BBG93 & AB Update please - Marriage Builders® Forums

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Hey BBG93 and Albany, Hows everything going? Its hump day and the weekend is coming. Just checking on you two. Hope everything is going well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

It is hump day thank goodness. How is it going with you??

If you have read (feeling anxious posts)you can see how I have been doing.

Actually looking a bit up--H called last night to say that he is really thinking about this and he just doesn't want us to argue--always says that.

Anyway I have just been trying to act as indifferent to him as possible told him I couldn't keep giving because for almost a year a really haven't gotten anything in return & I'm worn out.

Tell me what is new with you--I was worried hadn't heard from you.

Albany

Hey Sunny,

Was thinking of you, I pray all is well or at least getting well! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I am doing alright I guess. Yesterday was our "1 yr. anniversary" of H coming home. I told him that & he didnt' want to talk, all he said was that it doesn't seem like a year. I started to press further & tell him that in a year we had made no progress on US, much less including OC in OUR lives but I didn't.

H called me a little while ago to ask for a resume, he is currently looking for a new job, & I am not sure what happened to the old one, asked how my day was going blah, blah, blah. I am not talking to him so he is being more attentive of course. I think I may have that talk w/ him tonite about us, just to ask a couple of questions. Being that I asked him to leave & he won't, but is not trying to work on us either I dont' understand what is the purpose of us living under the same roof? I can't really say I am in plan B since he won't leave, so I am totally in limbo land right now & I hate it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Albany, I am glad to hear H is sounding a bit more positive, I didnt' mean to be harsh yesterday & I hope you don't think I was, I am so annoyed in my own situation & your H was sounding a lot like mine so if I was telling you what to do, I didn't mean to, I am also very annoyed with myself right now & hate feeling trapped like this. If I had no love left for him at all it would be so easy to change the locks, let him call the police & whatever happened from there oh well.

So Sunny how are you, any good new to report I hope?????

I'm feeling better. I go to the doc tomorrow and they are doing some xrays to make sure my lung is clearing up. I am so tired of coughing. My sides even hurt from it. The insurance co called and my car thing will be settled by the end of the week so I can start looking for another car. I need my ride!. H been really sweet and stuff. He's been at home doing honey do's and helping me w/ D. He's also been cooking cause I'm just so tired and don't feel good. Hasn't metioned the OW or the OC anymore. I'm really at a lost. I don't know which way I'm going yet and don't know what I'm going to do. A friend asked me yesterday what was I scared of? So I've been thinking about it. I think most of all I am scared of letting my D down again. She has been so happy to have us together, and now I'm thinking about going to plan b and leaving again. She's too young to try and explain things to, and yep mom's the bad person again. She see's us getting along and see's us as being happy. She doesn't know Dad is still in contact w/ OW and there is OC on the way. How do I explain all of this ? Last friday when she was at work w/ me she drew a picture and put it on my desk. It was her mom and dad holding hands w/ smiles and they are happy. I felt ike faxing it to the OW and tell her that her name was ***** and she loves her mom and dad being together she is ()age and she does this and that just so she would know something about the person's life she was distroying. Because she would be very upset if her parents aren't together. But she wouldn't give a [censored]. It would only make her get a nut that she gets to me. She's never cared about a childs life anyway. Not hers, not mine, not the one on the way. Just what ever makes her happy. On our next Voodoo talk I will ask H how can he communicate w/ a person that wants to tear up our D life ? He should be wanting to protect her, you would think. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> I really just feel like screaming! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I'm having lunch w/ H and I'm going to make a copy of the picture so he can have one, to remind him why we are doing all of this for. She's not he only reason, but she is one of them. If it hadn't been for her I wouldn't even be here. If I didn't have her I would be a a beach somewhere finding myself. lol <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

I really don't know whats up w/ these men that are just in limbo. I think its like KT said, we are letting them do this so why not. Its really hard to just so OK thats it and go on w. our lives when we have tried so hard, (year?) to make things different. I did read the cakeman art. on the TOW . Most of the men seam this way. But maybe its because we let them. I pray that god gives us the strength to do what we need to do to get off this roller coaster ride soon. I know ya'll are as tired and scared as I am. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Sunny,

I hope the pic wakes your H up too. And you are right OW would give less than a damn about hurting your D, most of them only care about themselves, that is why they get pg. in the first place thinking & hoping it will get them someone elses H.

I hope you are feeling better soon. I have asthma so I know a bit about lung problems, no fun at all. I also suffer from common migraines so H was asking if I had a headache today, only cuz he wanted something from me I am sure. I wish I felt like just running away, a part of me does, I have prayed that God would take the love for H out of my heart so I could move on, maybe that is not his will. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Well if we all end up on plan b then we should get together and take a cruise!!! The boats leave from the same spots, we can just go and do something for ourselves and all the stress we have been though. Had lunch w/ H and he was plesant. We are taking a trip in about 2 weeks so we where making plans for that. He's getting where he's not carrying his phone? I don't know if thats good or bad. Maybe he's not wanting to talk to her and keeps it off. Don't know. He needs to be changing. I've made several commints to his sis and to several close friends that I was tired of them talking. So maybe its sinking in to his head. I told them I was ready to walk if contact continues. Same thing I've told him, but maybe hearing it from someone else might hit him. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> There needs to be a reality drug to wake these guys up. Its almost like they don't want to totally commit to anything. I think its the way they are raised. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> I bet they are all around the same age! Mine is 35. Hope everyone has a good night.

I am ready to go, where are we headed!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Glad H seems to be see the lite! Mine H is 36 going on 3. That is what I get for marrying a younger man, they never grow up or catch up I should say.

The cell phone being off is a good sign for sure, hopefully the start of many more good signs to come. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Let's go for <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> sun would be so nice.

My H is almost 29--I'm 28. Haven't heard from H today--but he is very busy at work today--the phone call last night was interesting--did I mention that before??--he says he is really thnking about us--hope he sees light again--he saw it before and we were recovering--then OW says she is pregnant.

Sunnydale glad to hear it is going well for you--Babygirl don't give up.

It stopped raining here--what states do you guys live in?? I live in Oregon.

Remember not to LB

Can either of you get into private board I emailed but still can't get in and haven't heard anything.

Albany

Hey Albany,

I thought you were upset w/ me, I am so glad your not!

I live in upstate New York, the weather is trying to slowly turn around, been raining & cold.

I desparately need a vacation, have needed one since July 14, 2002, but can't afford it now.

I am definitely going to ask H at least 1 question tonite, very calmly of course w/ no LBing. I want to know what he wants to accomplish between us going into year 2 of our "reunion" knowing that I am ready to live apart again. Since he never responded to my plan B ltr. he should at least be able to tell me something other than "I don't want to argue." That is all I hear too Albany.

I am trying not to give up & I am also trying not to try - make any sense.

Hope you get some good news tonite from H.

OT:
Hey albany, I DREAM of moving to OR!!!!!

I live down south of you!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> (where it's nice and sunny)

My aunt lives in/aroudn Salem. Just had to mention that.

I live in Albany-20 min. south of Salem.

This past week or so we had been blessed with beautiful weather--84 on Easter.

bbyg93--not mad--same as you just trying to care but not to show it and acting as if I'm not trying--throws them for a whirl.

Albany

<blockquote>quote:<hr />same as you just trying to care but not to show it and acting as if I'm not trying--throws them for a whirl. <hr /></blockquote>A fine line to walk ain't it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

I'm having a ball how about you? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Ain't it FUN <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

It is such a hard thing!!!

Have a great night--I'll give you gals any update in the morning.

Albany

Hey girls, when does the ship leave? I would love some sun, fun, and no stress!! I could just imagine my H's face when I tell him he has to watch the kids 24/7 while I sail off into the sunset.

My H will be 35 in June. I thought about the age thing before. Before A, H would talk about wanting more out of life, blah, blah. Its like they get to an age where they have a career and family and then they get bored. They don't want to settle down, they want to continue to have fun. Just a thought.

I live in sunny Indiana - at least it was sunny today. Yesterday was cloudy and 40's. Spring in the midwest - one day cold, the next day warm. I can't wait for summer.

Last night I had one of those nights when hearing the wrong song on the radio just sets the tears off. Anyway, H made some comments about OC this morning, just in conversation that really hurt. I know he didn't mean it, but yet it does hurt. I know he is excited about being a dad again, which I would expect, but he just doesn't always think about how this effects me or how this will effect our kids once they know. That, on top of a grouchy boss, I had a real fun night and day today.

When I got home, H apologized for comments. He said he didn't mean to hurt me, he just wasn't thinking. I believe him. I told him that I didn't want him to be afraid about talking to me about what he is feeling, but he needs to take my feelings into consideration also.

H has Friday night off and I asked him if he wanted to have a date night. Said he would let me know. I just get so scared at the thought of getting hurt all over again. I know we need to spend time together, and I know what I want to happen, but I am afraid of the lies and mistrust and all that crap. I want to get close, but am afraid too. I don't trust myself to make the right decisions at time, and I don't trust him with my heart, even though I could very easily give it to him. I guess we'll just see how it goes.

I read a devotion last night that made me feel better. I find myself getting very impatient because I don't see any progress in my relationship with H, which I know we are all feeling. I just keep thinking why can't God just give me some kind of sign that H is turning his life around. I was getting a little frustrated. Anyway this devotion talked about trusting God and that we don't have to see to believe. It talked about walking by faith and not by sight. I guess it was basically saying to trust God and to stop doubting. Even though we don't see the changes, they are happening. It meant alot to me.

I keep thinking of all of you. Keep the faith.

God Bless,
Kris

Well I guess I'm the baby of the bunch as far as age goes.

Would just love to get away--last real vacation (meaning getting away) I had was a week of President's week Feb. 2003--My parents and H & I and a few frriends went to Yellowstone and stayed at the lodge for a week and went snowmobiling--it was awesome.

Just poking around the house tonight--loaded ran dishwasher, started load of laundry, picked up sons room and kitchen and next I need to pick up our great room because we have a lady that cleans for us every other Thursday for about 4 hours and she is coming tomorrow--makes me pick up because I want her to just be able to clean and not pick up and clean around things--don't get me wrong I still have to clean some--especially vacuum-a couple of times a week etc.

I hope it doesn't rain here in Western Oregon this weekend because I bought a whole bunch of bulbs on closeout that I would love to get them in the ground--glads, liatris, and lilies--have about 200 to plant--guess my eyes were pretty big that day I bought all of them. We have only been at this house for 2 years and I still have a lot to do in the yard--just adding flowers etc--big back yard we live on a little over 1/2 acre.

Okay so we will all have good nights tonight--I pray we do and I expect to hear from you all in the morning.

I always check MB every 1/2 hr. or so while I'm working.

Smile
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
Albany

Yep, must be the age! I thought maybe 7 year itch, but we are all over 7 yrs. Maybe the 11 year itch. I'm in TN. Snow for easter! Yeh, But today was nice and it's getting warmer. I'm really glad that I have ya'll to talk to. It makes things seem better or at least some kind of hope. I had my friend tel me yesterday What are you staying for? I ask myself that several times in a day. i think H can tell the difference in me since the Its a boy conversation. I just don't want it not to work in a year or so and he throw up in my face You made me miss this and that. I don't think he will. i really think and feel that he wants to be here. And I don't think I have ever thought O could love someone this much to put up w/ this crap. Trust is a hard thing to get back and I am trying to do it. Well my car is officially paid off today. I can start looking for another one. I really hate shopping for a car. I'm glad everyone is having a decent week so far. I don't know what I will do when we go out of town and I don't have a computer. We wont be alone, so we cant do much talking about us, but we should have a good time w/ our friends and stuff. We are always going somewhere. Which I guess is good. But I would like 2 or 3 days of us, so we can talk about things and my and his feelings. It will come. Well I'm going to the doc tomorrow wish me luck. My lung which I've already lost a 1/3 of is acting up. So I hope I dont get the streroids. I hate those things. Talk about eat! I think alot of it is stress and not resting but I have meds to help me do it, Ijust don't like taking them either. Well good night and I hope no one is LBing tonight. As the oldies say BREATHE! Easier said than done. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> And I still would love for all of us to get on a boat and give the kids to them for 24-7 for awhile and they would see why we get stressed! LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Havent heard from the private board either. Maybe we will soon. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hey Kris,

So glad to hear from you, I was gonna start a new thread asking about you.

I know it is so scary asking for "a date" I am still doing it or at least was & my H is home! Even times when we are intimate I have told him that my head wants to be with him but the cost is too high for my heart.

I hope all goes well for you & that he will refrain from making comments about OC. You don't need to hear that now. All conversations should be about the 2 of you, your M & your family.

I read a really good devotional this morning from Pastor Doreen, I hope you saw it, it talked about how God has kept the love alive for your spouse even after all they have put you through & how we should trust God not man to keep you through this trial in your M. I have prayed for that love to go away, cuz it hurts too much.

I gave my H an ultimate this morning by phone, he wouldn't answer, if he is not going to cut contact w/ OW & start working on our M I want him to leave & I mean it I am miserable & cry all the time, my mind is on this constantly & he walks around as if he doesn't have a care in the world other than hisself & OC.

So we will see what this evening brings, he hasn't called me back, he won't, doesn't want to deal with it, well he is gonna have to. I am soooooo tired.

BBYG93--wish it was going a bit better for you but it doesn't sound all bad so I will keep thinking positive thoughts for you.

Sunnydale--things sound up for you. No LBing.

KrisM--the whole asking for a date would scare me--rejection is hard and I usually protect my heart from it--my H says I never start things with us and it is because I don't want rejection.

Talked to H last night--he was really bummed about a few things at his work--too long to explain--anyway I was understanding but i didn't act overly concerned abut it--he was very neg. about it but I didn't throw it at him that he was being neg.--you know it as only me who is neg. according to him--really had to bit my lip on all that.

He called me before I left for work--wanted to know if he could come over and take a shower--they lost all power at his apt. complex--I said fine but don't forget that the housecleaner is coming.

He arrived before I left for work--I asked if he wanted to take our son to daycare today--H is workign graveyard tonight--he said he would rather me because he was going to sleep at our house after his shower if that was okay and not back to his apt. right away(it is near son's daycare)--I reminded him she would be cleaning today and he said fine and I suppose he is their right now--tis all I know for now--think positive for me.

Albany

<blockquote>quote:<hr />wish it was going a bit better for you but it doesn't sound all bad so I will keep thinking positive thoughts for you. <hr /></blockquote>Albany,

Thanks for the positive thoughts & prayers but what part doesn't sound all bad? I know I am running the risk of losing him 4ever if he leaves, but I feel as if I don't really have him now anyway. He says he doesn't want to give up, that he still loves me etc. but action speaks louder than words any day in the week. He spends no time w/ me, claims he is not w/ OW & OC as much as I think, he is either bowling, throwing darts or talking w/ him mom every evening til late at nite, & the weekends forget it - always gone, where & with who?

Again I thank you for being in my corner but the towel is in my hand & I am about to throw it in.

Hope your evening goes well & your weekend is even better.

BG93 - Just a thought - a while ago my H told me he had trouble spending time with me because every time he sees me he is reminded of all the pain he has caused me. Could your H be going through the same thing? From what you say, I think he still loves you and wants to stay married to you. Maybe its a guilt issue. Sometimes it is just easier to avoid a problem, then to try to work on it.

As a matter of fact, my H told me that just a little while ago. He says that he is afraid that he has done too much damage to repair M (even though I constantly am saying it is fixable) and he feels that it may take too much work to fix it. I still don't know what my H is thinking. He told me tonight that he talked to OW last night. She says the only contact between them will be concerning OC. She wants nothing more to do with him, unless he gets a D. Which H seems to indicate that he doesn't want right now. He seems to be seeing a different side to OW, and I think it has got him thinking. Yet I don't know if he is ready to commit to us either. I am still in limbo.

What has got me even more worried is H and OW want to handle all of OC issues themselves, without a lawyer. Says she won't get nasty unless he doesn't pay. Says at first, H can come visit OC at her house - she is afraid that I will resent the OC. I still question paternity, but that is not my call to make. If H wants to trust OW that this is his child, then what can I do? I just wish he would at least talk to a lawyer and get some info. Says he can't afford one, but I think he can't afford not to have one.

Talk to you later.
Kris

Kris, he needs to get a lawyer! Just ask KT. After 4 yrs of not anting anything then all of the sudden you owe the OW big time! tell him he needs to protect you and your children first and formost. Thats what I told my H. We haven't went yet but he assures me that before the OC is born we will. This house is not putting any money out unless he goes though a lawyer. And he knows I'm not coming off of that. I don't trust her and I told him he trusted her once and look where it got him. She wanted the child and was going to get it one way or the other. So who can't be trusted? Men are so green! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> If they could open their eyes and see these OW for what they are. Good luck. And you may be right about the pain issue. But like I told my H, do you want to live in the past? Or do you want a future with the person, before God, you chose to have a future with. Good Luck and I will say a prayer for you tonight! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Thanks Sunny for advice. H and I only talked briefly tonight. Believe me, I am not going to let the lawyer thing slide by. However, at this point, I am not even sure he wants to stay married, so I am going to concentrate on that. We have some time before OC arrives in Sept., so the lawyer issue will not be dropped, just sidelined a while.

BG93 - So how did things go with your H? How did he react to your ultimatum? I hope things are well with you tonight. I am a little worried because you haven't posted tonight. Hopefully, you are having a good talk with your H.

As always, you are all in my thoughts and prayers.

God Bless,
Kris

Yesterday H gave me 500 cash--it came from a vehicle we sold--the rest of the cash is to payoff some tax thing--anyway he said us it for whatever--I had told him it cost us 237 to get taxes done and our cell bill was 280--he only uses cell--doesn't have real phone at apt.

So this wipes out the 500 and I hae other bills to pay and my check won't cover everything--power, phone, cable, water, car ins. for both of us, his sears card, his visa etc. and now I'm concerned about asking for some of his paycheck--he has been a little funny about money this time.

Last summer & fall when he didn't live at home he still had his check go DD into our joint acct. and then I paid all the bills and gave him check for his apt. rent and then he used his debit from that acct. This time he set up own acct. and that's where his check goes.

He typically asks where all the money goes ad then I show him and he doesn't have much to say because I have wasted it--just paid bills and bought groceries and then he doesn't have much to say.

Anyway I just don't want to make a fight but he needs to know what is still left to pay. I think I will write down all the bills that need to be paid and then add up my check and the 500 he gave me and let him see what all is left.

Then I guess just ask him how he wants to handle it.

Albany

HIS cell phone, HIS sears card, HIS visa???? Hello...there's no need to ask him for $$$$$$ just give H HIS bills. Seems pretty simple.

What is there to fight about? How can he fight over HIS bills?

Give them to him and have him notify the billing parties of his 'change of address'. IF you do pay the bill this month then make SURE you fill out the change of address portion on the statements so that the bills go to him from now on!!

Why are you still taking care of these things anyway? HE wants to be on his own so let him-YOU are NOT his accountant.

Give the man the space HE wants. Let him be a grown up in ALL aspects, including finances.

ALSO, this is a good reminder about filing for a legal separation and getting CS and alimony if you want, in place NOW. There is no reason NOT to do this. Then you don't have to 'ask' him about $$$ ever, it is automatically there.

Hey Kris,

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> a while ago my H told me he had trouble spending time with me because every time he sees me he is reminded of all the pain he has caused me. Could your H be going through the same thing? From what you say, I think he still loves you and wants to stay married to you. Maybe its a guilt issue. Sometimes it is just easier to avoid a problem, then to try to work on it. <hr /></blockquote>I wish that was his problem, my H is so deep in a fog of pride, I dont know if he will ever come out. I think maybe deep down he fills guilt, shame, over A & OC. but he has not truly taking ownership of his acitons, he blames me for the A & says it would never have happened if we had a baby of our own. Well I see that as a pretty convenient excuse. We had other problems beside that though, I see now that I have control issues, & I tried to run the show instead of letting him be the head of the household the way God intended. Not having a baby with him was selfish on my part. I admit & take full responsibility for my actions & whatever part they played in the current situation coming to pass but I will NOT take the blame for him chosing to stray outside of our M & to produce OC.
Does he love me? I believe he does still on some level cuz he came back to me when he didn't have to, why is the real reason he is still with me, only God knows. As for my "ultimatum" he still proclaims he loves me & doesn't want to give up on us, same ol- story different day. I asked him what he wants, other than not to argue, his reply was he wants me to stop holding the A over his head & talking about it all the time. If he would take care of visitation & cut contact w/ OW other than when it is necessary things would change tremendously -but he feels he doesn't have to do that right now so we are at a stalemate I guess. I am not backing down anymore on this. he has had more than enough time to straighten the situation out.

Sorry to ramble, Kris your H need to get a lawyer involved, like Sunny & KT have said you should have CS set up for your kids as well, who can predict what OW will do in the future, she obvioulsly wanted your H so she is not happy about him still being your H whether he lives with you or not. I wouldn't trust her to not flip out when she realizes he is not gonna be with her & decides to hurt him the only way she can - in the pocket. I believe your H has many guilt issues about how the A & OC on the way have hurt you, but I still think it is a lame excuse to use to avoid spending time. Hopefully he won't continue to do that.

Oh what patient saints we have to be! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Albany,

I agree w/ KT, why should you be stressing out w/ all the financial crap that he had a share in making?

H & I had it out about $ too last nite, he is not pulling his weight financially & seems to think it is ok for me to take up the slack, cuz he is trying. Well it is not!

It is also not fair to you to worry about his bills being paid. Taking care of your bills goes alond with having your SPACE.

His bills still come to our house he doesn't have a new address--convenient to keep them coming to our address--the cell phone bill is actually in my name and my phone is about 60 of the total bill.

I have tried to get up to take the steps all the way out but he won't just like Babygirl93's H won't.

We'll see later today when I bring the subject--I probably bring it up until Saturday -he is working tonight and probably won't have enough time to talk about it and I just may not feel like talking about it today.

Albany

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I have tried to get up to take the steps all the way out but he won't just like Babygirl93's H won't. <hr /></blockquote>Your H won't what?

My H got a PO box for a time while he lived in "fantasy land" w/ OW. I don't blame you for not wanting to talk about it, you get tired of having the same conversation especially when nothing is resolved or they are acting funny. You just get TIRED! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

I have tried to get him to step all the way out--move all of stuff etc. but he doesn't want too and I would think that if you were done you would--but I don't think he is done by his actions.

I just don't like to have to deal with it and explain to him where the money goes--he knows I'm a tightwad and it hurts me that he sayd that because he knows he can trust me--I would never cheat steal etc from him--and then because it hurts me then I get mad and then I LB.

Albany

Oh I see what you mean now, it is the game, the hold out, the way to keep US hanging in there. You know if he gets all his stuff out, it is saying his done w you & your M so to speak, he isn't that is why he wont' make that final move.

$ is always a touchy subject it seems, even more so when there is not enough or you are not living under the same roof & need help from H. Did one situation, now living the other.

Well at least it is Friday! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

EXACTLY

DOESN'T WANT TO BE ALL THE WAY DONE.

These things all add to him not being done even though he says he is. I talked to him about the money and he was totally fine and going to give me money--didn't have problem.

Albany

Doesn't it totally make you wanna scream!!!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Must be nice to be in the position where you know someone loves you, ants to work on your problems & try & save your marriage, while you take your sweet time deciding what YOU want to do. Oblivious to the hurt, frustration, anger, pain etc. you are causing your spouse to endure.

Selfish, selfish, selfish.

When my H moved out last march I changed his address for him on the computer. Go under US post office and it cost 1.00. And you can also change accounts thought the computer. Funny when he was gone I could keep track w/ the bills that he was paying and make sure they where on time. It was my credit too. I still say it was the way these guys where rasied. Guys now think its ok for the woman to support them. I like to work to help! So we can have nice things. But the more you make the more you spend. My H freaked because my car the insurance paid it off. I told him I didn't want a new one. I was going to find something I could pay cash for and be done w/ it. I'm not about the material new crap. Get me from a to b and I don't have to work on it and pay a note, thats what I am screaming. Hope everone has a good weekend. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I think this is directed to Kris, you said that your H said he feels so guilty ect. blah blah blah. and that maybe it can never be repaired.

Well, my H was the same way--for a time. It sucked because while I was the one who really needed the assurance of love and devotion because of HIS betrayal......I still had to be the one to reassure him that I did forgive and love him and would not go anywhere.
************
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I have kept "diaries" since I was 12 years old....so funny thing is that I can look back in my journals and see what was going on in our lives before, during and after A.

Interestingly enough, AFTER the A, when H had made the "choice" to stay w/ me and I didn't even know there had been an A or pg, he was treating me even WORSE than during the A. Didn't look like someone who CHOSE to be married and 'work' on the relationship. Looking back now, I think he was very depressed. He had lost his job too and things were extrememly stressful PLUS this BIG hidden secret of his was probably, literally, eating him alive.

Then when it all (really only part of it) came out H just wanted me to 'get over it' and if I can't then maybe we shouldn't get back together!. All these years later when the real truth came out--he said quite often that, "maybe the damage is just too much and irrepairable and we will never get through this'. I thought that too sometimes, you guys know that.

The point of my rambling is that I think there are normal stages that couples go through to deal w/ and get through this. Guilt is a major one and no one wants to be reminded of this awful thing they did and having OC makes it even worse because it's always there, in your face. But time really does heal all wounds.

Finally, I just had to face the fact and remind my H that there was NOTHING he could do to make us 'even' or make it up to me BUT that was OK, I still forgive him! I would still love him anyway and was here for the long haul.

It takes time for them to receive that forgiveness that they KNOW they do not deserve. But, do any of us? Do we deserve the forgiveness our Heavenly Saviour has so willingly offered us? HECK no! But it's there anyway.

All this is normal, I think. I think this because I am seeing it over and over again around here and in my own life.
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You mentioned wanting to ask your H out for a date night right? HElllooooo go for it!!!!! That is exactly what you all need. Sometimes we forget that part of "working" on our relationships is having FUN together. You don't have to discuss important issues all the time.

BE YOUR H GIRLFRIEND!!!!!!!! WE all forgot that @ some point and became something else, something boring and "old" and non-romantic!!!!! Step-up for the person you really are and the lovely wives you all are! Put on your make-up, show a little skin (hey flaunt what you got! use it or lose it! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> ) buy some new undies (or none! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> )whatever, go out and have FUN!!!!!

scared of rejection????? Don't be, H are too and they don't give up! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> And anyway, H love when wives intitiate "things", makes em feel good! Who doesn't feel good to be wanted?

You guys can get through this. How about you all have nothing but FUN w/ your H this weekend. Don't worry, the problems will still be there Monday morning so why not enjoy this weekend, it will never be here again.

It's my b-day tomorrow so you can all go and celebrate in MY honor!!!! A virtual b-day party. My gift to you? ENJOY YOURSELVES!!!!!!!!!!

This may sound funny but I am TOTALLY SERIOUS!!!!!

Take a break from the misery and madness and start to make some new GOOD memories. You have to replace all these sad memories w/ new good ones.

Afraid of being used? in what way? If you are having fun and enjoying yourself how are you being used? Maybe you are "using" your H to make your self feel good and have fun!!!!!!

Just do it. What can it hurt?

Thanks kt!! You are so right as usual. I read your post last night. H had decided instead of a date, we would cook out and rent some movies and spend time as a family. It was a nice relaxing evening. We watched the first movie w/ kids and then sent them off to bed. H and I then had some alone time. It was so nice.

I sincerely hope you are right that my H is just going through one of the stages of recovering from this mess. It seems that he is changing in ways, more receptive to talking and spending time together. I just hope that he moves home soon so that we can really concentrate on us. But I am trying to stay patient. I know I can't push him into making the decision to come home. He has to do that of his own free will. I will just keep being supportive and loving and we will see what happens. Last night was wonderful. I just hope it leads to more.

Anyway, wanted to let you know that at least Friday night was good here. I hope you have a great birthday.

Talk to you all soon.
God Bless,
Kris

Hey everyone ! I hope your weekends went well. Me and H went to our cabin. Some really good friends ended up going w/ us and we all had a great time. We spent most of the time doing yard work and eating, but we still had a good time. H is doing really good lately. I havent seen any calls from the OW and we are living like she doesn't bother us anymore. I know, I will just enjoy it while I can! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Because I know she will be bothering us again. Our friends took my H to the side and talked to him about it. They told him about the attorney and not doing anything until we got everything taken care of thought the attorney. I get my car tonight! Yea! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> This one car thing is driving me crazy. We have planned a trip and leaving thrusday AM and get home Monday. I need a lap top so bad. I will miss all of you and hope everyone is on thier way to better days, no matter what. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> I'm taking KT and Lynns advice, live, love and have fun! I like being the girlfriend ! And letting him buy me things and call because he misses me. I think the fog is trying to lift, but not totally sure yet. He told my friend that he still thinks I may leave. He said he just didn't know what he would do. He said he was so afraid of loosing me and D. He knows if it doesn't work I am moving out of state. I think that scares him. Plus I told him I didn't want to be his "friend" if it didn't work, he would just be my EX and my D dad. I think he is also thinking about the commit I made about OW trying to tear our D life apart. I don't think he really thought of it that way. How can someone say that they love you and want to hurt someone so close to you? I guess when you dont have any
pride or self respect for yourself, it doesn't matter. Oh and my GF told him he couldn't expect me to be happy that the OC is on its way and going to be a boy. (Still don't beleive that) I think she told him that because she knows thats what he wants to hear. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Happy monday to everyone and hope to hear good news from BBG93, Albany and Kris !

Hello All,

KT happy belated B'day!!! Hope it was a blessed day for you.

Kris, so happy to hear you had a great date weekend! Sounds like things are looking up & the fog is lifting a bit. Keep doing what your doing, Plan A to the max!

Sunny,

Glad you had a great weekend & you have supportive friends in your life you help H see the light, it is so amazing that sometimes it H's will listen someone else say the same thing you have been saying all along.

Albany, how was your weekend?

Mine was ok, I had a lot of fun w/ friends & my goddaughter, not much w/ H. He is determined to do this his way at my expense, will not listen to anything I try to tell him or ask him. We are supposed to write out a "contract" stating what needs we both have & changes we want each other to make. I am really in give up mode & feel like even if this contract is written down he won't honor it. Just another waste of time I think.

BBG93 can't be giving up. Keep praying and you do what he asked and maybe he will stick to what he said he would do. I would put things that a good also, like love the way you do this, or that. Don't make it all neg. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> He could take the all neg and say, your just being neg ect. So for every neg put a positive, or at least try to. Sometimes they have more neg's going than pos. And so do we. Try not to let your brain run away w/ you when he's not around. I have a really bad problem w/ that. I know it will take a LONG time before, if ever, I quit that. I wishing everyone a good week and I will be keeping ya'll in my prayers.

KT- Happy B-Day !! Another year wiser, I hope. LOL

See ya <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Keep praying and you do what he asked and maybe he will stick to what he said he would do. I would put things that a good also, like love the way you do this, or that. <hr /></blockquote>Sunny - it is really sad to say this but there are no positives to speak of, not since he came back home, I have put up with a lot of s*%! since last April & he seems to think there is no end to what I will deal with just to have him in my life.

I am sure he does lots of positive things for OC & OW, but not me. So at this point he can continue to do them, but why should I have to know about it and live thru it?

BBG93, I feel the pain you are in. I don't know what to tell you. Just keep the faith and God will lead you though what ever you feel you have to do. Like I said he never intended to see us unhappy and with his guidance we can get though the hardest of times. Of course like I told a friend when I filed for D last year. God can't file them papers for you. You have to pray about it and feel like thats what you feel God wants for you. I know he wants you to be HAPPY. I haven't heard you smile for a long time now and I am sorry for your pain. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> I wish I could come and just slap him in his head for you, and tell him this is the best thing you ever had or will have and your blowing it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> God did not put us here to be abused, taken advantage of, or for us to live in a place where we couldn't grow as a person. It seems like some people have to get down to the bottom and loose everything they have to look up to him and see what he wants for them. Sounds like he is almost there. I know mine had to get to that place before he started noticing what was important and what is stupid, selfish, and no good. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> (((((HUG)))) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> You need it and I hope you feel better w/ your ashma.

Sorry--I haven't had time until now to post--work was hectic and I was processing payroll for 240 people.

Sunnydale-

I so glad to hear that you had an excellent weekend. Isn't that so nice--enjoy while it. I'm so excited for you.

Babygirl93-

I encourage you to try the contract thing and not to give up quite yet but do what you have to do--myabe it's time but I don't think so--so please don't give up.

KrisM--what's happening??

H worked graveyard Friday night. He came over around noon on Saturday and hung out and slept most of Saturday until 7:00pm or so and then went to his apt.

He said he would come over Sunday and he was their by 9:00 and stayed until 5:30 or and then went and help a friend move some wood. Sunday we picked up around the place outside and I did yard work--we watched amovie took a nap and went and looked at travel trailers--no real reason just for the heck of it--had a bunch of fun and tonight we have a dinner date at our house and I haven't decided what we are having--spaghetti I think--I think this weekend kind of surprised him--I have just charged ahead with things and made plans and picked paint colors etc., and planted a ton of flowers and I think it sinks home a little that I just keep moving forward--he seemd great--seemed like he enjoyed himself.

OW never calls--not our issue right now however mid June is approaching and that is when OC is due.

I'm thinking of all of you--you are in my thoughts & prayers.

KT Happy Belated Birthday--hope is was great.

Albany

Thanks ladies,

I will try the contract thing, my faith is just about gone though. First & foremost he has to file a petition for visitation, and write OW a no contact ltr. except for cases of p/u d/o or an emergency. I refuse to keep living with him running over to her house all the time to "see OC".

I don't see him doing either of those things, he will most likely feel like I am trying to tell him what to do, control him like she does, & I don't have the right. You are right Sunny, God won't file the papers for me so when I come to that conclusion I know he will see me thru it.

It is so funny, my mom told me yesterday that she forgave H for what he has done to me & my dad is not filled w/ hatred & anger at him anymore either. She said they talked about it & decided that as long as I can forgive him & I am happy, who are they to hold a grudge. She then asked how we were doing & I said alright, which is far from the truth. I hated lying to her but if they had an inkling of what was going on all they were have no understanding.

So I will see what tonite brings. Thanks for your hugs & words of encouragement.

Good Luck tonight--my thoughts are with you and remember whatever you decide is your choice--it is your life and just think their could be soemthing much better out their--just trying to say do what is best for you and I support you in whatever decision you make.

Look forward to hearing from you in the morning. Just remember live for you. I will honestly tell you that if I didn't have a child with my H--I would have been done without a fight this time even though I love him so much because walking away would have been really easy--the family thing really keeps me more focused so <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I understand how you have reached a point of just thinking it is time to walk forward on your own. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I will let you all know how tonight goes with dinner, etc. I hope it goes well-it is almost like we are dating--still a little tense every once in awhile--mainly when he talks of going home--maybe just tense on my part--lots of emotions always flowing through my head that I try to keep under wraps so not to LB.

By the way the weather stinks here--rain and wind-not looking dry until Thursday--true Oregon spring weather--Easter weekend was very unusual--sunburn on Easter--not typical spring western Oregon weather--unfortnately we are due some rain.

Albany

Everyone thinks I am crazy for not walking away too, I even question it, since there are no children. I know it is because I love him & this is my second marriage, I don't want to be divorced twice but I have to face the fact that it may come to that. Only God knows for sure, but you are right I have to live for me. I know I have done all that I can do, I am a damn good woman & if he can't see that by now, shame on him.

As Sunny said maybe he needs to hit rock bottom to see what is for real & what is not. Losing me will maybe be his rock bottom. I can't continue to worry about this though. It is costing me too much.

Hey everyone - I've been enjoying the sunny weather with the kids, so I haven't been on the computer until now.

Sunny & Albany - I am so happy to hear things are looking up for the two of you. I hope it continues.

BB93 - Hang in there. I think the contract idea sounds worth trying. Who's idea was it? If it was H's, maybe he is trying to make an effort. It can't hurt to spell out all your expectations and see what happens. Don't let it be all negative. Also, maybe let him know what things you are willing to change/compromise on. Remember its a give and take thing. Doesn't seem fair with everything we have been put through, but let him know you are willing to do your part to - which I know you are. Keep the hope alive. I think there is a reason that you are not ready to file yet. Maybe back off and take some time for yourself so you can refocus, but don't give up.

As for me, Friday night was great as I said in my earlier post. However, there was nothing else happening over the weekend. Only a phone call to see how much I spent on groceries. Tonight when I got home from work, H seemed a little distant. It always makes me wonder if he has had more contact with OW. All these questions go through my head. Was I the only one who felt good about Friday? Was he just using & abusing me to get what he wants? Or is he having feelings again and is just confused? Please, someone give me the WS manuel so I can figure it out!! As always, I am just taking things one day at a time, one moment at a time, one breath at a time. And I am really trying not to read more into things (positive and negative) then what I should. I am just trying to take things for face value and not second guess so much. It is just so hard not to always wonder what is happening when H is not at home.

Talk to you all soon.
God Bless,
Kris

Hey Kris,

Of course the contract idea was mine, any idea about "saving us" is mine. He just walks around oblivious to my needs & wants, neglects me shows my son nothing of how a real man conducts hisself and shows remorse or tries to make amends for his wrongful act - real great role model.

My best friend, who introduced us just told me to have faith & not give up. She felt that I should't even ask him about legal visitaion & cutting contact w/ OW. That I should ask for smaller things. Why should I put off another day asking for something that should have been done over a year ago? I know full well that he most likely will not do either of those things but how long do I wait for THEM to stop making my life a living hell? So I am not backing down on that, enough is enough.

I know how you feel about being with your H & thinking is was really great & him acting distracted & non-chalant. I went through that it was really tough. You can get thru this though, at least you can still feel love from him, even if you question his motives, that is something. Like you said one day, one breath at a time. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

BB93 - Are you still trying plan B? Sounds like your H needs to be aware that you are not joking around with this. As much as I want you to reconcile with your H, maybe it is time for total plan B. Get him out of the house and start living life without him. Explain to him the purpose is to preserve what love you have for him. Tell him that what is happening is not working and until he is willing to make an effort, then tell him to get lost. You need to go out on the town with the girls and show him that you do not need him to be happy and have fun. Show him that your world does not revolve around him and then maybe he will see how lucky he is. If not, you will begin to recover without him and you can begin to move on.

Listen to me, I am not the one to really be telling you this. I don't think I could for one second do a plan B without giving in the second H made a slight hint of hope. I get sucked in so easily.

However, a good plan B without giving in may be what H needs to be forced into making some changes. Right now it sounds like he comes home to you when he wants, but then runs to OW/OC just as easily. Until one of you (you or OW) take a stand, then he will continue. I learned that the hard way. Remember when my H took the weekend trip w/ OW and then lied. It took me confronting OW and then H for something to happen. Luckily for me, the OW ended things - at least so it seems. If I hadn't done something, I think H would have continued to run back and forth. He was truly living the best of both worlds. And when he needed to escape from both of us - he had his apartment to run to. Such a lucky guy!! Anyway, I am rambling. Maybe it will take something drastic like finding his clothes on the front porch to get him to see you mean business. Then again, he could just run away and never look back.

You will know what you feel comfortable with. Its like I keep telling one of my friends, I get so tried of bending over backwards for H just to get kicked in the a$$. Its time to do something about it and stand up for yourself.

Take care and know I am praying for you.

God Bless,
Kris

Kris,

I am not in any plan at the moment, I would love to Plan B wrote a ltr. 2 weeks ago, he ignored it basically. He won't leave on his own, I coould file for D & have him removed from the house, but I don't have the $ right now. I have threatened to throw his stuff out, leagally I can't put him out & he knows that.

I go out all the time now, did this past weekend, he got upset cuz he thought I was w/ a man, ain't that hillarious! He couldn't stand the thought of it but it is ok for me to accept & forgive A & oc. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

IF he still won't leave I can do the best plan b I can with him still here & in Aug. I can file. He is a real piece of work, I keep telling him a person can only take so much. I get sucked easily too, can you tell???? I tell him to leave & he says I dont' want a D, & I am the one who wants to give up & I go for it for about day or two cuz nothing changes. I am now having 2nd thoughts about the "contract". It is gonna be a waste of time, I really feel all he wants to do is keep having it ALL.

Thanks for the prayers, I am praying for you too!

BBG93------what are you speceifcally asking H for that he is NOT doing? Is he still continuing C w/ OW? Excluding you from visitatin w/ OC?
What? What is it SPECIFICALLY?

So when is our ship leaving? Has anyone decided?

BG93 needs to get away and I think we should all party on her behalf.

Seriously, BG93, is there maybe some place you could go for awhile since H won't leave. Not that I would suggest giving him your home, but maybe you should get away for awhile. I don't know what to tell you. I would think it would be hard to plan B while living together, but I suppose it is possible. I just think that while he has the freedom to do whatever he wants and you get to witness it on a day to day basis, that any love and hope you might have will die. That's the purpose of plan B - to preserve what love you have for H when all else fails. I just don't know what to tell you. You know my philosopy for the moment is to not give up, but I know you have been through alot and been doing it a lot longer than I have. My H left of his own free will and now I need to have patience for him to come home. It just drives me absolutely crazy that our lives have taken such different paths at the moment. I am just continuing to have faith that God is going to take care of me and my BC. I trust God will join my H's and my paths in the end. Have faith, trust God, surrender all your problems to Him and live your life - this what I tell myself time and time again when I think I can't handle this. I pray that God will move both our H's to the right path that will lead them back to us.

God Bless,
Kris

<blockquote>quote:<hr />------what are you speceifcally asking H for that he is NOT doing? Is he still continuing C w/ OW? Excluding you from visitatin w/ OC?
What? What is it SPECIFICALLY? <hr /></blockquote>Both of the above KT, he does not have legal visitation, brings OC to our home maybe once a month, hides it from OW. Sits in OW's apt. on a regular basis to see OC. Plus he spends no quality time w/ me working on our M. I have put up with this for a year with promises that it will get better & it hasn't.

Kris, I wish I could go away & not come back, in a real financial bind right now, so a vacation is out of the question. I won't leave my home & him in it w/ my son so I am kinda stuck right now. God will provide a way of escape - soon I hope.

BG93 - Believe me I understand being in a financial bind. If H didn't continue to pay household bills, I would be living with my parents right now. Okay, so maybe that is part of your answer. You are not meant to escape. If that is what God wanted for you, you would have the means. So that must mean that you continue to fight for your marriage. We just need to figure out a way for your H to give a little.

Why does he not bring OC around you? I know it is probably the OW. But if he is serious about your M, then OC will be apart of your lives for along time. You need to have the opportunity to bond with OC. I don't understand his thinking. This is his child too, so if OW is saying NC w/ you then so what! My H told me a few nights back that OW says that at first he can visit OC at her place. She is afriad I will resent OC. The more I thought about this the more upset I got. 1. Does OW honestly think I will harm the child? No. I, unlike her, am a caring and compassionate person and realize that this mess is not the fault of the OC. 2. Why didn't H stand up for me? H knows I would not harm this child or any other. It is just part of their evil plot to steal our lives.

I am rambling again. I think that the point I was trying to make is that there is a reason you can't leave and that H is staying. Listen to what God is telling you and pray that you find a way to reach out to H.

God Bless,
Kris

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Why does he not bring OC around you? I know it is probably the OW. But if he is serious about your M, then OC will be apart of your lives for along time. You need to have the opportunity to bond with OC. <blockquote>quote:<hr />

OW told H the day he came home that she didn't feel comfortable w/ OC around me, but OC came to visit w/ H while he lived w/ OW. OW doesn't want OC to bond w/ me, I am not supposed to be part of the "fantasy family" they created

<hr /></blockquote>I don't understand his thinking. This is his child too, so if OW is saying NC w/ you then so what! My H told me a few nights back that OW says that at first he can visit OC at her place. She is afriad I will resent OC. The more I thought about this the more upset I got. 1. Does OW honestly think I will harm the child? No. I, unlike her, am a caring and compassionate person and realize that this mess is not the fault of the OC. 2. Why didn't H stand up for me? H knows I would not harm this child or any other. It is just part of their evil plot to steal our lives.
<blockquote>quote:<hr />

I dont understand it either, he acts like he is afraid of OW. I hope your H does stand up for you & not wimp out like mine, that is why we are in this mess now, he should have told her from day one that he would not allow her to dictate to him where he could take his daughter, but he didn't & now I have no idea what they have set up other than dont' include the wife.

<hr /></blockquote>I think that the point I was trying to make is that there is a reason you can't leave and that H is staying. Listen to what God is telling you and pray that you find a way to reach out to H.
<hr /></blockquote>I so want to believe that, I just don't know anymore. H is not home yet, I am going to bed, too tired to deal with him right now.

Talk to you tomorrow.
Have a good nite.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> <hr /></blockquote>

BG93 - I hope tomorrow is a better day for you. Keep the faith. Talk to you later.

God Bless,
Kris

ok so H still spends signifigant amounts of time w/ OW 'supposedly' just to visit w/ OC. He does bring OC to your home about once a month.

Where does OW think he is taking OC during this time? How long is that single visit?

Why don't you go w/ H next time he visits? Just do it, either you go or it doesn't happen.

What would he do? What if he said no but then you followed in your own car and were determined to be involved? What would happen?

What does he say about 'this', his reasons for excluding you? How does he "rationalize" it as something that is "ok" to do?

What is your idea of 'quality time'? Do you suggest going out on a date and he denies you? Does he specifically say he does NOT want to go out w/ you?

Ok let's focus on this/you for awhile. I'm sorry I was so unclear on your situation, sometimes they all become one, big, tragic, blur.

Good Morning KT,

ok so H still spends signifigant amounts of time w/ OW 'supposedly' just to visit w/ OC. He does bring OC to your home about once a month.
**********************************************
I have not seen OC since Feb. when OW dropped her off cuz H had no car & she needed a sitter. Only on that day did she feel comfortable w/ OC in our home & she knew I was there.

Where does OW think he is taking OC during this time? How long is that single visit?
**********************************************
I have no idea, probably says he is going to a relative or friends house. Visits are usually a couple of hrs.

Why don't you go w/ H next time he visits? Just do it, either you go or it doesn't happen.
What would he do? What if he said no but then you followed in your own car and were determined to be involved? What would happen?
***********************************************
He would have a cow, I know if I forced that issue there would be lots of problems, maybe he would leave though or have an accident trying to out run me. I used to know where she lived, working on getting the address again, then I could just show up there.

What does he say about 'this', his reasons for excluding you? How does he "rationalize" it as something that is "ok" to do?
**********************************************
Always says he is working on it, papers will be coming regarding a visitation court date. They haven't come in a whole year, they ain't about to fall from the sky.

What is your idea of 'quality time'? Do you suggest going out on a date and he denies you? Does he specifically say he does NOT want to go out w/ you?
************************************************
Quality time is talking about anything other than the OC situation & of course going out doing something fun. He always says he wants to go but he has cancelled on a few dates, as recently as Sunday w/ no valid excuse.

Ok let's focus on this/you for awhile. I'm sorry I was so unclear on your situation, sometimes they all become one, big, tragic, blur.
**********************************************
I know so much pain going around here & BS. My focus right now is to find some peacce, if that means he leaves than so be it.

See my next post for his "contract"

Well H came in at midnite last nite, was at the "bowling alley." Told me he had written out his contract but left it downstairs cuz he wanted me to accuse him of not writing it & then tell me that he had - does that sound like the mind of a rational person?

He also accused me of seeing someone, I told him if he felt that way he should leave, go back to OW or mommy I don't care anymore. Of course he doesn't want to do that.

I didn't read it til this morning;Things I want U to do for me

1. Do not go in my car no more

2. Do not go in my pant’s pocket no more.

3. Please do not want to hear about old thing’s going to the court house, telling me I can't go see my Baby Girl, getting mad when I go to my mommy house.

There is more….. but he didn't write it all out.

So ladies H & I have a stalemate. #'s 1 & 2 I could do if he would be honest & accountable.

#3 is out of the question, he either gets visitation or he can go plus the other items I stated on my contract which I will give him tonite. As for getting mad about him being in mommy's house, he can live w/ her for all I care at this point. This has to end one way or another.

okay you guys were all very busy last night.

Bbygrl93--I'm at loss as of giving advice to you right now except to say hang in there if you can and keep some faith.

Last night was good-H brought our son over after picking him up from daycare. I made spaghetti and salad--we had a good dinner. He thanked me for it and he stayed until about 7:30pm and then he left--I didn't spend a ton of time with him--after dinner which he helped clean up and put away all leftovers I thanked him and then gave our son a bath.

After that we just hung out by the fireplace and played with our son. He then left. He called me at about 9:00pm and asked if I was watching the TV we watch at 9:00pm and I said yes and he thanked me again for dinner and said to call him at 6:30 or so because he was going to come over to our house in the morning and spend the day with our son--H's last day off is today and then he works 4 twelve's.

I called him to wake him up--he is horrible at waking up--called at 6:35am and by 7:05 he wasn't at our house and I just knew it--he had not gotten up and had fallen back asleep--mind you I have to be to work at 7:30--We live about 5 min. from where we both work and his apt. takes about 10 min. to get to our house. Called again and he told me he was on his way but he didn't sound like it--he called 5 min. later after he had looked at the clock I'm sure and said okay I fell back asleep and didn't want to tell you and I'm just leaving and said to leave if he didn't get their because he was on the way--our son was still asleep in his crib--I diddn't want to leave and then he said well it is 7:15 I should make it and he did.

He seemd a bit grouchy when he came--at himself I asked for a kiss and he let me give him a kiss on the cheek--I don't think he had even brushed his teeth. I'm thinking that is why he didn't give me a kiss--at least I hope because one can be intimate but not give a kiss????

Anyway I though it was nice that he called and said goodnight and thanked me again for dinner etc last night.

He apologized for falling back to sleep--I didn't scold him and give him the 5th degree like I use to when he screwed up--I just said okay I have to run--I didn't LB--and i haven't for quite awhile--he never seems to know what to do when I don't fly off the handle and yell at him.

KrisM--glad to here things are looking up. Want to hear more.

Sunnydale--keep us posted.

Babygirl--I said an extra pray for you last night.

Give me any thoughts, feedback or advice etc. All thoughts are welcome.

Albany

So he wants no accountability. He doesn't want to feel like you are 'checking up on him' or do not trust him, understandable? yes, earned? doesn't sound like it.

But that seems like it should be easy to counter w/ your contract.

Wants to be trusted? then gives acconts of where he is @ all times. If he is telling you everything then there is no need for you to check up on him now is there?

Both the car thing and pocket thing is just stupid. Why would he specifically not want you in his car, and everybody knows you HAVE to go through pockets when you do the laundry. It's more about him feeling like you trust him and you feeling like he is trust-worthy.

Your contract would say, including you w/ OC, you are her STEP-MOTHER. OC is how old now? Old enough for daddy time w/o mom!

You guys could come to a mutually agreeable contract. LIke this, I will do 'A' if you do 'B'. Even w/ consequences, If you do 'c' then I will be forced to do 'd', you get the idea.

He includes you in visits, you lay off the court talk.

Why would he be cancelling dates w/ you? Come one, any sane man knows you treat a woman nice, take her out, romance her and what do you (the man) get????? hmmm.....So why would he want to avoid that? Total LB for you!!!!

It sounds like neither one of you are getting your needs met @ least not by each other.

ok I get it now, no wonder you are so frustrated. But then if H did not want you why did he move back home? He could have just stayed w/ OW and had this little fake family of theirs.

Ok and you were doing plan A and nothing changed?

I'm so sorry. This IS so frustrating. What did H say about your contract? Did you guys even discuss them or what?

I completely understand wanting to give up. Really. We have all been there.

We're here for you.

Hey Albany,

Your evening sounded very good. I know how frustrating it can be to have your H in the house & he leaves to go sleep somewhere else. Keep being paitient & no LBing. Sound like you are on the road to recovery! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> Try not to read to much into H's actions or lack of them. Fogland, I guess.

Thanks for your prayers. I truly have no clue what will happen now, but I am ready for him to leave if he can't commit to working on our M. I have been praying too, but I know God doesn't want me to live like this, I am to have life & have it more abundantly!

KT,

He doesn't want me going thru his things, cuz he has stuff to hide, still leading a double life. Why did he come home to me? Excellent question, I think OW threw him out, got tired of him telling her he was coming home. I asked why he doesn't go back to her & have his little fake family - of course I get no answer that makes any sense at all, usually a question back instead of an answer.

OC is 18 months way old enough to be w/ daddy & me. It is OW being a pill & H being a wimp & doing what she dictates. For the past couple of weeks he has backed out of a date w/ me w/ very flimsy reasons or none at all. Then he has the nerve to accuse me of cheating on him! We didn't discuss his contract at all, he told me had wrote it at 1:00 a.m., so I didn't read it til this morning. Bending on the court house issue is risky to me cuz it goes back to him setting up visitation w/ OW at our home & she is not having it. I don't know whether she still wants him but I know she is bound & determined to break us up & he is allowing her to do it.

I am still working on my contract, I see your point about counter acting his list but I don't know if that will work, H has this injured party attitude going on. I am the "bad guy" here so I should act accordingly & not rock the boat the fake family is sailing in.

I am glad I have you guys to vent to. I will get thru this, I know it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

KT,

P.S.
I did Plan A for maybe 2 weeks, by the time I found out about it things had gone way out of control. I am sure it wasn't long enough but so many things had been established such as visiting OC at OW' apt. I was just too hard for me not to LB, & all the rest of what Plan A says not to do.

So I wrote the Plan B ltr. 2 weeks ago cuz I don't have a whole lot of love left for him, he is killing it daily, I have told him that.

He won't leave, won't act right. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Babygirl93

Who's house is it--yours together???

Can you and your son move out to apt or with relatives and make it done or move on that way???

Just trying to find out all options.

Can you pack up his stuff and say move it out unless you are working on this M??

Albany

Albany,

The house is mine & mine alone. So no way I am leaving. I was told plus know for a fact that since the house is H's legal residence I cannot put him out. That is why I say I am trapped & can't do anything legally until I file for D & I can't do that unitl Aug.

So if he refuses to cooperate I can make it so uncomfortable that he leaves on his own, hate to go thru those changes but he may leave me no choice. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

BBG93. I would do like the others said. Start living for you then. If money is tight then just go to a friends, don't be home waiting on him ! He knows your going to do that. Go have dinner w/ someone (not a man) Churches have like a divorce class, or singles class and I know they do alot of things. I know mine does. My H freaked when he heard I was in a singles class. There where mainly women, but what he didn't know didn't hurt. He just knew I was willing and ready to get on w/ my life. Even if you have to just start going to the park and walking. GET OUT OF THE HOUSE ! You sitting at the house letting your brain take over is not good. Been there, done that. Don't confront him, don't ask him, don't have time for him. I think he thinks your not going anywhere because of the money issue. Let him pay for his stuff. Don't pay for any of his stuff. He hasn't taken the caring wife route, so lets see how he does on the I"M TIRED route. I really feel for you. I know you are hurting SOOO much and I will keep you in my prayers. And wish you luck. If its your home then don't leave. Save your money and do what you have to do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Sunny

That is exactly the plan, save my money & do what I have to do. I wrote my contract, will give it to him tonite, he can sign or not, doesn't matter - this is my LAST effort. Even if he does sign I don't expect him to honor it, that is a bad sign I know & if he does do that it's over, not dealing with anymore broken promises or should it just call them what they are LIES.

Definitely no more sitting at home waiting for him, that is why he thinks I cheating on him now, not home all the time like I used to be. Going out w/ friends this evening matter of fact. No more limbo land for me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Well, I did go out last nite had a good time. When H got in he said he would read the contract tomorrow, gave no specific reason why the delay. Of course I told him he was only prolonging the envitable. So once again nothing accomplished or resolved. He can't run from it 4ever. It is strange I am finding some peace though even now, cuz no matter what becomes of my M, I am blessed & God will take care of me single or Married I know & trust that.

I have CTS, carpal tunnal syndrome, & today I am getting HydroC shots in both my hands so I won't be on the computer again til Monday after today. I hope all you lades have a great rest of the week & an even better weekend. I will be praying for you all Sunny, Albany, Kris & KT you all will never know how much it has helped me to share & talk with you all. Even if I end up on Divorced/Divorcing section I will still want to keep up with you guys you have all added to my life. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Sorry I haven't kept you guys updated very well lately.

Want to hear from you guys.

Things are going well H has said that he doesn't know what he wants--I think I mentioned that and don't think that he will be flinging the I'm done thing around so much--I said I can handle you don't know but I don't handle I'm done when your actions do not match that--and I blow my top and then it usually leads to me LBing.

He has spent a lot of time at our house. Calls a lot. Called me Saturday morning at 6:30 am after he got of graveyard to say that he would come over in the afternoon and then he showed up at 9:00am and i asked why and he said because he did his laundry instead of going to bed and just thought he would come over--he slept mainly--he had to work graveyard again Saturday night. Saturday night he said he would come over Sunday afternoon after sleeping and at 7:30am Sunday he arrived and I asked why and he said so he wouldn't sleep the whole day away and he spent most of the day with us.

He spent alot of time on Thursday calling me and apologizing--I had to see OW and her mom on Thursday-ran into them in town--really ruined my day--I can't stand her--I know she got pregnant on purpose and I hate her for that--what she has done by choosing to bring a child into this and by what she did to H knowing he not child with her and what she has done to my family.

He just kept saying he was sorry that it ruined my day etc. and he hoped I wasn't mad at him--why he so worried about all that--must care I think more than he lets on.

Last night he and I were annoyed at each other and he said he was done and I said think you had better check and see if you are just saying that since you are angry--I said shouldn't be taken lightly--saying that and he you are right I don't know what I want and I shouldn't have said that.

Beautiful weather this weekend--I planted a lot of herbs and worked outside--now I want to start painting the great room like I had planned.

Anyway sorry I haven't wrote much I have just been worn out and haven't had much energy lately relive all this as I do when I write it--especailly the OW seeing her--She is definately pregnant. It really wonder if I can cope--I was so full of hate after I saw her and I don't really know if I'm strong enough to cope with her--part of me says to walk away--I guess I sorta feel like giving up. It's been so long and I'm grateful that things are going well right now but it takes so much out of me not make to much of it and get to attached to the good times since it may not last since he doesn't know what he wants.

Okay and yes we have been intimate but I just want to be fully wanted and needed by him and right now I'm not and maybe it just seems worse this week because it is that time of the month and emotions are running high.

I don't know why I'm rambling about wanting to be done because ultimately I want it to work but I'm so tired and empty of being loved.

Albany

Albany, what did you do when you saw OW? Did you just "see" her or were you like face to face w/ her? DId she say anything to you? ohhhhhhh! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> IF I had some unexpected meeting like that.....arghhh!

Did you just see her in passing or something and act like you didn't?

That is a good sign that H is spending so much time @ your place. The intimacy is good, you are married <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> , not like YOU're doing anything wrong there.

I think he may be close to realizing that he might as well just move right back in and then........true/more recovery and healing can begin.

YAy! for you!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Hey Albany,

I am glad you had a resonably good end of the week & weekend.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />especailly the OW seeing her--She is definately pregnant. It really wonder if I can cope--I was so full of hate after I saw her and I don't really know if I'm strong enough to cope with her--part of me says to walk away--I guess I sorta feel like giving up. It's been so long and I'm grateful that things are going well right now but it takes so much out of me not make to much of it and get to attached to the good times since it may not last since he doesn't know what he wants. <hr /></blockquote>I know it is really really hard to see OW, I didn't see mine pg. but I can imagine it would have hurt like hell. Try not to let the hatred consume you, easier said than done I know but it takes up too much of your energy & you need it all for yourself & especially your son, (hope I remembered that correctly). Ok H says he doesn't know what he wants - fog? What do YOU want??? Can you keep doing a sound plan A until he figures out what is in his heart, even if it lasts throughout OW's pg. & maybe beyond. It certainly sounds like he doesn't want to lose you & your family & he is not very happy w/ OW at all & hates the thought of you seeing her causing you pain, you can take some comfort in that. The lonliness is so hard to deal with, watching him leave to go live elsewhere when he should be home w/ you.

Try to stay focused, & have patience is all I can say, at least your H is trying & communicating, that is worth something. A whole lot of something. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Thanks you guys--Yeah--seems like if he didn't care about me very much he wouldn't care how I felt about seeing OW. Also doesn't seem like he would be spending so much time me and son. He just gets defensive and withdraws if I ask too many wuestions about what he is doing where he is going etc--too much pressure I guess.

Seeing OW sucked--saw them at Costco parking lot--not sure if they saw me--funny thing is that H saw them next day in mall parking lot--he says they disgust him but that is it--says he has not feeling for them--he saw OW her mom and her Mom's husband which use to be one of my H's ex boss's. Ex-boss waved he returned the wave--OW and mom just smirked at him.

Went to Ob office for annual--saw all these pregnant women really hurt-wanted to be pregnant about now with second child--really didn't realize how much that bothered me until Friday.

Babygirl tell me about your weekend

KT--we are having excellent weather in western Oregon--green and beautiful with spring flowers.

Albany

okay so tell me why I feel like giving up now that things are going better--I don't want it to be over with us--and our marraige but I'm thinking it is just because I want this mess to be over--maybe it has finally gotten the best of me.

any thoughts??? words of encouragement???

Albany

It hasn't gotten the best of you. Hang in there.

You are just tired is all and being emotionally upset (like seeing pg OW) will wear you out physically which then makes you weak mentally. Unless you've been there, no one can understand how draining this all is on the psyche and the physical body. Plus you did say you might be hormonal so that would add to the extra emotional part.

The hate and anger will go away, I think seeing OW probably had to bring up some emotions and feelings in you that you hadn't had to deal w/ yet because you were focused on H right now and getting him back home. Which is fine, stay focused on that. Don't give OW another thought. She is nothing to you.

I understand about wanting to be pg again. I thought we were finally ready to grow our family and get pg too when I found out about OC! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> H and I's oldest and our 2nd child are 7 1/2 years apart.......but in the end, the age difference has been really good and I recommend it. By 5 or so they are so independant and can take care of themselves enough to be a great help w/ a new baby sibling. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

The weather here is sooooo hot. It's like summer already---that's Ca, thinking of going to the beach tomorrow or Wednesday. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Funny, I was just wondering what the weather was like in OR and I was gonna email my aunt to find out. Thanks for the update.

Oh and I wanted to add---it is a very GOOD sign that H is disgusted by seeing OW! That is clear thinking and not fog! He is realizing how disgusting his behavior was to have an A and there is no fond memories attached to it. He has realized how deplorable his behavior was and I think he will be coming around to realizing his bad behavior now too. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Keep the faith Albany.

[ April 26, 2004, 08:25 PM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]

Hey Albany - sounds like things are looking up for you. I agree with the others that your H seems to be seeing the light through the fog. Let's hope it continues. I am so happy for you. I understand what you are saying about feeling like giving up at times when things are looking better. I don't know why that is. Maybe it is just part of being on the roller coaster ride. Seems like at times we are on the same ride as H's, but on different cars. At times I feel down, when H seems more willing to work on things, or vise versa. I also think alot of it is the desire for the ride to just be over. Unfortunately, I think it is a long roller coaster back to anything that resembles normal. Keep doing what your doing and you will be fine.

Not much happening at my house. This past week we have had alot of kids end of school year activities. Lots of family time together - which has been really nice. H has even been around my parents for the first time since this all happened. I am so proud of my parents - they treated H as they always have, and I know that was really difficult. They are so supportive of my H and I reconciling. Their support really is such a blessing. They are such forgiving people - I come by it honestly - I love them and are so proud of them. I know this has been really tough on them. I just hope that continues when they find out about OC. I have not said a word about that to them. I don't think I should until I know where my M is heading and if OC is H's (even though he still says he has no doubt).

OW is still getting nasty with H. Rumors are flying around work as to who father of OC is and she is accusing H of spreading false rumors. Tell me, if she is not ashamed of her A w/ H, why does she not tell everyone the truth? The fact that H and OW hides this whole thing says alot to me. I guess I just don't think like they do. If H was so in love w/ OW, wouldn't you think he would admit he is father of OC? If OW was so in love w/ H, don't you think she would be telling everyone who the father was instead of hiding it? Just a thought. Anyway, she says she is now going to file for CS through the legal system instead of working things out in private. Which is the way it should be, but H and OW were convinced they could handle it all themselves. This scared me because I don't think H's rights would be protected.

I have rambled enough.

Sunny and BG93 - How you doing?

Talk to you soon. This week should not be so crazy.

God Bless,
Kris

Was looking good--tonight was bad--he says he just didn't want to hurt me and that is why he kept saying he didn't know--still doesn't seem like he is done--he has extra money right now could file for divorce but doesn't.

It was awful tonight I pushed his buttons he pushed mine and then he said all these awful and hurtful things. I love him so much but I think that I have to let him go--I don't want to follow him around where I'm not wanted and this is all hurting too much. The pain has to stop.

I'm sorry you guys but I can't take it anymore I don't think and I can't keep going on with getting nothing in return and that is how I feel it is now.

He said his parents know he is done and they just feel sorry for me and don't want to upset me so they deal with me. According to his mom he hasn't said he is done to her--but you know I don't know who or what to believe anymore.

I feel like a failure especially to my son--he doesn't deserve this--he deserved so much more than this and I have failed him and myself and my marriage.

So now I tuck my tail between my legs and go to lick my wounds in peace and remember that life is full of change and nothing ever stays the same and it takes time to heal and sometimes you are sad and it is okay to cry.

i know that I'm giving up but I want so much to be wanted, cherished and loved and I haven't had that for nearly a year and I have ran on empty too long.

All those things he said tonight were awful--the thing that seemed positive was I said to him I guess you don't care about me anymore and he said I was putting words into his mouth. How can he care and do the things he does and leave our marriage all at the same time.

He says I'm just full of questions and just asked if I ever stop.

I just can't really describe to you how I feel right now except worthless and unloved.

Albany <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Okay so he just called to check on our son who wasn't sleeping well earlier--he seems to be having bad dreams anyway--I'm bawling when he calles on my cell phone because I'm online still and I told him our son was fine and that I couldn't talk and kept wanting to know what was wrong and I said I don't want to talk and you don't love and don't care and I need to go and hung up--of course he called back and then he said tonight isn't the time to talk about it and I said it never is--he always says he doesn't want to talk about it--he is working an OT graveyard shift tomorrow night and I had offered earlier for him to pick son up from daycare bringt in home so he could se him some before he went to work.

Earlier he said that he wouldn't do that he didn't think and now said he will call and let me know--which means I have to see him tomorrow.

I don't know what to say or do or how to act--I can't think straight anymore--so tell me what things show that doesn't want to be done (actions) verse his words--I can't see for myself right now--probably because I fell as if it is time to give up and I can't see anything positive right now.

Albany

Sorry about bad typo's hope you guys can figure out what I meant--so worked up that I can't type or spell.

Talk to all tomorrow.

Albany

Albany,

I hope you are feeling better this morning, I didn't get online last nite & just saw your posts. I feel your pain, I really do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> know that I'm giving up but I want so much to be wanted, cherished and loved and I haven't had that for nearly a year and I have ran on empty too long.

All those things he said tonight were awful--the thing that seemed positive was I said to him I guess you don't care about me anymore and he said I was putting words into his mouth. How can he care and do the things he does and leave our marriage all at the same time.

He says I'm just full of questions and just asked if I ever stop. <hr /></blockquote>My H always says that to me too, I am putting words in his mouth & I ask too many questions. I guess that just don't get it, maybe because you can't truly understand this pain unless you are living it or the guilt in them doesn't want to deal with the situation they helped create. I told my H on Sunday that he wants this all to just - poof - go away, & I am supposed to keep it all bottled up inside & not talk about it at all, ignore it. My weekend was not good at all. But I am concerned about you, don't give up Albany, your H is disgusted by the fact that OW is carrying his child, mine is/was proud during OW's pg. Would never turn his back on her & OC. That says a lot about how your H feels about you & your son. You fight for yourself & your family, don't let OW & OC (if it is H's) destroy what you two have built.

I know you are tired, God do I know, I have been riding this ride since 2002, so I know how you feel about just wanting the pain to stop & getting off the ride, you think how much more of this can I take & why am I putting myself through this? There is a reason, I can't tell you what it is though. You know this does not have to be the end of your marriage, many here will tell you that, KT in particular & they have contact w/ OC!! So it is not hopeless, try to hang in there - remember it is not over, til GOD says so! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

So tell how this isn't the end??

one of my friends says that H just comes over and spends time with us because he has nothing better to do and she thinks I'm just reading signs that he isn't done into things like him coming over and staying--she doesn't think that he cares just doesn't have anything better to do.

So I'm I just reading signs into situations because I want it not to be done???

albany

Kris , please, especially w/ OW talk of filing for Cs----please remember to do this yourself, for yourself and your kids. In most states, whoever files first, will get the biggest % of support and if you and your H do not get a divorce great and then you have secured more income stays in the home.

Albany, this is also a good time for you to file a legal separation. Call H bluff, take some control of the situation. You do not have to sit around waiting on H to make up his merry mind.

If you feel like he is starting to play you then you do the job yourself. File legal seperation, everything is in place, legally. Then if H wants a divorce--HE can do it himself. And you and son are protected.

Maybe this will make H realize what it will be like and I think you need to set some clearer boundaries.

Come on, H says hurtful things then calls back asking "what's wrong?" He knows d@%M well what's wrong and he is in denial about it.

He is disrespecting you BIG time and right now you are letting him. He leaves whenever he wants, gets to avoid any serious issues, gets to put in no effort towards marriage BUT he still gets all the perks of being married!!??? huh???

He gets to come and go as he pleases, use the shower, take a nap, get SF....uh hello??? Set boundaries woman. Stand up for yourself.

Either he is done and starts living like it or he is committed to making this marriage work. And part of ending the marriage is that his son will now only get to "visit" him. That is a consequence, I'm sorry but it is. It is not because you have failed it is because your H is acting like an @$$ and he is choosing this.

Maybe you need to go into plan B. HE can still see your son and you can have NC w/ him. We do it w/ OW so you can do it w/ H.

Be strong and stand up for yourself, have some self-respect and dignity. You are not a doormat so stop acting like one.

I think you should tell everyone. Your H has had absolutely NO consequences for his actions so why should he move back home? HE has nothing to lose right now because he still has it ALL. You should tell your parents and his parents that you guys are struggling right now in your marriage, you are trying to work through it but need their support and tell them why you are struggling---because H had an A AND OW is pg. TELL THEM. You need to have a support system in your home & around you right now. Don't you trust your family?

Are you afraid they will turn their backs on you and on him? Most parents don't. Will they be hurt for you, yes but parents have a great capacity to forgive and know about unconditional love. Maybe one of them can talk some sense into him.

Well, that's my "3" cents, for what it's worth.

[ April 27, 2004, 09:43 AM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]

Dear, sweet ((((albany)))),

I know I've said this before, but it is time for Plan B. Don't skip ahead to divorce without doing this step first.

He has sat on the fence far too long. Also, continued contact, while he has not made up his mind, is killing the love you have for him. Plan B will help to preserve it.

It's a risky move, but it's necessary. You may receive the desired outcome or you may not, but at least you will have tried. You will have an answer, instead of this daily heartache of uncertainties.

He already doesn't live with you, so that particular logistic of Plan B is already solved. If you need help with a Plan B letter--let me know, I can give you an outline.

Hang on albany--we're pulling for you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

~ad

Albany,

KT & AD gave you some pretty good advice, as far as taking legal steps & possibly doing a plan B, maybe that is what your H needs to snap him back into reality. He has been on the fence a long time.

Doing both of those things would at least give you security for your son & stop the daily pain of his visits & calls. It is a hard choice to make but what else can you do at this point? As AD said plan B will allow you to perserve the love you have for your H. Going on like you are there will most likely be more LBing on your part & it will take its toll. From what I see Plan B is not about giving up but saving yourself from any more pain & giving both of you the chance to experience not being in each others lives & it will open both your eyes to whether or not you want to save your M.

I just don't get H--but do you guys think he comes over because he has nothing better to do--that he doesn't really care for me.

Why won't he just go and file again????

Also remind me what I'm hanging on for or why--doesn't seem like their is much left now??? Why the hot and cold from H?? Too many questions already if I was asking H all of these things.

love to hear from you guys again.

Albany

so tell me is the 180 and plan B fairly similair--I have a hard time even doing some of the things on 180--like not asking where he is or what he is doing or has been or is planning to--probably comes from a trust issue I have now with him.

also have an extremely hard time acting indifferent towards him--have a harder time when it is like this--the more he pulls away the more I try and pull him back and pressure him--I think that may be human nature or at least it is my nature.

Albany

Well here is my sorry update, if I can call it that. H finally read over the contract we both wrote out & told me he wanted to make a revision to his portion stating that I never bring up the affair or baby again, duh how can I not mention the baby ever again if we are together & he has visitation. He claimed all my stipulations in the contract were already in the works, they are not. So he signed nothing, neither did I. I am not waiting for his revisions either.

I am pulling out my plan B ltr. again. I may just have the locks changed, put his stuff out & see what happens. I am so tired, & yes any love I still feel for him is dying daily, I can't believe how selfish & cruel he is being to me. I have told him over & over if he doesn't want to try to make our M work then leave, I am ok w/ that at this point, but he refuses & works on nothing. I wish I could run away but I can't.

Oh & to add insult to injury he is now accusing me on cheating on him, maybe cuz he is still cheating on me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Actually I take that back I am not insulted or injured by his paranoia. It would serve him right if I did cheat, his ego couldn't handle it, I already know that. I just know I can't keep this up, it is a joke, & I am ready to move on w/ or w/out him.

I'm so sorry for you--I guess you are left with no alternative. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I'm very mad for you and very <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> for me.

You are much stronger than me I think.

I pray for you--anymore thoguhts for me or as me you are probably at such a loss that it is hard to give much advice.

Albany

Albany,

<blockquote>quote:<hr />I just don't get H--but do you guys think he comes over because he has nothing better to do--that he doesn't really care for me.

Why won't he just go and file again????<hr /></blockquote>Seriously I think your H is just playing the game that you allow him to play, I don't doubt he loves you & spends time cuz he wants to, but also to make sure no one else spends time. He won't file cuz that is not what he wants, he may need you to take legal action to wake him up! As long as he knows you are waiting for him he will keep saying he doesn't know what he wants, I think he is like my H, he wants it ALL! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

He wants you to be there for him if & when he decides to come home, but he wants the freedom to live alone, come & go as he pleases, not answer any questions.

The 180's are really hard to do. I have tried to do them w/ H in the house & it is hard. For me plan B would be so much better right now, then I won't wonder what he is doing or who. I will a little, but I will know he wont be coming in late, or breaking his word to me anymore & all that goes with that.

Do you really want to continue to live like you are now? Think about it, the worst that can happen is you end up getting a D. That pain will end eventually but to live in limbo land you are giving your H all the power to decide your future, that is not right.

Doing a 180 is more conducive to Plan A. Plan B is absolutely NC, except for (generally) emergencies and financial matters, (and then those usually go through a 3rd party--such as your folks or his).

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I just don't get H--but do you guys think he comes over because he has nothing better to do--that he doesn't really care for me.

Why won't he just go and file again????
<hr /></blockquote>I think he's doing this back and forth game because he doesn't know what the hell he wants. He seems to only want the M on his terms, ie: not wanting to discuss difficult topics. Right now he is being a cake eater. Plan B will put a stop to that. He will no longer have it both ways. In Plan B there will be clear cut boundries that you will set up in the PBL.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Also remind me what I'm hanging on for or why--doesn't seem like their is much left now??? <hr /></blockquote>For your M. For your little boy.

The fact there isn't much left now is just one of the many reasons you must go to Plan B. I believe it is your only hope at this point.

If Plan A is becoming more and more difficult for you to maintain, and it's not moving your H to commit to the M--it's another sign it's time for Plan B.

If I'm not strong enough to manage Plan A or a 180 how I'm I ever going to do Plan B.

I'm only most successful at the others when I have the ball more in my hands--things are going well and I feel comfortable being indifferent but when he upsets my applecart I can't stop the urge to call and want, want, want from him.

Somehow if I can get the ball back get him more playing into my hands again instead of me playing into his then I think if I work real hard I can maintain--but I don't see any hope right now--the ball is so out of my court.

What do I do at this point?? To put it quite bluntly--I'm scared ****less to lose him and the marriage and Pla n B seems so hard without much reassurance going into it. this being tired and working on this sinch last June almost a year has really taken a toll on me and worn me out--made me mentally exhausted.

Albany

Babygirl--

I wish I could help you or give you at least a big hug. So I have sent you a hug via this message--you give me hope and inspiration.

I still feel like giving up today though. I love him and our family so much but I'm so empty inside right now that I don't think that I'm capable right now of offering anything.

Sunnydale--would love an update from you.

Albany

<blockquote>quote:<hr />If I'm not strong enough to manage Plan A or a 180 how I'm I ever going to do Plan B. <hr /></blockquote>Plan B is difficult yes, because neither of you can have contact with each other, but I think once you get into it, you will find much relief. You will miss him, but you won't miss the crap he's been putting you through. You can do this albany--can you think of a better plan? Can you keep doing what you're doing with no committment from him?

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I'm only most successful at the others when I have the ball more in my hands--things are going well and I feel comfortable being indifferent but when he upsets my applecart I can't stop the urge to call and want, want, want from him.

Somehow if I can get the ball back get him more playing into my hands again instead of me playing into his then I think if I work real hard I can maintain--but I don't see any hope right now--the ball is so out of my court. <hr /></blockquote>Albany, the ball will be in your hands! You and only you will set up the guidelines of the Plan B. It's not up for discussion nor POJA. There will be very strict perimeters, (which btw, one of the definitions of perimeter is: "a line or strip bounding or protecting an area "--in this case, you, your M and your love for him)

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> What do I do at this point?? To put it quite bluntly--I'm scared ****less to lose him and the marriage and Pla n B seems so hard without much reassurance going into it. this being tired and working on this sinch last June almost a year has really taken a toll on me and worn me out--made me mentally exhausted.
<hr /></blockquote>I don't blame you for being scared "****less"--like I said before, Plan B is risky, but honestly, what have you got to lose except for, (at best), a part time H who won't commit?

If you've been working on this since last June, Plan B is long overdue. Yes, Plan A should be fully exhausted before moving to Plan B--good Lord, don't you think you've done that? In the words of Dr. Phil, "How's that been workin' for ya?" and "You're burnin' daylight, girl!"

The mental exhaustion can end in Plan B because there will be no contact, hence no string pulling by him.

There are lots of us here who will be of support to you while you do a Plan B. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

~ad
ps. How is it OC is due in June if A ended last June, or is it a typo?

Albany,

Thank you for the hug. I am pulling for you & your M too, please know that. I don't want to see you have to do the PBL route but what is the alternative? It is so hard when you love your H & want your M to work & your family to stay together.

Only you know what you can handle right now, but sweetie I know what it is like to be emotionally drained, that is exactly where I am right now. When you have reached that point, that you can go on unless something changes be it positive or negative you will know. As my pastor always says, "when you get sick & tired of being sick & tired" you will know & do something about it.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />You are much stronger than me I think.<hr /></blockquote>No not at all, you have made it through a year of this & still have your right mind right? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> This situation may have taken many a woman over the edge but not you. You are stronger than you know, I found that out about myself too.

I wish I could say something more encouraging to you but you have to use your common sense & then follow your heart at this point I think. God will give you strength for whatever path you chose.

Autumnday--

affairs starteed on those dates--ended in mid-October 2004--got pregnant near the end of it or it isn't his.

He was pleasant today--when talked about son.

Babygirl & Autmnday

This is how I'm starting Plan B--slowly. Today I may or may not see him. He is working OT tonight--normally cal him around 9:00pm and tell him to have a good night--I will not do that and tomorrow he should be sleeping for the most part. I will not call and see if he wants to pick son up--I will just do it and then Thursday he starts his 4 day shift and I can avoid contact easily, no offering left overs for his lunch etc.--he won't last he will call always has.

I'm feeling stronger now and I thin I can make sure he gives in and calls or at least has the ball taken away.

Do you usually tell them about Plan B or just kinda of do it without telling them about it--I'm unsure of that part of it--I don't think that he would do it knowing about it.

Anyway I'm hanging in there.

Plan B will give youback the control youwnat while allowing you the space to regain yoruenergy and self-respect and love for your H and your marriage.

JUST DO IT!

What are you waiting for? If youa re afraid of losing him then this will keep you from LBing him and pushing him away any further.

Are you saying that you are so scared that youwould rather allow him to disrespect you and continue to keep you in limbo land then to actually make a choice? You are so afraid of losing him that you will put up w/ him treating youlike crap?

Come on albany, you are a big girl, you can do this and you must do this to save your marriage, your strength, your sanity and your love.

AND you must file a legal seperation and get CS set up ASAP. Unless the laws for CS are different in you state or something.

You need to set some boundaries.

Your son needs a FULL time dad not this instability that H is currently excercising. Your son needs to know that dad will either be there or will have a scheduled time, no more of htis dropping in and out whenenver H feels like playing house!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Either he wants to work on the marriage or he doesn't! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! By not "choosing", he has made a choice, he doesn't want to be married so give him what he wants, a legal separation w/ some clear cut boundaries!

That sounds like a start at least, get your mind set into thinking that you may have to cut contact w/ him. But he won't let that happen, he will for sure notice that you aren't calling or making time to see him & most likely call you more or try to come by more. I think he likes this set up a lot.

If & when you decide to PBL you will hopefully have a 3rd party to arrange p/u & d/o for your son, otherwise it won't truly be a PB. In my case I wrote the letter gave to H, didnt' explain that it was a plan to help me perserve my love for him, just basically stated I can no longer live with him under the current circumstances & I wanted him to leave.

In my case I also added that he needed to do a NC ltr. to OW unless there was an emergency w/ OC since I know he won't stop seeing his daughter, he should not be continuing any type of contact w/ her other than to d/o or p/u the baby.

I also told him that I wanted our M to work, even though I no longer wanted to live w/ him & when he had broken contact w/ OW & was ready to come back to me totally committed to working on us to let me know. But for my peace of mind I needed him to live elsewhere.

Since you are already separated, that part is out of the way. I wish I had done this while my H lived w/ OW, maybe this would all be over by now. Oh well that train has left the station.

I pray this works for you, hang in there, I know it is hard.

THANKS

I'm trying I will think about telling him that eventually--as far as want it to work but need space and want it work when you are ready--but not right now

When talked today I said I love you and want this to work and do not want to argue. He ju answered okay ot everything--it good for him to stew over all this right now while he working--and doesn't have left overs and all the convenience's that he would have if he was allowed to come around. In fact the next time he comes over to stay I think that I might okay will have to tell him to go home.

albany~

Plan B is not something you filly fart around with. It's not something you start out slowly with, to see if he will give in. This is serious business, and he needs to know once and for all--you mean business!!

You need to have a clear cut plan of action. You have to have a "go between person" set up before hand. Yes, you tell him you are going into a Plan B, and you do that by way of the PBL, (Plan B letter). Don't worry if he would do it willingly or not. He no longer has a choice! You are taking control. You are setting the perimeters.

Ok, this is what most people say the PBL should convey.

1. That you love him.
2. That you want to remain married.
3. Your apologies for your part in bringng the marriage to the state it is. Also that you are learning how to make a relationship better and take into account his feelings with all your actions.
4. You have to cut off all contact because of the pain of his actions, (or rather, inactions in this situation). Also, because of the pain, you need to do this in order to preserve the love you still have for him.
5. Make it crystal clear there is to be NO contact, other than situations of an emergency, (and let him know in the letter who the go between person will be)
6. You will agree to contact again when he makes up his mind and wants to come back to you full time and ready to work on reconciliation with you.
7. That you love him. (Yes begin and end the letter with letting him know you love him)

Also, let me add--you do NOT give this letter to him personally. The last time you see him BEFORE him receiving the letter is the LAST CONTACT you should have.

Albany, I urge you, you cannot do any sort of modified Plan B. I've read over and over again, how it does NOT work. You're the one who absolutely can NOT GIVE IN...not till he is ready to step up to the plate and give you his 100% assurance he wants to restore the marriage, and that includes moving back in with you.

If you do Plan B the right way, you will finally have your answer. Either he is ready to move on WITH you, or he can move on without you. You will be putting the ball in his court--but albany, you will be in charge--he can no longer walk on you.

***edited because chalk fall of mistakes--too big of a stinkin' hurry!!***

[ April 27, 2004, 03:48 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

You should definitely tell him no more over nite visits. He chose to live alone, so let him, another step in going toward PB. He needs to realize that you are not going to keep playing this game with him, & he needs to make a choice & stop prolonging this mess HE helped create.

Be strong, do what you have to do for YOU & your son. You can't make him want to work on your M, he will in his own time, but I hate to see you continue in this current situation.

I never thought I would have to strength to write my PBL but I found it, so will you. You have been w/ your H 11 yrs. total, so have I. That is a long time to invest in a relationship & M, & all those yrs. are not to be taken lightly, I know I don't but who is to say these men won't try & drag this out another 11 yrs! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

You owe it to yourself & your son to take positive steps toward repairing the damage done to your M, even if that means PB.

Okay well I'm not yet ready to do Plan B and maybe I won't have to--I need a few days to gather my thoughts and get use to the whole idea. This past summer we did Plan B basically except we stil some when not necessary and we did not have a go between--so it was not a true Plan B I gues according to you--what about just trying a 180--whenever I start that but I haven't worked at sticking to it--it has helped a lot even for both of us -- a lot for me I feel revived.

Honestly--I'm not ready yet for Plan B but zi work towards it--I think he knows almost too much that I care--probably be better if I didn't tell him so much.

Autmnday--don't get me wrong I love your advice and all that but honestly not quite ready for PB.

Maybe soon--I just want someone to wave the magical wand--and really is it worth trying PB is their really any signs in anything I have said that make you think PB will work for this H. Maybe I should give up now and be done.

BBG93 & Albany I hate that things are not going good for you. I think I did plan b first I filed and made him leave. Something he didn't think I would ever do. It puts a light into the fog. Doesn't lift it by no means. I tried not to talk to him, but he called constanly. Drove me crazy. And I did give him 8 mnts to spend w/ her and it hurt everytime I heard they where here or there. But I don't regret the way I got his attention. No he knows that I can and will do it again. I don't care what he has promised our D. He's the one that broke it. It's not going to be all momma this time and I have told him that. I remind him of what he has promised me and her. This OW is just trying to destoy our lives and if he is weak enough to let her do it, then so be it. I'm a big girl and will be fine. I still don't know or what the furture hold for us, but we will find out. Like KT has told all of us newbies, if you file for seperation and they leave then your done, its over, your finished. If he straighten up and comes out of the fog, then your on your way to recovery. What do we have to loose, our minds! And only our minds. The last voodoo talk we had I think finally sunk in alittle, but we are still having to put all our efforts into this EVERY DAY!! And will do that I guess for awhile. I'm saying a prayer for each of you every night and you are on my mind also. Missed everyone but trip was GREAT. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Look forward to the next one. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Maybe soon--I just want someone to wave the magical wand--and really is it worth trying PB is their really any signs in anything I have said that make you think PB will work for this H. Maybe I should give up now and be done. <hr /></blockquote>Ok, albany...here's the skinny.

Yes, there are signs Plan B will work. I wouldn't be spending the better part of my afternoon, (with wet hair, and with my kid's bugging me to make the dessert I promised), trying to convince you it's the next logical step you should take if I didn't think there was hope!

You say you don't think you are ready for Plan B, yet you go on to say, maybe you should give up and be done. Now albany, I understand you must be terribly emotionally drained, but those two statements just don't jive to me. See, Plan B is extreme, and I can understand why you are afraid to do it, but ending the M is REALLY extreme.

If you want to continue in Plan A, and try the 180 concepts, that is fine, but at the very least, you should begin a course of action. Set a goal. Have it in your mind, exactly how much time you will deal with things as they are now.

Albany, remember though, that when entering Plan B, you need to leave WH with the best possible memories. The longer you hang on, and the longer he is being Mr. Cakeman, the harder it will be for you to leave him with happy thoughts of you!

I'm pulling for you girl. I see something in your situation that gives me much hope!!

Okay I get it--sorry to be a whiney littlw twit but I'm glad you see something because I can't see anything that shows it could work right now--I think I have reached my own fog state so to speak if that makes any sense.

Anything that jumps out at you for making it possible given the history here.

Sorry to be bothering you today while the kids are pulling at you--go make dessert write if you have time--your family is more important.

I will try to start maing some goals and bechmarks so to speak--an outline and at the same time do 180 stuff.

Thank you Autumnday--all of you guys are great!

This goes out to all of you gals you have been their for me. A hug and a great big thank you for all your help especially today.

A BLESSING

FOR YOU, AND HOPEFULLY BACK TO ME

"I wish for you...

Comfort on difficult days,

Rainbows to follow the clouds,

Laughter to kiss your lips,

Sunsets to warm your heart

Gentle hugs when spirits sag,

Friendships to brighten your being,

Beauty for your eyes to see,

Confidence for when you doubt,

Faith so that you can believe,

Courage to know yourself,

Patience to accept the truth,

And love to complete your life.

God Bless you!

I asked the Lord to bless you

To guide you and protect you

As you go along your way....

His love is always with you

His promises are true

No matter what the tribulation

You know He will see us through

So when the road you're traveling on

Seems difficult at best

Give your problems to the Lord

And God will do the rest.

Oh albany, I get a little too sharp tongued for my own good, when all I'm really trying to do is make a point. My hair can wait, and so can my kids, (they're a little on the spoiled side anyway--they're teenagers, what more can I say? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> )

You are not a whiney little twit, please don't even think that about yourself!

I do see hope in your situation, I honestly do. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I don't post directly to people regarding their exact situations too often because of time constraints and what not, (well that, and it's difficult for me to keep track of lots of stories at once). I pick and choose carefully. When I came upon your story, I was touched, something told me you have a real opportunity to save your M.

I hope I did not offend you in any way. If I did, please accept my sincerest aplogies, and lets get back to the work of turning your H around!!!

It's fine--I just felt bad for taking up so much of your time today.

I will start with implementing the 180 and sticking to it--my problem is that it begins to work and H comes around and I stop doing the 180 things and I never maintain long enough--I'm too easy and H has figured that out--so I need to stick to 180 and really make him work for it instead flopping over as soon as it begins to work.

He hasn't called about picking son up and I'm not going to worry about it--going to pick him up like most days and forget about it--not going to call and find out why he didn't call back about it or b*&%h at him about not letting me know--ignoring him works rather well.

I just have to build up to it one step at a time and I'm sorry that I'm in such a state that I can see any signs right now. We have been through so much-brain tumor, business failing him doin personal bankruptcy, havin a child etc.

Thanks for taking time out of you busy day for me someone you wouldn't even know if we saqw each other on the street corner.

Hey Albany, Sorry you had such a rough day. I kept reading your posts at work, but I can't log in to respond. I read a post that might be helpful for you over on the General Questions board. The thread is called Plan A: Doormats and Love Busters. It was posted by Zorweb. It really explains plans A & B and some common mistakes that are made. It also talks alot about LBers. If you haven't read it, you might want to check it out. I learned alot from it and it just might help you decide what direction you want to go right now. You are in my thoughts. Your M is worth saving. Continue to trust in God and keep working hard at your M. You will survive this mess. You are in my thoughts and prayers. Don't ever worry that you are taking up too much of our time here by posting alot. Thats what your MB friends are for. We are here to listen and support you whenever and how often you need us.

Sunny, So glad that things are going so well for you. I wish I could talk H into going away for awhile. I think that would do us a world of good. So happy for you!!!

BG93 - Hang in there. Keep the faith and things will get better for you.

I will talk you all later. I have got to go cook for the kids.

God Bless,
Kris

sorry hijack......making new topic.

[ April 27, 2004, 06:33 PM: Message edited by: ktbunch ]

I don't know if anyone can help me at all, I guess I just really need to vent or ramble. I am starting to feel like I am depressed, the last few days I can hardly get out of bed, I have started sleeping w/ the covers over my head, haven't looked at H since Sunday morning. I am usually in bed when he comes in & still there when he leaves for work in the morning. The last few days he has been making small talk w/ me about my hands mostly, asking how I feel & how is work coming etc. I am saying nothing to him unless he talks to me.

I am totally miserable, I really don't care much anymore if he re-does his contract or not. I feel like he will never compromise w/ me at all concerning his D & OW's role in all this. I want him to leave, to not feel this pain anymore of knowing that he is coming home, but he never really came home. I don't want this on my mind anymore & there seems to be no escape from it in sight.

I am going to set up an appt. w/ my IC, I know God does not want me living like this, I have gained weight, & I am depressed about that, I really don't see much purpose in my life right now, no reason to get up everyday, all there seems to be is this pain, this thorn in my side that I can't seem to pull out. If he really ever loved me at all, he would leave, but it is like he doesn't see the pain he is causing me daily, when I try to explain it to him he tells me he is in pain too & ashamed of what he has to done to me & our M. His actions say something totally different though.

I asked him to go away w/ me for our anniversary next month, he never got back to me, I asked back in March. He doesn't want me, why won't he let me go? I feel like this in the only place I can let this all out.

Thanks for listening.

BBG93 (((((((HUG)))))))) I feel you need a hug. I'm so sorry that he wont come out of fogville. I hate to see you like this. When do you think you can get the money for the seperation papers and get him out ? Have you contacted an attorney yet? You are loosing all your love for this man and not leaving him w/ a fond memory of you either. Do you not have family you can get the money from? How much would it be to get him out. He is bring you down and I hate to see it. You are worth so much more than that. I know you are tired and you do need to do something. GET OUT OF THE BED, GO FOR A WALK, LOOK AT THE THINGS GOD CREATED FOR US TO ENJOY !!!! Smell the fresh air. I know you don't want to leave your home, but if you can't get him out now then maybe you need to look at leaving for a little while. Just because you leave doesn't mean you can't get the home back. I left & got him out and then went back. Or just the next time he wants to argue call the police and have him removed and change the locks! thats kinda bogus but if it works. be back later <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

I'm so sorry to here that. We are always here to listen--here for each other.

Life is worth living and believe I wonder what my purpose is right now and where I will be in a couple of years.

I strongly encourage going to IC and finding out about an anti-depressant--I'm OCD and it really got severe during all this and I started taking something for it in December--it has really helped me out. It is actually an anti-depressant that used for OCD (Paxil) so maybe it is helping me in more ways than one.

Get your butt out of bed and go exercise in the morning--it will really help or go in the evening--even just a walk in the neighborhood.

Don't stoop to this and curl up in a ball you are much stronger than that--I can tell that from you posts--I think you need to get going and be happy because right now even if he did commit you are in no shape to even really care or deal with it so right now your goals and focus should be on you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Your are a great person--really extraordinary-I mean how many people can go through what you have and would fight this long for something?? Not many we are unique.

Don't know a whole lot more.

H called yesterday on his way to work to say he was sorry that he hadn't called to let me know one way or the other if he was picking son up from daycare. I just said I had picked him up and left that issue at that.

I left him a voicemail about I love you, care and want us to work on our marriage and good thins usually do not come without work.

He called back and said he got my message and I said something in response about doesn't sound like you really care-he said all he was saying right now is that he was acknowledging that he heard what I was saying. I think he is scared to say much more because I usually fling it in his face--I know not good but I'm working on it.

He picked our son up today after he got off this morning and took him to daycare until this afternoon. We had pleasant coversation. Last night he called and I wasn't real nice--wasn't mean--just acted not interested in talking to him.

Anyway that is where it is at right now.
Not all bad.

Thanks Ladies so much, I could borrow the $ in a heartbeat but I don't want to ask my family & there is no one else to turn to for $. That is why I said I would have to wait until Aug. to do anything legal. I have thought of changing the locks & putting his s#@t on the curb but I really hate to cause a scene, plus my parents live 4 houses down, they the whole story but not what is going on behind closed doors right now, they think we are working things out, & they don't really ask much. They just got to the place where they can think of forgiving him for what he has done. So when they find out any of this he will be gone.

I thought of getting some AD for myself, but I take other meds & dont' really want anything else, I have not had anything in almost 2 yrs. so why start now. I need to lean totally on God & give this over to him, but it just tears me up to know H is still in the house w/ me, & it is so hard to try not to look at my circumstances & lean on GOD w/ him there.

I am not going to do anything stupid, but I sometimes I wish I could lay down & not get up. Guess I am just really tired & having a pity party for myself today. I will be alright eventually.

This weekend we have to do some things together for the house, that is also why my $ is all tied up too, remodeling. After that is done, I really will have no use for him at all. I will make an effort to eat better & start some type of excercise prog., I am only killing myself slowly like this I know.

Thanks again for the input.

Sunny I am gonna email you.

Albany,

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Life is worth living and believe I wonder what my purpose is right now and where I will be in a couple of years. <hr /></blockquote>Your purpose is your son if nothing else, & I am praying & believe that it is also to be a W to your H. I know I feel so down because I have raised my son, so I feel like no one needs me, I could be a step mom to H's D, never raised a girl so that would be a challenge I am sure, best part is if I didn't want to deal w/ her I dont' have to & she wouldn't be w/ me 24/7, (never wanted a daughter). It is not all about having a man in my life either cuz I know if H can't treat me no better than this I may as well be alone. It just feels so overwhelming right now, like I am under water & someone keeps pushing me back down.

I think you are on the right track though, like I said only YOU know what you can do right now so work PA (Plan A) & the 180's as best you can. I too believe H will come around. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Hi albany~

If you feel you must remain in Plan A, then I say go for it--give it your all. You must do an absolute stellar job of it though. Between me and the fencepost, I believe if your H is going to respond to anything, it will be a hard-core Plan B, but it's not up to me. Only you know what you can do. Please have a plan in motion, in case Plan A continues to leave your H in la-la land. I think you need to set a realistic date-- say June 1.

Keep in mind what a good, strong Plan A looks like: Always trying to meet his ENs, stopping all LBs, and exposing the affair/oc to anyone and everyone who could help him to see he needs to be accountable. They say this is best done in Plan A, not Plan B when you are not as able to do damage control.

In doing the best damn Plan A you can muster, (even if it doesn't have the desired outcome of him coming home and working on the M)-- you will at least acheive showing him your best side. See, then if you do have to go to Plan B, you will have left him with a very good image, and promise of what he could expect the M to be like when he comes back. If you leave him with only a bad taste in his mouth before moving to Plan B, he will be like, "why would I want to go back there????"

Your best hope at a successful Plan B, is a beautiful, nearly flawless Plan A. So the time is now, albany--give it all you've got, and then some. Who knows, maybe this time it will work, and you won't have to go to Plan B. I still need to be a little voice of doom, (read reality), and say it is extremely difficult to acheive the desired results using Plan A, while the WS is living outside your home.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I will start with implementing the 180 and sticking to it--my problem is that it begins to work and H comes around and I stop doing the 180 things and I never maintain long enough--I'm too easy and H has figured that out--so I need to stick to 180 and really make him work for it instead flopping over as soon as it begins to work.

<hr /></blockquote>Albany, you will never be able to stick to a flawless Plan A, if his actions and words dictate your actions and words. What you must remember is that only you are in control of you. NO MATTER WHAT HE SAYS OR DOES, YOU STICK TO YOUR PLAN A CONCEPTS! PLAN A DOES NOT END WHEN HE BEGINS TO GIVE IN A LITTLE OR BEHAVE A LITTLE BETTER. Your goal is for him to say, "albany, I am ready to fully come back to this M, and I am ready to give 100% to you and our M." Do not settle for anything less before ending Plan A concepts. Of course the only other way Plan A ends, is when you need to go to Plan B.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I left him a voicemail about I love you, care and want us to work on our marriage and good thins usually do not come without work.

He called back and said he got my message and I said something in response about doesn't sound like you really care-he said all he was saying right now is that he was acknowledging that he heard what I was saying. I think he is scared to say much more because I usually fling it in his face--I know not good but I'm working on it.
<hr /></blockquote>Ok, well I am glad you are working on it--you recognize the things that don't work, that's a good thing. However, I will reiterate, and I believe it's in the 180 list I gave you--DO NOT talk about the relationship. Especially saying to him over VM that good things do not happen without work. You know that was a major LB, right? He most likely heard it as preachy, and treating him like a child. He probably feels backed into a corner each time you say things like this. Then of course your response to him about him sounding like he didn't care--you heard straight from the horse's mouth how frustrated he was with that.

You're right, he probably is scared to say too much, and not even sure exactly what to say, for fear of your response. He may be measuring his words, because he feels you're measuring, and analyzing every word he utters, and even the way he says them.

This having to bite your tongue stuff reeks, I know--it's one of the hardest things in the world for me to do. I try to remember to pray each morning before I even get out of the bed, "Dear Lord, please help me not to say or do something I will regret today." Also, when on the way to any kind of social event, meeting, and anytime I know there will be major communication w/ my teens and or H, I say out loud to myself, "autumn--listen more, talk less, listen more, talk less!!!!!" Maybe if you try these, it will help you too.

Also, you may want to try things like this:

When he says something mean to you, you should say, "I'm sorry you feel that way".

or

"You're right dudely, (insert your term of endearment)".

It will be difficult for him to pitch a fit when you're not striking back. He'll quickly run out of arrows, or at the very least, will see no use in using them.

Let him be the jerk all he wants, but no matter what, you will remain true to Plan A. Keeping in mind, Plan B is just around the corner to fall back on, if even your most flawless, best-damn, this side of the Mississippi, Plan A does not sway him!!!!

Here for ya albany! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

~ad

Hey Albany,

How are you doing today? Slept w/ the covers over my head again, H came in asking how I felt & about my day. This morning he got up & was standing in the bedroom in the dark doing who knows what, did this for about 5 min., got back in bed, got up again 90 min. later, did the same thing before getting dressed & leaving. Asked me what wrong before he left. Duh - where do I begin!!!!

It is bothering him that I wont' talk to him or look at him. I am gonna leave him a note about Sat. - going to pick up the furniture. I know I will probably have to wait for days for him to put it together, that is already making me mad.

I will see my IC next week, don't know how much help she will be. I know I am stuck in limbo land until he leaves or I throw him out, or by some miracle he does a 180, I know I am dreaming. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

BBY93

Things are okay--had call hi about the lawnmower-it had a dead battery and he had left it on the charger--but it still wouldn't start--I was annoyed with a little bit and he said do we have to argue everyday--I said not I'm just angry--that I can't mown the lawn--he is good if we have no conflcit--he can't handle in conflict right now--don't know why.

He said he would call today--I replied yah and he repeated himself and I said okay yah whatever.
He didn't like it that I wasn't really excited about him calling--justing needing a break.

So if I care and show it--it pushes him away and when I act as if I don't care--he wants me to care I think--hello--what the heck???

Anyway he hasn't yet called--that's fine--said he would stop by after work to check out the lawn mower. Whatever--just get it working so I don't have to call you about it again is all I want.

Albany,

Are you doing some of the 180's? I am sorry I am forgetting what you are doing.

It drives them crazy I think when they are ignored, but when you want to talk about something meaningful it seems to turn into an arguement & then they get annoyed. Hopefully he can get your mower fixed & you won't have to call him anytime soon to help you w/ anything, sounds like you don't feel like dealing w/ him today at all. I know what that is like.

Hang in there.

Yes, I'm trying to do 180--started that Tuesday. Also do some Plan A. It is a beautiful day today--suppose to be mid 80's.

Anyway--I'm trying to not LB and trying 180--you are right they hate to be ignored.

It is very nice here too, mid 70's, windy though.

I can no longer even try to do PA so I guess I am doing a 180 also, under much protest, (since he won't leave), being that I am asking him nothing -no questions about anything, not talking at all unless answering a question & trying to live my life as if he isn't there.

This sucks so much. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

BBG93& Albany (((((((((((HUG & HUG)))))))))))))
I feel for both of you. I wished things whould turn around for yall. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I so feel you pain in your words and just wished I could come thru this computer and give you the hug you need!! <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> Yall have tried so very hard to save your marriages and I admire you for this. Yall are stronger than you think. Keep the faith and remember we are here for you. I'm on the computer for most of the day and have this site up for the most part. Plan A , Plan B, 180 rules they are so hard to keep up w/and its hard to not talk or be with the one that you love so much. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> I just wished there was more that I could do. I am here to listen and BBB93 has my email so if Albany you can give me yours if you like. At least I could send you a card. I think sometimes we don't realize how strong God made us, but these ladies here and you have been the strongest people I have seen and has made me a stronger, more aggressive person. I can't tell you why my H is coming out of the fog? Beats me. I'm doing and trying the same things you have. The only thing I haven't done is pop him on his head! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> He might have woke up sooner. I do know if they think they are loosing you they have a tendency to notice their down falls and try to change. I don't know if that helps but I AM HERE FOR YOU TWO!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny , good night & tomorrow is another day that God will see us through.

Hey Sunny,

Thanks for the hug, & your kind words I sure do appreciate them.

I had to look at & talk to H this morning since he went into work late & was blocking me in the driveway. Actually I am not sure if he was going to work or not, God forbid he tell me anything. I did ask him if he was off, he said no, that was it of course. I should not have even bothered, part of the 180's right?

Tomorrow we have to go pick up some furniture, fun wow, I can hardly wait, wish he didnt' have to go w/ me. When I left this morning I didn't say goodbye, & he seemed to be sitting there waiting for me to wave or something. It is driving him up the wall that I am not talking to him, & Sunny you may be right about them thinking they are losing us & coming around, not sure if it will work in my case. I know he doesnt want to see me w/ anyone else & he doesn't want to leave but he doesn't want to commit to doing any work on our M or change any of his ways.

So I am hoping to go out tonite w/ friends & forget my troubles. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> At least until I come home & have to look at them.

Albany hope your evening was good.

Its good to hear from you. Yes go out have fun. Shoot, go get a new out fit. It's friday and I have to work tomorrow, so we decided to stay in town this weekend and do some work around this house. My flower beds look really bad. So I guess I will get that done. H has been doing really good we havent LBed in quite some time. But I still take it one day at a time. I really can't say why he's coming out of his fog. I think it has to do w/ our friends and his family supporting us so much. Maybe it was me asking him to leave about mnt ago. Don't know maybe God just slapped him while he was asleep or something. But I just thank him for the willingness to change. I hope everyone has a great Friday. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

Hey Sunny,

It is so great to hear some positive news around here. Thank God for supportive friends who can help talk some sense into H. I wish someone would talk to mine. I did ask my Goddaughter's dad to talk to my H, he hasn't yet. Him & his wife talked to us both after I threw H out back in 7/02 & helped convince him to move back home.

I am not sure who he talks to now other than his mother who hates me & other silly men who aren't married or look up to him like he did a great thing, they are single & have no morals at all. THen of course he still talks to OW & we all know what her thoughts on the subject of his M. Our friend has his number so I am hoping he will call him soon, H stopped going to church so he won't see him then like I do. If he would hear from someone else that he trusts that he is about to lose me, maybe that would snap him out of this fog of thinking that he is so right about all of his actions & I am the bad guy.

Well hopefully something will happen soon one way or another.

Hope you have a good weekend at home w/ hubby & family, that is what it is really all about. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

BBG~

Is it possible to get your H to move out? Is there a way for you to move out? I hate to sound like I only know one tune, but Plan B sounds like the place you need to be right now.

First, he is still seeing OW. Secondly, you are kinda doing a Plan B right now, but living under the same roof. You're living as separately as you can, but because it's in the same house--Plan B concepts are more like LBs, does that make any sense? While Plan A is nearly impossible if the couple is living apart, Plan B is nearly impossible if living together.

As for your depression. I forget, are you on AD's? I know the despair of which you speak, (only mine was self-inflicted). Do as sunny has suggested, and take care of yourself--do something good for YOU. Make the choice to have some fun. Try your best not to worry about tomorrow...

~ad

Last night went well I think--he came over and fixed lawn mower--just had a bad connector at the battery--cleaned up the connector--works great--he offered to pick up the new BBQ I bought that wouldn't fit in my car and went so far as to offer to bring it over after work tonight and put it together. I said that would be fine.

He made plans for him to take our son when drives to across Oregon visit his parents and pickup a little pickup he had bought over their at Thanksgiving--he buys used cars and trucks to fix up etc. and sell--of course he is bringing it back to our house--we have big 3-bay shop with a car hoist that comes up out of the floor.

Anyway I didn't talk to him much and he seemed a little unsure of how to take that--I could just tell by his reactions. When he left--to go get BBQ and go to his apt. he actually gave me a hug.

Didn't call him after that--but of course he called me later to tell me he had picked up the BBQ--not sure why he needed to call and tell me that.

So that's all I know.

Sunnydale--so happy for you.

Babygir--keep up the good work with 180--I think it is making an impression now--you are one tough cookie.

Autmnday--thanks for all imput and I hope you are right when you say you think there is something that shows hope.

Another great day here--high will be about 85--suppose to nice this weekend also.

Not sure what I will do without my son on Monda-Thursday next week--probably ride my horse every night and maybe start that painting I want to do but it seems like a big task and I haven't gone got all my paint or supplies yet--would be a good project to do either Sunday or Monday evening.

Tomorrow my mom and I hope to go to our favorite nursery and get plant plugs/starts for all of our hanging baskets and pots. I'm looking forward to that.

Hi AD

Thanks for your reply, I love Sunny & Albany, Kris & KT to death, but i am always welcome to hear from an "oldie" w/ words of wisdom.

I gave him the PBL since he is in the house w/ me on April 5, he won't leave. I then came up w/ the idea of a contract listing things we would both stop doing & work on making changes to benefit saving our M. He wanted to revise his portion of it, hasn't done it yet, & I don't expect him to. That was my last ditch effort, unless he makes some BIG changes in his self & how his D will fit in our lives, & puts OW in her place I am done.

So I am trying to do some of the 180's, basically ignoring him, trying to act like he isn't there, Plan B?, but that only works so well w/ him in the house. It is so hard to do, but I am getting better by the day, it is driving him crazy that I won't talk, won't argue - say nothing unless absolutely necessary. I agree though, I am defintiely ready for PB but I need him to leave & he won't. I can put him out if I file for D, & can't do that until I have $, (Aug.).

I am not on any AD's & I don't want to take any. I am already on other meds. I am gonna snap out of this, getting better already. I don't like the current state of affairs in my home right now but I can deal w/ it. I have too for now anyway. I know I have not done everything right, never did a good Plan A, but I also know there is nothing else I can do right now to make our M better so if this goes to PB & then ends in D I have no regrets & have to accept it as God's will for my life.

Thanks again for your post. It means a lot to me, I sometimes feel like I don't fit here since we have no children together but it helps me to know people do care & want to support me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Yes we are here for you. Hey do you have seperate bedrooms? If you moved out of the BR, or moved him out, then he may get the hint! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> Ya think ? He is thinking if he lets you calm down then things will be back like they where. Him running here & there and you being drove crazy. I wish you all the luck in the world and remember the power of prayer is great. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So I keep praying that he wakes up and makes things right. I hope you have a good weekend. I'll be in town and will be on the computer now & then. BBG93 Go out and have fun and start living. I'm glad you don't have the covers on still !! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
type at ya later LOL
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> sunny

I'm with Sunny on move into different bedroom if you can--she is right isn't that fairly pointed???

Well it is to us but maybe not to them if they are so fogged in.

I know this is hard <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> (180 same house) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> but I think it is healthier for you and it will hopefully make an impression on H. Have a good time and live for you-take a bath w/bubbles, paint your toes, take a walk in the sun--or heck do as Sunny says--buy a new outfit or anything that is just for you.

A big ((((((((Hug))))))))) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> . Hang tough

Hey Ladies,

Thanks for your input, it makes my day! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I think I may ask him to move out of the BR, it has been on my mind of late, Lord knows he's not getting any these days, that is driving him crazy too! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I did got out & buy some clothes on my lunch break today, & hope to go out tonite for sure. Not think about him til I have to. I borrowed this quote from MereMortal on a different board

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I think my WH's ability to get me to respond emotionally - either with anger or with crying gave him even more confidence that he oculd get away with it a little longer. It's the calm, firm reactions that really get them worrying IMO. I've read that the opposite of love isn't hate, but indifference. As long as the WS can get still an emotional reaction from the BS, they probably don't worry too much about losing us? <hr /></blockquote>I told her that she hit the nail on the head I think with that summation. I certainly don't hate him but my love is dwindling daily, that is why it important for PB right now so I don't lose all love for him. So indifference is my plan right now along w/ 180's as long as he remains in the house. The separate sleeping arr. will certainly wake him up I know. I don't feel I should have to move out though & he is stubborn enough not to move so we will see.

I am gonna live, w o w/o him, life is too short & I am too old for H's games.

Albany
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Didn't call him after that--but of course he called me later to tell me he had picked up the BBQ--not sure why he needed to call and tell me that. <blockquote>quote:<hr />

He wanted to make sure you were home alone & see how you re-acted to the call! Classic fence sitting! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

<hr /></blockquote>Babygir--keep up the good work with 180--I think it is making an impression now--you are one tough cookie.<hr /></blockquote>Not sure how tough I am, any strength I do have or have left is from God, not me that is for sure, but thanks for the compliment. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hope you have a great weekend! You have things to do & plans w/ your mom - that is 1/2 the battle right there! Let H know you aren't sitting around waiting for him to call or come by. BE INDIFFFERNT!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

It is warm here again today too, happy about that.
We are finally having our spring here in good ol' upstate NY, better now then never I guess. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Way to go BBG93 Glad you got an new outfit. I'm glad you are picking up. Don't make him feel sorry for you. Show him you are a strong lovely woman who deserves to be treated as such.!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> And I would probally put him out the BR. Your not the one who broke their promise, so suffer for the guilty. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Have a great time tonight. We have a funtion at church w/ the childrens group so we will be there. Type at you tomorrow.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> sunny even if its raining!

Yes I am definitely going out w/ my girlfriends, & my new outfit on!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

You are right, I don't want him feeling sorry or thinking I am in this funk b/c of him. He is gonna see a woman determined to move on w/ her life, despite the plans of the demonic spirit controlling him right now!

You have a great evening too!

Hang in there Albany.

Kris what is up w/ you? I pray all is well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

okay so I was stupid and asked up about a debit from our account where he went to dinner on a Friday night and spent 55 bucks--said he went with a friend-of course now he is upset at me--said he shouldn't have to explain himself because we are not together and doesn't want to argue and isn't going to come over tonight.

I said we aren't together then when are you going to tell people we aren't and file for divorce and he said after he gets back from visiting his parents--next week.

His mom doesn't think that at all--she doesn't think he will file. I guess the hug he gave me meant nothing--I suck at all this and I'm just going to give up at it--So I can't ask about what he has spent or he gets mad but he can me a hug for no reason. I asked last night why are you giving me a hug and he said I don't know.

I just have to vent again that I'm really upset at myself--we were moving forward maybe a little and now I just made up turn away.

Sorry just feeling really down because I knew better.

How can I not care about where he is or what he is doing--how does doing all that stuff in the 180 and PB work????

He slipped up in the phone conversation--I said sounds like you don't care he I'm starting not to--why does not talking at all about relationship work???

Why can't I do this??? I felt good this morning about things--he said all we do is argue and I don't make him happy and he doesn't make me happy so it is stupid to not be done--I don't know what to do when he drops BBQ off. He states nothing is working and that even though he comes over it is over--I said yah I bet that--not if you are done the spend time elsewhere.

So when he comes over I guess all I can do is not talk about today's conversation and act again like it's done.

I hate this--and I made this bad today--the more we do this the more I lose him each time--meaning the harder it is to get him to come around sort of or to want--and the thing is he is the one that made this mess and I'm the one having to try and fix.

Hey Albany - Vent away.

Sorry you are having a rough evening. It really sucks that we have to be the ones to do all the work to correct a mess that H's created.

First of all, you have the right to know about mysterious spending from your joint account. You are still married and whether or not he is living at home he is accountable. However, maybe change how you ask about the information. If you see a debit like that, maybe just ask him what he did on Friday instead of questioning the debit. Maybe he will be truthful and you can find out without causing an argument.

It is so hard to play the nice guy in all this. I have struggled with this this week also. I have been doing such a good job of not dwelling on this mess 24/7 and I have felt better. When H is around, I never bring the subject up or talk about it at all unless he wants to talk. H and I have really been having some good times together lately. However, Weds. night was one of those nights when he brought the subject up. Some of the comments he made have just haunted me the last couple of days, which has put me in a down mood. He said things like he had been dreaming of leaving for a long time, that counceling would have worked for us 4 yrs ago (first A w/ same OW)but he doesn't think it will now, how he doesn't want to miss out on things with OC. Yet he has said things like sometimes he thinks he should come home, how he misses the kids, how he doesn't love OW (but has feelings for her), etc. One second he builds up hope, just to take it away in the next breath. I have really had enough of it. I have really been doing good at not showing him how his stupid comments effect me, but the last two nights I have been really distant with him, which makes him mad. I just wish he understood how this whole thing effects me. He knows that I am so willing to work things out, and I think maybe he sometimes takes advantage of that. I am sick of it.

Anyway, the point I really wanted to make before I started ranting is that you kind of have to try to detach yourself and your feelings from the situation - not easy I know. Don't let him see how this is effecting you and be there for him when he is ready to talk. I have found that pushing H just causes more problems. But if he is the one that opens up, he more freely talks about things and feels more comfortable because it is a non threatening environment. I have told him that when he is ready to talk, I am here for him. Be supportive, kind, caring, concerned for him (all the things they should be doing for us). It really has seemed to help with H and me, I have just had a bad week. I let some of the things he said (fog talk) get to me too much.

Keep praying for strength and wisdom to handle this, and God will help you.

And, of course, you always can vent to us. Thats the key, vent here so you don't show your angry to H. It gets easier with time.

Talk to you soon,
Kris

albany, albany, albany, why are you torturing yourself?

You can take control and plan B or you can live in a constant state of emotional upheaval. Why are you doing this to yourself and to him?

You can end up destroying any of the love you have for HIM by allowing him to continue to hurt YOU. I know that is not what you want.

Are you sure H is not seeing OW any more? So what other choice would he have if you gave him one? You or nothing. That's it. If he chooses you he gets his family intact, has to face some issues in counseling and keeps his marriage and wife, if not then he gets to "visit" his son and he's on his own. And you are free to move on----------guilt free and w/ the potential to be healed.

Why are you procrastinating on this? Do you really think that he will choose to only have "visitation" w/ his son and not have you @ all? Come on woman!

Get moving and DO SOMETHING ABOUT THIS NOW!

Why do you allow him to hurt you? Why are YOU playing this game? We know what HIS problems are but what's wrong w/ YOU?

Maybe you should plan B for HIS sake so that you do not destroy any more of the love he has for you.

BG - Thanks for asking about me. I had a couple of bad days, but I will keep myself busy this weekend and get back on track. Just seems like when it rains it pours. H made some comments that I have really let bother me, job is getting a little stressful, worrying about money issues, but mostly, really beginning to worry about how everything is going to effect my kids. Times flying, and soon their whole world is going to be rocked. They don't deserve this and I am starting to stress about how they are going to handle this whole thing.

Glad to see you are going out to have some fun tonight. Live it up. You deserve some stressfree (what's that??) time with your friends. And I agree, I think you ought to move H to separate bedroom. That should open his eyes a little. I will hope for the best for you.

Sunny - So happy to hear things are still going well for you. Congrats and keep up the good work.

Love you all!!

God Bless,
Kris
T

okay I went shopping--so I wasn't here when he dropped BBQ off--didn't answer my phone either.

He says he cares but doesn't want to be married--I told him fine whatever--I said I ignore and act indifferent you become needy so then if I show I care you pull away.

I have to stick to 180--I'm not calling back etc.

Honestly though he isn't done I don't think but he isn't really going in either direct so I'm going forward away from him right now--you are right KT this is causing both of us to lose the love for each other.

He said tonight that he is just done--wants no more arguing--sad thing is that we are only arguing about being done--he wants to be done and say are you sure essentially and he yes and it just goes on--I enable argueing so tonight I just said thanks for leaving BBQ and that was basically and said that I didn't call to argue.

Why does the 180 work?? Not talking about relationship or pointing out good things about it seems to draw them nearer--why??? are they afraid we are becoming detached beginning not to care???

Anyway--I guess I'm numb tonight because why believe he is done when he has said it a million times and is never done according to his actions.

albany~

edited to say: How cool is it to answer before the question??!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Email is good, any post I'd attempt now would suck--I'm beyond sleepy. Just wanted to let you know I saw your latest posts. I hear your frustration and despair--please hang in there!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

[ April 30, 2004, 11:12 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

Got it--do you want to post or me to e-mail you--I just suck at all this 180 Pb stuff right now--maybe the break Monday-thursday will let me gain some strength etc.

AD---did you get the e-mail I sent to you??

[ April 30, 2004, 11:22 PM: Message edited by: albany ]

Nothing new here--no phone calls from H I guess he must have had good dinner with the lead man on his crew and his wife.

Just bummed--I'm the one always holding down the fort. Hope he will call--It is taking all my strength not to call him right now--have things to do but no motivation to do them.

I guess I'm just in the dumps <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

The Update:

H called at 2:30pm today and said he was coming by before work-that was extent of phone conversation. He arrived kind of lat about 20 minutes before he had to be at work--our good friend was over and I think that threw him for a loop-he actually accused me of having an affiar with this friend of our--but when you are guilty I guess assume others are too. Anyway he didn't want a hug because after last time he hugged me on Thursday I threw it in his was last night--fine no skin off my back--he was going to come over tomorrow to put BBQ together--last night he had stated that is when we would talk next but you see he couldn't go 24 hours without talking to me or seeing me.

I have news for him when he calls about putting BBQ together--I don't need him too--our friend--who knows what is going on--actually was H's friend he met when we were apart in 1999--put it together for me just as long as I made him a steak so we ate BBQ steak and then he left awhile ago--he was hanging since his girlfriend went out tonight with a girlfriend.

Well I'm sure he will call tomorrow and come over--think I will tell him that there isn't any reason for him too because the BBQ is already together <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> that will impress him--NOT! oh well.

Took a three hour nap today--I really needed it--was so emotionally and mentally exhausted--went and got flowers for all my hanging baskets with my mom at the nursery. It was a good day--knew he would call even though he said he would call on Sunday--oh yah he is sick sounds really bad in his lungs--I didn't so a ton sympathy--told him if he quick smoking it would help---started taht when he got all stressed with OW and her being pregnant--left it at that. I don't see why I need to show much sympathy.

Keep me posted BBYG, Sunnydale and KrisM--hope you are all doing well.

You are in my prayers tonight as every night.

Hey Albany,

I am sorry I wasn't around this weekend, how are u today? Did you talk anymore w/ H? The 180's are extremely hard to do, since you are acting like you don't care when you so so much.

Do you think he was telling the truth about dinner w/ a friend? It worries me that he seemed to get defensive about it.

You sound like you are in the same shape I was last week & that is not a good place to be.

Albany,

I am sorry I missed some of your posts, did I get things screwed up about the dinner your H had?

Anyhoo, here is my update for the past weekend, Fri. nite went out had a good time, got in really late, H was home asleep said nothing to me the next day. H was home until 4:40 on Sat., (he is usually gone long before that), we then went to pick up the table, he then came home early, (usually goes out on Sat. nite.), to put the table together. I limited my conversation to talking about picking up the table only. He made some small talk not much. Yesterday I got up went to church, came home to find out my grandmother had fallen down the stairs & was in the ER. Told H about it & rushed out to the ER, he sends me a text message at about 1:10 asking if everything was ok & said he was in church. He hasn't gone to church in quite some time, so that was surprising. I got back really late from the hospital, & H was not home, when he did come in he was aksing how she was.

This morning I didn't get up to go to work since I was exhausted from being up all day yesterday, so he was asking if I needed a hug, I said yes & of course he wanted to be intimate, so I strayed from my 180 & asked if he thought that would solve anything being that we have unresolved issues to work out. He didnt' want to talk of course, so I didn't push it. I did then ask him why he wanted to be intimate w/ me & his response was - because it's been a long time. -----Not I need you, I love you, wanna be close to you. So I got dressed & went to work. That is why he is being nice.

Our friend did call him & H asked for his # so he can return the call, hopefully they will connect & soon.

I am afraid to be hopeful at this point, not that I have much to go on but I don't want to get my hopes dashed again either. I am still planning to 180 & may ask him to move out or our BR this evening. We will see.

Where is everyone today???

I have a day ffom heck at work--month end at my job--computer network down due to virus.

H was annoyed to see I had friend put BBQ together.

He came by this morning and got ready for his trip to see his parents-picked up our son and one of the dogs he was taking--of course he went to his apt. to get his clothes first but then came to our house and took a shower and bath--he worked last night-we did give each other a hug goodbye this morning.

He called at 10:30am and asked me a favor to pick up RX that he had forgotten to pick up. Said he would call when he got their to let me know they had arrived safe.

H called at 3:00pm to let me know thaey had arrived and he said I could give him a call back if I wanted too.

Well guess what I want to call back--but I'm not going too--180.

Oh by the way he is still done according to him.

We aill have to wait and see what he tells his parents--his Mom will tell me.

Hey everyone!!! I have been running like a chicken w/ head gone. But hows everyone doing? We are about the same. H and I got into a voodoo talk about the OW Friday am. I haven't been talking a whole lot just had alot of crap on my mind. He wanted to know what was up and I told him I just get worried and stressed about all thats going on. He said nothing to worry about he was here and not going anywhere. He asked when we where going to tell our D about the OC. I told him when we know for sure it was his. And here we go again. Its just going to P her off and she is going to try and take everything BLAH BLAH BLAH, oh and she has talked to the attorney and having the OC in our state and can get support set by our state. I told him she was a dumba$$ and it was based on where she lived not where the OC was born. Remember I talked to an attorney too, but H didn't want to go. Then he said she told him if we embarrassed her w/ a p test, and I said hold it, what about MY embarrassement? What about D's embarrassement? I didn't give a rats behind about wheither she was embarrassed or not. And he looked at me as if a light went off in his head? H said she didn't want me no where near the hospital, but he really did want to go see what the baby looked like. I told him she put me in this and she would have to get use to me because I am the step mom! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> If he wanted to do this w/o me then so be it me and D would leave and he could enjoy the rest of the pg w/ her. He of course said no, he didn't and we came first BLAH BLAH BLAH. I told him sometimes I feel like he could just change his mind and turn around and run any min sometimes, he said no. So we will take day by day. But we had a good weekend had lots of friends over on Sunday and everyone said just like old times, and made me feel good. He knows OUR friends will never except the OW and like me far better, they know I am a better person. He would have just HER friends if he left and went to her. He knows his life is better w/ me and feel he really does want everything to work, but some how in the back of my mind I keep thinking he could leave after the OC is born. Can't get over that feeling and maybe w/ time I will. Well that's my update and I am praying for you all
Sunny <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

We'll I didn't call him and he called me to make I got the message--well whatever--if I didn't I would be calling to see if they arrived safely--hello <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> my son is with him.

That's it haven't heard from him since. Not all bad. I just hope he doesn't tell his parents that he is done. Hope his mom gives me an update.

Babygirl--your's sounds a bit like mine--intimate when it's been too long--so sweet <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> (NOT)-I figure they can find someone else <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> --but hey look where it lead to the first time.

Sunnydale--sounds good to me and time I think will heal and rebuild trust.

KrisM--haven't heard from you today.

Have a good day tomorrow--you are all in my thoughts and prayers tonight.

Hey girls,

I haven't postede in a while, just don't know what to do. I have been reading your posts and it sounds like for the most part things have been going better for each of you. I want you to know that I may not post often, but I continue to read and learn from some of the things that you all go through as they relate to my situation. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

So thank you all for your thoughts and kind words of encouragement to each other it means more than you know. This whole situation is so new to me that I feel lost, but I get a quick fix when I read something from each of you. It reminds me that I am not alone.

I find it hard to release the anger. I get positive results when I plan A but I am not ale to keep it up for more than a couple of days. My lack of confidence and strength in my mariage may just cause me to loose it for good. I keep telling myself that surely God did not want this for me and I should just get out of it; however, I love him so and I want my kids to have their father in the home. H swaers that he wants to be here but we have got to work through our communication problems and my controling issues. H states that my angry outbursts and actions toward him is what caused him to go outthere in the first place.

I want to work on it but I don't know how th relinquish control. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Hang in there JT2 we are here for you--the roller coaster rides gets to all of us at one time or another.

Haven't heard anything from H--really want to call him--but I'm writing a little post instead here--makes fell better.

Having a girlfriend over for BBQ dinner tonight. It has started to rain a bit and will shower off and on all week and weekend <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> typical OR weather--so much for the sun we have had--enjoyed it while it lasted.

Babygirl, KrisM, and AD--what is up???

Hello,

JT good to hear from you, sorry you don't have better news. I will keep you in prayer, this is all still new so remember that it takes time for things to look up, we want everything right now, I know I do, but it doesn't work that way especially in God's time frame.

Yesterday H came in & finished putting together the table & chairs, part of the table was damaged so he had to take it back. I thought for sure he would let it sit in the box for days. So that was positive I guess. I do think he is being really attentive b/c he wants to be intimate, but I don't see how I can do a real 180 & do that w/o sending mixed signals. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Thank God & all of you I am feeling much better this week, taking one day at a time & feeling better about whatever the future may hold for me. My anniversary is in 3 weeks, I wanted to go away but don't see that happening at least not with H, but I will celebrate anyway, 8 means new beginnings, & that is what this year will be for me a new beginning maybe married, maybe single if there is no 9th anniversary to celebrate I am ready for that possibility too.

Hope everyone is having a blessed day! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Nothing new--now phone from him or his mom--maybe he is done or maybe he is just having fun with family.

Can't say that I have much faith--it scares me greatly that in my heart I think he is done.

Have you guys ever felt they were done too--I think that I have lost hope that it will ever work and that we will ever be a family.

I know I say this after only a little over 24-hours of no contact--which is why I suck at this--I feel really weak to feel like this and be so upset with no contact-but I just have this bad gut feeling that this is it and it is done. Hope my feeling is wrong and wish I was internally stronger at the 180 thing--I just don't feel like I hold the cards and when I feel that way I'm very weak with the 180's and no contact etc.

I'm sorry you guys but I just feel like I have lost him for good. I don't want to be alone the rest of my life but I really don't want to have my son have a stepdad--hard for me to explain--I would have rather had a child without another parent figure in their life then to have a child and give him a two-parent home/household only to take it away.

I feel my life is changing and I willnever get my dream of the family I wanted.

Anyway I need run--just a crying mess right now and I will say a prayer for each of you tonight.
<img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

Hey Albany,

I hope you are feeling better this morning. I know how discouraging this can all be, like I told JT, this is still fairly new right? So don't expect a quick fix as bad as you want one it isn't going to happen right now. Time is the key, the wait is horrendous, I know, I am still waiting too, you are more blessed than I was since you at least have this place to come & share w/ other women who unfortunately don't have to try to imagine your pain since they are living it as well.

Try to stay encouraged, know that God has the final say on your marriage, learn to lean on him & trust that he will see you thru this no matter the outcome. I can relate to not wanting your son to have a step dad, even now 20 yrs. after the fact I still wonder what my life would have been like if my first H had gotten help for his abuse problems if we could have made it, possibly I would have had a brother or sister for my son & we would be celebrating our 24th wedding anniversary this year, but that was not meant to be. God knew all of these things would happen to us before the foundation of the world, but his plans for us our good. Try to hold on to that, I know it is dark right now & everything seems hopeless but weeping endureth for a night & joy comes in the morning!

How long is the night... I have asked myself that many a time, my night is still going on too, we have to be patient, don't give up or give in. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

BBYG-- a little better this morning--not much--just feeling like the end has came and I'm not sure why I feel that way--really bummed about Mother's Day.

I really hope my feeling is wrong but I feel like a big piece of me left yesterday and I have this huge hole in my heart.

Do you think that how I feel is a bad sign that subconsciously I know that it is over or I'm I just feeling this way because he is gone and I haven't talked to him or his mom??? I'm just so afraid.

{{{{{{{Albany}}}}}}}} Big Hug to you sweetie, I can't tell you how many times I thought the end had come, especially while H was out of the house. It is a rollercoaster & you are having a bad day(s).

I had a bad week last week so it happens when you least expect it or you just let yourself hope too much sometimes I think. You will know if & when the point comes that you can no longer go on like this. Maybe you need to seriously consider doing Plan B, if you are constantly hurting over things H says & does or doesn't do? I think if he was truly ready to be done w/ you & your marriage he would act on it, I think he is having a grand ol time sitting on the fence while you stress about this 24/7 & it is not right. Really pray over this Albany & if the 180's are not working, it may be time for a new approach.

As for me I strayed from the 180 today, I got a new phone & text messaged H today, just to say hi. I have not gotten a reply, so I am not sure if he got it or not, now I wish I hadn't bothered. I only got the feature on my phone cuz he has it on his. I am not gonna stress about it though.

Hang in there.

Okay BBYG--why do set ourselves up like that--we know not to stray from 180 and we still do it and then we regret it immediately--thinking of the text message thing you did-I have done hundreds of different things like that and totally regretted and then been upset by the outcome.

I will be checking the site all day--I just refresh ever few minutes.

Albany,

P.S. I am bummed out a little about Mothers Day too. Last year I asked him to leave after him only being home a month, we had a long intense discussion & both of us were crying before it was all over.

I know this year will be different, I won't spend it crying not over him anyway, but the pain of knowing OW will be celebrating being a mother to my H's baby & I never will hurts so much.

Just really sad for me because we always did something so special for Mother's day and now no one meaning him or something from my son that my H got will happen.

I just feel so alone this week. Sorry to bother you with this but--I just feel completely empty.

You are not a bother at all, like I said we all have our days, I was so down last week I just wanted to go to sleep & not wake up.

It will get better, I wish I could tell you when, but that is what this board is for we pick each other up when one of us is down as best we can w/o physically being there.

Who knows H may surprise you on Sunday, but even if he doesn't it is still a special day for you if nothing else know you are blessed to be a mom & have a healthy son, there are many women who will be really sad that day b/c they have lost a child, or their own mom, so we can't not be grateful & thankful for the good things we do have in our lives. As much as it pains me that I can't celebrate being a mom to my H's daughter, I have a healthy son who loves me & my mom is still alive. My grandmother is in surgery right now, she feel on sunday & swallowed a tube they put in her nose so they are operating to take it out, I pray she will be fine & home on Sunday, but only God knows.

Just remember you have a son who needs YOU, so focus on that, H may or may not come out of the fog, you can't control that, dwell on what is good in your life, I remember a good friend telling me that early on in all this while H was living w/ OW & she was still pg., I thought yeah, easy for you to say but it was very good advice, try to follow it if you can.

I am here, you are not a bother at all. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I also had an awful dream last night--Had a dream that H took a job with the same company he works for now but over near his parents and he was trying to get full custody of our son who I took care of the whole time he didn't live at home this past summer while he was having the affair with OW.

Why is my mind running away so badly with these bad thoughs and feelings??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

Morning Ladies~

First, BBG, I wouldn't fret about the text message. It's not like you sent a bunch more after he didn't respond to the first one. I think one of the overall themes to the 180's is to display a NON-clingy attitude. It's also doing opposite behaviors of what you've done in the past--thus the term 180. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> One of the goals is to get him to pursue you, not the other way around. From all you've indicated, you are doing good with the 180's. By the way, I saw your other post asking if being intimate would violate the 180's...I didn't get a chance to see many of the responses yet though. I'll try to check back on that.

I wish like crazy you could get your H out of the house, or that you were able to get out, because you seem very ready to do a complete Plan B! Is there a way you could work toward that? If I were you, I would do everything in my power to do a *real* Plan B. For now, you are doing really well. Have you been feeling any better?

Speaking of which...albany, you already know how much I agree with BBG about YOU doing a Plan B, so I won't go on and on about it with you.

I do want you to think of this though--You've mentioned several times now, how you feel stronger when you have the ball in your court, etc...I want to suggest to you, (I may have already, but it bears repeating), that the ball will be in YOUR court when you go to Plan B. You call the shots, you set the terms, you draw the boundries. It will all be set up in your Plan B letter.

I also wanted to point out that right now, your nerves are shot. That being the case, I wouldn't rely too heavily on your "feeling/emotions" to determine whether your H is done or not. Relying on your feelings right now, when you are so emotionally drained, will only make the roller coaster ride more stomach turning! You know what I mean? One day, he gives you a hug, and you might want to plan your 50th wedding anniv. party. The next day, he's gone to visit his folks--no call from him--and you're sure he wants a divorce. Try not to give into your "feelings", or I'm afraid you will drive yourself crazy. Not only that, but I believe at this point, going on feelings alone, will steer you wrong.

Try to step back and seperate yourself as much as possible from the situation, and think with your head.

Now for a little levity, (I hope). If all else fails--I came up with a good plan for you two ladies. BBG, you seem to want to do a Plan B, but can't get that pesky little H <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> out of the house, and we all know modified PBs like NEVER work. Albany, you really want to do a good Plan A, but H is living elsewhere, and we all know it's much more conducive to have Hubby living at home to have a successful Plan A....

Soooooo, you two simply need to switch H's!!!! How's that???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Seriously ladies, if I could wave a magic wand, or at least slap your H's silly till they had some sense knocked into them, I would. Unfortunately, I cannot, and neither can you. This stuff is hard work, and it truly sucks that in so many cases such as yours, the BW is having to do all the work. Keep your minds set on what you want the outcome to be, try not to let your head wander from the goal, and go from there.

Hang in there ladies--things will get better!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Warmest regards,
~ad

***edited to add a little on to the 1st paragraph to BBG***

[ May 05, 2004, 11:24 AM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

Thanks AD

yeah the whole intimate thing--been there--they don't last too long without--after that though my H usually comes around much more--until I push on him for an answer and then he becomes distant again.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> First, BBG, I wouldn't fret about the text message. It's not like you sent a bunch more after he didn't respond to the first one. I think one of the overall themes to the 180's is to display a NON-clingy attitude. It's also doing opposite behaviors of what you've done in the past--thus the term 180. One of the goals is to get him to pursue you, not the other way around. From all you've indicated, you are doing good with the 180's. By the way, I saw your other post asking if being intimate would violate the 180's...I didn't get a chance to see many of the responses yet though. I'll try to check back on that. <blockquote>quote:<hr />

AD - Guess what, I called to tell him about my Grandmother, since he didn't reply to the message & his phone is off, didn't pay the bill, so no harm no foul! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> I didn't get too many replies to my post, as I said I just think it send mixed signals, H tried really hard this morning, I really had a bad headache though, still do, so I told him tonite, probably shouldn't have made that promise. I just know that once it is over he will most likely go back to being non-attentive & I will feel used. I can't lie though I feel a need to be close to him, but as I said how do you effectively do a 180 & still make love to your spouse?

<hr /></blockquote>I wish like crazy you could get your H out of the house, or that you were able to get out, because you seem very ready to do a complete Plan B! Is there a way you could work toward that? If I were you, I would do everything in my power to do a *real* Plan B. For now, you are doing really well. Have you been feeling any better? <hr /></blockquote>Actually I feel a lot better, maybe b/c I am enjoying his pursuit of me. The 180 is going well, he is talking to me more, but as I said if I give in tonite, will that give him his fix for the next couple of weeks & he will leave me alone? I don't have this burning desire to do PB anymore, I feel a certain peace, for the moment anyway, that I can't really explain with him being in the house & me trying to 180, so right now I am taking it one day at a time. Maybe I am losing my mind, nothing has changed, I am not seeing a real positive sign that he is ready to change, but I am not down in the pit of despair like last week either.

Maybe I have truly released all this to GOD & he is giving me peace?

At any rate since last Friday I have felt this way & it is so much better than stressing over it all the time.

The trading H's comment was a hoot! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I doubt very seriously Albany wants mine though!
Thanks for your post AD.

I wish I could release and be a peace like you are right now BBYG.

AD I hope you are right when you said that you have a feeling that my H and I will make it. I hope your special sense is correct--and you are right I'm too worn out and that is why lately I believe I feel the way I do sometimes. I willtry to step back from the situation--but it is so hard.

So I'm I doing okay on the 180?? Haven't talked to him etc.

Hey Girls,

I think that everyone is in the same state right now, but I will agree that it is all to new for us to make any rash decisions.

Albany just hang in there and see what happens. I know it is harder to do, but the outcome might be what you are looking for.

And about Mother's Day please remember that you are a mother and it is a celebration of the bond you share with your son, not your husband (you are not his mother).

I know that it is hard to do because I am struggling with it too, but you need to concentrate on you right now - and just breathe deeply.

I struggle with it daily, but am so tired so I must now just take deep breaths and pray for the best.

I focus to much on what if's instead of trying to correct our problems. H has to make some hard decisions. You must also allow him time to get it straight so a 180 is a good thing.

Keep praying <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

JT2--

But I wonder if he isn't just done--he clearly said on Friday night that he was done. Maybe he doesn't need time to think. What are your thoughts??? His mom believes he needs time and just can't take the pressure--I always ask and ask questions and want answers--it is in my nature to know things and I'm not comfortable with having things up in the air--especially when it isn't on my terms.

Although he has said he was done many times before so I can't really tell. Everyonee here and my friends and even his mom does not think he is done because a lot of his actions do not match his words.

I know we are all in the same boat--I guess I just want him to chase after me etc and want me--I really have the need to be wanted--haven't been wanted for a long time now.

You are right Mother's day isn't about him and I but it is hard for it not to may me sad.

That is the operative phrase "I have peace right now' I am hoping that is permanent. It was taking too much out of me to continue in the "cycle of pain" I was in. Asking for & receiving nothing but grief, it is already done - whatever the outcome of my M will be. When I was in church Sunday a friend that I have not spoke to in awhile gave me a word I believe was directly from the Lord, she said "enough - close those doors & stop looking back" it applied to so many things in my life other than my M which of course has been #1 on my list for almost 2 years now.

You will get there too, you have to re-direct your focus, easier said then done & it takes time, be patient, I know it is soooooo hard. 180's arent' easy but you are doing well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Going to lunch, be back.

Thanks BBYG

I hope that is true about doing well with 180--I also hope I'm rewarded for it and I know that we are only given what we can deal with but I hope this turns out well--I don't want this just because I'm able deal with it--otherwise I wouldhave choose to be weak so I got what I wanted because I wasn't strong enough to deal with obstacles. Does any of that make sense??

Anyway I hope you are all right and that H is really done and that 180 works in a positive way--catch you after lunch.

albany,

If he was really through with you he would not waste any time talking to you. Most men have to much pride to keep hanging around if they don't want you.

So don't worry besides he would have already filed by now if that were the case.

So please feel better about your situation - He's not done with you yet - He is just confused!!

Thanks JT2

Have a wonderful rest of the day.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I wish I could release and be a peace like you are right now BBYG. <hr /></blockquote>albany, you don't have to wish, you just have to do .

<blockquote>quote:<hr />So I'm I doing okay on the 180?? Haven't talked to him etc.

<hr /></blockquote>Yes, from what you've said, you haven't chased him down, since he left for his visit w/ family. That's a good thing. Also, sounds like you've been having some fun with your friends, your new BBQ, and your gardening. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Just keep doing what YOU'RE supposed to be doing, no matter what idiotic, confusing behavior he exhibits. You cannot control him, but you can control you. If you insist on giving Plan A another try, then remember you MUST be as flawless at it as you possibly can be. Keep telling yourself that, ok?

<blockquote>quote:<hr />I guess I just want him to chase after me etc and want me--I really have the need to be wanted--haven't been wanted for a long time now.
<hr /></blockquote>The only way he can chase you, is if you STOP chasing him. He can't chase someone who's running after him--unless you guys like running in circles. Picture a dog trying to chase his tail!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I know you don't like running in circles, albany, it's totally draining the life out of you!

Stop sticking your hand out, checking which way the wind is blowing, and deciding your behavior, and also the state of your marriage based on it.

Your H is a mess right now. The way I see it, you have control, all you have to do is reach out and grab it. He's out there aimlessly drifting about, you cannot afford to do the same.

BBG~

I read the response from WAT. He happens to be one of the sharpest tools in this MB box. If you noticed, he said doing a 180 is reversing old destructive behavior, not reversing the right things! So, I believe he is saying, and I agree...you should go for it!!!!

If you're not attempting Plan B, but rather are trying to give Plan A a go again--then part of Plan A is meeting his ENs. I would venture to guess, your H isn't much different from most men, and SF is at the top of his ENs, right?

True, he may only need it right now, to meet a need, his need, and not to meet your needs, but hey--you never know??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Besides that, even when a marriage is going really well, sometimes, just because we love someone, we want to and should give them SF, even if we don't really *feel* like it that particular day, you know?

My H didn't particularily feel like taking our D, (who I promised a trip to the ice-cream shop yesterday), out at 9pm last night, when I was too tired to do it, BUT he did anyway. Not only did he do that, but he stopped at the grocery to get me a carton of vanilla, a pint of raspberries, and pecans. Then came home, made me a sundae...AND salted the pecans, because he knows I don't like them plain, on a sundae. (yeah, I'm just a tad high maintenance) I know he was tired too, and didn't *feel*, like doing all that, but man oh man, my love bank was going, ca-ching, ca-ching...and I made sure he knew it!! You better believe the next time he's wanting SF, and I'm not in the *mood*, I will get in the mood, but fast! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> When one seeks to give, one usually ends up receiving!!

So, I say go for it BBG. I wouldn't go overboard. I mean, be yourself and everything. I just wouldn't suggest you make any overatures, such as, "Oh honey, this was so wonderful...see how great we are together, let's get going on turning this M around, blah, blah, blah..." Be relaxed as you can, ENJOY it, don't act as if you're doing it out of a sense of duty, (even if that's how you feel). Don't read too much into his actions, be they good, or bad, afterward. Just keep doing a stellar Plan A. Remembering what we always hear, this is not a sprint, rather, a marathon.

Keep thinking--gonna fill up his love bank, gonna fill up his love bank!!

That is such a beautiful word your friend gave you! I too, believe it was from God. What a wonderful direction he gave you, and I believe if you're obedient to His will, your blessings will overflow!!!!

AD,

That's so great! You are giving great advice to us all. I greatly appreciate it!!

Keeping me on my toes!

Much prayers - and blessings <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Thanks AD

you are right I need to act for me not according to him.

Hopefully he will chase me--we will see. Hopefully he isn't done--anyway this afternoon will only be 48 hours without contact.

I try and be more positive.

AD,

Thanks so much for that sound advice, I was gonna give him SF this evening anyway, since I like to keep my word, & it is not that I don't want to, just I am trying to guard my heart as much as possible & that opens the flood gates for me. But you are absoulutely right, I will be myself & enjoy, I have needs too afterall.

I think right now I am doing more of a 180 than a Plan A or maybe it is a combination of both I guess whatever it is right now it is working like a charm for me.

You are right the words my friend said to me I believe were straight from God, she knows the situation, but I have not talked to her about what has been going on since last summer, & she even said to me I dont' know what the circumstances are or what is going on with you right now but it is enough. We were holding each other & I just cried as she spoke these words to me cuz I knew it was GOD. I have been in & out of church, going out too much, dwelling on the past, tripping on things I can't control,looking to the wrong people for help w/ problems so all that must stop, closing that door, not looking back! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

JT,

I have been following your post to Gemini, counseling is a great idea as well venting your anger in the gym. You can never do enough for yourself these days you know. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Don't keep beating yourself up about what has happened in the past, sure we have all played a part in the events that may have led up to the A but the fact that you see your part & acknowledge in it is enough. None of us can go back & re-write history what is done is done. Also bottom line is your H just like mine & everyone else who posts here made a conscious choice to stray outside of his M & have a A - not YOU!

You make amends for what you can & try to do better for yourself, your kids & your M but you can't fix him, only God can.

I am praying for you too, & believe your M can be healed, God is able to do anything but FAIL!

Just want you to know that I'm sick to my stomach--okay--I have got to get all this out of my mind--I miss my son so much--I miss my H and my family.

Albany,

Hope you have a good evening.

Stay strong! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

We were posting at the same time, I hope you feel better it is hard not to let this physically get to you, but try to concentrate on the good & positive things in your life, call your mom or some friends who can help you take your mind off the situation for awhile.

I am leaving work now, but I'll be on at home. Take care of YOU.

I will try--do you know what I mean by the gross feeling you get--I just feel awful and I can't believe that he didn't even call and have our son talk to me.

I think this is all getting me because I don't know what is going on and I haven't got to talk to his mom to find if she knows anything.

AD-
I re-read 180 list and I have been doing well with all the things that would be visible to H--some of the things for me--not so much but not all bad.

Sorry to be in such a funk right now. Maybe I will hear something tonight but I'm not getting my hopes up.

AD-let me know when you want to chat so I can explain the whole situation and you won't get so confused and you will understand why it is strange to me that my Dad hasn't yet found out at his work about OW being w/OC.

I will try to stay positive I just remember H saying he would start the divorce when he got back from trip(he said that last week)so I thought this was the time he would tell them but according to him they already know--NOT--according to his mom.

I will be off in a hour and have to vacumm at home and tidy up etc.--I think that I will take a nice long bath--pamper myself and hey do I answer the phone if he calls???

Need feedback on that you guys.

Have a good night and many hugs BBYG--sure you will get more than hugs <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

[ May 05, 2004, 05:27 PM: Message edited by: albany ]

Just wanted to share.

I believe

I believe-
that we don't have to change friends
if we understand that friends change.

I believe-
that no matter how good a friend is,
they're going to hurt you every
once in a while and you must forgive
them for that.

I believe-
that true friendship continues to grow,
even over the longest distance.
Same goes for true love.

I believe-
that you can do something in an instant
that will give you heartache for life.

I believe-
that it's taking me a long time
to become the person I want to be.

I believe-
that you should always leave loved ones
with loving words. It may be the last
time you see them.

I believe-
that you can keep going
long after you can't.

I believe-
that we are responsible for what we do,
no matter how we feel.

I believe-
that either you control your attitude
or it controls you.

I believe-
that regardless of how hot and
steamy a relationship is at first,
the passion fades and there had
better be something else to take
its place.

I believe-
that heroes are the people
who do what has to be done
when it needs to be done,
regardless of the consequences.

I believe-
that money is a lousy way of keeping score.

I believe-
that my best friend and I can do anything
or nothing and have the best time.

I believe-
that sometimes the people you expect
to kick you when you're down,
will be the ones to help you get back up.

I believe-
that sometimes when I'm angry
I have the right to be angry,
but that doesn't give me
the right to be cruel.

I believe-
that just because someone doesn't love
you the way you want them to doesn't
mean they don't love you with all they have.

I believe-
that maturity has more to do with
what types of experiences you've had
and what you've learned from them
and less to do with how many
birthdays you've celebrated.

I believe-
that it isn't always enough to be
forgiven by others. Sometimes you
have to learn to forgive yourself.

I believe-
that no matter how bad your heart is broken
the world doesn't stop for your grief.

I believe-
that our background and circumstances
may have influenced who we are,
but we are responsible for who we become.

I believe-
that just because two people argue,
it doesn't mean they don't love each other
And just because they don't argue,
it doesn't mean they do.

I believe-
that you shouldn't be so eager to find out a
secret. It could change your life forever.

I believe-
that two people can look at the exact
same thing and see something totally .
different.

I believe-
that your life can be changed in a matter of
hours by people who don't even know you.

I believe-
that even when you think you have no more
to give, when a friend cries out to you
you will find the strength to help.

I believe-
that credentials on the wall
do not make you a decent human being.

I believe-
that the people you care about most in life
are taken from you too soon.

Send this to people YOU BELIEVE In...
I just did.

Hey Albany - Hang in there. It is so tough to be going through this, especially when your son is away too. That definitely makes it worse. The first weekend my H took kids after he moved out was when I hit rock bottom. As much as H put me through, the kids were keeping me strong and sane. When they were gone, it is like everything just hit like a ton of bricks. It was like I was seeing what life would be like if H and I divorced - kids visiting H on weekends. I hated it. This is not what I want for me or for the kids. I just wish H would wake up and see that he would be causing kids so much harm. Hang in there though. Once your little one is home, you will feel better. And if H calls, I would pick up. Don't let him know what you have been going through. Ask how the trip is and ask to talk to your son. Don't make a big deal about it.

Take care of yourself.
Kris

Thanks KrisM

I hope it all works out--I hope I didn't push him away this last time for good by demanding answers to soon and not letting him come out of the fog on his own.

It feels not good to me I have a bad feeling right now but I think AD explains those feelings of doom well. <blockquote>quote:<hr /> <hr /></blockquote>I also wanted to point out that right now, your nerves are shot. That being the case, I wouldn't rely too heavily on your "feeling/emotions" to determine whether your H is done or not. Relying on your feelings right now, when you are so emotionally drained, will only make the roller coaster ride more stomach turning! You know what I mean? One day, he gives you a hug, and you might want to plan your 50th wedding anniv. party. The next day, he's gone to visit his folks--no call from him--and you're sure he wants a divorce. Try not to give into your "feelings", or I'm afraid you will drive yourself crazy. Not only that, but I believe at this point, going on feelings alone, will steer you wrong.

Try to step back and seperate yourself as much as possible from the situation, and think with your head.

I'm trying but as you say it is so hard. He took our son and one of our dogs with him and I guess I didn't realize how much they keep me going and occupied.

KrisM--what is your current status-would love to hear and update.

Well he just called to let me know how things were going. And asked how it was going here and I said good. He sounded okay but I couldn't get a feel one way or the other for the situation between us.

He asked if there was certain time I wanted our son dropped of tomorrow night--he said I don't know if you have plans.

Hey Albany,

Sounds like you are feeling better, how did you act while talking to H? Did you manage to 180? It is very hard to do them all & well at that.

Listen to this I get a call this evening from the day care center that H's daughter goes to, they are looking for H, called the house since his cell is disconnected, asked who I was, then asked if I was the baby's mom! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> The day care wanted to let him know about something to do w/ public assitance and money, she was talking in code, kept saying he would know what she was talking about, but of course ME I am just the wife so why do I need to know anything. I am a tad pissed, not about the money I know he has to pay CS & should, just the fact that it goes along w/ secrets & lies to me. It is like part of his "secret life". So I don't know about the SF going on tonite now.

I am not going to turn this into a big LB but I don't appreciate it plus it was embarassing, H seems to be so proud to be a dad why not tell everyone how she got here?

WTHeck! Why are they calling YOUR H about public assistance and $$$$$$. He is not on public assistance so that is none of his business either. AND even if OW and OC are, it is confidential. They are not supposed to be sharing info w/ him. All I can think about is that OW has a deductable for childcare and has referred them to him for payment. Even so, that is not for them to be calling him. how stupid!

Yah, try not to LB, i would be!!!!!!arghh! Just let him know, non-chalantly that they called looking for him & it was "something about public assistance & $$$$". No need to say anything more.

Let him love you, why not? just go for it, and your right, you have needs too. You don't have to deprive yourself. You ARE the one married to him, you are the only one w/ the right to enjoy SF w/ him so go ahead! That's my vote! Men feel closer after SF so that could be a good sign that he also wants to feel close to you!

KT,

I thought the whole thing was stupid too that they woould call & it wasn't anything life altering so wait til he gets his cell on or call OW, being that I think if I had said I was the mother she would have told me what the real deal was.

I just burned me up that she seemed not to know the deal, did she think he lived w/ OW or that D was mine, guess so, since she asked. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

But you are right, I will mention it not LB, or blow it out of porportion, it is not worth it to me & it would greatly disturb my new found peace.
Guess this is what they call a "trigger" I am glad I had time to vent about this here before he comes home.

I will let him love me, mention if afterwards or maybe in the morning, the devil is a liar & no weapon formed against me shall prosper!

Thanks again as always for your words of wisdom. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

H and I had only about 2 minute conversation. I acted indifferent did 180 stuff-didn't ask him questions.

Talked to his mom later when my H was not at his parents house--he has not said a word about us. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> of course--stressed myself for nothing.

Phone rang at 11:30pm last night-it rang a few times before I answered it--I was sorta asleep-- <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> of course <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> it was H. He asked if I was asleep--I said no-not sure why I said that--but he could tell that I was kinda of out of it.

He asked why I took so long to answer--it was one of those times when you heard the phone but it took a few to register. He actually said do you have someone there?? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> --I said no and then he said well why so long to answer the phone and I explained it--a little worried I guess--180 things must be working. He said that he would call when he left on his way home.

Come to think of it he never said why he called and I was so out of it I didn't ask--but I think we all know why he called. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

BBYG--I hope you had a good night. update us this morning please if you want to.

[ May 06, 2004, 10:01 AM: Message edited by: albany ]

Hey,

Albany you should have asked him why when he asked if someone was there, that is not really his concern since he left your home is it? Maybe next time you should not answer at all if he calls that late, especially since he wanted nothing! I am in a devilish mood today, can you tell. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Well I strayed from the 180 again, asked about the call from the daycare, he got defensive right away & said he didn't know why she would call him at home about that, & it was to do w/ payment & public assistance. He later apologized for snapping at me & I told him it was embarassing to me that I was telling this woman that I am his wife but the baby is not mine. After that we had a good nite, I don't feel used today but I have questions now that I can't ask since I am doing the 180.

Well I will see if he is still nice & loving today, now that he got his "fix".

Hey everyone !! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I have been so busy lately at work and haven't been on, but I have been reading. BBG93, Good for you, did you get your fix too! Albany I know what it feels like not to have your children w/ you. When H took D on his weekends it would drive me crazy ! (When we split up last yr) Its best to keep busy while they are gone. Do some sewing, painting, something to keep your mind off of it. Thats what I did. When you paint or sew you have to think of only what you are creating, and enjoy it when its done. Makes you feel good to use a gift God has givin you. FIND A GIFT TO USE ! Everyone has one. Or do what I did and go to class and develope one. LOL Me a H are doing good, no LBing, LOTS OF LOVIN!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> And the boat is in the water this weekend. Have the kids,and their friends some of our friends, great time to be had. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Oh my 17 yr old D (who went to live w/ her dad in Oct of 93) found out the grass on the other side isn't greener either. She is wanting to move back home. We will take it slow on that too. She hasn't been visiting since but came over last weekend and realized she missed us and wants to come home. My attorney loves me !!! Dropped in to say HI <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> And hope everyone is having a good day.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> See ya Sunny

Hey Sunny,

Yes I got my "fix" too <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I just know his MO & it wouldn't surprise me if he goes back to being unattentive & no so loving & talkative.

Looks like you are gearing up for a great weekend, ENJOY, ENJOY, ENJOY!!!! It is always so great to hear good news from you. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Tomorrow I am going to a friends graduation, & then out to celebrate, Saturday I plan to have my Goddaughter over nite & spend sunday honoring my mom & being w/ my family. I am taking Monday off so I am looking forward to that too. Letting no grass grow under my feet anymore. Not sure if H will do anything for me on Mothers day, & if no it's ok. Pre A & D being born he always took me out even though I had no baby for him, oh well NO MORE LOOKING BACK!!!

Kris, & JT how are you both today? I pray all is well. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />
Albany - I believe was beautiful thanks for sharing it!

HEY GIRLS,

So how's evryone this morning? I am doing okay I guess. I did a huge LB last night. I came home with some info involving the OW staring me in the face. I immediately blew up and even called him at work to tell him of my frustrations. I then commenced to tell him that I was done, finished with this marriage. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I feel as though I am getting nowhere with him and don't want to keep being hurt by this A. I don't want to live this wat or relive it every single day. I have no peace it seems.

I know that the devil is always busy but how much more can I take it has been long enough. I don't think that we are growing from this situation. We keep on repeating the same old cycle.

I am losing all hope and the will to go on with this it seems that it would be much easier to just let it go and start anew.

My pastor would say otherwise, yet I can't live for anyone else's thoughts. I have been drained by this whole situation and don't feel like I want to go on with it. <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" />

I have to almost beg for SF from him - He claims it's great when we do but I could count the times that we have done it in the past eight months. I am tired of feeling like a failure and a train wreck waiting to happen.

H just called me while I am in the process of writing to you girls. i could hardley talk to him. He called to tell me that I was right about some insurance matters and wants my help to clear it up or get him in a better situation about it.

He also told me that he was going to clear the incident that got me upset on yesterday up today; however I told him that he told me the same thing back in December. It is still not corrected can you believe it. It is so annoying to have it come right to my face and my house. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

I could not help it I just told him that he promised me that he would fix it months ago and I could no longer talk to him about it so I told him that I had to go and I hung up the phone.

I am just sick of the lies and the pain of it all.

What the H*** do I do now? (Please excuse the language I am p*ssed!) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

JT,
<blockquote>quote:<hr />I feel as though I am getting nowhere with him and don't want to keep being hurt by this A. I don't want to live this wat or relive it every single day. I have no peace it seems.

I know that the devil is always busy but how much more can I take it has been long enough. I don't think that we are growing from this situation. We keep on repeating the same old cycle.

I am losing all hope and the will to go on with this it seems that it would be much easier to just let it go and start anew.

My pastor would say otherwise, yet I can't live for anyone else's thoughts. I have been drained by this whole situation and don't feel like I want to go on with it. <hr /></blockquote>I feel your pain I do, I have been there & was there last week big time. I know you are tired & giving up look very inviting but try to hold on. I really don't think you have reached the point of being sick & tired of being sick & tired. I know it seems like YOU are doing all the work here & H is still lying or doing things behind your back. While my H was living w/ OW he put her car on OUR insurance. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I only found out after he came home & our ins. agent told me we had 4 cars & I knew we only had 3! It took him FIVE months to take care of this, all the while I was LBing all over the place which probably made him take longer to do it. While they "played house" who knows what deals he set up for her. So I know about your frustation & anger over things concerning OW staring you in the face & affecting you. Try to calm down & not LB, even though you feel like taking his head off.
Are you doing Plan A?

Starting over won't be as easy as it sounds, you have a family to think of & this is your M, fight for it! God will give you strength when you think you have none left, he will also put no more on you than you can bear.

JT2--BBYG is right and she has given me hope and the desire to keep fighting just when I felt like giving up.

You are strong and you will have to be the one to do all the work mainly right now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I know that is hard as I keep thinking why I'm I doing all the work and I'm not the one that went out and had affair and OW pregnant.

Think of you kids and realize it didn't fall apart over night and it will take even longer to put it back together.

We all have our bad days/weeks and you will get through this and I believe any marriage that survives this will be a very strong one in the end.

I give you a big ((((((((HUG))))))))) and I will tell you that you can do this you have not just one but two children with WS--please keep the faith.

I understand all your angry and realize that I'm just getting to the point where I can go without LBing--I use to all the time and takes lots of effort and control to not LB.

Vent away and keep writing if it makes you feel better--we are here for you.

Thank you, All of you!

I appreciate all of the support because I have no where else to go for it. I don't want family and friends in my business so I try to keep it all in but it's killing me.

Thank you for everything i can't tell you where I would be if I had not found this site. I would hate to even know where I would be. My life is a wreck and it seems to be getting worsem, but I am going to look on the bright side and pray long and hard about what I want from my H and this Marriage.

Lots of love to you all <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I feel sorry for everyone not doing good. I just hate it. But remember anything worth having is worth fighting for!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I have bad days and good days. I come here to vent and it helps soooo much. That way when I confront H, I have thought it through and its not as ugly. Chose your battles ! Don't sweat the small stuff ! These are some of the things I try to keep in mind when things come up. Don't let these so called women break your home up. Its not a win / lose thing. Its a doing the right thing, thing. Do whats right for you and your children! Listen to your heart because your mind will drive you crazy thinking about things that are not there, and is good for over reacting ! I have each one of you in my prayers and hope it works out for all of us. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />
sunny <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

YEAH <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I get to see my son in a few hours my H should by back with him around 7:00pm pst. I haven't seen him since Monday morning--seems like forever.

Hope you guys all have a good night.

I will give you an update of how tonight goes.

Hello everyone. I am hoping that this is the outlet and help that I am looking for. Cyn1018-I read your posting, and I have to admit that it made tears well up in my eyes, and gave my co-worker goosebumps. On 9/17 of last year (my 2nd wedding anniversary) I found out that the sister of my husband's co-worker was pregnant with "my husband's baby". I was completely devastated. My world has been turned upside down. We have been trying to have a child for 3 years and so you can imagine how I felt. The pregnancy was awful for me...her calling for updates and wanting him to go to dr appts. I have cried every day for the past 9 months...My husband decided that if I would keep him that he wanted to stay with me and that everything was a big mistake. It sure would be a lot harder to forgive and give a 2nd chance if the baby wasn't in the mix. Well, I love my husband so much, and I feel like he is trying to make amends in our marriage...but I am still so hurt! The baby was born almost 3 wks ago. My heart hurt so bad...I just laid in bed hugging my pillow and crying...noone knows the pain until you have been there...noone knows how it hurts to be alone, and wonder where he is... I am in nursing school and ALMOST failed my last 2 semesters b/c of all this...I am trying so hard to pick myself up and carry on, but I CANNOT FORGET OR STOP THINKING ABOUT IT. I need support and advice from people who KNOW. Not people who think they know but have never been there...they mean well, but they don't truly understand. God Bless everyone...we all need it... Kristin

Kristin, you should post your story on a separate/new thread so that you can get MORE support so that you won't get lost in the mix.

Welcome to the "club" the club we ALL wish we didn't qualify for! I think we can all relate to that "robbed" feeling. The child that should have been ONLY ours. The intimacy that should have ONLY been shared w/ us.

Yes, we can all feel your pain and anguish. I am sorry that you are here but I know you will find the support you are looking for and unfortuneately you are NOT alone! We have all been there, maybe in different ways and slightly different stories but we have ALL been there.

There is some relief in finding this forum, to realize that there are others that are struggling right there w/ you, those that have gone before and can offer you the strength that you don't have right now, those that can offer you the encouragement & promise of healing in your marriage and life that you cannot even imagine attaining @ this point.

Take care of you and we are here for you.

Kristin,

Sorry to welcome you here, but you found a great place for support. As KT says start a new thread with your original post so others will know you are here.

Well this is my lastest update, H's mom calls the house last nite looking for him, I told H not to give her my #, I had it changed last year cuz OW had it, & so that his mom wouldn't have it either. Our relationship was never good & since all this happened she has not given me one ounce of support, but has nothing but praises for OW. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> So H tells me he gave her the # cuz his cell is disconnected & that is my problem - why???? His phone has only been off since Monday & last nite after 11:00 p.m. she has to call & leave a message for him. I can't stand her.

I didn't LB but I wasn't real happy during my conversation w/ him either. I also told him I drew up a new contract w/ the additions he requested & that I wanted him to look it over & we would discuss it on Sat. He wasn't real happy about that, too bad. The 180's seemed to be working but that contract issue was left unresolved & even though he claimed he was going to re-write this weekend I know he wasn't, he is like so many H's just wants it all to go away & not talk about it or work on anything, thinks some one will come along w/ a magic wand & fix it all, shut me up or whatever. I am proud of myself I didn't LB, he would probably disagree since the subject of his mom is very touchy. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

So we will see, I wont' talk to him about anything this evening, going to a graduation & out to dinner after.

My peace is getting shaky.

Hi BG, JT, albany, and all!

I'm sorry I haven't gotten back to this thread in a couple days.

albany, how has it been since your H and son got back home? I remember reading where you weren't sure if you should've answered the call from your H late at night. I think it was good you did. You're not doing a Plan B, so it was ok. To NOT answer might have been an LB. Yet I know what you and the others are saying...to not answer would be like a 180...keep him on his toes...let him wonder what you're up to, etc. I like that too!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Since your son was away from home, and in his care, I believe you did the right thing though.

BG~

About the daycare center calling, first let me say, I have absolutely no experience with daycare centers, so I could be all wet on this topic. My best guess, is that the call was possibly from someone in the billing office. Perhaps not someone directly involved with the children and the families? While, I think the person should've done proper research before making the call, it was probably "innocent". I'm assuming, the daycare, like most businesses are only looking out for the bottom line, all else be damned. I doubt your H had any control over the matter either.

I can see where the call would be terribly upsetting, especially having to put the situation "out there" to a stranger. My heart goes out to you. I think it sucks.

How are things going since then?

JT~

I'm glad if I've been of any help to you. Most of the time, I feel like I'm shooting from the hip with my advice. I try to make sure what I say correlates with MB concepts, though. I've learned a lot in the last year, and hope to learn even more.

Hang tough ladies, and keep the faith, (but not to yourself <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> )

Love,
~ad

Sorry BG, somehow missed your last post, before I posted.

I understand the MIL thing, especially when she isn't supportive of you and the M. I say good riddance to all who cannot be in the corner of your M, but kinda hard to do when they're related... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Just one more thing to explain gently and calmly, (while carrying a big stick <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ) to thick headed H. Thank goodness for POJA, it really is a wonder. Getting H on board with POJA is another story though. One thing at a time, one thing at a time...

You have my prayers and well wishes.

albany, something occurred to me. I don't think I mentioned this when I suggested you should have a date set in the back of your head as to when to go to Plan B. That is, do NOT tell your H you have set a date, (and I hope you have set one!!!!). It's a big LB, a threat...like if you don't behave and come to your senses in X amount of time, blah, blah, blah...

It's only necessary for you to have knowledge of your "time table".

[ May 07, 2004, 01:48 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

AD,

I know the daycare center call was not H's fault, very poor business call though for sure. He knows I know that too, asked them why they couldn't tell him about the message in person, he works at his D's daycare. The whole thing was stupid.

As for "mommy dearest" H also knows there is no love lost there. That is his mother so I do try to give her respect but there is no need for her to call my home, the same home she wishes her son was not living in.

POJA for us is a long way off I am afraid, he gives new meaning to the work THICK. Like I said we will see.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> asked them why they couldn't tell him about the message in person, he works at his D's daycare. The whole thing was stupid <hr /></blockquote>Oh God, I guess!!! Did I miss that part? Very stupid on the part of the daycare. That makes me even more pissed and dumbfounded. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I'm in complete agreement regarding your MIL, (would it help if I referred to her as Monster IL?) I've heard that label used a time or two!

I know she's your H's mother and that alone deserves some level of respect. I think it was Lynn who said, when you have to be in the same place as a relative who doesn't support you, or who you just don't get along with, be courteous and pleasant, talk small talk, but nothing more.

Don't let her get to you. You don't need anymore crap piled on your heap.

No I didn't mention that he works at the same day care, I almost think his boss was just being nosey. Since the call had no merit at all.

Monster in law is good, I usually call her the woman who gave birth to my H. Her real problem is that she wants her son to be her man! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> She has never been anything remotely close to a mother to me, & I am ok w/ that. The only reason I brought it up to H about the phone call was that I dont want her getting comfortable calling the house 20 x's a day if he doesn't respond to her ASAP on his cell phone. I can hardly stand the sound of her voice, plus I have to see her in church every week & listen to her phoney hellos & smiles.

No, she is the least of my worries.

Hey you guys I'm back-was very busy this morning,

Update:

He called on his way home--we started to get into it and he was knida a jerk to me--saying again that it didn't matter what he did from now on-asked why he called at 11:30pm--I know I shouldn't have asked--he said to tell me son was having a good time.

Anyway--I promised myself when he arrived we would have no conversations regarding us--no pressure. I made dinner for our son and him. He stayed to eat then he asked if he could take a bath--he only has shower at apt.--I said fine--but then he only took a shower.

I put our son to bed-we watched TV he asked if I would rub his neck--I gave him a neck and back rub--and well one thing led to another etc. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I think you get the picture--he did state that he wanted do what we were doing but didn't know what it meant. I would rather that then lying and saying it meant nothing or it meant everything when truly I know he hasn't a clue.

He left in a good mood of course <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> He said he would call me on his morning break--have no idea why. He did call this morning and say he would move money to our joint account so I could pay house payment etc. and asked how much I needed--he didn't have a problem with the dollar amount he was way nice--scary <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

So that is the update.

Now question--I want to make taco's for dinner--have a craving for them--he gets off work at 6:00pm should I call and invite him--or see if he calls and invite him if he calls or not because trying to PA and 180?? What do you guys think???

Seems like he needs to make the moves or it is too much pressure.

As much as I know you want to see him for dinner, what if he says no or that he has plans, are you going to be ok w/ that?

If it were me I know I would do the invite, I did many a time while H was "away" & got so upset if he couldn't or wouldn't come by. Just don't want you to set yourself up for a fall.

I said all that to say I have no advice, sorry.

See what I mean about how SF clouds & confuses things sometimes? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I am glad you had a good nite last nite though <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> !

the SF didn't actually confuse anything for me I'm glad H was honest--I would usually ask him to dinner but when he turns me down I get hurt, mad etc and then LB--creates--all bad things come from it so--I think I must not ask--since I do not handle the no thing well--I would ask then what are you doing and then it would just keep going from there--so since I know my reaction to it I know I had better not ask.

SF was great but it usually is.

I'll keep you updated.

Follow your first instinct. He may surprise you & call you.

Talk to you later, have a good nite.

If I'm not too late...my advice is don't call and invite him. If he calls first, and you feel so inclined to invite him, then go ahead. BUT be prepared for any answer. Expect the worst--hope for the best.

If he says no, leave it at that, and wish him a very nice evening. Keep your voice as lighthearted as possible, don't give one inkling of being down in the dumps...even if you are!!

Good luck <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

You are not too late--he called me <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Just to tell me he had done the money transfer at bank. He also said he was going straight home after work and crashing--he is still sick sounds like it is in his lungs--friend of ours that he works with him at his new job has pneumonia. He decided that maybe he should go into urgent care get checked out and get medicine.

I cheerfully said guess what Bailey and I are having for dinner. He said what and I said fajitas-chicken and shrimp and he said just you and Bailey and I said yes unles you would like to come over and he said he thought he needed to go home and crash--I okay--it is up to you. He then said he come over tomorrow after work to see our son--not us--but that is fine and I said well you should go to urgent care--I was cheerful and left it at that.

I wouldn't be surprised if I see him tonight--if not fine--but I think I'm getting him where I want him or he wouldn't be calling me.

Thanks AD and BBYG.

Good work, albany! Keep it up!

Remember, don't let him dictate your behavior. Stick to your plan.

I cannot promise your desired outcome even if you do everything right, but I'll tell you this, if you DON'T stick to a stellar Plan A, you are pretty much guaranteed of a bad outcome.

Part of me wishes you had told him, "Bailey, me and a friend" *evil grin*

Hey, I could be the friend...fajitas sound good long about now!!

Have fun!

Yah a Bailey, I, and a "friend"--I thought of that <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> but it would have provoked a fight and I don't want to out right lie.

Anyway you are right but my chances are better than not doing PA and 180 things.

He won't stay away I'm sure--I refuse call him or check up on him tonight and I will not call him tomorrow--my world does not revovle around him--well I let it sometimes but results aren't very good when I do so all he needs to know right now is that it doesn't. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Hard for me todo but I'm coming along and getting better at all this.

Like I said I feel that the ball is actually beginning to roll in my court and I actually think it is right at my fingertips. So I plan to grab it over this weekend and keep it.

We all know why he called the other evening late and why he has called twice today--but I don't dare tell him--why do men need everything to be there own idea??? They really are less evovled then us women as MIL says--she also says we really should be running this world as we give men all the ideas and let them think that they came up with the ideas. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Have a wonderful evening

Everyone else I hope to get online tonight to post some things to the rest of you--it isn't always all about me although somedays I wish it was <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

Okay I haven't heard from any of you guys this weekend or yet today--JT2, KrisM, BBBYG, Sunnydale, AD.

Hope everyone had a super Mother's Day. Mine went well.

H called a couple of times on Friday evening--he didn't have much to say except that he didn't feel well.

He called me Saturday morning at 6:45 to say he still was really sick--called a few times throughout the day--not sure why or do I know why <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> . I went to my parents in the evening and H called their to find me we talked and he said he would be over Sunday mid morning. He went to urgent care on Sunday morning--he has a lung infection. He brought me a gift from our son. He never said Happy Mother's Day but that is okay. He left after we ate a lunch and went home to his apt. to sleep before working night shift. He called at 5:00pm when he got up and then he called at 5:30pm and I was still down at the horse barn with our son and my parents--we were riding and taking care of horses--he stopped by to see our son and visited a bit with my parents and then he went to work.

He called me at 6:15am this morning on his way home from work to tell me he would come by on his way to work this evening to get old BBQ to throw away in his work dumpster and to unload wood from his work-we burn it in our fireplace. He also said to have a good day at work.

I haven't had to call him at all--he called me so much I haven't even had a single thought to call him.

So why is he calling and being so nice--maybe the trip to his family made him think more about a family?

So I think the ball is in my court and I have just been PA and 180ing it.

I think that he misses our son and actually us--he didn't need to call this morning--I already knew he was coming by to get stuff for the dumpster at work--so he didn't need to tell me about wood--any excuse to call don't you think???

I was amazed he told me to have a great day at work. I think he wants it to work but doesn't even know it yet himself--so I guess he will figure it out eventfully--but heaven forbide I mention anything--he can't do the pressure but I don't think I need anything re-affirmed as he is calling all the time--doesn't sound done to me.

Want to hear updates and feedback <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

We were about to leave for church, Sunday, when 3-almost-4yo fell and gashed his forehead. So we spent the morning in the ER. I guess they don't do stitches anymore because they used the same superglue stuff that they had used for 1-almost 2yo when she split her chin open.

That was fun! Story of my life! Only the KTBunch would spend Mother's Day morning @ the ER! LOL

But other than that it was terrific! One of my best ever. Really!

We had OC this weekend but OW picked her up Sat. afternoon because she obviously gets her for Mother's Day. OW looked different and it kind of sent me for a loop! She looked trendy, wearing some low rise tight jeans, fitted tank top, sunglasses. I have never seen her dress like that and actually, I have NEVER seen her in jeans. I usually dress like that, NOT her. H had told me,(in the past) when I ???? why/how he could possibly ever be attracted to her, that she looked/dressed "different" back "then". So when I saw her, I imagine, it was like this. I immeditately went into LB mode. "hmph! OW looks different today, is that the way she looked when you were w/ her?" H: "I didn't even look @ her" me: "Well, look @ her, I think that WAS the way she looked back then!" H: "No, I don't want to look @ her."

Then I went to my room to write so I wouldn't ruin the entire rest of the evening. Then H called me to come back into the living room w/ him and why did I go into the bedroom? I was honest and told him it was because I was irritated and didn't want to take it out on anyone. Then he hugged me and made me sit on his lap (we sit like that a lot when we watch tv)and I couldn't help but cry and told him to tell me how sorry he was.....AND to tell me he's so lucky because.....? and blah blah blah, so he did. So that avoided things getting worse! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Then we went to his parents to bar-b-q. Which I have to say, my H is a GREAT bar-b-q'er! Those burgers were delicious! mmmmmmmm..mmmmmmm..good!

And Friday, the oldest won 3rd place in the Science Fair!

Sunday morning, I awoke to a beautiful vase filled w/ an assortment of flowers, a couple of homemade cards, homemade bracelet, some lovely jewelry w/ a heart locket that the ktbunch picked out and H bought, and a very nice card that he bought and a love letter that he wrote! It was perfect-----and then the trip to the ER! LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Then we ended the night watching our favorite show!-Survivor-we are addicted! So it was a really great Mother's Day weekend! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Sorry this post is a bit out of order!LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Hey everyone!!! Hope everyones Mother's Day went well. Maybe not as exciting as KT's but weel! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
We went to out cabin. My 17 yr old came, which I was glad of. She's fussing about living w/dad and wants to come home. Her step monster is on her nerves. But we took the boat out the water was really cold, but the kids didn't mind. I had a rough time at first saturday when we first went out. Thoughts of the OW and her S being on my boat last year during M.D. really hit me when I got on the boat. I don't know why, just did. A good friend was w/ me and she just said cool it. Look where he is at. Who is he with? I don't know how long I will have those flash backs but they really get to me. H knew I was upset and wanted me to sit w/ him and he just held me and told me he loved me and was so glad that I was back on my boat. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> We really had a good time and there will be more to come. I don't think he's heard anything from the incubator. (OW new name) Thats all she is, and ever will be. SIL said she felt sorry for her, being preg and all alone. WHATEVER. I told her she chose to sleep w/ a married man and she made her bed. She is an incubator for a child that H didn't want or plan to have. But we would do what was right even if she didn't know right from wrong. SIL makes me want to puke! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> I missed work. I really don't know what is wrong w/ to stomach? I think its just monday and most of the [censored] that happens is on Monday, so I guess I'm stressing in my sleep or something. But nothing so far today, just rested and H checking up on me every few hours. He was going to work late tonight but said he needed to come home so he could fix dinner, since I didn't feel good. I am just so scared everything is going so good right now that any minute all you know what is going to break loose! When did I get past this feeling? <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> Everything is good and I just want to cry. Is this all part of the stages, mad, hurt, ect? We are just into the recovery stage and I just don't what is going to happen next. But our plate is full wee have just about every weekend planed till mid July. So I guess I will spend my time just living him and taking it day by day. Sorry so long, thanks for listening.
Sunny <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Hello All,

KT - glad you had a good Mother's Day, & that the little one is ok, what a morning you had, our job never ends does it???
Sunny - I am glad you had a good day also, you & KT are both so blessed to have H's who truly love & care for you & wont' hesitate to show you how committed they are & remorseful about their past actions.
Albany - Glad you had a good day also, stick to you plan girl, H is coming around slowly but surely!

Well, surprise, suprise my day was good but not as far as H was concerned. Sat. morning we got into it cuz he once again broke his word to me regarding plans we had made. We didn't discuss the "revised" contract until later in the day & he didn't want to talk about it then, he signed nothing, said he still wanted to make some changes, & had the nerve to ask why I hadn't signed off on it yet. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I LB'd big time, sorry to say.

11:08 p.m. sat. nite his mummy calls, earlier in the day H told me he spends most of his free time w/ her, hardly sees his D cuz she is w/ her God Mother all the time, now I told H on Thurs. nite when she called I didn't want it to happen again, so I answered the phone, she asked for him & I told her he wasn't home & she wanted me to give him a message, I told her that he claimed he spends time w/ her everyday so why did she need to speak w/ him now? ALso told her that he could go live w/ her or OW as far as I was concerned, I am tired of him & that I never wanted her to have MY phone # anyway. She said she was sorry she called & hung up. H came in shortly afterwards, already knew about the phone call, I wonder how? We got into again, I am not sorry about what I said to her, she has hurt me for the last time & it is gonna stop. The conversation was on tape since I picked up the phone after the ans. machine came on, so he heard it, he said I disrespectd her, too bad, he should pay his cell phone bill!

Yesterday, I got up went to chuch, ignored Mummy Dearest, felt bad about what I said but I am not apologizing for it. I came home & H didn't even say Happy Mothers Day to me, I mentioned it & he said I didn't give him a chance, then told me he had a card for me, but didn't give it to me. Later that nite he came up to bed after midnite, told me he left the card in the car, I told him why bother the day is over, I asked if he gave OW a card & he said yeah, claims that is all he gave her, it was TOO much in my book, I told him I will not put up w/ this for the rest of my life, he acted like he didn't get it. He doen't give a s*#@ about me, it is so obvious. He was also sick last nite wanted me to take care of him, I didn't was tempted to call OW or his mummy have them do it.

He came home from work on break today, still not feeling well, I didn't say much to him, asked how he felt. Guess I am back to the 180's for real, until I can plan B. I am sooooooo tired of all this. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

Hey everyone!!

Albany - Looks like things are looking up for you. Keep up the good work and H will continue to come around. Its just a matter of time and patience.

Sunny - So happy for you still. Sounds great and glad you have so much support from your friends and H. Overcoming those reminders are going to be tough - but you can handle it.

kt - What an eventful day!! I so wish my H reaches the point that your H has. I think the key is communication - and you and your H seem to do that well. I know you have no problems speaking you mind, and your H seems to do the same. That is one thing my H and I both need to work on. I am trying, but I have never been one to speak up too much - just bury it all inside. Not good for me, and I am now realizing not good for M.

BG - So sorry your H has not opened his eyes to see what he is missing out on. You are a wonderful person, and one day he will truly regret what he has done to you. Hopefully he realizes it before he has destroyed your M totally. Keep the faith. Work on bettering you and your relationship with God. A strong foundation in faith is so important in life and in M. I just had a talk with H about that tonight. I was telling him how I am so worried about the path he is taking in life. Said he needs to stop his destructive behavior and turn it over to God for help. Who knows if it helped? But right now I am sincerely more worried about H's spiritual life than my M right now. If he does not make a choice to change, it absolutely terrifies me the consequences he will face later. I will keep praying for him.

Mother's day was good. I really didn't expect much except the gifts the kids make at school. I was pleasantly surprised by a present H bought. It was a music box with angels on it and a water fountain. It plays Amazing Grace. It is beautiful and I told him how impressed I was by it. H also bought a hanging basket of flowers for the porch. Like I said, it was all a very pleasant surprise. I wasn't even sure I would see him on Sunday. The kids and I usually spend the day at my parents after church. H called my parents and said he was home. So kids and I went there to spend time with him. It was very nice.

I hope H takes to heart some of the things we talked about tonight. I know he is confused by the feelings he has for OW and especially the OC. I just told him he needs to pray to God for help to overcome these feelings and to pray for help to get his life back on track. I hope he takes it to heart.

Talk to you all soon.
God Bless,
Kris

KrisM: how sweet and what a good sign that H bought you such a thoughtful gift! I think he is coming around!

Uh...no...communication is NOT my problem-TOO MUCH communication is my problem! I "never shut up" about things and H hates it------but I'm learning, we're BOTH still learning, it's a process. LOL My H is learning to be more sensitive to me and I am learning to choose my words more wisely and not repeat my self 5 times just to get a point across. You are right though, I do not have a problem being direct.

Where's Albany? She's usually around more.

I am glad to hear how things are looking up for most. It's quite a journey right?

We have our next therapist appointment for OC next week(next tues.)! oh yay! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> It will be all of us, me, H, OW & I guess OC! whoopee! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> whatever! I still start to feel nausious thinking about it but.......I know that we have done all we could and any "problems" OC has are not because of anything we are doing! So I know we have nothing to worry about.
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I am focusing on our summer plans and I plan on spending the summer camping w/ the ktbunch! I can't wait. H has agreed to spend all his weekdays off camping (Mon. afternoons to Thursday mornings, every 3 weeks). I think that it will be quite enjoyable! We have a nice and huge 3 room tent that has only been used ONCE! LOL and I found a great air mattress (one of those aerobeds)@ the thrift store for $9.95! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> So we are set!

I can't wait to be out in the fresh air, under the stars! I hope this is a summer to remember! I think it will be!
*******
Did I ever tell you guys that Gary Smalley does these marriage seminars or something and he has said that of all the families that he has ever interviewed, the "thing" that the stronger marriages and famiies had in commom was that they go "camping" together on a regular basis! He said it was something about the "unpredictability"(enexpected circumstances & events that happen when you are camping) that encouraged the family bonds to grow stronger! So....some food for thought!
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Have a great day everyone! Keep the faith! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

KTbunch--sorry to have not been around much--just been really busy glad to know that I don't bore you all too much and you all notice when I'm gone <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Not much is happening--H has still been calling--he might take our son again to fly across state and visit his family again next week--his brother will be in town--hasn't seen him since he got back from pilot mission in Iraq two years ago almost.

Anyway I'm jealous he can go during the week with his schedule of four on four off--he is off during the week--I just want to go and be a part but can't because of work and heck who knows if we are even together. Told him that they should go if they can. He called again this morning after he got off of his last night of night shift. I'm not real sure why--I guess just to talk--but I listened and didn't ask why he called or push him in anyway--didn't want to make a flight risk <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> .

Still PA and 180ing it--don't know what else to do because pressuring him only makes it worse--I just try to live for me and do my own thing. I'm really wanting a vacation and wanting to get out and do something--it's not like I cand go away while the takes our son because I still have to go to that place we call work and a job.

So you guys think it is a good sign that he is calling all the time to chat??

Why do you guys think that he is calling??? Do you think he cares about us and the marriage still??

Gotta run

albany~

Glad to hear you had a good weekend and Mother's Day. Sounds as if you are staying on task with Plan A concepts. Of course he has been behaving more normally, so it makes it a little easier for you. Remember to keep doing what you're doing, even if he does some buttheaded behavior, ok?

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> he can't do the pressure but I don't think I need anything re-affirmed as he is calling all the time--
<hr /></blockquote>This is what I mean--even if he suddenly shows NO signs of affirmation, don't get swayed off course. Don't LB, and DO NOT ask for confirmation or reassurances.

BG~

I'm sorry your H was an a$$ on Mother's Day. I can understand your LBs. Also, the whole MIL thing is out of control. She definitely seems to be purposely trying to drive a wedge between the two of you. I hate to see it working. Do you have caller id, so you don't have to take her ridiculous late night, (if any), calls?

It sounds as if what you said about her and to her, was an LB to your H. I would try to make her a non-issue as much as possible, via not taking her calls, etc. It's difficult enough as it is to not LB. You don't need the topic of MIL too.
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Guess I am back to the 180's for real, until I can plan B. I am sooooooo tired of all this. <hr /></blockquote>I just want you and albany, (and anyone else currently doing Plan A), to keep something in mind.:

You don't move to Plan B because you suck at Plan A.

Plan A has to be a beauty.

You move to Plan B because Plan A has failed to produce the desired outcome of your WS recommitting to the M, (among various other reasons), BUT not because you stunk at Plan A.

I know you know this, but remember, in case of an eventual Plan B, your H needs to be left with good memories. Need to leave him with the hope of coming back to something good. You want him to miss you during Plan B. If the last interactions he recalls are LBs and DJs up to his eyeballs, what's to miss and what's the incentive to come back?

[ May 11, 2004, 03:08 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Why do you guys think that he is calling??? Do you think he cares about us and the marriage still??
<hr /></blockquote>Because you are doing a good Plan A. You aren't pursuing him. You're not being clingy. You're not arguing. You're doing the opposite of what you've done in the past. He's wondering what's up...

I've always thought he cares about you and the M. He just has to come to that place on his own. No one can force him. Yet, the funny thing is, an efficient Plan A by you, is in a way forcing him...he just doesn't know it. See, YOU do have the ball...

Keep it up, albany--great job!

Oh, and another thing--keep busy with other stuff, to help keep your mind off him all the time. Try to keep your focus on other things--like your happiness! Being lighthearted and happy will be attractive to him, (talk about a side bonus, hey?)

AD

Thanks!

Maybe he is beginning to eat out of my hand.
He called at 1:30 and said he was awake and couldn't sleep well and asked why I hadn't gone home from work early. This morning I had told him I probably would because my allergy's are really bad and I fell like s**t. He probably thought he could come over and share the bed.

Anyway I didn't act too interested so he said he would talk to me later in a deflated tone-well that's fine--I have had my share of being deflated.

I will let you all know what tonight brings.

You guys are all in my thoughts and prayers and I hope it all gets better for you soon but as I know it feels like it won't and then when it does it changes again all too fast.

Good-you're doing really good, albany. Stay strong.

Hope the allergies don't get you down too much either.

I apologize for the above double post. The site must've shut down or something right when I was trying to submit. I had a feeling it would double post. Now it won't let me delete one. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I'm sorry your H was an a$$ on Mother's Day. I can understand your LBs. Also, the whole MIL thing is out of control. She definitely seems to be purposely trying to drive a wedge between the two of you. I hate to see it working. Do you have caller id, so you don't have to take her ridiculous late night, (if any), calls?

It sounds as if what you said about her and to her, was an LB to your H. I would try to make her a non-issue as much as possible, via not taking her calls, etc. It's difficult enough as it is to not LB. You don't need the topic of MIL too.
<hr /></blockquote>AD ~ Thanks for your reply. H's mummy has been a problem from day one, she has also been worse since this all happened as far as trying to break us up & convince her son that OW is better for him than me. I do have caller ID, so if she calls again, which I highly doubt I am not going to answer, I was so glad I got to say some of the things I wanted to her, & I just don't care anymore. Your right though I don't need this BS from her on top of everything else.

H came home last nite complaining about some porn tapes that were "missing". (I threw them out) other than that I was not going to say anything to him about anything, he knows I am lying, but I don't care about that either, it is not right but look at all the lies he has told me & continues to tell me. Anyhoo, I am doing the 180's. I didn't find out about Plan A until a couple of months ago so there was so much damage already done & so many aspects or our relationship that had changed & not for the better, now it is all routine, none of it to my advantage & H is not trying to change. So I feel 180's until I can Plan B is my only option.

H is beyond fog right now, & I am just done.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> So I feel 180's until I can Plan B is my only option. <hr /></blockquote>Sounds like a plan.

You seem like a woman of much faith. HE will see you through. ((((((BabyGirl))))))

Thanks for the hug AD, my faith is not so solid these days, trying to give this all to God & let him handle it, but not doing so well.

I know I have done all I can though.

Albany - things are looking really good for you, I think AD is right on the money, he is pursuig you cuz you are doing a great Plan A!

Keep doing what cha doing girl! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

Good Morning to all !!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Two more days then the weekend! We are in town this weekend some friends got M a cuple of mths ago and they are having a party so we will be at that. I have been in a mood lately and really don't know why. Too much on my plate I guess and I'm back to not sleeping. I've got to quit thinking about the worst things.
I really don't know why I do that but I do. When its good I worry about when its going to get bad. I'll just take the good day's and try not to worry about the bad days comming. Have a good day
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> sunny

H was at our house yesterday when I got home. He was sleeping and he stayed until about 7:30 sleeping on couch and then he got up and we hung out a bit and then he went home to crash--he has meeting today for work.

I haven't a clue why he came to the house just to sleep on couch. Anyway I let it go and didn't say much. I basically went about my business doing normal stuff and took a bath and shower--helped me out with my allergies--I went to bed early 9:00pm and he said he would call today and come by after meeting at work.

Nothing else happening.

Glad hear it is going well Sunnydale.

BBYG--keep the faith and I would agree with doing a 180.

AD --thanks for all of the support.

So why did he come over just to sleep???

<blockquote>quote:<hr />So why did he come over just to sleep???
<hr /></blockquote>I would say just to be near you, see what you were doing, make sure you had no company, since he obviously could have slept at home.

I think maybe too, he may be feeling like he wants to come home but because of either pride or more so knowing when he does come home there is a lot of work to be done to repair your M & he is not ready to do that, & you don't want him to, believe me, I know that is where most of our problems started, he came home before he was ready. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Try not to worry so much.

BBYG--coming to soon--I get that H came home before in November 2003 and it was too soon--we weren't strong enough to handle him unloading info. of OW with OC in December 2003.

Well it is a lot easier to PA and 180 when you have the ball in your hands--so I just need to keep it and relax a bit.

Yes, thank goodness it is Wednesday and the weekend is nearing once again and I'm looking forward to a four-day weekend at the end of the month.

Hope things get better for you BBYG--keep me posted you remain so strong and give such good support even though your life is full of such turmoil.

I honestly don't know how you do it.

okay girls,

I'm reading and finding that it is going to be a long ahrd road. I am not sure that I am up to the challenge. I am not sure that I want to go through this for an extended period of time.

I want to be happy and happy I am not. I want to live without the drama of an A in my face all the time. I want to be me again, and not this bear that I've turned out to be.

I'm tired of being sick and tired!

You are up to the challenge and you will do this for your M and your children--it is just a bad day and I believe in you--you will do think don't give up-fight for what you is yours, you believe, and what you love.

You have nothing to lose at this point by trying PA and 180 and really you have nothing to lose in trying PB if a good solid PA and 180 without LBing doesn't work.

Fight!! Dig deep into that soul of yours and ull out that strength that has made you who you are and as BBYG says God only gives us what we can handle.

Go out and do some things just for you and the kids--forget H right now live for you and see what kind of response you get from him.

JT I know how you feel! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Somedays its all you think, cry, scream about. But look at the (no offence) "Oldies" and see that we all can get over this one way or another. Wheither we are M or God leads us down other roads. My 17 yr old is wanting to move home, my SIL wants to move in, My H OW is due in sept, my car was stolen, oh and my family just found out about the OC! WHAT ELSE could happen in my life. (I know my attorney loves me!) By the time all of this calms down I will be a nervious wreck or the strongest person there is! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> I don't really have time for a break down now, but I might have one when its calm. I too get sick of being tired and tired of being sick, but we will get though everything, and it will be as he (God) has planned it. I worry, becauce I let the devil take over, and then I calm down when I let God take over. But we are human and we are bad at trying to FIX everything. And fix it fast, is what I want. Over and done with! Go on to something else. I just want to wake up and not feel the A or OC or OW in my life, but guess what, I'll never forget about it. It may not be as vivid in my mind but it will always be there. Which it needs to be, God is teaching me something here, what, I'm tring to figure out, but he is. I better hurry up and get the message before something else happens, LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
I only know what I feel and I feel like my family is what he wants me to cherish the most. My M should be the best it can be and my home is where (I guess) everyone wants to be. Since everyone wants to live there now! LOL I need a smaller house. My H is back home after almost a yr and he tells, shows, acts, and reminds me that he loves me. Almost everytime we talk. And we realize what we both want and miss about each other and why God brought us together. But I CAN NOT, WILL NOT let my memories and the thoughts of the A, OC or OW take that from me! And neither should anyone else here. Not saying its not hard, but thats why we are here, to hear others and get the support that we so need. God gave me the chance to try and help, love, and encougage today and to stop worring about things that are not. Thanks for listening again!
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Hope things get better for you BBYG--keep me posted you remain so strong and give such good support even though your life is full of such turmoil.

I honestly don't know how you do it. <hr /></blockquote>Thanks Albany, I dont' either, most times by a "wing & a prayer" I guess. I think in a way talking with you ladies helps me to take my mind off my own mess, & it encourages my soul to try to encourage others. I sit here & smile at the updates that contain hope & I feel sad & I have shed a tear or two when the posts are not so hopeful & all seems lost. I think I have just come to the conclusion that my M is just about over, but I am so glad that God put in my spirit the ability to rejoice & hope & pray for others to overcome "this obstacle" in their M's & have a better M than ever. One that truly glorifies God!

JT, - hang in there girl, don't you give up, remember this is all still in the beginning stage, if you quit now you will always wonder what if???? And it is not just about you - your children need & deserve to have their father at home w/ you as God intended it to be if at all possible, WE ALL SIN & fall short of the glory of God, but you don't write a person off, as you already see this road is not going to be easy, you will have lots of ups, downs & all that goes in between, & no you will not find quick fix, believe me I have looked for one, but you have to try, there is too much at stake not to!

P.U.S.H. - Pray Until Something Happens <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

I needed to hear from each of you today. I have heard every word that you have told me and decided that I am not going to give up.

I watched dr. phil today if you did not see it look at it on the website. The woman in the marriage scared me in a way it was like looking in the mirror. I could not believe that someone could be so mean, yet at times it was me with my H. Yes there are two sided to every story, but to hear her I can remember all the hurtful outbursts that I would have.

But I will get better and I will go to counseling. I told my H lst night that I needed him to pick up the kids for me from relative care today. H was so excited he has only driven the kids twice ( without me in the car). H was so excited that he just called me at work to tell me he was on his way to pick them up.

He was like a kid in a candy store. I packed his own little diaper bag with everything that he'd need for them; He was just so happy. I had taken that from him for some time or better yet all there lives (2yrs). He is a good father, and they love him.

He asked me while on the phone where I was going and I told him I had a counseling session. He was glad. I asked him if he wanted to go and he said calmly that I needed to go first for some things then definately we were going to go as a married couple. I was amazed.

I think you all are right I must fight for my M then I will not have any regrets. I may still have some up days and down days , but I must try.

Thank you for reminding me again!!

JT

I'm proud of you JT <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I knew you could do it. Just put your mind to it and go for it. When you are having a hard time then just get on the board and post--vent here--that's what it is all about.

You just made my day and it gives me more hope for my M.

Going to store after work to pick a few groceries. I'm cooking lobster tails tonight and having salad and french bread. I'm sure H will want to stop for dinner if he calls before dinner time and asks what I making.

Another thing I thought of to tell you guys about comment H made last night--he said he wanted to know if he could stack firewood from his work in the dog run--20x24 concrete pad. I said yes but it will get wet when it rains and he said we would cover it so we could use it this winter.

Hello--WE--supposedly there is no we--well I just digested it and believe me I didn't point out what he said--we all know that causes flight and we wouldn't want that. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

JT--you are on the right track. Glad to here that it is looking up.

I'm feeling a bit cocky right now <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

I think H is coming around out of the fog. He called me on my cell phone after his meetings at work to see where I was. He was at our house and I was not. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> I just stopped at the store and I said I was hurrying to get home so I could cook lobster tails. He said why not tomorrow night and I said because I wanted to get them cooked and he said cook them tomorrow. Of course I asked why and he said he needed to meet with a guy them work about testifying on a union thing.

He then proceeded to say tomorow because he assumed I was cooking them for dinner for us and he couldn't make it tonight.

Okay girls--I really had to bite my tongue-- <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> a million smart*** comments ran through my mind and almost leapt out of my mouth before I could stop them.

I'm thinking I really have him. He was then all excited about the firewood and was telling me about re-stacking it all and to be sure and look at the new wood that was in his pickup that he wood unload tomorrow. Why is he so excited about wood for the house if he isn't going to be living at the house anymore???? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

That's it for the update.

I most definately expect to hear an update from everyone--AD, BBYG, Sunnydale, JT2, KrisM, and KT

JT2--so glad you decided that you can do this--I have been where you were earlier today--you see no hope and it seems like it just won't work but it has always been everyone here with the encouragement that made me go on and fight for what is mine.

I hope the 180's that I reminded you of that AD so gratefully shared helps you. I see potential in our M. It is there but H has really hidden it--you will both find it again.

JT and Albany - I am so proud of you two. Stick with your plan and keep being the best wives you can be. Show your H's what great women you are and they won't be able to resist coming home.

Tonight I went to H's softball game. That was one of his chief complaints - that I never came to his games to support him. So I am making the effort. He smiled when he saw us there. God I hope he comes around soon. I miss him so much - I miss us so much. One step at a time.

I agree with BG that if we push them to come home before they are ready that it will make things worse. It is just so hard with the OC. I just feel like if I screw up in some way, H has his second family to run too.

Have you all read the post over in Just Found Out titled Let Go, Let God? I read it a couple months ago and it really helped me. I made a copy of it and read it from time to time when I find myself trying to take control of this situation. It really does help so much to just surrender it all to God and let him take control. I will see if I can find the post and copy it to here.

Take care of yourselves.
God Bless,
Kris

Here you go girls - I found the post. If you haven't read it - enjoy. If you have - enjoy again.

Let Go, Let God!

Effective immediately, please be aware that there are changes you need to make in your life. These changes need to be completed in order that I may fulfill my promises to you – to grant you peace, joy and happiness in this life. I apologize for any inconvenience, but after all that I am doing, this seems very little to ask of you. I know, I already gave you the 10 Commandments. Keep them. But follow these guidelines too.

1. QUIT WORRYING. Life has dealt you a blow and all you do is sit and worry. Have you forgotten that I am here to take all your burdens and carry them for you? Or do you just enjoy fretting over every little thing that comes your way?

2. PUT IT ON THE LIST. Something needs to be done or taken care of. Put it on the list. No, not YOUR list. Put it on MY to-do list. Let ME be the one to take care of the problem. I can’t help you until you turn it over to me. And although my to-do-list is long, I am after all, God. I can take care of anything you put into my hands. In fact, if the truth were ever really known, I take care of a lot of things for you that you never even realize.

3. TRUST ME. Once you’ve given your burdens to me, quit trying to take them back. Trust in me. Have the faith that I will take care of all your needs, your problems, and your trials. Problems with the kids? Put them on my list. Problem with finances? Put it on my list. Problems with your emotional roller coaster? For my sake, put it on my list, I want to help you. All you have to do is ask.

4. LEAVE IT ALONE. Don’t wake up one morning and say, “Well, I’m feeling much stronger now. I think I can handle it from here.” Why do you think you are feeling stronger now? It’s simple. You gave me your burdens and I am taking care of them. I also renew your strength and cover you in my peace. Don’t you know that if I give you these problems back you will be right back where you started? Leave them with me and forget about them. Just let me do my job.

5. TALK TO ME. I want you to forget a lot of things. Forget what was making you crazy. Forget the worry and the fretting because you know I’m in control. But there’s one thing I pray you never forget. Please don’t forget to talk to me OFTEN! I love you. I want to hear your voice. I want you to include me in on the things going on in your life. I want to hear you talk about your family and friends. Prayer is simply you having a conversation with me. I want to be your dearest friend.

6. HAVE FAITH. I see a lot of things from up here that you can’t see from where you are. Have faith in me that I know what I am doing. Trust me, you wouldn’t want the view from my eyes. I will continue to care for you, watch over you, and meet your needs. You only have to trust me. Although I have a much bigger task than you, it seems as if you have so much trouble doing your simple part. How hard can trust be?

7. SHARE. You were taught to share when you were only two years old. When did you forget? That rule still applies. Share with those who are less fortunate than you. Share your joy with those who need encouragement. Share your laughter with those who haven’t heard any in such a long time. Share your tears with those who have forgotten how to cry. Share your faith with those who have none.

8. BE PATIENT. I managed to fix it so in just one lifetime you could have so many diverse experiences. You grow from a child to an adult, have children, change jobs many times, learn many trades, travel to so many places, meet thousands of people, and experience so much. How can you be so impatient then when it takes me a little longer than you expect to handle something on my to-do-list? Trust in my timing, for my timing is perfect. Just because I created the entire universe in only six days, everyone thinks I should always rush, rush, rush.

9. BE KIND. Be kind to others, for I love them just as much as I love you. They may not dress like you, or talk like you, or live the same way you do, but I still love you all. Please try to get along, for my sake. I created each of you different in some way. It would be too boring if you were all identical. Please know I love each of you for your differences.

10. LOVE YOURSELF. As much as I love you, how can you not love yourself? You were created by me for one reason only – to be loved and to love in return. I am a God of Love. Love me. Love your neighbors. But also love yourself. It makes my heartache when I see you so angry with yourself when things go wrong. You are very precious to me. Don’t ever forget that!

With all my heart, I love you

God

Thanks KrisM

Sounding more positive on your end. Glad you went to the softball game--that was a good thing.

Glad to see someone else is up and on the board tonight--you are either up really late or you are PST time zone also as I am.

Albany - I am just up late. I live in Indiana. I only have the chance to post after the kids are off to bed. That's mom's time.

So glad things seem to be going better for you. Remember this is a roller coaster and you will have those down days. Just keep your eyes focused ahead to the good days coming - because I trust that they are in your future.

Isn't it funny how we can see such hope in each other's futures, but always doubt our own? I think I read someone else posted that earlier today. It is just so hard to trust that things can be better after all that we have been through. But you know what? All of us here are tough - we will survive this. How many people do you know that would continue to put themselves through what we do on a day to day basis? I think most people would have just walked away when they heard about the A, let alone the OC. That still blows me away - my H is having a baby with OW. I don't think the reality of that will hit until the baby arrives. Anyway, we are all fighters and have the faith to sustain us through this fight for our marriages. That I believe!! We will be stronger and better people for this experience - that I think is part of God's purpose for all of this - to make us stronger people to do his will. I think about that alot. We are going to be such good Christian examples for our friends, family, and our children. We are trying our best to be that example for our spouses right now. They need us to lead them back to God - not just to lead them back to us. God wants them back in his fold and that is my focus right now. Sorry to get preachy - this is just what I have been reading alot about lately and I know in my heart that as my H's wife's that I am responsible to help him back to God. He has been living without him too long already.

Just my thoughts for tonight. I hope you saw my post above (Let Go, Let God). It is worth reading. I think we were posting at the same time and I didn't want you to miss it.

Talk to you more later,
Kris

hello ladies

KrisM, I am SOOOO glad that you went to H game! Keep up the good work. The guys love to ahve their own personal cheer leaders! (and from what I've read, they love the uniforms too! LOL)
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Things are "ok" on my end. Feeling a bit anxious and on edge because OW said OC is still having "emotional problems". I call them behavioral problems but w/ us OC is totally fine and acts normal......so anyway OW wanted to take OC to counseling again so we are going to the same therapist we went to last year.

The thing that has me on edge is that I find out today that it will NOT include OC. It will be us "adults". I am not looking forward to this because then it can open up the door for the topic to change to A rather than OC.

So Tuesday will not come fast enough for me. The mere thought of it makes me physically nausious.

It's not a big deal---just stupid really. Who ever heard of a BS going to counseling WITH H AND OW? This is stupid.

But, I know I can't complain because we CHOSE C w/ OC, as I have been reminded of so much lately. It's just stupid that it will not even be w/ OC.

In the long run it will be better because we can discuss OC behavior "freely" w/o OC being there and discuss whatever else may come up.

And I DARE OW to bring up ANYTHING else!
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Otherwise the future looks promising w/ us. Still moving on and ahead. Survivor is over so nothing to look forward too on Thursdays anymore! LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I'm here to offer encouragement when needed.

Hey KT--snowcat143 could use your wisdom.

You will do great at counseling--just don't let OW get the better of you. I really envy you for where you have gotten too. I hope to get there too--and hope one day to be an (oldie) here. Don't think I would be maing it work still if I hadn't found this site and gotten support from everyone here that it is all possible.

So just wanted to say thanks again for the continued help. Somedays I think you oldies must get tried of hearing us newbie whine and cry and muddle around--you must wonder when we will get it together.

Well I know you are up because you are PST--and a night owl I venture to guess. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

KT how do you face OW in counseling? Is it tough on you/H to be in room together with her? Of course you have been doing this for awhile, but I have yet to have to face OW. I have talked to her once on phone, but to see her face to face. Wow, I don't know if I could handle that. I would like to think that I could handle it and do what is right for OC - try to get along. But wow, that will be so tough? How do you get through it without backsliding?

Just curious about things to come.

Kris

I practically backslide mentally a lot.

We have worked our parenting agreement so that we hardly ever see OW anymore. I can't stand to look @ her and I rarely can look her in the face, much less in the eye. It's like I am ashamed to look @ her.

I don't know about this counseling thing. (like I said the idea makes me sick and I have just about stopped eating again <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" /> ) I imagine my self just blowing up @ her! But the therapist is there so I try to be very calm and contolled, which I usually am plus the fact that I don't want OW to know how she gets to me.

One time the therapist actually reprimanded me (in front of OW & H)because of a face I made and it literally took every ounce of self control I could ever muster not to say, "I don't have to put up w/ this!" and walk out! I had to bite my lip soooo hard. I just shut down after that and didn't say another word. The therapist kind of apologized to me later (on the phone) and said that I was hard to read (I kknow this)and she was trying to figure me out. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> whatever.

If I get a chance to speak w/ the therapist before hand myself I am going to ask her WHY OC is not included and let her know how unneccesary I think this is.
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I am not strong, I am not great, I am not a "good person", a "better person" or anything like that. But I am realistic, honest, upfront and have a great sense of humor, some of these things work to my detriment(like making jokes @ the most inopportune moment and about the most serious issues). I can be crafty (like the serpent not the glue), I am very skilled @ manipulation, I can be very catty and argumentative and it's extremely hard for me to admit that I am wrong. I am quick witted and impulsive w/ my words and language. In case you haven't noticed I talk A LOT and it takes me a ton of words to make a point!

So I HAVE to try very hard to keep myself in check knowing how I am. I can also "read" people very well, (body language and stuff) and have a tendency to almost read people's minds because of it but I am hard to read myself. I waste too much time worrying and wondering what others are thinking so much that I sometimes can't recognize what I think about a situation.

So with all that in mind I wonder how I can be the one you guys can seek advice from. I mean really, what do I know?
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I am struggling w/ this entire crazy-making situation, just not as much anymore. I try to reach out to get support or advice on how to handle things when they are not going how I thought they would or things are going negative w/ C W/ OC and lately, I am only reminded that I CHOSE this(one step away from saying stop whining, I think).

So I think it is best(for others not already having C) if NC is chosen. Best for all parties involved.

If I handle this in any way correctly or @ all it is only because of my Lord Jesus Christ. You guys know that. How else do we all survive something like this? I know of no other way.
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And my "other" secret weapon? I write long, wordy, tell-off emails to OW that I never address so they NEVER get sent!!!!!!! LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Good Morning,

Boy I missed a lot last nite around here too busy watching Idol & The Bachelor.

Albany, my dear it looks like you are on your way to having H back home soon. I am so proud you didn't LB or anything else when he made the smart comment about dinner, this is what he expected I bet & it may have led to an arguement & tearing down all the progress you had made so good for you! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

Kris - thanks so much for sharing Let go... I didn't even read it all, before I was in tears. You are so right about us W's leading our H's back to God. My H was saved before me, grew up in church & has been on a helluva back slide obviously, but he is still a son of God even when he acts like a son of a b*&%#! Refer to that often when you want to rush things or get down about the situation, God is in control.

JT - Put the boxing gloves on & do what cha gotta do, work on yourself & show H you are the woman he wants to be with, the woman God chose for him to spend his life with, his helpmate!

KT <blockquote>quote:<hr /> So with all that in mind I wonder how I can be the one you guys can seek advice from. I mean really, what do I know? <hr /></blockquote>How could you not know what an inspiration you are to us, even though you have up & down days still you are a testimony to those of us hoping to get where you are in your M, & you remind us that it takes time, & lots of PATIENCE. What to you know? --- You have experience behind you for one thing and especially for those of us considering contact w/ OC you are a great help. You have helped me keep the faith on more ocassions than you know, & I know I am not the only one who feels that way. You are truly a blessing to me. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> I pray all goes well for you w/ the counseling & that OW will give up her childish ways & put her D first in all this & be thankful that she has a father who wants to be in her life as well as a stepmother who cares for her.

Well for my update - I changed my hair & it drove H crazy, he was really sweet to me last nite, caring & attentive, we even made plans to celebrate our anniversary on the 25th, not going away like I wanted but it is something. I am still not happy about Mothers day but it is over, gotta let it go, Lord willing he will do better by me next year. Do I dare plan for the future w/ H????? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> Obviously I am up today, but cautious, I know one evening promises nothing. The last few days I was so convinced that this was the beginning of the end, of course I have felt that way most of the year, & now I feel like fighting again & not giving up. I just hope I am not setting myself up for a fall.

Hope everyone is having a great day.

Hey everyone ! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> Sounds like most are doing good. I'm hoping more of the WS come out of London (FOG LAND) They should realize Jack the Ripper lived there, its not a safe place to be. LOL I had one of the best nights we have had since finding out about OC! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> We talked like old friends again, and made love like newlyeweds! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> It was great! Had a friend over Tuesday, he (H)was going to work late, but didn't,
but she comes over and we get to vent together. But H came in and she cornered H w/o me ( I went into the house for a min) And told him again how lucky he was to have me, most people would have walked by now. H called this friend the whole 8 mnths we were sep and begged her to call me and take him back, he loved me so much BLAH BLAH. She reminded him of that. She told him OW should not be an issue w/us any longer and OC will be welcomed and loved by me and he better not mess up again! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> See I have friends that LB for me so I don't have to!! But he must have been thinking about it Wed, because he said he just missed me sooo much and never wanted me to leave him again! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I think we are both stressing thinking the other might leave, so we just need to enjoy each other while we are there. Told him that he would be the one that would make me leave or the OW and H. I didn't plan on going anywhere, but his actions would let me know if I needed to. Called several times this morning, woke up early to be w/ each other for awhile before work. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> It was great also. Cant say we are out of the fog just yet, OC is on the way in 9-04. I am tring to get ready for the stress of it all, but I think we will be so strong by then, that its not going to be what my mind thinks it's going to be.

KT - So you want us to think you are human? NAH, You are so much more than that! You have given all of us Newbies so much encougagement, its not even funny. You are a strong person and God gave you a gift of helping people. And you use it well sister! I know you will have your mansion on main street and more crowns you could ever wear when you get to heaven. If it hadn't been for you and Lynn ( which I miss, where is she) I would have packed by bags a long time ago. Your words of encouragements have me a much stronger person and thank God he brought me to yall. I was afraid before that the OW might know of this site, but realized, who cares, she needs to know how I feel and now how good my M and life is. But I could never thank ya'll enough for the words of wisdom that you gave.
Thanks <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" /> Sunny

albany~

You are indeed having a good week. I couldn't be happier for you. It's so easy to sense your joy, and see the burdens being lifted. However, (you knew there would be a howeve, didn't you? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" /> ), at the risk of sounding like a repetitive pest, I want to urge you to remember to continue doing as you're doing, no matter what he does. He's responding really well right now. But, remember he's the same man who tends to go back and forth, up and down a lot. Your job is to be consistent and constant, no matter his responses. Don't allow anything he says or does shake you, ok?

Continue to tread lightly, and do as flawless a Plan A you can muster, even if you come across a bad day, or the smallest of bad moments--do not get off the Plan A path. It's a good idea to read up on the Plan A concepts once in awhile, so they are embedded in your mind.

Ok enough of the reminders--for this post anyway. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

Take good care, my friend.

~ad

***edited to say--Actually, I could be happier for you--when H comes to his complete senses, moves back in, and commits to the restoration of your M, (but you knew what I meant). <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" /> ***

[ May 13, 2004, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

Hey you guys! I'm just going to vent away.

H called and left me a voicemail at work and said he couldn't come until around 7:00pm for dinner. He asked me to call him and let him know if that was okay.

I called him back and said something came up and he said yes he had to help Kevin from his work. I casually asked what he had going on and he said that he was helping him till up his garden.

Okay this set me off because I always had to pratically threaten to cut him off to get him to do that kind of stuff for me or when my Dad asks for help--mind you H doesn't offer he kind of is turd about it.

So I LBed a little bit--I said Oh I didn't know it took two people to do that. Of course he made some noise and was pissed--he then went on to say yah it will be me. I asked why Kevin couldn't and he said because he hurt his shoulder at work--well no one told me that.

Anyway I never said what time to come over and he gingerly said that he would be over arond seven. I'm really pissed at H right now--I almost told him not to come over at all but then that would not have reaped the results I want and so I bit all the way through my lip AD & BBYG--I'm sure it bled like crazy.

He has changed plans on me two nights in a row and personally I know it doesn't have to do with OW--nothing has since I found out she was Pregnant in 12/03.

I think the things are legit and I think he feels like he needs to do this because he is slipping back too much too fast--it is like a struggle of wills sometimes between us--I swear.

I know that I shouldn't be pissed but I was and now I'm feeling better--it stems from feeling shi@?* again today--still sick and letting myself get too excited with him coming over--haven't seen him since Monday I think.

So shame on me for LBing but it was only liitle AD and I promise not to any further tonight--so I'm just going to act completely nonchalant about things when he comes over and I will go home fix my make-up, start a load of laundry, drink a glass of wine and water my plants and of course start dinner somewhere in there.

IS it wrong to get annoyed by little things like that??? I don't know why it upset me so.

I hope he isn't just coming over for dinner and then heading out. I want him to hang out but I'm not sure if he will.

What do you guys think if he just comes over eats and leaves after a short while??? I'm I being used or is it just what is expected of H and the need for baby steps so he isn't feeling threatened????

Let me know--I'll check the site again tonight.

Hey you guys! I'm just going to vent away. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

H called and left me a voicemail at work and said he couldn't come until around 7:00pm for dinner. He asked me to call him and let him know if that was okay.

I called him back and I said something came up and he said yes he had to help Kevin from his work. I casually asked what he had going on and he said that he was helping him till up his garden.

Okay this set me off because I always had to pratically threaten to cut him off to get him to do that kind of stuff for me or when my Dad asks for help--mind you H doesn't offer he kind of is turd about it.

So I LBed a little bit--I said Oh I didn't know it took two people to do that. Of course he made some noise and was pissed--he then went on to say yah it will be me. I asked why Kevin couldn't and he said because he hurt his shoulder at work--well no one told me that.

Anyway I never said what time to come over and he gingerly said that he would be over arond seven. I'm really pissed at H right now--I almost told him not to come over at all but then that would not have reaped the results I want and so I bit all the way through my lip AD & BBYG--I'm sure it bled like crazy. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

He has changed plans on me two nights in a row and personally I know it doesn't have to do with OW--nothing has since I found out she was Pregnant in 12/03.

I think the things are legit and I think he feels like he needs to do this because he is slipping back too much too fast--it is like a struggle of wills sometimes between us--I swear.

I know that I shouldn't be pissed but I was and now I'm feeling better--it stems from feeling shi@?* again today--still sick and letting myself get too excited with him coming over--haven't seen him since Monday I think.

So shame on me for LBing but it was only liitle AD and I promise not to any further tonight--so I'm just going to act completely nonchalant about things when he comes over and I will go home fix my make-up, start a load of laundry, drink a glass of wine and water my plants and of course start dinner somewhere in there.

IS it wrong to get annoyed by little things like that??? I don't know why it upset me so.

I hope he isn't just coming over for dinner and then heading out. I want him to hang out but I'm not sure if he will.

What do you guys think if he just comes over eats and leaves after a short while??? I'm I being used or is it just what is expected of H and the need for baby steps so he isn't feeling threatened????

Let me know--I'll check the site again tonight.

Sorry for the double post--I hit the stop so I could fix a few things but I guess it had already posted even though I still had the message screen displayed on my monitor.

Hey Albany - I hope this post isn't too late. Don't let it bother you if H leaves after he eats, or at least don't let your H knows that it bothers you. Just take things as they go. Some nights my H leaves just as soon as I get home from work, other nights he stays and we spend time together. Yes, it does bother me - I think because I take it too personally. Sometimes it seems H wants to just see kids and as soon as I get home he is free. But sometimes I think I read too much into his reactions. I want him to stay and spend time with me, but you can't force them into doing what you want. I know there are nights when H has things to do at apartment - laundry, etc - and his leaving has nothing to do with me. On the other hand, it bothers me alot because he is some place he should not be. He should be living with his family. I just have to keep reminding myself to be patient. And if I find that these things bother me, I just come here and post or I find something to keep me busy. I tend not to dwell on it so much then.

Hope this helps.
God Bless,
Kris

<blockquote>quote:<hr />so I bit all the way through my lip AD & BBYG--I'm sure it bled like crazy.
<hr /></blockquote>lol...Ok, I said flawless Plan A, nowhere did I suggest risking life and limb!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

As far as the topic that produced the LB, I can relate. I've had similar situations arise with my H--I'm sure we all have. I used to always ask my H, "How is it you aren't able to say NO to anyone but me?" I would sometimes be a real smart a$$ and show him how to mouth the word "NO", you get the picture, not very attractive of me, but...ewwww, I would get so frustrated!

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I know that I shouldn't be pissed <hr /></blockquote>No albany, it's perfectly fine to be pissed. Who wouldn't be after he changed plans on you, two nights in a row? As Kris pointed out though, the difference is, don't let him see you're pissed. This is so tricky, because I don't advocate you being a doormat. It's not that he should get the impression he can be inconsistent, and it's all honky dory with you. Boundries can be set by you, it just needs to be in a non-LB'g manner.

I'm tired right now, and feel I'm not making a lot of sense. Do you know what I mean though? I don't want you to be an emotionless Stepford Wife type of person, and I'm quite certain he doesn't want that either. It's ok for you to be hurt, pissed, disappointed--just not LB while trying to convey those feelings, you know?

<blockquote>quote:<hr />IS it wrong to get annoyed by little things like that??? <hr /></blockquote>No it's not...see above paragraph. I'm the last one who should be telling anyone their feelings aren't valid. It's one of my pet peeves--when a person doesn't see another's views as valid. Just because one thinks it's something little, doesn't mean it's little to the other. These type of issues will be something for the two of you to tackle once you are back together. Him going off and helping a friend, you not seeing the point, and being frustrated because he doesn't do the same for you, w/out much persuasion, is a matter that can easily be ironed out through POJA.

Right now you have bigger fish to fry though. Which reminds me, is there anyway you can ask him to move home? This has been weighing on my mind. I really think he needs to be there. Remind me again, why the separation? He's not seeing ow, right? You're not in Plan B.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> What do you guys think if he just comes over eats and leaves after a short while??? I'm I being used or is it just what is expected of H and the need for baby steps so he isn't feeling threatened???? <hr /></blockquote>On one hand, I think it sucks, because it does appear on the surface as if he's using you. You have a good attitude though, to think of it in terms of baby steps. I like that! On the other hand, he may just be enjoying your company. Ever thought of that, Miss. albany... huh? You have a great sense of humor, and your more relaxed state this week is probably very apparent to him. Ahhhh, and not to mention, you sound like a fabulous cook!! If you were doing the "old albany" type of behaviors, do you think he'd becoming for dinner at all? Give yourself some credit, and don't sell yourself short! Keep being lighthearted, he won't be able to resist.

albany, you know what I've noticed about you? Here, you have an OC on the way, but you are allowing all the issues that surround an OC to sit on the back burner for now. You are putting your M first, and giving it your all to make it work. You are giving things their proper priority. I'm so proud of you!

Oh, and I'm so glad to hear you're keeping busy, even if it is laundry and watering plants, or whatever. Do some "me" stuff too. Busy is good, busy is good. Well, idle is good sometimes too, just think on productive things when you're idle. Hey, like re-read Plan A concepts, and memorize the 180's!!! I've mentioned that before, haven't I? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" />

Have a great rest of the evening!

~ad

[ May 13, 2004, 10:43 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

KrisM--You couldn't have said it better--I take it way personal--more so then I should.

He came over a little earlier than he said he would and dinner wasn't quite ready but we had a great dinner--loster tails, artichokes, salad and french bread. During he said he had a horrible headache and needed to take a vicodin--I asked if he had left any at the house and he said not and then he would go home shortly after we got done eating. He asked it that was okay--I said yes--I offered for him to take a bath to relieve the tension--he doesn't have a tub at his apt.--he declined but layed on the bed while our son took a bath and I put the dishes in the dishwasher.

I rubbed his back for him and we just layed on the bed and watched TV for awhile. He left at 8:30pm and gave me a nice big hug before he left.

I was telling him that tonight would be hard night to get our son to sleep since H had been their during his bedtime--our son never wants to go to bed when he is their--I think that is because he not their as much of course as when living together.

AD--asking him to move in would send him running--he moved out again because we just argued about trying to get things resolved with OW with OC--and he stated that we weren't doing anything but fighting and arguing and that their was a reason he left before and cheated--and that basically maybe he shouldn't have came back but he wanted a family---FOG TALK--anyway I think I need to keep up what I'm doing for ahile longer.

Here is another good thing--He called me at 7:45am when I was at work--he said what are you doing and I said working--I asked what he was doing up--he a sleep in person--always has been. He said he got up and was hungry so he was driving to McDonalds to grab breakfast and then going back to bed--still sick also--he had a lung infection. He said he called just check in about picking our son up from daycare at 3:30pm.

We discussed that last night but HEY we know why he called!

Got to run and get busy--want to go home earlier because I him still so sick and I have stuff to get done at work.

Everyone else want an update.

Well after Wed. nites activies, last nite was dead as a door nail, I was in a coma when H came in so we didn't talk at all, he didn't wake me up.
Maybe for the best, since I may have started to stray from my 180's again & ask questions I shouldn't. Going out w/ friends tonite, he doesn't like that I am going out on a regular basis either, oh well.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> We discussed that last night but HEY we know why he called! <hr /></blockquote>Yes we do! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I wouldn't worry about the little LBing you did the other day, you are human, keep up the good work - its working!!!!!

Laides just a little something I found to help us in our stand...

In Isaiah 64:4,5: Since ancient times no one has heard, no ear has perceived, no eye has seen any God besides You, who ACTS ON BEHALF OF THOSE WHO WAIT FOR HIM. YOU COME TO THE HELP OF THOSE WHO GLADLY DO RIGHT, WHO REMEMBER YOUR WAYS. (New International Version). A false god is one YOU have to carry; the true God carries you.

Now listen to the prophets sharp contrast beginning in verse 3:
Listen to me, O house of Jacob, all you who remain of the house of Israel, YOU WHOM I HAVE UPHELD SINCE YOU WERE CONCEIVED, AND HAVE CARRIED SINCE YOUR BIRTH.

Even to your old age and gray hairs I am He, I am He who will sustain you. I HAVE MADE YOU AND I WILL CARRY YOU; I WILL SUSTAIN YOU AND I WILL RESCUE YOU.

Waiting is an act of worship. It is the attitude of stillness in the presence of God. It is recognizing our inability and a determination to do nothing till we hear from Him.

Waiting on God means that we adjust our lives to Him; our time schedule to Him. We set our hope on Him and look to Him rather than to our own efforts or ingenuity.

When this situation in your family gets desperate, what is needed is not more effort on our part, but a deepening of our communion with Him, a more intense concentration of worship and fellowship. God Works for Those Who Work Righteousness and Remember His Ways.

God acts on behalf of those who gladly do right, those whose heart's delight is to obey Him and constantly call to remembrance all the wonderful things He has done for them in the past.

Remembering what God has done in the past will encourage us to believe He will not abandon us in the future. Remembering His goodness impels us to gladly obey His will. This is the kind of person on whose behalf God works.

BBG,

That's a great scripture. I am so glad that you posted it. I needed to hear a word from God and I think that you just provided it. Thank you so much for that. I hope that everything is going well with you today.

I hope that everything is going well for everyone today. Keep your heads up and know that God is with you and I am also. I know that I can only offer comfort and not much support because I am new to this situation myself, but I do want you all to know that I am with you.

Take care and keep in touch - talk to you all later.

JT

Check with you gals later--I'm at home now and I going to sleep until H picks up our son from daycare at 3:30pm.

A good nap should help--by the way AD or whoever said that about a "great cook" sometimes--have a hard time finging energy to cook dinner and enjoy it after working all day. Tonight I think it is soup and sandwiches.

JT2--I'm glad to hear it is going better and so proud of you for letting H take care of things--amazingly enough they can cope even though we tend not to believe that.

Albany,

You're right - H did a great job! Kids were happy and feed and believeit or not they were even still clean!!

JT

Sunny - I have a question for you. I read that recently your family found out about OC. How did you handle this? What was their reaction? I have not told my family about OC yet. I thought of waiting until DNA is proven. Maybe it won't be an issue - wishful thinking. I don't know though. Maybe I shouldn't wait. They may be more upset if they find out I have known since Feb. and didn't tell them. They have handled the news of A okay. They have been very supportive of me and want very much for M to survive. I am afraid that will change if they find out about OC. I couldn't handle not having their support anymore. I was really hoping H and I would be on the right track by now and that family could handle it better if they knew H was committed to M. However, that is still up in the air.

Any advice from anyone??

Thanks as always.

God Bless,
Kris

Well me and my family hadn't spoke a whole lot since H can back. I mean my dad, brother ect. I have spoke to my mom alot. First D moved in w/dad and her step mom asked her if she knew? So how did she know? I told my D, but she didn't tell. D said SM heard from B! Well he works in the same industry as me and H, and the lovely gift I got when I came back to work from a trip we took, well we gave everyone something to talk about. Of course H is an A$$, I am a saint and OW is phyco! Thats what everyone is saying. Well yes H can be and no I'm not a saint by no means, and OW can be phyco at times. Can't we all. I know I think about things but be the grace of God I do not let the devil take over!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> I really thought someone would say something by now, but NONE of my family has said anything? I don't know if mom knows, if she does she's waiting on me to tell her. Well like you I was waiting for the test, no since in starting issues w/ family if I don't have too. H family knows but I never said anything to but maybe three close friends and that was it. H had the honor of telling people he screwed up. And that is what he tells them. He didn't want it, but together we will deal w/it and sooo glad he has me, blah, blah. But noone has said anything, I keep waiting. Don't really know what I will say. More than likely will be the same answer that H gave. No one has to live w/H or me and no one can judge us for what we do, just God. He is H and OW judge, and like I have said before I will be judged on how I handled it, by the only person I care abouts judgement, God. I fight so hard everyday to try not to give the devil the pleasure that he is trying to be in my life. Somedays its harder than others. But you will notice, as I did, if I give the devil glory, then crap hits the pan and when I give God the glory for my family, friends, life, then he helps me in sooo many ways. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />
Hows everyone !!!! AL, BBG.Kris. girlfriends we need an update!!!
Sunny <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="images/icons/cool.gif" />

Nothing great here-H called Fri. afternoon, stopped and got meat at Costco and we BBQ. The evening was great and then after he left I was checking e-mail and he had response that is application for a job with his current co. had been received for a job in Boise--different state and 10hrs away.

Well that set me off and he was a jerk and told me he had gone and got file yourself divorce paperwork--well it went from their and how he hated to be around me and I was angry person--I let all my angry come out on Friday night that is true--basically he threw everthing back in my face.

I was stupid and pointed out to him that his actions and words do not match. I said why do you come around so much and he said to see our son. I said well if that is the case you could have had him all day on Thur. & Fri. instead of him going to daycare--H was off those days and I said you are welcome to take him to your apt. That of course just seemed to piss him off more.

Anyway so much for things going well--by the way he admitted yesterday that he hadn't gotten divorce papaerwork. I told him that I have about had it and maybe we should try no contact and he said that's fine it be a start for me for us being done--thank you again for being a jerk.

So last night he stopped by to unload wood which I told him not to bring anymore home since I was going to have deal with it all in the future--covering it etc. He was fine and we ate dinner.

This morning we talked and I just said that the person I use to know would fight to make this work and the person that I lived with again in November and December told me thaey would never leave and that they loved me and our son and no matter what happened with OW being with child he would make this work. I just told him that I knew that person still existed somewhere.

Oh yah he told me he was telling his parents on this trip and I find that interesting since he told me he already told them which I knew he hadn't but just a point of interest.

I think that if I hadn't reacted to the job thing he would have kept coming around and eventually realized or admitted to himself that he wasn't coming to see our son. I think I really screwed it up and I have been doing a strong PA since then and as of today I'm impletmenting 180's again--not talk of how things can be not I love you etc. I lost the ball and I need to get it back.

AD--I'm sorry I lost it and he right though I'm very angry now and I have been more angry with him ever since he left again. That anger comes from him telling me we would make it work and telling me he loves me and our family and this wasn't going to ruin it for us--him leaving after that hurt som much and it made me very angry because I trusted him and believed him. So yes I have some issues--only if something comes up about be done do we fight otherwise he is great and seems happy. He also told me he wasn't happy when he was back at home and I said well then you folled me, your family, my family, your friends and your IC.

Okay AD I'm ready for your scolding--by the way I'm thinking the moving back in questions wouldn't gone over well because then he would known that I could tell he was making baby steps back.

So what is everyone's thoughts??? HE leaves Wed, with our son to go to his parents again to see his brother. What is the best tactic between now and then to leave it the best possible between us and what should the long range plan be?????

Hello Ladies,

Well my weekend was the usual, I went out on Friday, came in late, H grilled me in the morning about it, I gave little or no details as usual. Sat. & Sun he disappears. I strayed from the 180's & stupidly sent him a text message, he didn't reply, that was at 3:30, he came in around 11, asking if I had a new phone & actually thought he was gonna get SF! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

I (stupidly) asked why he didn't respond to my message, he gave me a dumb answer, then I went on to be more stupid & ask where he was all day, I LB'd told him to leave the bdrm. he refused, said it's his bed too. I told him he could take it w/ him & that I am tired of playing this sorry game w/ him. Of course this morning I get a message from him, kinda late don't cha think?????? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

I think I may move out of our bdrm. next week my anniversary present to him & me. I can't do this anymore.

Albany - I am not sure what to tell you, AD will have better advice I'm sure. I would have blown up too if I thought H was leaving town & not even going to discuss it w/ me, especially since you guys have a child. If it were me I think I would try to 180 until H leaves, no sense in being angry & letting him know you are, just be indifferent, but happy.

BBYG--so sorry to hear that--I think that moving out of the bedroom is the best thing.

Hopefully AD will have some insight/good advice. Yesterday he was fine and came over to unload more wood that he had gotten-which I had said not to-okay whatever. We talked and had a good time. I actually think that he is thinking and we got a long great--he is suppose to come by on his way to work tonight--I'm not sure why and the more I have thought about it the more I'm sure that he doesn't just come over to see our son as I said he could have our son when he has been off during the week instead of our son going to daycare and H picking him up early. He could also take our son over night or too his apt. for a while--it's not like I tell him that he has to keep him at our home.

Anyway I'm keeping my chin up and I will pray that for him to stay and I think that if I had to take a guess he won't tell his parents/family that he is done when he is over their this week--flying over on Wednesday.

Hope to here everyone's thoughts. Hope everyone had a good weekend.

albany~

I'm not going to scold you. I'm sick, and don't have the energy to scold, even if I wanted to! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> You were presented with a really big issue, nearly impossible not to LB.

You know what the goal is. I don't know how far or how close he is to saying he's ready to come back and commit. Maybe he needs to see more consistent Plan A behavior from you in order to get off the fence. So, as I've said before, continue on, doing the best Plan A you can, but don't beat yourself up everytime you LB. Just pick yourself up, and move on. Take each day, each moment as it comes. It's easier to do when you see things in small increments, rather than in big chunks of time. Let yourself be characterized by your Plan A behavior, so that an occasional LB or DJ isn't so noticeable.

I know you don't like it when I say this, but you cannot be in Plan A indefinitely. If he doesn't commit soon, you must move to Plan B. I'm sorry albany, but you don't want Plan A to make his cake eating easier, you want it to make him come to his senses.

Keep in mind, if you begin to LB more times than not, you risk leaving him sour before going to Plan B.

I know Plan B frightens you albany, but I see it as possibly being "just the ticket" in your particular case. If/when you near Plan B, you should go over to GQ...there are quite a few posters in Plan B over there who can provide you with many answers, and lots of support.

BBG~

I'm sorry to hear your latest developments. I know for sure I've asked this before, but is there anyway you can do a real Plan B? Get his butt out of there? Your statement, "I can't do this anymore" says it all. The love you have left for him, must be protected if there is to be any hope of reconciliation. He needs a wake up call too. He's eating the same selfish cake as albany's H.

Pulling for you ladies...always!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="images/icons/smile.gif" />

~ad

[ May 17, 2004, 12:13 PM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

AD~
Maybe I was wrong to point out that his actions and words do not match--but I don't think so. I think he thinks he is done and tells himself he is but he isn't with these types of action--i'm I right that he can spend time with son not at our house--nothing makes him come over to stay and what about how he assumed He was the one I was making dinner for.

Anyway I hope you feel better AD. Being sick just sucks--I think the fence sitting thing is strange based on his actions and I think that he was truly happy in Nov. & Dec.-- I think he says he wasn't as an excuse.

I would rather hear I"m not ready to go or come back instead of I'm done and have it be a lie. I did mention no seeing each other and not communication and his reply is that it will just be a good start for us being done--I think he might be surprised at his own reactions to a PB--he tries to be tough and say no contact would be just great for him. I may just have to test that on him.

hey Girls,

It must have been stupid Husband's weekend for everyone. I thought that I was the only one that had to LB or get in his s*** weekend. I was just infuriated, H spent the weekend at home with me and the kids, came in Sat night had had a drink H does not drink so when he came home all lovey dovey I knew and could smell it on him. So I then told him the only reason that he was even interested in SF was because he was tipsy.

H denied it and then away I went (*?!!#**) <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />
Then I went to bed. H did not even make it to the bed he fell asleep on the couch. I did not even wake him. I got up just to see if he'd put our son to bed. Don't get me wrong he was not drunk, but was very relaxed. He had put his pj's on and put him to bed so I then went back to bed and left him there on the couch. Eventhough he looked very uncomfortable. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

The next morning early he came and got into bed about 7. He then perceeded to get SF, but I was still to angry. Then his cell rang at 8, he looked at it and said that he did not know who would be calling him from a private number - so he did not answer it of course.

I went completely bolistic <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />
I got up and let my mind just run away with me. I LB's to the point of no return. I went and threw some of his personal belongings out and told him to get out!! I can not do this anymore. I might be the reason that he has not come home but I can't hide how I feel and I feel that he is not acknowledging my pain and hurt. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

We got into a trowing match and destroyed some items, and the kids got up in the process. I am going insane here and don't know how tio get past it. Maybe I just need to leave and not look back. I am only torturing myself.

Later that morning he was suppose to be packing up his things, but he did not he just cleaned up his part of the mess and took my son to the store with him. They were gone for a couple of hours so I had time to put the baby back down and clean up the mess. He called to see if I wanted breakfast like nothing had happened like everything was okay.

I just hung up the phone. I am beginning to think that I am the problem here ladies!! I am the one lashing out and being angry. I CAN"T LET IT GO!!! IT IS KILLING ME!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Last night he tried to make it up to me by getting some new CD's for my car. He even came upstairs for SF. Every time I look in his face all I see is the betrayal. I can't se anything but that. I went as far as to throw my wedding rings back at him and my Mother's day gift.

This is not going to work it is getting out of control. I need to tell my C about the incident and learn how to cope with it much better and calmer.

Help! Again!

<img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" />

I forgot to mention that I can never do more that 3 days of plan A before something happens. I still have yet to do a plan A. His major complaint is that I argue about it every single day. He can't live or relive it everyday is what he tells me.

BUT WHAT ABOUT ME!!!!

JT2

I feel for you--but I know you can do a better PA for longer than three days--I only use to be able to do a few days at a time but I have gotten better--a week or more until I did big LB this weekend--lost it when H said he had gotten D papers--which was actually a lie so big fight just because he lied.

He leaves out of town on Wednesday and I think that I will leave him a letter to read--I will write it tonight and tomorrow night--Kind of a last effort to explain myself, feelings, etc and why it could work and be great.

Right now just PA and 180 stuff--you can do it too--I'm here for you--I know I thought things were going so good until Firday evening--like I said previously my H's actions and words do not match at all.

AD - I could put H out at the risk of him calling the police, since this is his legal residence I cannot legally throw him out, he may not cause a scene, I dont know. I think it may come to that though. Moving out of the bdrm. will shake him up I know, but you are right I am losing love for him based on his treatment of me. If I could stay w/ the 180's for a good month, that might help him see thru the fog, but things bother me so much like him not being around! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> I told him that I am tired of being lonely & I have a void & an emptiness I need filled, (same thing he said to me when I asked him why he had A), he got upset that I used his words, oh well I am telling the truth, what sense does it make to have an H that you hardly see & do nothing with! It is almost like he is trying to see how far he can push me before I snap. I almost started kicking him in the bed & telling him to get out, I was so mad, I hate to feel that way, but that is where I have let him take me. I also told him that payback is a b*%#h! I know it would prove nothing & make me no better than him but I could easily have an A myself, just to let him know how it feels, that would get his butt out for sure!
I got off work early & H was here we had a couple of words basically just about him taking care of a problem I am having w/ my car, so I am sure I be sleeping when he comes back home.

JT - I am sorry you had a bad weekend w/ H also. I know God won't put more on us than we can bear so if we got it, it means we can handle it, but I am not doing so well. I have thoughts running thru my head that are not of God, & it scares me. What are you going to do? I wish I could tell you something encouraging, but I am in a bad way today. Just keep praying, try not to look at what is going on around you & give your H to God, (when I learn to do it myself, I will share the secret).

I am praying for us all.

Thank You for your prayers!

JT

JT,

Anytime, I know we are not supposed to question God, but do you ever wonder why you are in this situation? I know I do, I believe everything happens for a reason, but I can't see any reason for this, it is almost like my H is punishing me continously as if the A, the baby & OW aren't enough, he then comes home when he didn't have to & continues to make my life miserable. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" />

I don't understand why it is so hard to be honest about what you want? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> H says he loves me & wants us to work but his actions say the opposite totally.

Do you feel that way too?

FIRST: I think it's time to retire this thread and start a new one. It's hard to keep track.....but anyway......

JT2: deep breathe. Everyone has the knock-down-drag-outs @ some point. It's natural. About your H behavior---keep in mind H are more rational and less emotional than us. My H has responded to our blow-outs in the same ways sometimes and I have come to appreciate him being able to be forgiving and putting it in perspective.

I think it was good that H acted like nothing and still even wanted SF. He is beginning to trust you (@ least my POV) that even after something like that, he's still there w/ you and risking rejection by initiating SF. Think of it that way.

Maybe you were over-reacting/maybe not but it sounds like after it all, H did NOT continue to over-react. Sometimes, you DO just have to let it go. Laugh about being so stupid and how you both let yourselves get carried away and then........go have some make-up sex. Send that passion in a better direction.

I swear, you sound just like me. Trying to be "good" and you're being so self-controlled and holding it in and it's so hard then finally you just boil over! Everything you've been trying so hard to hold in and then you get set off by something insignifigant than what the real issue is to begin w/!

Keep reminding yourself of the rational/real things in your life. Your marriage, your H love for you and your love for him, your kids that you have together. Those things are real and will last, your anger and pain will not.

Talk to your H, tell him your sorry if you can, and tell him that you know you over-react sometimes, are irrational sometimes but you appreciate his willingness to work with you through it all. Explain how hard it is for you and that you do want to be happy but your foundation is so shot now that sometimes you feel like you just don't know where you are anymore. Remind him (& yourself) that you do love him and you appreciate his patience w/ you.

Remind yourself of ALL the things you DO know for sure and try to not focus on all the uncertainties. Here's some for starters;

God loves you
God is w/ you
God KNEW this would all happen
God wants you to be married to your H
God wants to bless you
God chose your mate for you(even knowing this would happen)
You love your kids
Your kids need/want/deserve an intact home
Your H loves your kids
You can be unhappy and still have JOY

Read Jer. 29:11--again. There is a plan for you.

Hang in there and change your attitude! Remember the saying around here, Fake it till' you make it!

Go have some M-U-S!!!!! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Don't be afraid to emotionally reconnect w/ your H. SF may be very emotional right now and rightly so. LET H COMFORT YOU! Stop fighting it. Your H wants to re-connect w/ you too and SF is his way. Your H wants YOU JT2------no one else!

Maybe I am way off base here and correct me if I am. But you sound so much like me that I feel I can share w/ you what I have learned about H & I's relationship and help you to not make the same mistakes I have but maybe not. Hang in there.

Okay--maybe we do need to start a new thread but I'm not sure what we would refer to it as.

BBYG--you H is opposite of mine--your's says he cares but actions are far from supporting that and mine says he doesn't care yet actions scream that he does. Can we just shoot them be done with it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" /> No we love them too much

I have ordered three new books. Two are Dr. Laura--the one KT says is great--Proper Care & Fedding of Husbands, "Ten Stupid Things Couples Do to Mess Up Their Relationships, "Working on Your Relationship Doesn't Work: A Transformational Approach to Creating Magical Relationships"Ariel Kane.

We all know the first one is good I will let you guys know--I won't have them for a week or two.

I'm so with you KT--I totally let my H have it Saturday morning--I let all the pent up anger out and boy oh boy did it flow out--of course then my H used that against me and said I needed to get help with my anger <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> --they are so good at turning it back to us.

So tried of putting out all the work/effort maybe it is time for PB after he returns from visit to parents--he says no contact with him is fine but he never seems to be able to back up his words--we know he can talk the talk but can he walk the walk. I'm betting not as he was the one calling me all last week even though he is done.

Thanks KT,

You are right it is like you can read my mind and my heart. I appreciate everything that you have to say because it's like you are right there with me feeling what I am feeling. It is great to know that someone understands me and what I am going through ( not to slight anyone else on this thread - you've all helped tremendously).

I will try to keep the faith and will try some M-U-S. H is at H everynight with us, but H leaves and goes back to the hotel. I will try and Fake it until I make it!!

Please pray for me I am having a real difficult time with this.
<img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />
JT

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Can we just shoot them be done with it. <hr /></blockquote>Sounds like a plan to me! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="images/icons/wink.gif" /> Will you buy the gun or shall I borrow my dad's LOL <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="images/icons/tongue.gif" />

I really think PB would work for you, your H doesn't want your marriage to be over or he would file & stop coming around unnecesarily. He could make arrangements to pick up your son & not see you. He is fence sitting like AD sitting, eating his cake & getting real full.

My H on the other is just tripping, sometimes I feel like he is only here for shelter.

Maybe we could call the new thread, "we need help before we lose our minds!" or "WH's/FWH's - can't live w/ them, can't shoot em! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

BBG,

Why would I start a PB if I have not even done a partialy good PA. I can't even get through three days of a good solid PA. H responds great to it but I let something small set me off evrytime.

Thanks anyway,

JT

JT2--I think BBGY was referring to me

YOU still have time for PA.

JT,

I see what KT means now, I wasn't telling you to PB, I meant Albany.

You haven't given PA long enough, I believe you will get to the point where you can go longer than 3 days, it takes time & patience. In your situation I wouldn't advise separation until you have done PA to death, maybe a good 6 months as Dr. Harley says, & if you get no results then PB.

BBYG--I haven't made the 6 months yet I don't think--but mine is jerking my chain with actions and words not matching. SO I'm thinking that living totally without me for some time may really open his eyes as AD thinks also--He needs to know what is like to not have any access to me--who's he gonna call when he is sick or his having a bad day or if his Grandma you isn't doing well passes away. I think he doesn't have clue what it means to have someone who is willing repair the M after all of this--so many spouses would just be done.

Albany,

I think you may be on the right track but be absolutely sure before you write that letter, being that he is already not living w/ you that should make it easier, I think it may have been KT who said long ago, what do you have to lose at this point? If you don't PB, H keeps playing games & hurting you, if you do PB & he files for D or doesn't respond then you part still loving him & him with good thoughts of you & YOU are on your way to healing & moving on. It is a risk but the alternative is to what - keep riding the roller coaster? I know you are tired of it, as am I, my position is not as easy as yours right now as far as PB goes though. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Frown]" src="images/icons/frown.gif" />

BBYG~I really want this to be a good letter--any thoughts of what/how to say it--I know you can't write it for me--it is just that I would like it to be an eye opener letter--but I don't want to sound whiney in it. I want to reach out and grab his heart and wrench it.

Any input would be great from all of you-sometimes others have a better way of putting something into words.

[ May 17, 2004, 06:08 PM: Message edited by: albany ]

Oh yes he just called to say he was stopping by on his way to work if that was alright. I said fine--but I bet it won't be alright with him if I start saying no--so out of character for me--he would sh!@.

BBYG--I tell you we can't live without them and we can't kill them--how unfortunate <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="images/icons/grin.gif" />

[ May 17, 2004, 06:19 PM: Message edited by: albany ]

Albany - In my opinion, you need to focus on the good things - your love for him, love for kids, needs of kids. Read KT's post to JT2. Alot of the things that she said there would be good for your letter. Sorry, I don't think I am much help.

I just LBed my H. Is there a full moon or something? Our H's are just nuts. Anyway, the OW's ultrasound is Wed. H told me tonight that he is thinking about going. I have told him before how I felt about that - obviously fell on deaf ears. H feels like he is not a part of prednacy - HELLO??? Should not even be a pregnacy - but seeing how he is not married to OW or living with OW - should he really expect to be part of it!! Sorry, but I let my anger show. Last night, H told me that OW said she has been talking to other man and is ready to move on. I say go for it woman and good luck to new man. However, I think she is trying to make H jealous again and get him on her side of the fence. I pointed this out to him. I asked him why he would want a woman who has to use jealousy and manipulation to win you over. My H is right - he is being an idiot. I then told him that if he is willing to break the hearts of his two BC for sake of OW/OC and he could live with himself - then go for it. If that's the type of relationship he wants while sacrificing his M and BC, then don't let me hold him back. He will be the one who lives with all the regret later. I honestly don't see how a M with OW will ever survive built on dishonesty and manipulation. Hey the sex must be great!! Sorry, I am just really angry right now.

Good luck Albany with your letter.

Talk to you all later tonight. I think I need to say a few extra prayers for some more strength and some for H so that he can clearly see what is really going on with OW. He is sacrificing so much for so little in return.

Kris

Kris,

It is called FOG heavy duty FOG! My H went thru EVERY step of OW's pg. Of course he had never been thru this before so is was justified - NOT. I see no need for it at all, my reasoning is if you don't plan to be w/ OW after the birth for good, then why be there for the pg., especially when HELLO - you have a wife. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> Keep praying Kris try to keep LB's to a minimum it is only natural to let them slip or all out blow up w/ them you are only human.

Albany - In my PBL I broke it up into 5 paragraphs;

1. Said I no longer want to live w/ H under the current circumstances, asked that he respect my feelings & leave asap.

2. Acknowledged the part I played in our M falling apart & how I made him feel.

3. Talked about the kind of M I still felt we could have including having his D be a part of OUR lives but that we both had to change.

4. Told him that I still love him & wanted to continue to be his wife but he must end contact w/ OW & make a sincere effort to commit to rebuilding our M.

5. Stated that I wanted no contact w/ him unitl he was ready to come home fully committed to me & our M & ready to work on our relationship. Told him that I am not giving up on us, but I can't do this alone, I have put it in God's hands & needed him to leave so I can have peace of mind. Asked that he would contact me if & when he was ready to come home & start real recovery.

Hope that helps you get started.

THanks BBYG~I may not write letter for fear he will think it is a way clinging on or an act of desperation.

Of course he acted just great when he came by. I'll fill in on the details better later tonight after son is in bed.

<blockquote>quote:<hr /> I see no need for it at all, my reasoning is if you don't plan to be w/ OW after the birth for good, then why be there for the pg., especially when HELLO - you have a wife. <hr /></blockquote>BG - That is my major problem right now, H is still very much on the fence. He is not so sure he won't be with OW after birth of baby. Sometimes I think I am just a big ol road block to his happiness. It is really sad that H feels he has to give up a wonderful family that God has blessed him with for one that was developed out of lust and evil (for lack of a better word). It is just so frustrating because I want what is best for H, what God intended for us, and he continually chooses the path of temptation and sin. I feel totally helpless to stop H from ruining not only his life, but ours. I am helpless - God will do his best to stop this all from happening. The sad thing is that God gave us all a freewill to choose our path in life, and H is making all the wrong choices right now. I pray that God will open his eyes soon before it is all beyond repair.

Why can't our Hs just see the love we have for them? We are willing to stick by them and try to lead them back to the path God intended them to follow, but yet they are so easily swayed by the temptations before them. Why can't they see that OW don't offer them real love? If they really loved them, they would leave them alone in their M? The OW certainly are not concerned w/ our Hs souls - what kind of love is that? Selfish love!!

Sorry girls, just needed to vent a little. I don't think I really LBed that much. I even told H that I was getting angry and was walking away before I said anything else.

God Bless,
Kris

KrisM~

Vent away--that is what we are here for. Well you could have my H who is on the fence about our marriage--I love you care for you but don't want to be marrid to you and oh yah don't forget that you are my best friend.

My H is very much done with OW--he has tried to make contact about DNA test after birth of child and her plan for child--does she want to sign away his rights etc or what--but she won't return a single call. By the way not sure if I mentioned but know your frustration with OW who do this to keep the man--both H & I are almost certain OW got pregnant on purpose.

I have decided not to write the letter to H--I think he will see it as clinging, not being strong, etc.

Update on visit tonight: He was jolly when he got here-made a funny remark about I see how you cleaned my saddle--I told him I would wipe up his saddle before he took on his trip to his parents to help out branding at feedlot. I thought how dare you who doesn't want to be married and isn't living in the same house--I said well you are leaving Wednesday and I said it would be done before then--then I said have I failed you before?? No answer--he really was joking when he said it but it kinda pissed me off if you know what I mean.

Next he proceeded to ask me what he should drive to the airport??? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" /> Hello you don't want to be my H but you are asking my advice on this <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="images/icons/shocked.gif" /> --I told him what I would drive based on milage and gas costs and which vehicle you care the least about being in long term parking. He agreed--values my opinion yet I'm not good enough to want to stay married to <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" />

Next, we played with our son--the three of us. Our son cried non-stop when H said he had to leave for work <img border="0" alt="[Teary]" title="" src="graemlins/teary.gif" /> . H asked why he was doing this <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="images/icons/mad.gif" /> and I said because he loves it when we are with him together--he can tell the difference and he knows H isn't around like if everything was good. I proceeded to tell him that our son deserves us as a family and that we miss him and that I love him, to have a goodnight at work and to be safe and that our love is here for him. He said okay, nodded his head etc. He may be just doing all that to appease me instead of answering with I'm done because he knows that gets me fighting--sometimes I feel he just says okay so that there will be no arguement.

So my strategy before he leaves Wednesday is to be happy as a family when he is around and leave him with pleasant thoughts before he heads of with our son to see his family.

I guess the worst that can happen is that he tells his family that he is done which he has been telling me since he moved back out at the end of January--but no D or D papers yet and not acting as if getting a D. Even if he tells them doesn't necessarily mean he is done.

I guess that I'm resigned to the fact that if he tells them he is done then I will just give up-or I really should as a last effort so I know that I did everything in my power to save my marriage and keep my family together for my son and myself do PB--have nothing to lose by PB-either he comes back and it works or you have moved forward to proceed on your own and with the D as KTbunch states.

I have to keep reminding myself that God will see me through this and to trust God--sometimes I think this is a test by God because I have never been one of much faith and did not attend church growing up except for holidays--so maybe God is trying to tell me to let him take care of things--sometimes I think that I'm trying to hard and if I would just let it be- that it will take care of itself. So like I said maybe if I put my faith into God I wouldn't still be here with H on fence maybe I would be past that and on the road to rebuilding M.

I will tell you that I have come to believe that God definetly made me capable of forgiveness and he made a very strong women and that their is a reason I have endured all these things in my life that others haven't--that has kept me going lately--I use to alway ask why me, why can't I just have a normal life like every other person and now after joining this site I wonder how many others really are normal or not as they may not be what they appear to be which reminds me of AD's post about Do You Ever Wonder?? Yah all the time and at least I know I'm not alone--when I first found out about OW being pregnant I thought this can't happen to anyone else, it can't be common and of course it would happen to me and I'm in a lifetime movie or soap opera.

Well I'm rambling now so it is time to go.

Want an update on you guys tomorrow--Sunnydale, BBYG, JT2, KrisM, and AD

Also Ktbunch of you read this I'm anxious to hear about you counseling session with H and OW about OC.

I will say big prayer for all of us tonight--and hope God will give us each more strenght to endure this until we achieve our goal of rebuilding a marriage and keeping a family together as that is best I believe.

Kris,
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> It is just so frustrating because I want what is best for H, what God intended for us, and he continually chooses the path of temptation and sin. I feel totally helpless to stop H from ruining not only his life, but ours. I am helpless - God will do his best to stop this all from happening. The sad thing is that God gave us all a freewill to choose our path in life, and H is making all the wrong choices right now. I pray that God will open his eyes soon before it is all beyond repair. <hr /></blockquote>That is my prayer also. I know the frustration you feel, it is like watching someone you love so deeply tear their life apart & you try to help them stop but they won't let you or listen to what you have to say, or even believe you care so much after what they have done to you. My H is a christian, raised in the chuch the whole 9, I know he is being deceived & blinded by demonic spirits - OW & his mummy too I believe. He has gone to church the last 2 Sundays, not w/ me but at this point any house of God is a good thing. His behavior has not changed yet of course, I feel impatient as I have been going thru this almost 2 yrs. now, I hate to have endured all this only to give up too soon, God's time is not like our time, yet I am afraid to hope this can still turn around, maybe I am living in denial, one day I want him gone a couple of days later I don't, I feel like I have some fight left in me. Kris I wish I could tell you it is gonna get better real soon but only God knows if & when he will turn our H's around.

Albany - Like I said only you know when you are ready to PB, don't make the choice out of anger, try to keep doing PA & maybe a little of the 180's until you feel like you see no change so it is time to move on. YOU will know when you have had enough.

Sunny how r u doing?

albany~

If/when you go to Plan B, you MUST write him a Plan B letter. It is in NO way clingy. You will in essence be laying down the law. The letter is an essential part of going NC.

Don't forewarn him or in any way threaten that you may go NC...look where that got you when you mentioned it this weekend? He threatened, (once again), to be done...yeah right, where have I heard that before?!? <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

albany, you need to call his bluff. Give him a taste of "done". I'm not sure how much more you can and should take of his indecisiveness. Plan B will give him a cause to once and for all make up his mind. Like BG suggested, for good or bad, you will have answers, no longer on the roller coaster. You will either move forward with him or without him, but you WILL move forward. Not only are you on a roller coaster, but it's going in circles, over and over and over again....

Before you write a letter, you will have to have a plan in place. You're already one step ahead with him living elsewhere. With your child involved, it's a little more complicated to figure out all the logistics of NC, but it CAN be accomplished. You only need the determination and the will to have your marriage restored.

Hope you are well.

PS. I believe I put an outline of a Plan B letter somewhere on this thread, a few pages back. Also, reading over on GQ will be invaluable...lots of people with first hand Plan B experience.

[ May 18, 2004, 09:50 AM: Message edited by: autumnday ]

Well of course he called at 6:40am this morning once he was home from work. Called to say he would transfer money today yet we dicussed that and reached that conclusion yesterday before he went to work. Then he told me he tired--long, busy night at work and asked how our son was doing.

I said okay and I said he really misses you being here an we nboth love you and he said I know--he chatted more about work and I told him I cleaned his saddle and needed to go so I could finish getting ready for work and he said okay I will see you tonight on my way too work.

What a surprise that he called--NOT <img border="0" title="" alt="[Roll Eyes]" src="images/icons/rolleyes.gif" />

He actually seemed happy and I think it will be good for him to go be visit his family--both sisters live their-1 D and re-married other D twice and not re-married but with a good guy, and his brother is married. My H is the baby of the family. His brother will definetly not be pleased if he finds out H isn't living at home again--he thinks H has best thing he has ever had--anyway I'm feeling positive and I'm ready for PB yet and really think that I can at least accomplish sending H off with a good PA again and that I feel is important.