My husband has been having an affair with a co-worker, I should say his subordinate. She is recently divorced, no kids. He travels alot for work so the affair was easily concealed and happened primarily at work meetings and functions. We have two boys 5 and 18 mos. Since I have found out about the affair, he went form saying he does not want a divorce, to I miss her (ow) to I want to try, to I want to see if I can date her outside the office (that one felt really good)
I did plan A when he said he did not want the divorce thru his ambivalence until he told me he wanted to separate so he could figure things out. I told him to leave the house immediatlly.
Since then he has been flip flopping. The dating outside the office just happened last week, he was suppose to see her in OH, but I told him if he went we were done.
He did not go..he told his boss, he has already told most of his family and friends. The OW is suppose to be resigning, I will believe it when it happens.
I anonymously sent an e-mail to HR, and his counterpart at work. I have a list of names from form linked in that work there that can expose as well. I am doing this anonomously because I really do not want them to find out is me, things are hard enough for me and the boys at home.
His boss is disapointed with him but will not fire him, my H told him it was over and the OW was resigning. He has a meeting in OH next week and I would like him to feel uncomfortable, right now he feels relief, like he dodged a bullet with work. His ambivalence is killing me. I am nervouse one the OW leave they will really start dating outside the office, although he live in NJ and she lives in OH.

Need help deciding if I should further expose. I do not think HR will do anything, I sent the email a few days ago and I have heard nothing. I also need to stay annymous, further expsosure people could suspect me. I sound crazy!

The problem with trying to remain anonymous is that most people won't take something like this as seriously as they would if there was a name on the note. They might even ignore your exposure to them. Who do they have to respond to or answer to? Heck most people who haven't had to deal with infidelity don't even much care if someone is having a fling at work.

You'll need to get more serious and more of "a problem" for them to get them to act, IMO. Let them know that your WH has been having an A with a co worker and using company resources(time, phone, whatever). I think for them to take this situation seriously you'll have to come out and stand up for yourself.

How long have you been in a plan A? Sounds like you need to do a couple of weeks of a stellar plan A and then into a dark plan B. This can't continue as it is. Doing a wishy washy plan A will just enable the A.

Glad you made it to the site. Welcome.

Unless you're an expert in computers, your 'anonymous' emails can be tracked to you. The email itself contains headers that specify your IP address which will likely point straight at the computer you used to send the email.

Fortunately, you don't have to worry about anonymity. To save this marriage, you need to fight for it proudly, vocally, and out in the open. Sending anonymous notes isn't going to solve anything--it'll just push it farther underground.

Further exposure is necessary to end this affair. You need to tell everyone who has in influence in your H's life. Not through anonymous notes, but proudly signed with your name and phone number. The vets will be along soon to guide you through this process. Be strong. Lean on them if you need.

I did plan A for a month, the week we were on vacation I tried so hard but by the end of the trip he was already feeling conflicted. I understand about not being anonymous, but my husband is about to go on antidepressents, finally! we are in therapy separately but same therapist and he has already exposed himself to his boss. Right now the only thing we are talking about are the kids. Like everyone whi is posting, I am not sleeping, suffering for anxiety and have extreme jealous rage against the OW.

Hehehe.... You said he "exposed himself", hehe!

Just kidding to lighten things up. Everyone is right, the exposure needs to be done out in the open so you can show your husband and everyone else that you are going to FIGHT for your marriage.

mason, this is a very ineffective exposure. Anonymous exposures are meaningless because they can be easily dismissed as gossip. I doubt your "exposure" impressed anyone. I know I would dismiss it myself.

If you want to save your marriage, you are going to have to do this in a way where your exposure has credibility. I would do it this way:

1. send a certified letter to the Director of Human Resources and cc a key VP and your H's supervisor advising them of the affair.

2. make up a list of close family and friends and call them up and expose the affair. Call his parents, close sibs, your parents, family and pastor. Tell them all about the affair and ask them to use their influence to persuade your H to end his affair

3. expose to all children over the age of 4. Tell them about their dad's filthy affair, how it impacts you and why adultery is immoral. if you dont' tell them this, you can be assured your H will blame the problems on you

4. Find the skankho's facebook page and copy and paste all her contacts into a WORD doc. Cherry pick her parents, family members and ALL married friends. Send them all a letter telling them about the OW's affair with your H and ask them to use their influence to persuade her to leave your H alone.

SIGN IT WITH YOUR FULL NAME, ADDRESS AND PHONE # and tell them to contact you for evidence. Ask that her PARENTS call you personally

THAT is how you do exposure, Mason. You have no reason to hide behind anonymity. You must tell people who you are so you can TAKE FULL CREDIT FOR YOUR EXPOSURE. You are not the one that has something to hide.

Are you positive that he told his boss? WSs lie...they will swear on their children's lives, stare you straight in the eyes...then LIE. Verify this if you haven't done so.

If he did tell him, he told him a spun story and it sounds like the boss is handling it under the table. That is why she needs to send a certified letter to HR director and cc the boss. That way, no one gives into the temptation to deep six her letter. I assure you that many bosses are tempted to hide stuff like this and handle it off line. If the letter goes out to everyone, then no one can hide it.

Thank you, yes he did tell his boss and it looks like he dodged a bullet and no action will be taken. All of his family and friends know already, he told everyone. I think he was either trying to relieve guilt or looking for some type of acceptence.
I understand about the anonymous part. I am passive and want the word out but do not want to look like the crazy wife.

I have a list of coworkers etc.. and I am prepared to move further with the exposure. I want hos job to feel like a pressure cooker.

As long as your exposure is done in a loving way, you will not look like the crazy wife. If your WH or OW find out that you are going to expose, they will paint you as the crazy wife. Did YOU talk to any of his family to tell them? When he told them, what did they say to him?

He told them WHAT exactly? And how do you know he told them? Have you spoken to them personally?


Its ok to be passive but not if you want to save your marriage. Very few people will think you are crazy, and if they do, so what? Is your goal to save your marriage or is to garner approval from everyone?



I would go higher and expose this to Human Resources where it will count. It is ok to expose to coworkers, but they will just gossip.

Start with his family, the OW's family and Human Resources.

What Mel said, Mason. Do not assume that your H was forthcoming to his employer with his actions. Verify. They may likely give you some sloppy, self-serving crap about how they can't disclose employee information, yadda yadda. It doesn't matter what their response is - the important thing is for you to confirm that the correct information is in their hands. Talk to family and employers yourself.

Mason, you are in a battle. It's a battle for your marriage and the life you know right now. This is not a time for wimpy action. You need to enter into this with grit and determination. Go save your marriage.

Try to fogbabble back to your WH. Waywards are selfish and want their ego stroked always.

Tell him that him ending this is saving HIM and his job. HIS money, etc. They understand that stuff.

Meanwhile expose skankyho. Do it.

Tell wh that unless he has no contact with skankyho, HIS job could be on the line and she could sue for sexual harassment. Again, appeal to the wayward side of him to get him to side with you until the affair is 100 percent dead.

Meanwhile plan A and B. And whack him with the carrot and stick of it too.

You can even call btw, an airline to confirm if somebody is on the flight if you're worried skanky is on the same business flights as wh is. Everytime I called, Delta gave me all the info I needed to know

Oh...yea, I pretended to be her (the skankyho in my case)sister. I pretended to the airline there was a devastating family emergency and I had to reach her upon their flight landing.

I did speak with his mom and his sisters, everyone is extremely dissappointed and sad and are hoping we can work it out.
Not sure, he is at a work meeting with her this week and I think next week as well. I am sure he told his boss and he told his boss it was over. ( he told friend of his this- not me) Not sure I believe that.
It is just so hard to try to make sense out of all of this.
Having a bad crying day today.

(((mason))))


It comes down to his not protecting his boundaries. He allowed someone else to meet a top EN of his and he liked it, it felt good, so he allowed it to continue until he started to "feel" something for her. It's endorphins. She could have been anyone.

Work the plan A. Have you read the carrot and the stick of plan A?

If you don't want a D, don't talk D. Tell him so.

Show him that you are willing to negotiate new "terms" for your M, but you will never allow a third party in it.

Don't argue or even try to engage in any type of critical discussions. He will actually go out of his way to start fights. It's his way of convincing himself that what he doing is because of YOU. It's his justification for his bad behavior. Don't fall into the trap. It's what he wants you to do...DON'T.

Be pleasant but firm.

I think you need a to get your ducks in a row for plan B. Do you understand plan B and why just planning Aing a WS doesn't usually end the A? Please read up on it. Your WH is deeply entrenched and you're going to need to work these plans to have a chance at R.

He is no longer living in the house, Can Is till do plan A. The only thing we are talking about right now are the kids. I do not want a divorce, he is still ambivalent. I have told him that I want to work on things but I can not do it with three people in the marriage. I told him she needs to be completely gone. That has not happened yet because they are still working togther. She is supposedly his giving her notice (I doubt that)

The therapist says he is clinically depressed and was probably depressed before the affair even started. ( i do not think that is an excuse) she told me to sit backk and try not to win him back at this point because that is what OW is trying to do.

I am so angry, sad, confused and like everyone else hates this more than anything.

Okay, you've made your position clear with him. Good. But you still need to create disruption in the affair by informing his employer. Have you read the letter on this site for informing employers? Based on their work relationship, his employer could be subject to a sexual harassment lawsuit caused by this A. Employers don't like to hear the word "lawsuit," believe me. Why have you not done this yet?

You're right - depression does not excuse the terrible actions of having an A. When one person in a marriage is depressed, the couple works on it together. They don't run out and add more depression and grief by having an affair.

Yes you can do your Plan A when your WH is living outside of the home, others have done it.

mason, it will be real important to expose this affair at work. it is no fun to have an affair when everyone is watching. Have you exposed the affair to OW's family? If not, I would get her parents information and call them up. You might also call the OW and tell her there is no future in her affair because seh will be eternally hated by your children and the in-laws for breaking up your marriage.

Here is a good letter for workplace exposure. It should be sent to the director of Human Resources, key VP and both their bosses.

Developed by Brits Brat, board member and corporate attorney. This letter should be sent to the Director of Human Resources and cc�d to the adulterers supervisors and a key VP. It is critical that this letter be sent to several people so no one person can give into the temptation to bury the issue.

To Whom It May Concern:

This letter is to bring a matter to your attention that may be a violation of your Company's Code of Conduct and/or other policies, procedures and business ethics.

WS and WS are involved in an extramarital affair that is taking place, primarily, in the workplace. Aside from the potential sexual harassment claims this situation presents, it also involves the inappropriate use of company resources and assets. WS and WS are using company time and company resources to further their affair. If you check the call histories on their office and cell phones along with their workstation computers, you will find the two of them are spending an inordinate amount of what should be productive work time to further their sexual relationship.

If you have any questions, please call me at xxx-xxxx. Otherwise, I will anticipate a response from you once you have investigated these concerns and taken appropriate corrective action.

Regards,

BS
_________________________

Facebook exposure letters

Dear friend of Joe Scumbag,

It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of his friends should know the kind of person he really is. Joe had an affair with my wife, Sally, from Aug until September. I believe that his friends should know this, so you can protect your marriage from him. My wife and I have 2 small daughters and this affair has almost wrecked our marriage.

I would be happy to provide the evidence to anyone who asks.

I would appreciate it if someone would notify his parents and ask them to call me at xxx-www-xxxx.

Thank you, BH

Dear friend of Skankyhola,

It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of her friends should be aware that Skanky is having an affair with my husband, Joe. We have been married for 5 years. They have been having this affair since October according to the evidence.
I would be happy to provide the evidence to anyone who asks.

I would ask that you use your influence with Skanky to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husbands around her because she is no friend to marriage.

I would appreciate it if someone would notify her parents and ask them to call me at xxx-www-xxxx.
Thank you, BW

If you don't try and win him back for a few weeks, then you will be handing him to the OW. Do you want to do that? I don't think your therapist has the slightest idea what she is talking about and is giving you bad advice.. I bet the OW HOPES you do nothing to win him back so she can have him.

Also, surely your "therapist" understands WHY he is depressed? Adulterers are typically depressed because they are living in violation of their conscience. Being bad does not bring happinenss, it brings depression.

mason, you can do Plan A for a couple of weeks, but Plan A also means exposing the affair in a strategic, effective way. I see many overlooked opportunities here where you could inflict some major blows to the affair.

When did he move out of the house? You didn't mention that in your first post, but I may have missed it.

Mason, while you dally the affair is becoming entrenched and he is becoming more mired in it. Why have you not taken the advice given to you and done a full-on, proper exposure?

This OW is not going to quit her job or she would have announced it by now, and she hasn't, correct? Your H has told your that to get you off his back so he can carry on with his A in peace. Which is exactly why you should expose to his employers.

I also re-read your first post and caught that she is his subordinate. Mason, this is a hand grenade! All you have to do is pull the pin and lob it into the HR dept! This is prime soil for a sexual harassment lawsuit, do you understand? An employer getting a letter like the one written by Brit's Brat is going to break out in a complete rash and will address it! Why have you not used this??

Thanks, I have been trying to communicate better with him, but then I get upset because I do not want to be his friend. He goes on the meds on Monday after seeing his doctor. I feel like I have so much riding on the medication working and then I feel like I am waiting for the final blow of him telling me he is choosing her. Not sure how to prepare myself for that.

Did you want to try to save your marriage?

Yes,
I want to save my marriege, I found out he saw her on this past Saturday, and I am sure slept with her again. She flew in from OH to see him. He admitted that he was out with her. I only was suspicious because he did not answer one text or his phone at all, when my son wanted to say good night to him. Sad.
After he told me all through texting, I just did not respond at all. I think I should start Plan B. He still says he does not know what he wants and he has not made a decision of his family or the OW. Aslo, she was suppose to be leaving her job (she reprts to my husband) and she is not. My husbands boss said as long as you keep this prefessional he does not care what happens.
Not sure what to do at this point. I do not want to talk or see him at all not even when he gets the kids this weekend.
I feel like such a sucker that I still want to try, but I am not sure how much more I can take. I will feel even worse if he decides he wants her. His decision this weekend tells me that is what he wants.

Why have you not done a proper exposure of this affair, like we advised a month ago???

He exposed the affair himself to his boss etc... His boss told him as long as they can work profesionally together he is fine with it. Everyone knows at work already, his family knows, her family knows.
We had been talking more, but all he says he does not know what he wants.
I just do not know what to do. He has shown so little remorse and regard to what he has done, Cutting him off from us maybe the best thing to do. He told a friend after he saw her that hes still has not made a decision. He is not committed to the OW or me.

if you have exposed and planned A him then I suggest you go to plan B.

How long was your plan A? What did you do during plan A?

Mason,
I think it's time to let him go, tell him that you no longer will engage in this ridiculous triangle........Tell him he has made his decision to leave your marriage and be with the OW.......
Tell him you want No Contact with him while he is in the relationship with the OW....
Tell him that you love him and would like to work your marriage and get it back to a place where both of you are happy.......but only if it's the two of you.....
Let him feel what his decision really feels like.............you just watch how soon that relationship falls apart when she has to fill all his needs..........he will really see who she is and not just the fantasy woman, with no real life problems, let's see if he likes her warts and all......
When you do see him, look good, smell good and show him life for you will go on...........he will soon learn , don't just sit around waiting for him to chose you......you are better than that.......
Once you draw the line in the sand, things will change, you have to be patient this won't happen overnight, the fog will life but it will take a few weeks.......
When he picks the kids up, don't be there........stay No Contact with him, you will see how much he will miss you, don't cave when he tries to have it his way.....stay strong.

Yes, you said he told you that. Did you VERIFY this with his employer? Did you send a letter to his employer and copy it to higher-ups? That this workplace affair has great potential to end in a sexual harassment lawsuit? Have you personally spoken with his superiors to let them no in no uncertain terms that you intend to fight for your M, however you need to, and that you expect them to support the sanctity of marriage? What have YOU done in the way of exposure at his workplace?

He is now fully exposed at work up to his CEO. I used parts of the letter from this sight, especially the part about "innapropriate use of comapany funds and resources to support their affair" He is pretty pissed, he said it is defamation of chracter as he is now being investigated by his corporate attorneys over his expenses over the past year.
I am not sure that this will even end his affair, he is just pissed off that he may be fired. I am a coward though I blindly sent emails, I know I may be found out, he suspects it is me> I have denied it the way he has denied his affair that he continues to have.

You have done nothing wrong. He is upset because he did the wrong.

Tell him the next time he deny's his affair that what is he worried about then at work.

No time to reread your thread did you expose family and friends as well?

mason, what is he mad about? If there is nothing wrong with his affair, and he claimed his bosses already knew, then what is the problem? I would strongly suggest you tell him the truth about your exposure. You have done a good deed and can't very well take credit for it this way.

Did you expose to the OW's facebook friends and family like we suggested?

mason, the OWH in my sitch exposed anonymously as well. No matter. It had the same effect. Everyone knew it was him. He did it anonymously for the same reason you did - he was afraid his wife would be angry. She was. She knew it was him as well.

She apparently got over it, because as far as I know they are still together.

I would stand up and take ownership of the exposure loud and proud. What do you have to be afraid of?

He was so angry yesterday, about being under investigation for his expenses by his companies corporate attorneys. I do not want him to think I am responsible for sabbotaging his career and livelihood. I took a risk because if gets fired, he cannot pay me. I did say to him if your expenses are in line then you shoudl have nothing to worry about, but the fact is they traveled together, a lot, probably more than they shoudl of and he is the OW boss. Thanks for the support, I am scared to death of him finding out it is me, I am trying to be nice at this point. Another note: he went to OH last wknd to visit her. Their affair is still going on, he does not know I know this, and at this point it is not worth confronting him about it.

He also said his company is going to find the person that sent the notes and put legal action againts them. Not sure if he will have a defamation case or not. He seems pretty persistent to find out who sent the emails. First, I beleive his investigation will happen and see if they find anything.

He is lying. There are no grounds for legal action here. He's trying to spook you into admitting that it was you. And I would, like I said. Loud and proud. I would invite him to have his higher-ups call you for any information they might need. Think about it: how have YOU/anonymous tipster defamed his character? You told the truth.

All family and friends know, I did not expose her on facebook yet.

Nah. You did not force the company to do anything with your email, you pointed out the truth and they took action.

(Sounds to me the wayward is trying to guilt a confession out of you.) Scare tatics.
Are you afraid of him?

No, I am not afraid of him, I just do not think he would ever speak to me again if he found out I did it. He was trying to get me to tell him I did it. I think legal action is a long shot in any case. I think he wanted me to confess and then possibly the investigation would stop becasue he could say my crazy wife sent them.

You need to do this post-haste.

Expose her on FB like...yesterday!

Then I would definitely get to them before he has a chance to spin you as a loon.

"Mr. CEO? Yes, this is Mrs. Mason. I just wanted to confirm that you received my email regarding my husband's affair on your company's time. It's very important to me that you have this information, because I want to save my marriage and cannot do that without your support. I'm sure you understand that I love my husband and will do whatever it takes to save my marriage. Do you have any questions regarding the information I gave you?"

Your marriage can survive his temporary anger. It cannot survive an affair.

I agree, it can not survive this affair. After all of this and him going back to her I still have an ounce of hope left.

mason - YOU are not responsible for sabotaging his career. He and he alone did that to HIMSELF when he decided to treat his own workplace like a dating service and wh*rehouse, and decided it was okay to help himself to whatever women he could get while there.

His company will not care about that - not as long as they keep doing their jobs and making money for the company. But if he's been spending company money on this - especially falsifying expense reports to cover for an OW - THEN the company will take action. That's how the CEO of Hewlett-Packard was recently forced to resign.

That is correct, when his boss first found out about it he said I am not happy about it, but keep it professional. And yes, he did not want my husband to leave. Now that it got to the CEO, it is another matter. I remember the firing of the HP CEO, I am not sure if they will find anything, but I hope the stess kills him

Well... have you exposed to friends and OW's family?

That is like instant death to the fantasy of the A.

Just found out that not only is he being investigated so is the OW!

Justice does come after all.......fantasy is going to be filled with anger now.......probably wasn't worth losing your job.......hehe!!!

How did you find this out?

Found out through a friend that talks to my husband.

I am just hoping that this will not bring them closer together to try to support each other through this.

Think about those cop shows you see, where there are two bad guys. The cops separate them and start questioning them. Eventually they rat each other out. I suspect that is what will happen here. Because, really, waywards are selfish people with their own self-interest in mind. Your WH will be primarily concerned with his job, I think.

Typically, after exposure how long until the fog is lifted?
Thinking about telling him if he continues to see her, I am done.
I need to preserve my sanity for the holidays and try to get through them without worrying if he is with her every other weekend he does not have the kids.
Hoping for a big explosion for him at work next week after his interview with the corporate attnys.

mason, the fog lifts after he ends his affair.

My suggestion would be to finish up your exposures. If you haven't exposed to the OW's friends and family, then get that done ASAP.

Then go into Plan B. ARe you familiar with Plan B? Do you have the book Surviving an Affair?

Got it, the affair has not ended and I am familiar with Plan B. It has been 4 months of ambivalence, they are full exposed now, especially with work.

I would suggest going into Plan B real soon. Just before the holidays is a GREAT TIME to go into Plan B because it gives the WS a taste of the single life without his family. Do you have the sample letter from Surviving an Affair? If so, I would write it out and post it so folks can give you feedback.

Before you go into Plan B, I would find someone who can remain completely neutral who will be your intermediary. Her job will be to act as a SPAM filter who will only pass on pertinent information about finances and the children. When you send him the Plan B letter I would attach a visitation schedule so that you won't have anything to discuss. In the letter tell him he can pick the kids up from the driveway and drop them off outside. Under no circumstances should he come in the house. You might want to change the locks in advance so he doesn't barge in.

Additionally, you would want to put something in the letter about him never bringing your children around the OW. They should NEVER be exposed to his filthy affair.

Does he have his paycheck direct deposited to your account? He will be expected to continue to support you and pay the bills.

You will want to get this all worked out before you go into Plan B.

Have you exposed her to her family and friends on facebook? Have you personally spoken to her parents?

The investigation at work took place this week, all I know is that for now he still has a job, but he thinks there may be some changes and his boss needs to go to the board with any changes next week, so that tells me, yes they found something wrong with his expenses or the affiar and his job will not support their affair.
I did expose anonymously through a anonymous email service, he told me they are looking for the IP address of the person who sent the notes. I think he may still be trying to spook me. I do not know of any HR department to give up an anonymous complaint to the person who the complaint is about, I am sure they will want to avoid anyone going postal. Just nervous if he finds out it is me.

Why are you hiding it?

I am hiding because he will never forgive me. I understand all the logic hear of let him know it is you but i know he will never think about reconciliation if he thinks it is me, that is why I am hiding, I have two small boys and can not take any more angst or anxiety over what has happened. I am already on medication, anything else will send me over the edge. I want him to have the repercusions at work, but I would rather him think it is form someone else.

Have not posted in awhile, My H did get repercussion at work, the OW no longer reports to him and they made him sign a NC with each other during work hours. I wish he was fired. They are still seeing each other, he told me. He wants to come over on Christmas morning, I told him no, that I need to emotionally protect myself and because of the choice he made I know he does not want to be with me/us. (he still says he does not know what he wants). I told him I still want to save our marrige and family but I know that I am the only one that wants to have a future together.
I just can not tolerate sitting with him watching our boys open gifts. No need to play happy family anymore.

Mason -- is there some reason you're not using the MB approaches?

It sounds like you want to be in Plan B, but have not laid the groundwork -- or set it up to be a complete dark seperation from him.

Right now you seem to be in Plan "Be-the-pissed-off-wife-who-punishes-WH-by-not-letting-him-see-the-children-on-christmas-while-he-continues-his-affair"

Is that what you're trying to do?

I am lettinghim see the kids, just not in the morning. He is no longer living in the house, we are still in contact about the kids. I do not have an IM to go back and forth with the kids, he sees them every other weekend. We talk about nothing else, so I guess without an IM I am not in Plan B. I am not punishing him, he will pick the kids up at noon and keep them for the day. I do not know what to do, should i let him come christmas morning?

It is so confusing and sad over the holidays, all I wanted was things to be at least starting to be better by the holidays and they are not. Emotionally it is so much harder. Part of me wants him to help me with Christmas and another part of me wants to shut him out and let him know waht it feels like to be divorced.

If you are in PLan B -- BE IN PLAN B.

Get an intermediary. Do not talk to him at all (not even about the kids.)

Do you have some protection in place financially? Have you been explicit that OW may not see or be around the children?

THE OW lives in Ohio, and my husband is staying with friends so if she does come to visit him it is when he does not have the kids. (he usually stays at his moms with the kids) Financially he puts money into my account to pay the mortgagae and daycare, that has not been an issue, I need to get an IM, all of my family has kids and work full time so that is why I have not set one up yet. He has been in limbo for 5 1/2 months now, I thought the trouble with work would set him off on the right path it has not, I just want to be sure I am doing the right thing about Christmas morning. He just assumed he woule be here and got annoyed when I said I did not want him to be.

Need some advice, Afet the holidays my husband said he wanted to work on things. He broke off the affair. NC was in place. I had a week of I am sorry, I love you and I will do anything to make this work. After the week he pulled away fromme and I justthought well, we need to learn how to become comfortable around each other again. We had been separated for six months. I did expose to everyone but it did nothing. He did not move back in and we agreed to take things slow. He just told me on Thursday that he does not love me anymore and that he wants a divorce. I ammoving to Plan B, no contact, my sister will be the IM. Going to attny on Wedensday to formalize the separation. Anything else I am missing about Plan B? Also, I feel like he is in such a fog and most likely in contact again with his OW. I have lost hope. Any stories of people coming back anfter their WWH said they wanted a divorce. I have alwasy had hope and now I am so sad and angry that my marriage is over,

I don't necessarily believe that your M is over, but I've got to ask: the first time he broke off the A (because you know he's back with her now, right?) exactly how did the two of you 'work on things'? Did you read and implement anything from this site? Do the EN's questionnaire? Talk about POJA?

What did you do to recover? And if he wanted to 'work on things' why did he not move back in?

You are right back at square one, you need to expose the affair again to who ever is important to the two of them. This time from the wife......ask for help saving your marriage....
Go to your attorney and get things set up for you in terms of an agreement, go to the bank change your bank accounts and your credit cards, take care of the business part of this marriage, arrange child care between the two of you.
Now you continue to Plan A him as much as you can.....but be firm that you will not accept a relationship with him as long as there is another person in it.
Tell him that you love him and are willing to be the woman he needs, the two of you can have a better marriage so the both of you are happy........
If he won't then go Dark Plan B, do not talk to him for any reason, go through your sister and let the affair play out............watch how quickly it falls apart, when they lose everything they know and the OW has to fill all their needs it's a whole different ball game...........
Don't let him scare you, be strong, look good, smell good, and show him you are moving on without him.

Read all you can here, put a solid plan together, the vets can help you a great deal............

He has broke up with her a few times. When he told me he did not love me anymore and feelings were not coming back. We were barely intimate> I aksed him is he was going back to her he said no, he wants to be alone. This jut happened Thursday night so I do not have proof he is back with her, just seem logical to me that they are in cotact again. He did not move back in becaue he said he wanted to take things slow, which I was OK with. We was going to come back gradually. He only stayed over twice. I did Plan A him this entire month, in therapy we talked about what our needs are. Did not have a chance to get him to this sight. I told him I wanted to keep our family together, that was my goal and that I think his feelings will come back for, that it takes time. He responded, I do not want this and I do not love you that way anymore. It hurts just to write. So I told fim to get the **** out. and he left. Wanted to the kids this weekend.I said no and have not been in contact since. I think I go to Plan B. I appreciate you saying my marriage is not over, but I feel like it is. I have an appt on Wed. with an attny. Our finances have always been separate. How could he say he does not love me anymore when a month ago when he wanted to come back he said he did stil love me... I am so hurt and confused, felt like D day all over again. I feel like I have no hope left. I do not think our recovery ever got off the ground.

Because he's back with his OW and is conflicted. She is probably pushing him to D you and be with her. He wants both of you.

Why did you never attempt to recover your M using the tools on this site? You didn't have to show him the site.

I did the best Plan A I could, he was pulling away after the first week or so. He has told his family he is not back with the OW. I do not beleive it, he has always lied to everyone. I want to save my marriage so bad but this is the first time he has ever said to me he wanted a divorce, he has usually said he did not know what he wants or what will make him happy. Now I know it is not me. It hurts so much. What do I do next?? I cleaned his closet out and put all of his clothes in garbage bags in the garage. that felt good.
I think I am past plan A at this point and I need to go to Plan B. I do not want to get divorced!!

Any advice on the best chance I have to save my marrige. Does him saying he wants a divorce really means he wants out?? He was as cold as could be when he said it. He showed no emotion and was stoned faced. He is staying with a friend, he told me when he got home he started crying. Why cry, he should be happy. I feel like taking my kids and running away. I am just so upset.

Mason, are you reading what we're posting to you? I've already answered this question. How can we help you if you don't read what we post?

I am sorry I just wantto make sure plan b is the right step. I am very confused and upset today. If so beside no contact, and IM is there anything else I need to know about plan B. I do not want a divorce, but I do not know who my husband is anymore. I am just looking for some hope today, that I do have a chance to save my marriage.

mason, Plan B is the right step for sure. Your H is not undecided at all. He decided a long time ago that he wants BOTH of you. If your marriage can be saved, your best chance is Plan B. I suspect the OW is not able to meet his needs in a comprehensive way, so he is using you to prop up the affair.

Even if he does not come back, Plan B will make the transistion to divorce much easier for you. I would send him a Plan B letter, go into a pitch dark Plan B and don't come out until he has met all your conditions. If you dare lower your standards for reconcilation you will be damning yourself to yet another false recovery.

Does your IM understand that nothing gets through to you except pertinent information about the kids and finances? In her words? Typically a WS will try to send longwinded rationalizations in an attempt to open up contact. The IM has to protect you from that crap. Can she do that?

Yes, she will, I already have planned that she will be here when he drops the kids off next Sunday. I almost feel like what is there left to fight for. A shell of a man who can walk out on his family. Our boys are only 2 and 5. But, I still feel so strongly about trying to save things. I just have no hope. He did not wnat That is what is sad too. The loss of hope even if I had false hope all along. Have people come back from this?

Did you ever expose to the OW's family and friends? ARe they still working together?

Mason, you're going to have to lose this loser attitude that you have. STOP BEING A DOORMAT. If you want to save this marriage you're going to have to stop being a total wuss and grow a spine! Can you do that?

They are still in the same company,I exposedupto the CEO, her family already new everything.They can no longer travel together and they had to sign a no contact with one another druing work hours. He originally told me he was willing to find a new job,now that was BS since he told me he wants a divorce. I just do not get how someone does a 180 within a months time,
MB, please tell me how I am being a doormat and I would appreciate your hard core advice on how to have a chance at savings things. I am in plan b with and IM in place. What else do I need?

This sight is my only hope. I want to have my husband bacck ane keep my family together.

And what did her family say to you EXACTLY? What are their thoughts about her shagging a married man?

They do not care, she told her family. I just need to stop him wanting to divorce me. I am not sure how I can do that. Plan B Yes. that is my only hope? I believe he is still in love with her and will not make the commitment to see if his feelings will come back for me. any advice would be appreciated.

I read on here all the time, rarely do I post because I am still in recovery and do not feel like I know enough to give anyone advice.

I am amazed at times when someone like you Mason comes here asking for advice and the vets (MelodyLane, maritalbliss, JT and others)on here who have saved countless marriages give you awesome advice and it is like you do not understand a word they say. I wonder if you are reading what they say or are so wrapped up in doing things your way that you refuse to take the only advise that could possibly save your marriage.

First let me say loud and clear CHEATERS ARE LIARS. You cannot believe a word they say. I learned that the hard way. When I read your post and you say that "she told her family and they do not care". Can you please tell me how you know this? Have you talked to her family? Did you send a letter to everyone on her Facebook page?

PLEASE go back and re-read what the vets have told you to do about exposing the affair. I sadly found MB when it was too late to do any exposing and wish I had. The only person I exposed to was to the OW's H.

I think it was maritialbliss that said to stop being a doormat and grow a spine and you need to do just that. I'm sorry if this sounds like I am being mean, I'm not. I just want you to do what the vets are telling you to.

To all the vets, not sure how you do this when it almost feels as if you are talking to a wall. I get so frustrated just reading it, can't imagine how you all feel.

HU

I have exposed to everyone. His family knows her family know, the OW is divorced and moved back in with her parents. I have listened to the advice, that is why I exposed the affair. This past month I thought I was in recovery, my husband broke it off with her, but it was a false recovery. He said he had no feelings for me anymore and wants a divorce. I came back to the site because I wanted to understand what I need to do to move forward and try to save my marriage. I blieve my husband is comapring his feelings he has for the ow andnot giving us a fighting chance.

Have you told him what your requirements are for staying in the M? This isn't over by a long shot, mason. Your H is conflicted and is terribly foggy right now. You need to show him the way home.

Unfortunately, the critical factor in this is that the two of them still work together. I don't care if they signed the Declaration of Independence - they still work together. Any time they see each other their feelings for each other will be triggered. That is why he has done this 180. There has been contact and they have resumed the affair.

I would continue Plan B and use your IM as planned. Hopefully that will be a jarring experience for him. Did you write a Plan B letter? (Sorry, I can't remember reading that.) You need to let him know that you love him and want to save your marriage, but that you will not remain in a relationship with another woman. OW has to go. And your WH will have to leave that job. Those need to be your requirements. Have you told him this?

I know he is lying but he told me he wants to be alone, he did tell me when he wanted to recover that he would leave his job, but after telling me that he does not love me anymore and he wants a divorce. It is so cruel. I did not send a plan B letter, I have not contacted him since Thursday nor do I want to. I told him on Thursday that I wanted to keep our family together and we need more time. He flat out said he does not want this. I know Plan B is the way to go. He will get legal separation papers next week and then he will know how serious this is. He knows I do not want this. I have packed his closet up in garbage bags and put them in the garage. He will be suprised when he gets the boys next wknd that he will not be allowed in the house. I am not sure a letter to him will matter at thos point. I do not think anything will change his mind. Tough pill to swallow hearing such cruel words.

I disagree, mason. I think you need to write a Plan B letter and put it with his things. Have his things sitting on the porch when he comes to pick up the kids.

Change the locks on the doors so he can't get in.

Ok, I will write one up today. I am going to change the locks. Thanks for your advice. My entire family thinks I it is over. This is the only place where may have a glimpse of hope and be able to save my marriage. Funny thing, before he told me he wanted a divorce he told me he was glad we could talk without the hostility. Little does he know we will not be talking at all. Must be the fogginess and the dillusional life he thinks he has.

Any suggestions for the Plan B letter after he already states he wants a divorce. I had one written up but it was when he was telling me he did not know what he wanted. Now his decision is divorce.

Why don't you post what you've written and let us take a look at it.

Here it is....

I would like to acknowledge and apologize for my part in the demise of our marriage. I was selfishly caught up in myself, and with my selfishness and foolishness I neglected your needs, and I failed over and over to give you what you needed. I want you to know that no matter how bad the past has been, no matter how ugly things may have gotten, I know that we can get past it.

Over the past year I have endured the hurt and pain caused by your affair, but I will not do so any more. Every day that passes with your continued contact and involvement with her and our marriage in limbo only continues to weaken the love and respect that I have for you. The path that I must take now is one of both choice and self preservation. With all my heart, I would like to build a new marriage with you. A marriage in which we both feel loved, safe, and respected. I simply will not continue my efforts to rebuild our marriage while you are still involved with her.

I know that we can only fully rebuild our marriage when there are only 2 people in the relationship, you and I. There is no room in my marriage to you for additional parties, Lori included. Until you are willing not to have any emotional, physical or sexual contact with her, I will no longer communicate with you, except through Sharon. I am taking these steps to protect the love and respect that I have for you and any chance we have at recovery as well as my emotional stability.

This is pretty good, but how about a few tweaks?

Also, remember: say what you mean, and mean what you say. When you start Plan B you go dark. NO communication with your WH. Block his phone number. Change your email. Don't discuss him with your IM. She is there to filter out his drama. The only thing you want her to report to you is when he indicates that he has ended the A with the OW and wants to return to work on the M. Permitting him to contact you directly will undermine your efforts and show him that you don't really mean what you say. Waywards capitalize on wishy-washy actions by their spouse.

Marritalbliss edits meet Pep approval.

In other words, this affair has not been exposed to them and is another important step that has been skipped. How do you plan on saving your marriage if you won't take the advice here?

I would send the Plan B letter, change the locks, and then finish exposing the affair. This affair has not even been exposed to the OW's parents, as was suggested long ago.

I missed this, mason. Why have you not exposed this A to OW's parents? They very likely will be extremely disapproving of their daughter consorting with a married father.

They will very likely be powerful allies in your fight to end the A.

Thank you for the changes in the letter. The OW parents know from her she lives with them. I am sure she is thrilled that my husband has asked for a divorce from me. I will send the letter, change the locks and I am going VERY dark.

You don't know for a fact what it is her parents know, and you won't know until you talk to them yourself. For all you know, she's told them she's dating a man whose wife is running around on him, and he's in the process of divorcing her because of it. She may have told them that WH has been separated for years but his psychotic wife won't let go. Or that there are no kids.

Mason, parents with even a shred of integrity have a problem with kids being exposed to an affair. They won't want their daughter or son involved in that.

Call them and talk to them yourself so they have the true story.

Again, the affair has NOT been exposed to her parents. I seriously doubt she pranced in and announced to her parents: "hey, I am having an affair with a married man from work! He has a wife and 2 little children and he is abandoning them so we engage in barnyard sex. He is a wonderful man!!"

Rather, she told them a lie about how "his mean, CRAZY wife kicked him out for her affair several years ago and filed for divorce. We are just waiting for the divorce to be final."

The best thing you can do for your marriage is to go personally to her home with your children, tell the parents about the affair and ask them to use their influence with their skanky daughter to persuade her to leave this married man alone. It would have an even greater impact if your parents and/or MIL went with you.

Mason, you need to go see them and make sure they know. i know that scares the crap out of you, but it has to be done.

Exposure killed my wifes affair when other people in the family and OMs fiance came down on them like a ton of bricks.

You have to do this. Before you go dark.

I did not think of it that way, she lives in Ohio. I can find her on Facebook. I will do that, I have nothing to lose at this point.

I know I have seen samples of what to say, can somone post so I mak sure I get my point across.

I would do an extensive facebook exposure on her and then follow up and speak to her parents. [call them if they don't call you] Copy and paste all her facebook friends into a WORD doc first. Then send her contacts a private message. Start off with her parents and then work through her relatives and then her married friends. Time them at least 60 seconds apart so you don't get shut down for flooding. Be sure and put a family photo on your facebook page so they all see a photo of you and your H and child.

Dear friend of Skankyhola,

It is with great regret that I send this letter but I believe all of her friends should be aware that Skanky is having an affair with my husband, Joe. We have been married for 5 years and have 3 heartbroken children. They have been having this affair since October according to the evidence.

I would be happy to provide the evidence to anyone who asks.

I would ask that you use your influence with Skanky to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husbands around her because she is no friend to marriage.

I would appreciate it if someone would notify her parents and ask them to call me at xxx-www-xxxx.

Thank you, BW

Hi again,
Mason, I think if you follow the steps of the vets here, MelodyLane and Maritalbliss are guiding you with ........ and if you follow the steps you will have done all you can to save your marriage....
What you have to do is stop worrying about what your husband is doing or why he is saying what he is saying, he is in the middle of affair fog and won't say anything you will want him to say.
Your first job is to expose the affair with everyone then you send the Plan B letter and then you let your affair fog husband feel the brunt of his decisions and let him wake up from the decisions he has made, you stay strong in the meantime.........
When he is ready to not lose everything that he has know in his life you can then work on your relationship.........Until that realization for him takes place all you can do is follow the plan and wait........and improve yourself and be a great mom and person...............

Thank you, I thought I would feel better today and I do not. I need to make sure I get daycare paid for then I will expose to her family and friends. This nightmare will never end.

mason, your h cannot legally stop supporting you. You can't be in a position where you have to appease him in order to be supported. If there is any hint he will stop support you should file for divorce.

I am going to an attorney on Wednesday and getting our custody ageement and payments (mortgage and daycare) written up so there is no gray area. I am prepared to protect myself and the boys. I am hoping this exposure works, andsh finally dumps him, it is my last chance. I feel so desparate. I have nothing to lose by exposing to everyone at this point. I will follow the plan. He is a cold hearted person.

That's fine, mason, you absolutely should seek legal advice so that you know what your rights and options are.

But you should also get in your car and take a little drive to see OW's parents. If you do that now, you may not need the help of your attorney.

The OW parents live in Ohio, I live in NJ. I am going to send an email through facebook. Thanks for your advice,I am taking it all with nothing to lose.

Call them when you know she's at work.

She works at home. So maybe tough to do. I will try to look up the number and block my number. I know I have to do everything I can to shake him out of his fog and make him see that there will be consequences for his choices. There have been very little. I almost feel like he has a sense of entitlement. He shows no feelings at all, I do not think he has any feelings anymore.

Ok, I just sent the exposure letter to I think the OW mom or step mom. I was hesitating, and then I thought WHY??? I have nothing to lose, my husband already told me he does not love me and wants a divorce. Nothing left to lose!!!

Mason,

I have been following your thread, not posted before but see an amazing woman, hang on in there and look after yourself.

Sending love and light to you

Ok now I am scared, my husband just called three time and the OW took her facebook page down already. I know I have nothing to lose. I am angry let him be angry and realize that he is a cheater who walked out on his family.

Mason, take a deep breath for me, please? It's going to be okay.

There's no reason to be scared, you just got confirmation that he's still in contact with her, and you're exposure arrow hit the bullseye! Good Job!

Think about it if her family "knew all about it", then she wouldn't be getting all upset, would she?!

Mason,
Just wanted to lend my support, you are doing the right thing, I agree if the affair was okay why not rejoice and go with everyone knowing how wonderful it is.
Just keep telling your husband you are trying to save your marriage and that you are fighting back because you love him and need the affair to be over so the two of you can work on your marriage, just the two of you...
fantasy is going to meet reality now, let it do it's job.............hang in there, be strong ........don't trust anything he says...........keep your appt with your lawyer and sit back and watch the show.............

BTW, I've seen on here many times where a WH says that he's done, he wants a divorce, and that's it... (which your husband will probably say again with this exposure, that's how you know it's working), and they never DO anything.

Watch his actions, pay no attention to his words, as you already know he's a liar.

I'll say that again, Watch his actions!

BTW, some of those WH's are no longer W, and are actively in recovery!

Ignore him, did you copy the details of all her friends off facebook. If you did ensure you blanket this exposure to all her friends and family, their adultery thrives on deceit. Do not fear him,do not let him intimidate you. In the event the OW waylaid her mothers message send the message in a letter to her mother , use a non descript envelope and either fedex it or use recorded delivery to ensure it gets through.

I guess I did not think of it that way. I hope this works but since my husband already wants a divorce I am pretty sure I just made him angry, which is OK because I am angry too! You are right, what is the problem with their daughter dating a married man who has left his family.

She has taken her facebook page down. I got her mother, sister, brother in law, and her x-husband.

Be a broken record when you speak with him: I will do whatever it takes to save our marriage and our family. I will do whatever it takes to save our marriage and our family.

Mason, please don't quit posting, please don't quit listening to the vets here... I think that's why you had a false R, the good people here can sniff out infidelity like a bloodhound, they would have helped you set your bar high, they would have helped you to identify what was going on and help to avoid some of the heartbreak.

The vets here are your best bet to saving your marriage, the plans aren't a guarantee to your marital recovery, but they ARE for your personal recovery.

You are not alone.

Good job, she can't waylay all those messages. Do not take his call until you are ready to, whatever happens do not be afraid, the truth hurts those who lie.

As for Plan B:

MelodyLane had a great post about Intermediary Training, see if you can find it, it'll help your IM.

Have you gotten the locks changed yet?

I am going to ignore him form this point and begin Plan B. It was in a matter of 15 minutes that her FB page was down, or I was blocked and that my husband was calling. I think I hit the strongest targets. I think her page is down because when I went on her mothers sight I could no longer see her as a friend. My crazy life. You are right I should have followed the plan my husband was nice to me for a week and then he pulled away. I had no boundaries set. I am pretty sure he is lying to everyone or why would she have called him so quickly.

This is a response I got from her sister:

Trish, all I can say is shame on you for airing your dirty laundry this way. Lori's family and friends support her and love her, and quite frankly, this is NOT about her, it is about you and your husband. You should really keep it that way.

How should I respond.....

I wouldn't. The point was to inform, not to have a discourse.

What was the msg that you sent everyone? Can you post it?

Mason - I exposed about a week ago and apparently my WW got similar responses from some folks. My suggestion..and I'm in it like you obviously...is to ignore it. Ir you respond, you'll wind up in a virtual argument that will not be productive - this person has made up their mind about it (although it could change, once they've had a chance to reflect on it).

Vets, please contradict me here if I'm wrong.

Sit back and laugh, the fact she responded says she has recognised her sister is a cheat.

I would not respond, it's probably not even her sister, and it's actually her, you don't want that drama in your life either way.

I am not sure I can I sent it in her facebook sight. This is how I was going to respond:

Really, so you are ok with your sister beng the other woman. How would you feel if your husband was having an affair and broke up your family. I think Lori deserves better than my cheating husband, who is a habitual liar and goes for two weeks at a time without contacting his kids. Lori thinks my husband is such a great dad. I have nothing to be ashamed of, I did not have an affair or break up a family.

I wouldn't respond to her because you can't teach the willfully ignorant.

But YOU need to remember that 'Lori' is in this up to her eyeballs - she's crawling in the pig filth of an affair (my apologies to the pig.)

Do not second-guess your exposure. We see at least one FBer who responds like that every time there's a FB exposure. They'll change their tune in a hurry if it ever happens to them.

I know, I am just hoping she dumps him. My husband wants nothing to do with me, but I guess it is a good sign that he called three times to probably yell at me.

In regards to this "My husband wants nothing to do with me".

Again, watch his actions, don't listen to his words.

He hasn't filed for D.
He still comes to you to get some EN's met.
He's still cakeeating.


A WH who has checked out wouldn't care who you exposed to or what you said. The fact that he's still engaging with you, even if it is to yell, is GOOD!

Now, where are you at with planning Plan B?

locks changed?
letter written?
IM training post read?
Plan in place to change phone #, email address?

Plan B is not punishment, it's for you to find healing, strength and to preserve what love you have left for your H. When you do it, do it right, don't do it half-way... half-way doesn't work, and ends up doing more damage to you and the marriage.

Don't focus on what if's... focus on what you can DO.

I am seeing my attorney on Wed. He just tried to call again. keep hitting ignore, left the house went to my sisters in case he tried to come over. I do not think he ever ended the affair really. He saw her at a work mtg the first two wks in January, I am sure things started again. I will have my lock changed by Friday, letter is written- do not plan on answering his emails or text. My sister is the IM for now, I have two so they can switch off, one will be there on Sunday when he drops the kids off.

He just emailed me saying I am not sure why you are sending emails to Lori's family; this is between you and I. Deleted it and did not respond.

I know we all get to a point where there we feel like there is no hope, that is how I feel but atleast I did something today and now her family know he has walked out on his family, I am sure she us saying he is so great and she is just mad because he asked for a divorce. All of this makes me so sick; like everyone else.

"I will do whatever it takes to save our family"



I love how some people say that "it's just between you and I", or "this is between the two of you", when you wouldn't be in the position you're in if there hadn't been a 3rd person!


Great job on the Plan B plans! When will you be giving him the letter and beginning officially?


Hold your head high Mason, you've alot to be proud of!

mason, here are your next steps! Are you paying attention?? Send out more facebook letters to the rest of her family members. Get her parents phone # and call them. If you can't find the #, send them another message and ask them to call you.

Good job!!

THEN, email your husband your Plan B letter and then delete your email address so he can't respond back. Get your locks changed ASAP!

You did great today!!

RESPONSE BACK FROM WOMAN'S MOTTHER:

Affair never STOPPED:
Trish,
I was not going to entertain this letter with a response, but since this is the second time you have done this now to my daughter, I will say a few things. First, I am sorry that things have not worked out between you and your husband, however, I don't see how that is my daughter's doing. From what I understand, both Lolly and Mike were in unhappy marriages, and that is the main reason why their relationship developed in the first place. Second, this is not about my daughter, it is about you and your husband. You say that you want us, her family, to persuade her to "let him go", but he is a grown man, and can clearly make choices for himself, especially life changing choices. There must be a reason why he has made the decision to end the marriage. And I would keep that part in mind - he is ending the marriage, not leaving his children. Those are two very different things, and I know that people, even when divorced, can still maintain a very healthy and happy relationship with their kids. I also know that Lolly has in fact told Mike that she only wants his happiness, and if that meant going back home, then do it.
And I would like to add this - you keep saying she deserves better. Don't you deserve better than to be with a man who tells you he is no longer in love with you? And doesn't he deserve a chance at happiness?
Please stop contacting us. You need to talk to one person, and one person only, and that is Mike.

Mason don't blink. Exposure killed my wifes affair.

Oms family externally supported him, internally raked him over the coals. Keep going until you are done, and DO NOT BE AFRAID.

Don't mention the site, don't apologize, don't explain and don't stop.

You are getting under their skin. GREAT JOB

Really,with a response like that, it means they supprt the affair. They have no moral and do not care that their daughter is in this relationship,what kills me more is my husband lied to his sister and friends that he was not going to tell her that about asking me for a divorce for awhile (like hewas not getting back together witrh her). BS he left my house and called her and said it was done. I emailed his sister tonight and told her she had benn lied to and pasted the email from the mother. Those word verbatum came out of my husbands mouth. I think it was the tramp behind that e-mail not her mother. Too much was exactly what he said to me. It still hurts. He is under her spell...I can not wait to change the locks.

mason, they are trashy people who don't know right from wrong. I would not pay it any mind. You were able to create great conflict in the affair and that is all that counts!

Just stick to your plan. Send the Plan B letter, change the locks and don't flinch. You were a brave girl today!

Mason, I agree the email from the mother is suspect and here's why:


If this was my child that I was talking about, I would have said..."You say that you want us, her family, to persuade her to let him go. But she is a grown woman and can clearly make choices for herself."

The "mother" focusing on her daughter's boyfriend doesn't make sense to me.


The above just stinks of an OW trying to convince you to let her have her way. Seriously, why would a mother have such an intimate knowledge of her daughter's boyfriend's marriage?

A buck gets you twenty that the email, along with the one from the sister, was authored by OW. I'd hazard a guess that OW and WH told her family some baloney about you being a nutcase and that WH was the victim. Then, her family gets this email from you and it throws their story into question. Now, they are trying to do damage control.

Oh, you should probably delete the names of these people from your posts. You wouldn't want them (OW and WH) finding this site through a google search. If you cannot edit the posts, I'm sure admin can do it for you.

Take care, Mason, you've obviously stirred the pot and gotten them worked up. Good job.

Thank you, will keep you posted, he is with her now, checked his frequent flier acct. and is due back to tomorrow night, sent hime a text saying, I know you are in cleveland, once again to the true form of the man you really are. our boys have an excellent role model. A cheating piece of sh*** basta***> Go f*** ypurself. This is who my husband is right now.

@Mason -

You mentioned that this affair is being conducted through work.

Has their employer been informed through Exposure?


I know you are angry right now, but you really need to refrain from this. This is not very good Plan A.

You know you are in Plan A until you can implement Plan B.

BTW, the responses you got back do tell you that there is some affect on the Affair.

i expsed at work back in November. all that happened in they cannot travel together and are suppose to have no contact. i am moving plan b. I wanted him know that i knew he was lying. He called me at 4:30 this morning to leave her alone and that this is between he and I and to call him back. I will not call him back, my text to him was enough. Not sure if it has affected the affair at all, but my job is done. sent an e mail to his sister to let her know she was lied to as well along with the email that the tramps mother sent me. Seems her family is on board that she is dating a cheater and a liar

Ignore this. The content of her email is secondary to what you've accomplished. You've put her family on notice as far as the facts go. OW and WH no doubt put a spin on the truth of their affair to make their relationship more palatable to people, and you've corrected that.

I understand your anger and I'll not chastize you for sending that text to your WH.

Plan B, mason. It's time.

It is time, thank you. I was so angry last night. I am a bit better today. He has not tried to contact me again, not sure why 4:30 am was the time he wanted to yell at me last night. His sister was sad and sorry that he was back with her. He has not told his mother yet that he wants a divorce. I do not regret sending the e-mails and exposing and owning it. I see the attorney tomorrow and I hope I feel even better after that. I have to move on without him in my life.

mason, what is his mother saying about all this? Have you told her about the email from the skanks mother? Will your MIL speak to her son and the OW and tell them to stop it? If I were your H's mother, I would be telling the OW to leave my son alone, that she would never darken my doorstep. Just after I told off that vile mother of the OW. What trashy, trashy people.

Is this skank married?

SHe is now divorced. Apparently due to the feelings she had for my husband. She has said her and her husband were just room mates, which is the same line he used on me.

Who used that line on you? You mean your H said this about you?

And I have to ask, how do you KNOW she is divorced and not just having an affair? Have you spoken to her husband?

my MIL is on my side, his father left her but my husband was 25, he told his life full time and he coached all of his soccer games, My husband has no idea how to be a decent father. He will miss so much as a 4 day a month dad.

Will your MIL help you bust up this affair? She could deal the affair a death blow if she emailed the OM's mother and told her that she does not approve of adultery and her skanky cheater daughter will never be welcome in her home. She could then call the OW and tell her the same thing. If she does that, it will put great pressure on the affair.

If I was your MIL I would be GLAD to do this.

My husbands mother does not knwo about the impending divorce, I will call her. My SIL could not believe i had the nerve to contact the OW mother. Really?? who cares at this point. I am sittig back, changing locks, seeing attny, and hopefully my husBAND WILL SEE PLAN B IN EFFECT. I feel mor powerful with th advice form this sight. I am so much bettr with the no contact, no response ever. I was not good at this before,

I went to the attourney today. Prett ymuch tols me to sit toght as I am getting more money from himnow than is I pushed fora divorece. He is the one that asked me for th e divorce, let him file and see what the terms are. I am good in Plan B with no contact, I feel better without angry text messages and such. Still sad, but I need to protect myself emotionally at this point. My husband is a procrastinator, and he had none of my info like SS# to formally file; so I will sit back and see what happend. Do you need that detail to file?

Mason,
I think you are doing the right thing, protect yourself in Plan B and in terms of financial for now...............sit back and let your husband make the moves he needs to move........don't believe anything that he says, you are now in charge of your own best interest...........good luck

Thank you, I was sad this morning but feel a bit better now. Have not spoken with him since last Thursday when he gave me the D news. I will pack a bag for the boys tonight and leave it at daycare tomorrow morning so he will not have to come to the house. I was also happy my attorney told me that I can put a clause in there that the boys can not meet anyone new (OW) for atleast a year from the time of the divorce. I am going to talk to my therapist if she will back me up on this with a letter. She is the one who gave me the idea.
It is hard not to believe anything he said, the shock of how he spoke to me is wearing off a bit. He is holding on tight to the OW, and willing to give up everything.

I am losing it today. I was crying when I said goodbye to the boys this morning. I now understand why people run away with their kids. I am having a problem of how someone can inflict this much pain on someone. If anyone can help how I can better wrap my brain around out of this. There is no common sense to how my husband said he wanted to work on our marriage and he loves me to three weeks later telling me he has no feelings for me. Does he even know what he wants? Not me, he wants this woman and a life with her. He is willing to only see his kids 4 days a month. I have such hate and anger that I am forced into this lifestyle. I feel like I have no say and I do not matter to him. He gets to do what he wants and just says he was not happy in our marriage. Not very hopeful today. I need to cope better.

Ugh, Mason. How hard for you!! I am so sorry you have to feel this pain. Please try to keep yourself busy while the boys are gone.

I am hoping your WH feels something when he doesn't have the boys. That may push him back toward home.

Mason - I'm new here, but I think that you're trying to apply logic to a situation that's inherently illogical. That's the fog a WS has - they don't know what they want, they don't know what they're saying one minute to the next. I've gotten the same message from mine - she doesn't miss me, divorce is inevitable, she hates me, yada, yada, yada....

She also specifically said again last night that she hasn't been happy in our marriage since Aug '09 - but that same person doesn't want to work on the relationship when I offered up every possible option.

My suggestion is for Mason to work on Mason - do the things that bring you joy, take up a new hobby or re-start a neglected one. Spend quality time with the kids. I would also suggest exercise - it accomplishes two things: it makes you feel better about yourself and it'll make you tired at the end of the day. Consequently, you might sleep better. Your WS will also notice the change, if you can stick to it.

Thank you, I have a therapy appointment today. I knew this wknd was going to be hard, during the very, very false recovery we had stopped splitting up the boys, so this is my first wknd without them. I will try to stay busy. Luckily after Sunday I do not have to deal with this for another two wks. He has no mid wk visits, Never asked for them. He is chosing his job and the OW over his family. I no I can not make sense out of nonsense and I will have the strength hopefully sooner than later to build a better life for myself. Just needed a little support today from everyone who is in the same boat. Dealing with people who do not have a soul.

So happy the wknd is over an I have the boys back, He was angry that my sister was going to be at the house when he dropped them off, He was frantically looking for his passport (apperently for a work trip to Canada) he called me to find out where it was, though it was my sister calling me and i just said I do not knw and hung up. He took his checkbook (as a threat not to pay for daycare) I took a book of check of his and hid them in the anticipation he would do this. Not sure why he is so angry, he should be happy that he does not have to deal with me and only has to have the kids 4 days a month. He is as free as a bird now. He texted me that he does not like that I am not responding to him, he never asked about the boys once last week and I have not reached out to him since he told me he wanted a divorce. I am getting better everyday, and I have no desire to contact him, he needs to get a good dose of what being a divorced single dad is really like. You do not know what is going on with your kids unless you are with them. I told my sister we will do this again in two weeks when he has the boys. He will never see me again.

mason, you are doing great!!
\
Was he in your house?

Yes, with my sister when he dropped the boys off. She met him at my house, was there waiting for them. He texted me after he left, "you can go home now, I left". He does not get it yet. Not sure if he will ever see the light, but this is protecting me emotionally, removing myself from his life. I know he expected me to freak out about the checkbook. ( I have done this in the past when he has tried to take it) Dead silence!

mason, you did good in setting up the exchange with the sister, but he should not be allowed to come in the house and rummage around. I would have your IM send him a message and tell him in the future he should just tell her in ADVANCE what he needs and then she will check with you and she will give him the item.


I would not read any of his texts, emails, or listen to voicemails. Either block him completely or if he does get through, just delete ti without reading or listening to it.

I know, I have been deleting all of his text and not repsponding. I am going to out his passport in the mailbox, most of his things are in the garage in garbage bags. I do not have to pay daycare for another month, hope he does not pull any crap with that. Wait and see. I will just write the check from his checkbook. My sisters have been great and understand that I never want to see him again, they hate him for what he has done.

OK, speaking of not snooping, I have never stopped, I know in Plan B- you should not but I can realized I can get into his AOL acount but will have to change his passowrd, Both sister an dbest friend say NO, you no everytuing. I still feel like I want to. Not contact him, but get into that account. My gut says no, but want to... Thoughts?? he will no because I wiil need to change password,

I put his passport in the garage on top of the garbage bags with the rst of his things. A little sad today, trying to feel stronger. I panic everytime I see fedex drive by that it is divorce papers. Have to stop.

Hang in there, mason!

He is going to Cleveland to be with her this wknd. Not suprised he does not have the boys, atleast they will not be shacking up in a hotel close to me. It still stings so much. I do not want to care. I am rationalizing things in my head that he will come back, does not look like it. Packed up more things and put them in the garage. I have so much anger and hate towards him, he does not have a conscience.

I am sorry, Mason. I promise you it won't always be like this. Try and focus on your own life. Start working out, finding new things to do.

Thanks, I am trying, it had only been two weeks since he told me he was done, I am hoping in two more weeks I will be that much better. It is just hard to make sense out of nonsense. He is missing so much of the boys' lives. How do you live with yourself, all for a chick in Cleveland.

I know in Plan B you are not suppose to hear anything about him, but his friend sent me a text asking how I was doing. Then he said that he thought that my hsuband did really try and that since he felt no "chemistry" between us he in panic ran back to her (OW). Tough to hear again, although I told him after only going to dinner twice and giving up after one week was not really trying. I asked he thought he was happy, he said I do not think he knows if he is happy or not. I think the OW gave him an ultimatum, if you come back make sure you tell your wife you want a divorce. Again, trying to make sense out of this nightmare.

Stay in Plan B, if your husband is confused, let him go back and have the OW try to meet his needs, watch how quickly it all falls apart when she is pressuring him and demanding things to be a certain way and not filling the needs he has that she doesn't want to meet.........REALITY..............
Sit back for now..........

You don't need to hear garbage like this, mason. This does you absolutely no good. And it's probably your WH using his friend to get this garbage to you. The next time someone texts you to see 'how you're doing' stop them from going any further.

"I'm doing as well as can be expected. I prefer not to discuss this right now. Thank you for respecting my wishes."

I know, I am sitting back. One other note he has not been to an attourney yet. Not sure why, he was crystal clear. Apparently he wanted me to wrap my head around the last few weeks. Really??

Ok, I got into his personal email. (could not help myself) and found out while we were suppose to be working on things he made reservations to stay an extra night in New Orleans while he and OW are there for work not until June but he was thinking ahead tomake OW happy. Also that is his wknd with the boys. Not helping him with that, ever! It just solidifies he was never on board to save our marriage, he could not wait to run back to his other life with zero responsibilities. I wish this nightmare would end. If I did not have kids it would be so much easier.

mason, stop looking at that stuff if you're in Plan B!

I know, I am now done. That was the last of it. I need to become numb to it all. Old habits die hard.

Okay, if you promise. I didn't mean to sound like I was yelling

Thank You!!!!! Appreciate the support so much. My family and friend ar so sick of me. Eight months is a long time to be talking about the same thing. I repeat myself over and over again trying to get it all out.

Kind of sad this weekend again, thinking of him being with her still stings so much. I just can not wait for the day when I do not think about it anymore, it is so hard all I want is someone to really love me again and I feel like I will never have that, he has given it all away to someone else. I know it will get better with time, reading everyone's posts tells me that. I want to have a success story so badly, but really do not see that ever happeneing, he is so sucked in. I feel like it is just so easy for him to escape to his other life he is building with her. I took all of the pictures down of us and him with the kids, too sad to look at how our family used to be... Replaced them with all new pictures of the boys. I know plan b is the best place to be, looking back I let him walk all over me and was almost like his friend while he kept lying to me. When we were in false recovery he could not even spend a night here with me and the boys and he is with her for 4 days straight, it makes me so sick. Just need to rant a little, I am so angry.
I read one post where someone said that WS threaten divorce but rarely take action. I hope that is the case with me and Plan B really works. Not sure why I have this strange sense of hope, when the reality of his actions tells me there is none.

Need some insight, in plan b and husband refuses to take kids to my sisters last night so I can pick them up.He was mad because my son told him I was away for the night. Why? Inever know where he is. I was but was on a work trip, had my sister watch the kids for me (he was returning from seeing Cleveland . My husband pick them up from daycare to take them to dinner. He started texting me like crazy questioning where I was and telling me he was keeping the boys if I was not coming home. I had already told him I was and had a work dinner. He was going crazy sayinghe was waiting for me at the house. I told him to go home and after what he has put me through to respect my wished for once. He finally left. Heasangry he found his stuff in the garage. Not sure why he is angry, he chose this, this is what he wants. Not sure why he could not have gotten the kids for dinnerand dropped them off at my sisters and end it there. Any insight would be appreciated.

Sounds to me like he's not liking his lack on control in Plan B. I'd say to stay calm and keep doing what you're doing.

But if you're in Plan B you shouldn't be getting texts from him. AND you responded to him. How's that happening? Where's your IM?

I only answered him twice, new he had the kids, he would not talk to my IM. With having such young boys, I get nervous about emergencies. I am calm and gave him one response answer. I just am trying to get better, he should be happy that he is free from me and day to day responsiblities. Is Plan B working?? Just suprised he just left the OW on Monday and started this nonsense the very next day. I told him to leave me alone. It was like he was trying to have a stand off with me. He is still FOGGY, all I was thinking does he really want a divorce. Did he not have a great weekend with OW? He also checked my Frequent flier acct, got a notice with from my acct to change my password. Why is he snooping on me??

Yes, STOP READING HIS TEXTS. Delete them. If a text comes throug, call your IM and have her send him a text that he needs to send any messages through her because you aren't reading his texts.

FORCE him to go through the IM.

Did you change the locks?

You are right, need to get back on the Plan B wagon full force. The attny I went to said do not change the locks, you are getting more money now than you normally would get if you were divorced. Do not rock the boat.

I need to realize if he does want to talk to me it will be about recovery of our marriage not about the BS he was pulling yesterday. This is why I am posting, need to get focused again.

He's snooping on you because you've kinda/sorta changed the rules and waywards don't like that. They like to be in control. You've seen a difference in what you've done so far, right? And what you're doing is a lukewarm Plan B. He knows you're up to something - you've caught his attention. Now he's testing you to see if you mean it, and by being available to him you're showing him that you don't. Your attempts will fail with this half-hearted attempt.

Mason. You are defeating your long-term goal with short-term waffling. Tighten up your Plan B, woman! Close every crack, every loophole and go guns a'blazing on this!

I will and thank you for the support. He has the kids this weekend and will not be here again. I will have my sister waiting when him when he drops the kids off. You are right I should not have anwered but when he is driving around with my boys in the car going crazy on me it makes me nervous. You are right about changing the rules. I am back on the Plan B bus. I was overwhelmed yeserday with work and traveling and he through me off guard. Does everyone fall off the Plan B track once and awhile?
I guess I must have gotten his attention, it has only been three weeks of rule cahnging. I think he is getting a dose of reality of what divorcing me will look like. NO friend and no contact.
He will be dead to me.

It happens, mason. And it's typically regretted afterward.

No matter. That's history right now. Climb back on board with it and keep going. You're doing fine.

Thanks, went to therapy today and feel recharged a bit, She agrees with no contact and thinks my husband will have a miserable life. That expert advice makes me happy. He is a crazy person who is giving up two great boys for a loser woman in Cleveland. I say good luck and be happy. I am done condoning the affair. Know better do better. Just will be sad when I do not have the boys this weekend but he is only a visitor in their lives now. I will have the major impact on them. They are my boys. I have them 90% of the time.

Mason --

Every time you break Plan B -- you make the AFFAIR STRONGER.

Your husband was panic-mode when he couldn't find you. He was imagining you out on a date. It was driving him insanely jealous. He was imagining this new man replacing him. He was imagining his sons calling the new guy "daddy". He was in a PANIC to find you.

And what did you do? Reassured him.

So now he's calmed down, and back to his affair-routine.

Is that what you wanted? NO.
You want him to REMAIN in that panic-mode of not knowing what you are up to. Bacause THAT feeling is the one that will make him come to his senses and end the affair.

Stop sabotaging your plan.

Here is an update, WWH started texting my IM like crazy, he think I am dating someone,(I am not) he picked the boys stuff up and found a shopping bag, (I bought something nice for myself) he started pull all of teh financial threats out, only paying 1/2 for daycare, find my own car insurance, health insurance, he is going to call a realtor to sell the house. Told me I am responsible for 1/2 of his credit card debt that it is marital.

I have been to attorney and I understand that he still need to pay as he is now that it is considered statis quo- until we are divorced. Also he can not put the house on market without my consent.

He showed up at the house a 9 am this morning saying he needed something for the boys. (I think he thought I was with someone) He is still with the OW so not sure why he is acting like this. I told him I would bring it outside, he said open the **** door, I pay for 1/2 of this house. I did and locked myself in the bathroom. I am a month into Plan B and this has been the worst it had been. I was pretty shaken up this morning. Going to call the attourney on Monday. Any insight or advice?

Mason,
He is mad that he has lost control of you.......he will calm down, you are right if he is still with OW then what is he doing..............
Call your lawyer on Monday and see if they can send him a letter asking him to conduct himself in a civil manner.........
stay safe

Thank you, the text messages went from 6pm until 1:30 in the morning. If he wants to divorce me then divorce me. Do not threaten me with financial implications. I am not as scared as I was this morning. That is the first time I saw him sinve he told me he wanted a divorce. All of this still makes me sick!

stay calm, he is giving up what he has known in his life, and he doesn't like it, most people in affairs want something from both parties..........he has to now give up what you were giving him, maybe things with the OW are starting to blow up a bit, Reality isn't like the Fantasy they were living before.............
that is exactly why the stats of survival of affair relationships are so small.......
Try to do something relaxing tonight.....

I am, I am going to dinner with one of my girfriends, I have the house bolted and she will stay with me tonight. Thanks, I am glad I checked back in again...I just hope the boys are having fun. He will drop them at my sisters tomorrow.

I am a nervous wreck after this wknd. It did not stop, the finacial threats went on until Saturday afternoon. Then he told sent another text through IM, for me not to worry about the health or car insurance, really what about daycare and selling the house. He called to talk to the boys last night, at first I did not answer, then dialed the phone and let my 2 year old talk. My 5 y old did not want to talk to him. He heard that and then I hung up the phone. I am exhausted from all of this. Is this normal in Plan B.
If he is so happy with the OW why harrass me?? If you want to divorce me so bad why do you care what is going on in my life. I am staying dark and calling my attorney this week. Scary thing is I still do not want a divorce, I should after all of this but I don't. I keep hoping the fog will lift. He is just angry and after everything he has put me through he has no right to be angry at me.

Can someone provide some reassurance. Is this a nomal reaction of a WW when Plan B is implemented??? I need to get my anger back and throw away the fear!

Hi Mason!

I think that all of the turmoil you're seeing from your WH is from the effects of your Plan B... and I agree wholeheartedly with the PP that he needs to be in this turmoil, as it's the turmoil that will bring him out of his fog.

I do want to encourage you to keep Plan B dark, dark, dark!

At this point, since you're still working towards recovery, I'd not put any stock into his words about cutting you off and such... watch his actions!

You're doing great!

I just wanted you to know that you've been heard, please don't keep posting!

Please remind me, did you give your WH a plan B letter? Does he know your conditions for return/recovery?

after he told me he wanted a divorce. We had a very false recovery in January. He does not want to end his relationship with OW, he ran back to her the day after he told me he wnated a divorce.

mason,
I agree your hubby is just angry that his life is in such turmoil, he is seeing the destruction he has caused and he is not liking his life in the shambles it's in.
I think when people are in affairs they never really see the reality of the situation so it comes to him as a shock as well.
Let him feel it all, stay dark..........
He can't leave you hi and dry, the courts won't allow it..........I hope you have legal representation as well......you have to protect yourself and your children, if he say anything tell him through your IM that you have no choice now.......
Let him live the life with the OW let him see her true colors..........He is probably not liking what he is seeing..............the grass over there on the other side is just grass.......remember that.................

The reason why I asked that question is because it seems that he's been allowed to come and go as he pleases (cake eating); and what came of that is the whole "I want a D" scenario.

When you went dark on him, he became frantic, trying to control and contact you (no cake to eat).

What this shows me is that B is working, because the darker you go, the more he craves contact with you (cake), ANY kind of contact.

I just want to encourage you to stay the course and stay dark, and when he does break B, tighten it up asap, and bring out the broken record "I'll do whatever it takes to save our M" and "I'll reopen communication when my requirements are met".


He's going to continue breaking plan B as often as he can to get a dose of you; and as long as he's getting that dose of you, this can go on indefinitely.

And that is not healthy for anybody.

Thank you, it makes sense. I will stay the course and stay dark. I need to protect myself emotionally, I feel better than I did this morning. I hope his threats are just threats if not I will contact my attorney to make sure he knows he legally needs to pay me. It feels good not responding at all, it does give you a sense of control and power, and you are right , he could come and go as he pleased. I was a doormat.

I've often heard here that the plans are simple, but they are not easy, by any means.

Hang in there Mason, you're not alone. We're just a post away!

WH had the boys this weekend, he was angry because I did not tell him about a spring concert at school, he should have found out himself. He did not like picking up & dropping off the boys at my sisters. To be honest I had to drag him to the school stuff last year, always acted like he was too busy. Still sending mean text messages to my IM.

Plan B is still stressful. Some days I feel OK, but broke down yesterday when I was looking through the real estate section, that I probably will have to sell the house and will have a hard time affording anything decent.

Not sure if he has been to attorney or not. He is just angry at me. Alot of nerve after what he has put me through. Follow the plan. He is mad it is not his plan. This is what divorcing me looks like. We are not friends. We do not co-parent. I am frustrated. I want the husband I married back, not this angry person.

Mason --

If you were truly in Plan B, you would not KNOW about his anger or his "mean" text messages to IM.

The main job of the IM is to filter out the non-necessary communication and not deliver any emotional content. Just the facts, not the flavor. ya know?

Your focus needs to be on you and your boys. Let go of WH.

You are right, hard to let go... need to a better job of letting go. I think about everything that has happend. It is the first thing I think of when I wake up and the last thing when I go to be. When will that end. I am grieving for what I have lost and for what might have been.

I will have to reinforce the boundaries to my sister. It is just hard with two young boys and dealing with financial stuff.

I have been pretty dark, just need to have her to stop telling me things. I want the Plan to work so badly and quickly. I do not want a divorce. Everyone always asks me why haven't you filed? Everyone thinks I am crazy for not filing after what he has done.

I know it is hard, but for a little while, you are going to have to grow a pretty tough skin when they ask you about you filing for a D.

I found it extremely difficult at first because people think that you should just move on. Well, I have been in Plan B for more than 15 months and I am not even legally separated. I haven't filed for a D because I don't need to.

There came a point in time, when I was strong enough, that I just didn't care what other people thought about what I was doing. I have to defend myself now when someone says, "Why are you still waiting for WH?" I say, "I am not 'waiting' for him, I am just not ready to date yet, so why get a D?" I then also tell them that it doesn't mean I will NEVER file for a D. I tell them that I am healing and right now, I am not ready to heal from a D too. They usually are okay with that answer, but they weren't at first.

People really want what is best for you. They just don't know how to help so they tell you what they believe would help them. They have no idea. We do.

The more dark your Plan B, the sooner you will know the peace of healing.

I see Lexxxy touched on the IM. If your sister is unable to handle this for you, you may need to find someone else.

You shouldn't even have known that your WH was upset about finding out about a school function late. You should be in a bubble. Now, about that school function, will he be there? Will you be there as well? You know that the two of you can not be in the same place while you are in Plan B right?

Thanks, I did not tell him about the school finction. He was mad that he missed it. My sister just said the boys are here and you do not need to pick them up from school and he asked why? I could not stand to be in the same room with him right now or ever. I understand what you are saying, I have been hurting for so long, I just want relief at this point. Some good news would be welcomed for a change. Like I said, I still think about his affair all of the time, I wish I could block it from my thoughts.
I am jealous of all my friends who seem to have a good marriage. I want that so badly! But I guess I should be wishing for me to heal and get stronger. Toughen up a bit!

There are bound to be times when you will not only be jealous of your friends, I found myself being jealous of complete strangers. I would see a couple walking, pushing a baby stroller and I would wish that my WH would be there.

It is NORMAL to have all of these feelings and to go through this grieving process. I can tell you that you WILL feel better as long as you stick to these plans. It is a marathon, not a sprint. And there will be times, when you will feel like you are heading the right way and something will come and hit you like a ton of bricks.

What you need to do is allow yourself to grieve and then.....focus on YOU. What kinds of things can you do to make yourself better? Exercise? Read? Take an online course? What do you want to do? You will need some things to help you think about other things. What are you going to do today? tomorrow?

BTW, there was something that people used to ask me on my thread, so I will ask you, "What colour are your toe nails?"

Funny, I did do some nice things for myself this weekend, went for a facial on Friday and a mani/pedi on Saturday- my toenails are a great color called Chinchilly- purple/grey. You are right, felt good and then Sunday not so great.
Thanks again,I feel like I want it to be a sprint, but I need to get into the marathon mentality. I am following Plan B the best I can. I have known my husband for 23 years- since High school. I have never stopped talking to him. This is a huge change. Should have done this back in November.

I was with my WH for 18 years, and he has had my heart. I understand the pain. I still sometimes, in a rare weak moment, want to call him.

Unfortunately for you, and for me, we can't do that anymore. We are now faced with consequences of an affair that we never had a say in. But do you know what we do have a say in? We have a say in HOW we will let the A effect our lives. We can CHOOSE to make a better life and come out of this better than before. Join me? Plan B not only as effectively as you can, but when you find out a way to improve it, make those changes. You CAN do this. It's a choice that you need to make each and every moment of every day. Once you've made the choices day after day it becomes a habit. You won't need to do it consciously after that. Unfortunately, until then, you are going to need to think about the new choices more often.

You CAN do this. Don't look back at the things you should have done, look to the things you CAN do today and tomorrow. That's where your focus needs to be.

Thank you so much, I am crying, he called to talk to the boys tonight, (not a regular thing) I had my 5 year old call him back (I dial and hand the phone to him) when they give me the phone back I hang up. I know i need to make this a solid plan and keep going with it. As all of us on this forum we want the pain to end. Thanks again, Scotland for you insights, much appreciated.

Had dinner last night with a mutual friend, she told me she thinks I should communicate with my husband about the boys, BTW this friend had cheated on her husband- they are divorcing. She thinks it is not good for the kids, I said I was doing this for me. I got upset. She was basically saying, accept this, and move on. She said I want you to get everything you want out of the divorce ( no one has filed yet) and stay in the house, she thinks by me not talking to him I will not get what I want. I told her I do not care, I will sell the house if I have to. She was basically saying comply with him, No way I did that for 5 months and that did not work. I am not scared anymore. I will move on but I do not have to accept his affair.

I am cutting this friend out of my life.

She is wayward and as you have seen, waywards are good for no one.

I would actually suggest that you let your friend know, in a letter(a Plan B type of letter)why you are ending your friendship. I would let her know that you do not agree with her adultery. That you can not be friends with her while she is a wayward. That you respect yourself, her and your friendship more than being able to sit by and watch her destroy her life, and hurt others. That you would be willing to continue the friendship some time down the road, if she chose a different set of morals to follow.

Before you send a type of letter to this friend, have you told her about this place? Would your cover be blown, so to speak?

She is wayward. Take anything she says with a grain of salt. Her morals are skewed.

I have not told her about MB, she and her husband as well as mine have all been great couples friends until she started her affair. My husband nowlives at her X husbands house when he does not have his kids and at her house when she does not have her kids- My husband and her husband have been friends for 20 years. so... I need to cut her off with the contact she has with my WH. When they were trying to recincile they were a great supprt, now that they are divorcing not so much.

He is using their divorce attourney,(they are not my friends) or atleast he consulted with him, he has no money for the retainer right now. He is still angry dropping the boys at my sisters or when I am not at the house when he drops them off.. keeping that going.. have not seen him for two months now
Again, I do not feel as scared, maybe plan B is working???

I will win this,although I do hope to reconcile.

Even more reason to cut her out of your life. That will be good for your Plan B. It can't be that dark, either way, with you talking to them. See, you know too much about your WH. He knows too much about you. Patch up the hole hunny, you will feel even better.

Today I am upset and anticipating My WH not to pay for full daycare, which has been our agreement util he threaten to pay only half less than a month ago, he also need to pay half of the money we owe in taxes. I was told by mt attorney that he will need to keep paying what he is currently paying for until we have a settlement agreement, this is called status quo.

I know if he does not pay I will have to file a motion with my attorney to get him to continue. I am nervous because I feel like this will begin our divorce process. I know he has consulted with an attorney and the OW is pressuring him to file. Not sure if I am ready yet, emotionally or financially, but I know I need to stand up for myself.

I need to wait until tomorrow to see what he puts in my account. Since I am in Plan B, I feel like he will not pay for what he is suppose to as a plan for me to talk to him. I will not, let the attorneys talk. But with that said are you ever emotionally ready? I know I am not the cause, but I do not wantto begin the process. I am confused today and sad.

Hi Mason - our stories are almost identical. Literally the only difference is I have two more kids and my STBXWH is deployed. I would like to talk privately with you becuase you and I are at the exact same stage of this nightmare.

You can read my story in the miltary sight.

Let me know if you would like to have one on one discussion.

Hang in There!!!

Thanks, I will catch up on your story and we can talk one on
one. I will send you a message when I am caught up wih your story. Just having a rough day, comes and goes as expected.

He only paid for 1/2 of daycare as expected. He has some crazy idea that he can stop paying for something. Left a message with my attorney. I am so angry, why after everything he has put me through he decides to change the way we pay our bills. I feel like he is trying to get back at me, but I know i can not take it personally. HELP!!! Can someone make me understand why???
I do not want a divorce and this feels like a knife in the coffin.

Here is the latest. For Easter, he dropped the boys basket on the porch, was suprised he did not ask to see them for a few hours. The weekend prior, he only took them to dinner on Sunday, he was suppose to take them over night. He claimed he had no where to take them.

He sent my IM and angry text telling her that he is going to talk to me this week if I like it or not. He said I need to start communicating about the boys, that he needs to know what is going on with them. When he call I let him speak to them, I just do not get on the phone. I never said he could not be involved, not through me any longer, giving him the daily updates when he is with his girlfriend. I had my OM, text back and say, If you want to preserve our marrige then I will speak to you, if not I think you have said eneough.

Have any appt. with my attny next Tuesday to get a motion so he has to keep paying me. (hope I win). I was so overwhelmed and scared after getting off the phone with my attny, she said I need to get a jump on this or she can not fight status quo, she said she thinks my husband was advised to stop paying the full amount to establish a new status quo. I am not ready to file, but I may have to. It may be more expensive to do the motion. i can not let fear get in the way, but I am ready to file! I still want my husband back. Not sure why anymore after has has been so mean and angry at me. Plan B is tough, I never thought it would drive this much anger out of him.

Just think of him as a 2 year old throwing a big ol temper tantrum because he isn't getting thing HIS way. That should make you understand this anger of his a bit more.

Your IM should not have told you about the angry text. What should have happened was a response from her such as, "Any communication about the children or finances should be past through me." Then she shouldn't have let you know that he even sent anything. She is a FILTER. She is supposed to be acting as a SHIELD for you. She needs to protect you.

Plan B can be hard, but once you are fully in it, it becomes a lot easier. A good IM is the KEY to a successful Plan B. And a successful Plan B doesn't necessarily mean a recovered marriage, just a recovered YOU. Get dark as night. These pins holes will drain away the remaining live you have left and you won't want him back, ever.

I know, I think she wanted to see if I wanetd to speak to him. I was second guessing plan B with the boys and not sharing with him how they are doing. But, he needs to do that on his own. He is mad that I am not fulfilling that need for him to connect him to his kids. He thought we would be co-parenting together. So the longer I go without speaking with him, the more threatening and angry he becomes.
Overall, I do feel better, less stressed with him out of my life. I am trying to preserve any love left, but I do not like the person he has become.
I do want a recovery, but I can not let him walk all over me. I feel like me speaking with him is condoning his beahvior and what he had put us through. I keep reminding myself I have done nithing wrong. This is the consequence of his choices. I will not be his friend or parenting partner.

So have you spoken to your IM and explained what she should do next time? Does she understand that she shouldn't let him intimidate her? She is an important part of your Plan B.

SO, how do the exchanges of the children take place? Is there any contact with your WH at all?

I just want to help you get into the darkest Plan B possible and then we can get you focused on healing yourself and making you stronger. I believe that part of Plan B leading to marital recovery, if that is the case, is so the BS will be strong enough to stand up for themselves against their WS. This way, they will KNOW that they CAN live without the WS and they will take a different approach to recovery. If you don't get marital recovery, you will still KNOW that you CAN make it without your WH.

mason, listen to Scotty. She's been where you are.

Get a temp order and a separation agreement. You can even get one on an emergency basis if he is refusing to pay you. That shows NEED AND URGENCY. Your lawyer can do this.

If he/she (lawyer) refuses to jump on this, and is anything less than a mean pit bull dog lawyer to your wh, then fire her.

YOU should be able to easily secure what is needed for your family to survive, esp since your wh has abandoned the family for a ho bag.

YOU also have the attny subpoena the ow and have her take the stand in the hearing. You want the judge and court to establish why the man has abandoned his family willingly. He did so b/c he did something else which establishes quickly fault in a divorce...adultery.

Jump on that. You can always reconcile and stop the temporary agreement. It's not a divorce, but it definitely puts some stress, HUGE stress on the affair.

He's paying for his affair now and since he willfully abandoned his family (what your attny says), he is paying for the gold digging ow now.

Also, since he willfully abandoned the marriage and family, I'd establish (also since he does not see the kids and doesn't try to see them regularly)that you need sole custody b/c of that fact, and because wh is living in an immoral and unstable environment. No proper family home, and is shacking up in sin with an other woman, an adulterous affair. Judges don't like that being exposed to kids.

Scotland,
I do not see him when he picks up or drops the boys off.- The only time I saw him was when he barged in the house. I did tell my sister not to tell me anything any longer. So it that respect, the thought of even speaking to him again makes me sick knowing he is with OW. I have no desire to see or speak to him. That tells me I am getting stronger.

Peachy,I have an appt with my lawyer next Tuesday and she told me we need to jump on this. I am going to plop down my retainer and get moving. I do not want my H to feel like he can walk all over me. It is scary, but I can not let fear get in the way of standing up for myself. Thank you for the suggestions, I have documented when he has seen and called the boys. I have heard my lawyer is a pit bull, that is what I need.

I know Plan B is right for me, I will be able to move forward eventually, but I will not be able to accept what he has done to our family.
Thanks for the support, reality is setting in and I think I have a fight on my hands. I wonder how waywards live with themselves and how they can sleep at night. Pure selfishness, I guess!!

Scotland, you words go through my head often, when you told me to stay in your bubble. I say that to myself when I feel weak.

Just came from my lawyers office. How surreal. I am filing a motion to get him to keep up what the current pay schedule is. I will know on Friday after she reviews the number how strong my case will be. Do not know why I am sad, this is the first step towards divorce, she said it may make him file sooner. I guess if he wants a divorce, he will get one. I am just confused. My feelings are all over the place right now. I was angry this morning and now I just feel sad and kind of numb. Feel so pitiful saying I want my husband back and always wonder how he could leave us.

Mason - I'm sorry to hear the sadness in your note. Just know that there are many here you've gone through that same rollercoaster of emotions! You're trying to apply reason and logic to an argument that's inherently illogical! Your WH isn't acting like a rational, sane human being.

It'll get better, it'll just take time. Try to focus on the kids and be there for them. He'll have to answer their questions in the future - I always keep that in mind as I'm going through this. What will I tell my DS in 10-15 years about this episode in my life?

Thank you, I think about that too, with my 5 year old. He will know the truth one day. Trying to shield them at this point. I guess as you move through this you think you may become less emotional and when you really stop to think you still do not believe this is happening to you. I keep thinking stay in my plan b bubble, that will protect me. I just wish I had more of a choice in the matter of my marriage. I wish I had a chance at real recovery. So much time has passed, and I lose hope. Hard day.

Began the process of filing the motion for financial support, was more upsetting looking at the paperwork than I thought. My husband had stopped most communication with my IM, kind of crawled back into his own little fog world. He has not spoken to the boys in a week. Is he accepting my terms of us not speaking finally, no longer fighting it.

Is this normal in Plan B??

Very upset this week, all apart of the roller coaster. I broke plan b last week when I found our my husband was in the Bahamas, we have a shared frequent flier acct.
I sent a text saying "is it better in the bahamas? must be better than paying for the boys daycare". I know I shpudl have stayed in my bubble, I wish I never found out because I have been reeling from it. I thought things were falling apart in LA LA land, but I guess they are as strong as ever. I am just so upset he can go on vacation and not keep up his obligations.
Back in dark plan B for good, can not sen myself spinning again.
The only good news is that it will be more ammo for my attorney.

The good news never ends! I feel like he could care less that I am not speaking with him. If only 90-95% of affairs last, I just hope I am not in that 5-10%. Looks like I may be.
Just a hard week.

I am all over the place today, can not concentrate on work, my letter from my lawyer is going out today. Just approved it for the continued finacial support. It is pretty aggressive. After I read it made everything seem so real. I am scared of everything. I do not want him to get angry, I do not want them to band together against me. I want his affair to end.

Everything I read is make the affair as uncomfortable as possible. This letter makes it uncomfortable.

Glad I found about the Bahamas trip, it was put in the letter. I need to be strong. Any encouraging words will be helpful.

My WH told my IM get his mail and his paystubs together. Really, I am suppose to gather his information to fight the motion of support. That is his problem. I knwo I sound crazy, I have the incredible urge to ask him if he really wants this. I will not, because I know what the answer is.

Why is it as terrible and hurtful as someone is to you do you still want them back? I am mourning the loss of who my husband was and it is very painful today.

Why do I feel bad about my attorney sending him the letter. He is going to fight me. I am taking away his affair $$$.

I want to be hopeful, I do, I think this will push him to file for divorce.

I am so scared and do not feel strong.

Mason, I can relate to pretty much everything you're going through, especially about missing the person who treats you like poo on the bottom of his shoe.

If you are in the 5%, I will be there alongside you if that's any comfort. While my STBWXH is not taking expensive trips to the Bahamas, he has no shame in taking his POSOW out for dinner 2-3x a week while I am getting grief from him about how he can't afford child support or alimony. Every month, it's like pulling teeth and I have to beg like a dog for what is a very fair amount.

I originally filed for separation and my H promptly filed for D - as soon as he found out I was expecting our child. So, don't be surprised if he files just out of spite or anger. In my STBXH's case, he is acting purely out of emotion and without thinking anything through - he's living 100% in the moment which is probably where your H is.

I feel strongest when I know ZERO about their relationship and have ZERO contact with him. If I get weak and catch a glimpse of him, I miss him but I don't think he misses me (he acts hostile towards me) so it's just painful all around. Why subject myself to that?

I just go to my therapist, work out at the gym, try to focus on work and my daughter and pray...alot. I'm doing better and I know you will too the more time and distance you get. And when /if, he comes back, you'll be in a good place to evaluate the situation for what it is - not take him back out of desperation.

Thanks, that is why I love this board, I do feel better not knowing anything about him. He pobably will file and at the very least fight the motion for support. I want him to file, I want that on him.

Mason, I'm sorry you are hurting right now. Good for you for following through with your attorney! Now, no more Plan B breaks for you. See how it sends you into a tailspin? If you have an attorney, let your attorney deal with all legal-related matters, especially when it comes to gathering records. Turn those things that your husband is asking for over to your attorney. Ignore the request from WH. In the legal realm, he is your adversary. You don't cooperate with the further destruction of your family. If WH wants a divorce, make him work for it. He will soon realize that it comes at a great cost!

Force his hand on the support. He OWES that to his children! Keep track of the marital funds that he is wasting on the OW while your kids are going without.

(((mason))) stay strong and do something nice for yourself.

I know this felt good when you sent it, and of course it was a good dig, but let me tell you something about waywards and there pretzel logic. They feel like the world is against them boohoo, and when you contact them with anything that is inflamatory,(true or not), it takes thier eyes off of themselves and you become the reason they are not happy together. When it is all over and they have to really look at themselves, they must then look at the truth, that the reason they are not happy comes from them. Now they are with another person who would lie and cheat on them for....???

Part of plan B is for your recovery also, and when you can truly know you will be fine without him we will have done the best part of helping you. You need to know that you will be fine, that he is ruining a marriage, and that you cannot remain in such a twisted relationship. If that is not accomplished recovery will not happen. Not full recovery anyway because if he is not interested in your emotional state and security as much as you are, he fails as a husband.

So whether he comes back or not, start to visualize yourself healthy and happy without him and this tripe he is putting you through. Do not even think about him and live your life as well as you can day to day. If he did come home and spent the time to recover then maybe this pain could be avoided but if he insists on running out the love bank units you need to let them go. Its going to happen anyways because all he seems to do is write bad checks off counterfiet units. You deserve the real thing.

Dark B and take care of yourself you will get thru this

mason, mason, mason.... you are like.... me! I just read this whole thread and so many similarities.... my husband also went from "I love you" to "I have to be with her" in a matter of a day and a half... I still cannot wrap my head around how he can be one and then now, no contact, and he's fine. I feel just as crazy as you feel. My husband has taken all the money and is paying nothing.... the main difference I see in our stories is that you have a good lawyer, and I think mine is not looking out for my best interests.... I am going to see if legal aid can help me on Monday...

Update:
He is resuming paying for full daycare, he payed what he owed me for last month. Finally something going my way in this. I really thought he was going to fight it. He may be getting ready to file, who knows. I hope this gave hime a bit of a wake up call. Less $$$ for affair.

Yup, reality verses fantasy..........
He can't get away with not paying......
Give it time when they starting fighting about $, kids, household chores, that kind of thing, they will soon learn that real life takes more than saying I love you's and a sex life, welcome to real life.......
just sit back and watch the show, take care of you and the kids, don't worry what he has chosen for himself, right now he being a fool..........let him be one.....
jessi

Thank you Jessi.... today is a good day for me. I feel a sense of relief financially.

Not sure what to do. I fear my husband will miss the fathers day event at school and not sure how to handle the daycare graduation on the 24th. It is his wknd and the graduation is at 5:00. I have not mentioned any of these events, my feeling is he needs to figure that out himself. How do I handle the possible meeting? I wish it was earlier in the day, he would miss it.
I am still grieving.

HELP, my husband files for divorce!! I am so sad. It is really over. I have no chance at saving my marriage.

Broke plan b and asked him if this is what he really wanted. Oh my god, help me. I am having a nervous breakdown. I have had false hope all along.

mason, time to resend your plan b letter.

drag out any divorce proceedings.

Well, since you broke plan b - tell us a little more about this conversation.

Lexxxy is correct.

Meanwhile, get a pit bull divorce attorney.
Ask around.

That is fear talking.

Are you taking any prescription anti anxiety anti depression medications?
You may need to ask your MD for something.
You need a clear head to be strategic.


Contact your physician and ask for medical help if you are actually having a nervous breakdown.
You have 2 small kids to attend.
You need to be clear headed.

I am on meds, it just hurts. Took a xanax and I am calmer. Spoke with my attorney and feel better, we will probably counter file based on adultery to make sure I get alimony. In shock I guess.
It just makes me so sad he wants to end it.
I will be put back together by the time I pick them up.
This is the final knock out blow....Affair beats family! Winning!

Calm down, take a deep breath and relax. It is a blow to you, but it doesn't change much for your sitch right now anyways. There have also been people who have saved their marriages moments from divorce, and one poster, Johstwin, who was actually remarried to her FWH. I know that any of these things are not something that you want to deal with. You need to think with a clear head.

Please, don't break Plan B again. It will only show your WH that you aren't serious about what you have said and if he does things that antagonize you, you will break Plan B and talk to him. Don't let him have that satisfaction.

You can do this Mason, we're all behind you.

I did get a typical wayward response when I asked him if he really wanted this divorce, he said he did not know. I was listening to Dr. harley's radio program yesterday in the archive and he did state that 95% of all affairs end. It gives you false hope. I was pretty good this morning. God, I want my life back. So many of us on this board do not want divorce, after everything our waywards put us through. This will be and is a tough ride.

I have not posted in awhile. Divorce is on hold, broke plan B and started talking again, which was nice. I felt like I was in Plan A. Asked him last night if he was still seeing her. He said yes I asked him again if he wanted a divorce, again I got I do not know. Then he said it sounded like I was done... Really??? It was the type of conversation when I woke up this monring thinking did that really happen. I have to move back to Plan b. Feel safer there. I have been upset all day. It is true I feel like my clock is set back to ZERO. I have been beating myself up all day for even having the conversation with him. I never should have left Plan b, but I thought maybe us talking again would be good. Not so much. I felt like calling my attorney this morning. I did not. Need to my emotions in check and crawl back into my bubble. I feel like their affair is never going to end. I keep thinking in my mind that there is trouble in fantasy land, apparently not. I think that is what upset me so much.

mason, did you ever hear Dr Harley speak about Plan C? That is the plan you are in right now. It stands for "compromise" and is the most likely to lead you to divorce. See, as long as he can continue to speak to you at will and keep you strung along, he can continue to pursue his affair in peace. Not only is he assured you will be sitting there waiting, but you serve an important purpose in his affair: a common enemy. As long as they have that, they can keep the focus on their own putrid selves.

Every time you talk to him, you help the OW, in other words. But you hurt yourself by staying enmeshed in the affair. Please go dark and stay dark, mason. You really feel so much better.

Thank you, I know, but for me it felt like we may have been working towards reconciling, (my false hope) I never asked about the OW until last night. I guess it just felt good to talk again, but after today I realize it has hurt me more. I think I want to save my marriage so badly. I need to go back again. I have been reading a lot on here and I was beating myself up today for not sticking to the plan. I feel better than I did earlier. I know this is a marathon, but I am now a year at D-day. What a terrible day and I think what has changed? I feel better, but I still do not have my husband back. He still has no home, he has not move forward with his life at all. Still staying with friend and at his Mom's. I think that kind of hit home as well. I may send a new Plan B letter.

And this is the problem. REconciliation is impossible until he meets all your conditions in the Plan B letter, ie: end his affair and commit to marital recovery. There is no working towards it at all. You either are or you aren't. In this case, all you did was tell him you have no standards for continued contact with you. So he knows he doensnt have to meet any conditions. You were NOT reconciling and the continued contact only hurt you more. It prevented you from recovering personally, prolonged the affair and neutralized ANY last remaining leverage you had with him.

Unless he is ALL IN and has ended his affair you are just spinning your wheels and wasting your time. Do you see how you were wasting your time?

A third problem is that it is extremely unattractive for a BW to seem as if she is chasing a WH. That is how it comes across when a BW allows a WH to contact her.

Yes, I know, he was initating all contact with me...I was not chasing, just making thigs easy for him again. This is why I was so upset all day. Believe me I get it! Another thing he said to me was how could we reconcile, you are not even talking to me. There is really no sense anymore. I guess when he putthe divorce on hold I thought it meant something. It meant nothing. I have gotten so much better and today I felt worse that I had in weeks. I am hoping I feel stronger by the day.

When he put the D on hold it did mean something, it meant that he still wanted to keep you dangling on the line. And then you showed him....that you are still dangling on the line.

So, you need to get back into Plan B. How long ago did you break Plan B?

Re-write and send a new Plan B letter, get into a pitch black Plan B and VOW that you won't break it this time.

I broke it for about six wks I think. I will send a new plan b letter, I can deal with the drama. It was nice to be removed and he did have me dangling.

I meant I can not deal with the drama. He had his cake. No more dessert!! It took me all day to wrap my head around this, and I was unable to concentrate on work againg. Know better, do better!!

The answer to "how could we reconcile" should always be: a) end your affair and b) commit to marital recovery. That is how. The path back is clearly outlined in the Plan B letter.

They say this so they can keep you strung along because Plan B makes them uncomfortable. But if he were really serious about reconciling he would meet your standards. This is why it is so important for you to NEVER EVER let him have contact with you unless he has a) ended his affair and b) committed to marital recovery. He was never committed to either. He just wanted to get his needs met in 2 places.

I completely agree, I fell for this one. I missed him and I am lonely, but I respect myself enough to know I deserve better. My boys are great and that I realize will keep me going. You right, I never metioned the affair, or the elephant in the room.

Have not posted in a while, no change but I am sad this weekend. Ths marks one year of us being separated and not living together. I remember it like it was yesterday and how much pain I was in. I think I am just numb now. I really thought after a year things would be different. How long do the Harley's say that you should stay in Plan B? Is it two years from exposure or two years from D-day? I am losing hope that I will be able to keep my family together.

mason, the Harley's recommend not hanging on longer than 2 years from exposure. He says after 2 years there is really no hope for the marriage.

Thanks. I exposed in November- so a year from November, not sure if I will be able to last that long...Only time will tell. Need to bounce back and stop being sad. I made it through the year of separation, that should be enough for today.

I think that Harley says he usually recommends getting a divorce after two years but he says that mostly, ( at least my interpretation of it), to do so because like Plan A needs a time limit to do it well, Plan B does too. An end point. That a betrayed spouse can not be in the nebulous marital situation indefinitely emotional health-wise and two years is a good place to feel you gave it your best shot. You'd have no regrets and feel pride in yourself vs regret at getting the divorce. Your waywards account in your Love Bank will be at a low level and make it bearable too.

In other words, I don't think there is no hope for a marriage after two years but you have got to move onward for your own spirit. You have to create a legal future without the wayward.You do so saying "C'est le vie (that's life). YK?

The bottom line is that there is a shelf date on when we can operate as half a person, and we have to move on.

You will be fully restored to Mason 1.0, the stronger more robust operating system, without the virus.

We all know that people are different, and people can change, but when they refuse to operate in the way of integrity, you must let them go.

If he ever came back he would have to be someone so different, and jump the hurdles to prove himself anyways.

It would be a new life, with a different person and yes, it is too bad he can't do that now..The chicken.

Rock on Mason, you are doing awesome

Reading, just for clarification, Dr Harley does say that if it there has not been reconciliation in 2 years, that it is unlikely to ever happen. If it goes on that long, he suggests not waiting any longer.

This is from the private forum to a lady that was in Plan B:

"Give him two years of plan B, and then let go. By then, there will be little hope for reconciliation."


Another one:

"I generally encourage a spouse in Plan B to make sure that the unfaithful spouse knows that reconciliation is possible if there is (1) no contact with the lover, with extraordinary conditions to guarantee compliance and (2) restoration of the marriage by following the MB plan of recovery. While this can be said once, it doesn't hurt for an intermediary to remind the WS of the offer. But I don't encourage a spouse to wait more than 2 years in Plan B. After that amount of time, reconciliation is very rare."

Best wishes
Willard F. Harley, Jr.

ML, both of those quotes say Plan B for two years, not from exposure. I know that in a case for a BW, we only Plan A for a short time, but for a BH who Plan A's for up to 6 months, that would mean 6 months Plan A and another 2 years Plan B. What I remember from SAA was that DrH told Jon 2 years total. 6 months Plan A, 18 months Plan B.

Mason, it isn't MANDATORY to stay in for the full 2 years, you should reevaluate how you feel. Me personally, I am not going to have ANY contact with my WH as long as he is with OW. If that is the rest of my life, so be it. When I would file for a D, if my WH hasn't first, is a different time for me, and it has NOTHING to do with hanging on to my WH, or "waiting." I don't even feel like I am "waiting" right now. I am not ready to be divorced, and I don't want to date, so there is no reason for me to file, yet. I do have a time line, for ME, and when I get there, I will file, because I should be ready by then. I haven't ever told anyone my end date, because I may want to change it, depending on how I feel(I won't extend it, only lessen it).

Thank you all for your responses, feeling better. Brought my 5 year old to kindergarten this week. I get the joy of bringing him there and picking up everday. He misses the boat on that. My son did say to me that "Daddy does not want to take care of us he always goes away, work, work, work." He is starting to realize that his friends Dad's live with them and his does not. Too much for a 5 year old. I told him he needs to tell Daddy that.

Mason - my six year old son is in agony over his dad. Last night my son come downstairs and this was our conversation.

Son: We have to talk to GOD to bring daddy home. Is GOD nice?
Me: Yes, GOD is very nice, and wants daddy to come home. All we can do is pray for him to come home.

Son: Mom, I am so sad. I miss daddy so much. I just want to go to bed.

He goes upstairs and then I came to tuck him in.

Me: Son, are you okay? What would you like to talk about?

Son: Mom, I just want to sleep because I am so sad. I miss daddy. I ask him when I go to his house if he will pack his stuff up and come home. He says he can't come home.

Me: Son, Just keep telling daddy you want him to come home. Let daddy know how sad you are and how much you miss him. I will be here for you if you want to cry, get angry, or feel sad.

I love you so much son, and with time, prayer, and patience hopefully daddy will come home. Just remind him how much we love him and miss him and need him.

When I went to bed last night my heart broke. All I can do is reassure my son I am here for him. The kids are so smart and understand the situation. I hope to use prayer and patience to teach my son a lesson. I pray that my son is learning it isn't right for a man to treat his wife this way.

For me that is the biggest lesson I want to gain from this experience. I want my son to know hurting a woman in this matter is never exceptable.

Many prayers {{{{{Mason}}}}}

Thank you, I want to cry. My son runs away from the phone when his Dad calls. I hate this and always will.

Feeling a little down today. I inadvertantly found out my husband is in Miami with OW. I just feel like their affair will never end. I wish I could jet set off every other wknd and live this lifestyle. I just feel like I am losing hope. I really always thought he would come back, I guess we all want LaLa land to explode. How do you keep the hope alive? I feel like giving up.

I have not posted in awhile. An update: My husband ended his affair a month ago. He was entrenched for two years. We have since been talking and seeing each other a bit. With that said he told me last night he is tryingto love me again and get feeling back for me. Is this normal? He is not back in the house, he is lookung for another job. I asked him if he thinks we have done everything we could to save our marruage, He said no, but he is worried about hurting me again and failing. He says he still wants to work at it. I am so confused and is this normal bahavior for a Wayward Spouse after a month of leaving the OW. It felt like another knife in an already wounded heart.
Any insights?

Is your WH looking for a new job because he works with OW, or has contact with her through his job?

Are you CERTAIN that there is NC between him and OW? Has he agreed to write a NCL like the one in SAA? Has he agreed to any EPs? What is his attitude like? Is he remorseful? Is he willing to do ANYTHING that you ask?

Are you looking at coaching or the online course with MB? Would your WH be willing to post on the forum(if you haven't told him about it yet and you're not sure if he is serious, I wouldn't).

It says that you were in Plan B, did he go through the IM to tell you that he wanted to reconcile? Sorry about all of the questions, it's just easier to advise someone when you know all of the possible information.

mason, doc H has said most affairs end on their own after two years.

Normal for WH to not know when end is up at this point.

Time to call the harleys. It would be great for the both of you. You can each do a session on that call.

Even if WH balks at this time a call will give you the professional guidance on how to proceed.

To be honest, I broke Plan B. No one could be my IM any longer and with two little boys it was tough. With that said, he does not seem as remorseful, seems more like he is trying to see if t he can love me again. I asked him if he can see his life without me, he said sometimes yes and sometimes no. But he wants to try. I just was wondering if this is normal for someone who could be in withdrawel? He does work with her, she lives two states away. He knows he needs to leave. I just need to try and understand this at this point. He has not been on this sight.

I have that sick feeling in my stomach again.

My advice would be that he isn't serious about recovery and that the A is still active, so you need to get yourself into a real Plan B which doesn't end until he is serious about recovery, of you get a D(even after a D you could continue Plan B if you wish, I would).

DrH suggests that BW's not try recovery with a WH who isn't remorseful.

Does your WH know about DrH in any way? Do you have SAA?

And this is probably the number one reason for me to suggest Plan B to you. A dark as night Plan B. One where you can heal, and stay away from your WH until he shows that he is serious.

you are right, now I feel as I am in Plan A. I do have SAA. I relate my story more to Sus and Jon. I believe the affair is over. Just not sure if it is permanent. I guess there a lot to happen and a new job would be the number one step towards recovery. I know better, until then this means nothing and what he said is fog babble. Just so tired of all this. Tired of waiting and hoping. Not much of that left

So, are you going to get into Plan B?

I have too... I now understand when I read when the BS is just so exhausted, I can not go through this anymore. I just want yo know is it normal for the WS to feel this way. I want someone to be all in and what does that mean "trying to love me"?
Is he trying to get over feelings for the OW? I guess after being in a two year affair the feelings do not just go away overnight. I have one friend to talk to, everyone else thinks I should be done. I feel like when people ask me how are things going and I say "the same" I just feel stupid. I still have the dream of my family being together again, just do not know if Is houdl start letting go. I have to let go.

Can a former WS give me any insight on how they felt when they ended the affair.

It has been shown on this forum (and you can read in recovery i.e. yb1, scientistmom, and the false recovery thread (I will bump)) unless they come back truly repentant (owning their crap) then they are not serious about recovery.

For repentant WH read sexymamabear, herpapabear, gloveoil, and sunnydintx.

Your WH is still wayward and he needs to know his path home to you.

Can you send him an update conditions 'love letter' that states what it will take to be married to you?

The number one factor is him finding a new job. I am aware that no recovery can take palce until then. I am just frustrated; at the no filter fog babble that we still have to hear. I am growing impatient and so tired of my sitauation, like many posters here. He knows his path to come home, he is just not on it yet. Not sure if he ever will be.
Thanks for your responses. Even though I do not post much I come her everyday to feel somewhat "normal".

i was hoping you would come back and give an update. I have been thinking of you. I am toughlove, so I used to post to you.

Many prayers and hugs!

Tough

Thank you.. again reading here helps me get through days when I feel sad still. I understand this is a marathon, but I need to change my my age and the age of the boys. We are all a year older. That makes me sad. Time passes so quickly but going through this it feels like slow motion. I have not followed MB to a T, but it has given me strength. I will know if i do divorce, I have given it my all. Like many others on here, I am just not there yet. I have a shred of hope left.

Have you and your spouse spoken to a MB Marriage Coach?
I wouldnt go into Plan B if you dont know the status of the affair.
If the affair is over, you need to start rebuilding your love banks.
Are you following the plan in Surviving an Affair?

We just spoke about the break up yesterday. Which is when he said he is trying to love me again, scared of failing and hurting me again. I really do not think recovery can start until he finds another job. He is not back in the house, but we are talking. Almost learning how to talk to each other again. He seems like he is in a place of limbo. So that is when I say I feel like I am in Plan A again.

Why is he still not home? If his affair is over and he is truly committed to recovering your marriage, he should be back home.

I suspect he has not ended his affair.

Yes, I agree. I think on some level it ended but they are still at the same company. He is looking for a new job. I am fully aware that we can not recover while they are working for the same company. I have expressed this to him several times. He is currently living with his Mom. Never got an apartment. Where we live nor her city... I will not have him home until he leaves his job.

Are you ready to go to Plan B? Because it sounds like he is cake-eating.

I believe it is over, He was cake eating. I can still check where he flies too. I do not want to Plan B again unless he goes back to her and start Plan D. I feel like we need to start build our love for each other again after so much hurt. It was just hard to hear some of the things he said. But after reading so much I guess it takes time to love each other again. The affair is over? Now he has to get a new job. Actions speak louder than words. Am I totally off base here?

Is it possible to Plan A again?

Mason ... I will be back ... If you want to try a 2-3 week maximum for Plan A ... then you have to go back into Plan B otherwise you risk your health.

Let him chase you ... you are worth so much ... if you chase him then you are in the same Pre-A marriage as before where he thinks he can neglect you.

Just be careful on Plan A.

The exact thing happened to me ... the whore dumped my WH. I thought he would come home ... nope he doesn't want to end the friendship. He is still intoxicated on her today. I tried Plan A but I couldn't while he was still friends with her. It hurts like hell ... Just be careful.

It can go in so many directions.

I have been careful and it does hurt. The one thing is I am independent after almost two years of this.

You could Plan A if you like, but I thought you were already feeling like you were in Plan A now, and there was no desired effect.

What is it about PLan B that worries you?

I was Plan B for 7 months. Which helped me tremendously. Not talking to him now when he told me he broke up with the OW and he wants to work on things I think would set us back. I do know that if he goes back I will never speak to him again and will be in Plan B forever. I have told him if we divorce I will not be his friend. With that said I think he is in a withdrawel stage- 3-4 wks out.... From what I read many WS do not jump right into recovery or feel love for their BS. Is that true? Botom line is he needs to leave his job and is willing to do that. I had some ideas in my head that he woudl come crawling back and beg for me to take him back. That had not happened yet.

Also, I know if this does not progress, I will not just accept things for the way they are. I deserve better. We all do. He is still a wayward and I need to not listen to his fogbabble. I do believe right after the affair ends they are still in the fog for sometime. Please correct me if I am off here. Just trying to wrap my head still around all of this.

Oh you are correct that WSs tend to stay in a fog even after the affair has ended.

Is there absolutely ZERO contact between OW and WH? WHy do you believe that he is in withdrawal?

If you believe that he is willing to start recovery with you, then you won't enter Plan A, you would enter Plan RECOVERY. Has he agreed to a NCL? Has he agreed to counseling of your choice(MB of course)? Has he agreed to any EPs? What are your conditions for recovery?

No we are not there yet, We have had one very emotional conversation. He can not be in total no contact beacuse they work for the same company. They are in different states, are no longer allowed to travel or work together. Because of my expsosure they had to sign a no contact. With that said at a company meeting (coming up in May) they could see each other. ( i am hopeful he finds a new job by then. That is the number one requiremnet right now. I am giving this some breathing space (for myself to heal from the conversation) and he needs to go to counseling himself.

I believe he is withdrwawel because of the way he spoke to me the other day, saying I am trying to love you, I do not want to hurt you and I am scared to fail. I would have rather heard something more positive, but thinking back when we were in false recovery, he told me all of those things I wanted to hear and he did not mean one of them.

I think a begining for us will be his new job. I read somewhere that one WH could not even think about recovery until he got a new job. In my crazy mind I feel like that is the case.

So what is your plan until he gets the new job? How long is that going to take? Is he actively looking for work right now?

Yes, he is actively looking for work. Hopefully something will come up sooner than later and he is aggressively looking, always telling me when he sends resumes out. I was thinking Plan A for now and then is things do not work and I am not happy Plan B.

I am just wondering is this normal behavior for a WS just leaving his affair?

I can not tell you what behaviours are normal when leaving an affair.

You didn't answer my other questions though. What else is he doing for recovery? Has he agreed to a NCL? Any EPs?

Is your plan that you will Plan A until he finds another job, and if you can't last that long, you will PLan B?

Personally, I think you will be better protected - and he will be more motivated - if you are in Plan B.

Right now the situation is ripe for a false recovery. He still has contact with her. He has not completed withdrawal. He is not remorseful.

I don't understand why you want to Plan A that. Is it a control issue for you? That you feel the need to know what he's doing and try to prevent him from sliding back to OW? Or is your own withdrawal from him too painful?

You are not starting recovery. He hasn't committed to that, and in fact has been rather HURTFUL to you. He has absolutely no fear about losing you. That buys him time.

If he is in contact with her at work then he is still in the affair. This happened with my wife, she was so addicted to OM that she could not cancel her stupid facebook account!
Needless to say, No Contact lasted an entire 10 days before she drove there one midnight for sex.
Dr. Harley says that sometimes a move out of state is needed.
Your husband is a addict, pretend he is a cocaine addict and the other woman is a cocaine dealer. They cant stay apart.
So if your husband says, "I need to find another neighborhood where by drug dealer doesnt hang out in"....but keeps going to the same neighborhood (work) how long do you think it will be until they are back in bed together?

You are probably right. He can buy his time right into divorce then. He has been with the OW for two years. He could still be with her, I do not know. I have a short window, for myself.
I told him the other night I was not going to be here forever and asked him if he thought we have done verything we could to save our marriage. He said no, I want to work at it. With that said, I do not trust a thing he says, but I love him and miss him. We need to start somewhere, but as I said, my window is short. Have already been dealing with this for so long, what's another month. I can have the rest of my life to be in Plan B and D.

Have you contacted Marriage Builders for marraige coaching?

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8116_coach.html

No, but Harley's radio show awhile back before the affair broke up. They told me to get back into Plan B, whcih is not out of the question. I will suggest the counseling. As I have said I have not followed everything to a T, but I sis not do a great Plan A in the beginning. I was so angry and upset that he was chooseing the OW over our family, then I exposed, then Plan B after a very short false recovery. Now here we are....

I wouldn't even Plan A for a month though. Why don't you Plan A for a week, and then enter Plan B. By your own admissions, you are feelings your LB drain. You are getting really run down.

I am. Tired. Thank you, I do have a fun wknd planned. Going out with college friends tomorrow night and a family party on Saturday. I like to keep busy still, when you sit alone there is too much to think about. Thank you for all of your responses, this is such a great sounding board and wish I found it on D-day. Not four months later. Now I am two years out and I hope that he is true to his word and it is over,but I always snoop, probably always will.

How are you going to make sure that you stick to Plan B this time? What were the problems you had last time?

A long plan A is a bad idea. There is a reason Dr H recommends it be kept short for women.

Aside from the fact that it WILL make you ill and drain your love bank, a short one will be more effective.

Men like to chase, they don't like to be chased. Plan A involves looking amazing, keeping cool and showing some steel.Being someone the WH would want to chase. Its hard to keep that up so a short EFFECTIVE plan A is better than a long one which will see you get drained and unable to keep it up. A woman who is worthy of being chased is someone who doesn't stick around to be cheated on.

A glimspe of paradise that is suddenly snatched away gives him something to work for.

I Agree. as I said before I am holding my control and making plans for myself. I have a life in some respects. I am going to make this short-lived. After two years I understand the behavior and what I am looking for. Wait and see for a short time, them close the blinds....ALready have summer plans with my boys without him. Believe me I am realist.

Could you please answer these questions?

Problem last time was my sisters (I have two) would handle the drop off, Pick up was always at daycare, He would screw around and say he would drop off at 1:00 and then he woudl show up an hour later. Huge waste of time for either one of them. Toward the end, I had him drop off in the driveway and I would meet them at the back door. A far enough walk where I could not see him. We stopped Plan B and started talking when lawyers got involved. That scared both us. The finality of it all. That was summer, and he broke up with her last month.

What can you do differently to ensure exchanges are done in a way that will have no contact between you and your WH?

How long are you going to be in Plan A? What is your start date for PLan B? Many would actually suggest(and I am one of them) that you should have been in Plan B a long time ago, since your WH isn't showing any willingness to recover with you and he isn't showing remorse.

Yes, I know. His remorse is light at any rate. I need to figure out where this is going, if anywhere. Short Window... I agree with all the principals here and as I said I have not followed to a T, but understand the strength and willing to implement if I do not see improvement. I have read so many threads and I appreaciate all of the advice. Again, just wanted to know if my husbasds reactions were normal for withrdrawel, he sounded depressed tonight.

If I never came to this sight I never would have though to expise to various people including the CEO about their affair. Luckily finding an org chart helped.

Did you think more about coaching with Dr. harley?
I hope you are doing good today

I have, but I think my husband needs therapy on his own. This is such a long road. There is no easy fix. I wish I could just turn it off sometimes. Take the boys run away and start over. (will never happen) but that is a daydream I have.
I am doing well, today. Better mood. Was out with old friends last night and laughed a lot.

Mason, if you can manage it, I think YOU would benefit from a call to the coaching center.

I just finished reading this entire thread. It seems by having contact with him off and on, you had given him the idea you are available for him, and that in itself is not likely to make him drool over you. Personally, I think you should have been in Plan B all this time, it would have given him a chance to miss you and lent an aura of mystique to you. But you need a SOLID Plan B, not just hit and miss. It means not reading his texts, not seeing or HEARING about him through others. You need to let others know your wishes too so they don't pass on information to either of you.

You ask if his response is normal, yes it's common. When the bubble bursts on their affair they usually do have a withdrawal period. This shouldn't concern you, it's like any other withdrawal and the only way for him to make it through it is to have NO CONTACT with her whatsoever. Including work. Even though she lives two states away and even though the job states "no contact" since the exposure was done, yet you yourself say they may see each other at an upcoming meeting! ??? That's not "no contact"!

You can make it through the loss of his job, even if it means losing your home, but you cannot recover your marriage when he is not committed to it 100% and remorseful!

It seems to me you are hanging on to a shred of hope of reconciling to the point that you are willing to throw overboard the MB principles to try and pursue it...which we have already told you is marital doom for sure. Why not give this marriage its best chance by following what the vets have laid out here for you and let them walk you through it instead of disappearing for months or not answering their questions or going on to do what you want to do? You were doing so well when you were in full plan B, I was so proud of you, you could SEE yourself getting stronger! THAT is the person most likely to recover her marriage! I really wish you the best with this, you have hung in there for a long time and been through so much, I'd love to see you have a good outcome...but you CAN have a good outcome, whether it results in a recovered marriage or just a healthy you on your own. You've already shown us a glimpse of that you!

I am done, all of you were right. He never left the OW. Just decided to cake eat more. I called the OW and told her everything, that we had been seeing each other and somewhat datingto try to recover our marriage. I threw him under the bus. I heard way too many details from her and he lies to her over and over again. She broke it off with him. I am sad because of the loss of hope. Funny, I kind of befriended the OW, we were sharing the same lies he told both of us. I hope she does not take him back, he had the nerve to tell her that our divorce would be final next month.
Neither of us had filed. That will change soon. Going back into Plan B and then Plan D. Called him out on all of his lies last night. He is a pathological sociopath to lie at this level.
Have not called mt attorney yet. Have to get myself together.
Trying to wrap my head around all of this again.

he told her he was meeting the kids next month when the divorce was final and that she would be moving to NJ so they could live togther. Fanatasy land. I broke that bubble. in the last 24 hours he lost the OW and his family. I want him to be alone.

Are you going to go into a dark Plan B?

Yes, when I thought he wanted to recover I went back into Plan A. I just made his life easier. He would spend part of the week with us and the rest with the OW. Throwing me crumbs to keep me hopeful. I was in a good place and I was sucked back in. I am amazed at the lies on both sides. Telling OW that I am greedy. Came back to reading posts and the one about Why WW get angry. He is angry at me for talking to the OW and telling her the truth. His boss thinks he is a pathological liar. I am upset today. Have to start splitting my boys up again. False hope is a terrible thing. But I saw glimmers of the person I loved. I do not want to be me anymore. It is D-day all over again.
I know all of the details now of his affair from her.
Had to come back and post. I now know I did everything I could to keep my family together.
I hope he ends up alone.

Going back and reading my posts makes me want to cry.... I am so stupid for believing he was in withdrawel from her. He never was away form her. I just want to be happy again. Waking up nauseated every morning again. I am so done.

As a BS who also experienced a FR I know your pain.

as some have said 'adultery is like getting knife to the heart, a FR is like they are looking you in the eyes twisting it deeper'

The ultimate betrayal X2.

I feel for you. So sorry.

Although we are in R now, at the time I discovered the A never stopped, about 2 days later I realized her LB balance with me was gone and I was completely out of love with her.

Realizing this made the decision to D easier in some ways.

Maybe you haven't gotten there yet since this news is so fresh.

Examine your heart. As painful as it is at this time, I asked myself 'what would I be gaining by continuing to Reconcile?'

The answers I came up with were grim. I had lost my dreams.

Tough realization.

Prayers to you.

I had two years of false hope. I am grieving the loss of keeping my family intact, I am grieving the loss of the husband I knew. I now know I am really alone. I have cried over this man since I was 16. On some level I still love him, but not like this. He would have to move Mt. Everest to come back to us. He was never willing to do the work. Lack of remorse was dead on. I should know better. I love my boys to death, but I wish he was not their father.

Don't feel to bad Mason, he really is alone, and all the crap he does is just distractions to that fact.

No matter how many warm bodies he deceived he is really missing and he is alone

Living and loving someone is allways a work in progress, even with the best of us

Desception starts with the deciever first, as they deceive themselves

Don't worry he really is alone, and you can pity him

Thank you. Funny, he just sent me a text asking how the boys are? Does he really think I am going to discuss the boys with him like I used to. I feel like he does not undertsand the ramifications of his actions and is now in the poor me stage.

He remembers Plan B and not speaking with one another.

I wish I could take my boys and jump into someone else's life.

Mason, why did you not follow MB? Why did you enter Plan A for sooooooo long? And befriending OW? Are you kidding me? How could you befriend someone who CHOSE to commit adultery with your WH?

I think you should get into Plan B even if you have chosen to go full on Plan D.

In Plan B. By talking to the OW and comapring all of the lies in wierd wasy has been therapuetic. Strange I know. I just needed to know the depth of all the lies. I told her everything on my end and it felt good to let her know their realtionship was a lie. I want him be be alone. Me talking to her will not last. Beleive me.
So I am in Plan B- and plan D soon. Giving myslef some time to clear my head. I already have an attorney- just need to get some of the emotion out of it.

I think I stayed in a Plan A state for so long because I was lonley. I enjoyed our family time together and I belived on some crazy level that he wanted to come back. Believe I was still like, this is not right. He should be remorseful and grateful he had a chance to save his family. He was none of that. I ate his crumbs as he through them on the floor and wlaked out the door. I regret it and my self esteem is kind of low right now. But I feel some solace that I just hope I blew up their relationship.
It hurts but I have to make myself happy again. I just hope that comes sooner than later.

Have you sent him a PBL? Have you cut off all contact with your WH?

Not only did you damage yourself emotionally, you also propped up their affair. You may have inflicted a temporary wound right now, but I can almost guarantee that your WH will convince OW to take him back. And YOU will be their enemy.

The best thing for you right now is to get into a true Plan B. Take the steps, get an IM, and pull the trigger.

Not wasting time with a Planan B letter. I am just never speaking to him again. There is no hope for my marriage. That is what I am delaing with is the loss of hope. that is all I had to hold on to. I may have wounded the affair but he can be her problem. I have really done everything I could. He hated Plan B last year. I really have nothing left. I am tired, sick stomach, but I would be the enemy anyway.
I have already been called the greedy, crazy wife.
What's left. D-day was August 2010.

I have made mistakes, but now I need begin the long process of legal battle, and rebuilding my life. So many changes lie ahead and I am scared. But this is the inevitable.
Trigger is pulled. No contact.

So you're not going to do an actual Plan B? You are going to continue to limp along and feel horrible.

Get yourself an IM, and do this Plan B properly. It will be the BEST thing for you. It really will. There is no such thing as Plan B lite.

What would you need to do to get into a real Plan B? How are you going to do child exchanges? How are you going to communicate with him about visitations, finances, etc? This is going to be a real long road, and the better you prepare now, the better.

I am going to speak with my attorney, last year he decided to stop paying me and we were about to file a motion. He started paying again and thru his attorney he know he has to continue support until we come up with a settlement. Exchange of the kids will be he will drop them off in the driveway and I will meet them at the back door. When school starts that will be tough with soccer games. Need to worry about that later. Divorce will be underway by then.

He will be a 4 day a month dad. I feel bad for my boys with this. They were really enjoying having him around more.

I know I will start feeling better, I did last time. Just need to get to that place again. and i do hope that they do not get back together. He was about to introduce her to the boys. Crazy how woudl I not have found this out.

This unfolded in a better way, atleast she know he is a cheater and a liar to her as well. She can do whatever she wants with that. I am glad I told her the truth.

My advice is to get into a proper Plan B. With an IM, the PBL, etc.

I am with scottie 100%
the plan B letter is more than an expression of feelings, it is a commitment to yourself of the path you have chosen

Your farting around with the commitment you have to maketo yourself

All the actions that are laid out in the plan B process are important and nessesary for your own self esteem and respect

Don't deny them to yourself

What would I even write or say at this point. I si hate to admit this and I feel like a fool, but if he turned his life around, I would think about it.

Yes of course you are still entagled with the fantasy. He has his own

Well then, you have your answer. You write a glowing Plan B letter, one pretty much like the one in SAA, and you go full force Plan B. Worst case scenario, you end up personally recovered and divorced. Doesn't sound half bad, does it?

You are right. I have my own fantasy. I need to think about my life and fuuture with someone new. I had false hope for two years and he is a serial cheater.

I enabled his affair and made his life easy especially with the kids. I need to get into my head that he does not care about me and he has abused and taken advantage of me for a long time.

I need to revisit the letter in SAA.

I am so crazy that I still love this person or the person he was. He will never be the husband or father to my kids like I want. Not sure what I am holding on to.

Thanks for listening.

It takes time away from your WH to see what you really have left. And sadly, as long as he is wayward, there isn't anything of worth.

Get yourself into a solid Plan B and in no time, you'll begin to feel much better.

I just e-mailed my attorney, i am crying and i do not know why. I guess the lack of remorse on his part, he really does not care about me and that hurts so much. He is runnning around like a lunatic trying to win the OW back, save face at work and acting like the victim. I wish he was trying to come back to me, I hate to admit that.

Plan B will help, I am so tired and worn out from this

Is there hope for recovery? Can someone really change and turn it around? I see it on posts here. This is what I want. I wish I did not. Can not admit this to my family, they hate him even more now.

Mason,

The reason you need to follow MB's Plan B is because right now, I suspect he could talk you right back into being with him again. You have said it yourself several times that you would be back with him if you could, so when you say things like "I won't talk to him ever again"... well, I'm sure he can see right through that.

Plan Mason has led you to an even worse situation. I would suggest that you stop following your own "plan", which is not supported by MB for very critical reasons (ie. your health, your sanity), and start listening to the actual MB materials and implementing it. You're hurting yourself even further, you realize that right??

You are SO vulnerable right now and he's a predator. You're going to end up right back where you started until you start following the advice you've been given...

No. Not right now.

But there is false recovery waiting around the corner, again. You're at the fork in the road and debating... get into Plan B now!

I am not debating, maybe just leaning on a hope and a prayer that he will turn his life around. That's all. Hard to give that up!

Hey Mason. I know exactly the hope you are talking about. It is that hope that keeps your heart soft towards your H. I NOW see the wisdom after being beaten over the head wtih it that Plan B'ing him is the BEST thing you can do for yourself (and the best solution if your marriage is ever to recover.) If you don't see that now, just look at how your plan (Plan Mason as someone called it) has worked. We want to believe them. They are our husbands. The problem is that he will tell you whatever it is that you want to hear to keep you where he wants you (keeping his life easy so he can eat cake) He wants his life to be as easy as possible, you holding down the fort, taking care of his kids, cooking meals, doing laundry, so he can easily live his secret second life because that is more imortant to him that his family is. Please see this. For whatever the reasons, you are not his priority anymore. He has to want to fix his marriage. You can't want it enough for the both of you or do all the work for the both of you. You are draining everything that he hasn't already taken from you trying to save this sinking ship when he has already abandoned ship, so to speak. He doesn't want you to drown, but he doesn't want to stay with you anymore. His heart is just not with you anymore. I think it is how you go about looking at it. Hope....hope that he can find his way out of the fog. Your marriage is over until he can do that. So, Plan B for YOURSELF. You need to shore up strength and fortify yourself for your children. You cannot hope that he will change his ways. That is not what is going to happen. Hope that while you are in Plan B, that he will have a break in the fog to "realize" the mess he has created. BUT, DON'T PLAN ON THAT HAPPENING. It may never happen. It may take 5 years after the divorce is final. Either way, you are heathy and so are your children. You can't make him choose you. You can't make him love you more. Please stop thinking that you can wish that to happen. You are hurting yourself more and more. You REALLY need to Plan B, NOW!!!!!!

You said that perfectly "his heart is not with me anymore" and it has not been for over a very long time. Like you I plan A or C way too long...I made his life easy. While he vacationed with the OW. I am just sad. I can not wish my life away with him. I am done, just wrapping my head with the finality of all.

Thanks for your input. Makes total sense

Hey there mason. I almost went to edit that to take that out. It is a harsh thing to say to someone. I am so glad that you took it like I meant it.

Mason, my heart is with you right now. I am exactly where you are. The toughest part is knowing that what you are going to do next is separate your family for good. I say separate instead of break your family up because your husband has ALREADY broken your family up. He did that a long time ago. I, like you, didn't see it that way. I had hope that he would choose me/us. That is wasted energy. Is is choosing EXACTLY what he wants to choose. It is a very tough thing to accept that he is choosing someone else over the person he made a covenant/promise to, and his family!! I just can't wrap my head around how he could do that. BUT HE DID. So, we have to stand up for ourselves and our children and draw a higher line of what we will accept in our lives and not!

You are worth more than this mason. I lowered my standards and expectations to "save" my marriage. All I did was let him get away with his selfish behavior at MINE and MY CHILDREN's expense. I now see that!! I hope you can too. You and your children deserve better. They deserve a complete, invested father and family man who LOVES AND RESPECTS their mother!!!! That creates the security structure they need. Our children do not have that. They have selfish fathers who have essentially abandoned them to live their secret second lives.

I know you are sad. You will be for quite a long time. NOW GET MAD!!!!! GET MAD that he has done this. Be respectful, but get mad enough to say NO MORE!!!! This is not what I agreed to!!! This is not a life I will put up with anymore!!! I do not want to go down this path with you anymore!!! Go!!!

I am so grateful that I have finally gotten there. I am still an emotional wreck, fighting the inevitable just wasted all my time and energy. I am emotionally a little better and not as paralyzed with fear for just accepting it the way it is, and not fighting it hoping that he would do what I wished.

I know, thank you. I know you are right. I believed everything he said to me. That he was going to find a new job and start coming back. He told me what I needed to here to keep his life easy. I love my boys so much and I have protected them the best I could. I thought it was good for them to see him more.

What a joke, fell for it again. I was so lonely and missed his company. No more, I will be going from sad to mad hopefully sooner than later. I will not co-parent with him.

Tomorrow I will have the boys waiting outside for him.

I am thankful that you still have some strength after the emotional roller coaster you have been on. The best way to get clear minded is to Plan B now. Get an IM. You don't need to "hear" his voice, or anything from your WH!!! You will have to set a visitation schedule, work out finances, etc... That can go through your attornies, court appointed mediator, IM etc... The sooner you separate yourself from ANYTHING your WH, you will begin to heal.

Does he honk, then the boys run out? They don't wait for him down at the end of the drive way do they?

At this point, it is your husband choosing another life over spending time with his own children. Please, don't you worry about the time your boys spend with their father. He is doing exactly what he want to do. He can deal with the consequences of not choosing his family.

No, it wil be on the porch. This is the first wknd we are splitting them up.... funny we were sharing our wknds with the kids. Which is why I thought we were recovering. I am also sad about every other wknd. I wish I could just keep them all of the time.

Hey. It will work itself out. They will need to spend some time with their dad. Others that I know that are divorces and sharing custody tell me that you do start to enjoy the little time you have to yourself when they are at their dad's. It is a good idea for each of you to have one-on-one time with your children, but if you do it this way, you will never have a your own time. I don't know anyone who splits their children up like that. But, that might just work perfectly for you. Just don't underestimate needing time to yourself.

I know, I am still in a place where I do not like to be alone. After two years of this, I need to be done and never speak to him again. I am lucky to have family and friends close by. I would think when I had not seen a friend in awhile ---my story has not changed....still stringing me along. I do not think I woudl know what a good relationship looked like if it slapped me in the face. It is nice maybe to have something to look forward to, to meet someone that treats you well and makes you feel safe. I was always waiting for the other shoe to drop... Well it did and I need to move on... Funny looking at your timeline it matches with mine. My life blew up in Aug. 2010. Too much time has passed.

Mason, how will the exchanges go exactly? And how will it be for the return?

I feel the same embarassment. How long we have let this go on!!!! At some point, people expect you to take action. We have waited toooooooo long. We didn't help our marriages by waiting and hoping for this long. We should have taken action back in 2010. Maybe they would have still been close enough for us to save our marriages. But, letting them continue, now they are too used to their selfish ways. You never know, but after 2 years, it usually won't turn around. Anyway, we have to be the ones that change our stories!!! I also was always holding my breath waiting for the next hurt, verbal criticism, discovery of deception, etc... to sideline me.

I am with you on what a good relationship would look like. There are times when I am talking to others and they say, their husband did this for them, their husband did that for them, their husband stepped in here, their husband did this for the kids, their husband treats them with respect, "My husband would NEVER say that to me", their husband, etc..., and I am just,
like, really? Asking myself, "Is that what I should expect?"

We have grown used to our husbands not being good husbands. Whether we lovebusted or did something to make them withdraw or not, at this point, isn't as important as the choices they made to handle the issues by turning outside of our marriages. These choices then made it impossible for us to overcome our issues.

Our stories do have a lot in common. We both need to move on for ourselves and our children.

And do you have an IM? IM Training School

I will have the boys waiting on the front porch, with me close by... I have been on Dr. Haley's radio show and he had told me this was fine. How could I have been so stupid for so long... I have let him cake eat for a year. Still feel sick to my stomach this morning. I wish I took his advice when I was on the show. I made his life soooo easy while I took care of everything. I gave him plenty of time to plan his next trip with her. He will never step foot in this house again.

Good morning mason. That sounds like a great plan with your children's pick-up and drop-off. It works and they are safe.

On another note, I look back at why I didn't take all the wonderful advice I was given last year when I first came to MB, and a have many emotions. After working through feeling like an idiot, being weak, etc..., I am finally at a more comfortable understanding that I wasn't ready. I wasn't completely sure that splitting my family up was the thing to do. I may have taken too long, but I am comfortable now knowing that the choices I make are the BEST choices for myself and my children. When I have the "I should have taken action earlier b/c maybe it would have saved my marriage" thoughts, I remind myelf that I didn't for the reasons I didnt/couldn't and that we are where we are now. I am very sad that he didn't want better for us and for our family, but then I also realize that he is only thinking of himself in all of this, so that tells me that I am making the right decisions now.

I hope you don't mind my telling you these things. These are the types of things that when I read them, they really help me wrap my brain around my situation and in some ways give me strength.

I will check back later. Have a good day now!!!!

I did do Plan B for about 5 months. He hated it, but I think it also gave hime the freedom to let his affair thrive. So when we started legal action last June, we stopped and said do we really want this. I thought those were his actions of not wanting the divorce. and I know I did not want it. I would look at my boys and cry...So we started slowly seeing each other and I was duped into thinking they broke up. I was not ready, but are you ever? Now he has no one. It was like exposure all over for him because he continued his lying and deceit. Now I need to get in protective mode and work with my attorney.

I am scared financially and still feel sick every morning. But then I think, what's changed? His behavior never changed. He remained the most selfish human being on earth.

I feel the same things as you. I look back and see that if he wanted to work it out like he "said" he did, then he would have!!! He didn't mean the words. He just wanted to pacify me so he could go back to living his secret second life with fewer problems from me. I worked hard at changing everything. He worked at nothing except hiding his actions better. You are right, are you ever ready to divorce your H when deep down you hope and pray that he would turn it all around? It is one of the worst situations I have ever been in. He will have to live with the consequences of his behavior. We shouldn't have to. Our children shouldn't have to. My kids are older than yours, and believe me, it hurts them more and more to remain in it. Focus on creating the family unit that your children need. That helps me anyway.

My biggest worry now is the financial one. Going back to work at some point is a necessity. I want to wait a bit so everything doesn't change for the children at once. But, I don't think I will be able to wait too long for that. You can work it all out. It will just take a little time.

He isn't going to change, not right now anyway. I know that most people have to have something so painful happen, hit rock bottom, lose everything to have a fog free moment of, "What am I doing?" But, sadly some don't even get it then. Don't hold your breath b/c you won't be LIVING. Live for yourself and live for your children. He isn't considering anyone but himself. Please remember that you gave him chance after chance. His actions showed you what he really wants. It is not what you want or what is in the best interest of your family.

So, DON'T care that he didn't like Plan B. Why would he? He liked eating cake!!! Now, YOU have to take control of your life and do what is best for you and the children. You CAN do this.

Okay, how will you know that your WH is there?

And when your WH return with the boys, how will you know they are home?

You will change your numbers, and email addresses, etc, so your WH has no way to contact you right? And you will also have an IM to communicate things right?

I will look out the window and see his car. We did this last time in Plan B- Like I said Dr. Harley said it was fine when I was on the radio show. It is the best I do right now. Our finances are separate and he has to continue to pay what he is until we have a settlement. The lawyers can handle all of that. I feel like a fool, not setting my boundaries high.

But my only good thought at the moment is I do not have to wonder about where he is what he is doing, Is he lying? I just need to worry about me. My goodness what wasted energy.

I hope I can heal faster than I did before. I want to be happy and feel like myself again.

Yeah prolly cuz Dr H was in on it, he got serious but not really.

It's up to him to do what he needs to do for recovery, and you will be fine with or without him

That's the plan right? To be ok?

So listen up and follow the MB plan to the letter ok?

It is possible and now nessesary Mason

I am in complete protection mode.... My husband never spoke with Dr. Harley...just wish I took his advice. At that point I was out of Plan B and he told me to get back in it. I just wish I had listened. I know I will be fine, it will take time. Ijust so wish I did not have kids with him.

Would have been divorced a long time ago.

Thank you for all of the advice and encouragement. Two years, my goodness, what a waste.

Mason, I KNOW personally that looking out the window and seeing the vehicle can be a HUGE trigger. When you get even slightly triggered, you crave more contact. Adrenaline also pumps through your body.

And, you still didn't answer, how will he drop them back off? Can you control not even seeing him? Is there any way you could drop them off at a neighbours, or a friend or family's house and have him drop them off there as well? Are they still only 5 and 2? or have you not updated your siggy?

My boys are older, so what they do is have WH call when he arrives, THEY answer the phone, and then they go out onto the porch and close the door, then the open the porch door(I have an enclosed porch). My DS12 then locks the porch door. That leaves me with TWO doors between WH and I. When they return, my WH says his good-byes, etc at the sidewalk, and the boys wait until WH drives to the corner before my DS12 unlocks the porch door. Then they knock on the inside door, and I let them in. There were a few times, in the beginning of my Plan B, when I looked outside. That was a mistake, and one which could have been avoided if I had the exchanges take place somewhere else. it works now, since I no longer get tempted to look outside. Heck, most times, I'm in the bathroom getting ready for work when the kids yell "Bye".

Pick Up and drop off went ok this wknd. He was already back in the car when my 3 year old was banging on the door.

I am really sad today. I guess it will come and go for awhile now. I just do not feel well. Very weepy.

Maybe I want an answer or a reason, but I know there is none. I could be in withdrawel from him, do not know...

Hopeless.

Did you get a peek at him when he dropped the kids off?

Those cracks can really do a number on you. It will get better if you can putty up those cracks.

I know Dr. H said it should be fine, but maybe for your your own health you should do the drop offs somewhere else?

It was ok, I did not really see him. He pulls up right to the curb, I will not let him in the driveway. I do have an urge to call him and just ask him why??? Believe me I will not, because there is no answer.'

He needs help, needs to leave his job, needs to change his lifestyle, get his house in order and make his children a priority. I never saw any of this....Just saw what I wanted to see and beleive.

Well talking to a wayward will make you crazy. Unless you know how to talk alien?

Plan B is for you now.

What can you do for yourself today? Can you get a pedi, manicure a massage?

Have you looked into ADs?

How is your support system IRL?

I have been on AD's for almost two years when he was gaslighting me, they help. I work at home so it can be isolating at times. I took Friday off and took my boys swimming so I would not be alone. My support system is ok, everyone just wants me to move on... It is hard, still love him (who he was) and if he got his act as I stated above maybe we could recover.

But, not now. I am sad my boys have him for a father.

I read the entire false recovery thread yesterday, the stories are all so similar, including my own. BS's just want to beleive so badly that the person they were is back without the proof.

Good morning Mason. I am sorry that you are having a difficult time. Just hold tight. You will make it through this time of withdrawal. Remember, he is NOT being a husband to you. You don't want the life that he expects you to accept so he can stay. Don't ever forget that!! Just be strong. As you make it through this time, begin to look at what your life could be like without him and the issues he brings in it!! What makes you happy? What are your hobbies? Start thinking of the routine you are going to have to get in. Paint a room. Pick an interest and sign up for it!! Start blue printing what you want to create for your life. You have spent years being tossed about with no real investment in developing yourself. Now you can. Use this time to find some anger in your H's selfishness and go pick weeds and work in your front yard. Plant some new bushes and work on the landscape. Just ideas... DON'T sit around today being sad!!! I know that is a hard idea right now, but you don't want the depression to get stronger. Just get up and work in the yard, go for a walk. Get the endorphins going. Then, go to the store. Go to the book store, get a drink and look through books. Pick a hobby book......... Please don't just sit around for long. Give yourself 15 minutes to cry it out, then shake it off if you can.

Mason, it will get better. Just ensure that you don't see even his car, that's why I asked if you could arrange for something else? Maybe someone else can be there instead of you?

Stick to a PB and you will be much better.

You are so right. I have to get back to me. It is hard and I get scared. I am usually ok when the kids are around. I was better yesterday. Just having a tough time today. I almost called my MIL. decided against it. that would be another crack to fall through. I have to stop being sad and be angry. Stages of grief.

Mason, just to let you know I'm thinking of you. I felt very weepy and down yesterday but managed to get out of the house (went walking for a couple of hours with a friend). This helped and I will also use some of Littlebit3's ideas.

Most of the time I manage but whenever my WH comes to collect our son my stomach churns. This is even though I don't have to see the car as my son is old enough to go outside on his own.

My stomach gets sick too...I know this will get better. I never wanted the label of being divorced. Just held on to the hope he would come back. I have therapy today so that usually makes me feel better. I am definetly in withdrawal from him, from the crumbs he was throwing at me. Sad, when you know you deserve better.

Sorry, I just want to make sure. You sent him a letter, and have an IM right? You're in a true Plan B?

Mason, you do deserve better and I know I do too. Some people might think we are weak for hanging in so long but I think it shows just how much we can love. I never wanted to be divorced either - I married in church at the age of 24 and truly believed in the vows I took.

Its hard not to get cynical when something like this happens but I believe if we do end up divorced, there will eventually be someone better for us out there (but it will be a LONG time before I think about that!)

I will be reading your posts and thinking of you and your children.

I am in the best Plan B I can be in....I did not bother to send him a letter. I have no one to be an IM yet, my sister did it last time and no one wants to deal with him. When he calls to talk to the boys I leave the room and then hang up when they are done. Like I said our finances are already separate and the attnys will handle everything else. He knows after many discussion what it would take to come back.
I know after all of the abuse I have to divorce him. Therapy today helped. I think what set me off this morning was that my 3 year old said he missed Daddy.

Thanks for the support, it helps!

This will get better, I hope.

Hey there mason!!! You are doing great! You aren't just going to snap out of the routine of your life that you have been living for years in a couple of weeks. One of the hardest aspects for me is thinking me or me and the kids and not "us." I have just always considered my H in everything. He doesn't consider me at all. I love what Jay67 wrote to you about how we stayed because of how much we love. It is VERY difficult to stay in the types of marriages we have. The longer we do, the more of ourselves that we lose. I am proud that I took my vows more seriously than to have just cut and run. In sickness and in health means through it all to me. There is another side to this. Why didn't I ever take a look at what I NEEDED? At some point, I needed to have faced it. Sticking my head in the sand b/c there was nothing I could do didn't help me one bit!!! Why didn't I set my boundaries higher and not let him cross them? What is going on with me that I allowed this type of treatment in my life and for so long!!!!? It kinda takes on a life of its own. Having children then complicates it too.

I am miserable b/c he won't leave. I know I will have an awful adjustment/change of routine, but I just don't want him around anymore. Passwords, quiet conversations, doesn't tell me where he has been or where he is going, last minute plans, triggers galore!!!! I don't want to deal with ANY of it anymore!! I don't want to cook, clean, do everything while he sits around playing games and watching tv. He lives his secret second life, comes home does nothing, is not a part of the family, is not there for the kids, leaves everything out, throws his wet running clothes on the floor (whether it is tile or carpet), leaves a mess wherever he is. I am supposed to pick it up. I got the, "I have to do my own laundry b/c you won't do it" comment a couple of weeks ago. Bursn me up!!! Well, when you throw everything onto the floor and it piles up for weeks, you can do it yourself. I am NOT going to go through your piles. I am not your mother. You have two whole loads of t-shirts and shorts (used to sit around in AFTER showering from the gym)that you cold try to use again." He creates so much work for me and expects me to be his maid. NO!!! I don't want to spend my wheels on him!!!!! He can take care of himself!!

So, which would you rather? hehehehe Thanks for letting me vent!!!

So, you didn't send a letter this time around, but do you have ANY communications with him directly? Emails? Texts? etc?

I KNOW you can and will feel better with ZERO contact. That's what I am doing while pointing out the holes in poster's Plan B. Helping you fill in those places will will hinder your recovery.

I have had little contact with him, I am done, grieving the little hope I had,
Scotland, I have read your post and I have always wondered why you had not filed, I get it. I do not want to file either, but I have been though so many more lies and betrayels.
I may drag out the divorce and hope for change. Not sure yet> still want to keep my family together, but not like this.

I haven't filed for purely financially reasons. I am serious when I say that I have ZERO money, and I don't make enough to be accepted for the mortgage on this house without my WH's income being included. As soon as this gets sorted out, I will do what I need to do.

You should have ZERO contact with him. I KNOW how much better off you would be without contact.

I am so sorry, would you not be better off with filing for support? I am so scared at the financial implications. maybe that has what has held me back with my false hope. pretty sure it was a combination of both.

My WH does pay me support, but support payments are not taken into account when applying for a mortgage, only your annual income from an employer. And that, it's less than peanuts, in my case(my WH actually pays me more in support than I make). I am actively looking to rectify that problem, to allow me more options.

After some time in Plan B(for me, about 2.5 years), you are ready to move forward without any thought to your WH. You know that saying, "Fake it til you make it"? Well, that's what happened to me. ALthough I was in Plan B, and was living my life without my WH, I wasn't really ready until quite recently. If I had the financial ability, I would most likely already have filed. This is a comment coming from someone who thought that they would NEVER move on. It's the genius behind PB.

Thank you, I know zero contact is best. I have to train my mind of a new way of thinking, which is hard to do. I go through thoughts of wanting him to come back (I have thought like this for two years) and be the man he was from how could he do this again? I know Plan B will clear my head, I had information overload over the past two weeks. Having a hard time processing the cruelty of it all. My body is riddled with stress and I am still have nausea every morning.

Thank you, I know zero contact is best. I have to train my mind of a new way of thinking, which is hard to do. I go through thoughts of wanting him to come back (I have thought like this for two years) and be the man he was from how could he do this again? I know Plan B will clear my head, I had information overload over the past two weeks. Having a hard time processing the cruelty of it all. My body is riddled with stress and I am still have nausea every morning.

Mason, what you describe is exactly how I feel. I have veered from no hope and wanting to make a new life to desperately wanting my WH back.

That's why I am now quite determined to go into Plan B as soon as I'm ready.

WH's are cruel - I suspect its because they can't handle the guilt.

I do not think he feels anything...No guilt or remorse. It is all sickening!!

Just called my attny...can not meet with me until Sept. 7th. I guess I have waited this long, what is another month.

Have you already paid this attorney?

If not, I'd get a new one.

She has my retainer and she is caught up in a trial and vacation. I really liked her and was reccommended as a bulldog...that is what I need. Last year she was great. I will stick with her...she wnats me to get the most $$$ I can get and really show know mercy calling out his affair and how hurtful it has been.

Truth is, I am ok waiting, he is still paying me, I have vacation with my boys at the end ofthe month. I will then have a clearer head and not speak with so much emotion.

I know that you are in a holding pattern for the attorney, but how are you doing otherwise? What is going on? Do you have any update? I am glad to see you holding strong and hanging in there!!!!

Do not see the attny until Sept. 7th. No real updates, leave the room when he calls to talk to the boys. (which is not everday and they rarely want to call back) Hearing his voice is a trigger, so I make sure I am far away enough. I look back and wonder what was I thinking.... I have plans for the wknd (hate being alone) and a family vacation at the end of the month.
Worried, but I think I will be for awhile.

What self care are you doing for you? This is very important in Plan B.

Self care for myself, I am going to head back to the gym, have not had too much time for myself, but this wknd I will. Trying to look forward to things and hopefully I will be really able to let go this time and what I thought my life would look like is over and let go of the fear. Work in progress.

I read my first posting today and it makes me sad how much time has passed. YIKES!

Good working out is so healthy and good stress relieved.

What other things have you always wanted to do? Write a book? Go back to school?

What things can you do tonight? Bubble bath? Pedicure or manicure?

Do you have an IM yet?

I would still suggest that you get an actual IM. You can't know how much this will help you and your healing.

I do not have an IM, I know I should but trying to see how this goes with the tiny cracks. Did our phone routine, boys did not want to talk and then hung up.

Not sure what to do about the week he has the boys and calling to talk to them. They will be staying at my MIL house, I was thinking of calling her and having her put the boys on the phone.
He never answers the house phone.
Any ideas?

Hey there mason. I wish you could find an IM. You need to completely clear your mind of him, what he is doing, etc...

If he won't answer the phone, then that might just be the way to talk to your children. You could call your mil and ask her to have them call you in the morning and/or every night before bed, so you don't have to call there. Would she do that for you? It depends on what their routine is, how busy they are. ????? You are probably going to have to call them until they are old enough to call you!!!! Tough situation. I hate it that you are in it!! I don't even want to think about it!!!! It is in my future too!!!!! I wish I had the magic answer for you!!

Stay strong mason!!!!! You are doing all of this to better your life and the lives of your children. You will make it through this!!!

Thanks, I did not want to get her involved but if my children are there she is involved. My family never wants to see or speak with him again and when I was on the radio show, Dr. Harley said this was fine.... That is one of the reasons why I asked for help. I think after being two years out, my skin has thickened. I still feel it but can move on with my day, where before, i would be on the couch and could not move. I realize that he does not love me, nor did he fight for his family. He chose her and was willing to fight for the Wayward life.

At this point, I feel sad, but I am so done with this.

I am so proud of you mason. You are doing what is right for you and the children. His idea of marriage and family is completely different than yours, so you could not have a marriage or be happy. You sound strong and committed to building a happy, safe and fulfilling life for yourself. Thank you for sharing your story. Yours is one that has helped me see that their wayward livestyles are not for me either. I don't want to put up with ONE MORE minute of it. I know I deserve better. It is just hard to do what I have to do. You deserve better than a H who has so little respect for you and for the sanctity of marriage. I am going to try to avoid the couch!!!!! If I lie down, I might never get back up!!

Believe me, I have lied down and took hours to get back up... I am lucky to still have my job (work from home) My work suffered, but I did the bare minimum to get by... Luckily those day are gone. Now, maybe I give myself 20 minute to lay down. The sadness lingers, but I can function.
Love does not feel like this...This is torture.

UPDATE:
Saw my attny filling out paperwork. My husband beat me to the punch and filed before me. Why does it hurt so bad. I knew this was going to happen and how can I care for someone that has hurt me so much. I will not break Plan B, I do not know why I am crying. I guess the truth is in my heart is I still love him.
I wish I had heart of stone.

Mason,

((((((hugs)))))

You will make it through this with your self-respect and integrity intact. And you have kids that know you are doing the right thing for them. And you have the support of your family.

What has he got???

Apart of me wants to talk to him, but why? talk him out of it? that is what I did last time and it got me nowhere.
I just wish it did not hurt so much. Another knife....this is still torture.
I think silence this time will be best. I have nothing left.

I am so sorry, Mason. I promise it won't always be like this.

Thank you, I just thought atleast he would give me that, let me file first...I know in the courts it does not matter who files, but I feel like I am the only one hurting.

My prayers go out for you Mason. I assure you that peace will come as time passes, and this is behind you.
In time you will rebuild, and be stronger than you ever were, but these transient times are shaky, and somehow nessesary, as your heart goes though this pain of rejection.
Chin up Mason, all things are for our sakes

Thank you, I can only hope that there is a reason for this and that I will get a second chance, I am grieving the person I married and wonder how he could not love me again. I feel better now. Heard back from my attnt and feel a bot better.
I tru;y appeciate the supportt of everyone and Plan B at this point is truly beneficial. As they say you do not negotiate with terrorits!

I'm sorry for your pain.
I hope you will sleep well tonight and have a good day tomorrow

Yes. Please take care of yourself.

Today is another hard day, I found out my husband is back with OW. They are giving their love another try. It makes me sick. He wins again, now he gets his divorce so they can be happy. It make me so sad he never fought for his family. We are discarded. My boys see their father 4 days a month. That is it!! Breach of Plan B, but I am glad I know. It still hurts so bad. I am sure one of her conditions is that you must file for divorce....All I wanted was for him to love me. I have been broken hearted for over two years. Enough is enough. I am filing on the grounds of adultery. I know in NJ the courts do not care, but I do. I want it on record of why we are divorcing.

This is why breaks in Plan B can be so painful.

You're on ADs correct? Have you worked with your doctor to adjust the dose?

What are you doing for yourself this weekend?

Yes, I am on AD's. I am having family over this weekend. I going to try with my divorce to keep OW away from my children. I need to do that.

Trust me Mason, he is not winning Sh*t

As divorce goes through, the stress on your WH and OW will increase and their relationship will suffer. Eventually they will start arguing and fighting. Financial pressures from child support and spousal support will mount, and the OW will resent that he can't spend as much on her as he'll have to spend you and the kids.

The affair will eventually die a natural death. A likely scenario is that the OW will find another guy, either before or after the D is final, as she won't be getting her needs met by your WH anymore.

Stay in Plan B, both for your own sanity's sake, and for the chance of there ever being any hope of recovery.

Find an IM to mediate your interactions with him concerning the children and finances.

I will, I think their is little chance of recovery...He is truly addicted to this woman and she divorced her husband for mine, so they need to make this work. But with all the lies and the mistrust between them I doubt it will.
I have been coming here for just about two years now and it amazes me how long I have been in this mess. Time to let the fear go and get out while I have an ounce of sanity left.

It reminds me of the difference in being a Freind, and being someone in need of a Freind.

His addiction fantasy will blow up eventually, and he will be looking somewhere else and to someone else to blame all his sorrows on, instead of the true culprit, himself. They always affair down, becoming victims of thier own lies and fantasies, and blaming everything on thier BS.

This is just one step in his slip down the slope. There is no excuse, rhyme or reason for betrayal, not when it comes to marriage, because that union was a chance to deal with our personal weakneses, not give into temptation to run away from them

Some are just not strong enough, or give themselves excuses, or even manufacture things they call "reasons", why it's OK to betray those that love and dedicate thier lives to them
As you have read in the thread, "The craziest thing to ever come out of a waywards piehole" , you can see they do not resemble much reason at all.

It's sad that many of us must go through this, but just be glad you are not one of them. They truly belong on another planet, and we need Gods strength to survive also because, they are sad and gutless people, which make no sense

We shall overcome Mason, that you can count on

Absolutely get out of their way. Their relationship is already strained. This divorce WILL throw in so much more chaos into it that the chances of it surviving are slim.

Let me tell you this ... if this woman does survive his divorce, it WILL truly demonstrate how morally corrupt, selfish, and delusional she really is. Your WH will be the brunt of that delusion and selfishness. His life has not even a chance to be happy because that is what he gets for a partner. She will manipulate, play games, and cut off his manhood. She is the core of evil, and your WH will be the brunt of her devilness. What a horrible, deplorable life.

Protect your finances and your children. This relationship WILL not last Mason ... it is so full of selfishness and deceit. They will become nothing but big anchors strapped to each other's necks and they will sink each other.

Plan B WILL be a great resource for you. I am feeling millions better after my divorce to the exact same man. My WH is identical to your WH. It does get better. Just put one foot in front of the next and take it day by day.

I am not dating, but I have had some coffee dates, and that has been nice. It was nice because the men actually seemed normal, and I learned I am quite a great catch.

I have not hope for reconciliation with my xWH. He is so deep in waywardville and selfishness it will take a miracle from God to break him.

My life is good, and I am blessed. In time you will begin to smile ... even at the rainbows.

I kept very busy this weekend, my WH has not reached out to the boys in over a week, I guess nothing has changed. They were asking about him this morning, I sarted to cry.
All I thought about how he is back in LA LA land and had a great wknd. Makes me sick.
I know everyone says they will not last but it has been 2 1/2 years already. This OW is in for the long haul. I hate her, I hate him. Angry today.

I broke Plan B, was ver upset last night, I am so frightened my WH will introduce the OW to my boys. I am so scared. I emailed my attny to see if there is anything I can do. I sent him a text asking him not to introduce. He said we needed to talk, I said there is nothing to talk about. I will not see him in person or at all. Should not have broke contact but I am so worried for them. My 7 year old said we are not a family because of Daddy.
Why is it that the betrayed still are hurt and they get to go live in their fanatsy land.. No consequenses.
I hate it all. Any advice of this issue of blocking OW.

First of all, the wayward spouses do face consequences. We all face natural consequences for our actions.

Regarding the affair partner the court will only block her if she is a danger to the children. Does she have a criminal record?

Regarding plan B, every time you make contact you will have increase anxiety and worry. Asking him not to allow the kids to see her is as productive as going on a cream cheese pie diet to loose weight.

Dona background check on the woman for any criminal background and if she doesn't have any history then you should work towards accepting that YOU are powerless over his actions.
You can only control how you allow his bahavior to affect you

I understand your pain.
I have found it helpful when I worry or feel sadnes to exercise.
Also I recently made some food for a church funeral and it helped take my mind off of my fears and worry and focus on helpin another person.

No criminal record...I know, I asked him because I justthought out of all the pain he caused maybe he would do this. I will not ask again..I will see what my attny says. My fear and worry for my boys, I want to protect them from OW.

Funny thing is I called her his affair partner (I will not name her by name)...He told me to stop calling her that, she has a name and it is L*r**. Now he is defending her like she deserves some kind of respect. Again makes me sick! I said I know her name and would it be better to call her sl*t which is waht your sister calls her.

I got divorced a few months ago.
I feel much better being away from the wayward insanity.

At this point I think you should focus on your own self improvement.
I benefited from church family and AlAnon meetings.

When I start to worry I say to myself, "Stop. I am only in control of my actions. The rest is in Gods hands "

It is true insanity... I am trying it is just hard when I worry so much for my kids and that he has no regard for their well being. It is all about what OW wants.
I know I can only control myself, but I felt I had to ask him not to expose the boys to OW and this mess. I tried. Done.
hole closed up and staying dark.

Courts really don't care.
My wife was having an affair with a man that actually went to prison for 9 years for trying to kill his own 3 year old daughter, drug use, domestic violence convictions etc. she had the kids at his house!

Fortunately I was able to get a no contact order in the divorce decree but it took some fighting.

Be thankful she has loose legs and morals and isn't a drug addict or felon.

Even after divorce you may be able to win your husband back.
That is because he is in love with a woman that agrees with everything he says or does. In marriage that can't happen , conflict is inevitable.

Yikes, I wish the courts did care. There is something very wrong with our family court system when in comes to adultery and abandonment. I guess I will fight what I can, but at the end of the day I doubt I can control this one. She has been trying to meet my kids for two years.

My therapist is writing a letter to my attny to try to block any visits on my behalf. It is the best I can do... On another note, breaking Plan B earlier in the week has not been good. My WH shared my text messages with the OW, she texted me today saying why am I trying to make him feel guilty, he is working hard in therapy. I guess you want him back....WHAT? He has lied because he has so many fears and he is working through that.
Why does she feel the need to comment, that was about our children. He selectivly read the message to make me look like I am the bad person, when he lied and cheated on both of us.
I am sick...she has a lot of nerve to reach out to me especially since he just filed last week.

She also said she is trying to work on her trust isssues. What a crazy person. Need to block her and him from my life.

no more breaks.

This is why it's preached so vehemently to not break Plan B.

You were getting so much stronger when you were in a dark Plan B.

Do not even try and figure out OW's response. Of course she's worried about you wanting him back because he is making you out to be the "crazy exw". Do not give them any ammunition.

Take care of you and your kids.

Tell us what you're doing for you. So??? What are you doing?

Nothing, have been working and in therapy... she texted me out of the blue today, I do not care what I look like, I did not cheat or lie for over 2 years. I know the truth and so does his family...I think I am wondering why she even reached out to me.

Make justification and why am I trying to guilt him back into the relationship. I was talking about our kids not meeting her, not trying to guilt him back. He owns that guilt not me.

Along with my therapist I am having my attny to send a letter to his about not meeting OW. I trust no one.

The court won't care about your therapist.
The court will care about the children's therapist.

Thank you, she is our family therapist. My attny advised me last year to have something written up on their behalf.

Can you please update me,
Are you in divorce?
What is the custody order?

Please communicate with your WH via your IM

Your attorney and/or therapist will have good advice about OW's contact with your children. Some contact may be inevitable.

Your kids will hate and it will be a miserable time for your WH and OW. I know that's not much consolation, but believe me, having the kids around will make WH and OW's affair harder, not more "fun".

WH husband had filed, I have already met with my attny and we will counterfile based on grounds of adultery. Custody since this mess began is he gets the boys every other wknd.

I regret breaking plan b, always do...but I was so angry and sad. But at the end of the day it accomplished nothing except me being upset.

Need to have all contact go through my attorney. I know that.
Sometimes waywards get the best of us still....

Were you able to get another IM?

Do you have your kids this weekend? If not, what do you have planned for you?

No, but I have nothing to talk to him about. I do not have the kids, hate giving them up.

I am having dinner with an old college friend.

Mason,

Hang in there. Plan B the best you can. You're probably not going to be able to keep WH from introducing OW to the kids. It sucks, but it's true.

Let him go into the darkness.

TE

I am, I have definitly paid dearly for the breaks, but I am only human and sometimes anger gets the best of us. But it was all falling on deaf ears. A true waste of my time.

You are right about OW meeting my kids, but for my own sanity I have to try and fight it.

Next time you think about contacting him please come here to the board and ask/vent. We're here for you.

Is he fighting for custody? Or is he okay with the standard order of every other weekend?

I do not think he will fight for custody, standard in NJ is every other weekend and maybe one night during the week. He would never be able to do 50/50 as he travels about 90% of the time for work, which is how his affair started.

I need to get to the point of indifference. I did everything I could to save this marriage, that has to be enough at this point.

I would like to share this with you:
"Who is to blame? Whom have I the right to blame? Let me concentrate on keeping my own conduct from being at fault; more I cannot do".

This weekend was hard, I was sad alot. STill grieving the loss of the marriage. He had the boys at his house he is renting, no longer at his Mom's. I guess I was feeling lonely. I want to feel better so fast, two years is too long....

I'm sorry.
I would like to share this with you:

"Personal freedom is mine for the taking. No matter how close are the ties of love and concern that bind me to my family and friends, I must always remember that I am an individual, free to be myself and live my own life in serenity and joy."

"when I know I am free within myself, I will be better able to give loving thought to others"

Thank you HDW...that helps. I had too much time to myself and that make your thoughts and what ifs too much to bear.

This has heppened for a reason, I want to know the reason.

an Update:
My attny did send a letter to WH attny reagrding the OW meeting my boys. It detailed the affair, best ineterest of the children, and how court appt socail worker may get involved if a meeting does take place. He is furious, but I do not care. I need to protect them. and yes a breach of plan b about knowing how angry he is, but I feel like I hit my target.

Another note it was my oldest son's b-day this past wknd. It was my wknd, had a baseball party for him with his friends, and a family party in the evening. WH never reached out once to try to see him, when in reality I am sure the OW was here. I was so sad for him and wonder if I should have offered. But need not want the chance mtg with OW. I can not trust him. He of course takes the stand that he was not allowed. WHAT? he is seven. I will not help him parent like I had in the past. But I somehow feel guilty, that it hurt my son not seeing his dad and perhaps I should have been the bigger person. I know he needs to live with his choices. What father does not see his son on his birthday, he could have taken him to lunch, dinner, even taken him for the night. Why do I feel responsible and guilty for not suggesting it?
Back to Plan B....hard with birthdays and events for the kids.

You said it Mason, your done not doing his share of respnsible thinking towards your children

It's just more evidence, that cheaters make bad parents, just like any thief

K hope you make a smooth transition back to Dark plan B

Thank you. and you are right cheaters are bad parents, the selfishness outweighs anything else that could be important in their lives. You just feel for you children so much. I must say my son did say this was his best birthday! That should be enough.

What are you doing to stop the crack in you plan B?

How did you find out about his anger? This needs to be stopped.

Also does your son know about his dad's affair? It's your WH's actions that has caused this not you "trying to be a bigger person". It's his doing.

I know a moment of weekness. He sent me a nasty text. I am now going to block him when I have the boys. No reason to keep this going. Let him and the OW live happily ever after. I am getting closer to indifference. That is my goal, to really and truly not care about him anymore. Long road....

I know it's difficult. Why not change your number completely? He can communicate through your IM.

Have you told your DS7 about his dad's affair?

No I have not told my 7 year old about it, when it started he was 4. Scary how much time has passed. I will, but just have not had the courage to do it with just being served. A lot to take in in the pass two months.

I need to work on my plan b....

You need to tell him

I know, he cried tonight wanting Daddy home he said if he asked him it is always no. This is a tough pill telling him, did not have words tonight, just said Daddy loves you he just does not want to be with Mommy. He is hurting and it kills me.

I have (still am) dealing with the issue of a crying child, missing the WS, wanting the WS spouse home. Biggest thing you can do is comfort them with their feelings, "i know you miss daddy", "i know you feel sad", and continue to reassure them they are safe, secure, and you are not leaving them. You cannot comfort them by saying "daddy loves you" & "daddy misses you", it creates conflict for the child because you cannot speak for the WS.

I know it is hard to see the pain they are in because of the WS. I have been there and still am.

Good advice. Thank you.

My kids tends to do this more so when they are tired (at bedtime). We had shopped at a used bookstore to pick up some more bedtime books since bedtime is when they miss him most. They picked out several, but i added some in that included love, family, support, etc themed. Worth a try.

Have you changed your number yet?

Have you told you DS7?

You should handle it exactly as LR suggested. It is extremely confusing for children for you to say that their father loves them, when their father isn't acting in a loving manner. It creates conflict in their growing brains because this doesn't seem like loving behaviour and an adult is telling them that it is. It will teach them to accept these actions as loving in the future, and they may also act in this manner as well.

BH had some great questions. What are your answers?

Yes mason it is hard trying to explain WAywards to little children, as we know they tend to blame you, and the wayward will allow it too, if they can use it to get thier way.

Remember you are the authority, and also hold the definition of what love looks like.

As far as the other parent is concerned, it is up to them to reassure thier children that it will be allright and they are loved. Whatever the "It" is that they are worried about, the most important thing is to reassure them it is not thier fault, and they are safe.

Yes the fear they have is the most damaging I agree, but your confidence and reassurance will be a lighthouse for them

Thinking back to my childhood I remember how it felt to me of how I thought my Dads problems were my fault, and vowed my children would never have to feel that way

Of course my late wife with her problems did not care and my children suffered during her death, but they knew without a doubt she made her own choices, and were not engulfed in guilt. The youngest was 18 at the time but he did have his moments of feeling responsible for not saving her. It's allways hard

Personal accountability is allways a hard thing to teach your children, and it is so nessesary to do that with little kids when this happens, to make it clear it is not thier fault, and they will be ok

Telling them that someone loves them when thier are no examples, will just confuse them, Telling them it will be allright helps them, and they need it, and is what they want to hear

It will be better too, and you can find lots of ways on the forums of how to explain what love looks like, and why Daddy is not there anymore

Little kids understand what love is, they are born with the knowledge, May we allways stand for it too, even if others are lost

Here are some book titles that might help.

My mom is great
What mommies do best
If you hold my hand
What moms can't do
Dinosaurs Divorce

Great titles LR

More books are on the way.....

Can anyone fix my broken heart
When mom and dad divorce
At daddy's on saturdays
It's not your fault Koko bear

Wow great titles for active little minds looking to cope

Thats cute the koko bear one lol

Mason.....how are you doing?

I am doing ok, thanks. Divorce process is moving along. Filing under adultery so POSOW will get a letter that I am suing her. Also, doing this so I will not be responsible for his debt througjhout the affair. That should sit well in their fantasyland. Staying in Plan B, which helps. Very nervous about what type of settlement I wiil be getting. I do not want to be forced to move.

I go through periods of accepting I am getting divorce to sadness and rage. I still ask why?

Have you gotten credit card records or whatever concerning his expenditures on her? That would help your case as far as your possibly getting saddled with any debt.

My attorney will request them. I have already told her that he is roughly 40K in debt. I am hoping we can settle that he keeps his and I keep mine. Who knows.

This will go on for quite a while, but will disapate with time.

There are probably many reasons and questions, as you sort through them, and put them in the past, maybe one at a time, maybe somewhere in a post found here on this forum, answers will come.

Make sure you take great care of yourself, and take positive action in your life for yourself, now that He is out of the picture and lost his place.

You have little ones that someday will know how much character you have, when Daddy did not.

Someday the fool will be revealed, it can't be helped, and it wasn't you

Thank you. Not having a great morning my 3 year old was talking about what he wished for, aside from Spider Man, he said he wants daddy to come back. Oh goodness.

I need to learn to stop asking the whys? Stop thinking about things when they were good. The last two years of my life has been hell. I just want to speed up the process of healing and the karma bus to run him over, like you said I want the fool to be revealed.

Just need to vent. Also found out my best friend who had been a huge support may be moving to London.

Remind yourself when you want to ask why, that you might as well be asking why the platypus exists, or something else ridiculous like that. There's no navigating the inner mind of a wayward, you can't figure out the why. (Well, selfishness, but...)

Take care of yourself and wait--the fool WILL be revealed.

OT I love your Sig karmarose. That is how I feel. I have come out the other side. I am the happiest I've been in so long I can't remember. I may not have a pot to piss in, he took that too, lol! But We, (kids and I) have a happy peaceful life. I wish the same for the OP.

Not having a great day, still in divorce limbo. Paperwork lost during the Hurricane had to refile. I feel like I am spinning today, WH is on vacation with OW and had the nerve to want to speak to me about negotitating the term of our divorce because he does not want to pay attorney fees. I refuse to speak with him.
I hate him more than ever. Plan B cracks always hurt. Now I am sad, he is vacationing and I am alone. I want the hurt to go away and feel indifferent towards him. I want this chapter in my life to be closed. most days are good, but when having a day like this it just brings back all of the pain.
They are moved on and I feel like I am stuck.
Still filing under adultery, he has no idea. I am sure that will go over well. Just needed to vent.

Hi Mason.Yes,plan B cracks always hurt!!Is there any way you could avoid even knowing his whereabouts?How did you find out about his vacations?The hurt will go away..eventually.You will feel indifferent towards him.You will detach completely when the time comes.Trust me.I was where you are months ago.The pain is still there but I can manage much better than before.
You are in my prayer.

I still snoop, have his frequent flier number, Old habits die hard. So yes, I can avoid it and will moving forward. Do not need to feel this way. Holidays are a trigger as well. Thank you!

In PB for 5 months and still snooping? There are enough cracks in PB when you have children, don't add any more than that. It will help you heal more quickly and more fully

Lesson learned. I have spoken about this in therapy. You are right, with kids those should be the only cracks. I need to focus on my life and my boys. End of story.

I am so frightened, I have a court date next Monday, I have not seen or spoken to WH since July. I do not want to see him in court. I have had many cracks in Plan B, but the past three weeks I have been dark and its been good. Still think of him everyday. Wish that would stop.
His affair has blossomed since I am totally out of the picture and OW is getting her wish. I still have her blocked from meeting my boys, but I know I can only control that for so long.

Look great there, and don't look twice at him unless you have to for some reason. OW is not worth your notice.

I know, I wish I could put blinders on. Thank you, just had to vent. I want this over with so badly. I have no idea if I am going to have to sell the house...etc. Financially eeverything is so unknown. Divorce is scary. I wish I did not have to go and my attny could handle everything.

Update:
Had court yesterday, had not seen him since July. Did not look at him or acknowledge him. He has aged since July, more gray hair, gained weight. I felt like I do not know this person any longer, he is stranger to me. We are using the adultery claim for leverage.
If we can agree on a settlement, we could be divorced in March (next court date). It is so hard, He is 40K in debt and has zero savings, yet he continues to spend like crazy. He is going on his second vacation in two months. The OW is a lucky lady!
I just hope I get what I want out of the divorce and be done with it. Just sad.

How are you? Divorce is a stressful situation anyway and D with a wayward can be living h*ll.

How are you eating? Sleeping?

I am sleepind and eating well (probably too well) but I am extremely anxious and stressed out. Mostly for financial reasons. I having my oldest son see my therapist, he has been acting out alot. My WH, is so selfish and only cares about himself. His job and OW come first. I just wished he cared about the kids more. You can not make someone be a parent.

I have such hate and anger for him. I want this over and hopefully fianacially secure without a fight.

Update:

Had parental mediation required by the court. For the past 2 1/2 years WH has only done every other weekend and never asks for more time. He goes in there saying he wants them Thursday - Tuesday every other week. Thank god the mediator said that is too long for a 4 year old to be away from his mother.
He said that is not enough time. Did not want to take the dinner during the week, but NJ law is every other weekend and one dinner. She told him 9 days is too long without seeing your kids.

So it ends up he gets them pick up from school on Thursday and drop off Monday morning and every other monday night for dinner.

Not sure why he wanted so much time...when he has done the abosolute minimum. I knwo they need their dad, but I lost a night or two.

Only good news is that we agreed that no one can introduce a new partner (OW) until the divorce is final. After that no control.

He is a fool.

Thank you mason for giving an update. I am sorry that he got more time. You are right, more time will equal more work and responsibility for him. Time will tell whether he will be able to handle that much time and responsibility.

How are you doing? What have you been doing for yourself?

The process of divorce has been very stressful. I stressed so much about being in a room with him. We did not speak unless through the mediator. I do not think he will be able to keep this up....I am sure most Monday dinners will be canceled due to his traveling.
I honestly think he asked for more time to hurt me. He said if it was up to me I would only let him see the boys every other weekend. He is dillusional. I always offered more time.

At the end of the day my boys crave more time with him. I just hope he does not dissappoint them.

I can only imagine how difficult everything has been. I dread the process myself. I know it has to be heartbreaking for you to have these decisions only to worry that he won't uphold his end of the bargain. You are right, they love their father and need time with him. It will be so very difficult for you to see their father let them down over and over again. Having experienced this with some of my friends, I realize that you have to be the strong, loving stable one in the face of their pain. Eventually, they will form their own opinions of their father if he doesn't do the right thing by them. Remember, you can't control him or what he does, but you can stand up for your children and protect them.

One thing to consider, be careful that he doesn't keep trying to get more time. I know they will do that so then they can get a reduction in the child support they have to pay based on the time percentage. So, when he keeps cancelling Mondays due to travel, then you can re-visit the custody agreement to remove Mondays from the agreement.

Document everything in regards to his visitation, whether he takes them to their activities, dr. appts., etc.... Keep that record. It will come in handy should you have to re-visit custody agreement.

I hope you don't have to be in a room with him again!! Take care of yourself. You deserve to find peace and happiness. I hope you are well on your way.

The next time I have to be in a room with him is the end of March for our next court date. Little Bit, so funny, my attny told me the same thing to write everything down too.
I thought of that about the child support, but the only way it can be reduced is if we fo 50/50 and that will never happen.
Maybe that was a motive of his.
Who knows, I am getting better, but still have my moments. No contact is best.

I have a trip planned to Florida in April with my best friend. I need it...

Yes, you do need it!!! I am glad you are treating yourself to a trip to Florida!!! You sound much stronger and seem to be finding your path. That is such a wonderful thing. Have a great day Mason. Keep in touch with us.

Sounds good from my seat..Yes you are thier security, and thier strength

Thank you all so much. This is such a long road...I am a different person from when this all started and I am sure I will continue to evolve. I am a work in progress...

As humans we all are, that's what makes us beautiful. Some humans are lazy and self centered and stop working. Anyways good to here your doing better. Be strong!

I remember you back when I was first going through all of this. I am sorry things still suck. I went back a few pages to see what is new. I didn't see, what do you do for a job or money?

I have found one of my more healing things has been going to nursing school. I wanted to continue to be a stay at home mom forever, but doing something new and creating a new life for me and for my kids has been better and has kept my mind more from worrying about ex and his life.

Luckily, I never stopped working full time after having my boys. so working and taking care of the boys keeps me busy.
I still hate being alone when they are not here and I do long for a committed trusting relationship. Like many here, you wonder if that will ever happen.