Hello,

I am new to MB, and have diligently been reading everything I can on infidelity.

My H and I have been together 17 years, and married 14 years. He told me he wanted a divorce on 3/31, moved out on 4/7, confirmed the A had been going on 4/16, and then agreed to take divorce off the table on 4/24. He was EXTREMELY angry towards me, which I never understood.

He said it had started emotionally a month before he asked for divorce, and then turned sexual after he told me he was leaving. He is still out of the house. We own a business together that we both ran, but I am no longer working there, and actively looking for work.

He has told everyone at work that we are getting divorced. The OW is an employee, and I have been told by members of the staff that he is flaunting the relationship with her a lot, he hides nothing.

He just recently told his family that we are separated, and did not use the word divorce. They were visiting him over the weekend, and OW tried to incorporate herself right in with them. They very much care for me, and wanted nothing to do with her, though my H mother spent the day fishing with OW. They feel she is completely wrong for him, and will realize his mistakes.

My H did confide in one of our staff members, and his family, that the OW is a alcoholic, and a very mean drunk. She is not allowed to drink around my H.

My H is very much someone who says terrible things to hurt out of anger, and I know he has gotten very good at lying, he is doing it with the staff and customers to justify his current situation, but he has alienated the majority of the staff members, losing their respect.

As I stated, he is out of the house for just over a month now. During this time I have been extremely positive with him, not showing anger, or disrespect. I never talk about OW. I have treated him with dignity, and kindness.

I haven't really wanted to push the boundaries with him, out of fear of pushing him back into divorce. When I have communicated with him, initially it was only being complimentary to him, positive things about him, trying to refill the love tank. Things like "You are strong, I very much respect your amazing work ethic, your passion, drive, and your intelligence." I also let him know how hard I was working on me, to become a better, more positive person, and that I knew I had relied on him to much for my own happiness.

I was informed the H had passed out at work. In the 17 years we have been together, he had only done this once befor, and it was during a time of great stress and pressure.

This type of positive contact went on for three weeks. He never asked me to stop. He then asked me for a couple favors that he needed me to do for the business, which I gladly did, and each time he responded with "thanks". It was the first positive sign from him since he left, the anger seemed to have faded somewhat, but I believe it is because the pressure of the situation is fading. People know it's happening, but just avoid it. Members of the staff barely speak to him, and he seems fine with that.

On Wed, May 6th, I sent him a letter that my counselor helped me draft. It was basically a letter owning my part in all of this. I did not ask him anywhere in this letter to end the A, nor to respond, or come home. It was just about me showing that I am growing, and learning what my faults were to help create the situation.

At the end of the letter, I stated that he had not burned any bridges with me, that I held no judgment towards him, how could I judge him when I was so at fault myself. I ended it by saying "You still have my heart."

I have been completely positive, kind, and treated him with dignity this whole time. The letter seemed to spark something positive, and he has called me now twice, not to speak about anything to do with the relationship, but only about our lawn mowers. The first call he answered a couple questions I had about something to do with the mower, then asked if he could come pick up the 2nd one we have, that I'm not using. The second call was to let me know he is having someone come pick mine up to have it repaired, and returned. But he was kind, and positive. I did not answer that last call or text though, I was busy. I still haven't returned the message.

He is still in deep with OW, in spite of being a mean drunk, as he said she was. I very much want my marriage back, and am willing to do the work, but I don't know which way to go at this point. Do I go dark, or continue with this positive road? Part of me feels it's time to stop pursuing, and hoping to get the response I'm looking for. I still very much love him, and want to save my marriage, but I don't know what that next step should be, or how to do it.

I will lastly add that he controls all the finances at this point, until I can find a job. He has a nice hefty sum in the business account, gave me $250 in my joint acct, and yesterday I did find proof he is helping OW financially. She has major financial issues.

I wanted to add that my H is typically a very kind and generous man, if I asked him for more money, he would give it.

I also need to say that he is the head cook at our business, along with owner, and manager. It's an extremely labor intensive stressful job. He works many long hours in a day, and is constantly pulled in many directions. I believe this had a significant amount to do with our marriage falling apart, along with what was wrong in the marriage.

Have you exposed the affair? You need to expose to everyone, your family, husband's family, friends, and ANYONE and everyone you can get on OW's side. The experts will have more to say but that above all needs to be done.

Being kind in Plan A does not include not being firm and letting him know factually

the affair must end

OW must be out of his life completely, in all angles

for the marriage to survive and recover from his betrayel.

Read up on Plan A
Read up on Plan B

See a lawyer about your financial rights and consider filing for legal seperating to protect yourself from financial betrayel.

Go into plan B (dark separation) after exposure as the other poster said. He hasn't ended the affair and you are at significant risk of health and emotional problems if you don't separate from him.

The first step is exposure and then plan for a totally dark separation.

It's tempting to see every positive interaction with him as a sign, but if he hasn't ended the affair after this length of time, he is simply giving you crumbs to placate you.

Did you have a question for us?

You have gone along with his plan to be friends while he and this POSOW are destroying your marriage. That just makes him feel at ease with his affair and the message that you are sending to Everyone else is that you are completely fine with this affair.

Exposure pleads with all friends of his and yours, requesting their help in restoring your marriage. After all, many of those friends and Family members were witness to your marriage vows, weren't they?

Exposure on the drunk skanky home wreckers side is to show that she has no respect for marital boundaries and to hold both sides accountable.

Please read the biok, "Surviving An Affair" and follow the proper instructions on how to Immediately crash their fantasy.

Quit being supportive of this home wrecking affair.

Do you have any children?

LTL

Before doing ANYTHING, contact an attorney immediately to protect assets.

Also, your self introspection is good, but your faikings are NOT the reason for his affair.

Most other advice instructs the Betrayed Spouse on how to remain friendly and accepting of the cheating spouses affair.

Dr. Harley, with his Marriage Builder time tested methods instructs that the best chance for a positive outcome is the shine tbe light of day on the cheating spouses despicable marriage wrecking behavior.

Read the 1st sticky post in this sub-forum that says, Read This First and also read the Exposure 101 link at the end of Melody Lane's signature in her posts.

LTL

Ginger, sorry I missed your question and just saw this. Yes, you should stop pursuing him because it will work against you in many, many ways. First off, it will tear you down emotionally to compete for him. It will happen fast, but most women last about 3-4 weeks before they start suffering emotional and physical damage. That makes you the LESS attractive option. It is also very unattractive for a betrayed wife to pursue her husband.

You did a really good Plan A, but I would suggest you go into Plan B very soon now. You can read about that in the book Surviving an Affair. I would also do a very comprehensive exposure using the tactics outlined in my exposure thread.

It sounds like your H and the OW have successfully spun the story as: Ginger and I are ending our marriage on a happy, amicable note because we have grown apart. In the meantime, I have met a new love interest, Sally Slut. Please welcome her into the family." See, he is using your cooperative, "non judgmental" approach to justify the divorce and prop up his affair. You have unwittingly helped him in that regard.

What we would have suggested is that you be kind, polite, loving, showing him you would be willing to meet his needs if he ended his affair while objecting STRENUOUSLY and LOUDLY to his affair. You have seemed to go along with his affair with this "non judgmental" stance. It is not being judgmental to object to flagrant ABUSE and affairs *ARE* abuse.

I would also challenge your notion that you had a part in his affair. You did not get a vote. You might have contributed to the poor state of the marriage which made the affair more tempting, but you did not have a part in his decision to have an affair. Saying that to a wayward is enabling and unhelpful.

In short, you have done some good things, but you have to fight for your marriage in order to have a chance to save it. Cooperating with his destructive plans lessens your chances of reconciliation.

Please listen to Ms. MelodyLane on this. And also Jedi Knight with his advice to see a lawyer. To recap:

1) See a lawyer
2) Expose to friends and family using Melody's exposure thread. Expose to everyone on OW's side
3) Go into Plan B and protect yourself.


Also internalize the fact that you didn't cause the affair. Replace "having an affair" with "pushing you down a flight of stairs" and see if the analogy holds up. Affairs are abuse, plain and simple and the wayward spouse chooses them without your consent. If he pushed you down a flight of stairs, would you say that you did something to make him do that? No. It's the same with an affair. He chose it. You could have had the best marriage ever and he could have still chosen it.

Ginger,

Please listen to these veteran posters; they will help you every step of the way. Jedi Knight's advice to immediately seek out assistance from an attorney to protect yourself financially is extremely important. Your husband may not be so generous once you begin to do the necessary things you need to do to stop the affair and save your marriage. You must protect yourself.

You have recognized your own faults in the marriage, but you are not to blame for HIS affair. You have already shown your H your willingness to improve the marriage, now it is time to stop the affair. Don't continue enabling it. This will be diffiicult, but you will find the support and help you need here. You can do this!

Wise words.

I am waiting for a call back from a lawyer.

Would you suggest I speak directly to him, and very caring say something like this, "I love you, but you are being destructive, and the affair with the other woman must end now."

Dont speak to him until after first speaking with your attorney.
In the meantime, read the Exposure 101 thread and let us know when you have finished reading it

I thought the most painful thing I could ever endure was the night my husband moved out, blaming me for everything that was wrong in our marriage. Turns out, I was wrong.......it's the picture of him and his new girlfriend, arm and arm together, that someone thought you would want to see, so they send it to you, and the response of someone who used to be a friend, saying "congrats to the two of you.".

Ginger, I would wager part of the reason you get emails like this is because you have gone along with your wayward's scheme. I can't imagine the pain you have endured.

This is why we advocate exposing the affair wide and far. This way everyone knows the truth and you get support for your dilemma. If everyone thinks you have just "moved on" and are having an amicable split, no one comes to your defense or helps you fight for your marriage.

X2. Ginger this is not for you to fix - it is for others to support you. You are not the problem you are the victim.

The problem is waywards act brazen, the BS is apparently 'separated' - It makes it hard for people to take a stand.

Call him out. Expose to everyone that you are not 'separated' which is still married anyway. He moved out to pursue his affair. Call people on it. Do they support you or the marriage? You need to know who's going to help and who's going to hinder.



Do a strategic exposure as outlined in Melody Lanes thread.

Everyone at the restaurant knows, and either doesn't speak to him, or avoids it because they don't want to get in the middle. I've encountered some resistance from family members who don't want to get in the middle either. OW family wants nothing to do with her, she was abusive to her daughters I've been told, and her mom passed away a couple months ago.....which oddly enough, was one of the sob stories she roped him in with.

Did you read the exposure thread?

Yes....but can you explain this part a bit more please. I'm not sure I understand.

"Eliminating exposure targets"

Would it be harmful to let the WH know that I've seen the photo of him and the OW? Or I should say, my sister letting him know. She feels she wants him to know that it was sent to me, that it broke my heart, and that what he is doing is wrong. I know he's not gonna care because it's just one person, but I don't know if it would do more harm than good right now until I do start the exposing process.

My feeling is kind of why should his feelings be spared? Mine certainly weren't. But I'm still afraid of pushing him to far......I know I have to get over that.

Who told you all of this?

You still need to expose to all of the OW family and friends. Until we expose, we never know just who will be a true support in helping to bust up the affair..

People who I thought were in support of our marriage...weren't. And people who I thought did not care...DID support us greatly (and continue to do so).

As for the family members who "don't want to get in the middle"...my experience is that many of those people were waywards themselves. Who-da-thunk.

This woman has an extremely bad reputation around town, and is well known for what she does. Most of my friends know her, and have told me these things. She is not a nice person at all.

Why would you confront your husband about the photo? Be doesn't need to be convinced that he is having sex with another woman.

Your husband is incredibly selfish and uncaring of your feelings right now. Your sister means well but your husband just really doesn't care and won't until the affair is exposed.

Do you speak with the attorney about protecting your assets?
Because he has control of the assets, and has abandoned you for his girlfriend and only given you $250 I am concerned he may start hiding money and other property that hou have lawful rights to.

Good. When you expose post her on www.PlayerBlock.com and warn others about her.

It is a good idea to expose the affair to all the targets listed on my exposure thread. As long as you don't, your WH and the OW are perfectly free to spin the story as they see fit.

I'm still waiting for the call from the lawyer, Jedi. I had gotten two referrals for good lawyers in our area. I spoke with one, and just didn't get a good vibe from her, and I'm waiting on the other one to call back yet.

Jedi.....I'm sure he's been hiding money for a while now. I haven't seen her cashed paycheck come through since last month. He's paying her cash, and taking out lord knows what before depositing into the bank,

I'm having a big conflict with exposure right now. The area this woman is from, and most of her friends are from, is right where our restaurant is located. Many of these people come to our restaurant to spend money. This will effect our business, and the bottom dollar. This is still part my business, in spite of what he says, and it is our only source of income right now. It pays the house payment, and the house bills. I can't feel good about the possible negative effects of that right now.....in spite of what he's spending on her. This has nothing to do with how it effects him.

Honestly, I don't care how it effects his reputation, that he did to himself. He was well respected in the community before this, but I believe he's lost a lot of that. My concern is for the business itself.

You will be competing with her for every penny unless you drive her off. Besides you needn't tell the town, just go for her friends and relatives. No one - besides the adulterers - will really care. You will also be surprised at how supportive people can be.

The biggest threat to your livelihood is a potential sexual harassment lawsuit claimed by this woman. Indeed your husband is paying this woman cash for what? Why take her off payroll? So he can say she is not employed for sex? Does he believe she can't make a claim. Get the facts.


You have to speak with an attorney ASAP both in regards to your finances and a potential harassment claim against the company. Have courage and speak your own truth. You can't operate out of fear.

-Read Melody Lane's exposure plan.
-Work w/us everyday and begin exposure
-Read Surviving an Affair
-Work with an attorney
-In the state your marriage is in due to your husbands affair, you can be easily be gaslighted, thus you need our assistance everyday. Present your questions and concerns here and please follow the guidance. Answer members questions so we can help. Its easy to lose veteran members help and engagement with newbies when newbies don't readily answer questions or make up their own methods or cherry pick the program.

We're all volunteers that have been through hell and back. We have seen what works and have seen the affects of best laid plans from half measures. There is a wide consensus marriage and individual counseling regarding affairs typically makes the situation worse. Case in point, your counselor leading you to enable your husbands affair by being non-judgemental plus taking half the blame for his stupid decision to have an affair. There are no good reasons to abuse one's spouse.

Talk with you attorney about the financial situation and what you can do to protect your assets. Do you officially own the business? It may be, that you will have to file for divorce to be able to prevent your husband from sucking the business dry and spending a lot of money trying to impress OW with his generosity.
Your attorney will be able to tell you what the best way is.

Do not make the mistake of thinking he would never do that. He is not the husband you knew at this point. You can always stop the procedure if you reconcile, but it is easier to reconcile when you still have your retirement funds instead of being broke, because he squandered all your joint money on OW.

If you do not properly expose the affair there is little hope for your marriage.

Yes, I have read the Expisure plan, and everything I could on this webpage about surviving the affair.

Yes, we own the business, via loan of course.

I know that I am not at fault for the affair, I would never take ownership of that.
That was 100% him! All I take ownership of was my faults within the marriage, but the situation he is tangled up in right now is 100x worse than anything we ever had issues with in our marriage.

I found out yesterday that in her last marriage, right after they divorced, she took him to the cleaners basically.

Please, understand I am waiting for contact from the lawyer, I will be calling a 3rd today also, and making appts to go in for a consult. The first lawyer I contacted, I just didn't get a good feeling from her at all. I wasn't comfortable with her. I am working on it.

Ginger, then what is your plan to expose? You don't seem to be answering our questions about exposure.

Monday. I need time to plan.

You waiting til Monday is very very bad. You don't need a lengthy drawn out plan. It needs to be done. They need to be exposed. Period. Sitting on it any longer is going to destroy your marriage.

I have a big job interview I'm preparing for today.

I'm starting to get scared. Two people have now told me since last night that she will take him for everything she can get. I also just found out that they are living in a house not far from our home. She lost her home because of the court case against her mortgage, so I imagine he is paying for it.

I've also been told he does not seem happy, he's quiet, distant, and making poor choices at the restaurant. No one from the restaurant will talk to me about it, except the one waitress who isn't speaking to him. She said the flaunt their relationship, but I have a feeling it's more her than my H. She's very in your face. She wants to be me.....she thinks she has power.

I'm calling the lawyer again in a few min, to schedule a consult.

I'm still just getting the machine, and leave a number to call back.

Ginger, in the meantime, I would get your exposure plan together and start exposing and making plans to go into Plan B. You need the book Surviving an Affair, which can be downloaded on kindle for PC [amazon.com] or purchased in any bookstore.

Here are a couple of links that describe Plan B:
What Are Plan A and Plan B?

HOW TO PLAN B CORRECTLY

What are you scared of? Whether you expose or not, the relationship is happening, which means whatever leverage she has due to the fact that she is an employee, she has no matter WHAT you do. If he faces some sort of civil suit regarding his poor choice, that is a result of him having an affair with an employee, not a result of your actions to try to save your marriage.

It just confirms your need to seek an attorney's help to protect yourself against the liability.

It is common for people involved in an affair to feel lost and depressed. Affairs are immoral and destructive acts and they therefore do not make a person feel good and happy about their life.

We always liken the affair fog and addiction to that of an alcoholic. It is similarly comparable in this way. Getting falling down drunk every night, physically and mentally hurt, destroying your family, suffering consequences like DWI and loss of reputation, and all the other things that can come with being an alcoholic, feel BAD not good. But it is an addiction so you keep going back, despite that. Same with affairs.

I have read about plan B, and plan to do that now. I'm so worried for him.....us. I honestly think he may feel trapped.

When I contact her friends/family, can I express my concern that she is using him financially?

I am going to get grief from family, I've already been called a manipulator by his brother, for doing things that will effect the business. He thinks I'm trying to hurt him, and make him lose the business. This is my biggest fear!

Do I include H parents in the exposure?

Yes of course. All close friends and relatives should be included.

I wouldn't say she is using him financially. Just stick to the facts and explain that she is having an affair with your husband.

Unwritten......thank you for the info on his current state of mind. I don't understand, if it makes them feel this way, why do they not get out? I just can't wrap my head around this.

I have a question. I like to know facts before I do anything major, it's just the way I've always been.

What are the stats on exposure? Are there success stories, and if so, what percentage?

Your biggest fear should be divorce, which is exactly where you are headed RIGHT NOW. She will be able to use him financially if the affair continues. Exposure will put great pressure on the affair to end. It is no guarantee, but exposure always makes the affair less desirable and sometimes kills them immediately. In your case, I don't think it will kill it immediately because this has gone on so long, but it will inflict great great damage and hasten its death.

Almost all of us who are in recovered marriages attribute it to exposure. I would say it is about 50/50. HOWEVER, in your case it is much less because you have allowed this to go on for so long. The longer you wait the more entrenched the affair becomes. However, it is your BEST CHANCE at saving this.

What are the stats of saving a marriage when you DON'T EXPOSE? This is the plan you have followed, so how has that worked for you?

Since this is how you have always been, what are the stats of your current path?

I have no idea, ML. I'm literally in a confused fog myself. This isn't normal for me.

I could just kick myself.....the phone rang, and I just immediately answered it in a rush, and it was H. I wish I hadn't done that.

There is no reason you shouldn't speak to him now. You are not in Plan B yet. Are you reading the advice in our posts?

There are no guarantees, but if you can put aside your emotions and follow a plan, it will give you the greatest chance at recovery. Can you follow a plan?

Yes. I'm trying my best, I am. This is the most difficult thing I've ever been through,

We understand completely!! That is the beauty and value of this forum. We can help you walk through this. We have been through this ourselves and are not crippled by emotions. [as we all were when we went through it!]

So if you can follow a plan, you will have the best chance at recovery.

Here are the most important steps right now:

1. plan your exposure and get it done

2. read the links about Plan B, download the book Surviving an Affair and start preparing to go into a dark Plan B next week

Plan B is a total separation where you send him a love letter giving him a path back. You will tell him that he may not contact you unless he ends his affair and cuts off all contact with the OW. [that means she will have to leave the job] You would not allow him to contact you during this time. It might takes months for that to happen, but in the meantime, you go about your life.

3. get legal protection so he doesn't wipe you out financially

I would listen to Melody if I were you. You are very lucky she is helping you. I sent my sister here in 2009 and prayed ML would help her because I had been here long enough at that point to know she is the best on this site for walking a person through exposure and killing an affair if at all possible.

By the way my sister did kill her H's A and they are now recovered.

If you are waiting for a time when it feels "right" or "good" to expose, then that is a mistake.

Exposure is scary.

Ask me how I know! I have been through it 2 times myself (yes both times killed my ex's affairs but I couldn't possibly stay married to him any longer) and I have been through it with my little sister.

You do it anyway. You are scared but you do it anyway.

We are here to help you.

Can I just say, here, that I have never understood a person needing to be convince to expose?

The first time I exposed I hadn't even known about MB. I just felt in my heart and soul that my ex-H's affair and sneaking around needed to be shared with our family. I wanted their support and I couldn't possibly keep that a secret for him. Why should I??

He is the one doing something wrong. Not you.

Plan exposure and get it done:

Melody lane has exposure thread linked in her messages in red.

Read through her exposure letters and fill in the blanks and add any more information specific to your situation.

Start with letter 'friends and family'

Come back here once you have it written and show us what you wrote. You'll get edititorial help if necessary.

Make a list of friends and family the letter will go to thru email and Facebook.
Make a list of friends and family you will be calling, or seeing in person.
Make a list of OW friends and family to expose to
Make a list of all employees
Forward the exposure letter via email list.
Forward letter to Facebook people.
Make the calls
Visit those you want to speak to in person.

Do all these exposure in a very short time frame like a day

Remember there will be fallout. Anger and words of blame.

It's fog babble and more gaslighting which your husband has done for years

Welcome to MB, Ginger.

Do you have children with WH?

Is this a first marriage for both of you?

I spoke with him again this morning. He asked me about the garage. A month ago he was given the paperwork, check, and all the paperwork/account book for the restaurant. He hasn't gone through any of it, and of course blamed me for it.

So this will be gttetting done soon, and I'm worried about the timing of the exposure/plan b, and him being here to fix the garage.

I asked him for additional funds in my account, and he said he would try to do it today. My guess is he hasn't even balanced the books either, so he doesn't know what's in the account. No bills are being paid either.

Are you on the restaurant bank account?

It sounds like your WH is doing a fine job of ruining your business together himself, failing to pay bills and using cash to pay for OW. How could exposure POSSIBLY make that worse???

You need to stop worrying about how he thinks so much. He is in a *fog* and he is not thinking rationally. It is like worrying about what a falling down drunk thinks.

It is almost laughable that he thinks you are trying to hurt him (while he is having an affair right in front of you) and that you are trying to ruin his business when he is not even paying the bills right now. But that is the irrational thought process of an addict in the fog. That is exactly why you should pay absolutely no attention to what he thinks.

Stop trying to understand his thinking - he doesn't have any. Affairs are addictions and until they die and they go through withdrawal he will think, talk and act like he is drunk. Except when the A is in danger when he will become eerily crafty and a convincing liar.

Yet people DO recover But only after exposure makes hiding from things impossible!

Every former wayward on this forum attributes their wake up moment to exposure.



I know it is hard but you MUST be brave. You must not care what people say - though most people are tremendously supportive when they know it ALL.

If anyone is unsupportive - then you will know which people are damaging your marriage and that is important information to have.



Once you've seen a few stories on here you will be convinced.

I've been here since 2012 In that time I have seen a 100pc failure rate with people who refuse to expose. I have not once seen even one remorseful wayward in that situation - the addiction is too strong to resist when they allowed to keep it a secret. Without significant all around support the BS also gets quite haggard and sick - and unable to compete (which a smart woman will refuse to do). We've even heard of them losing the kids to the APs in non-exposure situations.

Of success stories - some immediate successes with a remorseful wayward are had - and 95 pc of exposed affairs end in 2 years (some much sooner). Dr H advises a BS to call it quits after two years because the odds are q good up until that deadline.

Of course affairs are doomed even without exposure - but exposure speeds things up. It also keeps you afloat - and stops friends sending you dumb pics!

If you do recover you will need to ban all the unsupportive people. So give them a CHANCE to support you. Their loss if they do not.

Reocvery is likely as As do not last - what we do ensures it will be a REAL recovery and not a fake - and that it will happen soon.

I know of two RL affairs that lasted decades - they still ended badly but the APs were keeping up 'soul mate' appearances after ditching their families (which doesn't happen with exposure because they lose that straight off).

Exposure is beneficial no matter what. Please do not second guess it.

Just accept now that he will be no use at all and will actually prevent work getting done no matter what you do.

The husband you knew is not there.



Is that somehow worse than breaking up a marriage? I would keep it very simple and stick to the facts as you know them. Over explanation of 'why it is wrong' makes you sound weak and defensive - and no one needs it spelling out for them.

The template letters do this perfectly without any fluff. Just make sure to include 'heart broken family' and he left you all to pursue affair which has been going on for xxx amount of time.

Change your FB pic to a nice family one...

Ok, so I'm planning to start exposure this afternoon!

On a positive, I just got back from my job interview, and it went REALLY well! I guess after being out of the official workforce since 2003, I really do still have some valuable skills!! Yay me!! Please cross your fingers for me that I get it. I want to be able to become independent again! They are hiring two people.

Someone asked if I have access to the business bank account, and yes, I do. I watch it daily.

I'm also planning to change the locks on the door, he wanted to come here today while I was gone, and I told him I wasn't comfortable with that.

For the exposure, I will just be using a template letter shown in the Exposure thread.

Also planning to order the Survive An Affair book today too.

You know, after all the fear about exposing, I kind of feel hopeful about it now. He pissed me off today! Maybe I'm finally starting to feel anger.

Question. When I send the exposure letters out, can I include that picture of the two of them that I was sent, as proof?

Why don't you just withdraw some money...it is your money too and you should protect your finances. You don't need his permission and should have some money set aside before exposure in case he cuts you off which is very likely.

Yes you can include the picture if you want. They live together don't they?

I don't know if you didn't see these, but could you please answer them. Thanks

No, we do not have any children, this is my first marriage, and his 3rd.

Two more questions.

1. By me sending letters to the OW's friends, can I get in trouble legally, since technically, I am co-owner of the restaurant she is working at?

2. What do I do if he calls me after these exposure letters start going out? Should I avoid his calls?

Why did his others marriages end? Did you meet him before he was divorced from his second wife?

No, I did not meet him before either divorce, I came into the picture well after that. I would never allow myself to be that type of woman. Even before this, I couldn't imagine the pain that would cause.

As he told me, his first wife cheated on him, and they both admitted, they were very young at the time. But he had the OW (#2) already waiting in the wings his first wife told me, and refused to work on it. But she was with someone else, and ended up marrying him.

My H admitted to me several times that he knew that #2 woman was a huge mistake, the marriage lasted 6 months.......a total time of 2 years. Wife #1 never fought for their marriage like I am though.

Can someone please answer my last two questions, especially #1. I need to be comfortable with that before I go sending out those letters to her friends list.

Well, he is a serial cheater. It doesn't matter that his first wife cheated too. And he even MARRIED an ow. This stuff is very hard to overcome with serial cheaters.

And the hope diminishes even more. I will still try to remain positive, he's older now, we have had 17 years together. Whether he chooses to remember that or not, I don't know. I need something to hang onto.

Please, can someone answer these questions.

1. By me sending letters to the OW's friends, can I get in trouble legally, since technically, I am co-owner of the restaurant she is working at?

2. Is it ok to say she is an employee in my letter? I assume so, but just want to be sure.

3. What do I do if he calls me after these exposure letters start going out? Should I avoid his calls?

Are you telling the truth?

If so, don't worry.

Ok, I reread the part about not avoiding his anger, so I got that.

I provide his contact #'s in the letter to our family, and friends, correct?

I would just say " a woman that he works with" instead of employee

1) no one can get into any legal trouble for telling the truth.

2) if you stick to facts (that yes she is an employee) then again you can't get into trouble legally.

3) ignore him until exposure is done and EXPECT anger and fury from him. The angrier he is the more it means your exposure was effective.

I believe the exposure letter was drafted by a person who works in the legal field and is worded in such a way that it makes it safest.

I would encourage you to post your exposure letter here before sending it, it has to be short and to the point. A lot of BS s add unnecessary details to the letter because understandably they are hurt and in an emotional state but sometimes this can be counterproductive.

Be ready to hear threats of a lawsuit.

Ok, great, I can do that in a few minutes.

They will likely try to bully you into silence. Document everything. You may want a VAR to document any threats. Most states only require one person (you) in a conversation to know that it is being recorded.

Dear friends and family,

I am writing to you because you are an important person in the lives of XXXX and I. As some of you may know, XXXX has recently asked me for a separation, which has shattered my heart. To my shock, I am saddened to have discovered that the reason is because he has been carrying on an affair with a woman named XXXX XXX XXXX who resides in XXXX. She is an employee of XXXX XXXX XXXX. The purpose of the separation is so that he can carry on his affair without my interference.

He refuses to end the affair. I want our marriage to recover from this affair. If you have any influence with my husband, please do what you can to get him to stop this dangerous affair. I want to stay married, but the affair must end.

As our friends and family, I am asking that you use your influence with XXXX to persuade him to end his affair, and try to work on our marriage. Our marriage can be salvaged if he would only end the affair. Please support him in doing the right thing. Please support our marriage.

I would so appreciate your support and prayers.

XXXX: XXX-XXX-XXXX (restaurant)
XXX-XXX-XXXX (cell)

Warmest regards,

XXXX

By "they" you mean my H and the OW?

What's a VAR?

That sounds pretty good to me. Would you consider changing she is an employee of xxx to she is OUR employee? I'm sure the vets (mb experts and long time posters) will be able to comment on further with advice.

Have you finished the letter to the OWs friends and family?

VAR voice activated recorder.

x 100

I would withdraw all the money you have in the bank accounts. Given that WH is a serial cheater who is flaunting this OW (who is a drunk to boot) in your face, has moved out and you don't have kids, I would file for separation or D. Sorry I can't be more hopeful but those are vital things that can not be overlooked. A serial cheater is not the "typical" cheater and you will have to babysit him for life. Being a restaurant owner with not work either.

You should still expose regardless but be prepared for him to cut off the money if you don't transfer some/most of it. He will be spending your money on OW.

I like changing it to "she is our employee" and would also add she works as a waitress.

People may also slap WH by telling him the woman is using him for money given that detail.

If this is so hopeless, why even bother putting myself through all of this? Isn't there any hope, or something positive?

You should expose for a number of reason, Ginger but you also need to be realistic of what you are dealing with too. Exposure should ALWAYS happen. You get the support you need, it is the best shot you have of running off this OW, and you know you did all you could to salvage the marriage.

Recovery is possible but it will be difficult.

Also, have you confronted OW at work? It is your restaurant. If I were you, I would make my presence known instead of hiding from her if you have not confronted.

I understand. I still like to think that age, and our history together accounts for something. I need to be able to hang onto some hope.

No, I haven't confronted her at work. I have been to emotional to handle that part of it, and seeing her with him.

She physically pushed 2 of our staff members, and called them the "C" word, and harassed another via telephone and text. I don't want to put myself in the position that it gets to that point. Why? It's not going to do anything.

I understand. Follow the steps, Ginger. Expose and protect your finances. The sooner you expose the sooner you can get to the next step.

If she behaves likes that it can get her arrested

I would take a couple friends and go to the restaurant but that's just me.

Ginger

The process of recovering from affairs is tough in any marriage but is extra tough in marriages where the wayward spouse is a serial cheater.

Your WH has already walked out on two marriages when the going got tough and even after 17 years he is still walking away from your marriage with the same disregard for the consequences or the hurt he is causing,

I won't say that the situation is hopeless but I just want you to realised that he may not have matured as much as you think and if you wish to take the extraordinarily tough path to recover then you are In a position where more than most would need to follow this program to the letter in order to stand any hope of there being any future with your WH.

I know it's scary and can seem quite radical to follow advice of strangers online and a therapist you never met but please understand that

1) people here have been in your shoes and would not advise you to do anything they gavent had to do themselves

2)Most people here's HAVE recovered.

3) Dr Harley is an expert at saving marriages and has a well documented track record.

4) in my opinion you don't have a marriage right now, your husband is gone and you can't drive him further away by following this advice, he is gone all you can hope for is getting him back and creating a marriage where this never happens again.

5) you will find that most people (friend and family) have something to say about the situation but most people don't know how to save marriages so really their advice is nice but to be taken with caution.

6) cutting any corners will inevitably lead to more heartache and suffering (trust me had I followed the advice here my marriage might have survived as opposed to finding out that I was still being betrayed 4 years later).

Do you mean by the statement below that even by sending these letters out, people may not be effective enough at communicating with him? Maybe I don't understand.


5) you will find that most people (friend and family) have something to say about the situation but most people don't know how to save marriages so really their advice is nice but to be taken with caution.

I appreciate everyone here, I feel so cared for! Thank you!

Here's the letter with the change to "our" employee. I also added this line.......and a prep cook who works in the kitchen with XXXX.

Dear friends and family,

I am writing to you because you are an important person in the lives of XXXX and I. As some of you may know, XXXX has recently asked me for a separation, which has shattered my heart. To my shock, I am saddened to have discovered that the reason is because he has been carrying on an affair with a woman named XXXX XXX XXXX who resides in XXXX. She is our employee at XXXX XXXX XXXX, and a prep cook who works in the kitchen with XXXX. The purpose of the separation is so that he can carry on his affair without my interference.

He refuses to end the affair. I want our marriage to recover from this affair. If you have any influence with my husband, please do what you can to get him to stop this dangerous affair. I want to stay married, but the affair must end.

As our friends and family, I am asking that you use your influence with XXXX to persuade him to end his affair, and try to work on our marriage. Our marriage can be salvaged if he would only end the affair. Please support him in doing the right thing. Please support our marriage.

I would so appreciate your support and prayers.

XXXX: XXX-XXX-XXXX (restaurant)
XXX-XXX-XXXX (cell)

Warmest regards,

XXXX

I like it

Not at all I mean his brothers accusations toward your or people feeding you information on weather he looks happy/sad/ stressed etc,

In my case some people simply didn't understand why I wanted a cheating spouse back etc.

People like to give their opinion on things and I have seen too many Betrayes Spouses doubt themselves or get scared by these opinions.

The facts remain most people don't know how to recover after an affair or how to brake up an affair but people here and the plan they follow are your best chance.

I have been defending my choice to fight for my husband since day 1! I have had to cut ties with some relatives for right now, simply because I couldn't handle the negativity.

Here is the OW letter.

Dear friends and family of XXX XXX XXXXXX,

It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of her friends and family should be aware that XXX is having an affair with my husband, XXXX. We have been married for 14 years, and together a total of 17 years. They have been having this affair since early March according to the evidence.

I would ask that you use your influence with XXX to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husbands around her because she is no friend to marriage.

Thank you,

XXXX

Do I send the picture of the two of them with the OW's letter to her friends and family. Yes, it was on her FB page, but some may not have seen it.

I would say no to that based on the fact that she already shared it publicly herself with the probable intention of hurting you. Don't give her the satisfaction of knowing it hurt you that much.

Be emotionally prepared for the outrage that your husband will spew towards you and telling you that because of what You have now done, there is no chance of him even considering recovering your marriage.

There is a list of crazy things that come out of their pie hole on this site and if you hit all the targets at the same time, he will follow that script.

Remain calm and Repeat..... Once you end your affair, then we can both recover our marriage.

Don't tell him about this site and your forum topic thread yet either.

When you do this exposure today, you should withdraw At Least 50% of the co-owned business finances. Even your lawyer would advise you that half of the assets our legally yours.

If he speaks abusively, don't cry. Just calmly tell him that if he can not change his tone, then the conversation will need to be put on hold until things calm down.

Speak with the closest Family and Friends directly while you are sending out your e-mails and FB Private Messages.

Do not post your letter on your Wall. This exposure is to be done to each individual in private.

When sending the FB private messages, you "May" have to wait 2-3 minutes between each sent out PM, otherwise FB will consider a flood of messages at one time to be spam.

Hang tough, yet calm. Don't be needy or falling apart. That will drive him further away even more.

Good Success with your deliveries.

LTL

If you want to share it with your own friends and family thats another matter and it's really up to you. He's not hiding or denying the affair so I'm not sure what your aim would be

Probably just to add more people to contacting him I think. Isn't it true that the more that contact, the better?

I have an appt tomorrow at 9:30 am with the lawyer.

It's 5:00 pm here, do you think it would be better to send out tomorrow a.m.? What if people read this now, and then forget about it overnight, and not bother to contact?

Really? I was thinking it was perfect because they can work together. Am I missing something?

So, his affair blew up right at the two year deadline huh?

Don't worry about the serial cheater thing for now - it's tough - but things can be done and let's work on the job in front of us, exposure. Remember exposure is mostly about you - if you get hurt you get help. You tell people and you tell on people!




Two things: encourage people to tell him off but ultimately it is up to them.

Secondly people will look at you like you are crazy and dissuade you from recovery. Or go to the other extreme of counselling blind trust. Pat their hands and reassure them you have a PLAN and high hoops for him to jump through IF you decide to recover.




This can change when they see you have HIGH standards and a plan to make cheating IMPOSSIBLE.



We want that RL support for you too.

Good luck with the job. I was offered one today so I'll send my good luck fairy over

This step has already been prosponed to long.

All the advice has stated to do is asap and make sure you secure your finances.

How far along are you in securing the finances as advised?

Dr H says "tell everyone" - but you need to concentrate on people they care about. Ensuring they have no support system.

I've already started the exposure with my family, and will move on from there.

I have a lawyer appt at 9:30 am tomorrow. I will wait with the finances thing until I speak to her.

No one is going to forget an exposure bomb overnight. What are you going to do about securing your finances? You have avoided answering that. BSs are advised to withdraw funds and put it in a solely owned bank account.

Yes, Be ready for this. A few of us have gotten threatening letters from tort attorneys, etc. Just ignore it.

The best advice is to expose, preferably all at once, so nothing can be construed as "harassment" (harassment has to be sustained over a period of time, so if you can do it all at once, its not harassment) and tell the truth. The truth is always an absolute defense to libel, slander, etc.

black_raven, I am not avoiding it, I just feel better about it waiting till 9:30 am tomorrow to speak with my lawyer.

Secure your finances ASAP. Take your half now.also, gather as many records as you can. They can disappear.


And yes, earlier when I said they may try to bully you, I meant H and OW.

Now is the perfect time to expose because people are off work and can call now.

Fair enough, Ginger. I just don't want to see you get cut off should your WH do that...and it does happen especially when there is a nutjob OW in his ear. You may want to take a joint check book with you tomorrow or a joint credit card in the event you decide to retain counsel and pay a retainer.

yes!!! Send any evidence you have.

His kids too? They are married.

Then you should give up becuase the lawyer will tell you "oh no, do not expose!!" A lawyers goal is to faciliate an "amicable," easy divorce, not to save a marriage. If you want to take marriage advice from a lawyer, you are done.

The advice we are giving you is for people who want to save their marriages. It is from a clinical psychologist who specializes in saving marriages.

Yes! Tell the kids.

Good luck with your exposing Ginger! When I read your first post and how long you have been catering to your husband's abusive affair, I did not think you had the cahuna's to do a good exposure and Plan B, but I am happy to be proven wrong

Melody, I'm already exposing.........I'm only waiting to discuss the finances with the lawyer.

LOL! Thank you unwritten!

There is no reason to discuss exposure if you are going to take advice about exposure from a lawyer. The lawyer will tell you not to expose. Discussion over!

She's seeing the lawyer about securing finances.

Ginger just move it. As long as you don't spend it without legal advice you're fine to safeguard it.

Perfect!

whew!! I thought you were waiting to talk to a lawyer to expose and my heart dropped!!!

CArry on, Madam!

And be sure and get to the OW's parents and family members!

He's older but that hasn't stopped him from behaving the same way in your marriage that he did in his first marriage. A wayward mindset can be present at ANY age.

For now just keep putting one foot in front of the other by following the Plan. But do be realistic about his history and the fact that his mindset and lifestyle has been wayward for many, many years and recovery with him would be very difficult.

Look, Ginger, your husband has already proven that he is untrustworthy. You know that you CAN be trusted to be fair with H. So I think it is better for you to control the money.

Get it done!! All in one day!!

And move it to a new bank!

OW's parents have passed on.

That was how she hooked my husband........sob story overdone about her moms passing.

I'm on my husbands FB list, and it's not asking me for payment. Does that mean it's automatically going to the "other" inbox?

Through my FB of course.

Send it to his old boss? Who if he potentially loses it, could be his boss again? He's a nice guy.

Been there

I only had 1 message for friends on his list ask me for the $1.00.

As long as you are sending htem on a PC, you are probably ok since you are sending them to your husbands friends. You are on a PC, right?

Yes.

Also, send to his old boss, who could potentially be his boss again if he loses the business? He's a nice guy.

Yes.

Here is the OW letter.

Dear friends and family of XXX XXX XXXXXX,

It grieves me to write this letter but I believe all of her friends and family should be aware that XXX is having an affair with my husband, XXXX. We have been married for 14 years, and together a total of 17 years. They have been having this affair since early March according to the evidence.

I would ask that you use your influence with XXX to persuade her to leave my husband alone. You should also watch your own husbands around her because she is no friend to marriage.

Thank you,

XXXX

Anyone?

Ginger, your letter for the friends and family of OW is perfect. Send it on to all of her friends and as many relatives as you can find (I found a lot of relatives by viewing the photos of the OWs friends).

Good job.

When will you be sending it?

I am already, and I'm getting alot of backlash. I don't think anyone will speak up to her.

She has alot of friends on her list, but I did find her two daughters. One chewed me out, and said I was highly inappropriate.

Highly inappropriate? I think that's a great description of an affair with a married man.

Well, the husband just called, and literally just chewed me a new butthole.

He's going Monday to file legal separation papers, he told me to pack my things, and move out, I get nothing. He's not leaving her, he found true happiness, I'm nothing but a Bi**h, she's calling the police. Etc, Etc, Etc.

He said the customers said they saw this coming, he said one of them said I was selfish. He literally just beat me down, and now I regret it. I'm here alone, and I can't deal with it.

He said her friends are all calling her, saying a psycho woman is messaging them. No one will stand up to her.

That is great!!! You hit the bullseye!! The madder they are, the more effective your exposure!

What was he so upset about? You were just spreading the good news.

Melody, please stay on a bit, I'm feeling very vulnerable right now. And scared.

He said whether he's with her or not, he's not coming back. He said everything he could do to beat me down, and I'm feeling the effects of it right now.

He said the whole 17 years with me has been a waste of his time. He said I am a manipulative, vindictive person, who will never ever change, that I have never been a nice person.

But why? You were just spreading the good news. Is he saying there is something wrong with his affair?

He is infuriated because you................INTERFERED WITH HIS AFFAIR! That was the GOAL. IF your exposure did not inflict damage on his affair, you wouldn't have heard a thing.

Just imagine that you brought in a crowd of onlookers to watch the crack heads get high. It ruins the high and infuriates them. That is all that happened here.

I'm scared, Melody. His anger just beat me to the ground, and shook my core.

I didn't do this to speed up the divorce process, and I honestly believe he will go file now.

Here is an interpretation of his words: click here

You need to settle down here. The goal is to save your marriage, not to avoid your husbands anger at all cost. You just inflicted a huge blow to the affair, as evidenced by the reaction of the infidels.

It doesn't matter one bit. He may or may not. *IF* your marriage can be saved, your best shot is to expose the affair.

He's a very very VERY angry person, and I know he was here yesterday when I was gone. He came to pick up some wood. He's framing his garage for an apartment.

Tomorrow I'm changing all the locks.

Good idea! I would calm down and finish your exposures. Did you finish?

Nearly everyone who exposes here gets an angry phone call or conversation like this.

You've done the right thing here, just know that. Many of us have never heard our wayward spouses so angry as when they were exposed.

He just stepped into a bear trap and he's trying to vent his frustration at being caught on you. This is not your fault, Ginger. You are doing what is both reasonable and morally right, as well as the best thing you could have done to save your marriage.

Many, many people who come here for help are not brave enough to expose, and you were.


Very unlikely. If he was serious about filing he would have done it by now rather than risk getting caught like this.

This is wishful thinking of the highest order. If he thinks he can force you out and that you will get nothing in a legal separation, he is out of his mind.

This foolishness is probably being spoon fed to him by OW, who also doesn't have any idea what she's talking about.

He just called me again, spewing more insults at me.

- He said he would never marry again, but he will probably marry her.

- He is shutting the electric off tomorrow, and my phone.

- I am to move out, and the house will sit empty till it's sold.

- He is changing the bank account to a new account.

- It's his money.

The reaction is text book wayward.

Also, no matter the responses you get from people when you exposed.......the truth is out there. They can not lock it back into top secret status.

You are being brave.

You are being a good wife.

You are going to get through this scary part of surviving the affair and you will thrive.

Yes, and what if he does turn off the electric, and my phone?

Wow, you get nothing of a business YOU SHARE? Whateverz.

You need to stop answering his calls Ginger. We all warned you this would come in short order. You need to stop answering his calls until the dust settles. There is nothing productive that can come out of his calls right now.

I agree, but I still say, what if he shuts off the electric, and my phone? He said he's turning off the internet too.

Oh, and he's bringing her here tomorrow with him. He said when I move out, he's moving in here with her.

Ginger,

I wrote this to you 5 hours ago.


Now do you see precisely how predictable his reaction would be if you hit the right targets?

You did the right thing AND you threw their fantasy into a whirlwind of embarrassment.

He will deny that, but why else would he be so outraged.

If he threatens you, CALL THE POLICE!!!

As a matter of fact, Call The 911 Dispatcher NOW and tell them he has threatened to throw you out of your joint owned marital property, just so YOU have the 1st report filed and it is documented in their logs.

Keep a voice activated recorder on you during ALL conversations with him for NOW and in the near future. The most intense hostility will die down typically in 2-3 days, but can rear it's head momentarily again and often.

Or, download an App right onto your cell phone.

The App that I downloaded for free is called; "Smart Recorder"

.

The person you are currently dealing with IS NOT the husband that you thought you knew so well.

If telling the truth and asking for help actually causes him to file for divorce, then in reality it's best to be rid of the repeat cheating person he has proven to be. BUT..... It's Way Too Soon to jump to ANY conclusions.

LTL

If he turns them off......you call the electric and phone company and get them turned on.
You don't move out.
You do not answer calls from him while he is raging and having a big tantrum cause Ginger is not under his control anymore.

He said he's outraged because of what I did to her. He said I was mean and vindictive and hurtful to her. He doesn't care what I do to him.

You have acted bravely.

Continue that.

Be Stronger.

Don't let ANY MORE calls disturb you tonight.

Turn off your phone.

But, be proud and say it loud to yourself.

Call the utility company's tonight and state it is an emergency that your husband is threatening you with turning off all the utilities, including the internet provider and request they do not do so without your personal approval to put the accounts in your name solely.

It is illegal if a landlord turned off utilities on a deadbeat tenant and EVERY Judge WILL frown on that action by him and be supportive on your behalf.

When you contact the bank tomorrow, the moment they open, take out AT LEAST 50% if not all of the funds.

Have your husbands 50% put into a legal Attorneys Trust Account when you meet the attorney at 9:30 am.

This is NOT taking his funds away. It is safeguarding them from the tramp who wants to pretend to fill your shoes.

The Attorneys Trust Fund will make you look like you are protecting, not only yourself, but him also, from that heathen.

LTL

Read and absorb what I have written to you in the previous 2 posts.

Now, IGNORE his childish outbursts!!!

Did you call 911 to see if they can prevent the escalation of him threatening to evict YOU from your own marital home?

Get a report made now. Beat him to the punch. It will help you immensely down the road.

Do YOU feel your letters were mean and vindictive?

I sure hope not. They were sincere and truthfull and asking for support.

Boo-Hoo..... His tramp just had someone interrupt her fantasy gravy train.

Do you have any authority over your joint business restaurant employees?

Ask your attorney about what your best options are to get her fired for having an affair with the co-owners husband.

AND REMEMBER..... The Attorney Works For YOU!!!

LTL

He is going to spin this story far and wide to everyone. Just like he did when he first left. He will lie about everything to make me look bad.

Oh, and the smart recorder isn't working. I tried it on a phone call with my sister. It records me, but not her voice.

As advised get on top of jointly owned finances and assets. Move 50% out of joint accounts and seek legal representation ASAP. Even a legal separation is effectively a divorce of joint assets and while I doubt he files (he isn't prepared or else he wouldn't be trying to intimidate you like this) it will give you peace of mind and a PLAN.

He cannot move you out or OW in without your consent. He is simply trying to bully you into giving up.

You can buy a voice activated recorder from Walmart or Radioshack and you NEED this in case he comes home tomorrow and gets unruly. They are only about $50. If he threatens you or forcefully removes you from the home a recording of the event is enough to give you legal options for getting back into the home and getting HIM removed from the home. So buy a VAR, test it so you know how it works, and wear it when/if he comes by.

No matter what happens he's not going to kick you out and leave you penniless. That's not how marital property works, he's just trying to bully you.

As advised get a free call recorder for you smartphone from the app store ASAP. This serves the same purpose as the VAR.

As advised, if he turns things off, call and get them turned back on in your name with your half of the finances. Then let him try and turn that off and see what kind of luck he has.

Like many waywards, he is in lala land and thinks he can just pretend your marriage never happened and take anything he wants. He is in for a rude awakening.

LearnedTooLate........I have read it, but my head is just in a whirlwind right now. I'm trying hard. His calls have deeply effected me, and I know I shouldn't let them.

He said she deactivated her Facebook acct. He said he's so angry because her mom is dying, and it was her only means of communicating with people. So part of me does feel bad about that.

Is making a police report, and taking funds from the bank going to guarantee divorce?

Ginger, calm down.

He can not turn off utilities immediately. Utility companies require an appt to schedule a final meter reading. Anything that gets turned off at some point can be easily turned back on. It is not anything to get freaked out about.

If he brings OW to your house, call the police to report a domestic dispute. If he shows up on his own and starts acting crazy or you want him out, call the police to report a domestic dispute. Since he moved out they will likely tell him to just go away (they most definitely should tell her to go away so he would go with her). Police do not want anyone acting crazy so they should ask him to leave to cool off. Do not leave your house.

Do you have family or close friends that can come over tomorrow? I would postpone the attorney appt and get the locks changed and the money moved first thing tomorrow.

He says he's filing for separation but not divorce? Well that says something right there!!! Most WSs are all freak out and huff and puff after exposure. Even if he files, it doesn't mean anything. If he goes to an attorney, I have never heard of one dropping everything to file on the spot and you would still have to be served. Stay calm and stop letting him get to you. This is the TYPICAL scare tactic of a WS.

Huh? You said her mother was dead.

And....an OW always IS an 'innocent, dear girl" who the WH must defend.

If her mom is dying, what he heck is she doing getting involved with a married man which would bring her mom grief at such a horrific time?

That OW's inability to communicate with people about her Mom is not your concern. She can do it the pre-facebook way if need be. She could call someone who could spread the word about her mom for her.

The only thing that could guarantee divorce would be if you filed for divorce. That is the only possible choice in this situation that could guarantee divorce. Otherwise there is no guarantee of any sort.

I've been through having to separate finances and take these types of drastic actions, and it was tough because it feels like a big push away from your spouse. Maybe that's how you feel also.

But you need to keep in mind that your husband is not thinking the way you are. His big push away was a long time ago, when he decided to start a relationship with OW. He effectively clocked out way back then.

So you need to think about this differently. The actions we are recommending are just like the exposure...they will put up barriers and obstacles to his ability to continue the affair.

Trust me...THAT is the dominant thing on his mind right now. He is much, much more concerned about figuring out how to take the spotlight off of his shameful relationship with OW than he is about anything else.

That's why he wants you out of the house, is telling lies to try and discredit the exposure, etc. It's mere damage control, trying to create a distraction from the real story.

What we're talking about will make that very difficult for him and may actually discourage him from seriously considering divorce once he realizes what it will actually cost him.

And more importantly, it will protect you.

That's what I was told, by him, and another person.

I don't want to miss commenting to anyone in particular, so I will just say, "Thank you, everybody here totally ROCKS!!!"

Oh, and this was a good one too.....

"You have always wanted me to lose the business! I'm going to lose it on purpose, just to prove it to you!" LOL!! Even I think that one is PRICELESS!!!

Please don't feel bad about this, because the idea that you are somehow responsible for any of that statement is absurd.

Her very own behavior is the only reason she would have to be ashamed. She's the one acting like a tramp, not you. If an athlete fails a steroids test, is it his fault or the fault of the man who gave him the test? Same exact kinda deal.

Deactivating her Facebook and then whining about it being the only means of contact is about as sensible as throwing your cell phone out your car window and then complaining about it being the only phone you have.

Not to mention that I doubt his statement is true. Just think about it....if your MOTHER was DYING, would you not have a PHONE NUMBER, ADDRESS and EMAIL ADDRESS for her? Would you really relegate your own dying mother to a "Facebook only" relationship?

Either OW is a sociopath or (more likely) your H is full of ****.

OW's mother is dead, dying, stuffed in a closet, and was maybe born a man...who knows and who cares.

You will hear all sorts of spin and stupidity from WH and OW as they try to do damage control. Since they were flaunting their affair at work and are living together, what exactly is the problem?

Try to get some rest, Ginger.

Just letting everyone know I did file a report with the sheriff department just now. They said if I feel threatened by him tomorrow, to call ahead, and they will have someone here with me while he is here.

I am going to run now to Wal-Mart, and get some new locks for the doors. I can't sleep anyway. Going to see if I can get the neighbor over early to change them out.

Sorry.

The App is called "Smart Voice"

That one works just like a tape recorder, but it's not for recording phone calls, just in person conversations.

I also use one that records both sides of All phone calls. It's App name is: "Call Recorder".

BUT..... You need to tweak the settings to record the other person speaking. The instructions that worked for me are written in ths comments/reviews right on ths App info page.

LTL

Don't forget, he's been through this 2x before. He's told me before, he will do the DIY version of divorce, because it's much cheaper. I think that is what he is referring to when he's talking about legal separation.

Translation - she's yelling at me to get my wife back under my boot!

Look at you go you rock star! You've definitely caused lots of trouble here.


Handy phrase: "I'm sorry your affair is so embarrassing to you."

Not proud and posing for the camera now are they?

LOL.....I like that phrase, I'll have to write that down!

I was thinking about something on the way home from picking up the new door knobs and locks. So, if everyone was on her side, like he said they were calling me the psycho lady.........why would she have to close her page? If everyone was defending her, what's to be so ashamed of that you have to close your page? He is such a big liar!

Mind said "everybody is so upset with you. They will never forgive you!" Yeahhhhhh right. I even got a cease and desist letter from a tort attorney hired by the other woman (that was delightful). The bottom line is that their upset that you are ruining their little fantasy. Don't let it get you down. Exposure is glorious. It may not work right away, but it is your best shot. And no matter the outcome of your marriage, it will hasten the inevitable death of their affair.

Oh call a whaaaaaaambulance! You were mean to the woman sleeping with your husband? Having an affair is the single meanest thing someone can do yet you are the 'mean' one trying to fight for your own marriage? You are mean for telling the truth about your own life?

Ridiculous. They think they are entitled to have an affair right in front of you while you cover for them. Don't listen to one self entitled word he says right now.

He said he never cheated on me! He justifies this because he said he no longer considers us husband and wife. It's just a technicality he said, a piece of paper.

Take them up on their offer. Make sure they are present if and when he and the POSOW intend to show up, especially after he shows up trying to make a scene.

What a nice surprise, getting that dose of reality thrown in his face.

If he causes you fear and anxiety, follow up with any charges the police suggest.

LTL

Most of the cheaters say this. Mine did too.

Ignore the Fog-Babble.

A conversation takes at least 2 people. If you disengage from listening to his outbursts, there is no words being exchanged.

LTL

Nearly every single one of her contacts has messaged me with a terribly nasty message!

So true!! And if their affair so wonderful what is wrong with spreading the good news?

Good.

You now know who the false friends are, unless you are talking about his or her friends.

Do you really want friends who support cheating?

It's all based on their lies.

The truth will surface and this WILL blow over.

LTL

It's still to new to me to see the light, or understand it. I just have a feeling it's gonna end badly.

Don't delete any. They may be useful later. Don't delete any affair related evidence. If you find it upsetting just don't read it but KEEP EVERYTHING.

You need to understand that you had nothing to lose here because your marriage was already completely lost. Sure, he liked you being his "friend" but that is only because it made him feel better about sticking it to you. He wasn't warming up to you, he was just grateful you were enabling his affair.

I sort of doubt he has ever been held accountable for his affairs before so this is a very new thing for him. It seems to have had a major effect on him, so that is a good thing. Just hang in there and don't get upset. Your marriage was lost before yesterday and while it doesn't seem like it, this has given you a small chance. I will be honest and say that this is a long shot because your husband is a serial cheater. This is his pattern. He feels entitled to have affairs.

If it can be saved, we will help you do it!

Did you copy her friends list? Do you have her mothers contact information? I would try and find her right away and ask for her help. We have had many parents kill affairs.

Are you still meeting the attorney this morning? Going to the bank?

This was already ending badly Ginger. Your WH was having an affair right in front of you, and parading her around town, and about to file for divorce. All while you sat at home being his friend and enabling his destructive behavior, with the slim hope that he would come around on his own. This WAS bad. You were in a situation where you were not in control of your own life. You had handed the reigns to a fogged out serial cheating wayward to decide what to do with YOUR LIFE. How could that be any worse?

But now you have taken control of your own life back. You have made the bold decision to not enable his destructive behavior, or cover his lies. You have decided to fight for your marriage instead.

There is NO WAY it would have ended in reconciliation under the first situation. Perhaps he would have gotten bored with this OW and come back to you, but he would still be wayward and entitled and it would only be a matter of time until the next one.

There IS a small chance reconciliation will happen now, but it won't be 'marriage at all cost' but rather a marriage of extraordinary care where you do not get cheated on again. Anything less is a 'bad ending' isn't it?

Keep in mind that NONE of this was caused by your behavior, and it certainly wasn't caused by exposure. The fallout from his affair is caused by...HIS AFFAIR. His choice to have an affair is what is impacting him. You simply told people the truth about it. Any 'bad ending' you perceive from that is due to his behavior, not yours.

I hope you are heading to the bank immediately to protect your marital assets.

He WILL try to starve you out and beat you into submission.

LTL

It is great to see you come here and start to take control of your life. I remember how scary a waywards anger can be and the doubt it brings on.


Stick with us. Your WH is at a huge disadvantage because we have all been here and we have his number. His bullying and scare tactics are typical. He has no plan and his fantasy is falling apart. So yes he is angry.


You, on the other hand, have found a gold mine of experience and wisdom with MB. The reason there are so many long term posters here is because this place saved us. I am pretty sure that I would be institutionalized by now if I had not found MB.


Remember, if a waywards lips are moving than he is lying. So stop listening to him and take his power away.

Trust only what you can personally verify.

You WILL get through this and you will come out a stronger person. Hang in there. Cool, calm and in control...unlike the waywards.

Have you been to the bank and the attorney yet? How did it go?

Cool. A woman with no true friend is a pushover of a foe.

You find this with the truly nasty habitual type OW.

I just got back from the bank, and attorney. The attorney really was of no help, because unless I go into legal separation, I can't do anything.

You need to go into legal separation and get legal protection. Otherwise you will find yourself in the street.

I'm getting nervous. Only a very small handful contacted H, but there was alot of action from OW side. I feel like the reason he was angry is because of what he feels was done to her, and not so much him. This could be very detrimental for me?

She is known to harass people, and he may just go along with it. Her daughter keeps trying to friend me.

I am having a deputy be here when H gets here, just in case OW is with, and he tries to cause a scene.

All locks have been changed as well.

Melody, I just don't have the funds. How can that work. The lawyer said it would be very expensive.

Of course not. That is great that he is angry about the effects of exposure on her.


I agree you shouldn't friend her, but I would send her a PM and ask what she wants.


Good girl!! You don't plan on letting him in, do you? Why is he coming there? What does he need?

Do you have a credit card of your husbands? Did you take money out of the bank?

He won't be allowed in, and I changed all the locks.......even to the spare room in the barn where some things are kept that he wanted.

He wants his clothes, and some paperwork.

No, we don't have a credit card, and to be honest, he doesn't have the funds either. The restaurant doesn't do that well, he never has extra money, this is a very rare occasion to have extra funds in there. But it's summer. That has alot to do with why he pays so few bills, and probably why he hasn't proceeded before with anything.

I did take money, but not half. Part of me is still thinking with the business brain, I don't know how many checks he has out there, and bouncing checks will add alot of fees, and will be damaging to the business.

I don't know why I'm so afraid of him, to be honest.

IndieGirl has a good quote in her signature when she posts.

It says something like:

"We would you do if you were not afraid?"

HE is going to remove ALL of the money from the joint account and try to starve you out into submission. That's what Waywards do.

You should not be worried as much about the business funds right now, as your own assets for you personally.

I would go back to the bank and do an additional withdrawal.

Did you ask the attorney about taking out money to safeguard it against the POSOM and your Husbands affair spending? Heck..... He is paying her in cash and you don't even know how much.

Can YOU fire her?

Isn't the business half yours too?

He has NO Reason to come into YOUR Residence today.

Have him make a list and provide it first, with the Police or Sheriff there to follow him around.

Oh, he will Love being scrutinized like that?

LTL

What are you nervous about?

If everyone on OW's side is supporting her, then what on earth have you done to her other than rally her 'friends' around her? Clearly not everyone is supporting her and she is taking some heat, that is why WH is angry at you. Basically it means you have dealt the affair a sucker punch. And that is exactly what you wanted to do. So there is nothing to be nervous about!

One more thing.

If you are short of funds and your husband earns more than you report, some states allow the lesser financially viable spouse to use what is called, "Leveling The Playing Field", which is written right into the dissolution of marriage statutes.

What that means is, that he would be court ordered to pay some or all of your necessary legal fees.

Also, even without that as a statute, if pled for, a judge can order that himself.

LTL

Dr H says even if you need to divorce, you should do whatever you have to, to protect the money and credit. He says you can always remarry later after the affair dies. Whatever their former persona, a wayward will run through all savings and borrow funds. They will bankrupt you long before the A dies a natural death.

He always tells the betrayed spouse to protect the funds.

You could even add something in your Plan B letter to inform him the legal separation is not what you want and you will happily dismiss it when he is ready to end his affair.

See, waywards like to TALK separation - so long as they don't have to actually do any paperwork and face any changes to their lifestyle.





Sounds green. Can you find a lawyer more experienced with contentious separation and divorces? You need to stress you expect financial irresponsibility and require protection.

I won't lie to you it is expensive. But sitting there and hoping he isn't going to run through it all will be MORE expensive.

He will. Guaranteed.

I spent an absolute fortune on protecting myself. It was money I simply did not have. But I am better off financially now than I have ever been because of it.



This is 100 pc normal. It's natural to be afraid of someone abusive and without moral compass. He has great power to hurt you and he will wield it.

But we'll have you in Plan B and he will be without his ace card - his abuse of you.

Abusing you excuses his conscience, impresses his mistress, makes you I'll and unable to disrupt his A, keeps you available on the backburner, which keeps his mistress keen too.

You need out of the triangle until the all-clear siren. Have you ever read the Art of War? The greatest position of strength is the fortress.

I know you have enough 'ginger' to carry on, wounds and all, even in fear. That is true bravery. Acting as though you are not afraid when you are.

Is there any way you can get an emergency overdraft on the account? something that will cover a bounced check even though you have the funds? call the bank and ask for options. Just say you've removed funds but if checks bounce is there any way they can alert you etc...

Sorry to tell you but your business is already damaged and your WH will likely sink it. Running a restaurant (even under the best circumstances) is an extremely rough business...you stated as much in your second post. This is why I said running a restaurant will not work if you ever recover your marriage. High stress and little UA time would be a dealbreaker. Plus, your WH is allowing OW to abuse the employees as well.


And he is a lazy, delusional wayward.

The business loan you mentioned...is that a fixed loan or do you have a line of credit? If you have a line of credit you can write a check from that.

Ahhh gotcha. Knew there was something I was missing. Indeed.


Plan B should be approached as a single lifestyle - would you want the restaurant if it was just you?

Will it mean keeping contact with WH?

I'm just so overloaded, and overwhelmed! I just want to curl up, and cry.

Sorry Ginger

Do you have family or a close friend who can come over?

Are you going to go back to the bank and withdraw your half?

Was the amount you took out this morning just for general household expenses, like food and utility bills?

Now, go back and take out AT LEAST 50% of the remaining balance, since the other funds were for marital expenses like food and utilities. I would take it all at this point.

Did you contact the utility companies to get the bills in YOUR name only?

Stay busy!!! That way you won't fall as deep into depression or anxiety attacks.

Have you contacted of Your friends to be with you yet?

Hang in there. You WILL get through this.

LTL

I just called the bank, and the balance went from $7112. this morning, to $4156.51 because of some checks that came in, one being a big one to the food vender, and he will have another one coming in from a different one too.

That means I'd get a whole whopping $2300. It's not worth it to me to go through the verbal abuse I'm going to get from him. I don't know how much he's taking out before he deposits, I have no proof. But the business had a great weekend last weekend because of the holiday, and these next weeks won't be so busy.

I'm not making excuses, and yes, I should have taken it earlier, but I didn't, emotionally I just couldn't do it.

No, all of my family is 4 hours away, and I just don't have any support system here. Everyone is married, and always so busy. That is what's making this so difficult.

No, he won't shut them down, he's to busy whoring around. He can't even balance his books, or pay his bills.

Thank you indiegirl.:) When I told my friends who I was going to this morning, when they came over today to change my locks, they described her as a "divorce shark". She's very good.......and very expensive!

I know it is. He said to me last night he was going to lose it just to prove to me that I (me) don't care about it. Foolish statement, but I believe it to be true, simply because I think he's to overwhelmed by it, and he's to busy being infatuated with OW.


Yup, right now he is. He used to be THE hardest working man I know!


There is no business loan right now. It's what he wants to do to buy the business outright, instead of having it on the land contract that it's on. He'll never do it though, the income isn't there for the bank to want to take it on.

Thank you for such kind words!!

And truly nasty she is indeed!

What's really funny.......I mean seriously FUNNY, is the lawyer knew exactly who she was when I told her. She rolled her eyes, smirked, and said "THAT'S WHO IT IS!!!???"

I called my lawyer back, and I asked her if she could walk me through some financial scenarios with that. She knows my H is controlling the funds, and she will help me as best she can. I will then decide if it's possible.

My husband was just here, banging on the doors to let him in. He wouldn't leave, or stop banging, he said "open the door, or I will," so I called the sheriff.

He brought OW with him, and they loaded things up from the garage, decor, our boat, and took it with them.

He told the police about the emails that were sent out last night, and they said if it continues, I will be fined.

I honestly believe this is a hopeless case now.

You cannot be "fined" for telling the truth in America. There is no such charge, so don't worry.

And I want to assure you that this was hopeless yesterday. By exposing you gained a small glimmer of hope. But it is still a long shot.

I honestly feel this was completely the wrong route to take. At least he was civil before. Now he's just hateful, and he won't care what he does to me.

He's coming next week to fix the front of the garage, and I think it's pretty much guaranteed he will put the house up for sale.

I would also file a restraining order against this brazen, vile skank. How DARE she come to your home?

Yes, I'm sure she was just drooling coming up our driveway, hoping one day this will all be hers.

He was just FURIOUS with me!

You feel this way because you believed you were getting some where by cooperating with his plan to wreck your marriage. Your way did nothing but enable his affair. He liked that set up because he had his affair and a compliant, cooperative wife. As you surely know, that was not working. By exposing, you caused great conflict in the affair.

See, our goal is to save your marriage. Your goal was to avoid his anger at all cost. We have entirely different goals. If you are not making a cheater angry by fighting for your marriage, you have no hope at all.


He cant put the house up for sale without your signature.

Why would that be?

Thank you, Melody, you always calm me down. I just don't want to be tossed aside like a piece of useless dirty old carpet. That's what it feels like he's doing, and this is definitely pushing him closer to her. The good thing is, he's really showing her his anger right now.

I still can't believe he brought her here! His obvious goal was to hurt me.

And secondly, it just shows where his loyalty now lies. He should be at the restaurant, it's Friday night........one of our main money making nights for the Fish Fry. Instead, he's here, harassing me with his whore.

The reason you are here is because he was already "pushed closer to her." HE lives with her!!!


This is true.


I would do 2 things now: write him a Plan B letter and shut the door. Find an intermediary and go into a DARK separation. Without you in the picture, they will only have each other to get angry at. Are you familiar with Plan B? Have you read the Plan B thread? Have you read Surviving an Affair?

Secondly, I would file a restraining order against the OW and never ever let her set foot on your property.

You should also reach out to her mother and expose the affair to her. IF there are any remaining exposures, get them done today!

You really ruined the fantasy!!

The mother is on her death bed as I now understand. I was told she was passed, but not yet I guess.

There are no other exposures that I will be sending. I don't think anyone from mine or his family contacted him, other than my sister. How can this work if that is the case?

I am familiar with Plan B, but will reread the thread again.

I haven't had a chance to read the book yet.

I will take care of the restraining order on Monday.

I never thought of that. Maybe that is the case, he's avoiding it now. Whoops! Sassy me!

He's lost quite a bit of weight too.........I guess stress will do that to you!

I would find her and give her a call. She might be able to have a great influence on her daughter. What about her other family members?


Is there anyone left in his family or close friends?


I would read through the thread and start working on your Plan B letter. Who could you use as an intermediary? It needs to be someone who would agree to act as a neutral spam filter and only pass on PERTINENT information about finances. [versus the threats and hateful messages he will send]


Perfect! And also inquire about what "fine" you could receive for telling the truth in America? The last I checked we all have a constitutionally protected right to FREE SPEECH in America. If the Constitution has given way to a facist police state, it would be nice to know this!

here

Did the police officer have a Supreme Court judgment denying you of your free speech rights?

I'm not comfortable calling the mother, being that elderly and ill is a very personal thing for the family, and I feel it would make me a very bad person. I wouldn't want that if it were my mother.

No, there are no others to send to for him, and I was wrong, his kids did call him, but I'm sure he spun the story around in his favor.

He told the officer that I threatened to take my own life last night too, and that's why he was banging on the door as he was, because I didn't answer. See...............spin the story in his favor.

Nothing will happen to you. I actually had the OW hire an attorney and threaten me with a LAWSUIT. But nothing ever happened. Why? because it isn't illegal or libelous to tell the truth. She was furious over internet exposure. However, those posts of her remain up on the internet and will remain up until she figures out a way to take them down (if she can).

First off, you have no idea what her condition is. Elderly, ill parents are not crippled, useless human beings. She could be a great help. A bad person is a women who sleeps with married men and helps break up marriages, not a woman who tells the truth about an adulterous affair.

I would be horrified if my son was committing adultery and you dismissed me as if I had no human value as you are doing this woman. You have no earthly idea if she is elderly or ill. That is most likely a lie told by liars. Not that elderly people are less human than others.

And of course you are not "comfortable" telling anyone. We are not trying to make you feel "comfortable" but to encourage you to do the right thing. We know it is not comfortable!


This is why it is so important for you to tell the truth.

Ginger, you can't pass up KEY, critical exposures because of lies told to you by lying liars. Don't let self serving liars be the source of information you use to determine your exposure list. That is crazy!

Nor can you pass up critical exposures because you are not "comfortable." I have NEVER known a single person in 14 years that was "comfortable" exposing an affair. It is very uncomfortable!!

You need to file for separation or divorce. If you don't WH will keep acting like this...showing up to your house with his whore and taking stuff. I also doubt you have any basis for a restraining order against POSOW w/o filing. Your WH "invited" her along to his house....there is not law broken here. You have zero protection w/o filing and a standing order.

I am going to speak with the lawyer again more in detail about legal separation. The bank account is down even further this evening after more checks came in, so he is hurting for money. If maybe he'd spend more time there working, instead of whoring around, the business might be doing better. I'm convinced there is some truth to what he said to me last night. He is going to lose it just to prove to me that I never wanted him to have it. I mean seriously, get your head on straight!

He demanded I hand over the restaurants business Facebook page, he said he needs to start posting on there. First of all........LMFAO........that is funny! I built that page with personal stories about him and I, my personal photography, and other stories. He will never be able to do what I did with that page.........with her in the picture. He will likely have her doing it, and integrating her into more of my roles, and again I say..........LMFAO! But this tells me the restaurant is hurting for business, and what is going on with him IS effecting the restaurant too. It's a small town, and rumors fly quickly.

I can't just hand over the business page, it's attached to my personal page. He said then make me admin on it, but it's still attached to my personal page. The only way to do it is to start a new page, and me post on the original to go like the new page.

Below is what I believe will be the result of what just happened. I know that because he is royally PO'ed right now, any letter I send him, he is going to crumple up, and file in file #1. He said to me last night, "I knew you hadn't changed! Same old W."

Can someone enlighten me a little more?

"Unless plan A leaves the wayward s spouse with the impression that returning home is an attractive choice, separation can become permanent. So before implementing plan B, you want to be sure that the last thing your spouse remembers about you is the care and thoughtfulness you offered in plan A. That way, the separation can help create, "absence makes the heart grow fonder."

Yes, this is true. Before you go into Plan B, you should avoid all love busters and tell him that if he ends his affair you would be willing to create a great marriage with him.

You ARE avoiding love busters, right?

You have no idea what he will do with your plan B letter. You must send it so he knows that you are offering him a path back *IF* he meets certain conditions. AS the affair crumbles, he will remember the things in your letter.

This sounds to me like you did a pretty good plan A! He will remember that when you go into Plan B.

I'm doing my best, but quite honestly, he is extremely extremely angry because of what happened yesterday, and he won't listen to me. Add to it what happened today, and I don't believe his anger will go away. He is a very angry man right now.

Yes, he is angry because you interfered with his affair and ruined his fantasy. That is great!! And just think, when you go into Plan B, the only target of his anger will be the OW with you out of the picture.

As long as you are hanging around, he can blame you for his troubles instead of looking at himself.

I have witnessed HUNDREDS of exposures over the years. HUNDREDS. I have only seen *ONE* that did not make the WS angry. It was because he absolutely didn't give one CRAP. Every WS is angry about exposure. The more angry, the harder the blow you inflicted!

So Melody, how would you suggest this be approached, because he is so very angry, nothing I say will matter. She is the one in his life, she will be there forever.......in his head......he's going to marry her he said......and I don't know how to approach this letter.

I do think it's a bad sign for him though, when the lawyer even rolls her eyes, and snickers when she hears that's who the affair is with.

You need to accept the fact that nothing you say will matter and has not mattered through any of this. You only have control over yourself. That is all.

The goal of Plan B is only to remove yourself from his circle of abuse. Hanging around as an "option" has caused you enormous emotional pain and has made you look less attractive to him.

The Plan B letter is telling him you are taking back control of your life and he is not to contact you in any way, shape or form unless it is through your designated intermediary.

So, approach the letter in the normal way. Send it to him or drop it off at the restaurant.

Hi Ginger, I caught up on your thread tonight and you are doing amazing. No matter what happens, YOU my dear will always be able to KNOW down to your soul that you truly did to everything that you could to save your marriage!

As far as the OWs Mom "dying" (aren't we all?), how would your speaking THE TRUTH to this Mother in any way make you a bad person? Do you truly believe that?

This woman deserves to know the truth about her daughter, whom she very likely loves, and so will probably choose to try to guide her daughter away from evil and a surely lonely life.

I don't think that you can afford to fail telling the TRUTH to this woman, who may possibly be the most effective exposure target out there.

Are there any sample Plan B letters that a person can build off of?

One of the reasons your "Plan A" was so ineffective is because you weren't fighting against the affair so he had no reason to stop. "Plan A's" like that can go on for YEARS with no change. It seemed like you were actually COOPERATING with his plan of destruction, which dragged this out and allowed it to become more entrenched. Another problem is that he is a serial cheater and has never learned from his mistakes.

However, your exposure dealt a huge blow to the affair so there is a small hope.

Sample Plan B letter, from SAA (revised edition) pages 77-78:

My Dearest __________,
I apologize to you for my part in creating an environment that helped make your affair possible. I foolishly pursued my goals without understanding my responsibility to meet your most important emotional needs. I was not there for you when you needed me the most and we are now both suffering for my mistake. [Add your willingness to address other complaints that the unfaithful spouse may have communicated prior to the affair.]

I am willing to avoid the mistakes I've made in the past and create a new life for both of us that will meet your needs. But I cannot do that until you end your relationship once and for all. Living with you under these conditions has been the most painful experience of my life, and I can no longer endure it.

Until your affair ends, and you are willing to follow a plan of reconciliation with me, I will avoid seeing you or talking to you. Our friends, ________, have agreed to help make arrangements for you to see our children on schedule that is mutually convenient. They will provide transportation. If you want to communicate about the children or any other matter, it will have to be through them.

I ask that you respect my decision to separate from you th is way. You must know about the suffering I have endured because of your relationship, and I simply cannot be with you any longer knowing that you are together. I still love you but I cannot see you under these conditions.

As soon as you are willing to permanently end your relationship, follow precautions to avoid absolutely any contact with the other person, and join me in a plan to restore our relationship, I will be wiling to discuss our future together with you.

I hope that we will be able to rebuild our marriage some day. I want us to be able to meet each other's emotional needs and to avoid doing anything to hurt each other. We can build a new lifestyle together in which everything we do makes us both happy. Then there will never be a reason for us to be separated. I want to be your best friend, someone who is always there for you when you need me. And I want you to be my best friend.

I cared for you when we married and I continue to care for you right up to this day. But I cannot be with you or help you as long as you are in this relationship.

With all my love,
(signed)

This letter should be delivered by your friends to the unfaithful spouse, and a copy sent to the lover with a note at the bottom saying:

I love ______ with all my heart and am willing to do whatever it takes to make her happy. I will wait for that chance.

The OW pulled her FB page offline, and no one will speak to me about her anymore. I don't know that I could even figure out who the mother is. Either way, whatever happens, it is not something I am comfortable doing, and I will not do it. I respect the elderly to much. I called H dad yesterday, and he said to me, "I don't mean any disrespect, I care about both of you, but I am 70 years old, I'm in bad health, I'm on lots of medications, and the last thing I need to effect my health is to get in the middle of this."

I just can't bring myself to do it.

Thank you Melody.

Sometimes thw dying words of a loving elderly relative can change the course of someone's life for the better

Did you have your recorder on? This is why it was recommended that you get one... so that you have proof that WH is bullying you.





Were you there when this went down? Did the officer really tell YOU that you would be fined?

You need to call the sheriff and ask why they did not protect you when you had already brought the situation to their attention the night before.



That is your WH's plan. To get you to go back to enabling his affair.

Be strong Ginger.

I think this is very, very disrespectful to the elderly and it also implies that something other than the AFFAIR would be the source of the upset. Affairs and otherwise bad behavior UPSET parents. That is not the fault of the messenger.

I am sorry to hear your father in law cares nothing about his son or your marriage, but that is most certainly not the reaction of a caring parent. Most parents DO CARE. We have had many "elderly" parents intervene and effectively persuade their grown children to stop their affair.

You are missing a CRITICALLY important exposure for no other reason than your wayward husband has bullied and cowed you into silence. You won't ever win that way!

e]
Obviously he does not care about his son. What kind of a parent says he doesn't want to get involved when his own child is making dreadful, self destructive choices? A parent who doesn't care, thats who...

It is a huge mistake to ASSUME that the OW's mother is just as callous and uncaring as your FIL.

The Police department does not have the authority to fine you for emails.
That is protected by the first Amendment of in the Bill of Rights: Freedom of Speech.
If the police threatened to fine or imprison you then contact a civil rights attorney for a multi million dollar lawsuit or contact the ACLU.

More likely your husband TOLD you the city would fine you for sending emails.

Did you have your recorder on? This is why it was recommended that you get one... so that you have proof that WH is bullying you. [/quote]

He texted it to me. But he spun the story so the police believed him, that I was trying to hurt myself. Like he cares.





Were you there when this went down? Did the officer really tell YOU that you would be fined?

[/quote]

No, and I've learned not to believe him. The things he told me last night were so hurtful. Especially to tell me a customer called me selfish. He's lying to cover his butt.

I do believe this to be true. He's trying to deflect.

I have such a soft spot for the elderly, I'm sorry, I know it may be a risk, but please respect my choice. I've seen a picture of her, and she does look very frail. I could not live with myself if something happened after my interactions with her, because whether it was my fault or not, you can guarantee they would hold it against me.

One of his excuses was because he had done something in his past that he was not proud of, and felt it hypocritical to be telling his son he was wrong. Don't agree with it, but I have to respect his choice.

That is a huge miss for absolutely no valid reason. And I thought they told you she was dead? Of course they will hold every interference against you, that is not a legitimate reason to miss such an opportunity.

The reasons you give make no sense so I have to conclude they have scared you into submission. If there is nothing wrong with their affair, what could possibly be wrong with telling her mother?

I would strongly suggest you expose to the OW's mother. That is a critical exposure that shouldn't be skipped for frivolous reasons.

I suspected he was probably wayward just like his son. I could think of no other explanation for his callous and uncaring response.

]
With all due respect, that is an excuse. A poor one at that.

You say you have a soft spot for elderly and infirm parents.
Fine.
Know that you can let it ride and in the future perhaps regret having not tracked down and exposed to OW's mom.
Such is life.

Don't think that there is anything special about your H's reaction though to being exposed. He is so very text book wayward that we all relate. We have all seen it and felt the horror you are feeling ourselves. It WILL eventually settle down.

File for separation. I believe you can do so yourself at a county courthouse. Ask the lawyer if so and where you would do it. There are people there who will guide you in how to fill the form out.

You must now turn to protecting your assets.

Assets since you are joint owners of a business.

Save yourself and maybe in the future the marriage can be reclaimed.

Filing and Plan B are your best bets right now.

Protect your assets and your sanity and don't try to outguess anyone else.

Folks, I need some serious help with interpreting this. I received a very disturbing call tonight from my friend at the restaurant. She has finally reached her limit, and she is done. 3 staff members literally walked out tonight, not including her, but 2 of our cooks, plus our dishwasher, and my H did not pay anybody their pay. For our Friday night Fish Fry, we had quite a few customers walk out, due to the over 1 1/2 hour delay in getting food out.

My H has not been at the restaurant all week, he went in for about 45 min when the staff begged him to come in to help them. He is staying with OW. OW has tried to take over my position at the restaurant, but none of the staff respects her, she is mean to them.

Last night I guess the OW called the police on ME, after the Exposing to her friends. Except what happened is she had a warrant out for her arrest, and they went after her, and arrested her. My H took $500 out of the till to bail her out.

My friend said that 2 weeks ago, my H was literally crying at the restaurant, saying the OW is a mean drunk whore. My H never cries.....NEVER!

She said that when my H told the girls that he had left me, that he confided in them that he only used OW to get away from me, thinking I would leave him. This is the one I struggle with the most, especially after he so willingly took divorce off the table, and telling his sister we were only separated, after he told all the staff we were divorcing. I don't know if I should believe this one, or not. He had already proven himself to be good at lying, but I don't know if the reason is true or not. We had our issues, but they are nothing compared to what he is going through now. NOTHING!

My friend said that my H is scared of this OW, and he is in to deep, way over his head. He is not ordering supplies, things at the restaurant are running low, and he doesn't care. He told one of the girls he didn't care anymore, he could just get his old job back.

I believe this has nothing at all to do with me, the OW, or anyone else but my H, and the restaurant. I have seen the changes in him for the last year. I think he had become so overwhelmed, and it progressed, and the issues we were having, mounted on top of everything made it seem much worse.

I now believe that H's scary phone call to me last night was because OW was there, making him act that way to me. My friend said she noticed that once before as well with something he had said. He told her, "I will be with OW until she pisses me off." He then called her back, and said "I retract that statement, I will be with OW for as long as she'll have me."

I don't now what's going on. I think this is a cry for help of some sort that has been going on for the last year, and escalating to this point when he started the affair.

Another fear I have is that my friend said the OW is doing drugs, and possibly H has gotten himself involved with that. I don't know. I tend to believe that this woman is slowly building up control over him.

He is so bitterly angry towards me, and then I hear all of this, I just don't know what to think. I don't know if I completely opened up to him what would happen, especially after the Exposing, I don't think he'd let me in.

I'm fearful for him, and have been worried about something like this for a long time.

He is following the wayward script to the letter.

File for a legal separation and IMMEDIATELY ensure that you protect ALL of your marital assets.

The money in YOUR joint account just bailed the tramp out of jail.

Yes, $250.00 of that was You paying to bail her out.

Do you see what will happen to the rest of your funds.

The business is dead and is NOT going to survive and all of your assets will be used to try to keep it afloat for a few weeks longer, but the end is inevitable.

It is a LLC, so the corporation will properly need to discharge it's debt in bankruptcy court.

1. Protect your assests by withdrawing them all immediately.
2. File for legal separation.
3. Get an IM to deal with any and all messages from your WH.
4. Send him your Plan B Letter.
5. Change your e-mail address and phone number so tbat be can not bypass your IM and initiate contact with you.
6. Once he advises your IM that he will join you full on in a program for marital recovert, then your IM can let you know.

Ignore and eliminate ANY contact or information about or from your WH.

Doctor, Doctor..... It hurts every time I do this.

Well, then stop doing that.

LTL

You don't need to interpret any of that.

Would you go into a Bar at closing time and try to interpret what some marble mouthed drunk was attempting to say?

LTL

All the more reason to protect her!

I remember thanking God my elderly grandmother was dead when I exposed. Thinking it would kill her. She was a Christian woman who'd raised nine children, dozens grandchildren and great grandchildren happily. She would never understand her precious grandson in law sleeping with his best friends widow - my best friend, right?

Wrong. My mother was aghast at my attitude. My grandmother had once upon a time risked her family for her OWN affair and my grandfather won her back magnificently. In gratitude she became a loving matriarch and gave him the family of his dreams.

My mother said it was a SHAME she couldn't help. "She would have been your greatest ally".

This woman likely has far more life experience than you and deserves to know about her nearest and dearest, they are her life's work and if she is dependent on them - needs to know who to trust for her own protection.

Time and time again the unsuppotive exposure targets turn out to be wayward themselves. Ones who still have the secret and never recovered. They do tend to pass these behaviours on too. My FiL was the exact same.

Nothing at all to do with his health.

You don't need health to speak your disappointment.

I think one observant poster pointed out that the story re OWs mother keeps changing from dead, dying, to born again.

Waywards feel guilty and deeply depressed (weeping is not uncommon at all though they show their hard side to the BS) throughout the A and they tend to squirm at the idea of people knowing long before exposure happens. It's their greatest dread.

She doesn't want her mother to know - hence the spin about her. And I'd be willing to bet her reason has nothing to do with her mother's health.

I'm so pleased you have a great lawer.

Exposure is first priority.

Plan B (and legal, financial protection) is second.

She pulled her FB page, and no one will talk to me about her anymore, they don't want to get involved. I don't know the mom's name, but I will try to keep digging. I have one more source who may tell me, and will check with him.

I'm so thankful for this forum. To hear all of your explanations about this behavior makes much more sense now. Is there ever a point at which you can tell they are getting close to being ready to end it, and have had enough of the A and lies?

The account is pretty much depleted right now. I'm going to wait till Monday, the day he does the deposits......possibly Tues if he's feeling lazy enough......and as soon as the deposits go in, and all the CC transactions are deposited as well, I will go pull half. I have a call into my lawyer, but she doesn't have an assistant right now, so all I can do is wait for her to return my call to make the appointment.

He is going to be at the house here on Tues and Wed working on fixing the garage. I'm going to make sure I am out of the house, and away for both days. I am going to have my plan B letter done, and ready for him to have on Wed, his last day here.

The one thing he said that was most concerning to me, in my other post, was that he said he used OW to get away from me. This one really hurt me, because our relationship between he and I was not that awful. Is it safe to say this was all part of his lies?

She didn't pull her FB page! ANOTHER fricken lie from H!!!

If his lips are moving.... Even if he were to say 'I love you' at this stage it would be a lie. His entire being serves the A.



Get a PI to find her if you have to. It's worth any money - running a gold digger off will pay for itself.

They have been gaslighting you for ages into believing that her mother is no help to you. Literally a dead target. Why would they do that unless she is actually a bullseye target?

They (sorry) are both experienced waywards who know how to protect the A from exposure.



Typical script. It relieves his conscience and tears you down. Unless you've been holding him hostage at gun point I think it's safe to say he didn't need a drunk goldigger's help to get away.



Think of it as being a cocaine high - false euphoria. He knows she's fake happiness but she's always willing to play fantasy and give him that high.

It gets harder the more that real life (exposure) intrudes. He (a hopeless addict) will never 'get ready' or start to assess the affair as being worthless while it has him in its icy grip (forever), but nevertheless the highs are fewer and far between. More fights, less fantasy. He is just as much in need of a hit - he just isn't getting them.

You won't see anything good from him until she is well out of the picture and he's gone through a full withdrawal.

Even after withdrawal he remains vulnerable to an A restart forever - if any contact with her is allowed.

So now you can find OW's mother. You need to talk with her. Any caring mother would want to know if her daughter was wrecking another family. Why do you think the waywards are trying so hard to keep you from telling her.


Why, why, why do you keep listening to your WH and believing anything that he says? You are making poor decisions based on lies from a LIAR. Why?

Are you going to be able to stop believing a liar or are you going to let him manipulate you forever?

Be smart Ginger.

I wrote this in 2011. Others here were saying it long before that! The 'Never take the Word of a Wayward' thread I started with this post has many examples of people who heard the same lies over and over.

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2549782&page=7

Do focus on your finances and your assets right now.
File legal seperation (or divorce)
And count the restaurant as dead.

Put your love for H aside and protect your future.

This is not going to shoot you in the foot or show lack of love for him or commitment to your marriage.

It will send the message that you are of value and that you are a quality woman and wife.

In order to understand your husband's mentality, you should compare him to a falling down drunk. Truly. He is just as high on his affair as an alcoholic is on alcohol. If a drunk alcoholic told you that he "used alcohol to get away from his wife" as an excuse to drink, wouldn't you laugh? Well, you need to just laugh at this nonsense. If your husband wanted to get away from you, all he had to do was leave!

In the meantime, go to the OW's Facebook page and COPY all of her contacts and paste them into a text doc for safekeeping. Find her mother!!

Indiegirl, that is AWESOME!!! Thank you for sharing!

I am slowly getting stronger as I go on here, and learn. I have reached the point where I am angry, and PO! Maybe it took me longer than some, but I can't change that. I am truly beginning to see how this works for him, and why things happen, with help from everyone here. So grateful for your experience, I would be a total basket case without it, and not able to move forward.

Unfortunately, I can't reach my lawyer until she calls me back, but I know what I need to do, and I promise, I will do it. Someone mentioned one of those DIY legal separations, but I feel more comfortable speaking with my lawyer first.

The one thing I feel bad about right now, and only this one thing, is that whatever money I take will effect our staff. But, I can't deal with that guilt, HE did this.

And yes, I do have value, and I am an amazing woman! His loss right now! You certainly won't find my butt in the bar, drinking myself ugly till I can't even function!

I'm searching through her kids pages too. The OW doesn't have any descriptions on her photos, so I don't know who they are. The one photo I did find, all it says is "mom".

How do I go about finding a legal detective in our area?

Thank you for the explanation Melody.

Just read this on the thread I posted to you.




I write this to underline how vulnerable you are - the affair needs you to be its punching bag. You write about feeling discarded, like an old rug (I felt like an unwanted pet) but it's actually far worse than that. They never totally discard you. They will show up at your door and blame you for any discord or unhappiness between them two.

You need SUPPORT from your exposure cavalry, shooting down your attackers for you, and you also need ESCAPE in the form of Plan B.

Knowing he is not really your husband, but an alien mind takeover won't make it hurt less. You are in the habit of believing him when he speaks and on some level will doubt yourself whenever he attacks you.

Don't fear Plan B it is amazing and life changing.

Found one. Waiting for a call back.

indiegirl, the info you shared describes me to a "T". You always have such great info.

I don't fear Plan B, not at all. I will welcome the peace and quiet. I just fear the days when he is here working on the garage. I have to be out of my home, my comfort, knowing he is here, alone. He broke his way into the room in the barn yesterday, but I don't know what he took, the boat motors are still there, along with the wood he wanted. He took the boat without communicating with me, and the officer just let him take anything he wanted, saying it's "marital property". I get that, but shouldn't we both be in agreement?

I am going to load up the most valuable things, put them in my horse trailer, and bring them down to the neighbors. I don't trust him not to take, take, take. If he would do it by communicating with me, and he and I deciding what we each get........different story completely.

This won't work. He shouldn't be hanging around if you are in Plan B. How long will it take for him to finish the garage?

I am the one who mentioned you can file for legal sep at a court house in the family law dept.
Yes. Talk to a lawyer first about the best way to do that.
But, you can do it to save money.
A lawyer doesn't need to bill you time for filling it out or filing it if you go yourself.
There are, as far as I have seen, people at the court house in the filing area to help you go through the steps.
The plus to doing it is that once it is filed, your H is messing with the law if he runs up more debt and you can legally extract yourself from the restaurant debacle sooner rather than later.

She was planning to go into Plan B on Wednesday, after he's finished his few days cleaning out stuff.

Read this thread on Plan B preparation.

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2482787

Ginger, are you certain he will be done with the garage next week? Because once you go into Plan B, it will be important that he is not hanging around.

Also, since you are his wife, he can't put the house on the market without your signature. Does he believe otherwise?

You know I missed this bit. Really hilarious if you think about. To a wayward, their right to secrecy is like oxygen. They couldn't do half of what they do without it. Who would sleep with a married man if they had to go tell their mother about it afterwards?

They get genuinely outraged and honestly believe the police and courts will force other people to keep their secrets. Whatever nutjobs!!!!!!

But she gets arrested herself because her moral compass is THAT broken!!!!!

Just waltz off into your Plan B sunset now my dear. Leave them to enjoy each other's drama.

I'm not sure, Melody, but if I had to venture a guess, knowing how lazy and procrastinating he's been with everything else lately, I'd say a good month if not more. The insurance only gives 180 days to get it done, and we got the check about 45 days ago. I know that I do not want him here.

The amount they gave was based off of a quote given by the construction company he chose.......a customer of the restaurant. The deal was, H was going to help him do it, so the construction company wasn't going to have to pay any employees. I am going to contact that construction company, I know him well, and talk to him.

The other thing I need to speak with the lawyer about, the check from the claims department for the garage damage was nearly $7,000., if he is going to do it himself, I need to know if any left over money is to be split between us.

I am making a "to do" list, and have included this for next week. Thank you!!

Yes, I am aware he cannot sell without my signature, but what it will come down to is how long we can continue to make house payments. I know he will be able to go back to the job he had before the restaurant, so he better get his butt in gear, and get on that. I know he will slack though. I know the boss well, can I message him, and tell him to contact my H to speed it up?

No, there is no way he will be done with the garage in 2 days. Not him alone working on it. I need to call the construction company, and speak to them.

I know, isn't that just to good! I laughed so hard!

I do already have my IM, and he has agreed to it. I chose my uncle, because I felt H would be a bit more restricting as far as any crap he may try to say, vs to a woman. My uncle is very firm, and will do a very good job.

I contacted the owner of the construction company, who is a friend, and explained the situation to him. I explained that I'm not comfortable with H being here, and that my main concern is for the garage work to be done as quickly as possible. He is going to contact H, and work out a time to get this done quickly, he will get back to me in the next couple days he said.

Wouldn't this also be considered another exposure, too???!!!

You are not entitled to keep excess funds from an insurance claim payout. That would be insurance fraud.

The negotiated settlement claim was based on the contractors sworn writted proposal.

Typically, most HO-3 homeowners policies allow for ACV and RCV payouts. The ACV, Actual Cash Value after depreciation, is what you get if you do not complete the repairs and do not submit the final Certificate Of Completion, swearing the job is done.

The RCV, Recoverable Cash Value is the Held Back funds, which insurance lingo calls Depreciation. That dollar amount is only legally payable when the work is completed.

You may have a different policy than a standard HO-3 Policy, such as a Farm policy, since you mentioned a barn though.

It is VERY Easy to request an extension from the claims department to allow for additional time to get tbe work done.

Another point, the longer you are allowed to delay, then their pricing database gets updated with increased regional pricing and you then request that the claim be paid out to the future current timeframe to pay for the work.

I WOULD NOT LET THE WH SET FOOT ON THE PROPERTY TO DO THAT MONTH LONG PROJECT.

A true contractor can accomplish that in much less time.



LTL

Good point, it's likely he will drag it out so as to keep a fingertip hold on her.

I would send him an email saying he has two days maximum to clear things out because you need to reorganize it. That way you have it in writing that you gave him an opportunity.

Part of your prep might mean having some people round to clear anything he's left there after deadline. Get anything he could reasonably describe as his (stuff you don't want to be tripping over anyway) and send it to a storage facility or relative - You can tell him where in the letter.

By the way, thank you for posting that the POSOW was arrested when She contacted the Police.

That made my night. I was in pain from having just had 2 teeth extracted and couldn't sleep and that news made my night go more smoothly.

LTL

When Plan B goes into effect put alarms and locks on your garage. If he complains to your IM she should say she's been told the lawyers are sorting that stuff out.

He obviously doesn't know that you have made any withdrawals of your portion of the marital assets yet, does he?

When he finally figures it out, tell him to speak with your attorney about it.

There. No More Drama.

But, he will explode. Count on it.

LTL

That is hilarious!!

Food for thought on the legal separation. 1. My attorney & Dr. Harley explained to me that from a financial standpoint it is better to just file for D instead of legal separation because if this would end up in D you are paying first for the separation then their are even more costs involved to make it a D. 2. Also Dr. Harley explained that going through the separation first will drag the whole process out a lot longer if you ever decide he will not follow the MB program. 3. If your H turns himself around and will NEVER see or talk to the OW again and practice EP and the rest of the MB plan the D can be delayed or dropped. Because he is a repeat offender of infidelity a significant amount of time (whatever the veteran posters recommend) should pass before a D filing is dropped. 4. I had a former employee that opted for the DIY D and it ended up costing her more because ultimately she had to secure an attorney anyway. Not to mention with the assets you have and a business I think it would be to great of a risk.

Since she doesn't have an assistant, if you have to, go to the attorneys office and camp out there until she sees you and have make sure you have the retainer in hand.

Ditto X 1,000,000

I also think being served with a D would smack some of the cheek out of his chops.

I will be back on this afternoon. I'm overwhelmed, and just plain exhausted, I need to take a little me time to breath, and then figure out the next first step.

I did call back the contractor, and ask him not to contact H......I don't want him here, and he said he won't call him till he hears from me again.

At this point, anything will knock the chops off of H......he thinks I'm to timid, and won't grow a set of balls! Ha....he's got a surprise coming then.

I am late to this party and honestly haven't read the entire thread carefully but just want to add a comment for anyone who might be reading or will read this later. And for you too, Ginger.

The reaction of the people you expose to is not really that indicative of whether your exposure was successful or not. It really isn't.

What is a much better measure of how effective your exposure is if in the infidels are angry and upset that you exposed. The rants and threats of calling police is a huge indication that you dealt a massive blow to the affair. When the wayturds don't care, that's when you know it wasn't really effective.

Likewise, the fact that they really really don't want you to contact OW mother tells me she would be a GREAT exposure target. I know you are working on it, but just want to add encouragement to do whatever you can to find her ASAP.

Can you also post OW on one of those cheaterville sites? I say go for it and add as much turmoil as possible to this affair as possible.

I agree with Melody. This garage thing isn't going to work.

You need to wrap up your exposures and get into Plan B very soon. This isn't going to work.

^^^^ yes.

Please read this again and take it to heart.

You're welcome! Glad to help!!

Since the garage is damaged, and it probably won't be fixed for a while, since he's not allowed on the property, the only thing covering the garage door itself is a tarp. It's been such a huge inconvenience! He could easily get in.

Thank you for the info. When I called the contractor, his concern was that the quote he put out was underpriced by the insurance claims assessor, by like $700. It was quoted with my H helping the construction owner, I don't know why he did it that way, but he did. So to get said construction guy to do it for less, I am going to run into problems.

But I am going to call my insurance company and discuss things with them to see what can be done.

I'm not letting him in here, I don't trust him. He took alot of stuff from the garage, decor for the OW.....and his apparently....home. He took our boat too. He had told me he wanted the mower, but he didn't take that. He has no moral compass right now to not take just whatever he feels like taking. He wants it, he's taking it.

He doesn't care about whatever else he has here, and honestly, it's nothing of value. It's the last thing on my list to deal with, there's other things I have to do quickly before then. He already has his clothes, and all the paperwork for the business, that's all he cares about. After that, I can pack his things up, and have the IM tell him where they will be.

I find it so odd, yesterday when he was here, he was harassing me about the business FB page. He wants it, he said he has to get posting on it, and get it going again, like it's my fault the business is going under because I haven't been active on that page. And now, I'm just laughing, after finding out from my friend that he hasn't even been there to care about the restaurant at all. Jerk! You are done controlling me!

No, he doesn't. That's what happens when you don't balance your bank account books! And yes, he will explode.

Great info, thank you!!

Thank you for this, it continues to confirm that I did the right thing. I was getting grief from his brother that I was doing it to destroy the business, they just don't understand that he has already done that himself, without my help.

I am working on things to try to get them together quickly, and no, I will not allow him to be here.

Your contractor friend does not understand how the insurance claims process works best to properly compensate the homeowner for the full and proper value of the insurable loss.

The claim can get reopened at any time and supplemented for proper payments.

The insurance carriers try to baffle everyone with a very comprehensive cost database estimating program, (Which Is Managed By Insurance Board Members), and say this is all they can pay.

The actual Policy, which is a Legal Contract, states that they will pay the necessary and reasonable costs to bring the insured back to whole again, prior to the insurable incident.

One way to Maximize your claim to the proper amount, is to hire a Public Adjuster, who will pretty much guarantee substantially increasing the claim amount payable, even after their 10% fee is calculated in.

I typically find that I can increaseea damage claim from a minimum of 20% to 200% just by correctly identifying and including missed line items from the written scope of loss.

Look into it.

I have some nationwide PA friends I network with that could steer you in the right direction.

BUT..... The bottom line main point, is that you do NOT want your and his POSOW stepping foot back on YOUR Marital Residence.

Btw, a legal separation is about as time consuming and costly as filing for an actual divorce.

You can always slow the divorce down, or put a halt to it, IF you are the one to file the initial suit for dissolution of marriage. The Respondent never has that option, but the Plaintiff does.

LTL

I have some nationwide PA friends I network with that could steer you in the right direction.

Yes, please. My H always handled things like these, and I would appreciate any help I can get.....gladly!!

BUT..... The bottom line main point, is that you do NOT want your and his POSOW stepping foot back on YOUR Marital Residence.

I feel the same way! I do not want him here!!


You can always slow the divorce down, or put a halt to it, IF you are the one to file the initial suit for dissolution of marriage. The Respondent never has that option, but the Plaintiff does.

I like this idea. As long as it can be delayed, or stopped at any point of my choosing, I am good with that. Would a D vs a LS be something that would deter him from returning if he ever did turn himself around?

So, at this point, my next step would be to speak with my lawyer to get the ball rolling with the D, restraining order against POSOW and H, and then contact him, letting him know he is not allowed on the property.

Then hopefully by then I will have the mothers name, and contact her.

Then send out the Plan B letters? I found her address too, it's 4 PO Boxes over from mine in the same PO! Disgusting!

Then I am fully in Plan B, and my IM will deal with everything, only letting me know what I need to know.

What State are you in?

LTL

Wisconsin (west central side of the state.)

Thoughts on this order for my plans? Yes, no? Any other suggestions?

Sounds like a good plan.

Consider if you need to further expose OW. I think you did a good FB exposure? How about one of the online sites too - she will be exposed to whoever googles her that way. Sounds like you'd be doing a public service.

Have your IM read the training thread.

http://forum.marriagebuilders.com/ubbt/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2264548

I would change your PO box - you don't want to be running into her in Plan B. Is that not a bit of a spooky coincidence?

Some OW stalk the BW in order to get dirt/ take over her identity by copying her.

I think moving my mail is a great idea! I never thought of that. Technically, I get up early to go get my mail, and I'm sure OW is still sleeping off the drunk from the night before. But, this way I can move it closer to my home, and not have to go that way at all, and risk seeing either.

I deactivated my FB page when the daughter was trying to friend me. I did put it back up a couple days later because my friends were contacting me wondering if something was wrong with me, because H is telling everyone I'm going crazy. I think it may be better just to pull it down for a longer period of time.

I would leave it up in case anyone has any questions about the affair. You don't need to give the appearance that you have anything to hide.

What about the OW mother? Have you contacted her yet?

I have tried to find info on my own, but can't. No one will talk to me about her anymore. I have a call into the investigators, but still waiting for a call back.

Do you know the mother's name? Have you tried doing a search on people finder.com or intelius.com?

Everything is going to hinge on things going smoothly tomorrow before I'll feel better.

I had changed the locks on the doors of a separate room in the barn where we keep a few things. I see he broke into that room, pulled the handle hard enough to pull it from the frame. He took the boat, so I imagine he was after the motors in that room. The sheriff must have pulled up before he could take any of it. So I'm not putting anything past him when he's angry like this.

When the sheriff was here, he seemed more on H side, and not very sympathetic to the fact that H had threatened me the night before, and I was somewhat scared of him. I live alone, and you never know how far a mans rage can push him, especially when he isn't really in control of his own "normal" emotions right now.

Ginger,

As you can see, I have been "around" for a few years and lurked here for quite some time before I registered.

When I saw the date of your first post and then how many pages after that, I read through your thread. Not every page and every post, but every third page or so. Why? Because I KNEW the "in-between" after I read that you were going to expose!!

The denial, the anger, the "damsel in distress", the locks, threats, your guilt/wavering, etc. Textbook!

So, here's what I have to say to you: YOU ROCK!!

LTL posted to you the prediction of your WH's reaction to exposure as many others did, and advised how to handle, and you did. I have nothing more to add as all bases are thoroughly covered with this awesome group, so I am only posting moral support and major kudos for having the "lady-set" (also known as bravery) to do what you need to do to save your M and protect yourself both emotionally and physically.

As you move through the MB steps, know that the program is your very best shot at saving this marriage if you choose to. And, if not, this will be the healthiest path for YOU to take.

I am proud of you. Hold your head high as you move forward.

Heed the advice here from this incredibly brilliant group of people (new and vets), as these are real people that come from all sorts of places in life...the know of what they speak.

Prayers to you for the outcome of YOUR choosing.

I have been giving some thought to loading up the items I know he wanted in my horse trailer, and taking the trailer down to the neighbors.

Thoughts? Legal?

Thank you so very much surfer! Those words mean so much to me. As someone who has always relied on her husband to help her through the tough moments in life, this has literally felt like hell going through this. But the encouragement I get here is so valuable to me. It makes up for the grief I get outside of this group.

Black Raven: I just posted to support Ginger, and then read more posts...this one? tears. lol tears. I miss this place!!!!

Ginger, you copied and saved the OW's friends list from Facebook, correct?

Have you tried going to each one of the friend pages, and then looking at photos from there? When you look at the photos, also check the responses to those photos that will show on the top right. You might luck out there and find some other relatives. That is what worked for me. I found just one, and then viewed that person's photos and so forth until I had the whole family.

You are welcome! What I absolutely love about MB is the action plan. In fact, I wish I had MB-ers at work...we'd get a lot more done.

I read through a bit more, and I cannot express the strength of the woman who first posted versus the Ginger today. In just a few days, just look at how far you have come with taking control of your own future, regardless of the outcome.

You'll get a lot of people that are near and dear to you that will question and disagree with your methods, and that's natural when one is emotionally tied to both parties (or just one). Brush it of with a kind heart. In the words of some guy..."forgive them for they know not what they do."

Some will understand later, some will now, and some may never. That will define who will be a part of your future by YOUR standards. That's why Plan B is so important. Hold the love you have, stay kind, but firm. It's not easy. MB-ers know it's not easy. If you haven't yet, read through Piggly's thread one day. An, Indie's. That's only 2. And, the successes...

*stepping off soapbox.

You're doing GREAT. Not 100% sure if you are in a sound Plan B yet, but get thee an IM ASAP (if not)!

Yep, and also when you have a name on your FB toolbar (as if to search), don't enter the name, but set your cursor to the right of the name. Depending on privacy settings it'll show you "posts Surfer88 likes" or "posts Surfer88 commented on" for more search options.

Don't forget twitter. Google first and last name @twitter. Long shot, but if you find the person, they may link pictures posted on Instagram...annnnddd back to family names.

Well, I found out what town she is originally from, so I'm searching through the friends from that specific area, thinking they may be family too. She's been married so many times, I have no idea what her maiden name may be.

It's been a very hard road, but I just reached the point where I got tired of being the timid little pushover wife he expected me to be. He pissed me off. It was easy to grow a set after that.

Honestly, I've seen how ugly and threatening he has been now, and I don't like it at all. It scares me. This time has given me the time I needed to go back and really look at the relationship, and all the things he blames me for. Yes, I had fault, we both did. But I go back and see how he's controlled our relationship over the years, and how verbally insulting he could be. I think others always noticed it, but I don't think I did. I don't know if I could trust him again, or if I'd always be waiting for the next time to happen. I need to do a lot of soul searching going forward, and really take the time I need to heal, and decide what I want.

Surfer, not in Plan B yet.....hopefully after tomorrow, but I do have an IM.

Planning to be at the lawyers office when she opens tomorrow morning.

Good for you! Know this, and food for thought. Your WH fell off the marriage wagon. He can get back on, Honey. This site is to encourage and guide toward that...in this forum. I don't know if this can be recovered or not, but I hope it can.

You are doing everything you can as I see it. If not, our MB friends will help to re-direct. Trust the folks here as this is not a random fly-by-night site.

Oh, I definitely trust the folks here! Everything they've guided me through has been spot on. Even my sister commented how spot on things have been.

I will keep an open heart, but I feel he will continue to do what he has been doing....running from the embarrassment of what he did. It wasn't just me that he left, but everyone and everything at our business too. I feel that will prevent him from coming back. But, like I said, I have a lot of soul searching and healing to do, and if he did make the attempt, I would open the door to him, be open minded, and hear what he has to say.

Good, and one last for the night...we call it Gaslighting. Google that if you don't know the term (may have been referenced pages ago). Be sure that your not being gaslighted, but more importantly for where you are right now? Be sure to not gaslight yourself and your own story. Harsh, but you need to own your part.

Stay focused.

!

I did just look it up.....thank you for the info. What do you mean gaslight myself?

I have owned my faults right from the start, and apologized to him for those faults. Whether he was open to hearing them or not, I don't know, it was in writing, and not in person.

One thing I never did with him was play the blame game, I always felt I could only control me, and my faults. Only he could look deep within himself to realize what his faults are, but he's not ready to do that yet.

I have never been a person to walk away from or hide from my own mistakes. It's easier just to confront them head on when they've been brought to your attention. I looked deep within myself to ask myself what I could have done differently, and there was plenty that I could have definitely done different.

Yes but don't give thought to those things until you have a faithful partner to improve with. You did not get a vote in the A and your role in the relationship is all totally moot while the A is ON.

He could easily, easily have remained faithful, made a complaint and indicated that the complaint was marriage-ending serious.

He did not because it is actually just the A causing the problems.

Blaming an A on a BS is like saying you axe murdered someone because of a papercut.

I always enjoy reading your insights, indiegirl.

Marital property can be moved by either of you. In your case you can argue that you were worried because the locks were damaged and moved precious items to a more secure location. Unless you know that the trailer will not be visible, I think I would probably move them out of the trailer otherwise he may just break into it

My XH emptied the marital residence and took the entire contents including things I had inherited from my grandmother and put them in a storage unit in another country. Six years later I have yet to recover a single thing despite spending hundreds of thousands of dollars in legal fees. Definitely pre-empt him on this.

The big give away (I've learned) is that the complaints a man will make up during an affair are :1) vague--"you don't make me feel like a man." He couldn't explain how I emasculated him. I just did. 2) from years ago and you don't even do it anymore. "You got upset that you didn't do well when you played that sport." 3) Turning valid feelings of a past bad circumstance around on you-- "you were so upset that were in that bad job." 4) just patently crazy--"you waited three days to fold the laundry!!"

These things are to make you feel that you are a fault and to make you walk on eggshells ("what can I do better!! What can I do better!!!) in order to keep you in line while the affair goes on.

In Plan B you might gain more perspective on what you could have improved in the marriage. I for, example, felt very entitled to angry outbursts and while I didn't do them very often, I can see now how that is a love buster. HOWEVER (and this is a big however), my WH's independent behavior and willingness to gain at my expense were the real issues. He has poor boundaries that led to the affair and once he crossed some line in his head, he felt entitled to do whatever he wanted.

So, by all means reflect. You were in a marriage that had issues (we all were), but you didn't make him cheat. That is the REAL issue here and anyone with half a brain cell will see that.

Ok, I need help quickly with a decision. I got in this morn to see the lawyer, and going back in an hour. To file a restraining order for harassment is $3,000. I don't have that. To divorce is cheaper, but she said the judge will be the one to decide how far past 120 days the divorce will be set.

Will legal separation be better?

I'm so confused! Help!

Anyone?

You will be so glad you filed that restraining order. Can you bring down the price by doing some of the work yourself?

I have no idea what to do, but I will ask.

I'm waiting for H to make the deposit so I can withdraw half the account, but he hasn't done it yet. The restraining order will take everything I have.

I would focus on the legal separation or divorce, safeguarding your assets right now is top priority I think.

Once you are in Plan B, if he threatens or harasses you get the police involved. I have been a domestic violence victim advocate in the past and we got OFP's all the time and it cost the victim who was being threatened nothing, so I'm not sure why you are having to pay for one.

What is OFP?

And at this point, which would be better, legal separation or divorce? I don't want a quickie divorce.

Ginger,

How is it that expensive? The actual filing should not be more that a couple of hundred at most. Is that just the retainer for the attorney?

Are there any rules of conduct that need to be followed when you file for divorce in your state? For example, there are rules in my state that he can't harass you, etc once you have filed. Then you can get a DV restraining order against him.

I would file for divorce rather than Legal separation. The filing fees are the same.

Sorry 'Order For Protection is what we obtain for a domestic violence victim. I don't know if RO's are the same or different but if you have a reason for filing for it, such as harassment or threats, I don't know why you have to pay for it. Hopefully someone with more experience with RO's can weigh in here?

If the 120 day divorce is not something you want, I would do a legal separation for now. Keep in mind though, that your chances of recovering a marriage with a serial cheater are very, very small (that is, truly recovering and creating an affair proof marriage, not just settling for crumbs waiting for the next shoe to drop). And if you did divorce you could still remarry if he was willing to do the program, we have some posters who have done just that.

Call another attorney this minute and ask them if it is in a reasonable price range. Doesn't sound reasonable to me.

cost of restraining order:
http://www.co.marathon.wi.us/Depart...mation/TemporaryRestrainingOrderFAQ.aspx

cost of divorce:
http://www.google.de/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCIQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.lowconflictdivorce.net%2FWisconsin-Family-Law-FAQ.shtml&ei=VghaVbnEFsOtswGQnoDQDw&usg=AFQjCNGesdqXliWLdbAxWppw-8AV8Ws_Tw&sig2=_MvcGJzfTY_dWsXfHBOBIg&bvm=bv.93564037,d.bGg&cad=rja

Are you sure the $3,000.00 fee is JUST for the Restraining Order, or Order Of Protection?

That seems as if it would encompass the Retainer Fee for the Filing of either Divorce or Legal Separation.

Contact a Womans Abuse Shelter. They will assist you.

The RO is a Very simple order to have granted, especially on a temporary basis and you can motion that up yourself ex-parte, meaning he does not have to even be present in court in many jurisdictions, just based on his threats and your fear of his behavior.

Call a Womans Shelter for advice and referrals.

LTL

Did you also inquire if your jurisdiction has a "Leveling The Playing Field" statute, whereby the spouse with the majority of the income must pay for the financially disadvantaged spouses legal costs and fees?

LTL

Filing for divorce is a Better option than separation.
Waywards just use separation as an excuse to cheat.

Also, contact the court Pro Se assistance department.

They will assist you with whatever forms need to be filled out.

Often times, a way to engage an attorney you like, is to sit through several divorce hearings in that specific court room and decide who seems like you would click with.

I have seen them offer better financial terms when approached in the court hallway after they get done with their current case.

You can also ask their current client what their opinion of their overall business practice is.

Did they represent them aggressively?
Were they open to the clients requests?
Did they keep their client informed with updates?
Do they promptly return phone calls?
Etc.....

LTL

OK. It probably isn't very expensive to have your lawyer send a fear of God letter warning them that any property assessments must be done through her and that any further in-person approaches, in any format but most particularly to the property, will be seen as harassment and dealt with accordingly.

I think that would probably work but also you could plan that any further calls upon you, you don't answer the door, call the police and then the RO probably would prove cost effective if they are that persistent.

As for separation/divorce it's up to you if you would rather save money or keep the marriage legal. It won't make any difference to recovery but if he wants to come back you'll need to remarry. Some people like the idea of a whole new marriage.

x 2

I would file for D. The 120 days is just a minimum not the time you will be divorced in. SInce you have a business, it will take waaaay longer than 120 days.

Don't pay her $3k for an RO. That doesn't even make sense to me and I have never heard an attorney charging for one like that. Are you sure the $3k isn't for the Retainer? You can file an RO with the police department. In my state, a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) is automatically issued.

Whatever you file, a Motion for Temporary Orders should be filed with it or ASAP. You need to ask for exclusive use of the marital home to keep WH off the property.

I just got home, the $3,000 is her retainer, and if at the end of my case, there is money left, it is refunded. I trust her, she is easy to work with.

We opted to go for divorce, and not the harassment restraining order, she didn't feel the judge would think there was enough there to warrant one.

She said this will protect me from harassment technically, make him responsible for paying his share, and keep him from being able to take things. But, this will not protect me from whatever happens at the restaurant. The only way to do that she said, was to work it myself, but that is just not possible. My H was the head cook, and without him, it will never be the same. I have no restaurant experience, and it would not be possible to afford to pay 2 cooks to replace him. Especially after the damage that has been done to the restaurant already because of his actions.

She said the judge will be the one making the decisions based on finances, and who pays, since I am not employed yet. I am actively looking for work though.

If you have exclusive use of the house, then you probably don't even need the RO against OW unless something else happens later. If WH can't step foot on the property then OW won't be coming over either...two birds, one 2x4. If she showed up to your house, you can call the police for trespassing and go from there. I would focus on getting the D paperwork filed and including an RO against WH.

A question I have, if he is served the D papers, can I still send him the Plan B letter?

Looks like we crossed posted before.

Yes you still send the Plan B letter. If anything the D filing adds teeth to the Plan B because he can see you are serious that you won't tolerate his affair and his bad behavior any longer.

She said there will be a meeting to discuss the contents of the divorce, what happens, and who gets what. Can I send the letter before that, or what would be best?

This is such a terrifying and confusing time for me.

The order he receives things doesn't matter.

I know you are anxious but don't think about how things appear to him. He has no brain! There are waywards who come out the other side of the fog who have NO memory of things they did or said.

As long as you protect yourself from a) contact/abuse and b) being cleaned out of cash - you are on plan.

As long as you don't lovebust - don't worry about how you appear That time, Plan A time, is over. You did an AMAZING Plan A, but it is not a good idea to give an addict a free pass with no conditions or consequences indefinitely.

Now it's time to get out of the hail of bullets and tuck yourself up cozy in your own tailor-made-for-you Plan B.

I don't think it matters much since WSs are in lalaland as Indie said.

When did the attorney say the Petition will be filed and he can be served? I would serve him at the restaurant.

ETA: Can you cite adultery as fault?

Hey lady!

I did ask about the affair/adultery effecting this, and she said there is "technically" a law on the books in our state, but it is never enforced, so don't lay any hopes on that at all.

He will be served today, but the restaurant is closed.

The real kicker for me, is that he will be served by the owner of his competition in the area! Another restaurant owner! LMAO!!

GREAT NEWS!!!! I just received the call for a second interview for the job I applied for at the local hospital. I had my first interview last week, and he said it would be a couple weeks before I'd hear from him if they were going to call my back. It hasn't even been a full week, and they called me back for tomorrow! Woot Woot!

Great! Good luck with the second interview, too!

Go get it. All your attention has to be on you now. Don't just survive, thrive

And do not go out of your way to let him know you may, or will be getting a job.

That information will come out during Discovery Motions, just as him having to be accountable for any Cash Withdrawals and "Under The Table" payments made to certain employees.

He will realize what a piece of work he wound up taking up with for his affair partner when everything comes crumbling down around them.

LTL

Yes, this is what I meant by the caution not to "gaslight" yourself. Don't second guess or for one second blame your faults (you mean you have a few? :)) for the affair. Indie already addressed, but wanted to clarify.

You may be scared and anxious, but never, ever second guess your actions.

I'll back out now so as not to clutter your messages at this time of action unless I have some valuable fact to add. Stay focused! You are doing great.

PS: glad the TPO $$ was addressed as that would be insane. In my state and town that they are handed out like jelly beans on Easter.

PS: great news on the job!!

Thank you everyone for the good wishes! I appreciate it, and I'm not nervous at all about this! I am positive I will nail this, and get the job..........and no way in HE** will I tell him!

So today, I did two withdraws from the account, the first was just over $3,200., and the second just over $1,500. I first took half of what was deposited from the CC charge deposits, and then he finally made the cash deposit, so I took half of that. Shortly after I took the second deposit, I got a call from the woman who had been helping me at the bank, and she told me checks were starting to come in. I said, oh well, it is not my problem, he will need to deal with it, and she said "OK, I just had to let you know."

Then, on top of what I took, without realizing what I was doing, he gave me $750 in the joint account, which I happily moved over to my individual account that he cannot access. It worked out way way better for me to have waited to do this today, than if I had taken half last week.

He is supposed to get served papers on Wed, there was a timing conflict that delayed him being served. But, that means he will still be here tomorrow working on the garage, and Wed. There is nothing I can do. I tried to give him an excuse that it doesn't work for me, but was promptly told, "I don't give a sh*t about your schedule." My lawyer told me to make sure I am home, and that I have someone with me as witness, so my mom is coming tomorrow to stay with me the rest of the week. She will be alone while I am at my interview, but he won't bother her. It's me he's upset with.

I find this truly heartbreaking. H will literally be losing everything he had, all at once, and he doesn't even realize it yet. The business is going to be lost, the respect and admiration he had from the customers is already gone, and he is losing his wife........along with half his funds he thought he had. I will never understand why he did this to himself, for some POSOW, and someone that is going to leave him when she realizes he is no longer her sugar daddy. I hope he can recover from this, but right now all I'm worried about is me.

I did have some very happy news tonight, from my friend at the restaurant. I asked her what our regular customers are saying, because all I hear is what H tells me, and it's never good. I'm selfish, they saw this coming from me, and bla bla bla. But my friend said to me, "if you only knew how concerned these people are for you, and how worried they are, it would warm your heart. They pull me aside, and ask me how you are doing, and send their best. They all stand up for you, and cannot believe what he has done to both of you." It made me feel happy inside for once, and loved. Warm fuzzies.

Surfer........please don't go into hiding.....I love your posts! They are always very positive, just like everyone else here!!

Little bit of anxiety today, waiting for H to show up. I'm hoping he doesn't realize what I've taken from the bank while he's here at the home the next two days.

My lawyer said to move everything I didn't want him to take, so last night I loaded up the horse trailer, and moved everything. I even moved the two ponies, I didn't want to have to be out doing chores while he was here, and have to worry about being trapped in the barn by an angry WS, if he discovered what I had done while he was here.

My mom is coming to stay with me also, so there will always be someone here while he is here.

Please help. I think he found out about the money from the bank. He is contacting me, trying to get me to talk with him. My lawyer is in court all day. He was supposed to come here today, but he's not here yet. I'm not in plan b yet.

He hasn't been served yet either.....there was a delay in court.

I would turn your phone off and go do something with a friend. If he doesn't choose to pick up his stuff, that's his fault.

It's not about his stuff in the house, he has what he wants. He found out about the money I took.

I would send him a text asking him what he wants? WS tend to be stupid and hang themselves...which can be good for you to have it in writing if he goes there. You don't have to reply back right away should he respond.

I've done that, and he won't tell me anything, he wants to speak to me in person. He said it will take 5 minutes.

Tell him you can't and go out. I would not meet anywhere with him alone. He has already lied about you to the police. He is unfortunately not safe for you. There is nothing he has to say to you in person that he couldn't text. If it was a safe topic or he had your best interest at heart, he would not leave you wondering.

Text him you are busy as your mother is coming over soon. That way he knows you will have a witness if he shows up and it may deter him coming over today all together. Do not leave your house.

Maybe add in that you will have to talk to him later just to buy time. When is your mother due to arrive?

I have to leave....my call back interview at 1:30.

Should I just ell him to speak with my attorney, or not till he's been served?

I wouldnt mention the attorney until he has been served.
At that point you should enter Plan B.
Can't you do as Black raven suggested?

Sorry, I was out running errands...

I would not tell him to contact your attorney. He will be served soon enough to find out. Do you have any male family members that live nearby?

Much luck on the interview.

No, no family close by, or friends that can come when I call. Not having support has been the hardest part of this.

I didn't tell him about my lawyer. I simply stated I didn't have time to speak to him today, that he could text me his request, but he refused. I said thank you, and I hope you have a good day. I then went quiet, while he texted non stop. It finally stopped thank goodness, but he said he'd be back tomorrow at 3 after speaking to his attorney.

He said he only needed 5 minutes, and he'd be civil. Ya....sure!

Keep all the texts.

Did he come over while you were gone?

How was the interview?

No, he didn't come over at all. I had told him I had company.

Interview went great, thank you for asking! The next step he said if they want to hire me is it goes into HR, and then some physical and background checks. He said possibly 2 weeks before I hear anything.

Ys, I am keeping all texts.

Nice @ the interview.

When is your mother arriving?

Have you seen the Divorce Petition? My lawyer had to get my approval before filing anything or sending anything to my then stbxWH. You want to make sure the documents don't have an error and cover everything you need them to.

Also, to control the cost of lawyer fees, don't piecemeal issues with her. Most attorneys charge in a minimum increment of 15 min so if you have questions and talk to her by phone don't call for one thing that will take 5 min...use your full 15 min if that is how your agreement is structured...and write down the dates and times you speak to her should you ever need to dispute the billing.

My mom is here now with me, she arrived this morning.

I did see the petition, and I hope I'm covering everything, I'm so new to this, but I really do trust her, she came highly recommended by more than one person. She is well aware of the situation with the home and business.

Thank you very much for the contact tips for the lawyer. I feel like fish out of water!

Until you enter Plan B.....if in contact with WH, be pleasant no.matter.what
he throws your way.
If he wants to discuss the money, say "I am protecting our financial situation."
Don't get into any elaborate conversations with him.

Even when you do go to Plan B, he may pop up here and there to get you face to face and you never, ever escalate into an argument. Never.

Be cool and calm facing him.

Even if you need to call police, say "You may not be abusive to me" as you call and get them over to protect you.

I think I did ok with that today, and I could tell he was trying to not push the anger with me to bad via text. But why can't it be discussed via text, why must he see me in person?

I'm feeling very uncomfortable, and uneasy. Not just his anger, or irrational behavior, but I've been warned she is doing drugs, and is just as unpredictable. I have no way to verify that, but I'm not feeling comfortable, and I will not put myself in a position to be face to face with him at this point.

Is it typical to be fearful of the situation like this with your WS?

Typical in many cases. Not all but many (after all, your WH is in a very bad place right now). He IS unreliable to you.

Pat yourself on the back.

You are doing Great!!!

I would suggest getting a VAR, Voice Activated Recorder to have on you at ALL times to record any potential conflict or aggressive confrontations.

There are also Apps that you can download for Free on your cell phone.

The one I use is called;
"Smart Voice"

Play with it and get used to it and Use It.

When you do speak with your lawyer, try to always have your questions written down and leave space for her answers.

The lawyer is Not your counselor. Avoid running up the minutes with her crying about any Woes Me and Why Is He Doing This To Me, type of conversations. Keep it strictly about legal business questions and answers.

LTL

Thank you reading and LTL. I appreciate it.

I do have a mini voice recorder, and will use it. I have had my questions typed out for my lawyer, but thank you again for the tip on time management with her. I'm gonna have to remember to keep that in the back of my mind when with her.

It's easy advice to give, but if you are not mentally and emotionally focused, it is pretty darned hard to do for yourself.

My attorney also was my business attorney and also my next door neighbor eventually. My 1st session was nothing but a balling pity party.

Learn from others experiences and save some money as a result.

The most expensive fee is the initial retainer and then after that, of any forensic accounting is needed for discovery.

LTL

I'm definitely trying to learn, I'm getting there, and appreciate the help tremendously!

I have been following your thread and so rooting for you. Although you may owe me a new keyboard after I spewed coffee all over this one laughing so hard at that crazed harlot calling the cops on exposure when she had a warrant out for her arrest. When you're done exposing her on cheater websites you can also add her to some "stupid criminal" websites!

I digress.

The reason he may want to speak to you in person instead of by text is because he knows you are much easier to manipulate in person. Look at how you have quickly doubted yourself in the face of his anger.

He's having an affair and destroying your business and HE'S angry at YOU? That's RICH. Ludicrous to anyone not in your shoes.

But you are in the thick of things and easily thrown off balance. Also, he may want to say things he knows better than to put in writing. So have that VAR ready.

No matter what he says, just don't get sucked into trying to defend yourself or rationalize anything. (Pretend you're a politician and just keep repeating the talking points the pros on here gave you regardless of the question/comment.)

It wouldn't hurt to have your Mom there too. And if you have ANY sense that he could turn dangerous I would not meet with him. In fact, you have absolutely no obligation to meet with him. You could always ignore him or say something like "I am not open to meeting with you. I will address your questions by text or email but I am not open to talking to you."

If it is important he can email it. I can't think of any legitimate reason he needs to speak to you, other than to try to manipulate you or make you feel bad.

No matter what he says remember, as others have said - YOU ARE A ROCK STAR.