I have found out that the affair is no longer going on. I am ready to learn how to meet her emotional needs and give her the affection she deserves. The only problem is she.still doesn't want anything to do with me. She still doesn't want to talk to me or allow me to touch her. What can I do to get her to implement plan a so that I can show her that I can give her the emotional needs she wants.

The first thing that has to happen after an affair is that she must give you all information about the affair and open up her life to you to ensure the affair is over. Has she given you full access to her phone? Do you know everything about the OM? Is he married, and if so, have you discussed the affair with his wife?

The affair has to be dragged out into the light and killed before you can recover.

That is the first step in earning your forgiveness.

Set her down and explain to her that you want to have a romantic, loving, SAFE marriage and that you won�t stay in a loveless marriage. Tell her you are willing to give her an opportunity to earn your forgiveness. In order for the marriage to recover, certain things have to happen. This is what it will take to keep you interested:

1. end all contact with the OM for life

2. no more nights apart or going out without each other - create a healthy, integrated lifestyle

3. complete transparency - cell phone passwords, etc

4. no more opposite sex friendships

5. complete honesty about her affair<s> � passing a polygraph

6. commit to the Marriage Builders program for recovery as outlined in the book Surviving an Affair.

Tell her "this is what it will take to keep me in this marriage." Whether your marriage ends up with success or failure will depend almost entirely on her willingness and ability to make radical changes. Her lifestyle must become absolutely transparent, holding nothing back. She is in no position to negotiate when it comes to extraordinary precautions, because those precautions are designed to prevent another affair and help you feel safe. She must also meet your emotional needs in a way that until now she has failed. Unless she makes a 180 degree turn in her approach to what it means to be a wife, your marriage won't recover, it will be a crippled version of your pre-affair marriage.

You have nothing to lose and everything to gain by taking this approach, because if she won't do these things, you will have lost nothing except a loveless, abusive marriage.

Unless you use this program to create a much better marriage than the one you had before the affair, you are likely looking at repeat affairs. So don't even think you can get away with sweeping the affair under the rug and going back to what you had before. What you had before led to the affair!

That is the problem, some of the problem is me which is what led her to the affair. Now I'm willing to change to meet her emotional needs but she will not let me. It has only been a couple of weeks and she thinks it is not working. She thinks that she is not falling back in love with me and that nothing will change that. The only problem is she hasn't allowed me to do the things I think I need to do to get her to.fall back in love with me or has she tried to help me understand what I need to do. She just keeps telling nothing is going to change. I believe in my heart I can get her to change if I can figure out how to get her to allow me to do so. I have already admitted that some of the problems with the marriage is my fault plus I have already forgiven her for the affair but she still thinks nothing will change it. I am currently reading His Needs, Her Needs and I think it could help if she would allow me to do the things discussed in the book. So confused right now.

What exactly are these things that you think you need to do to get her to fall back in love with you? Why do you think she fell out of love with you in the first place?

I'm just curious what you think on this, because I'm pretty sure I know what everyone else thinks.

Have you actually read Plan A?

You need to stick with one thread, Totally.

Here's his original thread:

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2608661#Post2608661

You are putting the.cart before the horse. Did you read my post?

Melody- if you read his earler thread- I believe his wife is still an active wayward. I think he needs to find proof.

She has told me that she doesn't love me. I feel like I need to have intimate conversations with her and find out what affections of love she most desires like the book His Needs, Her Needs explains. The problem is she will not allow me to. I know most people believe she is still having an affair but I have know way to prove it with any of the resources pointed out here. She told me tonight that her feelings for me haven't changed but it has only been a couple of weeks. I believe things are not going to change in a couple of weeks. Am I wrong.

That is the problem if I tell I'm not going to stay in a lifeless marriage then she is going to leave me because at the moment that is what she wants. I am trying to prevent that by getting her to forget about the past and fall in love with me again. That is where I am stuck. She doesn't think it is possible.

If she won't work on the marriage, then you have nothing to lose and she SHOULD LEAVE because her failure to work on the marriage will lead to divorce. Let her know this will lead to divorce and that you won't stay in a loveless marriage. She needs to be working on earning your forgiveness and you should be holding her accountable.

She won't be motivated to work on the marriage unless and until you hold her accountable. As it is now, she is just living down to your conditions because she knows you are not serious. How can she take you serious if you are not serious?

She WON'T fall in love with you again unless you a) get rid of the OM and b) do the things necessary to fall in love. If she won't do the things I listed, she won't fall in love.

That is what I am afraid of. She is he only person I have dated and been with my whole life. I just don't want to lose her to something I know I can fix about myself.

My friend, you have already lost her. You just don't seem to understand that. If you want to save your marriage, you are going to have to man up and do something to lead your marriage out of the ditch. Right now you are leaving your marriage in the hands of drunken wayward. And you have lost your marriage doing so. If you want to save it, you are going to have to do something different.

Am I wrong to think this is going to take more than a few weeks.

*IF* you get her on board. If not, then a million weeks won't make a difference. There has to be a committment to a plan in order for anything to change. Not having a plan is a plan to fail.

How much space do you give them at the beginning to keep from pushing them further away from you. I think she is confused at the moment and doesn't know what to do. I just don't want to smother her and make her give up all together.

Tc, space will make the situation worse, not better. "space" is certainly not part of the plan. The plan calls for at least 20 hours per week of undivided attention time. I would plan out 20 hours per week together. She is confused because you are not guiding her out of the fog. Going along with her plan will leave your marriage in the ditch, so go show her YOUR PLAN.

TC- you also need to make sure the affair is over and exposed. I don't think it is.

I found out yesterday that my wife texted a high school friend for three hours yesterday. I don't know what the conversation was about and really not sure how to find out. I know if she was trust worthy she would tell me if I asked but I don't think that is going to happen at this point.

This will continue to happen while she is wayward.

What snooping techniques do you have in place?

You need to expose this affair. It will help kill the affair, but you need to know what you're dealing with.

You will continue to see and feel hurtful things until you follow a plan. Carrot and Stick of Plan A

None at the moment because she doesn't use the main computer anymore and I can't get access to her phone. And right now with my schedule at work I don't have the ability to follow her. May get a chance today if I can get off early.

Can you afford a PI? A friend of yours to follow her?

How about getting a VAR and put it in the house and her car? GPS her car?

Alright guys planned I guess backfired. I left work early and went by the ymca where I thought my wife was going running. She was not there so I guess ya'll know what ran through my mind. So I went by where she works and didn't see the van there either. Let me mention this that right before I did the snooping I found out that the guy she texted for three hours texted her right before she got off work and was suppose to go running. So needless to say my mind went racing so after not seeing the van at the school were she works I stopped on the side of the road because I was going to try and find the address of the guy so I could go there. About that time she passed by me. Well to put a long story short I now have moved out of the house because she said she was going to move into an apartment but I would have to pay the house payment on my own which I cannot do on my salary. So to keep from losing the house and displacing my kids from the only home they know I agreed to move out. However I did have her agree to go see her counselor this Thursday and then after that we would go see a marriage counselor. I feel this is the right path for me and still follow some of the plans in place here.

You need to go right back home. If your wife moves out she can't just stop paying the bills. She would have to continue paying the mortgage. If you want to save your marriage, you need to go home and tell HER she can leave but will have to continue paying the mortgage and can't take family money to finance her apt.

You have made a terrible mistake by leaving and abandoning your family. Most judges will give you HELL for running and leaving your family like that. Especially in their time of NEED. Courts FROWN on abandonment!


Going to a "counselor" is a complete waste of time while she is an affair and will not compensate for the damage you caused by leaving.

You need to STOP making mistakes and GO HOME. Read this: Men, do not leave your home!

Right now I have to go with my gut feeling and say the affair is over with. I honestly don't believe she would be willing to go to counseling if it wasn't. I might be wrong or I might be right. I just know I was somewhat headed in the right direcrion until I snooped to much. Will I quit trying to save my marriage, no I will nor but somehow I have to convince her that we can gain the trust back that we once had. The trust that we both have lost because of my snooping and her affair. I think I need to go about saving my marriage in a different way using some of the principles I have learned here and read in the books. I am just going to have to put my trust into the lord and pray that she is not still having the affair and that she will come around and work on the marriage after we go to counseling together.

Instead of having hope, how about having a Plan?

Have you read this by Dr. Harley abuot snooping? Snooping in a Marriage

What's wrong with following Plan A? You need to follow both the carrot and stick.

Did you move back in your house?

Many waywards agree to counseling while they are still active in an affair. Have you read the false recovery thread?

Trust but verify!!! I'm wondering what your WW has even done to earn your trust? NOTHING.

My friend we are trying to help you have a wonderful marriage.

I know ya'll are trying to help and I appreciate it but it just seems like everything is falling apart. I know I need to move back in that is why I came up with the plan that we both go to counseling together maybe there I can get her to admit that the affair is still going on since I can't find no proof that it is yet. This is my plan for the next couple weeks at least.

t2c, you are making terrible strategic mistakes that are going to destroy your marriage for no good reason. Snooping can only harm your marriage if your spouse has something to hide. And apparently she does. People who have nothing to hide, don't hide. Your wife is in an affair and that is why she doesn't want you snooping. Now she has tricked you into leaving the house so she can carry on her affair in peace and quiet. right in your own home!!

So, until you WAKE UP out of your fog and get yourself HOME and continue snooping, this is hopeless. Your tactics have only made it easier for them to carry on the affair. IN YOUR HOME!!

And IF she does go to counseling, she will only go so she can "I tried" when she kicks you to the curb for the OM. Counseling is useless when one spouse is in an affair.

That is a bad plan. The longer you are out of your home, the harder it will be to get back in. She isnt' going to admit her affair in counseling anymore than she is going to admit it to you. She isn't going to admit it. You have to FIND IT OUT on your own.

You only think things are falling apart because your goal is to avoid your wife's anger at ALL COST and ours is to save your marriage. They are entirely different goals. Your wife is upset because you are close to catching her cheat. That is all that happened here. The solution is to get home and do a better job of snooping. Put a GPS on her car, a VAR under her drivers seat and bust her.

You don't know what you are doing and only trying to avoid conflict. At the expense of your marriage. If you run and abandon your family every time she says BOO, you have already lost.

Go HOME. And do a better job of snooping next time. Hire a PI or do something that is more effective.

Man up and move back home. Act like a man leading the household, not running away.

DO NOT LEAVE THE MARITAL HOME, I guarantee that is the advice you will get from any attorney as well.

I remember my ex telling me at one point, why dont you man up and move out, I said, I am manning up and fighting for my family

I agree will all above, snooping does not destroy trust with people who have nothing to hide.

Sorry for the 2X4.

here

MelodyLane did your spouse keep telling it was over and that the trust could never be built back to where it needed to be. How long did it take for your spouse to love you again. I know every situation is different but I would just like a general idea.

When you leave the marital home, you have given her a ticket to tell everyone that you've abandoned your family and her kids, but that this amazing OM has swooped in to take care of what you left. Do you understand how badly this hurts you? It doesn't matter what she says at this point - you NEED to stand your ground as a father because right now she's shopping for a replacement for YOUR children.

No, I told him it was over and it took about 2 years for me to fall in love with him again. If your wife works really hard she can restore your love and earn your forgivness. But you will never have that chance if you abandon your family. You have to go home if she is to have a chance at earning your forgiveness. Running away won't help your marriage. Moving out only serves to facilitate her affair and greatly increases your chance of divorce.

Also, judges will give you hell for abandoning your family. That is a strategic mistake that you need to correct!

Many WS do say "it is over" when their BS interferes with the affair but that all changes when the affair is killed. For example, when you cut a drunk off at the bar, he makes crazy threats like that too, but you wouldn't take it seriously would you? Just because your wife says "it is over" doesn't mean it is. Obviously you are still married, aren't you?

The "trust" part is patently retarded so I wouldn't respond to that. Obviously, she is the one who can't be trusted. It is untrustworthy to cheat, it is not untrustworthy to CATCH her cheating. When she says stupid things like that, try not to laugh.

You have surrendered your wife and your children to the OM without a fight. Are you french?

You have told your wife "it is over" by moving out. The OM didn't have to fire a single shot and you just surrendered. You just showed your wife that you aren't willing to fight for your marriage.

Your complacent approach reflects a lack of caring.

I will never again drink coke while reading one of your posts. You owe me a new keyboard and monitor.

you deserve it for drinking Coke, you dawg!!

Ahhh, I forgot that you're a (blech) Pepsi freakazoid!

Totally,

"Am I wrong to think this is going to take more than a few weeks."

I guess you have not read or studied very much of MB. 'A few weeks'? There is no quick or convenient 'fix' to recovering a M after infidelity. You better be prepared to act on the advice being given to you here and also be prepared to 'go the distance' for up to a couple of years if you wish to recover your M. Since you don't seem to be convinced regarding the advice you are being given here it would be worth your while to have a phone consult with the Harley's. I say this because, like some BH's who post here, you have no plan and are not taking any postive action. Going with your 'gut feeling that the affair is ended' is Not a plan and you are floundering now. Wives do not respect a H who flounders at a critical time, even tho painful, and allows the M to 'fall apart'. That is why you need to cease the whining and pay attention to the advice you are being given and consider the phone counseling. Your wife is not going to fall back in love with you, whether or not she stays with her OM, unless you exercise leadership. Have you even thought thoroughly about gathering evidence (snooping), exposure, learning about Plan A?? So, stop whining and get galloping!

Best,

Tom

MelodyLane how long into the healing process did your spouse allow you to touch them by hugging and kissing and then complete intimacy.

Your wife won't allow you to touch her for 2 reasons: a) she is having an affair and b) she is repulsed because you allow her to treat you like dirt. Women do not love men they can't respect and they do not respect men they can run over.

If my spouse had ever not "allowed" me to touch him, he would have been shown the door.

Your wife is not "healing", she is having an affair.

My wife goes to see he counselor today although last night I think I found one of her emotional needs that Dr Harley talks about. I believe one of her biggest needs is admiration. I began to give her compliments last night about her teaching ability, coaching ability and her ability to figure out the budget. She responded really well to all of this or at least in my opinion she did.

OH MY GOSH!!!!


ARRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!


* I feel better. This thread is making me want to scream.*

Totally - please do something, anything - that is on the list of things you have been told to do to END THE AFFAIR.

I felt the same way, RidicSit, and have stepped away. He has surrendered his family to the OM. Nothing we can do to help because this is hopeless.

My god are ya'll ever going to believe me if I come on and say that the affair is over with. Ya'll just don't think situations can be different than yours. I haven't proved anything yet but until I do I believe her and will to continue to try to save my marriage by using the techniques in the book His Needs, Her Needs. Ya'll can step away if you want to it doesn't bother me.

You can't blame people for not believing it - you yourself have posted numerous oddities/discrepancies in her behaviour in the last few days and if I remember correctly, you aren't even living with her anymore (did you move back in?), so it's only natural that people think she's following the very typical behaviour of continuing her affair. You've left the house - how is that going to encourage her to NOT seek her OM or another man? I mean that in all seriousness? Women don't need "space" to think.

Yes, I am stepping away. Someone who is in denial can't be helped.

I understand what ya'll are saying but until I can prove it I can only go on what is being told to me. And there can be situations where things seem like an affair but are not. Situations can be different. I mean you wouldn't treat cancer the same way you treat a heart attack.

Who is more qualified to diagnose the knocking sound in your engine before the hood is opened? The haidresser or the master mechanic who works on engines every day and has for years and years? The hairdresser has no experience fixing engines but the master mechanic has plenty of experience. Guess which one you are?

AS you said yourself, you don't KNOW what is going on and are choosing to believe your untrustworthy wife who has a demonstrated history of lying to you. You are only doing so not based on any known facts, but because of a foolish DESIRE to believe her.

You have an emotional investment to believe her lies. We don't. We not only have an objective view that you don't have, but we are the master mechanic who listens to engines every day. You are the hairdresser.

Someone who behaves like that is in denial and can't be helped. I hope for your sake that you do some investigating and the evidence of the affair will wake you up.

T2T.,

Red alert, red alert.

You're about to lose one of the best MB professors.
You might want to start listening or you're going to lose your marriage.
Is that what you want? Your marriage to end? They have a thing for that it's called divorce.

I understand what she is saying but until I can prove it. All I can do is keep trying to investigate to try and find out. But until then I think I need to keep trying to repair the relationship. What is the best place to get a miniature camera from to put like in a air vent so she can't see it.

Radioshack or shop online.

Have you checked out operation investigate forum?

So you're doing carrot and stick of Plan A?

I would love to get spyware on her phone but can't get a hold of it long enough to put one on there. Refresh me on what carrot and stick of plan a is.

Pep's Carrot and Stick of Plan A

Thank you BrainHurts. That basically sums up what I am trying to do until I can prove the affair is still going on. I am trying to save the marriage while in the process of finding out if the affair is still going on. That post really helped.

Totally,

You have lost all of the vets here who could help you. You're not even near to first base in terms of saving your marriage. You just seem to be a whining, begging little guy in denial! There is no woman, inculding your W who is going to give you respect, much less any men! I honestly do not think you care about your M. Have a nice future!

Tom

Should I use a Christian marriage counselor or should I first find out how they handle the counseling first.

I would contact the MB coaching center. Can you afford some sessions with a MB coach?

I don't think I can that is why I was looking at the Christian counselor my preacher recommended.

Then I would find out if the counselor knows anything about MB and is pro MB or at least knows of Dr. Harley's works.

Couselling with Steve Harley is your fastest horse. If you absolutely can't, here's an article by Dr. Harley to help you know what to look for in a marriage counselor. Read it carefully - there are a lot of lousy MCs out there who couldn't even save their own marriage. Being a Christian counselor doesn't mean they're an effective counselor, it just means they're of the Christian faith and will possibly have some biblical knowledge of historical marriage tenets.

Check this out: How To Find a Good Marriage Counselor

Wow watching this thread is like watching a plane crash ready to happen. Everyone knows it is coming but the pilot. You totally2confused are the pilot that can't see what is going to happen.

We have been where you are. Now I am going to tell you a secret. It is an important one to remember. People that have affairs LIE. You can tell they are lying by the way they move their lips or write things to you.


Let me tell you about my ex-wife. She was sleeping with another dude. I had told her I would divorce her if she ever slept with another man. She told me the same thing if I ever cheated she would divorce me.

So I started to catch on and started snooping. I got her emails and texts with spyware. I even had video of her with the OM in my home when I was traveling. She even called the guy from my home on our land line and so I had a ton of evidence.

When I confronted her she denied everything. I showed her the emails and she said "We knew you were suspecting us so we sent these to catch you spying on me".

I played for her some of their conversations and she said "I knew you were recording it. We did this to catch you spying". My Ex lied about everything. Since she was having an affair it was easy for her to lie. In her phone conversations she told him she loved him. Wanted to be with him. Did not want to be with me anymore. I believed her after reading the emails and listening to it.

She still said she was not having an affair. It was all in my head and she was mad at me. Sound familiar yet??

So the worst thing was I knew she was meeting him in my home. I put a video camera in my room when I left. I did it so I would never have to listen to another lie every again. The video showed her having sex with the guy in my bed. She had done that quite often. The only thing worse than seeing this would have been walking in on them at the time. Needless to say I had it.

You are not going to keep your wife by being a doormat. I will let the others address that but living in denial will not get her back.

You do not have to believe her. You should not believe her until she becomes an honest person again.

Just so you know when my Ex saw the video she could not deny anything anymore. Up until then she treated me like crap but when she knew that I knew and the jig was up and she could not lie it changed everything.

You will not get your wife back by sticking your head in the sand. Your wife knows she can have you back any time she wants. She is in no hurry why should she be? She can do whatever she wants and you will beg her to stay. She has no incentive to do the right thing and better yet she can tell you she is not cheating and that makes it true.

You need to get a clue. I am not saying this to be mean just a reality check. These people have been through this and they will all tell you the same thing.

People that will cheat on their spouse will most certainly lie to them. That is a fact. Your wife is a cheater and a liar. You need to deal with her in those terms if you want her back.

I think it is time to let the cat out of the bag. My ww sent me letter tonight telling me she couldn't trust me because I followed her. She said it was over and the only reason she was going to the counselor was to get closure and to learn how to parent our kids. Does anybody here that I hadn't made mad because of my ignorant thoughts think this marriage can be saved. I'm really hurting tonight to the point that I am having some bad thoughts run through my head.

totally,

No one here could possibly predict or advise you what is going to happen with your M! You are the one married to Her, so you are the one who is going to have to take action and make a decision.

Your short responses indicate to me that you are not 'all in' with respect to your M or turely in love with you W.

You may want to consider, instead of constant whining, to consult with Dr. Harley.

If having 'bad thoughts' means a suicide attempt or violence toward others, then contact your local Hotline.

So, again, good luck,

Tom

Please contact a hotline if you feel like you are going to hurt yourself or anyone else. Nothing is worth that.

Now that you're ready to "let the cat out of the bag" how about making a plan. Go grab a writing pad and go back to the beginning of all your posts. Start taking notes on all the excellent advice you've already been given. Make a plan of action and a vow to follow through irregardless of your feelings and instinct. Most MB advice is counter-intuitive and not normally what you would do. That's okay. What do you have to lose that you haven't already lost trying to do it your way?

Come back here tomorrow and post your plan. Buckle up and prepare for battle. Your wife wants a husband who will fight for her. Fight smart.

Try to get a good night's sleep. It will help your focus. This is not over until the judge bangs the gavel.

totally,

Am up later than I normally am, and felt maybe my last post was a little harsh. Princessmeggy's advice is good - review your thread to possibly gain some insight to the adcice being given and a sound sleep. I will make a point to say a prayer for you tonight before sleep.

Tom

Does anybody know of a good plan or a good way to get this started. I'm tired of feeling like the bad guy here. My parents and my preacher are the only one's that know about the affair but I think it is time for her parents to know.

t2c,
You have been giving a plan, but you won't follow it. You were told to expose to all of your family, her family, your children and OM's W.

Did you move back into your home?

Let's try this again. Exposure 101
Exposure by Dr. Harley
Pep's Carrot and Stick of Plan A

Here's your plan.
1. Move back in your home
2. Expose this on facebook and to everyone you know
3. Pep's Carrot and Stick of Plan A
4. Give the carrot and stick of Plan A
5. Get to your doctor and get some AD's
6. Respond and answer to ALL the posts you receive with questions or clarity to what they are directing you

I would re-read your thread. We gave you a plan.

I want to think everybody here for their help. It is now time to start the plan. I have found a counselor that knows about this website and Dr. Harley. My first appointment is April 16th. Hopefully this will help along with the plan. I would like to thank MelodyLane for her patience with my ignorance. I just want to say I sorry for it taking me this long to open my eyes.

Why have you waited? April 16th?? GO HOME. TODAY. NOW.

All right I have been doing all the snooping that I can do. Been driving by the house when she least expects it but still haven't been able to turn up anything. Just wondering how do I go about starting plan a when she don't want to. Also do I go ahead and try to get her to follow the principles of joint agreement and to get her to be open and honest.

Are you still not back home?

Your right brainhurts. I'm trying to use this time to try and catch her if she is still having and affair. I'm hoping she will do something in the house and not know that I am driving by. Also I am using this time to try to come up with an effective plan of action. But don't worry brainhurts I plan on moving back in if she doesn't show any signs of wanting to get back together after our visit with the counselor.

Alright I think I have proof that she is at least having an emotional affair. I have text records that show she talked to this guy from 11 pm to 12 am last night and she normally does not stay up that late. I just need to figure out what those texts are saying. Anybody know a keylogger that can be installed remotely with having to have her phone.

Alright MelodyLane I need your help for real this time. I believe without a shadow of doubt that my ww is at least having an emotional affair with this guy. She has been texted him for the past two nights for two and three hours straight even past her normal time she goes to bed. I believe in all my heart that this is the reason she will not give me a chance. I'm ready to give her my plan but I don't want to come off sounding demanding or do I need to sound demanding at this point. My plan is.

1. Tell me who the other man is and end all contact with him.

2. Plan 15 to 20 hours a week to work on marriage and to meet each other emotional needs.

3. Be open and honest about everything.

4. To follow Dr. Harley's plan to the tee and to read his books.

I hope this is a good plan if not please help. Right now this is all I could think of.

Like I said before right now I do believe she is at least having an emotional affair I haven't been able to prove the physical affair yet.

An emotional affair is an affair. You need to expose it and NOT give her a chance to let it go physical (if it hasn't already). Exposure 101

You need to be back home and be in Plan A.

All the rest will come if and when she is ready to go into recovery.

Carrot and Stick of Plan A

tc, don't give her any plan at all, because she won't accept it. She will just accuse you of spying on her and go further underground.

You need to a) go home and b) snoop and find out who the OM is and what is going on.

Don't go off half cocked until you have all the goods. Now is not the time to present any plan TO HER. Find out who, what and where. And get back home!

I know the who, I just haven't been able to figure out the what and where. I know the guy because he put his telephone number on Facebook and all I had to do was match them up to what was on my cell phone bill. That was the easy part. Finding the what and where is going to be the hard part.

What is your evidence so far? Is this guy married? How do you think she met him? Have your kids met him?

MelodyLane, he is not married and she knows him from highschool. I'm not sure if my kids have met him yet. As far as evidence all I have is a list of text messages she has sent him. It is just a list of the times she texted and what day she texted him on. She has been Texting really late at night for about two to three hours at a time. One time was from ten oclock at night to just past midnight. She is normally in bed by this time. This is all the evidence that I have because I don't want to install anything on her phone that could get me in legal trouble.

Tc, you won't get into legal trouble if she doesn't know. You have to get evidence if you are going to make any headway here. And every day you are out of the house weakens your position more and more.

Is there a legitimate reason why you have done that?

I moved out of the house because she was going to get an apartment and I would have to pay for the house. I don't make enough to pay for the house myself so instead of.possibly uprooting the only home my boys know I move out. But I'm to the point I really don't care for the house anymore. Should I expose the affair she has already admitted to. I have a written letter that she wrote to me saying she had the affair.

I would move back home and THEN expose the affair. If she wants to move out, she will still have to pay her part of the mortgage. And she can't take your kids from their home without a court order. Go home and let her know she can pay for the house AND the apartment if she wants! You won't stop her.

Then after you move back into your bedroom, expose the affair wife and far. However, try and find out right away who the guy is because you will need to expose to his whole family. He may be married and his wife would be interested in knowing.

I plan on moving back home. I didn't know she would have to pay both. That is news to me. I just need to unravel the mystery about the affair which would be the reason why she doesn't want to give the marriage a chance.

You are right about the reasons why she doesn't want to give the marriage a chance. But you need to get home if you plan on busting up this affair and saving your marriage. Can you go home now? It needs to be done with no warning.

Right now I'm working third shift. I will go home as soon as possible. Should I go ahead an expose the affair she has already told me about. I have a written note from her telling me she had the affair. I just don't know who the guy was. It could possibly be the same guy she is talking to now. I'm just tired of looking like the bad guy in this situation. I know I didn't do everything over the years to keep the love there but all this isn't my fault. I want to thank you for coming back and giving me advice again MelodyLane, it really means a lot.

Tc, You are very welcome, my friend. I am always glad to help.

I would move home and then expose. When you do it, tell people that your wife has been having an affair with XX and wants to break up your family to pursue her affair. Ask them for their help. Please carefully read the thread in my signature on how to expose.

When you go home and when you expose, just expect your wife to go ballistic and then you won't be surprised. And don't let it bother you one bit. We will help you deal with it!

Thanks MelodyLane. She went ballistic the first night I came back home the first time I moved out. She told me she was going to call the cops if I didn't leave. I stood my ground and she left. Then we talked the next day and I thought we were going on the right track but she started Texting the guy I told you about so my suspicions just grew. That is when I followed her and she caught. She said the trust coudn't be regained and said it was over. I mean if your kid does something stupid to lose your trust they will eventually earn it back from you. I really just want to ask her who she is in love with and see what kind of response I get.

Well, she is the one is doing something stupid to break your trust. I would tell her over and over again that ou would be willing to give her a opportunity to earn your trust back if she ends her affair. But you must demand she end her affair.

Have you confronted this rat yet?

I guess one more question I have is why does she so pisses off when I tell her I love her or miss her. I told her I missed her today and she told me to stop. If she has no feelings for me then why does it bother her.

She hates it because she built up this image of you being a horrible guy. It's how waywards justify their having an affair.

Very simple. The truth of your sincere declaration diminishes her fantasy just a little bit more.

It irritates her because she does not feel that way and feels like you are obliging her to respond in kind.

Should I stop while I am in the process of exposing the affair or continue showing her my love for her.

No, continuing to fill her ENs is a part of the "carrot and stick" of Plan A. Exposure is part of the stick and filling ENs is part of the carrot.

tc, I would focus on getting home and exposing the affair. She already knows you love her.

ML, you said something about confronting the rat. I would assume you are talking about the OM. If so how would I go about doing that. I mean I'm about 90% sure he is the guy she is at least having an emotional affair with. She texted him for about an hour last night until 9:30 and then he was the first person she texted this morning.

I would find that POS after you move back in and tell him that hell is coming his way. Tell him that if this goes to divorce you will have him hauled into court.

Have you moved home and exposed the affair?

ITA with ML about telling him that if it goes to divorce, you'll have him in court. OMs are a cowardly bunch and don't like sunlight of that variety.

Not yet ML. I'm still working third shift also I'm trying to get all my ducks in a row so hat I will be ready for when she storms off and moves out if it comes to that. Right now I'm writing the exposure emails so they will be ready to go out. Also I'm trying to gather all the information that I will need by reading your posts and rereading mine. But don't worry D-Day for her(as I like to call it) is coming.

Hello totally,

You're position is in your home and I do not understand how you are going to be able to effectively carry out any kind of plan you are imagining by being out or your marital home! It seems you are too bent on 'catching her' and not directing your anger and efforts at killing the A. Your 'drive by's' your home to catch her are immature and a waste of time. What the hell would you really do if you saw his car there or had other evidence that he is there with her? How are you going to explain to your young kids why you are absent from your family?? How can you possibly meet her EN's or monitor her when you have abdicated your family home?

Sorry Melody, etc. etc., I do realize this guy is a well-intending H and a sensitive guy, but right now he needs a good Vince Lonbardi a#s kick to get home like NOW and reasuume his role as H and father!

Take charge totally,

Tom

Tom you are exactly right. I probably do need that kick. Trust me in saying that I am going home and will expose the one affair that I know she had. The one that she admitted to. The one that is going on right now I'm not sure about but an affair is the only reason that pops in my head since she texted this guy at 12 midnight.

Do you have the exposure letters ready?

Exposure Letters Samples

I am going to write it when I get off work in the morning using the samples in the link. This has been the most painful thing I have gone through in my life and just talking to everybody on this site has help out tremendously.

We know (((( totally2confused)))) we've all been there.

Dr. H talks on the radio show that he has counseled betrayed spouses that tell him that an affair is more painful than the loss of a child

I just pray this works. She can be real stubborn sometimes. I guess the bright side will be at least I want look like the bad guy to everybody that doesn't know the truth and I think overall that will make me feel somewhat better.

Yes it will make you feel better because you are telling the truth about her affairs not to "wrong" her but to help her. When someone is doing wrong they don't want the light to shine on them they want to hide in the dark.

Read this Dr. Harley on Exposure

Please listen to these radio clips from Dr. Harley tells a BH to expose and he is scared to do so. WW is having an EA.
Radio Clip on Exposure

Radio Clip on Exposure for the BH

3rd segment on Exposure from Dr. H to BH

Great posts, brainhurts!

This is my exposure letter, please let me know if there is anything I need to add, cut, or rephrase.

Dear friends and family,

I am writing you this message because you are an important person in the lives of Wife and I. As some of you know, Wife has recently told me she does not love me anymore and that our marriage was done, which has shattered my heart. To my shock, She has revealed to me that she had an affair back in June of last year. I do believe that the purpose of the separation is so that she can carry on her affair without my interference. Wife has tried to claim that her affair began because I did not give her the romance and support she needed. As of right now I believe the affair is still going on in the way of an emotional affair and I believe this is what is causing her not to give us a chance to save our marriage. I believe in my heart that we can save our marriage if she would just give us the chance to do so.

As our friends, I am asking that you use your influence with Wife to persuade her to end her affair and try to work on our marriage. Our marriage can be salvaged if she would only end the affair. Please support her in doing the right thing. Please support our marriage.

I would so appreciate your support and prayers.

Warmest regards,

Looks excellent. Do you have the name of OM? If so I would put it in the letter. To my shock, I am saddened to have discovered that the reason is because she has been carrying on an affair with an old boyfriend named xxxxx xxxxx who resides in xxxxxx.

We are here for you T2T. I know it's scary but you will feel so much better.

I don't know the name of the OM she had the affair with in June, but I do have the name of the person I suspect she is having an emotional affair with. It could possibly be the same guy from the affair in June.

tc, I worked this over a bit and deleted the ambiguity. Her affair is with the same guy, I assure you. And it is VERY unlikely it is just an EA. Women don't kick out their husbands over an EA. Even so, an EA is worse than a PA, but you don't need to get into that hair splitting debate with bystanders. Just keep it clean, simple and straightfoward with no ambiguity.

Do you have info on the OM so you can blow up his world too? His mother might want to know he is having an affair with a married woman!

I don't know the mother of the OM but his sister is friends with him on facebook. This is what he wrote about himself on Facebook.

"I'm a man who has had his shares of ups and downs.God has truly opened my eyes to the things in life that truly matter. I am a man who loves his family. I have never been married and have no kids. I hope to get blessed with a family one day, but until that day comes I will be taking care of myself and putting Jesus Christ first in my life!!!!! I love the outdoors, animals and exercising. Other than that I consider myself a good man with a big heart!!"

Makes me sick....

I would copy and paste all of his contacts into a word doc for safekeeping. Can you find his mother on the sisters page?

I just ran into a problem MelodyLane. I was doing some snooping on the page of the alleged OM. Come to find out he can't be the guy from the affair back in June because I just found out he was in prison for 2nd degree burglary. He didn't get out until February of this year. Now I do believe he is possibly the EA since he texted my WW at two am this morning and she answered him back and talked for eleven minutes. Then when she woke up this morning he was the first person she texted. Does this change my stratagy any?

Stop your exposure? Nope.

Do I need to reword it from what MelodyLane changed it to?

I didn't see where ML put the name in? Am I missing it?

It just means she has 2 OM. You can add that or not.

Just get it sent out? You doing this now?

Alright guys and gals it hasn't been a very good day. Spent some time with the kids while they were with her parents because she is visiting a girlfriend from college. I just couldn't be happy knowing my kids don't know what is going on and my WW thinks they will be happy with the way she is doing things. I just don't know if I could ever be happy knowing there is a possibility that I will have to watch my kids grow up in pictures. It has just been a very rough day not to mention I haven't gotten much sleep over the past few days.

t2c, how is the plan coming along? The longer you are out the harder this is going to be to save. What exactly are you waiting for?

MelodyLane, did you read my earlier post where I found out the guy she is talking with now cannot be the guy she had the affair with back in June. I was doing some snooping through the guy she is talking with now Facebook page and found out he.didn't get out of jail until February. I then did some more snooping and found out he was in jail from 2010 to 2012 for 2nd degree burglary. Do I need to reword.the exposure letter that you fixed in light of this new discovery.

Yes, just reword it to say she is having an affair with this guy. When will you be moving home?

I will be moving home Monday since I am off. I want to be prepared in case she tries to take the kids. This will also be the day I send out all the letters. My parents already know but I am going to send one to them so they can keep it in case I need it for court or something. She thinks I'm going to sit by and watch her.leave and not put up a fight. She thinks she will get the kids because of my work schedule but what she doesn't realize is that I am preparing to step down if need be to be able to win custody of my kids if it comes down to that. My kids are my everything and nobody will take that away from me no matter how bad they want to be.

Wow - get his FB friends copied into a Word doc and be ready to expose him on FB. He's trying to hold himself up as a Good Christian Man. Exposing to his FB friends will be humiliating for him.

So you move back the 16th and you expose the 16th?

Pulling for you, T2C.

Awesome! And you are prepared for her to go stark raving crazy, right?

I think I am prepare, any pointers on what to do when she goes beserk.

Don't burst out laughing! If you feel like laughing, go to the bathroom and shut the door. Just prepare yourself and don't allow yourself to get dragged into a fight. And dont give into her threats. You know she will make threats, right?

Stay calm and collected. Do not allow her to draw you into an argument. Let her know that you were wrong to leave your home and you're back to take care of your home and family. Repeat as necessary.

She'll blow. Because without you in the house she's been able to carry on her affair without having to whisper on the phone or sneak into the bathroom to talk to OM. She's been able to deceive herself that she's a swingin' single gal. Your reappearance is going to bring a dose of reality that she's not going to appreciate, poor little wayward

If you're going home at dinner-time, I would suggest that you get carryout from her favorite to-go place. Take food with you and start getting the plates ready as soon as you get there.

Be calm, be in control, be the Man of the House. Let her know that you are Home. And that you're NOT LEAVING.

[=pepperband]
Not apologizing for exposure or speaking the truth in a kind yet direct way.

Exposure makes the infidel furious

stay calm breathe

no one can stay furious forever ... being furious is exhausting ... consumes a lot of energy ... let the furious infidel fume and exhaust his/her self

YOU stay cool

You will hear:

"That's it. We are never going to stay married after what YOU did." "I am moving out now, thanks to you." "You are getting OP in trouble at home." "Now our kids will havea broken homethanksto you."

blah blah blah

You respond to all the raging comments: I am still holding out hope for our marriage.

You stay calm

You don't argue

You don't explain

You do not preach

You do not educate

~and~ you do NOT apologize forstanding up fortruth and marriageand keeping your family intact

YOU calmly re-stateyour belief thatthere is hope for the marriage....

if things get out of hand ...excuse yourself and go for a walk or a drive ...

remember ...exposuremakesthealready foggy spouse act insane ... but it is

Temporary

Funny thing is Brainhurts, she has already said some of those things. She was going to move out the second time but told me I would have to pay the mortgage by myself because she would have to pay for the apartment. I didn't realize that she would still have to pay half of the mortgage and the apartment until MelodyLane told me. I mean she wants it to be over but she hasn't filed any papers yet and our pictures are still in the house.

totally,

I am happy for you - you are doing great!

Steel yourself before your return home to deflect a great deal of reaction and abuse from her. Instead of bringing in take home, bring in a bag or two of groceries to calmly prepare a great supper. Just remember to stay calm, not engage her in anger, duck, dodge, dance and escape the 'pocket' like an Aaron Rodgers! You are reclaimning what is rightfully yours.

Best to you,

Tom

Yup that's correct. If her name is on the house she is responsible for half.

Stay strong and know you are doing the right thing.

Working 3rd shift right now and I think it has hit me like a ton of bricks. I think I can say that I am depressed. I really don't feel like being here right now. The next two days are going to be tough.

Can you get into your doctor and get some AD's? I know how difficult it is working 3rd shifts because my H and I do it ever 4 months. That alone can make you feel depressed and then add on what you're going through.

That's why Dr. H worries about peoples health when someone is going through what you are. That is why he recommends AD's if it's too much for someone.

You will feel so much better when you move back on Monday and expose on Monday. That may help with the depression, some what.

Do you have a support system IRL?

Thanks Brainhurts, I have my parents and then a couple of people at work. I have a situation now. I sent her mom and email last just saying that I loved my wife and I wasn't going to give up. I told her mom that if she would just give the marriage a chance that I think it would work out. Also I told her that I wanted to make my wife happy and in the process keep my kids happy. I told her mom that the kids may look happy right now but the truth hasn't set in yet. I sent that email last night now my ww is back from her trip and I guess her mom is acting different or said something to her because now my ww wants to know what I said to her parents. How should I handle this?

Melodylane if your on here I need help with the situation I just posted.

Just tell her what you said. It is not a big deal at all.

Thanks ML.

Just tell her what you wrote and add on " I am fighting for my M and I will do whatever it takes.

Just tell her what you wrote to her

All right I just sent the email to ww explaining what I told her mom. Let's see what kind of response I get. I not going to argue with her since that is one of the LB. I just going to leave it at the fact that I sent the email no matter what she sends back.

Yes stay, calm and keep repeating.

"I will keep fighting for my marriage and I will do whatever it takes". You want a cookie?

Latther, rinse, repeat

This is what I sent my ww.

"I told your mom that I loved you very much and have loved you for the past 14 years. I told her that I wanted to be the man that made you happy and that I wasn't going to give up on our marriage. I am fighting for our marriage and I will do whatever it takes."

Bravo!!! Good job.

This is her response to what I sent her mom.

"Everything you are doing is pushing me farther away. Over those 14 years, I have grown. You haven't. I've out grown you."

I had to laugh a little. I mean I'm pushing her further away but she has told countless times the marriage is over. If it is over then how can I be pushing her farther away. She has grown and I haven't yet I'm the one that wants to work on the marriage and she just wants to have an affair. How grown is that. Maybe ya'll can help me decifer this message.

Hello totally,

I do not think you could express or do better than you did in your response to your W.

Tom

Well T2C, I'm glad you laughed. This is fogbabble. How to decipher... everything is your fault. Nothing is her responsibility. Typical wayward script.

Keep Plan A'ing. No expectations though. Do it for you, so you learn how to be a spouse who meets EN's and know you did everything you could to help WW pull her head from her butt.

BTW, I loved what you wrote to her. Good Plan A'ing.

Craziest things to come out of Wayward's Piehole

Fogbabble, nothing more. Just stay the course and let this lift.

Babblehorn

Hey Melodylane, did you see my ww response. I had to laugh a little at it.

Alright tomorrow is the big day for the exposure letter to go out. Right now I think my nerves are starting to get me. Wish me luck.

Good luck and good job for doing the right thing.

Try not to dwell on it, because you're doing it and you're doing the best thing to fight for your Marriage.

Be loud and proud.

Do you have your letters all written? What method are you doing? Phone calls, facebook or email?

I have it written. I will send some out by email and probably some through Facebook.

Stay strong T2C. Let us know how it goes...

Don't expect everyone to be supportive. Do it anyway, because it is the right thing to do.

She has opened her own bank account, what should I do.

Post your exposure letter so we can give you some feedback.

Read this for Facebook exposure and pointers. Facebook Exposure Letters and Pointers

I have already posted Brainhurts. I think it is a couple pages back. Melodylane edited it a little bit, but I will repost when I get home.

How do you know this? Do you both still have a joint account together? If so I would transfer your money to another account and protect your finances.


WW have a tendency to take the money. So please protect you, especially since you're still out of the house.

Oh that's right. My bad.

I'm not sure at this moment that it is her account or possibly her parents or cousin since they were over at the house while she was in charleston. All I know is there is no morning missing out of our joint account. I will know for sure on the 29th when her next check is suppose to go in.

How did your exposure go?

You also moved back in today, correct?

Didn't get a chance to do it. I was so devastated from the counselor visit. She sat in there an told him she had no regrets for having the affair. She said if she could do something like that then she knew it was over. What do you do to change her mind if she had no regrets or remorse for what she done? I am really confused now.

More proof that counseling doesn't help couples recover from an affair. Ditch the counselor.

It is not uncommon for a WW to show no remorse. What you do is a stellar Plan A until the moment you Plan B her.

I know I still need to expose. That's not a problem. The problem is do I need to go from plan a to plan b now knowing what I know from the counselors visit.

Keep with plan A. STOP listening to her fog talk. You cannot let this sway you from right action. No more counseling so she can go on and on with her fog.

You've got to do the best you can to unhook from what she's saying. See her as an addict who's lost her marbles because that's exactly what she is.

If you want to get charge of this situation, you have to unhook from her babble.

EXPOSE. asap.

So what if she told the counselor didly?

All you're doing is letting her continue down her foggy path without the exposure. She will say all sorts of craziness after you expose. She says this before you expose and she will continue with her wayward talk until she is out of the fog.


Craziest things to come out of a wayward's piehole

You need to fire this counselor.

Move back home tonight.

Ignore WW fog babble.

Forget plan B, you still need to plan A.

Why have you not exposed. So get back home and expose.

How do I plan a if she moves out?

Are you back home yet?

How is the plan going? Dont' get distracted by the antics of a falling down drunk. Stick to your plan. Move home. Expose the affair. Please don't post meaningless fogbabble anymore.

p.s. and don't go to counseling anymore! Do something productive like washing your car..

Did you move back home and expose yet?

I just found out that adultery is a crime in south Carolina. It is punishable by a fine and possibly six months in jail.

Cart before the horse. Are you back home and have you exposed? Your thread is now a month on.

Well that's good to know if you file for D.

Have you moved back home and exposed?

Alright I've been doing some more snooping before sending out the exposure letter. I think I have found out who the first guy is, I just need your opinion. Last night I sent a Facebook message to the guy I had suspicion about it being and asked him why my ww stop being friends with him on Facebook and stopped Texting him a few months ago. I kept checking throughout the night to see if he answered back. He had not. I then decided to go back to his Facebook page which I had been on earlier in the day and to my surprise he had deactivated his account.I think I have found the first affair guy but I want your opinion about it.

He probably blocked you, not deactivated.

You don't ask an AP if they are the AP. you gave him warning. He will start doing damage control now.

No I checked one of his friends friends list and he isn't there anymore either. Oh well my mistake, it gave me the answer I was looking for.

Have you moved back home?

You need to expose. Did you make a copy of his friend's list? Then go and drop the exposure bomb. You gave this OM time to spin his story and hide.

You should've exposed weeks ago.

This is the first affair that she had back in June. The guy she is talking with now I have not contacted. I have the friends list of the one she is talking now. I am gathering emails now. I also now know where the guy she is talking now lives.

Exposure letter is fixing to go out. The other night was the straw that broke the camels back when she allowed me to take the kids so she could go out until one in the morning. It is time for the war for my marriage to begin and I will not tolerate terriosts to interfere. Don't get me wrong I loved having my kids. Also when should I contact the OM and tell him to leave my wife alone and stay out of my marriage.

This is silly.

Either do something, or just decide to give up.

Seriously. Your thread is a month old. It doesn't take this much time to man up and take action.

My first post here? Was on a Monday. By that very same Thursday- I had exposed wide, blew up the affair, and locked my husband out of the house in a deep Plan B.

DO SOMETHING USEFUL!

Update:

Exposure letter has been sent out, let the fireworks begin. Process of moving back in also has begun. I am ready for the fight and plan on buying a chips just so when I get home and she blows up I can offer her one.

Also saw a counselor today who it the MB way. Expose and move back home.

Good job on finally exposing. When will you be home?

Remember she'll be angry and your M can withstand her anger but not her affair.

Who all did you expose to?

Hello totally,

I had looked in on your thread the other day, and just shook my head because you had seemed like all plan and no action.

I'm glad to see that you are now becoming proactive. However, don't go home looking for a fight! That is not the purpose of exposure or MB. I think you've been out of your home long enough now that however you come back is going to create stress for her and for you. You don't need to go back like either a lion or a lamb - just matter-of-factly that you belong there. You should give her your statement of why you left and stayed away in the first place without elaborating or placing any blame. Since you have exposed her A yea you need to be prepared for her fireworks w/o reacting and without making things worse. You are a neophyte now in this so please keep that in mind, and listen to those here who will guide you.

Best of fortune,

Tom

I plan on no fighting. Brainhurts it will be either tomorrow or Thursday since tonight I don't.get off until late and I don't want her to wake the kids if she gets upset.

Brainhurts, I exposed to her family, my family, her uncle up in Pennsylvania that is like a father figure to her and to my cousins. When should I try and contact the OM or should I.

Who on OM's side did you expose to?

Radio clip on confronting the other man

When you go home just come home and say "honey I'm home and I will do whatever it takes to save this M"? Do you want a glass of milk? Make sure you are back in the marital bed. If she wants to leave then she can leave.

Do not get pulled into her drama when she does.

Alright, I just took pictures of a mystery van in my drive way of my house. Got pictures of the house, ww's van, and the mystery van in the same picture. Also got a clear picture of the license plate number. Does anyone on here know how to get in ran to find out who it belongs to.

Only if you have a cop friend, and he would be risking his job to do that for you.

Or hire a PI.

I would walk into my own house and confront him.

If it were me (and be thankful you're not me) I would've politely knocked on the door and walked in saying, "Hi honey, I'm home!"

Seriously though, don't even think about that unless you're prepared to spend a couple of days in jail. I pretty much did this, and while it was satisfying at the time, it wasn't worth it. The "reward" wasn't worth the risk.

Okay, I'm lying a little bit here, because you and I are different. It was VERY satisfying to me to be the cause of a massive disruption of their special little plans that evening. I'll never apologize for my actions that night, as I feel it was my right. There were no punches thrown, but I put the fear of God and me in him that night. LOL..word is, he still looks over his shoulder for me. Truth is, I couldn't care less about that POS. But let him live his putrid little life thinking that I do.

Miss Bliss (dang it, did it again!) is right though. Without running the risk of getting someone in serious trouble there is no real way to run a plate.

update, Just walked into my house and caught the guy in my house. I told him to leave and he left with no problem. Probably because he is a convicted felon and just got out of jail.

I applaud your efforts. I walked in unannounced almost two years ago and said Lucy-I'm home. My DD and I had moved out and were gone for 5 months. WW kept breaking into the house during PLan B. When my DD moved back-because she missed her friends-went for a weekend and did not come back-I decided I had to be there for my then 17 yo daughter.


Sorry to say I couldn't save the M but I stayed with the ship until all was lost.

I pray you have better luck. My WW also was/is (still) full blown alcoholic.

nESRE

Nicely done!!

I wish more of the men we have frequenting the boards had your clang.

Good job. So you announced that your back home, correct?

What did she do?

She just texted me wanting to talk joint custody of the kids. Should I tell her it is either work on the marriage on else I want full custody.

Yup. Didn't you also say that adultery in S.C. is punishable by law?

yes it is. She told me in the text that she would not see om anymore but I just checked our wireless providers site and she is still texting him as of 20 minutes ago.

just got finished sending exposure letter to all the om friends and his mom and sister.

Good and you're back home also?

will be tomorrow. she thinks she is coming over to pick the kids up from my parents house. Little does she know I will be home with the kids. She doesn't think divorce is going to affect the kids but she wants to put my oldest one who is five through counseling. There's some fogbabble for ya and one for the craziest things waywards will say.

Yes she is still very wayward because the affair is still on.

When you get home you be the best husband and father ever. Have some flowers and dinner ready. But do not be a doormat be a strong man and tell her you will not have three in your M.

I just wish it hadn't taken me a month to do this. Don't know if I will be able to sleep tonight. I need to stay positive though for my kids and my marriage.

You think melodylane will come back and help me through the rest of this.

Read these you will see strength.
Motarman update
Mortarman Custody

Ask her and see.

Wow t2c, just wow. Well done. IMO the POSOM likely left cause to him your WW just ain't worth a fight. Your message is loud and clear.

I think a warrior has been born. Hats off t2c, what you are doing shows true courage.

No lovebusting though. Now you are giving her some stick, ensure you remember to Plan A your butt off with a lot of carrot.

I agree!

The reason she is frantically texting about custody, etc. is because OM was probably like, "Dude, I thought you said your husband is out of the picture. I don't need this [censored]. Get a divorce or count me out."

NOW is the time to go full steam plan MB. Don't stutter, just execute the plans NO MATTER what she says. She's about to turn into Linda Blair in the Exeorcist, especially if you did a complete exposure. Her head will spin and hateful words will spew out of her mouth like Green Pea oup. Stay strong and loving.

You can do this.

The OM facebook page has now dissapeared but not before I exposed the affair to his family and friends. She is very much still lying because the text she sent me said he was out of the picture but then she texted back and forth to OM until one thirty in the morning. Boy ya'll were right about how waywards talk. If anybody can gte a hold of Melodylane please tell her I could use her help now.

Melody Lane has already told you what to do - in this thread. Just back up a few pages and read her advice. It still applies. Just read and do what you have been advised to do.

Mwahahaha, the OM's FB has disappeared BECAUSE of exposure. Sorry POSOM, but you can't hide.

Don't bother about what WW is texting. All you need to know is, she is still wayward.

Melody will likely be along shortly. Keep bumping your posts.

And have faith in yourself t2c... you are doing exceptionally well!

Here you go t2c, I'm wading through for Melody's directions.

Great job!!! Keep up the good work.

Thanks ML. Probably going to talk to a lawyer today just in case it goes that far. But I told her last night I didn't believe in divorce and I told her if she wanted to be with the OM then I wanted full custody of the kids.

That was a perfect response. And I very much agree you should see an attorney today because her next step will likely be a stunt to get you booted. You MUST go to Walmart and get a little pocket recorder if you don't have one. Have it on you at all times.

Keep up the good work!

Have you done all your exposures? If not, I would wrap that up today so you can focus on other things.

All exposures are done. Sent letters to her mom, sister, her uncle which is like a father figure to her, sent letters to my aunts, cousins,and my parents.

Sent letters to OM mom, sister, aunt, and some close friends I knew he had.

Very good.. You planned this out well.

OM's sister is no help. She told me it takes 2 to tango and I responded I know but I needed help on their end and then she responded back sorry it was between me and my WW.

That's cool. Some people are not going to help you and that is to be expected.

Back at home. WW doesn't know yet. She hasn't made it home. Let's see what happens. Got an appointment with lawyer tomorrow.

Good, finally. What Plan A action do you have planned? House clean, dinner made?

Have you heard anything back from your exposure?

Have you officially moved home? I am confused. I thought you already did that. You are doing that now? Please bring me up to speed. thanks!

t2c, did you get that VAR like you've been told? I certainly hope so.

Also, is this POSOM on parole or what? With us both living in South Carolina and having the law on our side, we have some unique weapons at our disposal that others just don't have.

It's okay, Wes - I agree, it does rhyme nicely

I dated a cop back in my twenties. He could run a plate, but it was all recorded by the computer in his car and his precinct. It HAD to be related to a legitimate police call. ie, he couldn't just pick a random plate on the street to run.

I know we have posters on this site who work with police and sheriff's departments - hopefully they can correct me if I'm wrong.

mb (I'll go back to proper address now), I have a "friend" whose wife is on the force and he told me 4 or 5 years ago they were severely cracking down on this kind of abuse of power. He used to get his wife to do it just for chuckles for him, although for the life of me I can't figure out why that would bring amusement to anyone. Anyway, cops started losing jobs over it and it came to a screeching halt because helping a friend with something like this wasn't worth ruining your career over.

I'll back this... I can access someone's criminal history in my job. Years ago I remember my supervisor checking out any potential date to ensure he wasn't a sex offender Think she'd been in the job too long.

You can't do it so easy these days. Every time I access someone's convictions it is logged and I have to provide a reason.

I work with Sheriffs as well, same deal. If caught doing something dodgy, your job is at risk.

Although there are still those who do take the risk. I know someone who managed to get a friend to run a history on his ex-wife's OM. There were pages of it...

Yes, it is a violation of policy which can result in discipline or termination. In some circumstances it can also lead to additional criminal charges.

For CPIC (Canadian database) and NCIC (the American database), you are required to detail each inquiry (plate, person, etc) with a specific reason for the search (you need to actually write - "registered owner reporting this plate stolen" or whatever. There are frequent and random audits, and whoever makes the inquiry has the inquiry stamped with their name.

If you must legitimately query your wife, husband, friend, family -> it is considered proper practice to ask a co-worker to do so, which I have had to do. It absolves you of any liability and quite frankly most of us don't want to read that anyways!

There are also secret ghost inquiries attached... so if you decide to query Britney Spears or whatever, you will have federal authorities calling within minutes asking you what/why. I had to do this for a celebrity once (legitimate reason) and the feds knew in minutes! LOL!

Bottom line - DON'T DO IT, NOT WORTH IT!!!

These records can be searched legitimately within reason if you hire a private investigator that goes through proper legal avenues (all provinces/states have freedom of information/public record laws).

Hope that helps

Update...

Moved back into the house last night. WW wanted to leave and take the lids but I wouldn't let her take the kids. So she called her mother and her mother came over and told me to let them take the kids. I told her no that the boys were staying right here. She threaten to call the cops and I told her to go ahead that I wasn't doing anything wrong. WW wife finally decided to stay because she knew she couldn't make me leave. She slept in the oldest boy room and I slept in the youngest boy room because I couldn't bring myself to sleep in the bed where they had been. I think the marriage is over because her family doesn't think she done any thing wrong. WW mom told my dad I was a sorry man for not letting go and leaving. Her mom also said I was making things worse. Do I believe what they say, nope. It just hurts that people can think that way in a situation like this.

I am so dang proud of you for standing your ground!! You stayed there and defended your kids!! Can I give you a big hug?

And the marriage is not over until the fat lady sings. Your marriage has a better chance today than it did yesterday. It might not work out, but at the very least you are in your home protecting your children.

And shame, shame, shame on her mother! For her to condone her daughters adultery is shameful and uncaring.

Please contact a lawyer today in case your wife tries to boot you out. We have had wives call the police and say they "feel scared" and were able to get restraining orders.

Can you take the day off work and stay there with your boys?

Don't cancel that lawyer's apt for today make sure you go.

Keep us updated and good job standing your ground at home.

I was not able to stay out of work. All I can do is pray that she will bring my boys home. ML, I am seeing a lawyer today as soon as I get off work. And yes ML you can give me a big hug. I think I most definitely need one right now. Kinda feel down in the dumps a little.

That is not surprising because you are walking through the fire right now. You are facing the problem FACE ON and that is not easy! You are having to fight for your marriage and your children's family. And I applaud you for taking the tough steps. This is a very tough situation that takes very tough actions. Just stick with it and don't let anyone divert you from your plan. You know now who is supportive of your marriage and who is not. Your MIL is not supportive of your marriage. But that is ok, you don't need her support to do the right thing. You are doing this for your marriage and your children, not for the approval of unsupportive people.

Did your MIL threaten to take the kids and call the police when the criminal OM was in your home? No. But she did that to you, the loving father of your children. What kind of a mother does that?? A mother who does not care, that is who. Shame on her!

I'm not giving up but if it does come to it how will I know when it is time for divorce.

When you have tried everything and it doesn't work. You are FAR from that point, though. And you can't go by what she says. The things she says are no more relevant than the rantings of a falling down drunk. The drunk sings a completely different story when they sober up. So, your job is to do your best to kill her affair while protecting your children and your legal interests.

I thought I had killed the affair the other day when I busted her but apparently not since she continued to talk to him that night and some the next day. she didn't talk to him as much but still a little is to much. This is one tough battle, no sleep and I have already lost about forty pounds in the past couple months.

It is next to impossible to kill it if you are not there, because she can still have the OM over. Sad that your kids have been exposed to this. But bravo to you for getting your butt back there. You really need to get a lawyer TODAY, my friend, because I expect her to resort to legal means to get you out. And be sure and carry a recorder on you at all times.

Just expect her to come up with a new ploy to get you out. Be prepared to stand your ground. Make HER leave without the kids if she wants to separate.

When is your apt with your lawyer today?

Quoted for emphasis.

DITTO

The apppointment is at four thirty, as soon as I get off work. Mel, should I go ahead and file for divorce just in case I can't save this marriage.

If you file for a D, let your Lawyer know that you want to drag it out as long as possible to give you a chance to save it. He/she will know how to help you out.

ETA: Sometimes, to get custody, finances, etc figured out, you will need to file. Talk to your attorney about that.

ETA that if you file doesn't mean you have to pull the trigger. Just get you and your children protected.

Do what you need to do to protect yourself legally so that you are able to stay in your home with your kids. If you have to file for divorce to do that, its ok, because you can do as Scotland advised and file and then drag your feet. I am concerned that you are in a very risky situation right now because you are a MALE. The females have the upper hands in these situations unless you proactively protect yourself.

Did you read these threads? They will be very helpful for you.

Here's another you can learn from.

sack's thread "vindictive, cheating wife is tearing me apart"

Update...

Saw lawyer yesterday. Don't know if he is the one I need since his philosophy is what is better for the kids. Right now he wants me to do a one year legal separation. He also wants me to talk with her and do joint custody where I would get the kids for a week and then she would get the kids for a week. He also said to get a restraining order put on the guy so he couldn't come around my kids. WW is going to see a lawyer on Wednesday. I just don't know if I can sit down and talk with her at the moment. I think it is time for plan b.

That will not work. You tell him you don't want to separate. Your goal is to save the marriage. So he needs to make sure you are legally protected. Tell him you want to stay in the house, get primary custody of your children and keep the OM out. Keep in mind that this guy works for YOU, not the other way around. His goal is to get you divorced. Yours is to stay married and to protect yourself legally until your wife comes to her senses.

This lawyer does not know "what is best for the kids." What is best for the kids is to have parents with an intact marriage.

tc, here is the approach you should take with her. Let her know that you want to stay married and will not be cooperating with any divorce schemes. Tell her that you have contacted an attorney to protect your legal rights and those of the children, though. [not to get a divorce, but only for legal protection]

Tell her you won't be leaving the house and you won't allow her to take the kids out of the home without a court order. You are here to stay and work on your marriage. DEMAND that she end her affair or you will file on grounds on adultery.

Let her know you want to have a great marriage with her and will give her an opportunity to earn your forgiveness. But first she has to end all contact with the OM.

And by all means, go down NOW and file a RO against the OM!

After reading those threads I feel like the united states has some stupid laws. I'm just pissed because it seems like she is going to win the battle and she is the one that has done all the wrong things. She is going to see her lawyer Wednesday but the only thing she can do is file for separation because she has no grounds for divorce here in South Carolina. She will have to file for separation and wait a year before she can get a divorce. I feel like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place.

I don't understand what you mean. You have her by the balls because she has committed adultery. Did you read my post?

You are still in your home, right?

T2,

Im in SC as well. You need to file first. A couple things, if adultery is proven, it prevents you from paying alimony in SC. It puts you in charge of things. If divorce is where your headed, that can be accomplished 91 days from the date of the temporary hearing. If you are not headed that route....by all means drag your feet.

Be the first to file. It doesnt mean you follow thru on a divorce, just puts you more in charge of things.

Thanks LR! totallyconfused, you are in a very advantageous position because of your wife's adultery. You need to capitalize on that. File for divorce on grounds of adultery, keep your home and maintain primary custody of your kids. Then DRAG out the divorce.

You need to get moving, because she is going to get you booted out of your home. Tell that lawyer to move his [censored] and make it happen. If he can't do that, then find another lawyer.

See, a lawyers only goal is to facilitate an amicable divorce. They are lazy and don't give a crap about your marriage. You have to tell him what you expect and tell him to make it happen.

File on gruonds of adultery, and name the OM. Then get a RO against him to keep that rat out of your house.

t2c, you also need to let POSOM know (through whatever channel possible) that with adultery being a felony in the state of SC that continued contact with your WW may be a violation of his parole. I've got a feeling this guy isn't too bright and that once he becomes aware of this he may be quite disinclined to maintain contact. You already mentioned he shied away from you when you confronted him due to him not wanting any trouble because of his prison time. Create more trouble. Make her not worth the effort to him.

Like Mel said, you have her AND him by the balls. You just need to start squeezing a little harder.

You have absolutely nothing to lose by trying. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work.

But what if it does?

Also, spend the money for a PI. 3rd party documentatiom helps you.....if this goes to court. That will aid in her character as a mother and person. Also, start lining up character witnesses for yourself. The more the better. This will aid you IF it comes down to a custody issue. Hopefully this will all turn around for you and you can be in recovery, if not.....be prepared to fight....get yourself in a good position with lots, lots of documentation.

I have records of the numbers she's been Texting, I have a letter where she admits to an affair, I have pictures of him inside my house, I have his mugshot picture. I guess I need to find out if i can prosecute him, I know I can prosecute her.

t2c, I wasn't suggesting prosecuting anyone. I was suggesting using the mere threat of it to POSOM as a tool to motivate him to back off. That law hasn't been prosecuted in probably 20 years or so. But he doesn't know that, and he certainly doesn't know what it could possibly do to his parole. I seriously doubt she means that much to him to be honest. The goal is to attack this POS with everything you have, and you have a lot to work with. You already have him on the run a little. You just need to keep pushing.

You need to be prepared to go to WAR against the affair if you want to save your marriage. You have to stop surrendering when you see a smoke signal. You have already won the war if you will just suit up and get in there and clear the field. The OM doesn't have a chance.

Are you in your home???

And I hope you have those records in a very safe place so your wife doesn't destroy them. You need to also password protect your computer.

Are you in your home???

All the stuff is on my parents computer.

Are you still in your home?

Are you still in your home?

Another one of OM friends sent me a message on Facebook asking what in the world is going on. How should I respond back to her. Also my WW has gotten back on Facebook but I'm no longer her friend.

Are you still at your home?

Tell them the truth, your exposure response.

I found OW's friends that contacted me either wanted to justify the affair, or were seeking education. It was a tough call on the responses to some, but then, they were 21-year-old's.

If she is asking a question, answer. Some of those I exposed to were clearly on the fence and seeking clarification. Give it to them. Remain polite and re-iterate the request for them to use influence on OM to end the affair as you wish to recover your marriage. I always thanked them for taking the time to respond (those that were seeking clarification anyways). Remember, it is easier to ignore exposure. Those who respond are showing something. It deserves acknowledgment (unless it is abusive).

Oh, and again, ARE YOU AT YOUR HOME???

We need to know this....

Still at home, kinda awkward and unsettling but still at home. This is what I sent OM friend. Maybe she will help since she is a little older than his sister. May be more mature.

" I want to thank you for your reply back. This is the husband of **edit**. **edit**has been having an affair with my wife for at least a month now. I am trying to save my marriage so I am asking for help in ending this affair."

Also, did you get to the lawyer and have them file for seperation for you first? This puts you in charge and you can drag your feet on it. Beat her to the punch. This can be handled on the phone with the lawyer. She is seeing her lawyer tomorrow right? Protect yourself and your children.

calling him today. Also noticed today that she has been getting back all her old pictures from her mom. Does this mean anything.

Dont try and figure out the alien wayward mind.....i have tried, so have others, it is impossible to do.

Make sure your lawyer files. It will protect you and your children. Filing does not mean your headed the divorce path. Your WW may think you are. Dont worry. Protect you and your kids. Have the filing down on the grounds of adultery, such a huge advantage in the fault state we live in. You have the power to control things if you do this part first.

Dont listen to the WW fogbabble. And take time for you to breath. You will ne ok, really, it will be that awful rollercoaster, so expect it.

Edited to add: No SF, in this state it actually "forgives" the affair, and the whole process would have to start from scratch.

Just saw counselor, and he told me to get a new lawyer. The counselor's view is a man should never leave his home. So I think my counselor is on the same page as ya'll. He told me to write her a letter telling her I still love her and to tell her I wanted to reconcile the marriage but only of she will end the affair. If she wasn't willing to end the affair and reconcile then I would sue for divorce based on the grounds of adultery.

Didn't you already write her one?

You're in Plan A so it can't hurt. Post it here to get advice first.

Smart counselor to tell you to stay in your home. Are you going to file on the grounds of adultery like all our fellow SC MB warriors informed you?

Major update.....

The female friend of the OM sent a reply back to me saying she has been dating the OM for a month now. She wants me to send her proof before she confronts him. This information just made my day.

Yes I'm going to file on grounds of adultery.

Don't know if ya'll got the update but found out today that the OM has a girlfriend. She is one of the ones I sent the exposure letter to. I just didn't know they were dating, thought they were just friends.

Bingo!! Now go and tell your wife this TONIGHT! Did you tell her you caught the OM in your home and that your wife admitted to the affair?

Your proof is that you caught him in your home.

Sending her that info along with pictures and the text message logs. The girlfriend knew they were Texting but I don't think she knew to what extent. Plus she knew he ate dinner with my WW at my house. The Lord does work in mysterious ways.

This is the beauty of exposure. We have had this happen several times when the "girlfriend" of the OM would contact the exposing husband. OM are typically players and you are busting him!

Did you see what I said about telling your wife?

That will drive a stake in the heart of the affair!

Did you get a new lawyer then? Is WW still planning on seeing her lawyer tomorrow or was this just a rouse on her part?

I got a new lawyer, I talk to him on the 29th. He is booked that far back, I heard he is good and usually gets the person what they are asking for. Not sure about her, will have to wait and find out.

I will definetly tell my wife. I think it is quite interesting that she is cheating on me and then the OM is basically cheating on his girlfriend on possibly on my WW wife depending on which one he met first, since he has only been dating the girlfriend for a month now and I think he has been talking to my wife for a little longer than that.

This is the letter I am sending my WW...

"Dear WW,

I am writing this to let you know I still love you and still would like to work on our marriage. I am willing forgive you if you will end the affair. I am willing to forget the past and look towards the future and begin our new life together if you are willing to end the affair with no contact. I am still madly in love with you but I can not continue to fight for our marriage if you continue down the road you are on.

If the affair does not end and you are not willing to work on the marriage then you will leave me with no choice but to file for divorce on the grounds of adultery. I will have the courts to subpoena OM to appear in court. I will also have them subpoena all the text message records between you and the OM. I do not want it to come down to this but if the affair does not end then you leave me no choice.

I will leave you with this...

I _____, take you ______, to be my wedded wife/husband. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish 'till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness.

This is the pledge I took and I will honor it if you are willing to honor it.

I love you!"

Any advice would be greatly appreciated since all the advice I have revived so far has been spot on.

totallyconfused, you are rocking right along! I am glad you are getting a new attorney, too. Please tell your wife right away about the OM.

I like your letter, but I would tell her all that in person. Can you do that?

Melodylane, at this moment I don't think I can. I had to take off work this past Saturday because I was to emotional. If she accepts reconciliation then I will garner the strength through Jesus to talk to her in person. Thank you for everything and keep me in your prayers.

Also I told the OM's girlfriend about how I caught them in my house. Waiting on a response back from her. I think I finally got an ally besides my family.

Did you tell your wife about the girlfriend?

You should also give your wife's cell phone # to the girlfriend. Encourage her to call her and ask questions.

Melodylane, this is what the girlfriend just sent me

" Look I would really appreciate it if you would stop sending me these messages. What happened in the past is just that, THE PAST. This is between you and her now. Please leave **edit** and I alone. We are happy together and u or anyone else is going to change that. I wish you luck and no hard feelings but please STOP.................."

Do these people have no morals. I mean he cheated on her while they were dating.

Thats fine! Just be sure and tell your wife ASAP about the girlfriend.

Wife just responded to the email and basically told me it was over and she wasn't in love with me anymore. She wants to do this as peacefully as possibly so it doesn't cost her 10,000 dollars. So basically she wants to get everything and not have no repercussions for it.

The past?? Wasn't it like a week ago?

Also? Your wife? Gets no peace.

My spouse asked for a divorce. It lasted about 12 hours. After I explained he would never have a private conversation with me again, we would not be friends, and I would fight for full custody with everything I had - he was suddenly quite different.

It ruined his fantasy of a happy divorce. Although now he says he is horrified he ever said any of what he said.

Did you let her know her OM has a gf?

Your right ridicsit, it was only a week ago.

Exactly.

No sunday dinners. No more family christmas. You wont be her friend. You wont hand her everything on a silver platter with a smile on your face while she has her hand on your wallet.

Yes I told her the OM had a girlfriend and she the proceeded to tell me it was over, she was done discussing him. I don't think she is happy that the shoe is on the other foot.

Mel, the girlfriend of the other man sent me this about three hours ago.

"Ok one thing I would like to say though, It takes 2 to do what you are accusing them of. He was open and honest with me about it when I asked. I do honestly hope you and your wife can work things out. I don't know her and don't care to. I appreciate you trying to warn me of him but I already knew but please if there is more to it than I was told you are more than welcome to send me a message. god bless"

Do I need to pursue this any further with her or let it be?

The first thing I would send her is your WW's cell phone number and suggest she call your WW right in front of him. That would be quite interesting to be a fly on the wall for.

And just "what" did she already know? That little phone call may clear up a lot of little things.

How on earth does the girlfriend know he's open and honest? LOL

As she goes on- you can tell she is unsure. You've planted the seed. Good job.

I would tell her what you saw- and give her your wife's cell number.

Did you give OM's GF all the details of your WW's affair and her BF? This was three weeks ago, correct?
Is OM and GF still together? Is he the guy you caught in your home? If so did you send GF copies if the pictures?

That is confusing. What EXACTLY did you tell her? Dd the OM spin this to her? Does she know this was a romantic affair?

I would respond to her and thank her for the message. Tell her you will let her know if you have any new news and ask her to let you know if she hears of any contact. Give her your wife's cell # and tell her to watch for that.

This what I sent her earlier today.

" I want to apologize for taking so long to reply back. It has been a very stressfull week. I have text message records showing where they texted back and forth for three hours straight and one time at two oclock in the morning. He would be the last person she texted at night and the first person she texted in the morning. I can send these to you, just let me know how you would like to get them whether through Facebook or an email address. I also have I picture of him which he posted on Facebook wearing my sons otimus prime helmet with his shirt off inside my house. This picture showed up on his Facebook page on April 25th along with other pictures of him inside my house. This also the night I went back to my house at around 11 at night and when my wife opened the door he was lying on the bed with his shirt off. She was dressed in her night clothes and her hair was still wet from taking a shower. I made him leave and then ask her if this was the guy she wanted to be with. She said she wasn't sure. I sorry this is happening and I wouldn't wish it on anybody in the world but I felt you should know although I thought you and Adam were just good friends at the time and not dating."

I think she has WW's number because she knew they were Texting back and forth. I just don't think she knew they were Texting that much.

Good job on getting back to her and giving her the info.

I would ask her if she wants your WW's number to check records again. She may have deleted your WW's number from her memory.

This is my song. I like the second verse about the word impossible.

Please listen.

tc, is this the first time you have told her you caught them in bed together?

Yes, this was the first time I told her. That day was the first I had caught them in bed. The girlfriend of the OM said he told her about everything but I'm not sure about that since I don't know what he told her. There has been only two times that my WW and OM have contacted each other since that night and the texts between them only last a couple minutes. She wants to work out a deal so it doesn't cost that much for lawyers but I'm not in the mood for deals unless it is how to fix our marriage. I just need to know what would be my next step since she said no to the email I sent her.

Keep repeating "I talk marriage, my lawyer talks divorce"

Make it clear that you aren't working any "deal" with her. That you will go for full custody and have her charged with adultery.

Didn't you say you're in SC and that adultery is punishable by law? Play this card, my friend.

I would let know "no deals." Tell her you have turned all that over to your attorney and are going to let him handle the whole thing.

What was the email you sent her?

This is the email I sent Mel...

"Dear WW,

I am writing this to let you know I still love you and still would like to work on our marriage. I am willing forgive you if you will end the affair. I am willing to forget the past and look towards the future and begin our new lifetogether if you are willing to end the affair with no contact. I am still madly in love with you but I can not continue to fight for our marriage if you continue down the road you are on.

If the affair does not end and you are not willing to work on the marriage then you will leave me with no choice but to filefordivorce on the grounds of adultery. I will havethe courts to subpoena OM to appear in court. I will also have them subpoena all the text message records between you and the OM. I do not want it to come down to this but if the affair does not end then you leave me no choice.

I will leave you with this...

I _____, take you ______, to bemy wedded wife/husband. To have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness or in health, to love and to cherish 'till death do us part. And hereto I pledge you my faithfulness.

This is the pledge I took and I will honor it if you are willing to honor it.

I love you!"

oh ok! You showed me that. Now you have said what needed to be said so you have planted the seed. Just stick to your guns and be patient, patient, patient....

This is what she just told me.

"I know you are upset, but not paying the bills is not good for the boys."

Umm... Like splitting up is.

What is she talking about? What bills are you not paying?

Well I hadn't paid a couple bills like the car insurance and cable bills but it isn't like I haven't been going through something right at the moment.

Are you back in your house?

Aren't you in SC?

Yes, Brainhurts I am in south Carolina and sorry Mel after staying there a couple days I couldn't stay there any longer knowing he was in my house. I know I need to go back but I may have to have meds to go back.

You need to be in the house, she can file in SC for abandonment if your out of the house.

Yes, you should move back into the house PRONTO!

Already talked to the lawyer about that. I have to be out of the house for a year before she file on abandonment.

Well, he can't be in the house if you are there. I dont see how this is going to work if you aren't there. Leaving facilitates the affair and makes it much less likely that you will save the marriage. I don't understand why you keep leaving?

I understand Mel. I need to find out what legal action do I have to keep my kids in the house when she moves out.

On a side not, I was just threaten by the other man using his girlfriends Facebook account.

" This is **edit** **edit** you homeboy and get the **edit** off my girls page and take care of your on **edit** up life...Good luck!!!"

t2c, you need to show this message to your WW. Call me an idiot, but I'm pretty doggone sure she's been thinking all along that she was his girl. What a pity.

Oh, and if it were me, I would reply back with this:

Look, you POS, you mess with my life, I mess with yours. You continue, I continue. You push me, I push back. Get the picture? Stay the hell away from my wife or you're going to fully realize what I'm capable of.

Hope you have a great day!

But you need to get back in that house now! You can't fight a war when you've vacated the war zone.

PS- I'm in Columbia t2c. Where are you located?

Wasnt this the same guy you kicked out of your home and he said nothing? What a chicken having to hide the behind the computer.

Logans_run, I stay in Florence. Yes that is the same guy. He also has to hide behind his girlfriend using her page instead of his and it took him over a week to do it.

TW is in cola......

POSOM sounds wimpy......gotta hide behind skirt tails......

I second TigerWes's idea.

You need to show your WW the message and say "see you aren't his only piece of tail he's getting. Don't you feel special?"

Then you need to send loser boy a message. I like TW's message.

How do you go about telling your WW not to bribe the kids to get them to go home with her without it being a demand.

Just got finished cutting grass for ww but mainly for the kids. About half way through lawn mower broke and had to finish cutting the whole backyard with a weed eater.

Thinking about sending flowers to ww for mothers day but haven't decided.

Huh? Did you go back to your house like Melodylane told you?

Waywards love to bribe the children because it makes them think, in their wayward mind, that they are a good parent.

How are things going with your lawyer?

I meet with a new one on the 29th. Hopefully this will be better than the last one that just told me give her everything and settle out if court for $1,500. I sent ww a email explaining how I was going to file if we couldn't work on the marriage and she basically answered back that it was over.

I think I am going to try and send her flowers for mothers day to try to stay in some sort of plan a but I think it may be about time for plan b except for the communication about the kids.

Well, if you think it's time for Plan B, make the last days of Plan A as sweet as possible. You really want to go out with a bang, as they say.

Point blank: Did you respond to this POSOM's message and show it to your WW, and if not, why not?

Totally, quite frankly, forget about sending her flowers for Mothers' Day if you are NOT at home - it would be an empty gesture, and I doubt if she would even pay any attention to it! The gesture she needs from you is to get back to your marital home and to show her that you do care for her and your marriage, and that you are wiling to fight! Despite what anyone says here, I believe that your Plan A from long distance is furtive at best! All I have to say in sum is AARRG in terms of you being able to win her back at this point. Please LISTEN and DISCUSS with the vets here instead of making intermittant, furtive posts!

Tom

Seeing Tom's post made me realize....yes. DO NOT send her a darn thing if you are not in your home. Men leaving home is just the worst thing they can do.

I didn't realize that you were out of the home.

If you don't get home soon there will be really no point in a Plan A.

Ok this is the next email I want to send my WW. It has to do with the letter she wrote me and told me she has grown up and I haven't and that she has outgrown me. I just want some of your opinion on it.


"I've been thinking about what you said about me not growing and the fact that you have outgrown me.

First off I grew up when I decided to marry the love of my life. I grew up when we decided to start a family. I grew up when first son was born and every night he threw up I came home to clean it up. I grew up when Aydyn was born and I took a job I really didn't want because I knew I needed to support my family. All I can say is that I'm still growing as I raise my kids and learn from them what they need in a father. Over the past couple months I have grown in the knowledge of what it takes to have a great marriage. Will I get to prove this only time will tell but in your mind probably not because you think the world is fill with impossibilities. So in your mind first son and second son will never be professional athletes, never make good grades in school, never go to college, or heck even possibly be president. Because in your mind everything is impossible.

All I have to say is if you don't think I have grown enough give me a couple of months and I will show you how grown I am."

Also I am sending ww the message from the other man threating me.

That is a terrible letter. Insulting your WW about her world view is not Plan A.

Go home. Hug her, and show her a grown man!

All right don't know where to go from here. Found out tonight from the OM's girlfriend that my WW wife contacted him and told him I was going to subpoena him to court. He apparently drove up to where I work looking for me to see what I would do.

I will be going tomorrow to get a restraining order on him so he cannot come near me or my kids.

With this happening I don't know which direction to go with my WW now.

p.s.
OM's girlfriend is now his ex-girlfriend because he broke up with her tonight. Apparently he has a new girlfriend and if I knew you she was I would warn her to.

Are you just blogging or what? You don't listen to anyone, you don't reply to direct questions with direct answers....

You're not doing anything substantial. Why not? What you need to get drilled into that thick skull of yours is that you have already lost her. Accept this, because this is where you are.

The question is, are you willing to do whatever is necessary to win her back! So far you have shown us that you aren't and just want to use this forum to [censored] and moan. That's fine as well. That's what it's for.

Oh, and t2c, did you even stop to consider that his new girlfriend might be your wife?

I don't think you need to warn her. I'm pretty sure she already knows.

Oh, and one more thing:

It occurred to me that perhaps listening may not be one of your strong points. If it were you may not find yourself in the predicament that you are now.

Just something to chew on.

So what plan are you in t2c?

Fixing to start my plan a over again since by listening to tigerwes and everybody else, I know I haven't been doing it right. From what I've been reading I should give it 3 weeks or should I give mine a little bit longer.

I never realized how hard this is going to be.

Tigerwes I am a listener but not somebody who can handle congregation very well and I think she knows that. I think that is whats making this harder for me. As the Nike slogan says I need to "Just Do It".

I see that you're online, so just what have you done the past 3 days?

Look t2c, I'm not trying to be a hard [censored] or jerk, just trying to motivate you into doing what needs to be done. Okay, you've had a problem with being a conflict avoider all your life. Well, put it in the past; reconfigure yourself for your marriage and fire up. Buddy, simply put, man up!

You say she knows that you aren't a man that can handle confrontation well? Well, it's time for you to change that perception.

Women like men that fight like hell for them in the darkest of situations and circumstances.

You're not doing that pal.

totally2,

To be harshly honest, you're not making much sense! To intermittantly post here w/o any indication of what is going on or the action steps you have taken per MB, and expect anyone to offer advice is just plain stupid on yuur part! The email you 'propose' to send to your W regarding 'growing up' is insipid at best! It tells me that you do not know even the basic things about Plan A, or women for the matter.

Man, you just better focus on getting your head together, obtain some humility to actually listen and I mean really listen to the veterans here, and simply dig down deep and learn how to treat your wife.

By the way guy, are you even back home where you should be???

All can say is good luck!

Tom

What are your plans?

Update please.

Tigerwes thank you for motivating me. How would you send the information to her about what the OM said to me over Facebook without it being some kind of LB or can I us LB to get my point across this time. Also I may need to you to drive down from Columbia to Florence and hit me with something bigger than a 2x4 maybe a 2x8.

Also if you don't mind may I ask what your story is. Tried to find it but couldn't.

You couldn't find my story because I have never taken the time to post it. Frankly, it pales by comparison to some of the things I've read around here. But I've been through what you're going through twice. My first XW was running around with my best friend who was in our wedding, and the second one I found out was cheating on me 6 days before Christmas 2003. And that vicious [censored] ripped out of my life the most precious thing in the world to me; my stepson. I wound up here not looking for help in busting up an affair but more so to improve myself so as to not keep making the same mistakes I was apparently making so I would have a better chance of not going through the pain of infidelity again.

As far as hitting you with something bigger, I can certainly do that, but really, what good would it do? You have 36 pages of advice and it pretty much all reads the same. I, or anyone else for that matter, can only do so much. It's entirely up to you to follow the advice....or not.

You have 2 choices:

1) Grow a pair, start fighting like hell and possibly lose her.
2) Continue what you are doing now and definitely lose her.

Every day you let pass with inaction is another day this gets more firmly entrenched. You've been told countless times what you need to do, and I know you've read other men's threads so I know you've read the same advice to them. The advice NEVER changes. I don't know if you're waiting for someone to tell you what you want to hear, but I can assure you that isn't going to happen. All you're going to hear is what you need to hear.

You just need to stop thinking and start doing. No one here can do it for you, pal.

Wow TW thanks for the little bit of your story. I'm so glad you found MB because your information is valuable.

Have you ever thought about starting a post to help other BH learn from your experience? I'm sure others would find it valuable.

Thanks fellow MB warrior.

Tigerwes, I have planted my set and I am watering them daily. This is what I want to send to the OM. What do you think.

"Look, you, you mess with my life, I mess with yours. You continue, I continue. You push me, I push back. Get the picture? Stay the heck away from my wife or you're going to fully realize what I'm capable of. By the way, wonder what the parole board would think about this."

Does anybody out think this will diminish my chances of getting full custody of my boys?

Bump *I need help, I'm tired of being walked all over by WW and OM.

Did she move out? Are you still at home?

What plan are you in t2c?

I am going back home. I will try to plan a her unless she decides to move out. I also was wondering what you thought about the message I want to send to the OM. At this point I just feel like I am being walked all over and I'm tired of it. I've basically have been walk all over my entire life from growing up to my job now and now this, I'm just tired of it. Like Tigerwes said I just need to grow a set and I finally ready to grow that set.

Would it do any good to expose to some more of her friends that may not now about it even though I have already exposed it to her family. I know there are probably a few of her church friends that do not know.

Go right ahead and expose. It can't hurt you. Everyone who could possibly influence her should be exposed to, family or not.

I agree.

Since Tigerwes gave you a man talk and you're growing a pair you need to stop being her doormat.

Plan doormat no more. We used to have a very wonderful poster with that name but he isn't around much anymore but you should read his threads.
4 months after Dday
One year after dday

Here's his last update.
Two years after dday

My list of things I need to do... Let me know what you think.

1. Move back home, be with wife and kids.
2. Plan A wife until I can't do it anymore.
3. Work on Plan B just in case.
4. Work on a list of EP's.
5. Read Surviving an Affair.
6. Send OM a message to leave wife alone or else.
7. Expose to some of her closest friends.

You haven't read SAA yet?

Come on man, you've been on here way too long to have ignored this.

No wonder you're still in Plan Doormat.

I thought you already sent a message to OM? Isn't this the same OM you found in your home?

I'm confused on what you want? You said you won't go home because of what you caught with him and her even though everyone including Mel told you to get back home.

Why are you going to listen now? I thought you were speaking to a lawyer? What happened to that? I thought you were getting a RO against OM to stay away from YOUR home and kids?

t2c, it's not like anyone's ignoring you, it's more like you are ignoring everyone yourself. Good advice has been offered, and you've utilized very little. Believe me pal, I feel your pain immensely, but no one here can help unless you're willing to do something.

You haven't even ordered SAA yet and devoured it?? This is step one, and you won't even take that step? You've been told this many times. Partner, again, no one here can do it for you. You gotta get to work. Otherwise.............

I know I've been hard on you, but I'm not going to apologize for it. You need a hard kick in the caboose to get going (and you know it), but frankly, my foot is getting a little sore.

I am painfully aware of my limitations on this board, and I'm not the best one to have on your side when the really hard work begins, assuming you get there of course. Others will gladly pick up that baton when the times comes. But I will do everything I can to jump start you into action to the best of my abilities.

Start doing, then come back and report your progress, and then everyone can go from there.

Went to the bookstore last night but they were out so I had to order it. Meeting with the lawyer on the 29th, he is the best one in town so he was completely booked until then. Do I need to read SAA before moving back home like letty said in my list? Trust me tigerwes I feel your foot.

No you can get back home and there's enough articles and posters to guide you.

Do you know if she still is having OM in your home? Is she still in contact with him?

Have you exposed to everyone and everybody?

Also this from the Exposure 101 thread.

In the midst of everything I didn't think about a Christian bookstore might have SAA. Going today to check it out and see. If I can get it today then I don't have to go pick up the one I ordered.

I was reading that thread last night Brainhurts. I thought it was a great idea if anybody wanted real evidence.

I didn't really expose to her friends. I just did family and naturally her family took her side.

Expose to everyone.

Do you know if she's still in contact with OM?

Yes I believe so, I'm fixing to contact my cousin in new jersey who is friends with the OM on his Facebook page. This cousin has been keeping tabs on the OM's Facebook page.

Last I checked with my cousin she was still commenting on his post.

Does anyone know anything about GoogleVoice.

Google voice is a phone number you get from Google. It allows you to make calls from your PC, text from your PC and it gives you voice mail and other features. You can also use it on a smart phone like android or an iPhone and send texts that don't show up on your phone bill.

Thanks Hap, I have few numbers WW is Texting and I can't find information in the numbers using intelius. Don't know of any other program to use.

What is the date that you will be moved back home?

And "soon" is not acceptable.

It is a lomg holiday weekend...FYI.

I'm pushing myself for tomorrow.

Just stopped by Christian bookstore hoping to get my hands on SAA but no luck. Will have to wait for the one I ordered to come in.

Why put off tomorrow what you can do today?

What is that saying? "blank" or get off the pot.

You have been here 2 months. How much have you accomplished?

Will you still be here in 2 months in the same spot?

How many people have moved back in and the WS moved out and filed for temporary custody of the kids?

Dude, dont worry about these questions now, get back in the house. Manu of these questions are stalling tactics on your part.

Actions.

That will get you somewhere.

You have had plenty advice from the vets. You have taken no action. You are going no where right now, but that same circle.

Do something.

sorry, totally. i thought i included a note below the quote box that said: "#1 and #2 should be done simultaneously."

When are you going back home?

Her affairs are still on and you are letting her have your kids around this?

Hey, Totally.

Can I tell you that you sound like my WH's OW's BH? And you do not want to be him. She has steamrollered him completely, taken over my WH, has 2 men worshiping her, and lives the best of both worlds in her double life. She has completely ruined 2 men, 2 families, and a whole lot of lives. No. End this now.

The best thing you could possibly do for yourself, your wife, your kids, and your life is to stand up and be an alpha male. Women want that and respect that. Not a testosterone surging, chest pounding jerk, but a man who is sure of himself, confident, makes decisions and sticks by them, stands up for his family and what is right, knows what he wants and goes after it, and does not allow himself to be walked on - ever.

I'm not sure what should go into a letter to OM - I'm kind off a newbie, but I would assume you come from a place of strength, calm, firm resolve and tell him that you love your wife, that you intend to stand up for your marriage and family, and that he'd better get out now while he can do it unscathed.

I think if you show strength, resolve, and decisiveness, do Plan A with no love busters, be the best husband and father you can be - NO neediness! - that you have a good chance of getting to your wife. If she leaves, she leaves. You can't control that. But you can control that she will know she left a man who loves her and has the fortitude to get through something even as awful as this with her. She will remember that, and it will get to her.

Don't just turn the kids over to her! If it comes to that, fight her for them. No WS should get custody. And no BH should leave his home - more plan doormat, the problem in the first place. She doesn't respect you. She's off with some Don Juan aggressive enough to come after a married woman, and probably loads of fun when he's wining and dining her in fantasyland. You be strong, steady, an example of love and strength and stability. Stand for what's right. That's what she really wants. Pixie dust dissipates eventually.

I took a bit of prodding to get into exposure as well. I've been a doormat for a very long time myself. At this point I am even literally physically afraid of my WH. But I stood up to him and this ridiculous tramp OW (after a few swift kicks from MB) - 2 people who have been running my life and my children's lives into the ground. I exposed to nearly everyone on her fb list. I would have done the same to WH if I'd done this 2 years ago. At this point, all his friends, family, coworkers, etc. know. I didn't read your whole thread, but sounds like this is recent enough to slam your WW too. EVERYONE. She'll be mad as a hornet, but she'll also see that something has shifted in you, she will see strength and somewhere in there she will also recognize that you love her enough to fight for her.

I know the feeling of dread and fear, the doubts, the questioning, everything - but you will feel like a gigantic weight has been lifted off your shoulders when you have thrown open these iron doors of deceit and darkness to let in some sunlight and fresh air. You will feel so empowered. You will know you have it in you to do whatever it takes to save your marriage, to be a great dad, and to live a great life.

I am no longer the doormat. I have stood up. I am the guardian of my own heart, family, and home. I will protect myself and my children, and no more of this garbage is getting through my door - ever.

You can do this, Totally!

Well it is 2pm eastern time. Have you moved back home yet? Or is it just hours, days, weeks, or months away still?

When?????

BH, I am not sure why you invest time in this guy!

Totally, watching WWII movies this weenend - not at all sure I'd want you in my foxhole. Do you have any idea of how many men died back then, especially in June 1944, to preserve the freedom and the opportunities that you now have! Sorry to say, but you are a disgrace now now to the men who would have loved to be with their families, but could not, and you choose to run away!!!

I know TOM. I'm losing my patience.

They did this to me too, Totally. It worked! GO HOME! and EXPOSE!

You will feel SOOO much better!

Then everyone who's kicking your behiney now will come back and cheer for you

Best thing I've don't for my self esteem in years - expose, expose, EXPOSE!

And go home! You'll lose your kids and your house if you don't. Some scum bucket lying, cheating jerk will be raising your kids, Totally. Yuck.

The way i see it, instead of moving back home where you would actually have a chance at marital recovery, you are now at her front door being a doormat. How is that working for you?

Totally, last effort:

"How many people have moved back in and the WS moved out and filed for temporary custody of the kids?"

Totally, let me flip your question - how many BH's abandonded their family, moved out of their home and allowed their young kids to be exposed to an affair and a POSOM - probably NONE! So, why have you abandoned your family? I realize the incident with the POSOM in your home and the bitter taste in your mouth. Could you please explain tho why you are allowing your young children to be exposed to your WW's affair and the emotionally damaging implications of your absence? If you think that you are being analytic, cutsie or James Bondsie, you are not.

I am very concerned about your immature attitude regarding your young kids, and the emottional damage that your absence from your own home might cause. I do not recall anyone here raising this concern! It isn't about just dialoguing with Melody or anyone else here about strategy for YOU in terms of exposure or recovering your M - it's about You fullfilling your role as a father. They are are all concerned people, but they can offer only so much, especially if you do not listen. So, get back home, like Tonight, not tomorrow!

When was the last time you talked with your kids?

I have looked at your thread with concern up to now. At this point I don't have the charity to go farther.

Tom

I second this! Totally, you remind me of my WH's OW's BH. If he had grown a pair and told my WH where to go from Day 1, he probably would have run away with his tail between his legs. It's because WH moved in so easily without a fight, BH was so "Mr. Nice Guy" decent guy. My WH and OW have called him "Balless ______" from the get-go. She has no respect for him because he never stood up.

You're bowing out to a coward. Stand up. Man up. I know it's hard. We all do. But Tom is right - forget everything else. GO BE A DAD!!! Throw your WW out if you must, but get home to your children.

I have looked at your thread with concern up to now. At this point I don't have the charity to go farther. - Tom

I got a bit left, Tom. Take a break....

T2C, let me ask you a question, or at least suggest you ask yourself a question. What element/emotion/concept is it that causes you to NOT take action? It seems that the advice here is read, and seemingly accepted, but never acted upon.

I'll propose that the answer is "fear", as in fear of being responsible for any unexpected, unintended negative consequences of actions you would initiate.

In a perverse way, being "helpless", even in a disastrous situation, has a comfort value with it. EMTs are trained to instruct trauma victims, "Relax, you're in our hands now, you don't need to struggle, we will take care of you," thereby lessening the pulses of adrenaline which create opportunities for shock, and increased bleeding.

The opposite environment, in which one takes control of one's situation, is highly stressful, in which every decision is fraught with the possibilities of being criticized by outsiders, or, worse, one's own self.

But placidly riding a situation such as yours into the ground, without having the risk-acceptance necessary to grab the control yoke and try to direct the craft into a better result, is not helpful, my friend.

Strap up, and fight!

Sorry guys for the absence. Needed to read through my thread a few more times. I talked to my new lawyer and he is behind me 100% on whatever route I want to take. I will be and I promise I will be moving back home this weekend. I know I have said this a number of times but this time is for real. The lawyer gave me some advice that helped me out. The reason for this weekend is so my wife doesn't take the kids while I'm at work if it comes down to that. She is a teacher and is out for the summer so I think we may end up playing tug a war with the kids.

On another note this is the text I just sent to the OM.

" Look, you mess with my life, I mess with yours. You continue, I continue. You push me, I push back. Get the picture? Stay the heck away from my wife or you're going to fully realize what I'm capable of. That means quit talking to her through facebook, Texting, or whatever your using to communicate. Also if you ever step foot in my yard, my house, or my place of employment, I will have you arrested for trespassing."

Please believe me this time I am going all the way. Thanks for all the help and the hopefully the upcoming help I will need to get through this.

We will be waiting to hear. (where is that foot tapping emotion?)

Here it is Logan.

And I second it.

Oh, oh I know, I know.

T2c is too busy moving back home to be answering his thread.

Geeez LR give the man another hundred breaks.

Alright after battling a bout of depression this whole week I have now moved back home. Got my copy of SAA in the mail today an have started reading it. Now waiting to see what the ww does since she wasn't home when I got here. Right now cutting the grass that hasn't been cut since a month ago when I cut it last. Now ready for your help.

"Originally Posted By: markos

Originally Posted By: bruinsb How do you control your emotions and fears?

The way you are talking about it, endlessly: stop doing that. You are causing your own emotions by your actions. Don't talk about it, don't dwell on it.

I have six children and I constantly have to tell them "You can do something even if you are afraid, even if you don't want to." It's as simple as that. For example, one of my children will sometimes spontaneously decide he doesn't want to put his head under the running water from the shower to wash his hair. I'll hear all sorts of whining "I'm scared!!!!!" And I'll say "Okay, you are scared, but that's not stopping you from washing your hair. Do it anyway, even though you are scared."

There's no "how" do you control the emotions. Take a deep breath and focus on DOING what you need to do, and quit using your feelings as an excuse not to. When you start posting about what you are DOING instead of what you are FEELING, you will find that it turns out you will FEEL a lot better."

Thanks Marcos for this even though it was said on another thread. It finally click in my head.

Sorry I just copied and pasted not sure how to work the quote button yet.

Good job.

Is she still in contact with OM? Did you see your lawyer?

Saw lawyer. He said he will do what ever I want to do. Told me to move back in the house. Last I checked through my cousin she was still posting things on his Facebook page. Haven't seen no text go to his phone, but there is a new number that is following the same pattern as before but I can't figure out whose it is. Spokeo just tells me it is a landline out of Georgia, but I think it is a google voice number that may be linked to OM's cell phone. The reason I think it
is a Google voice is because the landline number is able to send text to ww cell phone. I have had somebody call the number and it just rings and then goes to voicemail but it is a generic voicemail so I don't know who it is.

If anybody knows how to trace this number I would appreciate the help.

Also nobody thinks this marriage can be saved except me and you guys. Not even my own family thinks it can be saved. My family supports me every other way but keep telling me it is over.

Well have they dealt with infidelity? Probably not, and we have.

Are you on ADs for your depression?

So now that you're back at home get a keylogger on that computer and put a VAR on her vehicle.

What Plan A plans do you have prepared?

Not on AD's yet but might have to to get me through this. May go tomorrow since my Dr is open on Saturday for a few hours.

No my parents have never been through infidelity. They have been married going on thirty years now. They got married on Pearl Harbor Day and have been using and inside joke saying they have been fighting ever since.

Plan A is to be the husband that she thought I couldn't be.

Cut the grass like she wanted me to.

Learn to hang of my son's clothes using her system which I have learned. She said I wouldn't learn her system.

Help with the boys more.

Tell her she is beautiful, even though for years she wouldn't believe me.

I know there is more but these are some of the things she listed in one of the questionnaires I managed to get her to fill out.

I know we need UA time together but I don't think that is going to happen at this moment.

Thanks BH for coming back.

Of course, my friend.

Ok so when will she be home?

Can you install a keylogger before she gets home?

What about having something for dinner ready?

Have you told OM's BW they are still in contact?

She has already made it home.

Will have to look at a keylogger if she leaves again.

OM was not married. He did have a girlfriend while seeing my WW. But a few days after I busted him in my house the OM broke up with his GF. I then found out through my cousin who is still friends with him on Facebook that he had a new GF. About ten days after dating her he got engaged to her but then after about a week or so they broke up.

I may be able to cook dinner.

So what was her response about you being back?

Keep an eye on who his new woman might be and let her know ASAP if there's contact.

Do you smell good and look good? Are you in a good mood?

Do remember the carrot and stick of Plan A? Carrot and Stick of Plan A

She hasn't said a word to me yet.

I will keep an eye out on any new woman OM might get involved with.

Not really, still cutting the grass. Will have to hit the showers when I'm done.

She just came home without the boys. She just walked into the house and said when I was ready to talk she would be inside. I know this is going to lead to an argument, what do I do.

Control yourself and DO NOT ARGUE.

If she says anything that you don't like you keep repeating "I know we can have a very wonderful, romantic M but I will not have 3 in my M".

If she gets snotty you repeat it and add "you want a cup of ice (or cookie or potato chip but I was staying with the summer theme).

I didn't argue with her, but she is leaving. The only problem is that she didn't bring my boys home. I will have to go Monday and file for a legal separation and get a custody hearing. Although she will probably win since she has the better schedule.

Where are the boys? Go get them.

I think you need to call your lawyer back. We're still here for you.

I wouldn't bet on this. Remember what state you're in. Did you ever show her that message from the felon that you were told to show her? You do remember the one I'm talking about, right? And if not, why not?

You tell her that she is free to leave but that she will NOT be taking the kids with her. You will not allow your children to be exposed to the kind of "man" that doesn't have enough freaking sense to not do things that will get his sorry [censored] sent to prison. You let her know that you will not file for divorce, that you only do marriage. Make HER do all the hard work. Let her know if she wants out this badly, then she files. But also let her know that if she does choose to file then you will be counter-filing on grounds of adultery and seeking full custody of your children. Then you tell her that you'll be having POSOM subpoenaed for testimony and have all his phone and email records paraded in full view in a court of law. You can also let her know that his criminal past will also come out in court and will probably play a major part in custody. This is all very easy to do in this state. South Cackalacky is bass-ackwards in a lot of ways, but you have a distinct advantage in this arena in this state. USE IT DAMMIT!

t2c, I getting tired of asking you questions and telling you things over and over and not getting timely responses, and I'm sure everyone else is as well. You better get cracking and start doing what you're told to do WHEN YOU ARE TOLD TO DO IT or you're going to find yourself completely alone in this. I don't say this to be a butthole, but it is what it is. Nobody here has time to waste on someone that doesn't care about his marriage as much as we do.

Man up, if for no other reason, for your kids.

Tigerwes, that is why I finally came home. I'm manning up. The problem with the kids is that we both have legal rights to them. She can't take them while I am at the house but no sooner as I go to work then she can leave with them until one of us files and we have a temporary custody hearing.

My lawyer also told me the same thing about having the full advantage and he is willing to fight for what ever I want not like the other lawyer that told me to just settle out of court.

I haven't showed her the message yet but I did send him the message that you wrote I think, about him messing with my life I am going to mess with his life. I also added at the end of that message that is he set foot in my workplace, house, or on my land I would have him arrested for trespassing.

And sorry I haven't answered your question over the past couple weeks, I do apologize. I need all the help I can get and don't want to lose none of ya'lls support. I think my nerves took a ride on the tallest roller coaster today but I made it and feel better.

Where are your boys? Can you go get them?

I could but I think a fight would insure. So I am going to let it blow over for tonight and get them tomorrow.

Also I need to know if I done the right thing. She wanted me to leave until July since her nephew is down for a month. She asked could I do that for her. I then asked her what she has done for me. I said what have I wanted for two months. She said it was over and then asked again would I wait until July to move back in. I calmly told her no and I wasn't going to argue about it. That is where the conversation ended. Did I do right, wrong, partly right, or partly wrong.

Perfectly done. Don't back down either, because she will come back at you for a better solution that suits her, not you.

Are you getting your boys today?

Are you getting your boys today?

Ditto again.

Update?

BH

You forgot to add the

And yes we see that you are on t2c

Was spending time with my kids before giving them back to the ww. Unfortunately for right now until one of us files we both have legal rights to the boys and until I can find another job with better hours she has the advantage since she is a teacher and is out for the summer. Now don't get me wrong I will fight with every inch of my life when the custody battle begins.

I do feel a little better knowing I'm in my house and in control of my life a little more than I was a week ago.

Now just need to figure out next step.

Welcome back to the night shift t2c. Good job on spending the time with the boys.

Ok. So do you think she is still in contact with OM? What has she said about your M?

You're doing a stellar plan A?

Hard to Plan A when she is not here. I was nice to her when we had our talk on Friday. I complimented her on a good job of setting up the pool we had bought for the kids before all this happen. I also didn't raise my voice when we talked. I was calm and explained to her that I was moving back in because the boys needed me back home. This is where her foggyness showed through.

Apparently she has potty trained my 3 year old and she told me if I moved back home my 3 year old would relapse and not be potty trained any more.

During the conversation she asked would I wait until July to move back home since she had her nephew down for a month. I politely asked her what has she given me over the past two months. I asked her what have I wanted. She said reconciliation but that is not going to happen. She then asked me would I give her until July, and I calmly said no and then told her the discussion was over because I wasn't going to argue.

Did I do the right thing, I think it was Tigerwes that said I did a good job. Any other opinions is more than welcomed.

Any ideas on how to plan a better when she has moved out.

Please listen to these excellent radio clips of a BH and WW living apart and what Dr. Harely advises him to do.

Radio Clip on a BH Plan Aing his WW from afar
Segment #2
Segment #3

Excellent clips BH.

So I need to fill the EN's that I can fill from a distance. Also I should go ahead and.expose to the rest of the people I thought about exposing to. I plan on doing all the friends she has at church but should I expose to the friends that she teaches with or do I hold off since this affair didn't start at work.

Also should I apologize for not doing my part in the marriage like Dr. Harley says in the clip.

We can always apologize for not doing our parts in our Marriages. The best apology is actions. Show her you're sorry for your part in the Marriage.

I would not expose at her work if they don't work together.

I'm concerned about the trickle exposure effect.

Read this and see if it answers your questions. Also, remind me whom you did expose to?
Exposure 101

You're back at home and should be doing your best Plan A. What was she getting from OM that she wasn't getting from you?

This is what you need to concentrate on. Carrot and Stick of Plan A

I exposed to just her family and they all took her side like she was doing nothing wrong. I am hoping that if I expose to the friends at church they will have a greater effect since her parents go to the same church.

The only EN I know he meet that was high on her list was communication since they texted each other back and forth for hours each day. I know SF wasn't an EN high on her list.

Did you expose to your family?

What are you doing to meet her EN for conversation?

Yes, I exposed to my family. They are on my side except with the fact of trying to save the marriage. Nobody on my side believes the marriage can be saved except everybody on this board.

Really don't know how to start a conversation right at this moment. Any ideas?

What is she interested in?

Have you seen these?
How To Make Your Wife Happy
Conversation Is Boring

She likes the beach, camping, she didn't use to like watching movies until we separated. She also likes to read.

Ok good, that's a start. So any of those, that you're interested in also?

I like all of them except the reading. Although now with everything that has happen and all the reading I have done it has begun to grow on me.

She has hid her Facebook page now.

So do you know if she's still in contact with OM?

Can your cousin still see her page?

Ok so you need to talk to her about these things. Can you make a trip together to go camping? Just the two of you? You need to be doing a stellar Plan A.

What can you think of?

He sent her a text yesterday at 2 pm but she didn't respond unless they started talking over Facebook.

No my cousin can't because she befriended my whole family and the people I work with that she was friends with on Facebook.

I could try, don't know if she would go for it at this point.

Yes expose this to her church friends.

Does she pay her phone bill or you?

Do not let her conduct her affair in your home. Did you ever get the book SAA?

I will expose.

We are on a family plan so we both pay the bill.

I finally got it in the mail and have made it to chapter six.

Good job.

Have you read about John and Sue?

Yes I have read about john and sue or at least as much of their story that is through chapter six.

Just got my boys. But I will still be on throughout the day for further advice.

Can you afford calling the coaching center?

At least email the show? Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com.

I may be able to afford it. I will have to look at my finances.

I definitely need some advice on this one. My five year old asked me today what was going on between me and his mom. I definitely want to tell him but don't really know how to do it. I think he will possibly be my biggest ally in this whole situation.

I would really find the money and get a plan from the MB coaches.

Yes you need to tell him the truth. Please let me know what you think. Let us know what your DS5 says.

Found a radio clip from Dr. Harley telling children even as young as 4.

The Harley's discuss telling the children even as young as 4 about the affair [/quote]

That explains a lot BH. I think I am going write something up and post it on here and get your opinion.

I agree with Dr. Harley that if my ww love the kids the way she suppose to them she would have never done this or since she has done it then she would stop and try to fix it.

Well when waywards are wayward they aren't thinking. That is why the BS Has to drive the bus. Trying to figure out the thinking of a wayward will drive you crazy so don't waste your energy.

Spend your energy on making sure the affair is dead. Taking care of you and your boys. Being the best Husband that she fell in love with.

So how is the conversation going?

Alright BH I know this is going to sound stupid and you can hit me with whatever you want to but what would be a good way to start a conversation with WW considering she might not want to talk at all.

Just don't hit to hard.

Listen to this and come back and tell me what you think. Pay attention to the last part.
Radio clip on conversation

If I listened to the segment correctly I should start off by asking what is making her so upset towards me.

Yes. You need to make sure you are listening to her and remain calm if she tells you something you don't like. Maybe have a pen and paper and write down what she says.

Read this and pay attention to the friends and enemies of good conversation.
Conversation is Boring

What happened when you told your boys?

I'm working on how to tell them. That is my job tonight when I get off work. I'm going to jot some stuff down and then post on here to get your opinion.

Only telling one of the boys because the youngest is only three.

I agree to just tell your DS5. You heard in the clip what Dr. Harley says to say, correct?

BH, this is what I have so far. I think he should be able to understand.


DS5, I would like to explain to you what is going on between Daddy and Mommy. Your Mommy is having and affair which is not a good thing in the eyes of God. Mommy has found someone else that she loves more than Daddy. This guy has become Mommy's best friend when Daddy should be Mommy's best friend. Mommy is willing to sacrifice your happiness for this other man. I'm sorry Mommy is doing this to our family and is willing to hurt our family for this other man. Daddy is trying to repair this but Mommy does not want to at the moment. She feels we will all be happy if we live separately.

I would say Mommy has a boyfriend. Married people are not supposed to have boyfriends or girlfriends when they are married. Daddy wants to do everything to keep our family together. Mommy shouldn't have a boyfriend other than daddy. You shouldn't do what Mommy is doing to our family.

X 2. To the point and in words a child can understand.

I like what ya'll wrote a lot. I will use what ya'll wrote instead.

Good. So when are you telling him?

What has your conversation been like with WW? How's your Plan A? Is she still at home?

Shooting for tomorrow since I will have them for father's day.

She hasn't answered yet.

Cleaned up most of the house today before I went to work.

She is living with her parents at the moment.

Seven year wedding anniversary is in nine days. This really hurts.

Just want to jump in here. I told my DS3 that his Daddy didn't love his Mommy (me) anymore. That this made Mommy very sad. That Mommy hopes that one day Daddy will love Mommy again. He said, "I'm sorry you are sad Mommy. I love you Mommy." So during my weaker moments when I cried, he knew why and often expressed that. Otherwise he used to think he was making me sad and I didn't want that.

Did you ever write Dr. Harley ? Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com.

Here are some more clips I want you to listen to. Tell me what you think.
Please listen to these excellent radio clips of a BH and WW living apart and what Dr. Harely advises him to do.

Radio Clip on a BH Plan Aing his WW from afar
Segment #2
Segment #3

Just told my DS5 what was going on and he cried like a five year old should.

It was a good father's day overall except for this morning when I found out my ww wife saw the other man on June 4th. He posted a picture of them laying together on his FB page. My cousin is sending me the picture. I just trying to figure out who had my kids because I didn't have them. This is going to be one long marathon.

Weren't you trying to get an order together so that OM can't be around your kids?

Doesn't he have a record?

Yes I was. I was stupid and thought it was over between them. I am calling my lawyer in the morning. I hope and pray my kids weren't there but if they were this will be a major strike against ww if she doesn't want to work it out and this makes it to the courts.

Good job on finally telling DS5 the truth. Happy Father's Day.

It is a strike against her. She's an addicted wayward. You will have to start protecting your kids. She isn't being a mother when she's running around with an ex felon and putting her kids in danger.

Protect your kids.

Haven't heard back from the lawyer yet, I think he was in court all day today.

With the information I found out today I will be trying to get the posom arrested for trespassing since I found out he came to my work place while I was on vacation and this is after I sent him the message warning him.

Also WW sent me a text tonight stating since I'm living in the house that I can pay the bills.

Can you go to the cops and file a RO?

Is her name still on the bills? Then she's responsible for half.

Her name is on the mortgage and the car. Those are the two main ones I am worried about getting her to pay.

I am going to look into that today if I can't get him arrested for trespassing.

Haven't heard back from the lawyer yet, going to call him again tomorrow.

My WW told me that if I'm living in the house then I can pay the bills. How do I go about telling her that she is welcome to come back home without sounding demanding or needy.

Send her a pleasant note saying
We're still married and I'd be more than happy for you to move back into our marital home.

Or

You're more than welcome to come back home.

Lawyer finally answered back. He said that I can't force her to pay any of the household bills unless we go to court.

He also said since it has been a week since the OM was in there he wouldn't have him arrested because now it would look like revenge.

Now I am beside myself trying to figure out how to pay the mortgage on the house. This is going to be tough.

Document everything.

Can you file for a request for financial assistance?

I can look into financial assistants. If I didn't have a car payment I probably could swing making the mortgage, light bill, water, cable, security system for house.

Thought about taking the car to ww's parents house and dropping it off and telling her she can make the payments on it. I do have a truck I can fix and it is paid for.

How would I document this. Would it be considered abandonment even though I don't have the kids.

Date it and just the facts and leave emotion out of it and only facts.
DOCUMENT DOCUMENT DOCUMENT

Maybe you need to file to protect yourself financially. WW are known for sapping BH financially. Remember filing doesn't mean you have to complete it.

Would you send the note a handwritten note or would a email suffice.

Two days till anniversary.

An email should suffice.

Are you going to talk to your lawyer about financial assistance?

Can you plan to be with your boys on that day and do something really fun? Do not be alone. Can you do this?

My mind is going about a mile a minute thinking about tomorrow. I want to send my ww a message about coming home to the marital house. Should I leave it at that or should I try and apologize for my part that went wrong in the marriage.

I have also noticed with my snooping that she has stopped Texting the Georgia number she was Texting. This stopped two days after I moved back home and she moved out so I don't know if this is a good thing or bad.

Haven't you already apologized for your part?

Found the email and all I really told her was that I understand what I did wrong. Don't know if that is considered an apology.

I think you should get into Plan B and write her a Plan B letter. Have you followed jah's thread? He is implementing Plan B today.

You can follow the Plan B template and change it to your situation, but it has an apology in it.
Tell me what you think.
Plan B letter samples

So I should skip plan a even though I haven't implemented it very well.

Can you give me a link to Jah's thread.

The email I sent ww telling her I understood what I did wrong in the marriage was sent two days after I caught the OM in my house.

Well I would start to prepare for Plan B and as you're preparing for Plan B implement the best Plan A until you go into Plan B.
Does that make sense?
Jah's Thread
Here's another good thread to read of a BH preparing for Plan B/D from thier WW.
looking_for_help's thread

Hey BH, it makes perfect sense.

I was reading through some of LFH's thread, how do I write Dr. Harley personally?

Email your questions to Joyce Harley at mbradio@marriagebuilders.com

Let us know what he says. If you email it today you might get a response before the end of the week. Make sure you put something in your subject line to help it not go into spam.

Ok I will try again. I sent an email to Joyce Harley back on April 18th. It must have went to the spam folder. I will have to try different subject line this time.

After you send it notify the mods to let them know you had problems last time and you want to make sure they get it this time.

We had one poster that sent it 3 times and the MODS got involved and the Harleys finally received it.

Notify at the bottom of each post and then let them know.

Also let them know what email addy you're sending it from so they can watch out for it.

Please do not give up on it.

I will not give up on my marriage until the judge says it is over.

Just sent the email and just notified the mods.

I received your notification and have emailed Dr Harley & Joyce. I don't expect an immediate response because they are out of the country right now but should return in about a week.

If you don't hear something from Joyce within about two weeks,,please recontact me!

Thank you JustUss.

Good t2c it looks like you will get a response.

Keep us updated and in the mean time Plan A like a rockstar.

Did you send her the email yet? HAve you talked with her?

This is what I have so far as the email I want to send ww. Do you think I need to add anything to it.

" I have been doing some heavy thinking over the past couple of weeks. Through it all I have come to the conclusion that I am not ready to give up on my family.

We're still married and I'd be more than happy for you to move back into our marital home. I believe the kids would be happy for that to."

Also add I apologize to you for my part in creating an environment that helped make your affair with xyz possible.

I foolishly pursued my own choices without understanding my responsibility to meet your most important emotional needs. I was not there for you when you needed me the most, and we are now both suffering for my mistake.

I am willing to avoid the mistakes I've made in the past and create a new life for both of us that will meet your needs. But I cannot do that until you end your relationship with xyz for once and for all.

I want to apologize for not responding for the past four days, but I had some of the best days I have had since all this started. I spent all four days with both my sons. It was great.

I will add what you wrote BH and send the email out. This will probably be her last chance, she will then have to deal with the consequences of her actions.

Glad to hear it and keep enjoying those boys because even if your marriage doesn't survive your relationship with them is what is important.

So when do you plan to send this out? In the same time your preparing for Plan B, correct?

Tomorrow, and I will get started on a plan b letter.

Good.

Also I would line up an IM also. Do you have one?

Waiting on a reply back from the WW from the email.

Been using the past few days to try and sort some things out. Been looking at plan b letters and trying to figure out what to put in to mine if it comes down to that.

Not sure who to use as my IM right off hand. Still looking into that one.

Also haven't heard back from the Harley's yet so I just notified the mods again.

How long ago did you send WW the email?

Did you send the email to the Harleys again also?

Just a few hours, but she is up in virginia carry her nephew back home and she is staying the week. So she may not answer right away.

I have sent the mods a notice and asked them do I need to send the email again to the Harley's.

Yes send it to the Harleys again. They were out of the country for a bit and just got back. So they probably have tons of emails to get through.

Another good show of a H Plan A'ing from afar, but keep in mind they don't think she's still involved with OM.

Tell us what you think.
Radio clip of Plan A'ing from afar
Segment #2
Segment #3

Just got an email from JustUss2, she has notified the Harley's of my email so hopefully I will get a response soon.


I am fixing to listen to the radio clips you just posted and I think they might go along with my situation since I don't think my WW is with anybody at the moment. Not sure at the moment but I haven't seen anything out unusual on her Facebook or when I check the cell phone website for text messages. I think now I just have to get through to her to change her mind and work on the marriage.

This is one marathon I am ready to run.

BH, I think those last clips portrayed my marriage right to the tee minus the fact I didn't have an affair, but everything else was spot on.

Yes I thought it sounded like your situation (except you didn't have the affair). So what do you think about Dr. Harley's advice?

Hopefully you hear from the Harleys soon.

I think I am going to have to step up my game and show her that I can be the husband that she wants me to be. I am going to listen to the clips a few more times to make sure I fully understand.