicidarse, pero penso, que si lo hacia, yo no podria cobrar los seguros de vida y con que hiba a alimentar a estas dos nenas, hasta en eso se puso a pensar, doy gracias a Dios que, si en ese momento no penso en mi, penso en sus dos hijas, mi esposo tiene un corazon muy grande!!!.
Amiga, yo tampoco podia dormir, antes y despues del A, tube que ir a una psquiatra, para que me dieran pastillas para dormir y antidepresivas, yo, rogaba a Dios que me mandara la muerte, tampoco queria seguir viviendo, fue horrible. Hubieron unos dias que no pegaba el ojo en toda la noche, la unica forma de poder dormir un poco era cuando me acostaba en el cuarto con mis hijas, pero mi esposo me levantaba a cualquier hora de la noche para "hablar". Te he dicho antes que me corrio de casa un monton de veces, y en mi caso, es salirme de la casa sin mis hijas, ya me dijo que las ninas no vienen conmigo, asi que eso me hacia rogarle que me diera una oportunidad mas.
Que bueno que no tienes contacto con el OH, yo hise muchas estupideces, no dejaba de tener contacto con el OH y siempre me cachaba mi esposo, pero estaba perdidamente enamorada del fulano, y aunque ya no tengo contacto con el, mis sentimientos siguen igual, pero, todos me han dicho que me va a tomar un poquito de tiempo hasta que se desaparescan, por eso, aunque en este momento no siento mucho por mi esposo, quiero seguir intentando.
Mira, nosotros estamos viendo una consejera matrimonial, en las platicas, han salido muchos "trapitos al sol", que mi esposo, no me platicaba, no yo a el, entonces, en una platica que tube a solas con la consejera, me dijo, que una persona llega a un A, por que han habido motivos anteriores, por que han habido problemas entre la pareja, y que toda la culpa no es de uno, en este caso "mia o tuya", que de no haber tenido problemas y de haber tenido un matrimonio contento, nada ni nadie nos habria empujado a tener un A. Asi que no te sientas tan culpable como crees, TODA la culpa no es de nosotras.
Yo tambien lloraba a solas, que no me viera mi esposo, por que me decia de todo y solo podia quedarme callada.
Tear, no estas sola, todos los que hemos pasado por esto, te entendemos, pero hay que ser muy fuertes y saber soportar, pero no los golpes!! tu no mereces esto, nadie lo merece, somo seres humanos y cometemos errores, esto sucede "hasta en las mejores familias".
Amiga, te voy hablar derecho, el milagrito, no te va a caer del cielo en este momento, te va a tomar un poquito de tiempo, mi esposo estaba igual que el tuyo y tubieron que pasar casi tres meses para que las cosas se medio enderezaran, pero no dejes de hecharle ganas, esta muy fresquesito y tu esposo no te va a decir en este momento, mi vida, mi amor, te amo. No va a suceder, pero tampoco tines que dejarte vencer, todavia no!!!
Me imagino que eres catolica? Tu, que vives en Cd de Mexico, ve a la Basilica de la Vigen de Guadalupe,"NO ESTOY YO AQUI, QUE SOY TU MADRE" ofrecele algo, rezale para que te ayude, dice Dios "Ayudate, que yo te ayudare". Tear, mira, mi mama es muy religiosa y en Diciembre que fuimos a pasar Navidad con ellos, me dio una oracion, se llama "Corderito manzo", no te la quiero mandar por medio de esto, porque a lo mejor mucha gente va a estar en desacuerdo conmigo,pero tu y yo somos mexicanas y mascamos del mismo lado!! asi que si tu quieres darme un email, donde te la pueda enviar.
Amiga, no te des por vencida, "todo en en esta vida tiene solucion, menos la muerte"
Arriba esos animos!!!
Arriba Mexico!!!
GEMELA.

Tks traicionado, for your lines...Now my mom returned to her house.. She was very worry about me,, because violence we have been dealing,, but thaks God, I understood that I need to be more patient, and carefull myself in order to avoid violence from my H.

Sometimes I think deep inside my H want to start talking, or start to forgive, and then... his proud, or whatever, stops him <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Im going to have a travel, because of work... I understand my H is going to think that I can have bad behaviour during the travel.. so I want to ask him to join with me to go to the travel..

I hope even he continues in his fog, sun, beaches, sea, can help him, and my daughter is going to have fun, and she deserves that..

I hope my H accept travel with me..

gemela, paisana,,
Gracias por tus lineas, el saber que no soy la única persona que ha hecho sufrir a quienes más ama, me hace sentir no tan culpable..y ser optimista.
Mi autoestima esta baja, y ahora que mi esposo esta tan enojado, muchas veces me dice cosas que he tratado de que no me afecten pero me afecta.. necesito ayuda profesional y pronto.
Por todo tengo temor de que el se enoje más...y obviamente por ahora no recibiré palabras de apoyo o de cariño de parte de mi esposo.. lo entiendo pero es muy duro...
Te confieso que le rogué por un abrazo aún con el temor de que se enojara estuve insistiendo hasta que por fin me lo dió y terminamos haciendo el amor....pero yo sentí que no era el mismo... como si estuviera ausente.. es tan doloroso, luego pense que se iba a enojar más, y me dijo que me ama, pero que el haber hecho el amor no iba a cambiar las cosas.. quizá se arrepintió de dejarse llevar..
el escucharlo decirme que me ama... me dió más animo para seguir luchando.
Mi EA no llego a PA y aún asi nuestra intimidad se afectó y mucho,,,, es un largo camino por recorrer cierto??
Ire a la iglesia a ver a la Virgen, para pedir fortaleza y serenidad..
Puedes enviarme la ora´ción a mi correo miromguz@yahoo.com
te lo agradezco mucho..
Sabes? tengo que aceptar que muchas veces necesito de alguien que me escuche... ahora no esta el OM, mi madre ya se regresó a su ciudad, asi que ayer me sentí sola, y llamé a una prima que es mi vecina y estuvimos platicando toda la tarde... me sentí muy bien.. te confieso que tuve la tentación de llamar a OM, pero dije que NO, que no merecía eso ese tipo y que no debo siquiera pensar en platicar con él, por mi bien y el de mi familia... asi que recorde que debo platicar con mujeres, y llamé a mi hermana que no encontré y luego a mi prima quien me escucho un buen rato..
Comprendo que debo trabajar en esa necesidad que el OM cubria en mi,,, para ser fuerte y mantenerme enfocada...Me pregunto si algun dia me llama el OM, debo ser fuerte y firme y decirle que me deje en paz.. bueno cada día que pasa me siento mejor y mas fuerte al respecto del OM...

Estamos en contacto paisanita....

Gracias por tomarte un tiempo y escribirme...de corazón gracias

Hi,
I feel terrible, Im depress, my H found another greeting card that I sent to OM.. My H was searching inside my laptop in order to find "something" and he did it..
Im not sure how there was a link, to the ecard.. and the ecard, was talking about kisses, hugs and stuff like that.. and the my H thinks the worst....
He got violent again, I was scared,, he throw me a little present that I gave him, days before.. present is small, but it has a little piece of wood, or something similar, and unaffortunately it hit my head..
He threated me and it was awful..
Then I Realizee that even I love him, its not my duty support everything... so I told him.. then he was more quiet and we could talk..
I started to eat a lot today, I feel bad, I feel scare!!!
I didnt sleep
Im at work but I dont want to work..

tear,

You need to protect yourself from the violence. It is good that you stood your ground. I was out for a few days and gemela made a mess of the PC so she has not posted. I will ask her to post to you today.

I read what you said about calling the OM. Please understand that there is nothing but misery for you in calling the OM. If you want to end your marriage, fine - get a divorce and run off and live with the OM. Is that really what you want? If not, stay as far away from the OM as possible. Not even one phone call.

Whatever need the OM fulfilled for you, you are missing right now. You said that you and your husband never talked and that you and OM did. You said you feel alone. Mexico City is a pretty big place. I am sure you can find people to talk to without having to resort to the OM. You are sounding weak right now and you need to be strong. The only person that is going to make this right is you and you are going to have to work hard.

Your husband needs time. You are doing okay with that. Why did he find an eCard on your laptop? Ask him to sit down with you and go through the hard disk top to bottom and find anything and everything and have him delete it. Better yet - sell your laptop and buy a new one. If I knew gemela had been carrying on her affair with a laptop, I would have destroyed it just like I did with the cellphone.

You are doing a lot of good things. Be patient. Keep being transparent with your husband. You cannot allow the violence however.

Stay away from the OM. All you are going to find there is divorce or worse.

tear,

Hablé con gemela y te va a contestar hoy. Que estés fuerte - lo puedes hacer.

Paisa,

Perdon por no haberte escrito antes, mi esposo salio de viaje desde el sabado y regreso a penas ayer y para colmo de males se me bloqueo la computadora en casa y no podia comunicarme con mi esposo para que me ayudara, en fin, ya tengo tu correo y te voy a mandar lo que te dije, animo amiga!!!

hi tear,

i know the pain and the guilt you feel, i have had an EA as well and my husband is still dealing with the effects of it. The situation is somewhat different from yours, as my husband and me are not living together, he is not interested in working on our marriage at the moment, he has issues that he wants to deal with on his own and i cant help him with that, because he dont want me to help him with them.

It worries me that your husband has become so abusive towards you, and i do hope you are ok, you havent posted here in a few days.

I guess he is letting his pain out in this anger, i am glad to hear that you were able to stop him and that you then were able to talk to him quietly. I hope to see you on this board again soon.

Thanks traicionado, and gemela.
Tracionado

I dont have any contact with OM. And believe me I dont go to call him. I dont want to know anything about him.
I know he wasnt so kind, is not guilty of this but, he help me to got involved, even he knews Im married.. well, he wasnt a friend..I was blind, I regret about my EA.

My H thinks I hide him something, something worst that my EA. Thanks why he is looking for something in my laptop and as he know my passwords he checked my new emails in my mails accounts..

I wish to he stop to do this in order to get cancelled those accounts, at least one.. The one that I created as a result of my hobbie to chat on line.. I wish a new beggining, but maybe is too early, right?

My husband is stubborn and he is test me, with information that I have in those accounts, he is "watching" all movement in those accounts.

But as In my office I use another email, my H thoughtts that I use email office for my "bad behaviour" or something.

Last weekend I went to a mall and he was at home.. he took me time,, and he was angry because I delayed too much...

I know I need to be patient, and his behaviour is a consecuence of my EA.. but is so difficult..
And worst is that I feel scare about his mood, about his reaction if Im not agree in something...

we have bad days, "good" days, and awful days.
HE still sleeps in another room.. My daughter ask "why?" and she is having bad behaviour, I think all this is starting to impact her..

She has 3 1/2 years old, but she ask "is daddy still angry?" , does he quiet now?, wheere is dady? "why he is sleeping in another room?"

I told her that, as daddy snors he decided to sleep in another room..
My daughter sleps in same room in his own bed, but same room as I.

My H doesnt want any food, he is losing weight,, I feel terrible.. but my depresion is different, I started to eat a lot, and then I feel more terrible.. fat and miserable...

daggi

Is terrible right? My H threated me about leave me several times.. HE didnt think in anything,,
He said that we arent together, and that he is at house just because or daughter..
He doesnt eat anything that I cooked, and he sleeps in another room..
I try to help him with his clothes (washing, ironing) but is not the same..
I think everything has an advantage and disadvantage,and if your H leaft home, maybe both have time for think and he can realize that even an A, a relationship can survive if both want it...
When he started to get violent, I wished to he leave home.. in order to he got quiet.
"If you love something, leave it free, if it returns its yours if not, never was it" or something similar...

Keep posting Daggi..

tear,

All those things your husband is doing remind me of me - checking everything, timing your visit to the mall. I will try to remember all the paranoid insane things I did and post back. You might get a laugh. What your husband is doing is typical for a BS shortly after Dday. It does go away. That is not so important. What is important is this:

I think the fact that your BH is doing all these things is good news for you. If he did not care, if he no longer loved you, if he no longer wanted to be married to you, he would not do those things. He is doing these irrational things because he is hurt and he is trying to cope with that hurt. He is searching for a way to rewire his brain so that he can find a way to trust you again. There is one serious error in his thinking and I did it too.

In his mind, trust is the most important thing and his first priority. He thinks he needs to trust you before he can think about the relationship. That is backwards. Eventually he will realize as I did that trust is the LAST thing that will happen. What he will have to learn is to work on the marriage before getting trust back. This is all very new to him but this is a normal (and unfortunate) stage for him to go through.

I read this post of yours and laughed because I saw me doing all those things with gemela. It was not funny back then but it is funny now. I know these things drive you crazy but it is really a good sign to me. Be patient. Don't try to make sense out of it. He will do things that seem really stupid just like I did. They are stupid - they just don't seem like it to him just like they did not seem stupid to me.

After a while of him not finding anything, he will get bored with it and stop. If I remember correctly I got angry after I stopped. That anger phase didn't last very long and then I went into a depression again. Then I started to get better.

I guess I just wanted to tell you that your husband is now reminding me of me and I got over it so maybe there is hope for you too. I will ask gemela to post back to you. Why don't you ask her about some of these things that are worrying you. I am sure her memory is far better than mine. I am glad I am blocking her posts. I would be way to ashamed of reading all the things she might tell you. I really is quite embarassing now.

I asked Daggi to read your thread because her husband is trying to hurt himself too. I saw some similarity between how her husband is acting and your husband. I thought she might be of some help to you.

I'll remind gemela to post today. I hope you are staying safe. Don't lose hope. Your husband is being "normal" (except for the violence).

Perdóname tear pero, de mi punto de vista, ese sentimiento es pura caca de toro.

If you love something, fight for it. I absolutely totally hate that stupid saying. Maybe it works on dogs and cats - I don't know. If you love your husband, don't give up. He can always make his choice and you can't control it but, until he does, don't give up the good fight.

Well tear it is lunch time so I am just trying to think of all the stupid things I did. I did happen to mention this to gemela this morning ans she just rolled her eyes. She knows exactly what I am talking about.

Let me see...hmm...At first I checked the mileage on the car before going to bed and again in the morning to see if she had snuck out while I was asleep. That went on for a while. Because her OM was a swimming instructor, she had taken up the practice of swimming laps every day (or so she says) but we made an agreement that she would only go after I got off work and we would swim laps together. So I used to go check all her swimsuits to see if any were wet (they sometimes were and we had huge fights) - I also smelled them to make sure it was chlorine water. I used to time her when she went to the store to see how long it would take. I used to search the house looking for things. I can't remember how many times I went through her shoeboxes (a favorite hiding place). Every once in a while I would find something. The birthday cards she had bought OM are a good example. Almost got divorced over those. She said they were for her father. You don't say things like that to your father! She finally confessed. Alot of it was "innocent" - for example, she had probably forgotten about the birthday cards because our housemaid is so bad about moving things around, they were not where they "should" have been. Gemela forgets about them and I find them. I was looking for something (legitimately) in her swim pack and found a cell phone - exactly like her cell phone that she had in Dubai. I opened it and found a local phone card in it. I asked her about it and she claimed it was a friend's phone - too coincidental. Turns out she was lying on that occasion. Again another big blow up. The fact is from your husband's perspective, you are guilty until proven innocent.

I look back now and realize how ridicules all that was but how, at the time, it seemed so terribly important. I was obsessed by it. I am sure gemela can remember much more than I can. The thing is, if I had not wanted so desperately to believe in the marriage and believe in gemela, I never would have done those things. Did you ever look up the five stages of grief? I found this via Orchid's signature:

5 stages of grief

Try to understand what your husband is going through. It is almost an insanity. I have been there - I know from experience. I could go from loving gemela to wanting to divorce her in an instant - just based on a random thought. I went from hope to despair a hundred times a day.

If your husband truly wanted to divorce you, one of the two of you would probably already be gone. Your husband is grieving his loss. That is all that is happening. He needs to grieve and he needs time to do it.

seems that men have a much different way of dealing with things than women. Just give him all the securities that he needs and more. He needs to fight his own "demons" about this. There is nothing you can do but to show him that you are honest and serious about the marriage.
Dont give up, when he does blow up, try to difuse the situation with calm words.
He isnt sure himself how he should handle the situation, it is still fairly fresh, and he has many emotions, i am sure.

Right now he feels like he doesnt want anything from you, like when he refuses to eat what you cook. He is telling himself that he is not together with you in that sense right now, but at the same time checks your laptop and everything. He is torn back and forth and he doesnt really know what to do, his feelings are on a rollercoaster.

Give him time, things will get better. Time is always on your side, until then, even though its hard. Try to be the best wife that you can, keep cooking for him, even if he doesnt eat it. Show him that he is important to you, comply with the things that he asks of you, as with the emails etc.

I do hope his temper has gone down and that you will be able to talk to him in a much better way.

Hi
traicionado, thanks for your lines..Im not agree with you about "If you love something, leave it free, if it returns its yours if not, never was it", maybe you think that this means than you sholdnt fight for things that you want or believe... I understand it different.. I thing sometimes, distance, can make your main, and thoughts clear, and sometimes if someone doesnt.. how do you say? valorar in english? when "te valoran como persona.. a veces solo puede darse cuando no estas ahí...." there is another line "nadie sabe lo que tiene hasta que lo ve perdido"...
Well, the main idea is that my H is living grief... and I need to be patient right?
Now he is "kidding" in a bad way, (burla) and he speak about OM referencing as "mi galan" , something that my idol,... and several times he made a laugh (se burla) and I dont like it, it hurts me... I dont know why, but OM isnt my idol or my man... so I dont like these jokes...
I have a bussiness trip this weekend, and Im going to go with my H and daughter.. I hope everything is fine..
My H looked for list of people in flight..and looked for OM name.. He asked me hole name OM..
OM wasnt a coworker... but he thinks that maybe OM can be join with me in this trip, or I dont know...
Btw, we made love last weekend and he was in another place or something... I asked for it, so Im going to avoid, ask to make love because I think he is not ready.. neither do I if he is so cold. What about this? making love is the last thing that can be restablish? as the trust?

daggi,
Sometimes I got deppress, and I realize that main problem, (my comunication necesity is not full).. yesterday my H was watching TV, I told him things about the work,, but he didnt listen anything <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
But, this is going to be solved before my husband grief right?
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

tear,

You reminded me of something else. Yes when we went for our first weekend to Bahrain I called the hotels to see if the OM was registered. Here it is practically impossible to register under a false name. When we planned our vacation in Paris (he now lives in the UK), I changed our hotel at the last minute and did not tell gemela just in case she had told OM (I am sure she did in fact tell him all about our vacation because she told me she did).

I agree and disagree with you. You are trying to argue two sides of the same question and missing the point.



Tha would be your husband and I agree it is probably true. For him. Unfortunately a lot of bad can happen to him (and you) before he comes to that realization. Just ask Daggi. She is living proof of this.



Sigue siendo caca de toro. Again, just ask Daggi. The only way that expression applies in your case would be for your husband to use it on you. In other words, if he loved you, he would let you go and see if you came back. You have this whole thing backwards so just forget all about that stupid sentiment. You made a mistake and now you need to fix it. That is all you need to think about.



This is typical. I did the same. Your husband feels inferior to the OM. You have devastated his ego. I remember all of this in my case. It really hurts. I knew that gemela had found someone better than me and I felt lower than low. I was really depressed about this. Later I got over this. I realized just what a worm the OM was and that he is nothing compared to me. But it took me time to get to that place.



My suggestion is to not get offended. If you do get offended, smile anyway. If you get angry, your husband will think you are defending the OM. Bad idea. Tell your husband (without being angry) exactly how you feel about him and about the OM. Your husband needs reassurance. He won't believe you at first but just keep going. If he hears the same thing over and over, eventually he will believe it. He is hurting. He is searching for a way to understand this. He needs your help.



SF (sexual fulfillment) is not the last thing to return. It comes in waves. Gemela and I probably went two months after Dday before we had SF. I really can't remember how long but it was a long time. Neither one of us was interested. Then we went through a phase donde cojimos como conejos - dia y noche. Then we got back to "normal". Then lo dejamos por un tiempito. The regresamos a los conejos. Then we stopped for over a month again. Last night, in fact, was the first time we have had SF in over a month and I have to say I wasn'y really interested. Gemela was fairly insistent. She got me interested.

Don't let the SF worry you. Everybody reacts differently. Each time I got away from SF, it was for a different reason. There was the mental image phase, there was the violation of intimacy phase, etc. This last time was more me trying to get my head clear and decide what I actually wanted - separate fact from fiction. I don't know. I would say that every time I was not interested in SF and gemela still made me do it, it was good for us. I suggest you keep at it. It shows your husband you still want him, find him desireable, that he is a man. All those things you took away from him.

Your husband is probably machista. You have taken his manhood from him. Give it back.

traicionado

thanks for your words.

As always you know what Im facing right know. And as you are man and a BS also, I can at least try to understand my H behaviour.

Well we went to Cancun for my bussiness trip.Its going to cost a lot, but I think it worth.

Sometimes I think my H wants to stop to think in my A and give us another chance.. but then he starts to think again and he got upset.

He became a violent man, I mean not just phsically violence, but emotional violence..
He starts to scream me, or he blaim me for things that I dont have guilty.. I dont like that he be like that with me. But as in this time we are dealing with EA consequencues, Im going to wait, and be patient.

Im afraid my H and I crossed respect line.. both need professional help. But as both work are so demanding I haven found time to start my professional help.

A night before our trip, we had a fight, I mean we hit us.. He started and I defending myself using a kitchen tool, I know he didnt hit me with all his streight (fuerza?) neither I did (that tool is dangerous). Even this I hurt his elbow.. Then he throw away my tool and I was disarm (desarmada?) and he threated me.. he know in that case Im more vulnerable.. but you know Im brave (brava), and I stand in front of him.. I know he is stronger than I but even this Im not going to permit this...Im goint to defending myself..and we hit us.. (palmadas).. but then I realized that our inmature to deal with our feelings and the (ira) was controlling..
We are not animals, and we need to use brain not instint.

It was awful.. I told him our M was finished.. he told me he was going with me to the trip (something my daugher expected). I didnt care.

But he went with me to that trip, and in evey time he found a way to remember me OM, with "burlas".. ahora solo le dije deja de decir eso me molesta, but he didnt..

Im going to try to show me indiferent about that I hope this help.

Im not a quiet woman, I know sometimes Im stubborn, and sometimes I finish my H patient (paciencia)

Sorry my english is awful..

Its going to be Mother's Day here (10 may) and I realy dont want anything from my H. I mean, anything material, I dont like anything. But Im afraid his reaction if I told this to him.

Why I dont like anything? because I dont need anything material, I need a sincere hug, or kiss or sweet words from him, and as I know that in this time this is not possible I dont want anything...Im afraid my reaction if he gives me a present that day,..

Anyway Im not his mother so he doesnt "need" to buy me a present (but all years he does, because my d has 3 years old)

traicionado, gemela

How old are you? and gemela how old is she?
I hope not to ofense you with these questions.. if I did it my apologize and dont answer it..

Im curious about age.. I think sometimes it can affect us in our behaviour or in be more impulsive.. (impulsivos)

Hola tear!

Aun estamos. Thursday and Friday is our weekend so I missed your posts until I checked my work email. I have a question (threadjack). How is Cancun now? I ask because we are about to go there for vacation and I know it was almost destroyed last year by the hurricane - all the beaches were washed away. I just want to know what to expect. I can't change the vacation because gemela wants to see her family and SIL has a time-share there.

I have no idea what to tell you about the violence. It is totally wrong and you cannot allow it. The thought has never even crossed my mind to hit gemela so this is foreign to me. There were a couple of incidents where she got pretty physical trying to block me from leaving a room and one pretty intense wrestling match over a cell phone where she hurt me slightly but I was always very careful not to hurt her no matter how angry I was. Part of that may be your culture and the machista man. I am not Mexican so don't know for sure. It is just what I have seen on novelas. Gemela has told me that she also agrees that your husband should never hurt you and she worries about it for you. He definitely needs professional help.

Okay, let me leave the abuse behind just a moment and talk about the burlas. Your husband was once a proud, self-confident machista male who was in complete control of his environment. He was master of his domain with frinds who admired him and a wife who worshiped him - or so he thought. The his wife found someone who was better than him. In an instant, everything he believed in was "proven" wrong. He suddenly became insignificant and worthless in the shadow of this perfect ideal of OM. He believes he is in competition with the OM. In a way he is. But he is competition with a fantasy - a fairy tale prince charming who never existed. He doesn't understand this. He makes fun of the OM and tries to put him down not for you - but for him. He is trying to make himself believe the OM is inferior to him but he cannot do it. I did all that. It was only when I realized that the OM was human and not superman that I understood what a nothing he really was and I stopped worrying about it. The only problem that still remained, however, was the gemela still believed he was indeed superman. Me trying to attack the OM and point out his flaws to gemela only made her defend him more. Eventually I gave that up too and just left her with her fantasy of OM in her thoughts. I could do that only because I finally understood that the OM was nothing compared to me. His type is a dime a dozen.

I know this is difficult on you and I remember that you are still very early on in this and I was probably at about the same stage as your husband is now after this amount of time. On the other hand, you cannot allow the violence. Do what you have to do to protect yourself.

It is good to hear from you.

For a proud, confident and strong man that is used to being in control with his life, it is very very difficult to deal with something like this, to say the least. It tears the floor out right underneath him, everything that he believed in and thought was right is gone. Everything that he has done so far was obviously wrong as it lead to you having had an affair. His whole outlook on the world... the future... is gone... he has lost it all.

This is what has happened tear... everything he believed in ... is gone. He has to get everything back... his faith in himself... you... the world... the future...

This is what makes him react the way he does, he is utterly lost and has no hold. All these things can be torn away from you in a split second, but it takes a long time to get them back again...

traicionado, daggi,

Well, another bad night (yesterday)
My H was tired and with bad mood, and as he always had done he scream to me and he stops to speak to me, as I was the guilty of everything..

Yesterday I realized that he doesnt love me, his behaviour even before the EA was always distant, if Im sick, he doesnt worry, or even ask "How do you feel today?", he never listen my conversation when I returned from work and I want to share how was my day, I can cry a lot and he doesnt say anything.

I tried to speak with him, asking "Why are you mad with me?" "Do you think I deserve all those words, and bad mod?" he didnt answer anything...

He threated me with found someone else and has his A... I was sick of this and I told him, "go ahead, do it!!!! "

He say he stays at home just because my daughter..

Im out ot this, I dont want anything from him right now. Im sick, I have flu and I dont want more argues, and fights. I dont want even to speak with him.. And if he wants we can get a divorce now...

I think we cant force anyone to love us, and everyone deserves to have a happy life..

Sinces two years ago we were fighting, and we stop to talk each other for days.. is awful, the house environment is plenty stress... and my daughter feels this too..

Now Im thinking that is going to be difficult without him, my life, but, with God help I can be fine..with time and professional help.

Believe me Im not going to look ANYONE, its inside me answers to this, and be responsable if I got a divorce...

In my country be a divorced woman is like a "stigma" or something... but I dont care, I want to have peace in my life...

Im confused again...

Next sunday is holidady here, so we spent day at home, and its going to be hard feel that streess at home..

I asked my H if he want to get a divorce, he says he needs time to think about it, (days before D day he said he want to get a divorce, but I told him I didnt want it). Im dessperate, sometimes he shows himself as an inmature man... he is not worry about how Im going to face everything without him. He says as I work also I dont need money from him.. Can you believe it!,, he said,my daugther doesnt ask any money!!, I told him she doesnt ask it but she need it...

My H said yesterday, that I havent done anything in order to he forgive me.. for he, I dont do anything fine... and he feels that he has the right to treat me as he wanted...

He said he is going to leave home... good for him if he want to do that.. now Im not going to stop him..

I prefer to be alone than this way...

traicionado

cancun is beautiful,, I went to xel-ha, and tulum, and I was at Moon Palace hotel (expensive for me but my company paid for me, but for my H dont so we need to user our savings)
Hotel's beach has a little plants but there is a truck clean this.. but there are places as beautiful as it was before hurricane.
I was three times there and it worth if you like nature, sea, snorkeling..etc.
Isla mujeres is beautiful too I didnt have time to visit there in this trip, so I need to do another and go there <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
You can see trees down besides highway, but everything is working, dont worry.

Gemela and I were driving through Chiapas one day on the way to San Cristobal and we came upon a place in the highway where it narrowed to one lane because part of the highway had fallen away in a landslide. There was a rock wall built up so you didn't accidentally drive off the road there and in front of the wall was a bronze plack with the name of the landslide, the date and a brief history of the event. I always thought that was strange. The Mexican government knows its priorities. I remember the effort they put in when Acapulco was ruined. It doesn't surprise me that they have responded so well in Cancun.

I have never been to Isla Mujeres but the name sounds exciting! My personal favorite is Playa del Carmen.

On a different note, I know divorce in Mexico is a stigma for the woman. For me, the big question is if my marriage is good my the children or bad my the children.

It sounds like maybe you and Daggi are at about the same place. If your husband continues the way he is going, I think it will be hard for you to stay interested very long.

Traic, how very true your last words ring in my ear.

I wont get into it any further as this is tear's thread.

tear, maybe it is best if he gets some distance for a while, so he can get his head cleared out. It is all still very fresh for him, and he obviously cannot deal with the situation as it is. The emotions need to cool down before any permanent decisions should be made. I wouldnt jump straight into a divorce, but maybe a separation under given circumstances would be a good thing. This is just my opinion, to get a divorce right now, would most likely end up being regretted by either one or both of you. But taking a step back, letting things cool down for a bit and then when you are both able to talk about things without getting overemotional over it, then there is still plenty of time to make decisions that concern the rest of both of your lives.

But one thing has to be clear to him, no matter what emotional state he is in, his daughter is his flesh and blood and he will be responsible for her, and she will be his daughter for the rest of his life, she has not done anything, she is a victim of the situation and he HAS TO BE responsible for her, period.

Tear,

You and Daggi are venturing into territory I know little about. I will say that you need to get the abuse stopped or it is just a matter of time before you hate each other too much to ever recover. I think you mentioned your husband is a doctor. ¿Puedes convincerle a tomar unas pastillas anti-depresivas? I think it would help you both a whole lot. Even if you marriage had problems before the A, it doesn't mean you can't have a great marriage in the future if you both want it and are willing to work for it.

I will still talk to him any time you can convince him to let me. I would be more than happy to try to help him. I really do have a good idea what he is feeling.

Hello traic, daggi

I cant believe how different can be things at home, we can go from madness to "happiness".. Last weekend we spent a holiday (May 1) and we stayed at home, and april 30 was "Boy's day" so we tried to play with our daughter, and have a good time.
Saturday night I was sick (flu) and I got sleep a nap. And my daughter slept too, and when I got up, I discovered my H drink alcohol, it hurts me , see him drunk.. And then he started to talked about how miserable he feels, and he feels less man than OM (as you told me traicionado).. He cried, and I tried to speak with him, and advice him to talk about this with someone else. He isnt agree. This is so hurt for him that he even dont try, because is so embarransing ( I think). I dont know why he started to drink alone, it was at afternoon, I try to help him.. and suddenly, he got a phone call from hospital where he works, and there was a patient with problems. so he got a shower, and went to hospital.. I was worry about him all night.. He came home late at night.
Affortunately, he stopped to drink..
Sunday, was Boys day, we were argue for almost one hour, and my daughter said "shhhh dont fight..." it was so hard to heard my little daughther saying that... My H asked me what would I do if I were in his place, what about I was the BS.. I told him, that sure I got angry, but I would fight for him... We were talking, until both got mad.. He said he cant stop loving me.. (this shocked me!!) and then we stop talked.. I told him, it depends of us if we made this day good or awful for our daughter..
That afternoon he kiss me!!! I was so happy for this.. It was long time since he didnt permit event that I touch him.. And he kiss me!!! I dont want to be dreaming and thing that all our problems are gone, but.. Its a begining.
Even this he didnt want to sleep in our bedroom.. he still sleeps in another room. But we made love, and this time was different he was interesting, I still cant understand why he denies to slep with me, and why he wanted to made love with me.. but anyway I enjoyed it a lot..
Right now Im optmistic about my M..
Even my H still review my mails, he told me that he thinks I erase my new emails... I didnt do that, and I hope my H behaviour change soon,, or I dont now what its better for him.. review all my things and even this think that Im hidding something, or stop to do that and try to live day by day, step by step.. and be optimistic about our relationship.

I hope this isnt a dream that Im building myself trying to have hope about my M.

tear,

You gave gemela an email address to contact you didn't you? If you don't mind, I would like to write a letter to your husband. I will not ask him anything. I will just try to describe what has happened to me since Dday, all the thoughts I have had, worries, fears, basically try to show all the emotions I went through. I will then email that to gemela so she can forward it to you. That way she won't have to read it.

If she sends you that letter, do you think your husband would get angry if you gave it to him? He may or may not read it. I don't know what he would do. At least he could see how someone else felt about this without having to talk to anyone. You let me know. If you would like to try this, I'll write the letter. I will estimate that it will take me the better part of a day to write it though. It will be somewhat long.

Just in case you decide to try this, does your husband speak English fairly well or do I need to write in Spanish? I would prefer to write in English because I don't know all the words for the complexity of emotions in Spanish. It is strange but I get by very well in Spanish in situations I have been in before and have learned the vocabulary. In Venezuela I was pretty cocky at how well I was speaking Spanish and had been there for six months. One day the hotel where I was living had their laundry facility break down so I had to take my clothes to a tintoreria. I was in a panic. I had no idea how to say "dry clean" in Spanish. What should have taken a minute took 30. Clothes turned out okay though. I had trouble with the language because I was in a strange situation for the first time. This is my first time for infidelity too.

Be careful though. It sounds like your husband is changing his thoughts but it is a Montaña Rusa. He will have good days and bad days and the bad days can come for no apparent reason. Don't let those discourage you.

tear,

I have written a letter in English. Let me know if you want it. I don't want anything sent to you that you are not expecting and have your husband find it. The letter is addressed to your husband. If you think this will be helpful, I will ask gemela to email it to you. I am assuming she has your email address. Is that correct?

Hello traicionado,

Thanks for be so kind and try to help my H.

Im agree with send him an email. Im not sure if I should ask him first about this idea. Im almost sure he is going to say NO thanks..
But since yesterday he has internet in his work so he is loggin my email's accounts, for checking who is writing me, so if gemela send it my H is going to see it. But if the mail is in english, Im afraid he is not going to understand everything. He doesnt know marriage builders vocabulary either..
Im 100% sure that your experience can help him in this, only someone who had felt same can understand.
Im not sure what would be the best.
Do I need to ask him first?
Can you translate it to spanish? or can I do it? Is ok if I read that mail?

I will keep the English version and also translate it into Spanish. I think I can do pretty well.

I'll go ahead and do it. I avoided using MB terminology for the very reason you mentioned.

Does he know you are posting on MB? That is my biggest concern. If he does not, he might get angry that you are airing your dirty laundry in public.

If you want me to send the letter, you should absolutely tell him first before gemela sends it. You don't have to go into details - just don't let it be a surprise to him. He should always find out about things from you first. Not just now - always. That is how marriage is supposed to work.

Years ago I worked in a company and I had a boss who sent me to work in Mexico. Before I left he told me one thing: he didn't care what I did but if no matter what happened, he wanted to hear it from me first rather than his boss. I always did that and my boss was always very happy.

You're right traic, my H blaim me about why he needs to discover everything so I need to speak with him first.

He knows that Im posting here, I read a reply from me to gemela, as he was looking things in my laptop at home.. That way he discovered that one day, I was , mmm how do you say when you have a "tentacion" tentation? Im not sure if this word exists in english.. well I had a tentation about to talk by phone with OM, remember that? instead I talked with a cousin all afternoon and that it.. But my H asked me about that feeling I denied, and then he told me that he read the post, and that Im a lier...
So let me speak with him first... do I need to ask him for permission, or just let him know?
Im working in computer systems so I need to give support to critical systems in hours not of office, at home, so yesterday I was working too late at night and my H arrives, and he saw me, on line, and he was worry about my behaviour but as he was so tired, he just told me "dont start chating".
Chating !!!! I was working and sleeping at same time!!!! I told him in a good manner dont worry.
How long can I expect this behaviour? without any terapy...

Preface:

I didn't want to put the following in open forum but, since it is in Spanish, I have confidence that very few will read it. If any of you do, I am not interested in getting the slightest bit of feedback from you about my sitch. I am doing this only in the hope that maybe it can help tear. I don't want commentary or, more importantly, analysis.

tear,

I am posting this because I don't want your husband to see you getting emails that might make him get angry with you. Please print this and ask him to read it.

thanks

Para el esposo de “tear”,

Mi esposa es Mexicana y soy gringo. My esposa empezó un affair físico hace un año con el maestro de natación de mis niñas (5 y 7 años de edad). Es algo que jamás pensé que mi esposa era capaz de hacer pero lo hizo tan facilmente que, hasta la fecha, no lo puedo creer. Yo he estado enamorado de mi esposa desde la primera vista y le he entregado mi vida para hacerle feliz. Aún así, aparentamente no era lo suficiente. En todo nuestro matrimonio, no hablamos mucho. Yo hablo Español mejor que ella habla ingles, sin embargo, hay muchas cosas como pensamientos e emociones que no sé cómo expresarme en Español. Sin embargo, mi esposa nunca se quejaba sobre el matrimonio. Hace un año y medio, nos cambiamos a Arabia Saudita. Nosotros hemos estados expatriatos casi todo el matrimonio pero Saudita era un cambio muy fuerte para ella debido a las restriciones empuestas a las mujeres aca. No puedo decir que teníamos el matrimonio perfecto pero, sobre todo, creo que era un matrimonio muy agradable para los dos. LLegando a Saudita, los dos encontramos problemas personales pero no enfrentamos los problemas juntos y nunca platicábamos sobre nuestros dudas y temores. Los dos caeimos en la depresión. La verdad es que no sé totalmente el motivo para que my esposa justificaba su affair pero no me importa tampoco. Ella eligió tener un affair. Punto.

Me di cuenta de las pistas del affair por meses y sospechaba que estaba pasando algo pero no podía creer que mi esposa haría tal cosa. Ella y mis hijas se fueron a los EEUU para vacaciones y me quedé aca. Durante su ausencia, recibí la cuenta telefónica y encontré 187 llamadas que no tuvieron sentido y todas a un número celular. Después de una investigación hecha por mi compañia, mi esposa confesó que las llamadas fueron suyas. Me aseguró que el “otro hombre” (OM = other man) ya había salido de Saudita y que ella quería intentar salvar el matrimonio. Ella me dijó todo esto por teléfono desde los EEUU. Estaba yo solito en Saudita con mi familia en el otro lado del mundo. Estaba yo en “shock”. No podía aceptar que me estaba pasando esto. No sabía como pensarlo. ¿Qué significaba”? ¿Se había acabado mi matrimonio o no? Solo pensaba que esto no era posible. Huberion días en que pensaba que mi esposa me iba a decir que era una broma (de mal gusto por cierto). Me sentía tan solo. Perdí 10 Kg en tres semanas. Mi vida no tenía sentido. Quería morirme. No podía pensar en nada mas. Solamente quería morirme. Hablé con mi esposa y le pedí que hablara con el OM (quien todavía estaba aquí) para hacer un acuerdo que el me matara para que mi esposa se quedara con el dinero del seguro de vida. Se hablaron pero no sé qué decidieron. Sigo con vida por lo menos.

Pasaron tres semanas antes de que regresó mi esposa de los EEUU. Fueron una Montaña Rusa. Al principio estaba yo en la desespración total. Luego rogaba a mi esposa que me regresara para darme otra oportunidad. Sí, le rogaba. ¡Qué vergüenza! ¡Todas las cosas que le decía y que hice! Cuando en fin se regreso a Saudita, me dijo que se había acabado su affair. Pero yo me había comprador una grabadora telefónica sin su conociamento y escuchaba a todas sus llamadas. En el transcurso de dos días me enteré que me estaba mentiendo y aun estaba en pleno affair con el OM ¡que nunca había salido del pais! Bueno, le saqué de la casa con sus dos maletas y ella se fue con el OM a su departamento. El dia siguiente, ella me llamó y me pedió por el alma de su mamá que se regresara a la casa. Si no hubiese sido por mis dos hijas, le habría mandado al carajo. La verdad es no no quize que regresara nunca.

Durante todo este tiempo, jamas odiaba a mi esposa. Me odiaba a mi mismo. Yo era el fracaso. Todo en que había confiado, todas mis creencias fueron mentira y basura. La mujer a quien yo había dedicado mi vida y a quien había amado con todo mi alma, nunca jamas me había querido. Yo era un esposo desechable. Mi vida ya no tenía sentido. Quería morirme neuvamente. Llegó un momento en que pedí a mi esposa que me mandara a asesinar durante nuestras vacaciones en Mexico. Me dijo que lo aceptara. Rezaba día y noche que Diós me quitara la vida. Estaba yo encabronado con ella por lo que me había hecho. No podía creer qué tan egoista era mi esposa y lo poco respeto que tenía por mi. Me sentía tan inferior al OM. Estaba yo destruido. Me sentía como la basura de mi esposa que ella había tirado por la ventana de su camioneta. No sé si eso tiene sentido en Español o no. Espero que sí. Ella me había usado hasta que era conveniente y me dejó por algo mejor. Estaba yo avergonzado por haber fracasado tanto con mi vida. No tenía derecho de existir.

Por hacerlo peor todavía, ella negó de parar su affair. Ella mantuvo contacto con el OM en varias maneras. Llamadas escondidas, teléfonos celulares secretos, etc. El affair era una cosa pero estas llamadas me mataban. Esto me dolía peor que podía yo imaginar. Yo tenía que aguantar ésta mierda mientras ella me pisaba encima. Ella no me respetaba para nada e insistía en destruir lo poco de la dignidad que me quedaba. Aun así, todavía le amaba. Me odiaba a mi mismo. Sentí que no podía competir con el OM en ninguna manera.

Pero poco a poco las cosas empezaron a cambiarse. Te puedo contar los detalles si te interesa pero lo mas importante es que me enteré de unos hechos sobre el OM. Aunque no podía concursar contra la fantasia que mi esposa había desarollado en su mente sobre el OM, supe por cierto realmente quien era el OM. El era un predetador (predator) quien cazaba mujeres casadas por diversión. El era buenisimo en su pasatiempo porque tenía mucha experiencia. El sabía precisamente qué decir a mi esposa en cualquier momento para que ella caiera un su trampa. Desgradiacemente, hasta la fecha, mi esposa no lo quiere creer.

Actualmente mi esposa y yo siguimos juntos. Me ha costado unos 7 meses desde mi Dday(dia en que me enteré del affair) para llegar al punto donde puedo “aceptar” los hechos. Yo necesitaba todo este tiempo y aún necesito más. No es nada facil. Ya no existe la confianza en la relación y los expertos estiman que toma unos 4 or 5 años para re-establecer le confianza perdida. Si te digo la verdad, es más facil dejarla e empezar de nuevo. En este momento, confio que nosotros podemos salvar al matrimonio siempre y cuando mi esposa lo quiere hacer. Creo en nuestro matromonio y soy dispuesto intentar. Lo debo a mis hijas y también a mi esposa. Ella hizo un error. Somos seres humanos y todos cometimos nuestros errors. Cuando me casé con mi esposa, le prometí que era para siempre. Hize esa promise no solamente a mi esposa sino también a Diós. Todavía la quiero demasiado. No tengo idea si vamos a quedarnos junto por el largo plazo o vamos a divorciarnos algún día. Nada más en este momento, estoy luchando con todas mis esfuerzas por el matrimonio

Cabe mencionar que aunque le amo a mi esposa, no confio nada en ella. No me pongo pensar en la confianza. Primero estoy trabajando en el matromonio. Le digo abiertamente que no confio en ella y no le pido disculpas. Ella lo merece. Si no le gusta, ella sabe donde está la puerta.

Tu tienes una gran ventaja sobre mi. Tu esposa te quiere muchisimo y desesperademente quiere salvar su matrimonio. Mi esposa no quiere nada de nuestro matrimonio. Honestamente hablando, no creo que tu esposa tuvo un affair físico con su OM. Realmente no sé si tiene mucha importancia. Creo que hubiera sido mucho más sencillo si mi esposa nunca habría jodido a su OM. ¿Quién sabe? Sé que vi todas las pistas del affair pero negé de creerlas porque tenía toda la confianza en mi esposa. Fué mi error. Me equivoqué. Ella me mentió y me engañó.

Algo causó que tu esposa bajó sus defenses contra los OM. Pienso yo que tu OM también es un pradetador y andaba buscando una oportunidad con tu esposa. Ella ya sabe quien es su OM y sabe que el ni te llega hasta tus rodillas. Parace que has tenido problemitas en tu matrimonio por un tiempo. Probablemente faltaba la comunicación entre todo. Eres un hombre orgullioso. Eres un hombre muy bueno. Que seas un hombre fuerte y aceptes este cargo y luches por tu familia. Lo debes a tu hija. Ella te necesita. También tu esposa te necesita. Quieres a tu esposa. Busca la manera de amarte a ti mismo. Lo puedes hacer. Lo que te hizo tu esposa no es excusable pero si es perdonable.

Bueno, mi historia es bien documentada en el web site de MB. Si quieres saber mas de mi camino, tu esposa te puede guiar a mis varios threads. Puedes ver mis fallas y mis desesperaciónes. No estoy orgullioso de esto pero es la verdad. Espero que te pueda ayudar un poco. No puedes superar esto solo y nadia te lo está pidiendo. Necesitas ayuda. Todos necesitamos ayuda. Nosotros sabemos cuanto te duele porque hemos sufrido lo mismo.

Si tienes alguna pregunta para mi, nuestras esposas saben como comunicarse.

No te estoy diciendo que te quedes en tu matrimonio. Esa decision es tuya. Solamente te estoy diciendo que hay esperanza si quieres intentar. Elige tu.

You are an amazing man Traic, hats off to you... i do hope her husband will take the time to read and will at least get in contact with you.

I so wish tear and her husband the very best, it is very very hard, but one day it will have been worth the work and the pain.

un choquecito para tear

Mil gracias traicionado por mostrar tu experiencia y sentimientos hacia mi esposo. Le voy a entregar lo que escribiste..

El viernes le comenté sobre la idea de que le escribieras y me dijo "¿para qué?" y no dijo nada más... yo entendí que no quería que yo te diera su email y/o que me enviaras el mail a mi correo.

Sabes? creo que hay días en que él prefiere ni acordarse de mi A, dejar las cosas así, como si nada hubiera pasado, cuando está en ese punto, podemos pasar un día agradable como familia y como pareja, platicamos y hasta nos reímos.
Claro que hay días donde algo le recuerda lo que hice y ahí estamos otra vez, metido en el agujero negro y si es un día en el que yo estoy bien emocionalmente, entonces solo lo tolero y no pasa nada, pero si es un día en el que yo también estoy mal, entonces peleamos, discutimos y no herimos más. Y con nuestro comportamiento herimos a quien más amamos en esta vida: nuestra hija... A veces pienso que somos unos inmaduros e irresponsables pues aunque esté mi hija presente comenzamos a discutir, y mi nena se da cuenta y nos dice "no peleen"....

Tengo una comida familiar el próximo sábado, mi esposo me dijo que no irá a ningún evento o fiesta que tenga que ver con mi familiar, no quiere saber nada.. eso me molesta, y me confunde, porque para algunas cosas si cede, porque si podemos ir al cine como familia y no puede ceder e ir a la comida con mis tíos? , yo ya había confirmado con mi tío que si iremos a su fiesta... Como siempre hacíamos... pero a penas ayer me dijo mi esposo que él no irá y como yo me enojé por esto, le dije: "no quiero que me regales nada del día de las madres que es pasado mañana acá en Méx. ni que compres algo y se lo des a mi hija para que me lo dé...no quiero nada" y ahí empezó otra discusión.... Afortunadamente pasaron las horas y ambos cedimos y comenzamos a hablar.... Puedes creer que cuando nos enojamos pasan días y días y no nos hablamos nada? sucede que por nuestros trabajos de por sí nos vemos muy poco así que eso nos "facilita" el no comunicarnos y seguir cada quien en su enojo, sin resolver nada y haciendo el ambiente familiar tenso y malo para nuestra hija..

Me comenta mi esposo que en su trabajo sus compañeros le preguntaron "que te pasa? tú no eres así,.... que te sucede? " él no les contó nada.... y cada que algo así sucede, siento que él otra vez vive un día D... en menor escala que el primer día D, pero vuelve a ese punto...
Su mejor amigo de mi esposo también sufrió un A de su esposa, solo que ellos se divorciaron, no tenían hijos y ahora cada uno se volvió a casar... Mi esposo le mostró a su amigo las "peores" cartas que yo le envié al OM, una donde me despido de él y otra donde le digo que gracias por toda su ternura y por TODO,,, como usé mayúsculas, él y su amigo pensaron que TODO significaba TODO es decir que hice TODO con el OM... se equivocan y antes me enfurecía el que no me creyeran... ahora sé que como no hay modo de comprobar que hice y que no hice, y como mentí pues nadie me cree y no necesito que me crean si yo sé que fue lo que hice... Su amigo le dijo que seguramente yo había tenido un PA con el OM y creo que eso solo confirmó las sospechas de mi esposo... asi que bueno, mi esposo piensa que hice algo más y dice que jamás le diré lo que realmente pasó.... y ahí no puedo hacer nada...

Yo he estado deprimida,,, y comienzo a comer compulsivamente,,, y solo logro sentirme peor... además me siguen haciendo estudíos clínicos para ver si tengo hipotiroidismo o qué pasa, pues mi tiroides anda fallando... o algo así... Mi esposo me conoció con 30 kgs menos que hoy!!!! y creo que para él es muy importante el físico así que supongo yo también he fallado al no mantenerme en buena forma... Para la estatura de Mx. según soy alta, asi que eso me ayuda un poquito, pero ahora sigo subiendo de peso y me siento mal.. Igual tengo mis días buenos y mis días malos... Creo que la tiroides también ha contribuido a mis estados de ánimo tan cambiantes....

Vaya es mucho mejor escribir en el idioma nativo... comprendo lo que pasaste al traducir tu carta para que mi H lo entendiera... obviamente yo también expreso mejor lo que siento en español, pero a veces prefiero escribir en inglés para que más personas en el sitio lo comprendan.

Hay cosas que sucedieron en la semana del día D, que marcarán nuestra relación, además del A.. por supuesto.. por ejemplo, mi madre estaba en casa y le tocó vivir varios de los problemas.. serios, con violencia, etc.. y tu sabes que la pareja podrá medio matarse pero después se pueden encontentar... y ya que entra alguien más a escena , todo se complica....Mi familia, creo que tendrá que digerir el hecho de que yo sigo con mi esposo.. no les gustó su reacción a pesar de la causa por la que él esstaba así.

Luego yo le conté todo a mi suegra y mi cuñada, así que supongo ahí también cuando vuelva a verlos no me verán igual... Casi toda mi familia y la de mi esposo viven en un estado del sur de la república. de hecho ahí conocí a mi esposo, ambos somos originarios de ahí.. Se llama Oax. y está a 5 hrs por carretera desde la cd de Mex.
Creo que para estos casos es mejor tener a la familia "no tan cerca" pueden aconsejar a uno, queriendo ayudar, pero no conviene creo...

Ahora estoy en el trabajo y como me enfermé y falté el viernes, estoy atrazada con varias cosas, pero saben? el escribir todo esto hace que me sienta mejor,,, espero darme un tiempo y poder compartir con quien este pasando por lo mismo lo que he vivido y poder contribuir en algo al sitio que tanto me ha ayudado...

Muchas gracias a todos por leerme y dedicarse un momento para contestar y al menos saber que no estamos solos en este lío... y que no somos lo peor del planeta los WS...

Nuevamente gracias tracionado y ya te contaré que pasó con lo que le daré a leer a mi esposo, será hasta mañana pues hasta mañana lo vuelvo a ver.. hoy se la pasa trabajando TOOOOdo el día y noche....

Lo que cuentas de los dias buenos y dias malos, a nosotros nos paso lo mismo. Igualito.

No hable no nadia por mucho tiempo - meses. Fue un error. El no lo puede manejar solo.

Cuentame lo que dice tu esposo. Estoy aqui por el si me necesita.

Well, even I cant believe it, OM just talked... Im working at office, and when we had our A he talked by phone with me at this time...
I thought he never even consider talked with me.. again.. since he knows my H discover our A and since, he realized how pain cause all this, just because or frienship that became something else not just a frienship...
From deep in my heart I didnt want to pass to this moment, that I just passed.. Thanks God, my behaviour was good, I think..
When I saw his number, in my phone display, I was scare!!!!... and my first reaction was not answer, for two rings, I think, but suddenly I realized that it was run away the problem, so I decided to answer him..
He asked me How am I, and if I have time to talk, and I answered, talked about what?
He said, about you, how have been everything with you.. etc.... and I answered him NO, I dont want to talk with you, not again.. He got angry and said, I thought we were friends, and I told him yes, we were friends, but when we decided to got involved in something else not just friends, our frienship ended..and thats it. And I told him, "In fact you are make me troubles with my H with this call, I promise him to tell him if you call me, so I need to tell him and Im going to have troubles..". then he (OM) apologized for the call ,and say take care yourself, GOODBYE!!!

I hope this was the first and last time he wanted to speak with me.. I think I was rude enough (at least I tried) and he continue with his life.. he is single for him, this can be easier than by me.. and I have my H, that even he is angry right now, is a man much man than OM...

Im afraid of my H reaction...
Im scare...!!!
I need to talked with my H about this phone call , but Im scare!!!...

My H sometimes got violent!!
Im scare...

Tear,

This will not be the last time the OM calls you. I promise you he will keep trying. Since you have caller ID, NO CONTESTES EL PINCHE TELEFONO! QUE ESTABAS PENSANDO?

The OM wants a reaction out of you - any reaction. If you are rude with him, that still makes him feel good. OM's are cowards. He won't come near your husband but he will follow you to the ends of the earth in the darkness and secrecy of the affair.

There is absolutely nothing you can say to OM that will make him stop calling. Nothing. Period. If you answer the phone and he hears your voice, he will keep calling. Don't answer the phone. You owe him nothing. I am trying to be very understanding with you but, quite honestly, if I were your husband and I found out about the phone call, I would be angry too. I wouldn't hit you though.

This is difficult. The right thing to do is tell your husband exactly what happened. You have to stop the secrets. In your case, however, I would be tempted to not tell him as long as you are 100% positive that he will never find out on his own. At some point you still need to tell him but maybe later. If it weren't for the violence, I wouldn't suggest waiting.

But be clear on one thing. Don't ever ever speak to OM again - not one single word. Don't even pick up the phone and scream "te odio". Nothing. Not one single word. I promise you that there is nothing - not one word - you can say to OM to make him stop calling. If you don't answer the phone, he will get bored and eventually stop. If he mails you a card, don't open it. Throw it in the trash. The OM is dead as far as you are concerned.

Lo que hiciste fue pura estupidez. Sorry pero es la verdad.

Don't feel bad. I am just trying to help. Okay? <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Well I guess Im not be so intelligent right?
I wasnt prepare for the phone call, my first reaction was to not answer, but then I suppose that he would try again later, and he is a stuborn person so I though if I didnt answer things would be worst than now.
Once I asked my H how would he prefer to be my reaction about this, and he asked me not to call him to his work just to tell him "hey OM just called me" he asked me to wait until he arrives home. As today my H works hole day and night I told him in the afternoon, and OM called me in morning...
My H gots angry and, he said "why you tell me until now?" I dont understand!!! he asked me to do that..
If I told bad, if I dont told bad too. Im "fregada" anyway.
Phone call last 2:36 minutes, I told him we arent friends, and that he is going to cause me seriuos troubles with my H, beacause I would confess everything to my H...
I understand now that is better not answer..
I think OM is not going to call me again, however I dont apostaría that he wouldnt do.. so if this happen Im not going to answer...
Sad thing is that if OM wants to call me Im going to pay for his call, even if I dont answer... because my H is going to be angry with me.. no matter what happen, or not..
In this cases, I think my H proud is bigger than love that he still can feel for me..
Im going to pray and ask God for be strong and patient with my H..
My H blainmed me that I never told him the things before he discovered and in this case I told him and the results are same.. We got angry, and our relationship is shutting..
I need to wait until tomorrow that I see my H, and its going to be stressed wait until tomorrow to see what have my H for me as a reaction of this 2:36 min OM call...

If he try to hit me would be last time..
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Pues contestar es pinche teléfono fue una tontería es cierto.

Si estás fregada. ¿Qué más esperabas?

Okay. You told your husband. Good. He good mad and did not hit you. Good. You were honest. Great.

I don't bet you the OM will call you again - I promise you he will call you again. I guarantee he will call you again. Be ready for it next time. And call your H immediately and tell him. Sooner or later he will understand you are being honest and that the calls are not your fault. That takes time.

And if your husband hits you again, leave him forever.

Mmmm, In fact, I think that we should try to see something good, and be positive, every time, but sometimes is realy difficult. About all this by example, I remember a post that someone once wrote me "this can be an oportunity to have the marriage that you always want". And thats the idea that help me when I want to give up.
My H havent helped me a lot, by the way, maybe its just too early for him.. D day was on march 21. However good days are so good that if I put them in a "balanza" they have more weight than bad days.
OM, well I dont feel hate for him, or something, I know I need to be far far far away from him, he is a professional in appears has a good friend, bla bla bla. and then women like me fals down..and make wrong things... hurting people that we love...and ourselfs...Believe me I dont want anything from OM... I dont expect anything answer him, I was focus in be clear for him.. if this is not enough and he insists, is his problem.. now I can refuse his calls, and just dont answer..
I dont understand my H why he first asked to wait to notify about OM calls and then he blaims me why I wait until afternoon? as a WS his behaviour is like Im doing something wrong again.. or hidding something... or whatever....
I dont understand.. I deserve somethings but not all.. I think... and In fact, as Im not a woman with lot experience in this field (affairs and everything) I can make mistakes, even if I want to do the right thing...
Same my H, maybe he wants to keep marriage alive, but maybe his behaviour sometimes is not helping much..But I want incremental good days..
Things hapen for some reason I think...
Im looking for a book that some time ago I bought "Como mantener contento al esposo", I read some cap and it was so interesting, and in this moment could be so useful for me..But I havent found, is in someplace in my house, I hope..
Im a person so analytic that sometimes this is a problem.. My H told me some time ago that I made him feel with low steem... I decided several things about home.. I research about services prices, cars, maintenance,, etc and the I "suggested" my husband the right desicion, and if he wast agree I discuss why my option was the right one,, and finaly he "chosed" my option.. This is a thing that I need to change I guess...
Well I started to write of another thing,,, and this post is just to be agree about not to answer again a phone call from OM...( I think he is not going to call me, in fact I know that he is going to be one month in Germany, because his work and the World Cup so its good for me..., I can be quiet in this month..)
My afraid about OM calls is because I know my H reaction would be get mad.. and again, discussions, and stress at home, days without speaking each other...I cant believe this, all this mess for someone that doesnt deserve even to mention..
I was reading some post about OM's or OW's that sometimes started an anormal behaviour "harrased? , how do you say this, when someone is calling lot, and call your spouse, and sometimes they can inclusive figure out things, or tell your spouse lies, I hope this woulb be my case.. and OM leave me quietly.. And this is a consecuence of be so fool.. and put in risk my family I guess..

I rarely post anymore, but I see alot of support going here, and sadly, the poster isn't being completely honest.

If you want REAL help ..and support... it's best to be HONEST with the people that are trying to help you, because they can give you better advice ..when they know the TRUTH.

Have you been completely honest with your H??

About the length of time, and the number of EAs????

If you have NOT told him the truth, and he's becoming violent, this is a bad sign, because if he keeps digging, he will find more information in your laptop. He will find out more than you've told him, and that is not fair..and very dangerous.

Please be honest with the people who are helping you here, so they can know what you are really dealing with.

thanks betrayed for your post..
I'll keep in mind your suggestions

The fact that you are already deciding where the OM will be for the next few months is the fact that bothers me. For someone who is supposed to be out of your life and out of your mind, you seem to know a lot about his plans. At the very least it tells me you still think about him quite a lot.

I said before, he will definitely call you again. They always do. His ego will make him to do but he will call.

So your BH told you to delay telling him about contact and then got made when you delayed. That doesn't surprise me. We BS's don't really know what we want. Well, what we really want is for you to tell us this was all a bad practical joke but that isn't going to happen. Do what you believe is right - not what your BH tells you is right. Delaying is covering up. Delaying is giving you opportunity to rehearse what you will say. The chance to spin it.

I have to comment on your compulsive eating too. You have said you have had some problems with your weight. Excessive eating is not going to make things better. It will make them worse. You need to start taking care of yourself. Diet and exercise are good for you but, more importantly, they instill discipline. That pattern of discipline spreads to other parts of your life as well.

I think you still have another 4 months more or less before your BH is going to start to be rational again. I hope you will have the patience to wait that long. If your BH will start talking to someone, things will get better much sooner.

Did he ever read the letter I wrote for him?

Gemela is not posting at the moment but, if you would like to talk to her, just let me know. I am sure she will post for you.

Oh and feliz dia de las madres!

Tear - When the OM calls again, and he will, tell him that you made a terrible mistake, love your husband, and don't want the OM to call you ever again for any reason. Then hang up. Don't argue or explain.

piojitos
OM have told me about his trip before D day... My H was asking (and in a suspisious way) why OM havent called me.. and once he asked me Why OM havent called you if he was so interesting in you? I just cant believe it.. and then I thought, well, I dont know, maybe he is in his travel and we come back. maybe he is going to call me or maybe he just leave this away from his life... I dont know and I dont care... And then my H was a little more quiet... I think he thought that I was hidding OM calls or something..
The idea pioji is that Im not thinking in OM, not in way that you are thinking,, true that I need to recapacitar acerca de mi comportamiento y aprender de lo que viví, para no volver a caer en el mismo agujero...
Tuve una discusión con mi esposo antiér,.. cuando le conté sobre la llamada del OM, me enojé porque él no acepta que necesita ayuda.. yo acepto que estoy mal emocionalmente y necesito ayuda,, él no,, ni siquiera habla de esto con sus amigos, con nadie... él no quiere que nadie lo sepa... lo hace sentir vulnerable eso.. creo... yo le dije que no lo hace menos hombre, ni menos profesional, menos médico, menos ser humano,,, lo que yo hice.. pero para él a vista de sus compañeros de trabajo es muy importante.. Quizá se valdrían de eso para molestarlo o burlarse, no lo sé no los conozco... el punto es que si ni siquiera se atreve a hablar de eso con ellos, será más largo el camino por recorrer en nuestra recuperación.
Le dije de la carta que escribiste, la tenía impresa, me dijo "no la quiero y ya te había dicho es, nunca respetas lo que quiero".. le dije, que hay de malo en solo leerla? nadie te pide nada a cambio... y bueno,,, a veces pienso que muchas cosas él las rechaza porque vienen de mí... o son mi idea... han habido casos similares y su reacción es la misma...
Me molestó mucho eso,, me sentí sin esperanza en nuestra relación... además tenía un fuerte dolor de cuello y le había pedido a él un masaje o al menos me ayudara a ponerme la crema medicinal... y nada.. asi que ya saben permit´´i que eso me desmoronara y me entré en una crisis.. a llorar y le pedí que se ocupara de mí,.. le dije que no me amaba que no le importo... y puras cosas así... él se enojó y dijo hablaremos cuando te calmes... le dije que yo estaba muerta para él y que no quería nada de él ....
Llego el día festivo... y no mellamó... la madrugada del problema creí que mi día de las madres iba a ser triste, el peor, y al despertar de ese día,´ví a mi hija dormida y me dije, depende de mí, estar acá lloré y lloré sintiendo pena por mi misma.. o poner lo que esté de mi parte para esstar mejor.. aún sin mi H.. y así lo hice.. Traté de invitar a una prima a comer,, pero ella ya tenía sus planes.. mi familia vive en otro estado así que no tuve opción y me fui solita con mi hija... la pasé bien.. y estando en el restaurante extrañé a mi esposo... charlar con él y compartir esa experiencia... lo quité de mi mente para no entristecerme... era duro ver las familias, platicando y unidas.. y bueno,.. me fui a autocomprarme un regalo... lo hice, me sentí bien y regresé a mi casa.. la pasé bien...
Mi H llegó unas horas antes de su llegada habitual.. traía un regalo.. no quería aceptarlo, terminé aceptándolo... pero continuaba enojada... para mí es importante sentir su apoyo cuando entro en esas crisis.. eso se daba desde muuucho antes de mi EA.. y bueno... yo seguía molesta... mi H se fue a dormir... yo también pero últimamente no he podido dormir, asi que me puse a leer, y vi que es necesario resolver los problemas y si mis acciones no están encaminadas a resolverlos entonces no puedo quejarme...
y ahí me levanté y fui a platicar con mi esposo.. lo desperté, comenzó mi monólogo, mi bla bla lba..... mi H se quedó dormido... eso me dolió (antes me habría enfurecido) y bueno luego él me explicó que estaba demasiado cansado, y no era que no le interesaba lo que siento... y terminamos haciendo el amor <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Respecto a mi peso, sé que tengo un problema que se agravó con mi depresión, muchas veces busco mitigar mi soledad, tristeza con la comida... y luego me siento peor cuando me veo al espejo...
Mi regalo fue un aparato para hacer ejercicios y hoy inicie y me siento muy bien... con más energía y es cierto eso requiere disciplica y debo "pagar el precio .. a base de esfuerzo y perseverancia para cuidar mi cuerpo y estar más sana".... ahi se muestra otra vez lo mucho que necesito la ayuda profesional.

Ah! ayer mi esposo me confesó que ya había leido tu carta... la leyó al revisar lo que hago en la laptop de la casa.. no me lo había dicho y su razón fue que no quizo decirme pues quería ponerme a prueba a ver si respetaba yo su desición, dijo que no lo hice, pero no supe decirme por que... así que yo le insitiía en que el la leyera cuando él ya la hab´´ia leído.
Le pregunté "qué piensas de la carta?" dijo, "es igual a lo que siento, y lo que he pasado, excepto la parte de morirse" y ya no me dijo nada más.... Creo que aún no está listo para comenzar la recuperación... Lo leyo solo porque andaba en su revisión de mis acciones cotidiana.. y solo por eso.. o no sé.
Igual y se sembró una semillita..que dará frutos después.

Saben? no sé que tanto conviene que siga escribiendo acá.. sé que me ayuda muchisimo , pero el no tener nada de privacía no me gusta,, y lo digo por mi esposo que ha utilizado este sitio para ponerme a prueba...
Además como me he apoyado acá, no me he visto en la necesidad de buscar ayuda profesional, no lo sé.
Y por sobre todo, OM sabía que yo entraba a este sitio,, y podría ser que él estuviera al tanto de lo que sucede con mi esposo y conmigo, de nuestros problemas y eso no me gusta..porque si el OM lee que las cosas con mi esposo no están del todo bien, podría pensar que aún puede intentar algo conmigo y podría alentarlo a llamarme e insistir.
Tal vez por un tiempo... no lo sé

I know it is difficult. Your H definitely needs help. I know how he feels when he insists you are still talking to OM. I did that too. Don't get angry with him for that. You violated his trust. It will be a long time before you can earn it back. That is one of the prices you pay for having an affair. If you don't like it, too bad. Sorry but it is the truth.

I recommend you keep posting here. It is unfortunate that OM knows you post to this site and I wonder how he would know such a thing since you posted here after you terminated your EA with him. That doesn't make much sense and makes me wonder if you are telling the whole truth.

I am glad your H got you a Mother's Day present. Don't let anger get in the way of good behavior. What you should have been angry about is the choice of gift. What on earth was your husband thinking? "Here honey, I bought you this because you are getting fat." Your husband has a lot to learn about gift selection. That was funny and made me laugh. I think your husband is an idiot when it comes to women. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Nooooo, you're wrong... Yo me compré el aparato para hacer ejercicio, fue mi regalo (es decir, me lo autoregalé) <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Mi esposo me regaló un cuadro con una ampliación de una foto de mi hija de los días que estuvimos en Cancún.. una foto muy bella...
About OM, let me clarify this,, I was having troubles with my H since two years ago (more or less) and I found this site in internet, when I was looking for marriage conselour,,, I told my H about this,, even I printed quetionaire for know HEr and his needs(or something).
All this was long time ago (before met OM).
Then I "met" (by internet) OM, all this started as a frienship, and I told him about this site, that I was interesting in apply some principles that I found here with my H.
I want to be recover for all this, and believe me Im convinced that NC is the best, for me and my family.
I understand why you could not believe me, as a BS Im not a lealty person, or sincere..
I know and I accept that.
Im thinking to stop posting here, just for a while... I dont know..

Thanks to everyone here who took time to read my posts, and gave me a suggestion, or share experiences.Special thanks to gemela and traicionado...
Gemela, traicionado, no conozco mucho los detalles de su caso, solo espero de corazón que ambos encuentren la felicidad donde quiera que esta esté.
Ambos me ayudaron mucho, me dieron paz, ánimo, etc etc.
Mil gracias traicionado, me ayudaste a tener paciencia, y tratar de entender todo el daño que le hice a mi esposo. Tu punto de vista en esto me ayudó enormemente.
Lo que viví como resultado de mi estupidez, tomará muucho tiempo en recuperarme.. con ayuda profesional además.. ahora me resta organizarme para que me dé tiempo de hacer todo..
ME ofrecieron un ascenso en el trabajo, eso podría implicar menos tiempo con mi familia, y de por si estoy muy poco.. cierto que de no aceptar esa oferta seguiré haciendo lo mismo que llevo haciendo desde hace 5 años.
Ya veré que decido.
Exito gem, traicionado...
Hasta pronto.

SEguro que de vez en cuando entraré acá me encantará ver si andan por acá y como les va..

Ciao!!

tear,

espero que estén bién. No dices si sigues en la lucha o ya abandonaste el intento. Ni modo. Vas a salir en adelante. Todo saldrá bién en una manera u otra.

No te puedo decir si gemela y yo vamos a seguir o no. Es medio deficil en mi caso debido a que gemela no quiere hablar ni buscar ayuda. Ella prefiere olvidar el asunto y, para mi, no funcionará. Yo le dije que si no resolvemos el problema, nos caeremos en lo mismo mas adelante. Me preguntó si pensé que ella es capáz de tener otro affair. Le contesté que sí - no cabe duda. Le pregunté lo mismo y me dijo que no - que no va a suceder nunca. Entonces le pregunté si había pensado que era capáz de tener su primer affair y también me dijo que no - que no era capáz. Le dije que estaba equivocada entonces y está equivocada ahora.

Bueno - es mi problema - no el tuyo. Cuídate mucho. Cuida a tu niña y a tu esposo. Espero que pueden salvar el matrimonio. Olvidate del OM. El es un problema esperando hacerse. Con respeto al trabajo, pon tu familia primera. El dinero no es todo.

best wishes for all

Respectfully .. I would not recommend this.

Have you been honest with your H yet... about there being MORE than ONE OM in the last year?

traicionado
Im going to put my soul in my M recovery.
I love my H and I hurt him a lot...thanks for all your posts here...
Say hi to gemela
Why does she havent post here?
I hope she is fine

tear,

Can you please post me a recipe for tinga?

piojito
sure, but for me is easier in spanish...Im going to look for one in english.

betrayed
It has been just two months since D day, we have good days, and bad days, Im very positive in this..most days are good..
My H still dreams in another bedroom...
Once I got angry about this, now I know he needs time..

piojito

last weekend I went to Acapulco beach, and it was good, but is better Cancun, I remember you are planning to go, I hope this wouldnt be in raining time.
Last weekend almost all country had rain.
If you can, verify weather...

piojito
Que tanto has avanzado en la recuperación de tu M desde el D day?
Creo que han tenido ayuda profesional ambos, es util?
Como sobrellevas los días difíciles?
Porque ya no ha escrito gemela?
Como la has reconquistado o intentas hacerlo?

We have been to MC and she has gone to IC but the results are not great. You can get a good counselor but there are many bad ones too. If you try it and are not happy, go find another one. We have currently stopped MC because she doesn't want it. I would say we are stuck. Not advancing but not regressing much.

Gemela has not written because she got really upset by something Stanley wrote. I did not read it but she told me about it. I respect her wishes in that.

Not all days are difficult. Some are quite easy. The difficult days get fewer with time but when they do come they are really bad. I cannot speak for gemela. I get through the difficult days by reminding myself that they are just feelings. That the goal of salvaging the marriage is still a good one and trying to preserve the family for our daughters is still a good one.

I think it is best if you keep telling each other how your are feeling. I think we are so intent on trying to read each other's moods. If I am depressed, I just tell her that and it prevents a lot of problems.

I think your husband especially needs IC. He needs to talk to someone. He cannot hold this all in. I tried to do that for a long time because of where we live. Finally I couldn't do it any more.

In on of your last posts, you made the comment that your husband didn't want to hear from someone who failed like he did. That was a very important comment. That is how he feels. You need to tell him that he did not fail - you did. You both failed in communication. You could have made things better and didn't. Learn from that. But he did not cause your affair even though he believes he did. Try to make him understand that.

Did gemela and you answer questionarie about her, and his needs (or whatever) that is suggested here to fill in order to begining recovery?
I want to fill it with my H.. Its amazing that even I have lot years since I know him, I still dont know what thinks I can do in order to make him happy.. I know some, but not all..
As a result of my illness (hipotiroidismo) and that I started to gain weight I went to a Slim Center and there is psicological support.. There I had three "consultas" with a psicologist.. I told her about my problemas at home (all).. She suggested express all my feelings, and I did.. This was one day before D day.... I wrote my H a letter, show him all my feelings, and in that letter I was giving up about our M...

Now, I understand that give up is not what I want, but the damage is done... my H thinks that I dont care a lot our relatioship... Algunas veces no se está listo para escuchar las cosas como son, y si te equivocas, cuando la persona es muy reconrosa, es mayor el daño que haces que si no hubieras dicho nada.. Es algo que no entiendo.

Its difficult, I think if just one has "terapy",, I know I cant change my H, just myself. I know that for have a fight, you need two persons, so I have my contribution there..
About to convince my H that he didnt fail, I cant do it, I spoke with him, first he blaimed for all this... I know anyone put me a gun in order to have an EA..

DEsde hace mucho tiempo teníamos problemas,,, incluso mi esposo me había dicho "asi como estás es muy facil que me seas infiel" eso lo dijo hace muuucho tiempo... pasó el tiempo y sucedió.. Lo que quiero decir es que a pesar de saber eso no hicimos gran cosa para evitarlo.... yo me desesperaba que aunque llorara mucho y le rogara porque me hiciera caso solo lograba que el se enojara conmigo y me sentía rechazada...

En otra ocasión yo le dije que necesitaba que se acercara más a mí, siquiera para darme un abrazo... y se lo pedí "dame un abrazo" y nada,,, le dije ok voy a decirle al policia de la colonia que me lo dé... solo entonces me dió el abrazo que le estaba pidiendo.....

son cosas que pueden parecer tontas o sin importancia pero para mí tuvieron mucha... mi esposo ya lo sabe.. y él cree que yo como decimos acá "me tiro al drama" algo así como darle demasiada importancia a las cosas...

En otra ocasión, cuando la "queja" era que ya no haciamos el amor, el dijo que yo solo pensaba en eso y que si tanto quería eso entonces que me consiguiera un amante.. en aquella ocasión me enojé mucho por ese comentario.. JAMAS crei que sucedería lo que pasó... No tuve relaciones con el tipo (OM) pero como dice mi esposo "me estaba trabajando y era cuestión de tiempo" yo decía que no que jamás lo haría, pero ahora que veo todo, lo mismo dije sobre tener un A... ocultar cosas, y hacer cosas a escondidas de mi esposo... eso eran llamadas y contarle mis problemas a un completo desconocido.. vaya que estúpida fui.

Como verás cuando de comunicación se trata no hemos sido buenos mi H y yo...

Y hay muchas heridas en ambos lados que tendrán que ser sanadas si queremos una completa recuperación.

Ojalá gemela tenga una amiga de confianza, o alguna lectura para que continue con su recuperación.

Comprendo que a veces si uno está susceptible, es muy duro leer algún comentario, y aunque uno quiera dejarlo de lado, no siempre es posible. Por eso la entiendo muchisimo. Le mando cordiales a mi paisana gemela, y que esté muy bien...

Bla bla bla conmigo no? yo soy así y mi esposo es todo lo contrario, no habla, es muy introvertido.... con todo y con todos.. y yo hablo "hasta por los codos" vaya pareja no? jaja

If things bother you after this much time, they are not little things. I don't think it is ever too late to recover from some things. I view them as opportunites for communication. For example, the letter. Your H probably remembers that letter too. He is now viewing it as a warning sign of the end that he failed to recognize. You should discuss that letter with him but tell him how you really felt, why you feel that you wrote it and how you feel about it now. Just sit him down and tell him there is something you need to tell him. Don't ask him to say anything. Don't let him say anything. Just say what you want and then walk away. Let him think about it before he reacts to it. It is better if he does not speak immediately. I did this with gemela quite a bit and it was effective I think. She did it too.

Okay now you have learned that your communication style was flawed and was very ineffective. Now is the time to begin a new form of communication.

I suggest you make an agreement with your H that you set aside a time each day to talk. Let's say he gives you 10 minutes or 5 minutes. You can say whatever you want to say and he cannot answer. The next day it is his turn. He talks and you don't answer. I would keep this up for a while until both of you start letting your defenses down. Then change the rule so both can talk with the understanding that there will be no arguments allowed. If either one starts to get angry, you quit until the next day. If H doesn't want to talk, don't make him. Just sit there for the agreed time and come back again tomorrow. And whenever you finish one of your talks, I suggest you finish by saying "aun te amo y quiero ser tu esposa" or something along those lines. Always end up by making it very clear where you stand on the marriage. You cannot say this enough.

Gemela and I always held hands while we did this. Always make eye contact too. If you are outside, no sunglasses allowed.

When gemela and I did this, I was amazed at how each of us had entirely misunderstood the other's motives and intentions. It gives you a new perspective. It doesn't necessarily solve problems immediately but it does help.

I think you need to eventually find out why your H didn't want to hacer el amor contigo. That is a bit unusual and there is a reason for it that he does not want to tell you. Maybe it was as simple as your weight. Even so, it is unusual. Maybe in one of your talks, when it is your turn, try this. Don't ask him why he didn't want to hacer el amor. Just tell him that it bother you that he did not and tell him how it made you feel. You don't want to ask him to explain himself. You want to tell him about you and your feelings. If he wants to explain himself to clear up a misunderstanding, he will do that in his own time and his own way.

Juts remember that there is nothing trivial or tonta. If it is on your mind, it is important. You just don't know why yet.

You said that the two of you never communicated much. You said he is not very communicative anyway. You are expecting something from him and you are not getting it and that makes you frustrated. Maybe he does want to communicate and does not know how. When children get frustrated and cannot express their feelings, they throw tantrums or break things. As parents we teach them to communicate through words rather than actions.

I am suggesting that you need to teach your husband to communicate just as you will your daughter in a few years. Show him how the two of you can begin to communicate with each other. Teach him how to open up and talk - even if it is only to you. Be patient just as you would with a child. He has had a lot of years to get the way he is. Don't expect him to change over night.

Sometimes I think of committing to revocery in a marriage like a Mexican standoff. I am not sure you know what that means because I think that is an American invention. Anyway, imagine two people standing about 2 meters apart and each has a pistol pointed at the other with their finger on the trigger. Neither one of you wants to kill the other one but you are afraid to drop your gun because then you will be defenseless and you really don't understand that the other guy really does not want to kill you. So little by little you each lower your weapons. First drop them so they don't point at the heart. Then a little more so that a bullet will miss most vital organs. Then maybe you point at each other's leg. If the other guy fires, it will hurt but won't kill you. That is a typical approach to recovering from an affair. It might work but takes a really long time.

The other approach is to let the other guy keep his gun pointed at your heart and you throw your gun onto the ground. You let him decide what he is going to do without any influence from you. I think that is maybe a better approach. Open yourself up. What is really the worst that can happen at this point that might not happen anyway? Are you willing to risk a little pain in order to save your marriage?

Thank you for all your suggestions, sounds logical that way to start comunnication with my H... Im afraid if he knows that is a way that I learned here, he is going to be on defense (a la defensiva) . He hate when I told him about someone else experience or thoughts,, he think that Im getting too mucho influence from someone else. and that I dont think for myself...
This weekend was another bad,, night.. another discussion,, another same behaviour,, me crying at the bathroom and my H layin in this bed... He showed me his feelings about once time tha I was sleeping all morning,,for he is a weekend wasted... time for enjoy, WASTED!!! I got angry at first, now I didnt say anything, at first time, then I told him that I got tired, because my work sometimes I neeed to work all night,,, I saacrifice my sleep a lot... and even I didnt sleep my daughter need atention as usual in morning.. I explained him,, why that day I was sleeping.. believe me Im an active woman.,, all day, some nights,, and worst was that I got sick that weekend when I was sleeping, .. but for my H was time wasted..
I dont understand how a person say that loves you, but got angry with you if you are tired or sick and need time for yourself? sometimes I doubt of my H's love.... maybe he thinks that he loves me, but it doesnt...
If I asked him "Do you love me?" he answered, "you knon I do".... if I told him "I love you " he said "me too".... (can this be normal just because my A or Im trying to justify him, and Im blind about his real feelings,,,"
I told him all this, he didnt say anything as always...
Again he told me that Im not doing my best in order to have a better M.., he said that my behaviour is normal, as if I havent done anytrhing wrong... and again he said that Im not in a position to ask him something.. that I need to be happy (agradecida) that he is at home...

He is at home, but he dont sleep in same bethroom.. why for somethings as spent time together on weekends and go to movie, or something, for this he is agree, but he still put his wall between us, sleeping in another bethroom?

Im going to try new communication way as suggested.. We need to do another thing, and not keep same and same way..

tienes que hacer algo. han estado atorados por demasiado tiempo. You are both stuck and don't know how to get unstuck. That is a great benefit of counseling but unfortunately he won't go. It is his machista pride the prevents him from going. I don't think your H wants to spend the rest of his life living this way. Help him find a way out of it. Show him how to communicate. Try different things and be patient with him but find something that works.

About your sleeping on the weekend, I can see both your points. Gemela always sleeps late when she has a chance (which is a lot). That used to bother me but I have gotten used to it. It still bothers me sometimes. It is selfish. It is gemela saying that she does not care about what I want. She has decided she wants to sleep. Also to have a better marriage, gemela and I should spend time together. The only time we really have is on weekends. So if she spends her weekend in the bed, she is robbing from our marriage as well.

Now on your behalf I will say that there are times when all I want to do is sleep on a Friday afternoon (my weekend). Unfortunately I have two DDs who won't let me. So all I do is dream that maybe one day I will be able to sleep on a Friday afternoon. Actually two weeks ago the planets aligned, kids were out of the house and I did sleep for two hours on a Friday morning. It was great.

So sleeping on the weekend is not a bad thing in and of itself. Marriage involves compromise. The only thing I can see that is bad about your husband getting upset with sleeping on a weekend is that it shows that both of you are being selfish and not willing to consider the other's point-of-view. That is what is wrong with this picture. It is not the activity - it is the attitude.



Ask him how you can show him that you know you did something wrong. Ask him what he expects but don't ask in a defiant or angry way. I think this is a really important point and you need to explore it. One of the things that really pisses me off about gemela is that she show zero remorse for destroying my life and almost destroying the lives of our daughters. She is not the least bit upset about giving me HPV. I would be a lot less pissed off if she had the slightest remordimiento. But gemela acts as if nothing ever happened and that me tiene encabronado.

Mmm, in my case in one year just maybe TWO TIMES I sleep on weekend... and its because Im getting sick, or something similar...
Thats why I cant understand why my H boters.. Instead of get worry for my health he just ask more from me...
Even he is a doctor, or maybe thats the reason why his behaviour is... he always hear about sickess and people with pain.. and if Im sick, I need to be too bad in order to get my H atention... We have had trobles because this...
Is like crossing home door he is just my H.. and doctor stay out...
However he is trying to fix this,, and poco a poco we are getting better..
About my behaviour,, I ask him, How should I show him my regret, about my error?
I wrote him some letters, I gave him some things, you know,, muñequitos asking for his forgiveness (perdón)..I took his hands and watching to his eyes and I asked him his forgiveness too...
I cooked things that he likes,,, even he didnt ate anything,...
I dont know, what else? I asked him How can I change my behaviour in order to show him that I know what damage I did to my family with my mistake (mi estupidez), and guees what he didnt say anything!!!!
So, as usual Im fregada...
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

No te molestes! I am just trying to give you an outside perspective. The fundamental problem is that you two don't communicate. Sometimes even though we are adults, we act like little kids. Yesterday gemela called me at the office and I heard the kids in the background. DD1 and DD2 where in the pool and DD2's best friend, Yumna, was over and she was crying and asking gemela to take her home. She did not want to swim and was bored. DD2 then started crying because she didn't want Yumna to go home. Gemela told DD2 that Yumna had come over to play but didn't have anyone to play with because DD2 insisted on getting in the pool. They are 5 years old and you and your husband are acting exactly like them. The both of you need to grow up.

As far as what you can do to show you are sorry? I don't really know. I don't think it would be food. That shows guilt. For me, what I would want is to hear it. I would want gemela to tell me she was sorry. I would want to see it in her eyes. I would want to hear it day after day.

You are not fregada. You are frustrada. Ten paciencia. You are doing everything you know how to do and nothing SEEMS to work so you get angry. But how do you really know it is not working? People don't always say what they mean.

I used to lie to gemela to see how she would react. What convinced me to try to stay in the marriage was that she consistently said and did the same things. She got frustrated and, at times, was ready to leave. But she didn't. She straightened up her back and jumped right back in to the struggle. I would push her to the edge and she fought back. She did it time after time. That is what gradually changed my mind. You want a simple quick fix. It isn't going to happen.

In my opinion, you need to spend a lot of effort on communication. And when it doesn't immediately work, don't get angry. Keep trying.

Yes I know,, but its more difficult if just one spouse have this in mind... my H shows me interest in this only if I got crazy and say him , okk this is finish,, "we dont have any oportunity"
There are days when I feel optimistic and other pesimistic.. and sometimes I dont are, as you said Im frustrated, how can I guess what does my H like? if I ask and he doesnt answer...
Sometimes I put things in a balance (balanza) and I think that I cant have thinks that I had from my H when we were "novios" , when he was romantic, detallista, cariñoso, etc... My H told me this once.. "we cant do same thinkgs"
And maybe I need to acept that I cant have it...

He visto lo mismo con gemela. El unico problema es que poco a poco empiezo a creerlo. This is a bit dangerous. Sooner or later I think it will backfire. If you catch H in the wrong mood, he might just agree with you and you are done. I have told gemela this a few times. But I also meant it. If she had said yes let's get a divorce, I would not be married today. There is no guarantee and I can walk away any time so I am prepared to accept that possibility. If you are not, I would stop doing it. Look for another way.

Marriage and noviasgo are not the same thing. You can have romance in marriage but you also have the mundane. The marriage is what the two of you make of it. If you want nothing but to have a novio, get a divorce and go look for one but don't ever get married again. Some things were missing in your marriage that you needed. I think there were some things missing that H needed to. You just never told each other what they were. Right now is the time for each of you to decide what you want your marriage to be and then work for it.

But if you want roses every day and romantic dinners every night, don't stay married because no marriage is like that and it shouldn't be. Humans have an amazing capacity for creating boredom. If your husband treats you like a princess, buys you romantic gifts, takes you out each night for dinner and dancing, takes you out each weekend for romantic getaways, etc. You will learn to hate that soon enough. Why? Because it is boring and it is not real.

To be honest, it sounds almost like you are starting to fantasize about OM again.

No, Im not fantasize with OM, mi demanda de atención es desde hace mucho tiempo... El trabajo de mi esposo le impide estar en casa mucho tiempo.. el mio en ocasiones tambien y el poco tiempo que esta en casa, prefiere ver TV Porque dice que eso lo relaja... Y yo siento que aunque platique con el, mi H no pone atención... alguna vez me dijo que no entiende mi trabajo y por eso.. pero es que a veces ni siquiera me escucha, le pregunto "que te dije? y me dice, que? que dices?" eso es frustrante...
OM es untipo qué quizá demostró interés que en casa no tengo, pero una persona que según quiere ser solo tu amigo y no causarte problemas, jamás hubiera permitido que nos involucraramos en otro plan... Alguien que hace eso, o permite que suceda, no vale la pena.
Mi esposo puede ser gruñon, violento, y nada detallista pero es un buen hombre.. con valores morales.. y bueno ahora quizá es cuando menos cosas debo demandar de mi esposo por lo que hice....
El problema es que alguna ve me dijeron que debo ber como trata un hombre a su madre para ver como terminará tratándote y a mi punto de vista mi esposo tampoco demuestra demasiada atención por su mamá... quizá yo misma no he dado lo mismo para pedir algo similar no?''
No quiero rosas diario, pero creéme mi H es el menos detallista que hayas conocido... quizá compensa eso con el hecho de que no tiene vicios.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" />

That made me laugh because I think you just described about 95% of the marriages on the planet. This happens in a lot of marriages at times. Marriages also go through cycles of ups and downs where this happens for a while and then goes away for a while.

But instead of confronting the problem and trying to find a solution in cooperation with your husband, you went and found someone else to solve your problem. And it sounds like you are defending the OM as well which is not a good sign. So you were selfish. You wanted attention and you got it.

Okay the good thing about this post of yours is that you said something practical that can be addressed.

You need to study up on this web site of the policy of joint agreement (POJA). Your husband is never going to be Prince Charming. No husband is. That would be fantasy. But you can expect certain behaviors from him because he is being selfish too. As far as a woman treating her husband like his mother, who ever told you that caca de toro? Pura mierda de mi punto de vista. Nunca he deseado tener relaciones sexuales con mi Mama. So forget that stupid idea.

Your husband likes to watch TV. You don't like your husband to watch TV.

You want to have conversation with your husband but he doesn't want to listen to anything you have to say.

You want to talk about your work but he doesn't understand what you do.

You should come to an agreement with your husband that he can watch TV at certain times and turn it off at other times. If he likes to watch TV so much, try watching it with him every once in a while.

Set aside a certain time of the day (without interruption from daughter) where you two talk. No TV. No telephone. That will be hard at first but don't stop. Even if you sit there and stare at the wall and say nothing, don't stop doing it. It will get better.

As far as your work goes, I wonder if your job does not threaten your husband in some way. He seems like he is trying to belittle it. He is telling you it is unimportant but it probably bothers him very much. It seems almost like emotional abuse. He may be jealous of your work and it upsets him so he tells you that your work is insignificant and meaningless.

As far was what OM would or would not do, don't waste my time. You have no idea what he would do. He is trying to get himself involved with a married woman so he is worthless scum and there is nothing good about him. He is el diablo en la carne. Good men don't get involved with married women - especially in Mexico! You know that. He knows that. Why are you defending him?

Spend you energy with your husband. Look for ways to turn your marriage around. Look for compromise. Let him have days where he can do what he wants and you have days where you do what you want. Get involved with his life and involve him in yours. Talk about the reasons why he looks down on you. Ask him why your work bothers him. You said you just got a promotion. He knows you are finding sucess and that probably bothers him more. Your husband has centuries of cultural breeding going against him. What is happening in your marriage is not unique. It is all too common. Did his mother stay at home and take care of the house? Did your mother? What is different about your marriage as compared to your parents? What do you expect marriage to be? Maybe both of you are just a little confused.

Im not agree with you, when you said is "caca de toro" about how tratas a tu mamá, me refiero a cómo la tratas, a si te preocupas por ella, si le llamas, si tienes detalles con ella...si una persona ni lo hace siquiera por su madre, menos lo hará por su esposa... es cuestión de cómo te educaron... que valores te enseñaron... yo creo que en el matrimonio, cada uno trae además de la personalidad, las costumbres de casa, la forma de vivir de casa.. Por ejemplo, en esta casa donde vivo tiene unos closets muy pequeños y mal hechos.. en casa de mis padres siempre tuve unos closets con suficiente espacio.. así que a mi me molesta que la ropa se maltrate o que no quepa en el closet.. Mi esposo vivió en una casa donde no había closets entonces para él no es importante el mejorar los closets de nuestra casa actual..Sus padres se divorciaron, los mios con todo y el alcoholismo de mi padre siguen juntos luego de 39 años de casados.
PAra complicar más todo sobre nuestros antecedentes, mi suegra, es ama de casa, solo cuando su esposo se fue y no tenía dinero entonces trabajó solo un tiempo, porque se cansaba mucho... sus hijos padecieron mucho.. por falta de dinero... en mi caso mi madre tenía dos trabajos, uno de mañana y otro de tarde.. y nunca nos faltó lo necesario a mi hermana y a mí... Asi que la imagen femenina que pudiera tener mi esposo es todo lo contrario a lo que soy yo.. Yo jamás esperaría a quedarme en ruina para hacer algo por mis hijos... No quiero que se lea a critica destructiva, solo es cuestión de formación... a mi suegra la educaron para atender al esposo, cocina delicioso, saber labores manuales, artesanales... incluso les llevaba el desayuno a sus hijos a la primaria a la hora del descanso!!! en mi caso me educaron a desayunar siempre en casa aún sin hambre y a comer de todo...
Como verás estas diferencias de por si implican ajustes en el matrimonio, mi esposo dice que no quiere a alguien como su madre, pero sus acciones y actitudes me dicen que si... se molesta cuando no puedo estar en casa y él si...y no está conciente de que hago muchas cosas además del trabajo...
Amo a mi esposo, pero la forma como me trata no me gusta... obviamente no es siempre así, pero ahora eso se exponencializa... Ayer por ejemplo, me gritó "Haz lo que quieras" y no había razón para que se pusiera así.... AMBOS tuvimoso trabajo en la noche y AMBOS Estábamos cansados.... así que le pregunté "porque te enojas? porqué te pones así? " como es su costumbre no me contestó así que me enojé e hice lo mismo... cuando el me preguntó algo yo tampoco le contesté.. y adivina que.. en lugar de platicar, apagó su TV y se fue a dormir a su cuarto.. dejándome a mí todo lo demás de la casa, nuestra hija y todo... es lo más fácil,,, no enfrentar las cosas, lo más sencillo y salir y evadirlas...
Es en esos momentos cuando me pregunto qué calidad de vida quiero para mí, para mi hija... no me gusta que me traten así... y de mí depende que lo siga permitiendo.. siempre que le pido que no me grite de esa manera... no dice NADA.... a veces solo dice: es que me desesperas... no lo sé... estoy frustrada.
Todo en casa debo verlo yo.. de mi H no nace ninguna mejora o ayuda para nuestro hogar, él prefiere salir de casa siempre a tener su casa ordenada y bonita... se molesta cuando le pido ayuda,,, a veces promete hacer algo y no lo hace nunca,,, o lo hace de mala gana porque yo ya me enojé....
Y como yo fui la que tuve el A, entonces eso me convierte en la bruja del cuento,,,, y en teoria debo aguantar todo? y de mi depende que mi M funcione? no lo creo... el A es una consecuencia de algo más... mi esposo dice que no hago méritos para que me perdone..y conociéndolo jamás haré los méritos necesarios para que me perdone...
Estoy como quiero estar,, frustrada y a punto de la desesperación.. a punto de que me igual seguir o no... o quizá de seguir pero así como zombie, sin esperar nada de mi H, NADA....asi dejaría de sentirme deprimida...

I think we may be tugging on two ends of the same rope. I agree with what you say about treating people. I just don't think that I would ever think about marrying a woman like my mother.

It sounds like you have a lot of valid complaints. Unfortunately none of that justifies you having an affair. If you have problems, you solve them. You don't go looking for companionship outside the marriage. You deal with your problems and if there is no way to solve them, you get divorced.

Set that aside for the moment. It sounds like you tow desperately need counseling. This is not something that is just going to work itself out with time. If you let this go one long enough, you will eventually hate each other and the violence could even turn dangerous. You can't just learn to live with this. If your husband refuses to seek counseling, is there a way you could separate for a while?

You should really translate that last post into English. I am sure a lot of people would be interested in reading it and maybe they could offer some good suggestions.

Hi
Translate last post to english? Im afraid right now I dont have too much time to do that... maybe later... yesterday I didnt come here to work, because I had troubles with my H late at night... I was depressed because I got a medical diagnostic, not very optimistic, acording to my doctor, Im going to be diabetic early.. and I have another problem with a hormone that can be worse than now and I can have a tumor on head later... so I was suprised and depressed... my weight problem is not my biggest problem and this is another condition to others diseases...
I try to be positive everytime, so I thought ok, I need to reschedule my day, and put some time to myself.. for cooking health food, for doing exercise, for a MC...I called by phone to my H for share with him my feelings... and he almost regret me... because Im very analitic about doctor's diagnostic.. I have visited three doctors and none of diagnostics are same, so its a little confusing... anyway today Im going to have some medical results and Im going to visit another doctor..
My H was too much cold about this... I want to try natural remedies, and alternative as homepatic medicine... but my H never support me in this...I told him how depresed was, I told him "in this moments I realy need you... Im sick, I feel blue, I feel too bad, without energy.. worry about my daughter if I got worst."" and he said "Do you think that just because you are sick I should forgive you?" I never asked him for his forgive... I just ask for support, some word for keep trying and to keep fighting.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />
I realized that Im alone... even he is at home, he sleeps in another bedroom and he doesnt care about me.. my health... my job, .. nothing...
I felt bad Monday night,, my daughter was awake so I asked my H if he could go home at least for one hour in order to take care of my daughter because I needed to cry a lot... My H was angry because I started to cry by phone... he accepted to go home, but he was angry, with bad humor.. and he hanged up phone.. I got angry also and called him again asked him not go to home.. I knew that could be worst if he went home angry and me angry too...
I cried and my daughter asked "what happend mamy?" believe me, its was so difficult for me that moment, I just needed to release all that pain inside.. I got quiet... I asked God for streight for avoid my daughter to see me in that way.. and I went to sleep..
My H came home and he was angry... he said in bad manner "what happen with you?, why you asked me to come here, I was busy at work?" I got angry then.. and we started to argue....
He left home and I was speaking with him, nor even he said, bye.... I got furious because he left me speaking alone.... so I called him by phone and I told him, return here...I want to drink alcohol, I want to get drunk and I need you to take care of our daughter.... (I didnt want to drink, I just use this to force my H to return home, I know this was bad but I did it)
He returned home furious... I told him Im going to drink as you do in order to forget things and feel me better just for a moment... I was give my H back (de espaldas in spanish) and he hit me in my head... I was in shock because I even didnt expect any hit... others time when he hit me we were argue, and I was "prepare" but this time I was giving him back..
My first reaction was tell him how cobard is hitting a woman by back... and I prepared my luggage.. he said, you are not going to go out with my daughter... we pushed and pull each other ( I dont know if this is the right way to describe this).. and my daughter... wakes up and she showed afraid from my H.. so he was furious with me.. he started to shouth "because of you my little daughter has afraid of me"
He pushed me... and I told him "you want to hit me right?" he said "I want to kill you, you destroy my life, I dont know what did you do with OM!!!"
I was downstairs and my daughter asked if dady is going to go with us in this trip, I told her no, not this time... and she started to cry.. I couldnt with this... I decided to stop my daughter pain... I quit to my plan to leave home...
Im frustrated about this... when finally all this nightmare finished,, (4am) I went to my H bedroom and asked him, what do you want? can we go tomorrow with a lawyer in order to get divorced inmediately? he said yes... I only make you suffer and my daughter too...He said Im going to leave home..
Yestterday, he said, Im going to leave home today, I just told him "is your decision, your choice",,, and he didnt leave home...
Then I help him with his lunch, and he hug me and told me Im sorry!!... and he started to cry... again my daughter was awake so I asked him not to talk in that moment...
All family are suffer.. violence is more frecuently.. I dont want to give up, I want to fight last time, this time... but Im afraid that both should change our behaviour,, and put all our effort in order to keep our marriage alive....
Im not agree keeping same way... we are a time bomb... and sometimes this bomb explots,, and now we hurt us .. I feel my selfsteem low, under the floor.. today at 5am I wake up to the bathroom and I remeber the moment when I felt my H hit over my head I was in shocked, I started to cry again...
Today at work all several coworkers asked me "how are you?, we were worry about you, my boss know that Im having problems in home, and Im afraind my coworkers knows that we are suffering violence at home."
Im confused.. and for some moments I want to stop trying and get a divorce.. others I think I good days, and I want those days again...
Yesterday night I went to my H bedroom and I said him good night, have a nice rest, I love you.. and I gave him a kiss in his cheat (mejilla?).. and he asked me a kiss in his mouth... and I gave him just a little one... (we called him a kiko, a bird kiss) ....
Last friday, I write to my H some mails,,, I asked him what does he want? if he want to stay with me or not? , but he havent answered anything yet...
I dont know what to do...

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I was reading your post and it made me think of lemonman operating to save the life of his WW's OM and comparing that with your husband who is a doctor and couldn't care less if his wife has a critical illness or not. I don't know what kind of doctor your husband is. Is he a veterinarian?

I think you did the right thing packing your bags and leaving. I think you made a mistake by coming back. Your husband sounds like he is quickly falling into a cycle of violence. IMO I think you need to get out of that situation until your husband decides to get help. Sooner or later he might really kill you.

Your fights remind me so much of gemela. When he left, te dejo con la boca abierta. And when he came back and you got angry, le diste la espalda. I guess that is a Mexican thing or whatever but gemela has taught me through painful lessons that those are the two cardinal sins of arguments. You two being Mexicans should no better than to do those things. I am not criticizing you - just an observation.



These few words speak volumes. It seems to me that he is completely obsessed with the affair and is playing out the whole fantasy in his mind. His imagination is far worse than the reality.

Is it possible for you two to separate? Write him a Plan B letter and explain why you are separating and what you require to happen before you will agree to get back together. I don't know that much about Plan B but, if I were in your position, I would do it. The violence is just not acceptable. It will only get worse. How do you think this is affecting your daughter seeing you two shoving and hitting each other? Seperation is not the same thing as divorce. I think you have to do something to get your husband's attention. You need to force him to get help - to go to counseling. He doesn't think he needs it or doesn't want the embarassment. At the moment, you are letting him get away with it. If he wants the marriage, he will do whatever you need to get you back. Also, separation will shine the spotlight on him. He will not be able to pretend to his friends and coworkers that all is well.

There is no good reason to stay in the situation you are in. Very soon you will lose all your love for your husband. Sooner or later he is going to hurt you very badly. Your daughter is going to suffer for this the rest of her life.

Ohhhh yesterday I wrote a big post... and its gone...!! I thought I posted yesterday...as it became big, I thought I should stop write and save it,. I didnt and I lost it!!
Anyway two nights before I had a conversation with my H... I realized that he try to avoid "enfrentar el problema"... he tries to leave all his pain, and "rencor", hide it, he doesnt want to see any relative..he said I leave him without dignity...
Im almost convinced that maybe he doesnt love me anymore.. maybe my A was so devastated that kill all love.. thats explain me why he doesnt show any interest in me, in my healt, in my stuffss, my feelings...
Im not angry with him, not anymore... Im sad, and I need to accept that I cant force him to love him, or to forgive me...
I told him that we need to do something about all this.. we have two options,,,, keep same behaviour and destroy all love, and our daughter life living in this environment with violence and no respect... or another option is to made a commitment about our marriage.. but this time... leave away all our revange feelings, "resentimientos", pride... and do just things in order to improve our relationship... stop to be on defense "estar a la defensiva", this commitment we just could do it with professional help... as we have showed our inmature and bad comunication..
He answered me that he need time to decide. because that commitment for he would be too difficult... then I suggested that ok, both need time but we should be away from each other in order to think and be quiet...
He said he is going to think in all this.. maybe this weekend he is going to tell me what he wants... what he thinks...
My behaviour as I dont want another fight,, is like if nothing would happened last monday,, I still keep atention in my H's breakfast, lunch, supper, and even in his clothes...
this is first time that even Im depressed and sad I dont stay without speak.. or angry...
By the way, just to clarify... my last post I tried to express that when he hit me,, he did it by my back... "por la espalda" so I was "unprepare", "desprevenida"...
Even all this,, last wednesday we bought a membership on a sport club.. (too expensive I thought by my H said yes, we should get in),,,, this membership is for a couple... so I need to reschedule my days in order to include excercise... (I need to find a babysitter for my daughter, because I want to do exersice early in the morning)
My H asked me yesterday during our conversation "With who did you speak? why are you asking for a separation?" I told him wiht anyone,, I think this would be healty for our relationship.
Im optimistic about my health.. I want to put whatever I need to lose weight, and increase my energy, and release stress, with exercise...
About my H I dont know... at least we are doing or we are going to do something different of all behaviour...and I love him.

First, if your H loved you before the A, the A did not kill his love for you. It takes more time than that. If you two stay like this for a long time then you both will stop loving each other. That is why you need to do something to get him out of his hole now. Sooner rather than later.

If he did not love you, he would not be so angry about the A. If he did not love you, he simply wouldn't care. You would say you want to leave and he would say "good idea - take care of yourself".

I was not suggesting you separate from your husband permanently. I am suggesting you do something to a) avoid being abused and sucker punched and b) shake him up into doing something. I was hoping with time that your husband would view things differently and begin to talk but he is still obsessed with the OM.

If going to the health club is something the two of you will do together then that seems okay. I have to admit though that getting gemela, who has just had an affair, a health club membership is probably not something I would ever do. This raises some red flags for me. I think you should be very careful and don't get too friendly with any of the other members (hombres). I am willing to bet you right now that this membership is going to result in some fights. Just be careful.

Hi,
Well, again we are in good days, I think my H tried to leave my EA away just with time... Im afraid that would be possible,,, but not healthy for us..
As a result of our fight, my H told me that he miss me and now he returned to slep to our bedroom...(I asked him)

I need to be patient than ever,, and put all my effort to make my H love me again....

Im going to gym alone... I just go two days per week.. Im prepare and I know I need to avoid any man frienship... and Im going to be alert...I think in my case gym is going to help me to deal with my stress and frustration... and most important, for my physical health.. I dont want to be diabetic so young...

Im swimming and I like it a lot... I wish to go more time per week but I dont have who stay at home early with my daughter meanwhile she is still sleeping..

I need to be smart and discover which are my husband's needs.. I know admiration is one of most important,, Im not sure how I can showed him how pride I am when he told me how he operate (opera a sus pacientes) and how grateful are they..
I had told him this but as a result of my EA he denied everything. he said, Im not showed him any interest...

Well I need to look for a MC... at least for me...

How are things with gemela and you? I dont know details of your case.. just what you wrote in this post...

What you will probably find is that things will seem to improve with time but that his anger will return unexpectedly at times. Just be prepared for it. Don't get angry and tell him you thought things were getting better and don't get frustrated by it. His anger coming back is "normal". This is especially true since he refuses to seek help.

Be very careful at the gym. That can be a dangerous place and even more so since you are going alone. Gemela and swimming pools - that's how our problem started.

Keep doing things to build back your husband's confidence in himself. Keep telling him you love him. If admiration is a need of his, always compliment him on things when you can.

Gemela and I are not doing well at all. I think that is mainly due to the fact that she, like your husband, just want to pretend that this will all magically disappear some day. Most recently, she called me two days ago at the office and told me she had to go into town to buy pasta for lasagna as she had committed to take lasagna to a lunch for some Latin women the next day. Unfortunately the commissary here did not have the pasta.I told her to call a taxi and come pick me up after work and we would go together. She called back and said there were no taxis so she would have to take the bus. I dropped her off at the bus stop and went home to take care of the DD's. On a hunch, I drove back to the commissary and found dozens of boxes of pasta for lasagna. She came homw over an hour later than she should have for what she told me she was going to do.

This was one of her tricks during the PA. Make an excuse that she had to run to the commissary to get something. Two hours later she would come back and say she was late because she ran into a friend in the commissary and they got to chatting. So I am tired of her lies. I don't know what she did in town but I don't care either. I have had enough and I want her gone.

You need to be totally transparent with your husband. Don't let him have doubts about anything. That may make you feel like a prisoner at times but it will greatly help your recovery. It is just a price you have to pay. I hope things continue to go well for you. Don't talk to guys at the gym. Don't ever communicate with OM again. Be honest and open to your husband.

Mmm, I understand your "desconfianza" about her delayed in town...
That is something we (BS) need to deal, because everything is "sospechoso" as we had lied and hide things once.
I think a BS without support, and even if he or she thinks is recovered, is vulnerable...is like an alcoholic that knows that for him a first drink is enouhg to failed again and he needs to avoid it..
Even I feel I learned the lesson, I accept Im weak about this, and my M is not recovered so I need to be careful, and avoid any frienship male...
I dont understand why are you dont care about what gemela did in town.. why did she delay? Maybe you are "harto" about doing same things, research about if she chat with a friend or which was the real reason?
I dont understand ... or maybe I didnt understand.. are you telling me that you want to gemela leave your house? or just because you are mad you wrote that
"I have had enough and I want her gone."
I want to ask you another thing.
HAve you had troubles in your work as a result of your troubles at home?
I had and yesterday my boss told me a bad news for me, he reasign me another database (less important than the one that I had administrated for more than 3 years) and he said that at this moment Im not put enoguh atention...For me this was shocking.. but I need to be objective ant he is true... but right now I feel like a failed woman... not just at home but in work also... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I feel blue... <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

I think you pretty much "diste al clavo". Yes, "estoy harto".

I don't really think, after hearing the explanation, that gemela did anything in town. What I realize, however, is that she has complete disregard for my feelings. She is still being totally selfish and I feel like she expects me to just deal with all my problems. The question is why I should have to investigate what gemela did. "Normal" husbands and wives don't have to do those things.

Yes I had a great deal of problem at work. I became almost non-functional. Fortunately for me, even in my poor mental state, I still outperform the majority of my peers. My company has pretty low expectations of its employees. While that may sound like a good thing - trust me - it is he11. I prefer to be excited about what I do. Anyway, this is where AD medication really helped me. The bad news is that it took about 4 weeks for it to take effect. If you are not taking AD medication, I highly recommend it. I also went to my boss before starting the medications and told him honestly that gemela and I were having problems and that I was depressed. He did not need to know the details. My boss is a family man by nature and was very understanding.

Anti-depressant medications do not keep me from being depressed but they allow me to deal with the depression and allow me to focus on projects at work.

Hi, tear...

I understand you feel like a failed woman...at work and at home...you aren't, you know...

Your boss made that choice not based on who you are, but where your focus has been...doesn't mean you failed...

Same way with the affair...you lost your focus...

You might not have known you control your focus...you choose it...your thoughts...you do not have to obsess and worry, if you don't choose to.

Is that something you'd like to work on?

LA

Hi
You're lines show you more than mad,,, HARTO.. and Im wonder:
How show your anger?
How you let those feelings away? Are you drink? are you speak with a friend? are you hide your feelings to your wife? are you having professional help? I think you are , thats why you are takinkg pills for depression...
Have you ever doubt about gemela love for you ? ( wow I think I wrote bad the idea, Has dudado alguna vez del amor que te tiene gemela?) obviously I think when you discover her A, you thought she never loved you, but what about time after A... How can you be sure that she is in love with you? How long since you discover her A? How time in plan A? how time in recover?
Which things does gemela do and keep you in fight for your M? I know you love her but where do you take the strenght to keep fighting ? in your daughters? where?

Reading about your work, I feel less terrible, because I human and this process has been painful and difficult... when my H started to be violent, this put my love for him in test... and I just cant to focus on my work.... my boss know about my EA and he knows also about violence at home... and Im afraid he could told my coworkers about this and its so embarrassing... because you can almost read in his eyes (why did you permit this? why you dont leave him? why you are so ...idiot?) all my coworkers are man... some more machos than others... but man... and they think different...

I have been always too exigent with myself... I had excelent grades on university, bla bla bla,, and now ,know that because of my poor performance in work I lost best oportunity to keep me "actulizada" in my area... this is something I need to accept... but Im depress because this... I told my H about this and I told him I was so depress an he is not so tender as I want.. I dont know if this is because of my A of just because me.

I read article about "why women leave man?" and I feel identified about several things...and other days I think "Do I do things to keep my H in love with me?" I think answer is yes, but his answer would be no..... He didnt accept why if I love him, why I cheat him with another m....

piojito, take a deep breath.... think why you got married with gemela. dont give up!! not because your daughters, because YOU...

man and women express different our emotions, I know...

Well this is your thread and not mine but I will try to answer. It has been 11 months since Dday. Recently I went through a couple of weeks of anger but that seems to have gone away. No I don't drink alcohol any more and haven't for almost two years except when we go to Bahrain specifically so gemela can drink "Sol" beer and I join her.

I was getting help but am no longer because gemela stopped that for me. I am taking AD medication which has helped a lot - primarily in my work.

I used to believe that gemela loved me but now I don't. She has told a couple of friends that she never loved me in all our marriage and that she never really loved anyone until she met OM. Now I believe she is still in love with OM and is only staying here because of the children. That is the only reason I let her stay too. They are the only strength I have any more to try to salvage the marriage. I have been in Plan A for almost the full 11 months and we have not yet begun recovery in my opinion because gemela is still not working toward the marriage. Gemela is just sitting by and waiting hoping that this will all somehow magically get better by itself if we ignore it long enough.

I am glad your boss knows about your problem. That will help you to an extent. If he tells others, that is very unprofessional of him. Even so, people are people. Don't be ashamed when you go to work. Don't be paranoid. Go to work and hold your head high. Be proud that you have taken ownership of the problems you have created and that you are even taking physical abuse to try to right the wrong. You say you are muy exigente. I tend to think you are muy especial. You get mad when you fail and you probably even consider your problem with your husband a failure. Don't be so hard on yourself. You can't change the past but you can learn from it and make a better future. You lost an opportunity at work. Make another. You lost your old stale marriage. Make a better one. Take all that strength, creativity and perseverance you used to get excelent grades and use those in more productive endeavors - your life, your family, your marriage, your job. Dig down and find where you are strong and use it to your advantage.

And if you have a coworker look at you crosswise, just tell him que se vaya al carajo. Keep your head up. Hard to do when you are depressed.

gemela and I have to separate. I just don't see any other way. Right now she is like a classic "country club" mom. She doesn't need to fix any problems because she doesn't have any problems to fix. If she gets a little depressed about not loving me, she can just go off and daydream about OM. The rest of the time she can stay distracted and keep busy. I think she needs to have all this removed from her life so she can have time to decide if it really has any value for her or not. I guess my feeling is that you don't really know what you have until it is gone. I don't think she values me or our marriage. Let her live without it for a while and see if she is right or wrong. Either way, I will be better off than I am now.

Sorry, the question I forgot to answer is if I talk to anyone. The answer is yes. I have a good friend who I work with and have known for 17 years that I vent to. He doesn't offer any advice but it helps me to say things out loud. He knows gemela well and is a good friend of the family. I went for months keeping it from him and then one day I just spilled it all. I probably spent an hour every day for a couple of weeks talking about it. Now we hardly ever talk at all about the A. We have started talking recently because he asked how things were going so I asked his opinion about sending DD's to Mexico.

I do discuss a lot of this by private email with an MB member and I get a lot of good advice. Unfortunately we are now having an EA. Yes - it is out - ToddAC and I are having an EA. I admit it. ToddAC has been my truest and best friend through all of this and he has been extremely helpful. I also get occasional whacks with a 2x4 by email from a big Viking. I really listen to him because he scares me.

It is very important to talk to someone. Not necessarily for advice. Just say it out loud to someone who cares about you and it is such a relief. More than anything it really helps you understand that you are not as alone as you feel sometimes. Even if I were going to IC or MC, I would still talk about this with a friend or two. I am always direct and tell that person I do not want advice. I have been pretty lucky. It is still all my problem. I am not expecting anyone else to solve it for me.

Thank you for all your words... your lines "me pusieron los ojos vidriosos" (almost cry) I need to be strong....
In fact I want to share with you some things about your lines, but now I cant.
I just talked by phone with my H and he never call me so it was strange... and guess what he was reading THE LETTERS!!!!
The one's that hurt him more..... he insist in that Im not telling the truth.. he told me.. "Im not convinced.." and I asked him why do you dont keep letters where OM suggested me dont give up and love you" he doesnt answer anything....
Im afraid the nightmare still continue...
I he is waiting for me to told him that I slept with OM, he can wait forever because that wasnt true!!!!
If I dont have enough troubles at work, today would be a difficult night in home...
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Im in shock, I just read a post from you (11 month later) I didnt read all, and I need to accept I dont understand some things...and ... I wish I could share with you some experiences but I cant,, you know why....
Estas bien sentimentalmente? te sientes fuerte? seguro?
No soy quien para darte un consejo but be careful with main decisions if you are not sentimental healthy.
Best wishes for your DD's....
Espero poder leer con calma lo que escribiste, esa carta que le vas a dar a gemela es tan ... bueno asi lo sientes y lo expresaste... será duro para ella...
Tu decisión está tomada,,, y aceptarás las consecuencias de la misma..
Que todo resulte como lo planeaste, y tus hijas puedan estar bien....
I want to post in your thread... espero poder hacerlo aunque desde la casa no puedo y acá en el trabajo ya sabes que he tenido consecuencias por todo esto.. ojalá pueda.


"If you love someone, let it go, if it returns its yours, if not it never was"

Are you still belive this is "caca de toro"


Well I need to leave office and go to gym, at least Im going to do some exercise, and I need to confess you that Im afraid of what is going to happen in house as a result of my H was reading the letters...
Si se atrevió a golpearme por la espalda, me da miedo....Y no me gusta tener miedo de alguien que amo....
Como puede convivir el miedo y el amor juntos?

No entiendo...
<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

One thing that MB people have pounded into me is that you can't control the other person. It does not matter what gemela does. We cannot continue like we are. It is better to have all of nothing than 50% of something when it comes to a marriage.

Gemela has always had the ability to make her own choices. I suspect that family issues (mother's disappointment and fact that father still doesn't know), religious beliefs, her personal status and all other factors make her feel trapped. Keep in mind that, although I don't know exactly how many people here now about the A, I don't think it is very many. Gemela has worked very hard to establish her status as a great mother and wife. Our neighbor's wife did the very same thing although she left of her own accord and abandoned her children believing that OM would divorce his wife and be with her forever. Instead he dumped the neighbor's wife and stayed married. Now everyone thinks and talks very badly about the neighbor's wife.

I think gemela is trying to protect everything but the right thing. I am not saying she is not interested in the marriage because I don't know one way or the other. I think gemela is still focused on the wrong things - and it is still all about her and how people view her.

Am I prepared to lose gemela forever? Absolutely. Part of me hopes I never see her again. You can't be in a position like this for a long time and not lose your love. I still love her but I love me too and I won't allow me to suffer like this any longer. Do I hope gemela decides to eventually come back? Yes I do. But I want her to come back because it is what she really wants to do. She needs time to get herself back and decide what she wants out of life.

Emotionally I am in pretty good shape. I don't have any doubts. In the past, I would have. I don't think I was ready for this until now. The fact that she refuses IC, MC, the lasagna incident, etc. are just too much.

Have you asked your husband what it is going to take to get him to believe what you are saying? I know you have probably done that during a fight but have you done it calmly and sincerely? Have you asked your husband what are his requirements? What does he need from you? What does he need in order to start believing (not trusting) you? Don't mention trust. You don't deserve that for a long time. I know it is frustrating that he doesn't believe you when you tell the truth but that is a result of any affair.

Yes I asked him (calmly) , and he said I dont know....
I asked him about how I can do deposit to our love bank.. and he said,, "well you havent be tender, and cariñosa, because you are not .. "I told him that I can learn to be more tender,, and now if I write him a word as kisses in an email or in a letter,, he just remember that I use same word in my comunication with OM so I avoid this...
AS we use emails as a communication way with OM my H dont answer my emails.... so this is so frustrated....
If I want to send him an email postcard he is going to associate this with me and OM sending us postcards... and for me is difficult.

Keep asking him.

tear,

I have a question. You say there are a couple of things you don't want to do such as send a cariñoso email or un postal electrónico. Has your husband actually told you not to do this or are you just assuming he would be offended by it. If you are only making this assumption without ever having mentioned this to your husband, I suggest you ask his permission for you to do those things.

As a BS, I could go either way and I suspect your husband might too. If gemela were in your shoes and I were in your husband's shoes, I think I might actually like to get those emails even though I knew she used to do that with OM. The reason I would like it is that it would help break down a barrier between us. In other words, she would be taking down the walls she is using to separate her affair from our marriage. I think it would help me rather than hurt me.

I recommend you give your husband the choice. Don't just assume what he will say or do. You both need to change. Don't think for him.

tear,

I have been thinking a lot about some of your recent posts and something really bothers me. I am afraid you may be projecting your situation onto mine. Please remember that you and gemela are two distinct and different people. Gemela and I are choosing to separate because, if we don't we are going to kill each other. I honestly still believe our marriage has a good chance. I think we both just need time to cool down. I think gemela also needs to get back to her roots and spend some time with her family.

Please don't lose hope in your situation just because of me. I have told you from the beginning that if gemela had had your desire to make the marriage work, we would already be well on the way to recovery. For whatever reason, she does not have your same desire at the moment.

I still think you are doing many good things. I still think your husband needs counseling. I do expect to be back on MB in another six months talking about how great gemela and my recovery is going. So just don't give up hope. The fact that your and your husband are still together says a lot. Time makes all the difference.

Argg another post lost..

Yesterday I wrote here and its missing!!!

Hi
Things at home are bad, I angry with my H and frustrated also... several times I asked him if he wanted to recover our M or not, if he wants share his life with me. This straight question was a result of some behaviour of my H that I didnt understand, some days he shows a little interest, and other none.. He is obsessed about my EA, he denies to speak about this but inside him is obsessed... he got violent sometimes, he dont want to see good things that I had done in order to recover our M.. believe me I have done a big effort, but I think Im out of patience (paciencia) . I got my limit...

During all our M (6 years) I have been the one who made almost all decisions, and my H had have less responsabilities,, this has been an issue in our relationship, and this time I have enough.

My H need to be more mature...he never answer my question about our marriage, and his behaviour is so strange,,, for him Im the one who needs to be doing love deposits on our bank love... I was doing, or at least I was trying,,, but he is blind, his pain, and pride is so big that he didnt see anything....

For example, for he is ok if we go to the movie, or to the park as family, but he doesnt want to go to any relative party... he was sleeping in another bedroom until I told him that if he didnt put something of his part, our M is going to failed...

We had a party last weekend, for me it was important, even my parents came from my town only to go to the party. Party was on Cuernavaca a town 3 hrs from here... by highway,,, I never had driven on highway,,, and I asked him go with me,,, he said I dont know, but suddenly he said " I need to work all day (on Saturday!) and I cant go" I was so mad... this showed me that he is not commited with our M... just for some things but in hole not...

Our role in our family is not equal,,, I have hole responsability of almost ALL!!! and is not fare ... (no es justo) and he said, this is not true, and he wants that I be a housekeeper, a worker, a mother, and all. and he said, "you didnt do anything!!!! " ... I need to have everything working at home, and he sometimes give money, but most of times I need to ask him for it, I work also, and my work is demanding too, so is not fare.

Its difficult to express myself in another language, but Im trying... well, last Thursday I told him, "ok thats it!!! , since tomorrow, we are going to chage our way to live here, we are going to share responsabilities, and paids (pagos?) " He got furious, and said, ok, you are more interesting in a party than in our marriage, and if we are going to divide all, I returned to the other bedroom" and he went to the other bedroom...

I feel a little relief, I dont know why but I feel a little one.... I started to record, all my payments, and at end month we are going to divide it.. now, if my H wants to eat he needs to cook himself... if he want to wash his clothes also,. All time all things that I did for him, he said it was so easy , and for him that was my duty as his wife,,, (and in that case his duty would be give me money right?)
He never shows interest about if I have money even for my daugher doctor, or something... For all things I need to remmber him about "hey we should pain gas, or electricity, or telephone, etc..."
He said he would do a deposit to our savings because we paid a membership of a sport club.. but as I never remember this,,, he didnt do.... and his reasons was "you never told me the account"

He never accept any error, he always justify himself giving guilty to others....

My father and mom was here (in fact my mother is going to leave this weekend) last weekend, and he was without speaking with them, as if they had the guilty of my EA, or something stupid... his pride machista is killing him, and I told h im, ok with you Im not gonna be in any party of your relatives... (our family lives in another town), he consider this a revange, and maybe it is... But Im so angry...!!! I can go to visit my mother in law, I confessed her all about my A (my H got angry, he didnt want to tell to anyone!) well I can go to visit, but not with my H... I dont want to go to any place with him.

Yesterday we went to shopping with my parents, I invited my H to go and he denied...

Even to feed our dog now is a respnsabiliity for both.. he is going to do it Tuesday and Thursday, and Saturday, and I Monday, Wednesday, Friday,.and Sunday.... (the idea to have a dog was him, and he didnt help to care the puppie), I was the only one to care the dog..

I know this is not helping my M my believe me I had enough... first because I had remorse about my A, even I stay at home even he hit me some times... but I think we deserve a good life, and be happies,,, and most important, my daughther.

I know my H (or I think) and for he this action is just doing what I want, and he is angry also, and we can stay this way until I do somethin else....

I dont know what to think,,, but Im so frustrated!!!! (and angry)

(BTW I drove to the Cuernavaca town, for the first time.!!! and my H didnt asked "How drove?", ) He didnt call by phone not even to ask for his daughter.. maybe he is so selfish and tried to stay in same state as a victim (as some days before D day) )
Im furious!!

Now I dont care if he eats or not, of he has his clothes clean and ironing... not... even I told him if your car get broke, you are going to use public bus,,, (becauseI always borrow him my car, becuase he work far).. but he never "see" this things....

Just the day before last time he hit me... he saw good things that I did for him... but because he was with "remordimiento" of his ira...but he never ask for my forgivnes,, he said "you have the guilty, because you got me furious!!".

My first and biggest concern is for the dog. I am afraid that el pobre perrito se va a morir de hambre.

Movie titles never translate well to Spanish so they are hard to find. I still remember the hours I would spend in Blockbuster video in Venezuela trying to describe what movie I was looking for and ending with nothing but frustration. Anyway, your situation reminds me of a movie titled "War of the Roses" with Michael Douglas and Kathleen Turner. They divided up their house into areas for each one and marked them off with tape so that each would stay out of the other's space. I am not trying to be funny. That movie, although intended to be funny is actually quite sinister and sad. In case you have never seen it, I will ruin the ending for you - they both end up dead.

I decided a while back that I did not want my situation to deteriorate to the point it sound like you have gotten to. There was a point where I began to sleep downstairs but I forced myself out of it. I think I only did it for two days. In my case I have decided that I have to separate from gemela to preserve any chance of saving the marriage. In short, we can only take so much.

If you keep doing what you are doing much longer, you will only hate your husband and will end in divorce. After that the only time you will ever talk will be to argue about your daughter. She will then become the centerpiece of your war. I think I asked you before if you had a way to separate for a while. You need to do something to get your BH out of his hole. He is going to make himself mentally ill.

First, he needs serious counseling.

You both need marriage counseling.

You both need to agree on some guidelines for remaining together while you work things out.

If you do separate from your BH, you should have a plan. You should explain why you are separating and what you require before you will agree to get back together.

Your BH has been in his obsessive state too long. Is he still drinking? I ask that because alcohol may be part of the cause of his paranoia.

I don't know how much of what you write about your husband's behavior is true or how much is coming from your anger. If everything you said were true, I am not sure why you married him to begin with. If you do get him to go to marriage counseling with you, I think there is a lot you two will need to work out. Please try and convince him to go.

Cuernavaca is one of the places I am thinking of retiring to. I have spent some great times there. Close enough to DF but not nearly as crowded, great weather.

We are not in a war. I know this is not helping my M. I want to wake up my H.
He is so passive about this,, and he is obssesed for the A..
He is going to stay in that stage until he wants....
Yes everything I said before is true,, I married with him because some time ago for me was ok if I decided all in our marriage.. since my Daughter was born and now that she is growing up, I cant do everything... and my work is demanding also... I had spoken with my H about this, but he only get mad and nothing change.

Dont worry about our pet, I not so cruel and I verify if my H feed it.. If he didnt (I do) until now my H had done days that are his responsability.

I remember somethings about that movie (here is Kramer vs Kramer I think) and we are not in that case, we are not fighting...

In fact last sunday we went to lunch together to a restaurant... we spoke a little, and we are going to pay everythin by half....

I wrote him an email yesterday, I told him that I love him but I feel that he doesnt love me,, and I wrote him that I dont know what is going to happen in our M, but I pray for help...
AS usual he never answer.

Today I invited him to the movies, no answer either,

Even he accepts the invitation to the movies, I dont want to return to our initial stage...

You are right I need a plan.

And I shouldt decide something if Im mad.

If you are not in a war and you keep going the way you are going, you will soon be in a war. That is the point I am trying to make. You may be doing all these things for your H now to try to save the marriage but, if he continues to respond as he is, you eventually will no longer want the marriage which will defeat the purpose of all the effort you are making now.

One of my biggest fears when I made the decision to try to save the marriage was that I might get to the point that I no longer wanted the marriage. If gemela didn't want the marriage either, that would be fine. But what if she did want the marriage and I didn't? I would feel obligated to stay out of "duty".

I was joking about the dog in a way but on the other hand, would you do that with your daughter? Would you make your H feed her on alternate days? I don't think so. Don't bring the dog into the middle of this either. He is just a poor animal that loves you both. Be nice to him. The dog didn't ask for this.

I don't think you can continue on as you are for much longer. Violence is still a very bg concern for me. Some obsession about the affair is probably pretty common but doesn't last all that long IMO. Your husband's obsession seems like it is becoming psychotic. He seriously needs help. How can you convince him to get help? What do you need to do to pull him out of the hole he has put himself in? How can you get his attention?

Can you expose him? Just an idea. If you want someone to stop a behavior, there has to be a punishment for the bad behavior. How can he be punished (castigado)? Punishment can be many things and not necessarily all severe. What you have done so far is not working. What else can you try?

You could try not making his food - oh, wait, that didn't work.

You could try no sex - didn't work either.

What else can you do?

Can you tell his friends and coworkers about your EA and the result it has had on your M and ask them if they can talk to your husband? I am not saying do it. I am just asking if it might help. The biggest problem I can see is that your H refuses to talk to ANYONE about this. He needs to let out all that rencor he has built up inside.

Well, my H until I know is not drinking,, and last time when he hit me (por la espalda en mi cabeza) he wasnt drunk.
We started to divide all since past friday (just 5 days) and as he always are working, we see us few time.. two nights per week he sleep at work.. and other day (wednesday) he arrived until 11pm at home. So our life is as always.
Just his clothes, are still dirty because I didnt washed last weekend...
For he Im like a gost, and he just speak to me because of home stuffs or our daughter,.. thats it!
I dont know what to think, about your question "how can I get his attention?" I dont know,,, maybe if I lose 10 kgs!!
Im not ugly, or too fat,, just I was in better shape three years ago... my hipotyroidism only made me be more fat. but I think even this, when I use skirt (falda?) I look good, but he never sais anything....
Maybe if I go a trip with my daughter only...
Im afraid I can be in a stage where I dont care what happen to him... if we continue in this way, but why he doesnt say anything?
My parents came last weekend and he was so ,.... I dont know how to explain, he doesnt stay at home, and my mom asked me "Does he is mad because we arrived?"
As if my parents has guilty of our troubles....
About the dog, I understand your concern and your point, and my goal to do this, is make him a little more responsable, and share duties...
Let me explain you that our dog was scared about my H, because days before D day he kicked strong the dog.., just because the dog pass in front of him!! and the poor animal was a puppie... I asked my H not hit the dog,, and then you know who was the hited...!!
My H doesnt spent time with the dog, I dont understand why he brough the dog to home...
Yesterday I asked him, "are you gonna feed the dog?" and he said yes.. and he did it..
About sex, since too much time ago, we were having troubles in this field.... and I think this was a symptom that there was another trouble in our relationship.
What else?
MAybe if I change my behaviour, again ,and try to be the best wife maybe but just maybe he wakes up.. but I need to be sincere I dont want to do it not if my H dont even say ANYTHING,,,,, maybe he is havins his A? no I dont think so...
As my mom is at home he is in his world. He is very estrict with my mom, and I havent with his mom. well thats another problem...
Ok, thanks for answer me piojito... believe me if I couldnt write here, I would be crazy...
Thanks for sharing your ideas, and your experience,,, what a life! eh! you are the BS and Im the WS and even our feelings are so different we can help us.. well as someone said.. "por algo pasan las cosas" .. and maybe is good for me to know a thought about a man who was a BS as my H and maybe I can understand him. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

thank you.

Well sooner or later you are going to end up hating your husband and be desperate for a divorce. You simply cannot continue to go like you are going and just "hope that things will get better". That is where I got to with gemela. She just hoped that things would get better magically and without any effort. I took her to Bahrain for the weekend since it was her birthday. She wanted to go shop for a white gold bracelet. So she gave me the responsibility of finding the gold souk. She wore a very revealing top and then proceeded to walk around everywhere trying to hide herself with her purse. We were in one shop and she was looking at quite a few bracelets. I decided to sit down and rest a bit because I knew we would be there a while. As I waas sitting and observing her, it occurred to me in that moment that I really don't like this woman very much. It made me angry that she was buying gold bracelets. I don't know why it made me angry - it just did. If I could have divorced her in that moment, I would have.

I guess my point is that you just cannot go on like this forever. You need to do something to get your husband to wake up and get help. Until he gets help, I cannot see your marriage improving much.

my wife or soon to be ex wife had a friend she was talking to every day on the phone behind my back when i found out i took it just as bad as if she was having sex with him and i couldn't get over it,a emontional relationship is just as bad as a sexual one if not worse! once you break that trust its very hard to get it back

atalose

I understand your point of view, and Im agree, SA and EA is same, I failed to my trust husband, I lied, I was silly, stupid, idiot, ..... I was vulnerable, because I was emotional far away from y H since some time ago, before EA...

Do you know when and why do you stop to be your wife best friend?

TEAR

I'm just in the middle of reading your entire post from the beginning.
In my own case, it's been a two year journey to nowhere, and I've done a lot of reading on several message boards (it's interesting to compare the different ways of trying to solve the problem). In your case I still see some hope, as long as you stay interested in your marriage.

Just like piojitos said in post some time ago, I am concerned about any physical violence (to hit you), especially when he is not drunk. This is definitely unacceptable, and if he does not stop that you absolutely MUST get out of there. But first, tell him that you will leave if he hits you, and tell him clearly and exactly, and so that there is absolutely no doubt about it: "If you hit me I will leave you". Physical violence only gets worse by tolerating it, and it is far too dangerous for your life.

But besides that....
He is trying to punish you, and as long as he is continuing so, it means that he is still interested. All the things he does (not talking, refusing to cooperate, not doing his clothes) are games he is trying to control your behaviour. But now it is getting too long, and too far. He is inventing his own methods that he thinks will be his success. At this point he has become like a child who wants to punish his mother by hurting himself.

And this is the most important part: He thinks this kind of behaviour will get him the result he wants. He is doing that because he has no experience in how to solve the problem, he has not better way of doing it, and he cannot see that he will be getting the opposite of what he wants. He needs marriage counseling, but it will be almost impossible to make him go there - because he has been taught this macho-nonsense, a wrong image of what it means to be a "real man." (a real man does not ask for help, only a weak man asks for help, etc).

But you can start on your own. Of course, I don't know what kind of counselling you can get in Mexico, if anything at all (I am in Canada, I'm really interested in finding out what would be available in your country). Get whatever help you can find for yourself in Mexico. Tell us what is available.

You did some things already that are right. You told him, you are serious about working on your marriage. Most importantly, you are ACTING like it - you are doing, not only talking. You are on the right track. You are inviting him out to a movie, etc - that's good.

Now it is his turn. Make him understand, that you are doing what you can, and let him know it is HIS CHOICE now. (in truth it is not really, you are working on it).

Make little, very small opportunities to change his mind. Ask a girlfriend out to lunch or the movies or wherever, tell him when and where, and offer him to come along and join, and don't worry about the answer ! He has to get over this macho nonsense, just go with or with out him, but be totally reliable in what you say, which means go out with exactly the girlfriend, and exactly to the place that you said you would. Establish a new history of being reliable. You can act like a trustworthy person, all on your own, and his response does not need to stop YOU from doing so. You can be trustworthy with him or without him, and it will bring peace of mind to YOU.

Make your offers of what you are willing to do, and then leave it up to him to respond. If he chooses to walk around in dirty clothes after you offer to help, this is his choice.

Make it easy for him to respond or agree, but if he stays in his childish way, let him. Don't do it for him - he is not a child.

Hope this helps. Please, keep writing.

Thank you very much DMbx for your words....
I have optimistic and pesimistic days about my M.
Problems that made me feel that my H doesnt love me are still in our M, and now since D day are worst than before...
He doesnt want to speak about how was my work day, he prefers watch TV than speak with me, and stuffs like that...
I have spoken with him about his needs but he always got angry and feels that Im just complaint about him.. he doesnt think that is an oportunity to get closer and to have a better M.
Im agree with you I need professional help, for my own, and I need to be in peace with myself in order to be a better person, and mother, and wife, if my H shows interest in our M..
About violence, about one month ago, I told my H that if he hit me again, I would leave him... but guess what,... he did it and even I pack my luggage, I could leave my home, why? it was 3am in the morning, weather cold, and as my H started to cry because I was giving away from his daughter (3 years old) ,then my daughter started to cry also and say "mom I dont want to go anyway, I want to sleep here with dad" I just couldnt do it, and I know that this behaviour doesnt help me.. I havent failed in my promise about leave him if the hit me again..
Im afraid he can hit me again, and try again to use my daughter to keep us in house...
And another question, why should I need to leave house in the middle of the night with a 3 years old daugher? why my H doesnt leave either?
Im frustrated, when my H and I speak, he use to say nothing, and got angry... and then I try to answer the questions that he doesnt answer...
I dont know how to find a good conselour, this is a big city, and maybe I have lucky and find a marriage coselour..
Ups I need to continue working as this is the only place where I can write in this post.

Tear,

It is NEVER acceptable to be hit by your spouse I don`t care what you have done. That is an IMMEDIATE dealbreaker.

You don`t need a marriage counsellor you need an abused woman`s counsellor. You can find that type of counselling for free in any big city. Look in your phone book. Call a local health clinic. Women`s shelters can help you get back on your feet. This is what they do....they are professionals in dealing with this type of situation.

This is NOT okay. This cannot be justified. This will escalate overtime. Good worthy emotionally stable men do not hit their wives. EVER... for any reason. Your H will need to take some anger management courses BEFORE getting back together with you. You both have some personal issues to work on BEFORE you can become a strong healthy functional couple.

You leave him in the middle of the night with a three year old in tow so you DON`T GET HIT ANYMORE. Your personal safety and wellbeing is paramount here. You daughter is watching you. If she sees you living with this type of treatment she will accept the same type of treatment in her own marriage later on. You have to break the cycle NOW.

Please give a women`s shelter a call.

Hola Lagrimas,
soy nueva al foro de MB and queria saber si podias mandarme un email yo estoy casi igual que tu pero mi caso ya tiene desde Feb. 06 y han pasado muchas cosas mas... espero saber de ti pronto para darte mi experencia y poder ayudar a tu caso...

Hi again,
Giving good advice is of course a problem for those of us who don't live in your country.
In the big cities in the US and here in Canada -- a women's shelter, emergency numbers, and accomodation at 3 a.m. in the morning are available by making a couple of phone calls, or a call to the police. I assume that the situation is very different in other countries. For us, we easily give advice based on expectations that are true in *our* own cities! And that may not work very well for you.

When I said to leave him if he hits you again, I meant basically separating your life from his life for a while, whatever way is possilbe. The best situation is if *he* gets kicked out of the house, and it is him who has to find a new home.

If you leave the house, and he stays there, it means that you are getting all the problems, and he does not.
The other side of the story is this: If you tolerate physical violence even just a few times, it usually gets worse. Then the man thinks - no reaction is giving him permission to continue. Very soon he will not believe you anymore when you say you are going to leave, he heard you say it before, and it was not true.

On the other hand, if you do walk out before it becomes a habit, it may wake him up, _finally_, when he sees that he will lose everything. But, if wait another year and do nothing, and it will have become impossible to fix.

- - - We hear a lot of stories here that the police in Mexico is pretty useless (we can only guess the truth...) What other kind of assistance services exist near where you are? What are the laws? Where could you get information about what choices do have?

Do you have family? How far away do they live? How far away from your job is it?

I'm not sure if you feel comfortable talking so much about this one part of the problem, but it is important to think about it, but it is my feeling you cannot solve any other problem without solving this one?

All the best. Does anybody else on this message board knows more about services in Mexico?

Greetings. We're with you.

Daisy

Well I dont want to sound that Im justify my H. Im agree that both have a problem handling our ira...Why both? well I havent wrote here hole story.

Im not cobard, and I always said that I never accept anyone that hits me... and even Im brave I was quiet also.. I learned tae kwon do when I was a teenager... and I know more or less how to defending myself..

My A was my biggest mistake I had done in my life... and I unrecognized myself also.. but whatever I did it and I think that first time when he hit me.. when we crossed that line, I was so stuborn, and I almost provoced him... I know there isnt any justification here. but when he started to scream I scream also, and I how can I say in english, when someone is challeng you. (te reta), and I stand in front of my H even he had warned me that he could hit me...
Then he hit himself in the wall, and well, we were agree that violence is not helping anyone..
Then, in another argue, he closed his bedroom door and guess what I was kicking the door in order to he opened... and even I took a kitchen tool and started to hit the door,, then I had "sucess" and my H finally openend the door... and when he threated me about hit me again (for second time) guess what I did? I told him "ok, you hit me and Im going to hit you too, with this kitchen tool" our argue continued and finally he hit me and I hit him also with that tool and even I didnt hit him strong I left him with a shoulder hurt.. for almost a week...
Then I realized that my "defense" against his violence was to be on guard with that kitchen tool, and then as he was hurt first time, he thinks two times before hit me again...
I know that my behaviour was as bad as him, my ira got me blind and instead to solve problems, I increased them..
Third time that he hit me, was because I wanted to speak with him and he leave the house and in my frustration and desesperation, I called him by phone I lied him about that I was drinking as he did when he felt terrible.. I told him "not just you can be drunked, I can also" and he got angry and returned to our home.. and I was pretending to drink, and I put me some hearphones and I was listening music, when he hit me over my head, but I was giving him my back.... For me this was so cobard, I wasnt prepare and is something that we need to work in order to forgive and forget, and learn about this in order to not ever do it again.
As you can seen Im not a quiet woman, that keeps sitting, I defending myself.. but the idea is that I dont need to be this way right?
The tool kitchen is like a heavy harmer.
I know now that my behaviour was terrible, and thats to God that my daugher was sleeping in those moments... but I dont want to my daughter thinks that this behaviour is normal in a marriage...
I know he need help also. because he is angry with me because he said I didnt respect him and I chalenge him (lo reto) I think he is too macho
For my country stereotype Im a tall woman and Im not an inocent one..
However this facts, Im agree with all you that violence is not the solution, and if he hits me again, he is going to leave the house..
Im going to tell him in a quiet moment...
I need to take care of myself in order to take care to my daughter.. right? and I was a stupid fighting with a man, that is stronger, I put myself in risk and I learned the lesson...
When I was a girl and I fight with my daughert (4 years older than me) I always said "no matter if she win the battle Im going to defending myself, and at least Im going to leave her a brown eye) jajajaj <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
As you can see in this story I have put things in order to have the results that now I have...
"One receives that one seeds" "uno recibe lo que uno siembra"


BTW I live in Mexico City. edo mex

It is good that you are open about how things happened.
Would it help to if you communicate with your husband by writing - email, for example, just to change direction, and explain yourself that way. I know you said you sent him email, and he did not respond. But he probably read it anyways.

The goal would be to first cool things down, keep some distance, and avoid direct confrontations. Would writing be a possibility?

Even just for yourself, explain things to yourself, and make it clear in your own mind.

I have tried this... without response... as during my EA I use emails, and electronic greetings cards. My H said that all this things remember him my EA, and the way that OM called me. (love, or honey)
My H never have been romantic and OM was the oposite... so its hard..
My H said that he botters if I send him an email, or a card, because he prefers that I told him all things.. and y0u know we havent good communication..

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Hi again from way up here in Canada - summer weather outside, but inside, in my heart and mind(and yours too?) there is still a big storm.

I've been looking at your above message and wondering what to say.
In my own case (I am the BS - Betrayed Spouse), I followed the advice from a different message board. The advice there is to hold back, don't be too quick with making contact. Avoid looking desperate or needy.

This fits my style very well, because by nature I am a quiet person (a northern temperament). We've been living separate for one year now (it all started 2 years ago). It was not too difficult to keep the temper down, although that was sometimes difficult to tolerate the irrational unfair attacks on me, and I was not always cool, calm and collected. But fortunately things never got too far out of control.

Now I think so, that keeping the communication going is pretty important, especially in the early stage like the first 6 -12 months. I didn't do that and I regret, it was a pretty big mistake. Keeping quiet did me more harm then good, continue talking was the most important thing. That's why I think it's important to keep writing anyhow.

The other side is, meetings like the ones you described earlier on, need to be avoided at all cost, because it destroys any left-over love, and feels like being at risk, and it will put an end to the whole story. Your relationship won't survive the feeling of insecurity.

When he says that he wants to tell him, not write to him, I think this needs a translation: Maybe it really means he wants to make it a reason to keep the connection alive of meeting in person, because you can use writing as a method to keep him at a distance, he might be a bit afraid of that. The words have a very different meaning what they seem to be at first. Secretly he may be glad to get the mail anyhow, because it gives him a chance to loudly demonstrate his hurt.

The fact that he doesn't answer is just part of his game, giving him a method to punish you. I bet he is reading your sent messages anyhow, even if he doesn't write back. If you meet him, it should be in a place where it's too embarrassing to get too angry, that is, in a public place, not in the privacy of the home, where there are no limits. It's too hard to keep things under control.

When writing, you could say that you respect his thinking, but writing is a safer way of discussing your differences, and that you don't want to have another meeting like the last one.
So either you meet in a safe place outside the home, or write.
You'll have to overlook the exaggerated behaviour, and write anyhow.

I would like some advice about trying to get my Wife to talk about reparing out marriage. This is my 1st time on here.
We have been married for almost 11 years and have 2 girls 7 & 10.
I have recently read "His needs, her needs" and it was an awakening of what I need to do but can't get my wife to try and work on our marriage, I am still so in love with her.

She has told me that she is no longer in love with me and doesn't want to try anymore. She tells me she has been unhappy for alomost a year and that she has tried for a few months but is over trying and wants to move on.
It is my fault that we came to this. I have never cheated emotionaly or physically but was not meeting many of her needs emotionaly. She had been trying before to reach out to me but obviously I was not responding. I did not realize that she was this unhappy until recently.

We still live together and she says that she will always love me but the the feelings just aren't there for her anymore. She has told me that when our girls start shcool a few weeks that she will start looking for a job or go back to school and that she will start looking for her own place.

She tells me that I am now to clingy to her but if I would have done this months ago then it probably would have changed things.

She is also having an emotinal affair (EA?) I know he has beeting meeting her emotional needs and refuses to stop the EA. He lives overseas. She tells me that it is more like a fantasy and has said that if she ever did get with him that it would likely not work.

bhammel,

On the main forum listing, click on the "post" button and start your own thread. It will get more response that way.

DMbx,
Im agree with you and I keep trying to get close to my H.. I need to let him know that even my behaviour (EA) I never stop love him (he thinks that)..
Its not easy but I need to do it.
SOmetimes only if I got angry, he listen to me... about hear me instead of watch TV by example...
I need to stop to figure out what does my H thinks because as he is so shy, and close person, he almost always dont say anything, and Im so analytic and I figure out a possible answer.. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

Tear,

I admire your spirit and commitment...I believe you really feel what BS's go through.

Would you consider that you can't get close to your H? You can be close...you can only control yourself...you can share your thoughts, feelings and beliefs...simple sentences...and when he speaks, listen and repeat...know only he can be close to you by being there...not in your power, no more than you being close to him is in his power.

You cannot make someone feel love...they feel it. It's theirs. No one can make you know you're loved...your beliefs are your own. Acting love, which I believe you do, is from your choice to love...

Would you consider these beliefs?

We do not earn love...or punishment...that is parental...for training...teaching...and we are adults...with our own experiences, feelings, thoughts, beliefs, ideas, perceptions and perspectives...all of which, we choose...and no one chooses them for us. We do that. Respect your H as a separate, equal, whole, complete human being, as marvelously made as you are...capable of choosing to believe you love him as you are.

I used a rule of thumb which stood me well...if I didn't feel heard, I listened to myself more...if I didn't feel admired, I admired myself more...appreciated, accepted, respected...more...self-care is really important to break this earning love, filling ourselves up from the outside, instead of the inside...which destroys our marriages.

Your H thinks, feels and believes...he does not choose to share...he is capable of sharing himself...you cannot control him in anyway...not be the cause, control or cure of anything within him...you can be safe. You can not act out your anger...you can know where it comes from...find the belief...be okay in yourself with what you feel. You can share what is you, using "I feel" and "I believe" statements.

This won't change him...it will change you. You're half of the marriage...I believe when we change our interaction change.

As DMbx shared with you...and the rest of us...withdrawing doesn't work and invading doesn't work...staying present does. Being authentic and honest works. Why? Because then you are neither protecting yourself over the marriage (withdrawing) nor are you putting what is yours onto your partner (invading).

I learned to not react, but to act...tear, you can do this...you can choose what you do and why you do it, not because of what your H does or doesn't do...but from your own code, of your own making...your standards and boundaries.

Use your thirst to know, and turn it inward...do not DJ your H...or yourself. Use your analytic nature for you, inside...and be present, honest, which I believe are acts of love...

LA

LA
In this moment Im going to disappoint you...
This morning I sent an email to my H, saying thanks because yesterday he take care of me because I had a terrible pain in my hand (I dont know the word in english but its an articulation down the hand) My H is a doctor and several times he doesnt take care of me..
So taking this as a pretext I sent it and said him how much I love him,,, and kisses and stuffs like that..
As usual I didnt expect any answer but for my surprise he answered it, copying next to my email an email that I sent to OM, where I said similar things to OM!!...
My H thinks that I have sex with OM, and this is not true..
I speak about passion, in OM email, but I wasnt speak about sex.. OM is older than me and his point of view of some aspects of life for me shows lot of passion..
Its so hurt this.. Im trying and my H is obsessive with my EA...
So I cant sent my H kisses by email because once I sent also kisses to OM?
I cant call him love, because once I use same word with OM?
I dont understand.. what else can I do?
Do I need to keep for myself this anger that I feel?
I wish to explain to my H that he is obssesive and maybe we neeed to be on distance in order to decide if he wants to stay with me or not...
I dont understand..
Last weekend I had SF with my H and it was great,,, and now this,...
My H keeps a copy of last letter that I sent to OM (I wrote it before my H discovered my EA). My H keeps this letter inside his laptop's briefcase.. and everytime he read it, its like living again our D day... Sometimes he wants to get drunk becausee of this, and sometime he call me by phone and ask me "what happen with you and OM?"
Im so angry,, and sad,,, Im at the office and I started to cry even I tried to be quiet and in calm...
I failed to my family, yes, but I think I have supported somethings as my H violence and we are in same place as D day.

Do I need to keep this feelings just for me? or do I need to tell to my H?

I wish I could dissaper from here for some weeks...

I'm not disappointed in you, tear...that would be a DJ, assuming so...'k?

What you are experiencing are consequences to your A...and a lot of your anger is not at BH, but at yourself...sort through it...find where your own expectations...that your BH chose to stay, should be working harder on forgiveness, meeting ENs, changing, growing...find those expectations and stop them in yourself...we get angry with ourselves...we form our own expectations and hold others to them...very subtle, not outright...and we feel terrible pain, fear and anger, as if it is coming from them.

You had an expectation with your appreciation email...now look at what you have control over...you...and your choice to thank him remains yours...a great choice...not based on response or results...you took your step...let go the rest.

Can you see how you create a lot of anxiety in yourself when you take what happened this time and make it your future? You don't know your future...there's no always in it, is there, really? You know that for today, your BH showed you that he hurts because he doesn't choose to believe your words because they were given to another...that's his, not yours, tear...can you see that?

"Good to know." That was my phrase...it is good to know that your BH is choosing to let you know how he feels, what he believes...do not go past that into DJs (disrespectful judgments)...assumptions or mindreading his intent or your own future...stay present. Tomorrow, if you feel appreciation for something he did today, will you send an email saying those words, stating your truth...that you love him?

Or are you going to change what you do based on his possible response? This is important...because that means he controls you, doesn't it? And he can't. No more than you can control him...at all. Not possible. See the choices...choose from your own code. Stay the course and stay present...stay true.

Would you add the timeline for your A to your sigline? The dates beginning and ending; last contact...I believe there are real stages of recovery, and I don't no when NC was, or the duration of the EA...

You are experiecing great pain...of rejection...of helplessness, of finding your limits as a human...intense time, pain time...goes slowly...but it goes. Remember, this too shall pass...God's words...all things come to pass...unless you keep living what is not here yet or hold onto what went before...and if you do that, you miss your life...which is only now.

Your BH is mourning in his way...make your O&H (open and honest statements) about yourself...your thoughts, feelings and beliefs..."I felt loved when you cared for my hand. I felt hopeless when you replied to my appreciation email."

When your BH asks you what happened between you and OM...are you honest? What do you say? What is your truth? Do you know why you had the A and why you will never have another A?

LA

LA
I understand your point of view, and you are right.. Depends of me if rest of day is going to be sad an painful...
I know if I show my angry to my H he is going to stop telling me his feelings... and I dont want that..
About my EA details I have explained to my H but he is obsessive and he thinks we had an PA and this is not true.. but according to your point of view, that is his bussiness ? I need to stop get angry right? and yes is better for me... I cant change his mind, I only can change with all my effort myself....
Is his problem right? I had explained all and answer all his questions, but he wants to hear something that neve happend so our recovery is far far away right?

About why I had an A, well I think I felt lonely ,and my selfsteem was down. I "met" OM online and we started to chat, for hours, we had things in common and then I was confused about what I felt for OM... Now I know that I was blind, and I never knew that OM was so charming, as he got involved with a married woman.. And believe me we never speak as "us" or our love or something like that...
OM was a romantic man, and he always sent me ecards with kisses and thinks like that.. And I answered him in same way,,, My H didnt understand why I was so interested in OM and now I dont...
My H is "watching me" all time, you know, he is worry because he thinks Im going to look for OM.
But he is wrong.. and I havent failde in this,,,
About why do I never have another A? well I know that I was weak and that a male friendship is like play with fire in my case, at leas in this moment, and I prefer to stop a relationship and then started a new one..
I dont sure what is going to be my reaction this afternoon when Im going to see my H at home..
I wish I can be.. quiet and in calm,, in order to stop another argue as we use to had.

Thanks for reading and for your words... it has been helpfull because I was so frustrated... and in this cases Im impulsive and instead of solve things I only put them worst.

< Quote : I dont sure what is going to be my reaction this afternoon when Im going to see my H at home..
I wish I can be.. [color:"blue"] quiet and calm [/color] in order to stop another argument as we use to have.>

!!! Quiet and Calm ... by the time you are reading this you probably had your meeting already. I wish for you that you found that strong woman inside you, so that you could be calm.

From my own experience i know how difficult is is, it is very hard to keep quiet when the other person gets angry, and says bad things. It is a big struggle to stay peaceful, but staying calm is the best opportunity to create change.
If it helps you ... I tried to keep my mind on an IMAGE, picture of the person who I wanted my spouse to remember. Even if (and it probably will not be) a 100% success, it is still a succes if it happens at all.

Keep the anger down is the way to go up. Best of luck...

You're right, tear...

You can't change his mind. You can speak yours...calmly, respectfully, during the A question sessions. "I cannot change your mind, DH. I know I will earn you trust in my honesty again, over time. I respect you believe it was PA."

Can you see where there is no argument here? Acknowledge what you hear, repeat...hand back...gently.

About your why for choosing an A...this may be why your H isn't accepting what you're telling him as truth...

If this is your truth, tear...that you were blind, duped...that it wasn't your choice, then there is no safety ever again in your marriage. Can you see that? You can be duped again...if this was accidental...something you were unprepared for...because in different circumstances, it really could happen again...

He may be looking for your next OM because you believe this A sneaked up on you...he's looking out FOR you...

Can you get to a deeper truth, tear? Can you know exactly why you made the choice to betray your marriage, your H?

When you do...there won't be a "I think" in it...lonely is about you and yourself, not others...and we build our own self-esteems...no one else can do that for us authentically...praise is fake. Others' judgments do not come close to our own.

I believe you will have your H back from BH when you really get to your truth here...that is where your fear, his fear, collide...not quiet and calm. Oh, no!

You have power, tear...all humans do...we choose every single thing in our lives...what we believe, know, think, perceive and create...we choose. Know your real power...learn to understand it and embrace it. And know your human limit...you can only control you, tear...no one else on the planet. All equal and separate...and they cannot control you.

When you get this, and use listen and repeat, then you'll be choosing to live respectfully, and know that your BH cannot tear you down, build you up, make you anything...you are. You are. He is. That cuts out a lot of argument, doesn't it? Listen to his truth, acknowledge it by repeating it...and dig to find the truth of your choice...

You can do this. You are not alone. (And DMbx is RIGHT ON...you've got great support here.)

LA

Your husband sounds like he is still very hurt. He is probably afraid to get close to you again.

Give him some time.

Hi Tear,

I see evidence that you are still comparing your BH to OM. This is not fair to your BH. It is very easy for an OM to be romantic. He does not have to deal with the daily trials and tribulations of life. Can you see this? Your relationship with OM was a fantasy. Your relationship with your BH is based in reality. Loving under conditions of reality is true love; OM is still a fantasy in your mind.

I submit that you will never get over OM until you stop making comparisons between OM and BH. Can you see this?

My WW is from Puerto Rico so I am familiar with Latin culture. As you know, it is generally accepted that men cheat but when a woman cheats, she is castigated. Do you feel that?

My WW has all but been disowned by her Father and her brothers. When her Father dies, she may not be allowed to attend his funeral. She would bring shame to his name and reputatation and would disrespect him.

Tear, you are angry that your BH feels the way he does. But try to see the situation from his viewpoint. You say that he doesn't want certain emails or ecards because you sent those to OM. Can you imagine how you would feel if the roles were reversed? What if you knew that BH had sent an OW ecards and emails full of romanticism? Would that make you feel a little funny? Of course it would.

My best advice for you is to be as supportive as you possibly can. Try to see things through your BH's eyes instead of your own. It will take time for him to heal. Perhaps a lot of time.

Good luck Tear.

thanks to everyone here..
today I dont have time to post here.. tommorow

Hi guys,
Tod yes maybe you're right and sometimes I compare my H with OM... (not in a concient way) but I think Im doing less, and step by step Im going to stop to do it... I read some post that larousse wrote to gemela and I understand several things... about why we idealize OM.
Yesterday we spoke with my H about his email, do you remember? the one where he wrote some lines that I sent to OM... and I got angry.. and I didnt said anything.. I prefer this than starting another fight..
My H asked for an explanation, and I said him In a quiet way.. and well this was our first argue without fight... My H had been refusing to talk to anyone about my A and this time he called his mom... I left him in privacy to made the call and even he was mad.. he didnt got violent...
I started to do exercise and it has been so useful for me in order to let away from so much stress...
THis afternoon I called to my H asking if we are going to buy a new tire for our car,, (its expensive in the agency) and he answered me in a rude way "I dont know Im busy and he hangs up the phone", several times I had told him that if he is mad he take advantage from me (se desquita conmigo) and for me this is so sad and I feel lonely, and he havent any respect for me.. why he hang up?
Im tired of the way he speak to me if he is under stress,or tired, or bored, or busy,,,,,,
I know this shouldnt affect me in such way but it does.... I felt that Im not importan for him and he feels he can scream to me whenever he wants.... even my mother in law accept that her son has "bad humor".....
My H promised to pay phone bill, and he didnt and now our phone is broken at home,.... ALWAYS he forget to do things like this,,, but if I did, he regrets me and scream to me....
Nor even my father nor my mother used to scream to me.. maybe we should take some days separated in order to have clear what we want for our future...
I dont want that my H starts to scream to my daughter... just because he is not able to deal with his anger...
Im not perfect either,, (Im so far to this) but I accept my errors and Im doing something to recovery myself..

Im dessperate again.. Im going to pray God to give me some pacience....and peace...

Well I havent that pacience and when my H called me yesterday afternoon I answered same was as he did. "Im buzy and I hang up".... I know I shouldnt did but I was so angry, and I felt good... I dont know why but I felt good and without some anger.....
Its not fare that he always speak me in that way, so for first time I did same thing to he...
I know, I know this behaviour doesnt help us for our recovery, but I just couldnt...be quiet....

Hi, tear
<QUOTE: My H asked for an explanation, and I said him In a quiet way.. and well this was our first argue without fight... My H had been refusing to talk to anyone about my A and this time he called his mom... >

I was so glad to read this ... Anger is such a difficult thing to get under control, but here is a pretty BIG sign of change. Even if it was just for a moment, but it says that **holding back the anger made a difference.**

It is not easy at all, but you can be the better example.

Hola Tear:

I have thought about you because recently my mom was diagnosed hypotiroidism. My older sister has had it for more than 12 years. I wanted to share with you some personal observations about the way this illnes can affect the life of the paciente and the family.

As you know there are several causes of hypotiroidism and it's not easy to determinate the cause, neither the kind of hypotiroidism. Althougn in theory, once the patient starts to take Levotiroxin, there should be a follow up of exams to evaluate if the tiroide is working and if the levotiroxina has reached is normal amount. The basic step of verify that the amount of Levotiroxin is adecuate for each pacient and the blood exam of tiroidal perfil, are not done in Mexico. With out this verification, many pacientes are left with less or more hormons that the amount they need.

In theory once the hormone level is normal, all the symtomps* should disappear, unfortunately, I have not meet anyone with hypotiroidism that has recovered his the previous state.

I tell you all this because one of the consecuences of hypotiroidism is an acute rage, very fast to start and very intense. Most of the time the anger reaction is not in proportion with the cause.
Although you may never recover a -normal- level of anger, you can learn different coping strategies. It helps if the partner and the family are aware of the diferences between a -normal- anger state and one associated to hypotiroidism.

Another symptom is the acute tiredness, the need to sleep, the lack of strenght to do anything, different from the lack of desire of a person suffering from depresion.

Other caracteristics that is present in the most severe cases is a rather flexible idea of reality, a selective memory and sometimes a exacerbated libido.

The sadest part of this illness is that it has not dramatic physical signs other than the weight gain and the people around the person with hypotiroidism some times has problems to understand how it affects the daily life of the peple that has it. I hope you are getting enough medical attention and I would encourage you strongly to ask for blood test periodically, in theory some times the tiroids recovers by itself but it is not possible to know unless the levotiroxine is suspendend, under medical control of course.

I also sugest you to write a diary and to keep track of your mood changes and write your ideas. Ask a relative, maybe no your husband to help you track your behavior, it's important that you find out if your sense of reality, your impression of facts, is been impaired by your illness. The neourological aspects of hypotiroidism are not been diagnosed nor treated by the endogrinologist, in Mx.

On the marriage front...

Read again the information available on this site, the articles about Love Busters, Disrespect judgements, angry outburst. Don't make the forums your only source of enlightment although there are several ones that are very interesting at the moment. Follow Mimi in her Personal Recovery and she and others, if I could remember where, have had very interesitng reflexions about the differences between men and women. If you want to have a unexpensive comunication couching, invite LovingAnyway to your treat. <img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />)

Maybe you keep resenting the way your husband is, instead of acceptig him and comunicating with him in a way he understands.

One of the things I love more about MB is the idea of getting a plan. Get a plan to improve yourserlf and your marriage. Repent profussely and sincerely and at the same time learn to have healthy interactions with your husband.
If after you have done anything in your power to improve yourself and your half of the marriage and after you have given all proves of repentance, if your marrigae doesn't move to a recovery, then you may think on taking other steps.

It seems sometimes the FWW, orFWS, wish to start the next chapter of their lifes after admiting an infidelity, they find it difficult to understand why the BS doesn't forget about the past. The BS lives this desire to leave everything in the past from the FWW as a sign that the infidel is not aware of the impact of his or her actions and is not truly repentant, just wants to avoid the pain and the shame.

So, you can't impose a time frame for your husband to forgive you or to forget about the EA but you can implement new ways to interact with him.

Start by avoiding long talks or discussions. Identify all your strategies that in the past have not resulted for you when you try to comunicate with your husband. Although afection and caring is very important for you, it seems your husband doesn't get easily to those stages. Identify his needs and try to fulfill them. If he's not ready to talk about your needs, give him time.

All in all it seems your husband doesn't know how to be a man, I mean the family man, the head of the house. As much as you which that he would take more responsabilities, you have to inform yourself more about respect and comunication before attempting to change the roles both of you have had so far in your marriage.

Think, read, make a pause and take good care of yourself.


I hope things improve for yourself. It's difficult to keep a treat in another language. I have noticed that the posters that get more help here are the ones who are more actives about helping and changing themselves and geting a plan.

Suerte

thank you larousse for your words....I really appreciate it..

This has been one of my harder days in my life...
I think my M is finished.... and it hurts so much...!!!I think my M is finished.... and it hurts so much...!!!I think my M is finished.... and it hurts so much...!!!
Im so depressed that I need support...
Last weekend my H hang up the phone when I called him , I was angry and I did same thing to him , in house nobody spoke about those incidents, yesterday he answered me a trivial question in a rude way, I got more sad,, and worst because I had a pain in my right hand as a result of typing on computer,, it hurts aand I need to be on rest and try to not use my hand,,, (wristle?) (muñeca in spanish)
My H was watching TV and I was doing the laundry,,,, it hurts me so I asked him help.. he said he didnt heard me and I finish all alone...then I cooked and again you need to use for all your right hand,,,, I felt that my H doesnt have any interest in me..

I asked him in a quiet way,, "why do you say that you still love me?" and he answered me "because you are my wife and you are my daugher's mother" and thats it,,,,,,
He told me that he spoke with his mother and he suggested him to hang on, and support whatetever I do to him just because oour daughter,,,, and he said, I think everything has a limit and thats it...


I asked him "Do you want to be separated".. and he said "as you wish, do whateever, I dont care...,.. I felt so frustrated and sad and as his briefcase was near from me
and I knew that he kept a copy of last email that I wrote to OM... and alwaays when he read that letter he got angry and furioous...and I broke the letter in small pieces.. and he got furious and I was afraid of his reaction,, he took letter pieces from the garbage and I aasked him to throw it again, and try to recover our M..he didnt answered and he tried to put pegament to the lettter for rebuild it...

I asked, so "you are going to continue with this,,,, obssessivee with what I did.??? its morre important your pride and machista ego than our love? our family?

He said "think what do you want"

I was out of mind and I took my D and left the house... my H asked me to leave our D sleeping, I denied and I went to spent rest of night to an hotel near from house..
For me was devastaaaded, affortunately my D was sleepping but today in morning was asking me "why we are here mommy"? where is my dad? is he angry? di you fight with him?
It was terrible...




I doont know what to do..

I almost sure that my H wanted the letter becaause there I wrote that my H could use my afffair to have my D's custody,, so that is like a prof of my A..

He shows me aanger,, most of the time,,,,,, and he never apologize,, he said I should said thanks that he is in house deeespite my A.

HE called me again "baad woman" (in order to not be censurated here) and I think he believees Im one...

Tear,

Instead of taking the email and tearing it to pieces...why not ask your BH..."What can I do to help you heal?"

Instead of asking "why do you say you love me"...why not state that you fear him? "I love you, DH. I fear you do not love me. I fear punishment because I punished you. I fear being unloved by you because that's how I convinced myself to choose an EA...that you didn't love me."

Statements of truth...and no, tear...grabbing your DD, an INNOCENT in your marriage...and going off...Tell, Tear...did you do that when he hit you? Did you think to remove you and your child from his violence? But you do from his disdain, his heartbreak, YOUR discomfort...

Do you have priorities? Do you want to keep reacting to your life or choose it?

When you asked for his help with the laundry...and he said he didn't hear you...then why did you CHOOSE to continue? Why not come into the room, say "DH? I need help with laundry and dinner...will you be my right hand for a half hour, please? I'll be the left one."

And I'm with BH...yes, Tear...I have told my H many times, "Thank you...thank you for your presence, for your choice to stay in this marriage." You have cut him to his core...gone to what is a core hurt...and time, effort, consistent dedication is needed...and you aren't doing that.

You are still wayward, Tear. You are resentful, demanding, not working on your own personal recovery, your own boundaries...you don't even know that your A was your choice...yours alone...hence, you don't know if you'll have more, do you?

What your H believes, thinks, feels...are his. Not yours. Not your doing...your actions hurt everyone...you, your daughter, your H, your extended family...all in involved...but we each bear the responsibility for handling our emotions...they are ours. Show me how you handle yours? When you feel anger, do you sit with? Look behind it and find fear or pain or both? Do you trace back that fear to a belief you've had since you were a small child? Is that belief even valid today?

One might be that if you say you're sorry, you'll be forgiven. That's from our small child..."Say you're sorry to your sister!" Guess what? We are adults...we have to own every part of what we did, why we did it and vow to not do it again...and MAKE amends...for a small child, saying "sorry" is amends...we forget to teach our children, as they grow, so does their responsibility, and the size of their amends.

You know what to do, tear. I see you refusing to do it. You retaliate--you punish back, you hold him to your standards...tell him he should be different...not hurting himself with the email...not being angry, hurt or fearful of you...why? Why do that, tear? He is an adult...he is in charge of his own stuff...you are not. You can only control you...and you keep looking at him, as if he controls you...YOU CHOOSE, tear. You are choosing your life and experiencing the consequences of your choices.

Choose not to do laundry or make dinner...rather than resent. You will not die of exposure, or starvation...you will emotionally die of the poison that is resentment...and you are giving it to yourself.

LA

LA
In fact I had asked my H about ..."What can I do to help you heal?"
And he didnt answered anything..
And also I said that "I fear you do not love me. I fear punishment because I punished you"
And in this case he said, maybe...

He said I humiliate him... that I never respects him as a person..

In our M all decisions or almost all I do..

I know it was stupid, and inmature my behaviour, I just exploted...

I thought I was working on myself recovery, but now I know that I just do it for a short time..

I need my H supppport.. I need a hug,,, yesterday before the terrible battle,, I told my H how much I love him, asked again for his forgiveness and he started again as in our D day to scream to me and he said bad things...I deserves I guess..

He is doctor and he said Im a crazy woman...

I know I was as a crazy, and my D is innocent in all this,

I dont now what to do..

<img src="/ubbt/images/graemlins/frown.gif" alt="" />

Don't do anything... Breath.

Read our lasts responses to you, think what things of what has been said you can apply right now.

I'll write more in a little while.

((( Tear )))

I'm sorry you had such a hard weekend.

I found very useful LovingAnyway insights about personal responsability and personal recovery because I feel she has strugled really hard to overcome several situations. I think she has a very practical, yet deep way to analyze the way conversations go between a couple and has very clear comments about how to improve the way conversations go.

Tear, I feel you are in pain and some of this pain comes from feeling guilty and ashamed. Once I read a very enlightment threat by LovingAnyway about the way guilty and shame affect our responses and actions. Mayebe LA would like to talk about it if you are interested.

I'll try to break in small paragraphs what I see in your situation.

Before you can control you anger and your impulsive actions you have to understand where do they come from and how they affect your H and D.

It's hard to understand and internalyze that men don't react well to over emotional reactions and conversations. They feel impotent in front of long emotional tirades of recriminations and acusations and they tend to close themselves to what is been said. I understand that it offends you that he calls you crazy but think for a moment the image you are projectiong to be called that way.

I have the impression that you situation has solution but that it would require time from your side.

Believe me when I say that long draining converstations won't solve your problems right now. Avoid relationship conversations with your H. First you have to learn to talk to him in a different way. If you keep trying to talk to him the way you have been doing it so far, your relationship will keep worsening.

If he wants to talk about it or he recriminates you, try to validate his feelings, here would come in place LA comunications methods. If he says you have humiliated him, ask him to clarify, repeat what he says, understand his feelings and his position. Don't defend yourself.

You are still under the emotional impact of the discovery of the EA, you can't work on the other problems in your relationship right now. First your husband has to want to stay in the marriage and he has to grieve the pain of your affair.

Stop talking about separation and divorce. Take one day at a time, one step at a time. Everytime you go out of your house in an anger impulse you damage the trust your husband could have on you and on your desire of continuing the marriage.

I feel a lot of resentment on your side about everything you think you husband hasn't done in the marriage. I have not experience with that but I think you can't work on that at this moment on your relationship, you have to build trust in you, trust that you are not going to have another affair, trust that you can understand his feelings, trust that you want to remain married.

So, when you go back to your home, avoid relationship talks. Take some days to reflect about how you can improve your reactions. Remmember that a needy, crying, nagging wife is not attractive. Take control of your emotions before attempting anything else.

I hope you have a smooth week.

thank you larousse
You are absolute right!...

Im the one with problems, I need to forgive myself, and know me enough to avoid my bad behaviour..

I need professional help, but I dont know how I can schedule it because Im so buzy and I need to spend time with my family... but I need to do something..

And yes first is to think and no react...

Yesterday I hug my H and said him Im realy sorry, I just was frustrated, and angry, I need to be a better person in order to deal with my anger, and never never, do same thing again...

At the beginning my H refuses my arms, I realized how damage I cause him because my inmature behaviour... I realized so many things.... and I insist, in a good manner and finaly he responsed to my hug both cried together,,, it last just few minutes but that hug means too much for me
He said with tears in his eyes, that he loves me... (sometimes I think he doesnt love me, but this is my problem)

you lines "Remmember that a needy, crying, nagging wife is not attractive", gives me something to think, I havent been a good wife... and even my H is cold right, he has the reason to be this way.. and I think I can ask for something that I havent done first.

I need to do something with the thing that I just can write in this site from my office.. I need too much work to do and I need to express my feelings, here... I want to share my case and I like to share it because this can be useful for someone... Feeling that we are not alone is a good beginning.

Thanks for all that have use their time to post and suggest me somethings and shared their feelings.