I have been paying the mortgage on the house (separated since April) and next spring I have plans to put in an in-ground pool. My husband suggested today that I refinance the house in my name only and cash out on any equity and put it towards the pool. It won't be much, but it might cover it. I was discussing financing options with him and he was trying to help...he blurted out this idea in an effort to help and to get me thinking about what will eventually need done anyway if/when we divorce.

My question- if he agrees to the mortgage change to my name and it involves my cashing out on the equity and purchasing a pool with the money....can he retroactively request this money in a future divorce settlement? Should I be minimizing my purchases during this separation or just proceed as normal? This all seems like a great idea to me...much better than taking out a signature loan.

Thanks in advance for any input

Have you asked your lawyer?

I agree with Brainy that you need to check this with a lawyer if you have one but the underlying principle is that your real estate assets are marital no matter whose name they are held in. If you both wish for the house to remain with you and you both wish for a refinance to take place and to change the title to your name, then make those changes by all means if it makes economic sense to do so; for instance because you can reduce your monthly interest payments or because the bank might decline you for a refinance next year.

The house will still be a marital asset to be divided and the equity will still belong to both of you equally. The fact that you are currently making the mortgage payments is not going to be relevant as your income is considered marital.

I would not recommend either increasing the size of the mortgage or building a pool until your affairs are settled. You cannot know at this stage how things will play out. It would be terrible to find you have to sell the house to settle with him.

If separation or divorce has not been filed, he may not be entitled to any equity used to finance a pool...but getting a loan in your name only and putting in a pool sounds like a horrible idea to me.

x 100

You may put yourself in a very bad position by doing this. And I don't believe your H is concerned that you are comfortable with a new pool. His motive is very likely to be getting his name off the mortgage so he can simply walk away easier and sooner. You then have sole liability for the mortgage vs him being jointly liable for the mortgage and house maintenance. I would not do this.

Thank you all so much for the responses. I have not contacted a lawyer, other than free consultation, but looks like this is something I will need to run by him. The state we live in does not require a separation to be filed. We have not been living together and I don't mind being solely responsible for the mortgage and house maintenance. It has been a huge responsibility, but I have somehow managed and I would like to stay here indefinitely if possible. I really do want to put in a pool, but rethinking the loan idea...someone said this would not be a good idea. I suppose anything could happen in the end, he could change his mind about giving me the house...then we would be forced to sell, pool and all. Good to know that even if I put the mortgage in my name, he may still have claim to it. Thanks all!

Thanks again to all who commented on my post regarding finances and putting in a pool, while being separated. I have a new question and am hoping to find some clarity, since I've never had to deal with any of this before.

I love this house our family shared and I do not want to move out. I still intend to raise my kids in this house and make it a place they will always call home. Not always, but often enough, I am reminded of better times. These ghosts of the past haunt me and can literally bring me to my knees. The things we used to do together, the places we sat together.

Will this pass with time? My hope is that I can create new memories and eventually all will be a distant memory with no emotion attached to it. Has anyone else stayed in the marital home and eventually moved on, replacing old memories with new, loving your home, the way you always have? Whether a person loses a spouse through death or divorce, I imagine it is equally as difficult to deal with these ghosts or "ghost" in the home. It would be a shame if I forever associated this house with him and even more of a shame if the association always caused pain

I moved after my wifes affair and divorce and it was such a good feeling to be out of the marital home.
I encourage you to move and start over...or you can stay in memories for years

That is always an option, probably the most logical one. I really want to stay here for many reasons. Moving out would be a last resort. Not sure if I can deal with these memories for years though. Staying here does seem counterintuitive to moving on and putting the past behind me. Thanks for sharing what worked best for you.

WOS, if you move you will be utterly amazed at how different you feel. My H and I moved years into recovery from a house we loved and we were so surprised to realize we had been living under a dark cloud in that house. The sadness was lingering for all those years and we didn't really see it. Our marriage, and quality of life really moved into a bright, new sunny realm after we moved. That is when we REALLY recovered.

We have since sold house #2 and the people we sold it to said "this is a happy home."

Everyone I know who has moved has been extremely glad they did. I hope you move!

MelodyLane - thanks so much for your perspective. That is exactly what it is...a dark cloud. A new, sunny beginning would be nice for me and my children. I do love it here, so maybe I can find something around. I just haven't seen anything as perfect for me. I'll keep looking. In the meantime, I think I will give it a makeover, brighten the walls, rearrange the furniture, get rid of this stupid bed. If I had the money, I would buy new furniture. Each piece reminds me of the day we picked it out, funny stories about how we moved the love seat in our car by ourselves, the unique picture we found and loved so much, ugh. Time to start painting!

We kept the house because I had to (litigation) but immediately redid the bedroom. Stage two will involve redoing the rest of the house. If we cannot afford that, we will sell.

fyi, we completely remodeled our house after the affair. New carpet, paint, brand new kitchen, new windows, new master bath, new bed, everything. There was still a dark cloud that we didn't really recognize until we moved.

I didn't notice anything different after the remodel but I noticed a dramatic difference after we moved.

Unless you're prevented from selling due to pending litigation or the short term finances prevent a move, I recommend that people sell the marital house. Usually the house is a big trigger whether there is Recovery or Separation/Divorce. My ex tried convincing me to take the house in our divorce...I told him multiple times I did not want it and I also could not have afforded it on my own even if I did want it. I didn't even want to stay in the state the house was in much less the house. The house was rented and eventually sold. We took a huge loss on it but I didn't care. I wanted NOTHING to do with that house.

I'm still in the marital home. I wanted to move to a smaller place, but we've had troubles off and on since the divorce and there wasn't a good time. Now my YD said her sister got to live here until she was 18, she thinks she should be able to, too. Makes sense to me.

I stayed in the house.
My WH (now former H) left five years ago.

I won't lie. There are 'ghosts' here.

I have done some redecor and gotten rid of a ton of stuff that he had brought in (furniture, etc).

I have stayed since I could not find a less expensive place to live and the kids are all with me not being uprooted from their lives.

It is sad though. Sad but homey. YK?

So, if you can financially wing it, consider moving but if it is financially smart to stay put, rework the home to make it yours the best you can.

Walking,

I stayed in my home after my X left. I decided to because I did not want my kids to not have to deal with moving along with all the turmoil of the divorce. It was very hard living here for a while as there were way, way too many memories. I remember times when the kids were with my X, that I would not sleep here. I would go my brothers and sleep on his couch.

Now, years later, I am VERY happy I did not move. I always loved this house (when I was married) and I love it now. I have since created new memories in it.

So, if you love where you live, you may want to give it some time. It will get better.

I chose to stay in my marital home after my divorce, since I was underwater, and I felt that I could ride out the storm and then sell when the market came back up.

However, when I remarried my wife made me re-do the entire house before she moved in. Even after we did that, she always felt that it was my ex wife's house she lived in. We ended up finding a way to sell at a loss and still be able to purchase a different home that we could call our own.

I think you will have an easier time moving on with a fresh start.

I don't know if it will pass. I'm still in the marital home, I've been divorced for just over a year now. I know that if I were to move it would likely help a lot with some of the stuff my kids are going through. I'm working on repainting a few of the rooms and packing stuff up to prep to put up for sale. It's going to take me awhile, paints not expensive, but it's not cheap when $20 bucks is all you've got. I'm not real hopeful that it'll sell fast either because there are so many houses for sale right now in my area. It's also kind of scary to think about moving and buying a house all on my own. I've never done anything like that before.

So, none of that really answered your question, lol. I do also have this grand idea of posting pictures of my kids and my extended family up all over the house (I never decorated it when we moved in). I think something like that will help while we wait for it to sell.

Don't forget to consider before selling whether you will qualify for a mortgage on another house.

Thanks to everyone who replied. It's nice to see the different perspectives and what has worked for your situation. I come back and read all that each of you wrote on this topic often...still deciding on what I'm going to do.

My separated husband is done with the marriage. If you know my story, he moved out six months ago and has wanted a divorce ever since. There was someone else, but unfortunately for him she broke it off. He probably still has feelings for her. Regardless, he has moved on independently in his own place place.

He does not want to come back and has never wavered in his motives, feelings, and want of a divorce. I know he has been giving me time to become emotionally adjusted to the situation and hasn't really brought up divorce very often, but gives me indicators and reminders along the way that we should and need to be moving in that direction.

Last week I was all about moving on. Ultimately, I would like to do this uncontested. But in my state, I have two years. I've been dragging my feet, because I am just not emotionally there. I don't want this and never wanted this. Naturally he feels it is just another game to me and all about winning or getting my way. He doesn't understand it has nothing to do with that, but everything to do with my feelings and emotions.

How does one get on with things when I am so broken inside? The thought of losing my marriage has been difficult enough, but now he wants 50% custody. The thought of only having my children 50% of the time just rips my heart out. If we just sit down and talk, he says we can work something out, maybe not 50%. I know this is just a ploy to get this over with ASAP. Even if we agree to less than that on paper, I'm sure he could always ask for more after the divorce is final.

I don't want to be with someone who doesn't want to spend their life with me, but I also don't want to destroy the sanctity of my marriage. I wanted to drag my feet, but now I feel pressured to get things done. How in the world am I supposed to come to terms with all this? All of my dreams are being shattered. I never wanted this for my family...my children.

I know he now feels this is a game and his pride will never let himself give in, because then he will be giving me what I want in his mind. He just wants "the opportunity to sit down and discuss all of this (divorce, custody, etc.)" but in my mind I'm thinking, why should I "give him the opportunity"? I was never given the opportunity to sit down and discuss our marriage. I was never given the opportunity to discuss or resolve our problems. I was never given the opportunity to go to counseling with him.

I don't want a bitter divorce. I don't want either of us to waste our money on litigation. That is money for our children's education. He will get the divorce in the end anyway. This can be uncontested, if I could just suck it up and do it. He doesn't want anything material; he just wants divorced.

I pray every night but I still have no direction. How do I just willingly sign a form and be a part of all this. How do I just participate in destroying my marriage. How do I reconcile this in my heart? Two steps forward, ten steps back today

Please stay on one thread!

In my case, I signed the divorce paperwork because I was satisfied that I had tried, to the best of my ability, to save my marriage.
During my wifes affair, I remained in Plan A up to the actual day of divorce court...when I sent her a No Contact text.

I wouldnt focus on reconciling it with your heart.
I would focus on reconciling the divorce with your mind. When there is a conflict between your heart and mind, listen to your mind.

WOS, I hope this doesn't fall on deaf ears but I think you are being very unstrategic about this whole situation. I know how hard it is to be objective about one's own situation so I am give you my perspective.

First off, i don't believe that your husband wants a divorce. He hasn't even filed. If he wanted a divorce, he would have ...... divorced you. Rather, he wants the freedom to pursue his affair while keeping you hanging around as an option. Unfortunately, you make yourself the LEAST attractive option by hanging around the fringes lapping up the occasional crumb.

You have made his affair and his abandonment so easy, while diminishing your own value by being so available.

If I were you, I would shut the door and go into a dark Plan B. Stop making yourself so available. Remove yourself from this triangle. Doing so will change your mental outlook enormously. You will gain an emotional detachment that will enable you to move on in the future if necessary.

And screw the divorce talk. It is all a pack of crap. You shouldn't be negotiating with a terrorist anyway who is just talking crap. Stop contributing to your own demise and stop talking about it. He has been talking about divorce for months and still has not filed.

Go into a DARK Plan B and if he serves you with divorce, let your attorney negotiate the conditions on your behalf.

Walking,

I just read through your thread and you were supposed to be in Plan B but are still communicating with him?

Was his affair ever exposed to senior management?
Did you find an IM?

I'm sorry, I didn't realize I needed to do that. Makes sense.

Sounds easy enough. Most days I am there, today not so much. This is good advice. I need to stay strong.

Can this thread please be moved to my "marital home" thread? I would much rather it be placed there if at all possible.

I appreciate and hear everything you are suggesting. I know you are right. If I try plan B, to the best of my abilities, and If he serves me and my attorney negotiates on my behalf...say we agree to everything..that would be far less expensive than had I contested it? Right? I guess I never thought of this. He keeps pushing for us to resolve together...to save thousands in attorney fees. I'm quite uneducated about this whole process. If I just have to cover the fees myself rather than splitting, then I think this is a good option for me. Or would it be thousands in attorney fees, even if uncontested? Of course I would have to deal with the possibility of my not agreeing to what is filed, Then it could get costly, I suppose? I just don't want to be a party to this who debacle...I don't want to file "jointly".

Can you answer my question?
Did you ever expose the affair to senior management?
Do you have an IM?

Not in plan B. I absolutely do not have anyone to mediate. I have been moving towards divorce, just having a REALLY bad day. I could have done it to the best of my abilities, but has Melody said, I haven't really tried.

Did you expose the affair to senior management?

I am on the clock and can't keep up with all the questions. I didn't expect anyone to respond right away. I am so thankful you did. I chose to go down the route I did. I am just really struggling today.

He didn't start talking to her until the day he dropped the bomb and moved out. It all happened very quickly. There is no evidence of anything other than a few conversations. Her boyfriend has a couple texts and I have a phone bill. All occurred after he moved out. I'm sure they already know from the boyfriend. If I involve myself, my own position will come under investigation and be jeopardized. I will not do that. Regardless, as I said, I chose the road I wanted to go down...which actually hasn't been a road at all. I need to be stronger and figure out what I'm going to do. Instead of just sitting here and letting it all happen to me, I need to be strategic.

If you want this moved to another board as I attempt a dark plan B, to the best of my abilities, and move towards divorce and letting go, I would very much like the support. I need it right now. He is my best friend...but I don't need friends like him. I need strength to move on and I can't with him in the picture.

Then you need to get an IM and do a real Plan B.

Thus far you have not done anything that was suggested to you for the past year.

If you dont want to expose the affair and want to divorce, hire an attorney and enter Plan B.

You are correct, I can't do the textbook plan B, and am well past plan A. You are correct, I did not do that textbook either, but I did it very well. Yes, I have taken and implemented quite a bit of the great advice given to me and for that I am very thankful.

I have an attorney, I'm trying to move forward with this. I would like to not have contact, but just to clarify, I cannot receive support from this board, or do plan B, unless I do have an IM? Is this correct? I need to know, because I do need to find a place for myself. This is going to be difficult for me.

You can't do Plan B without an IM.

I don't think you understand Plan B. It is a "no contact" plan designed to protect a betrayed spouse during an affair.

You write that you can't do a "textbook" Plan B but I don't understand why you can't. There are thousands of people in these forums that have been able to find an IM and go into Plan B.

Thank you, you are saying "no contact" means no other variation of the plan will achieve similar or same results of protecting oneself. To move forward with the plan on this board and receive support and advice, you must have an IM.

I understand thousands of people successfully had an IM. I have exhausted efforts in this respect, with the exception of walking up to a total stranger. I can try to not text or call (my downfall) and essentially just have him drop kids on his weekend, without even seeing him. This is not sufficient? I cannot claim I am in plan B and post here; is this correct?

Thanks for your help today. I will somehow get through this...just don't know how at the moment.

I'm not saying when you can post, I'm a poster like yourself.

What I am saying is that you need to find an IM.
In many cases you can actually use an email IM and all communication can go through the email.

But you will need an IM in case there is a change of plans, sick kids etc

No contact means No contact.

I would love to be able to find someone to do this for me. I am going to try to protect myself anyway. It won't be plan B, but at least it will help protect me somewhat and he won't continue to know that I am always here for him.

Thank you for everything

This will be my official thread/post and I'm sticking to it. The other can be deleted or fall off, or not, whatever. Today, I posted a separate thread titled, "Struggling with Reality" I've reposted it below, so my story does not get lost.

<<<My separated husband is done with the marriage. If you know my story, he moved out six months ago and has wanted a divorce ever since. There was someone else, but unfortunately for him she broke it off. He probably still has feelings for her. Regardless, he has moved on independently in his own place place.

He does not want to come back and has never wavered in his motives, feelings, and want of a divorce. I know he has been giving me time to become emotionally adjusted to the situation and hasn't really brought up divorce very often, but gives me indicators and reminders along the way that we should and need to be moving in that direction.

Last week I was all about moving on. Ultimately, I would like to do this uncontested. But in my state, I have two years. I've been dragging my feet, because I am just not emotionally there. I don't want this and never wanted this. Naturally he feels it is just another game to me and all about winning or getting my way. He doesn't understand it has nothing to do with that, but everything to do with my feelings and emotions.

How does one get on with things when I am so broken inside? The thought of losing my marriage has been difficult enough, but now he wants 50% custody. The thought of only having my children 50% of the time just rips my heart out. If we just sit down and talk, he says we can work something out, maybe not 50%. I know this is just a ploy to get this over with ASAP. Even if we agree to less than that on paper, I'm sure he could always ask for more after the divorce is final.

I don't want to be with someone who doesn't want to spend their life with me, but I also don't want to destroy the sanctity of my marriage. I wanted to drag my feet, but now I feel pressured to get things done. How in the world am I supposed to come to terms with all this? All of my dreams are being shattered. I never wanted this for my family...my children.

I know he now feels this is a game and his pride will never let himself give in, because then he will be giving me what I want in his mind. He just wants "the opportunity to sit down and discuss all of this (divorce, custody, etc.)" but in my mind I'm thinking, why should I "give him the opportunity"? I was never given the opportunity to sit down and discuss our marriage. I was never given the opportunity to discuss or resolve our problems. I was never given the opportunity to go to counseling with him.

I don't want a bitter divorce. I don't want either of us to waste our money on litigation. That is money for our children's education. He will get the divorce in the end anyway. This can be uncontested, if I could just suck it up and do it. He doesn't want anything material; he just wants divorced.

I pray every night but I still have no direction. How do I just willingly sign a form and be a part of all this. How do I just participate in destroying my marriage. How do I reconcile this in my heart? Two steps forward, ten steps back today >>>

Responses to that post suggested I stay in plan B with an IM. If nothing, it will help me move on. Although I cannot implement B, I am going to try to make myself completely unavailable to him, so that I can achieve some level of peace with all of this. I will continue to search for an IM. There is an older lady down the street that watches the cat when we go away. She doesn't have messaging or email, but does have a phone. Maybe I could buy her a cell phone, with messaging, if she agrees to do this for me. I don't know if I could afford it though. Something I need to look into.

I do have a question regarding his continued phone calls with the children. Do I have to allow them to call him nightly? They are young elementary school age and he bought them iPhones that can just do FaceTime if in the home. It does not allow for phone calls or internet. I have participated in helping them do FaceTime and now they can do it themselves. Sometimes I am involved, sometimes not. To be honest, I don't want to do this anymore. I don't call them when they are at their fathers home, why should he call them here or require they call him? I don't want to hear his voice from another room and I don't want the temptation to slip in the room to hear their conversation or show my face.

Could this work against me in court, if it comes to that? Could this be viewed as preventing contact with their father? I just see it as so unnecessary and done because of guilt on his part.

You don't need to worry about "divorce fees" since he has not even filed. Don't worry about what has not happened. That is all HIS problem. NOT YOURS.

You don't need a mediator, you just need a friend who will act as an IM and pass on pertinent information.

You shouldn't even be thinking about divorce. There is no divorce filed!

So that my new question doesn't go overlooked I am reposting below:

I do have a question regarding his continued phone calls with the children. Do I have to allow them to call him nightly? They are young elementary school age and he bought them iPhones that can just do FaceTime if in the home. It does not allow for phone calls or internet. I have participated in helping them do FaceTime and now they can do it themselves. Sometimes I am involved, sometimes not. To be honest, I don't want to do this anymore. I don't call them when they are at their fathers home, why should he call them here or require they call him? I don't want to hear his voice from another room and I don't want the temptation to slip in the room to hear their conversation or show my face.

Could this work against me in court, if it comes to that? Could this be viewed as preventing contact with their father? I just see it as so unnecessary and done because of guilt on his part.

Why can't you go into plan B?

You should find an IM and go into Plan B. Being too "available" for your abusive husband has greatly diminished your value to him. You have propped up his affair by hanging around.

Melody - I posted this earlier:

<<I understand thousands of people successfully had an IM. I have exhausted efforts in this respect, with the exception of walking up to a total stranger>>

I am still searching

You have no friends or relatives in the whole world?

No one willing, wanting, or able to help in this way, unfortunately. Friends are pretty much non-existent. I'm trying to change that.

Walkin,

I may be completely wrong...but I think you are kind of a "glass is half full" kind of person.
You cant expose the affair, and you cant find an IM.

Are you a fugitive from justice, wanted by the FBI?
You say that exposure would bring your life into the spotlight. Is it this serious?

Do you belong to a Church? Have you asked the Church to help in the role of an IM?

WOS, being an IM is he easiest job in the world. All the person has to is relay messages to you. Do you have a relative who could do this?

You can allow them to call him anytime, but I would not allow the FaceTime contact for the reasons you gave. Just tell your kids the reasons why.

Thanks, I will do that. I really don't want them to even call, but that would be much better than hearing his voice or seeing his face. Should I comply with his wishes right now if he wants to see them 50/50? There is no reason why I shouldn't other than I don't want them to go and I don't want break up their routine this is going to tear me apart, but I'm thinking I need to let him see them when he wants.

Today, when I wouldn't agree to sit down and talk about divorce next week, things got heated and he told me that he wanted to divorce me the day after we got married and the last eight years have been the longest of his life. This why I am where I am today. Very hurt. Not sure why he would say such things if he wants me to heal and move on.

Are you going to go into Plan B or not? I seem to remember going through all this before.

He doesnt need to heal from anything.
He is having an affair which you chose to enable by not exposing.
He's busy with his affair and his discussions with you are just a nuisance he feels he has to get done.

To answer your question, he doesn't care if you heal or not.
He only cares about his affair

I will be asking my sister-in-law if she can be the IM. She previously said no, but that was a couple months ago. I'm going to ask her again. Husband was at the house today when I got home putting blades on the mower and putting in my new car battery. He also had the children hand me a birthday present from them that he bought last week. No words were spoken about the bitter conversation we had just the other day. I did not mention the no contact yet, because I want to make sure I have a reliable person first. He will probably be pleased when I do tell him. Anything to get me "moving on". In his words, "you just need to let it the f*#$ go".

That is exactly what I plan to do.

Your SIL would not be a good IM.
Relatives usually dont work out as IM's, especially in-laws

What I suggest is to use the SIL for CHILD EXCHANGES and get an internet IM.
There may be a poster here that can offer to help you as an email IM.
And just use the SIL house for child exchanges/ pick-up///drop-off

Melody asked if I had ANY friends or family. No friends (I do have employees, but out of question) and my minimal family is out of state. I work long hours and take care of children. That is my life. I exhausted all efforts with family months ago, but can ask again.

You answered a question I had this morning. I had an idea this morning to ask HIS sister again, but if she is not a good candidate, then I'm definitely not going to ask her. I was going to ask my brother's wife...my sister-in-law.

He will respect my wishes regarding child pickup and not even walk up to the door. I do not even have to see him. It will be hard but I this is what I have to work with. I will find the strength. I will also find the strength to not text or call.

What makes this extremely difficult for me (but a blessing to the girls) is that he is a very involved parent. He was there for parent teacher conferences, every practice, every game, etc. I think I can convince the teacher to provide separate meetings next time. We shall see.

He has my original plan B letter. I'm just going to send him a quick email this time. I need to move on. I want to move on. He is my best friend and I really need to break all emotional ties.

Do you have an out of state sister or close cousin who would do this?


Good! Tell her it is the easiest job in the world. All she has to do is act as a spam filter and pass on pertinent information. I am offering to help her behind the scenes. She will get the hang of it quickly with a little guidance.

You will need to get everything arranged beforehand such as a strict visitation schedule, finances, etc so you eliminate the need for contact as best as you can. Having a flexible visitation will be a NIGHTMARE so don't do that. Send a visitation calendar with your Plan B letter.


That is how you should be thinking. He is a horrendous parent who broke up his children's family over a skank.


He is not your "best friend." He is your rapist. I will help you write the letter.

Can you post your letter?

I don't have a copy of the letter. It was handwritten and four pages long. It was literally copied from one of the letters provided on this site. I had to plagerize most of it because I just didn't have the strength to come up with my own. I did add some things to try to make it original, but in the end, it was literally word for word. It was a good one.

There will be just a little more to this, but is this okay? "Because the things you have done and continue to do and say are very hurtful, it is best for me emotionally to not have any contact with you."

I don't want to put him on the defensive right away, by starting off like that or appearing as the "victim" as he said just the other day...even though that's what I am. He just twists everything and makes playing the victim despicable in his eyes. He wants me to feel sorry for him most the time...how he doesn't see the girls enough and how much he misses them. I have to restrain myself from laughing out loud. Ha! He caused all this and he wants me to feel sorry for him?!

You won't need to worry about him being on the defensive because he won't be able to contact you! That is the beauty of all this!

I would send him something like this:

Dear Joe, your affair and our separation has been the most painful thing I have ever endured in my life. Every time I see or speak to you, I am reminded of this tragedy. Because of this, I must have no contact with you.

I have attached a visitation schedule for you and the kids. I ask that you stay in your car when you pick them up and drop them off. I have arranged for all necessary communication about finances and visitation be communicated through my sister in law, Sally via email at sallysil@CCC.com. She will forward any necessary information to me. Any legal matters should be communicated through your attorney and I will forward to my attorney.

As soon as you are willing to permanently end your relationship, follow precautions to avoid absolutely any contact with the other person, and join me in a plan to restore our relationship, I will be wiling to discuss our future together with you.

I hope that we will be able to rebuild our marriage some day. I want us to be able to meet each other's emotional needs and to avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We can build a new lifestyle together in which everything we do makes us both happy. Then there will never be a reason for us to be separated. I want to be your best friend, someone who is always there for you when you need me. And I want you to be my best friend.

All my love, WOS

I also think you should file for divorce and force him to pay a portion of your bills and child support. I am astonished he just moved out and does't pay your bills!!! Filing for divorce will ensure you are protected legally.

Another thing I am going to suggest is that you get into counseling. I believe you have a warped sense of reality from years of gas lighting. The fact that you call him your "best friend" after the wicked things he has done to you is quite alarming, IT tells me you don't see things in a realistic perspective.

Before you send that, I would block him from calling or emailing you. Even if you have to change your #, you should do it. And be sure and tell your kids about your plan and ask them not to hand the phone to you or let him in the house. They also cannot be passing on messages from him.

Thanks Melody...that sounds similar to the last letter I sent. In case he lost it, I will make sure to capture all the important points you included. Thanks for coming up with that.

You're right, I won't have to be concerned about his defensiveness anymore. Thank God.

I am not emotionally ready to file for divorce. I am hoping Plan B will help me to move on from him. I know this is a process that will take years (moving on) but I at least need to feel less emotionally dependent on him for friendship. He is paying for half the bills we owe. I pay all bills associated with the house. He also pays for health care and childcare. He can at any time file for alimony in our state.

I would like to go into counseling, but I would lose my job. Counseling is not an option. I do understand it is warped of me to think he is my friend. I just lose perspective of that sometimes. It helps to be reminded, to hear the word "abuse" and "emotion rape" applied to what he has done. I should be way angrier than I am. It is not healthy that I don't allow myself to be ANGRY with him and the situation for fear of putting him on the defensive. Plan B will hopefully allow me to be ANGRY all I want. I will be able to rant and scream and cry if I need to do that too. Who knows, maybe I won't even need to do any of that. Maybe once all contact is broken, I will finally feel free! Free of the feelings and daily turmoil.

Sending email now.

Don't make it any longer than that or he won't get the point. It needs to be short, sweet and concise.


HE can file for alimony? How is that? And I want to point out that NO ONE is ever emotionally ready for divorce, however, I GET your point and AGREE that being in Plan B will help in this regard. I think you will be AMAZED at what happens to your mentality once you are in a dark Plan B for a few weeks.

But, I went through all this with you before and you didn't follow through. What is different this time?


How so?


You seem to be going along with his very destructive ideas. Are you depressed?

I could not find an IM last time. Time has passed and my sister-in-law and I had a very deep conversation recently. I think she will do it this time.

Once a divorce is in progress, he can file for alimony. I make more. Doesn't matter that he is the one that left. My lawyer made this very clear to me.

Just a requirement of my position. An investigation will immediately be opened to investigate my ability to perform my duties. Interviews of loved ones and not so loved ones, tests, polygraphs, it never ends well. I don't need this right now.

Not depressed, just need someone to talk to somewhere to vent or find support.

I'm eliminating the last two paragraphs this time. He is well aware of what I want and how I feel. It will just make him cringe, I'm sure. He knows what's in my heart.

WOS!! You can't do that.The letter has to contain your conditions for return. You believe you are not worth that, but you ARE. You are telling him he cannot contact you under any other conditions.

Have you lined up the IM yet?

Ugh...I just sent it! I need to fix this!

Did you line up your IM? Did you send your IM information with the letter?

I'm adding this and resenting.
When/if you are willing to join me in a plan to restore our relationship, I will be willing to discuss our future.

Does that work? Yes, just got off the phone....

Did you send this IM information to your husband? You seem to be putting the cart before the horse here.

My sister-in-law agreed and the letter is sent! Still waiting to send the update with sentence above. She sounded a little hesitant, but said she would if I thought it would help me move on. She was very supportive and would do whatever is necessary

I feel lighter already. At least at the moment. I'm sure I will go through the motions of grieving yet again, every time I try to let go. This time I am not just trying, but hopefully DOING it this time.

Yes all her contact information was included in the letter. Do you agree with that added sentence? Is it sufficient.

Thats fine!

How did you explain this job to your SIL? And can you give her my email address and tell her I will help her if she has any questions. Does she understand that her role is to act a spam filter and not pass on anything unless it pertains to visitation, finances, etc?

For example, she should not pass on anything that has to do with legal matters. I know your husband talks a lot about getting your cooperation in an easy divorce and stuff like that should not be passed on. If there are any legal matters, he should have his atty contact your atty.

My next concern is about your ability to maintain no contact. You weren't able to do this before. Are you going to be able to do it now? You told him before you were cutting off contact and weren't serious. How will he know you are serious this time?

I will contact her again. I also did not say anything about attempts to see me, which he most likely won't, but it will tell her now. Not unless he wants to come back and work on the marriage.

I am confused what you mean about "attempts to see" you. What do you mean by this?

How did you explain this role to her?

I appreciate your offering to walk her through it. I don't think it is necessary, but it might be. I think she will have very little to convey from him, as most of our correspondence was friendship and not about the girls.

Oops, didn't answer your question. I don't know how he will know I am serious other than time will tell. If I stick with it, he will know. He wants this, I am sure.

This has all been a little overwhelming. I will be back on later. I am very sad. I love him so much. I loved him so much. I can see I have a lot of crying to do today.

Does she know to NOT pass that kind of stuff onto you?

What I see here is a woman who has been paralyzed with fear for a very long time and is afraid to act because she is afraid she will lose her WH. The reason you keep talking about "friendship" is because that is what he wants and what he has told you. He is not your friend but it makes him feel LESS GUILTY to brainwash you into thinking he is. It makes it easier to screw you over. You have contributed to your own demise by going along with the pretense of "friendship."

I view him as no better than a rapist who convinces his rape victim he is her "friend" while he rapes her daily.

"Friends" don't lie, cheat, betray and abandon their friends. That is what he did to you.

I don't think he wants that at all. He won't want to lose control of you. I believe you will be quite surprised when he sees you are serious. But you have to make sure he doesn't get through.


I am very sorry. The first 2 weeks will be tough but you will feel 1000% better in a few weeks. You have been living a nightmare for a long time.

Is his affair still active? Do you know what he is doing?

He is not your "friend." You are not his friend; you are his VICTIM.

Walkin,

I dont think you understand the role of an IM.
I think you would benefit immensely by allowing Melodylane to help your IM get a system in place.

Interesting... He sent me a very formal email. He will not be communicating with Sally. If I wish to not communicate with him, that is my choice. He also proposed three more nights a week with the girls. Guess I should have gotten that straight first. At some point he wants to discuss holidays. He "appreciates my dialog to get this resolved"

Jedi...we got it all straight.I understand the role of the IM

I need instruction I'm not sure what to do at this point. Contact "Sally" and convey my agreement to his request? There is no reason why I shouldn't. In his response he didn't reject the "not getting out of his car" or the no FaceTime. In fact I also asked that he limit the phones calls.

Should I have her send my response regardless of his wishes or wait for him to contact her. He won't of course. What to do?

To clarify, there is no reason why I shouldn't agree to almost 50%. Other than it will just break my heart!

Jedi, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to come off brusk. What am I not understanding? I'm pretty sure I have a good grasp of everything MelodyLane has explained.

And my IM has a pretty good grasp of her role and the situation.

Taking the kids to the park, but will have my cell phone on me. Wow, I went from love to hate, back to love and hate all within two hours. Can we say roller coaster? I will get through this, I will get through this....

She knows not to pass "stuff" on to me, to include attempts to talk or see me which are not related to his working 100% on rebuilding our marriage. Sorry if I didn't answer those questions earlier. To be extra sure, I will send her an email just just to solidify everything.

Oh wow, this really hit home. Thank you so much for this. I think this is so true. I will come back and read this when I am struggling. THANK YOU

Delete the email. Have Sally email him immediately and say "your email to WOS bounced to me and deleted from her email via a RULE. If you want to communicate with her, it will have to be through me."

Limit phone calls to WHOM??

The kids. He doesn't need to talk to them every night.

Did you read this??

Yes, I will do that. I think she should convey my approval of which days to see the kids. I should have called him earlier today to get that all resolved, before I started this.

Settle this TODAY, WOS, by sending a visitation calendar with a SET visitation. If he wants to change up a few things and that works with you, then fine. Just make sure it is the same every week and works for you all. This 50/50 stuff is bullcrap. Does he even have a place for the kids to stay?

Go here and set up a living calendar that you can both access. https://www.google.com/calendar/render?pli=1#g%7Cmonth-3+22844+22881+22860

But send him a calendar today with a suggested weekly visitation. For example, he might get them every wednesday from 5 to 7:30 and Saturday afternoons at the same time.

Have your IM send all this, of course.

Thank you!!!

Apparently "Sally" didn't send the message. I haven't heard anything. I told her to let me know after she sent it and then I would share the calendar with his gmail account. Apparently she is rethinking her role and willingness to be the IM. if she told my brother about it, which she probably did, I'm sure he put his foot down to prevent her from responding and getting involved.

Things have been rough. There were SO many times I wanted to contact him...mainly because I know he wants to get the visitation schedule solidified. He sent me an email this morning to my work mail asking if I planned to respond to his request for extra visitation and setting up a schedule. Hope this non-response won't be used against me someday or reflect negatively in front of a judge...my unwillingness to communicate or correspond with him regarding the children.

I just sent her another text and info regarding the calendar. I don't have a link. Not sure how or if he gets a notification on his end. It didn't prompt for one

I included a note on the calendar for him to verify acceptance and/or make changes.

Actually the shared calendar is a great idea. I included school days off and other school events. I also included an event that said I did not read his email and just forwarded it to "Sally". I had to do something, since she failed to respond.

I did not respond to either of his emails. I also did not stop when I passed him walking into work this morning.

Huh? You work at the same place?

WOS, i don't believe you are serious about this. I know you are a smart woman who can plan and achieve objectives if you are wiling. Why not just admit you are not willing so I can stop wasting my time here?

Not same employer; same facility that houses thousands of people and thousands of agencies. Agencies are connected by roads. I drove past him in my car. First time I ever saw him there unintentionally. Chances of running into each other in person are impossible other than passing in my car and that was the first time that happened.

Is this why you say I am not serious and willing?

If you think I am not serious because of my inability to secure a reliable IM, then I'm sorry you feel that way. One can be serious and willing, but fail to meet the objective, due to circumstances beyond their control.

The ONLY other option would be his sister, who has already adamantly said she did not want to become involved.

I am at a loss and I'm sorry you can't help me. I have not had any contact with him and I have not sent any emails. As far as I know he has not received the calendar or any response from me regarding anything he addressed in his email.

If you don't have faith in what I am doing to make this work, then this is the point I become weak and give up, because everything I have struggled through the past few days is all for naught. At least in your eyes. I obviously can't do this by myself.

WOS, the fact that you saw your husband is not why i say you aren't serious. It is because there are so very many obstacles and problems in your plan b. Your IM is not really on board, your H continues to email you, and the essential calendar I suggested was never done. If you want to be taken seriously, you are going to have get serious yourself. We have already been through this once and I don't understand why it is so difficult to execute a plan.

Yes, there are many obstacles in my plan B. Not to mention the fact that I am in the process of possibly refinancing my home in the future. The calendar WAS done. I spent a lot of time on it. As for husband emailing me - can't control what he chooses to do. IM not on board - again out of my control.

Well I am proud of me. I have been extremely successful the past few days. I'll stick to the calendar and continue to delete and not respond to emails. He has my moms number if he has to reach me.

BLOCK his email address

What you can control is finding an IM who is on board and blocking all communication from your husband, it is your responsibility to make sure he does not get through. This is basic planning 101. That is all in your control.

And I would most certainly not refinance your home.

I don't know how to recover from this new Plan B disaster, other than to get a serious IM and take a more serious approach yourself.

The calendar should have been sent with the Plan B letter.

I've never been in a situation where I had to block someone, so I have no idea how to. While we work for separate agencies, my phone number and email address are published to his agency. How does one "block" emails?

Can I even do plan B at this point in time? When we are still trying to work out child support and scheduling issues? He texted me that he got the calendar. Told me my schedule is NOT going to work, and I obviously prefer he go through a lawyer and congrats he will now be going for 182 nights.

I haven't texted him back. I'm now scared he can get primary custody because I'm not communicating with him?? I've read that the judge looks at how cooperative the parent is with the other parent.

I need advice on if this is appropriate for me to be doing when my children are at stake?

Here's the thing...I know him well enough to know that he just wants to get this schedule out of the way. If we get that set up and I explain the reason for the IM, he will go along with it. And leave me alone.

Let's not forget the reason for my plan B is to move on. yes, I love him and yes I would love for him to come back, but I believe it may be too late for that. I'm just afraid if I agree to letting him see the children 50/50, it will solidify the separation more...and he will grow more accustomed to our new separate lives. The more we plan for the future apart, the more real it becomes (for him). Yet, if I don't help plan, it could backfire on me and jeopardize my case when it comes to our day in court.

Can anyone empathize with this situation at all or wish to offer any advice? I want him to come back, but I don't want to be an obstacle or prevent myself from retaining primary or more than 50% custody

I told you how to do this already. Send him the schedule.


I showed you how to communicate with him: via an IM.


We have had thousands of people go into Plan B over the years, most with children. I have no earthly idea why you feel it would be "inappropriate." That seems to be a question you might have asked BEFORE you said you wanted to go into Plan B and wasted my time for days getting advice about it. [for the second time!!] I have given you a ton of advice on Plan B and it seems it has fallen on deaf ears, which is why I have pointed out that you are not taking this seriously.

A big part of the reason your husband has stayed away is because you unwittingly prop up his affair by hanging around as his option.

My time is valuable and I have wasted it - yet again - on trying to help you get into Plan B.

How do I block phone calls at work? When he calls from his agency, the only thing on the caller ID is their main number. Many people from his agency call daily. I never know who it is until pick up. I think he will respect my wishes...but who knows. So far he hasn't called me or the girls. No FaceTime or voice for them and he hasn't complained about it. He just wants to see them more.

I have 3 kids and have no contact with my ex wife.
She DID complain to the court that I blocked her phone number and dont talk to her....the judge did not respond.

You have pre-emptively surrendered at every turn. There is no court order, no divorce filed, no custody agreement, no nothing. Yet you behave as if you are under a court mandate.

You are not in Plan B so this is all a moot point. Your husband told you he would not accept the SIL, so she is not the IM anymore.

ONCE AGAIN, you send a plan b letter and don't mean a damn word of it. He knows you are not serious and so do we.

I watched an old Andy Griffith show yesterday and one of the characters (Goober) was worried about an event which in all likelyhood would NEVER happen.
Andy told Goober, "If you stop worrying about things before they happen you'll eliminate 90% of the worry in your life"

Melody - you knew the risk of my not having any options for an IM days ago. I made sure I that was clear up front. I asked someone who previously turned me down. Sorry to have wasted your time, but my time has been wasted too.

He will not communicate with the IM regarding this schedule. I cannot force him He did not like the schedule That was sent. I am left with valid feelings of being afraid this will be viewed as not being willing to negotiate the visitation schedule. Anyone with kids would understand that fear. I am at a very critical stage.

At this point I have NOT had any contact with him. So yes, his texts and threats are intimidating me.

If you can't help me Melody, then don't help me. I'm sorry if you feel I have wasted your time. I don't think you have, because I read everything you have posted many times a day. It is the only thing keeping me from completely losing it right now. That must account for something. You have given me the strength and the resources to even get to this point. I am hanging on every word you have said. Maybe I can't find an IM, but you have helped me get to this point.

Yep, that's it in a nutshell. Maybe I am worrying to much.

This is good for me to hear...thank you

You were NOT HONEST with me about your commitment to Plan B. You never intended to do any such thing. I knew of no such "risk" because you weren't honest, you said you had an IM. And then suddenly it was all over when your WH rejected her.


Yes, he will if that is his only option. If he wants to get a message to you, he will have to use her. But you caved at the first protest and destroyed your credibility with him. AGAIN. If every BS caved like a French person and surrendered at every opportunity, then NO ONE would ever go into Plan B.

Plan B is supposed to give you back control of your life. But you have forfeited that control to a wayward tyrant. And yes, you have wasted my time and then insulted my intelligence with ridiculous, inane excuses. And that is fine, it is not my life to wreck. I was trying to help you and it was a waste of my time.

Thanks for pointing is out. I need stop worrying and not let his threats intimidate me.

BLOCK HIS TEXTS AND THEN YOU WONT BE INTIMIDATED

From the beginning I made it clear about my not having an IM. that has been my problem from the beginning. You keep telling me I can find one. So far this is not true. Has she bailed...no. But I haven't heard from her. She obviously sent him some sort of message.

No I didn't cave or lose my credibility with him...yet. I have not had any contact with him. How did I lose credibility?

You told me you had found an IM. Supposedly you solved that problem. And obviously she is not your IM anymore because your husband told you no. You weren't serious anyway hence all these myriad new excuses that were never brought up either time I wasted my time helping you get into Plan B.


He knows you are not serious about Plan B and can contact you any time. When you say you are ending contact and then allow him to contact you and call the shots immediately after the letter is sent, he knows it is a big joke and he is still in charge.

You are a grown woman who has VOLUNTEERED herself to be at the mercy of a wayward. That is all on you. You do this by choice.

I have already spent way too much time on this. If you ever do get serious about Plan B [all the instructions are on my numerous posts to you] let me know. And I do mean HONESTLY serious. i am not interested in another pretend Plan B.

Over and out!

Walking,

I sympathize with your suffering as I am also a betrayed spouse but as MelodyLane has pointed out, you allow yourself to be placed in these scenerios that result in suffering.

The fact is you haven't been able to follow any of the recommendations on here.

You were advised to expose; you said that you can't.
You were advised to Plan B; but you seem unable to.
Cell phones and text messages are blocked on Day1 of Plan B so that is an entirely separate issue from your IM. Apparently there is some reason why you feel you cant block his text messages either.

Let me ask you: Do you enjoy living like this?

Oh my goodness, if you feel I wasted your time, then I wasted your time. Moving on. From here on out, if you respond to any of my posts you are wasting your own time on your own free will.

You are right, he can contact me at work, but hasn't. He is not in control, hence all the threats. He feels like he is losing control. I does not know if I am even reading his texts or deleting them or blocking them...still have to figure that out. He has not heard from me whatsoever and is becoming angry. So he will battle for the children to get back at me. That is his only recourse, other than giving in and contacting my IM (who isn't my IM). His worst fear is giving me control or letting me win, or doing anything I want. He will take the hard road and waste his hard earned money rather than do what he thinks I want him to do. Maybe not, but I guess time will tell.

No, I am separated and going through the motions of moving towards divorce and unsuccessfully trying to accept the situation and move on. No enjoyment going on here.

Somewhere it was lost that was to block texts and emails. Doesn't matter, I am not in plan B and most likely won't be. I do feel empowered though and like it or not, I am ten steps further than I was on Sunday. I am moving on, because I have had no verbal, email or text contact with him. HUGE step for me.

UPDATE - Hey all - divorce decree is signed and finalized. I have been so busy at work (500+ emails) that I didn't even realize I had been officially divorced for three days! His attorney sent it to me in an attachment. Not proud of that fact, but it does say something about the fact that I am very clearly moving on.

I have decided to keep my family in this very beautiful house and refinance. Already painting and making significant changes to my dream home. I am in the process of refinancing into my name and taking out an equity loan for the pool. Sure there are memories, but oddly enough it doesn't bother me like it did a few months ago. My kids call this "home" and that in itself makes me very happy. I love this place, so I feel it was the right decision.

Ex-husband is in some sort of depression. Largely because OW won't talk to him and hasn't for months now - almost a year (they work in same office). Not a concern of mine, but it really is a downer sometimes to talk to someone that is in such a funk. If he is around us on special occasions, or for school events, etc. he really opens up and loses the "funk" but otherwise, he is a bore to be around.

I am SO NOT interested in the opposite sex right now. I just want to see what this new plan, that God has laid out, has in store for me.

I just find it so odd that he is so down, when this was all his idea. Why am I happy and he is not. Oh right I know...because he can't be with the one loves. Whatever...I've completely lost my trust in men. Maybe someday I will love again, but definitely not there yet.

You're still talking with your WXH?

I thought that was clear from my update, but I apologize if it was not.

I am excited for this new chapter of my life. I've started volunteering and will soon be involved in a government citizens organization, which will get me involved with other people and events. I'm naturally an introvert, but I like to push myself socially

All that aside, my job and kids keep me very busy. I've had little time to dwell in the negatives. Life keeps moving and I want to make it the best it can possibly be. My kids call this place "home" and that makes me happy beyond words.

Someday I will date again, but first I need to clean out the basement, organize and throw things away. I've already gone through the entire house, in the last year, except for the basement. This is my goal. It is a small one, but a goal nonetheless.